Comments on: Who saw John Adams, part 3?

Question: Who saw John Adams, part 3?

mccxxiii — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:10:51 -0800

I fell asleep during the 3rd part of John Adams and I missed something important. Question inside, in case it's a spoiler for someone.

Damn that red wine and its dozing-off-on-the-sofa powers!

When I woke up right near the end of episode three, John Adams was crying because he was sending his little boy away with someone (not sure whom) and I think they were going to Russia. The little boy said something about "doing his duty" and then he left.

Why would Adams send his son away instead of taking the boy back home to America with him? Why was it the boy's "duty" to go to Russia?

I accept scorn and mocking in advance if this is actually some historical fact that I, as an educated American, should know.

By: moxiedoll

moxiedoll — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:17:36 -0800

He sent JQ on a mission to Russia with a guy because the guy needed a translator (for correspondence?) and JQ could speak French. JA wasn't headed back to America yet, either. So don't worry! They'll be back together soon.

By: Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America

Mr. President Dr. Steve Elvis America — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:22:38 -0800

As a matter of history, apparently John Quincy Adams (John Adams's son) accompanied Francis Dana on a diplomatic mission to St. Petersburg, because JQA spoke French, the language of the Russian court.

By: mdn

mdn — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:27:05 -0800

I was awake (though admittedly only kinda half-watching) and didn't really understand who that guy was, but the idea about his duty was that he was now 14 (I know, the kid looks about 8, but they said he was 14) and it was time for him to be a man and do something for the good of his country etc. So since he knew French he was going to be a secretary for that guy.

There was also no indication JA was on his way home anytime soon - that was before he had any news of how the war was going. (I would have appreciated some dates myself, though -how long did the crossing take, how long were they in france, etc- while the show was going.)

By: junesix

junesix — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 00:49:55 -0800

Francis Dana was John Adam's own secretary in Paris. In that episode Francis Dana hands Adams the letter sent from Ben Franklin to the Congress suggesting that Adams be removed from his role as diplomatic minister to France at the insistence of the French foreign minister. Right after the reading, Francis reminded Adams that he was headed to St Petersburg to the court of Catherine II (as minister to Russia). He mentions that he needs a secretary who speaks French but doesn't explicitly mention JQA. The next scene jumps to JA having a talk with his son about his duties as a man.

Note that in the series, Francis Dana looks like a teen in 1780. The real Francis was only 8 years younger than the elder JA (he would be 37) while JQA was indeed 14 at the time.

By: DiscourseMarker

DiscourseMarker — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 00:54:31 -0800

I saw the whole episode, and they did indeed refer to the man JQ was going with as "Mr. Dana," so there's your answer.

and I think they're fudging a bit with the dates, b/c according to Wikipedia (assuming they're right) JA went to Europe in 1777 and again in 1779, and was in the Netherlands as ambassador in 1780. JQ doesn't go to Russia until 1781, when he was, in fact, 14. Obviously in a movie they couldn't age a kid 4 years like that.

By: DiscourseMarker

DiscourseMarker — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 00:55:12 -0800

D'oh! preview, preview!

By: mccxxiii

mccxxiii — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 03:46:04 -0800

Great answers, thanks!!

I think part of my confusion was that I thought JQA was, like, 9 years old during all this. I must have missed the part where they said he was 14. I thought JA was pawning off his 9-year-old son on somebody in a different country, which seemed pretty cold-hearted. (Though obviously we know it turned out okay, Mr. Sixth President.)

Granted, 14 is still young, but back in the day I can see how that would be old enough to contribute to the cause if you had a good skill.

By: thilmony

thilmony — Tue, 25 Mar 2008 04:24:01 -0800

Torrents are your friend

http://www.mininova.org/get/1266384