How does disownership of a child work in Japan?
February 17, 2008 12:45 AM Subscribe
I've seen the concept casually bandied about on forums and blogs and media (somewhere), but I've always wondered: Just how easy and common is it for Japanese parents to disown a child? Under what circumstances? Or is it just some old-fashioned cultural myth that disownership for dishonor/disobedience/marrying the wrong person/etc. is "easy" in Japan? I know the law must differ from the United States, so I'm quite curious about the actual process and limitations.
Not that my experience would be normative for any reason, but I've read a fair amount about Japan in English, consumed a variety of translated Japanese media, and also taken a little Japanese and I've never encountered this idea. In fact I don't think I've come across a reference to disownership in anything I've read, though I certainly believe that it happens at some frequency in Japan. I just haven't encountered any reason to believe it would be more frequent than anywhere else.
posted by XMLicious at 1:29 AM on February 17, 2008
posted by XMLicious at 1:29 AM on February 17, 2008
My Japanese wife's parents disowned her when they found out she was dating a round-eye (me!). I don't think it was anything official, though. OTOH, they got over it, and after her sister got divorced, they were all "well, at least Spacewrench is better than sister's ex..."
I don't know what the law is there, though. Come to think of it, I don't know what the law is in the US. I'm not aware of any "disown" proceeding or action. There's adoption, where any existing parental relationship is terminated and a new relationship is formed; and you can disinherit a child by carefully drafting your will to do so. But, other than a restraining order, I don't know what you can do to disown someone. And I don't believe a restraining order, or anything short of an adoption, terminates a parent's obligations to his/her minor child.
posted by spacewrench at 8:32 AM on February 17, 2008
I don't know what the law is there, though. Come to think of it, I don't know what the law is in the US. I'm not aware of any "disown" proceeding or action. There's adoption, where any existing parental relationship is terminated and a new relationship is formed; and you can disinherit a child by carefully drafting your will to do so. But, other than a restraining order, I don't know what you can do to disown someone. And I don't believe a restraining order, or anything short of an adoption, terminates a parent's obligations to his/her minor child.
posted by spacewrench at 8:32 AM on February 17, 2008
doesn't directly answer your question, but I hope it provides a little insight.
I took a Japanese Film class (okay, not entirely relevant) and we watched a film where a mom, to be with a guy, left her four kids in an apartment for months to fend for their own. I'm not sure if the mom ever came back, but it was based on a true story, and I don't know how the kids are doing now.
According to my teacher a lot of Japanese kids aren't actually registered and because they have no papers they aren't legally alive, which is very hard to navigate around. One of the reasons could be that one of the parents are illegal immigrants to the country, and/or they're illegitimate children. So if your kids aren't registered, I guess it's unnecessary to disown them.
Also, Japanese kids in particular grow up really fast, in terms of being independent. Workarounds to inconveniences are common in busy Japanese life. And because both parents usually work, kids are normally left on their own throughout the day.
posted by drea at 9:41 AM on February 17, 2008
I took a Japanese Film class (okay, not entirely relevant) and we watched a film where a mom, to be with a guy, left her four kids in an apartment for months to fend for their own. I'm not sure if the mom ever came back, but it was based on a true story, and I don't know how the kids are doing now.
According to my teacher a lot of Japanese kids aren't actually registered and because they have no papers they aren't legally alive, which is very hard to navigate around. One of the reasons could be that one of the parents are illegal immigrants to the country, and/or they're illegitimate children. So if your kids aren't registered, I guess it's unnecessary to disown them.
Also, Japanese kids in particular grow up really fast, in terms of being independent. Workarounds to inconveniences are common in busy Japanese life. And because both parents usually work, kids are normally left on their own throughout the day.
posted by drea at 9:41 AM on February 17, 2008
What do you mean by 'disowning a child'? If you mean cutting a child out of a will or kicking them out of the house, well, "we" do that "here". Typically, people who get married have reached the age of majority: there is no law that says that parents must support competent, adult children. So, yes, the stereotype is false, and confused to boot.
Japan does have very comprehensive family law, and a good (better than Canada) social services program for children in care. But it's comparable to "here". Same system.
Interestingly, Japan has not signed on to the UN universal declaration of the rights of the child.
Anyway, the stereotype you are referring to is that Japanese folks strive to protect "honor" or "save face" over everything else. There's nothing dishonorable about having a child marry a foreigner. But it must be disconcerting for a Japanese parent when their daughter comes home with someone who doesn't speak the language - someone they can't communicate with.
Kind of the same thing happens here.
However, sons and daughters have different experiences getting married. When a woman gets married, she typically "joins" the family of her husband. This has tremendous implications for things like elder care and maintenance of the traditional family burial plot.
In my wife's family, there are two daughters (my sister-in-law is a senior administrator in our prefecture's social services bureau, BTW). My sister-in-law married an eldest son - their house has her husband's family Buddhist altar, and she lives with her mother-in-law. She doesn't have much time to take care of her parents.
My wife obviously married me, a foreigner. For the time being we're in Canada (I have lived in Japan on-and-off since 1994).
So, who will take care of my wife's parents? What will happen to the Buddhist altar? It's a tough country for women, which is why many Japanese parents must prepare emotionally to cut themselves off when their daughters get married.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:42 AM on February 17, 2008
Japan does have very comprehensive family law, and a good (better than Canada) social services program for children in care. But it's comparable to "here". Same system.
Interestingly, Japan has not signed on to the UN universal declaration of the rights of the child.
Anyway, the stereotype you are referring to is that Japanese folks strive to protect "honor" or "save face" over everything else. There's nothing dishonorable about having a child marry a foreigner. But it must be disconcerting for a Japanese parent when their daughter comes home with someone who doesn't speak the language - someone they can't communicate with.
Kind of the same thing happens here.
However, sons and daughters have different experiences getting married. When a woman gets married, she typically "joins" the family of her husband. This has tremendous implications for things like elder care and maintenance of the traditional family burial plot.
In my wife's family, there are two daughters (my sister-in-law is a senior administrator in our prefecture's social services bureau, BTW). My sister-in-law married an eldest son - their house has her husband's family Buddhist altar, and she lives with her mother-in-law. She doesn't have much time to take care of her parents.
My wife obviously married me, a foreigner. For the time being we're in Canada (I have lived in Japan on-and-off since 1994).
So, who will take care of my wife's parents? What will happen to the Buddhist altar? It's a tough country for women, which is why many Japanese parents must prepare emotionally to cut themselves off when their daughters get married.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:42 AM on February 17, 2008
Response by poster: @drea: I read a little bit about the Japanese family register, so that's a very interesting notion (unregistered children).
@KokuRyu and others: Yes, I'm sure it's a stereotype that's blown out of proportion in some areas than others, or outright silly. Thanks for your feedback.
posted by Ky at 11:11 AM on February 17, 2008
@KokuRyu and others: Yes, I'm sure it's a stereotype that's blown out of proportion in some areas than others, or outright silly. Thanks for your feedback.
posted by Ky at 11:11 AM on February 17, 2008
@spacewrench, I can't speak to the legal situation in Japan, but in the US and the UK, termination of parental rights is legislated for, and can be entered into voluntarily. That is, obviously, a standard requirement for adoption, but it can happen outside of adoption, and does. Normally a parent has to petition the court, but if successful, it is effectively "disowning" the child - it ends any legal rights and usually all legal obligations, including child support.
posted by DarlingBri at 1:21 PM on February 17, 2008
posted by DarlingBri at 1:21 PM on February 17, 2008
The film drea mentions is Dare Mo Shiranai ("Nobody Knows").
I think this question needs clarification between disowning adult children (where the parents merely cease all communication) and actual children. Unregistered children, interesting concept -- you mean there's no legal responsibility? So like an unwanted pet, you could just ditch 'em somewhere?
posted by Rash at 1:37 PM on February 17, 2008
I think this question needs clarification between disowning adult children (where the parents merely cease all communication) and actual children. Unregistered children, interesting concept -- you mean there's no legal responsibility? So like an unwanted pet, you could just ditch 'em somewhere?
posted by Rash at 1:37 PM on February 17, 2008
Response by poster: I mean actual children--i.e. not in legal majority. Sorry. :)
The family registry thing is very intriguing, from what little I've dug up about it. Also disturbing.
posted by Ky at 4:14 PM on February 17, 2008
The family registry thing is very intriguing, from what little I've dug up about it. Also disturbing.
posted by Ky at 4:14 PM on February 17, 2008
Okay so I've read a little more on the koseki (family registry).
It's the family head's responsibility to register children. If they're not registered, they're not considered Japanese citizens, therefore no legal protection. Since it's the parent's responsibility to register their children within two weeks, my guess is some fail to do so entirely.
Children of non-Japanese parents are not considered citizens.
Also, since births are registered according to family, children born out of adultery might not be registered, otherwise the parents give themselves away.
posted by drea at 5:45 PM on February 17, 2008
It's the family head's responsibility to register children. If they're not registered, they're not considered Japanese citizens, therefore no legal protection. Since it's the parent's responsibility to register their children within two weeks, my guess is some fail to do so entirely.
Children of non-Japanese parents are not considered citizens.
Also, since births are registered according to family, children born out of adultery might not be registered, otherwise the parents give themselves away.
posted by drea at 5:45 PM on February 17, 2008
Not just japanese - asian in general, I think. My boyfriend is in the process of getting disowned because I'm a) white, b) hippyish and c) 10 years younger.
posted by damnjezebel at 6:37 PM on February 17, 2008
posted by damnjezebel at 6:37 PM on February 17, 2008
Response by poster: @drea: Alright, so it would seem that getting around the family registry in Japan is (implied) one way to skip the disownership issue entirely. I'm guessing through abandonment, which is a whole other thing. Not exactly what I was looking for, but very interesting nonetheless!
posted by Ky at 7:11 PM on February 17, 2008
posted by Ky at 7:11 PM on February 17, 2008
Response by poster: (Also in retrospect, I shouldn't have added the "marrying the wrong person" part to the original question since I was really thinking of minor children. That'll teach me to post at 2 a.m. in the morning.)
posted by Ky at 7:16 PM on February 17, 2008
posted by Ky at 7:16 PM on February 17, 2008
Best answer: There's a lot of guessing going on in this this thread, so I did a little research using Japanese Google and the some Japanese abstracts on family law.
Children in Japan are required by law to be registered in the 戸籍謄本 (koseki tohon or family register) at birth. Not registering children would be considered a crime. Of course, as noted above, there are children who may not be registered. They would then become wards of the state if no adult were able to claim or prove parentage or guardianship.
If a child is abandoned (perhaps a more technical term for being 'disowned') and is not entered on a family register, s/he is ineligible for Japanese citizenship, cannot enter the national health insurance system and cannot married. In certain cases it is possible to create one's own koseki, which solves this problem.
Some prefectures, such as Kumamoto, have introduced a 'baby hatch' system to deal with unwanted children (akachan posuto). Parents or guardians are found for these children; adoptees enter the foster parents' koseki. Children in orphanages typically were registered in their parents' koseki at birth.
However, it is a crime to refrain from register the birth of a child. And it is pretty uncommon to 'disown' or abandon a child to boot (the children in the movie 'Nobody Knows' were registered on the mother's koseki tohon). It is also extremely difficult to remove one's child from one's family register or 'disown them.' One cannot just go down to the local city or ward office and do this sort of thing.
I don't think abandonment is an "Asian" thing, as the same problem can exist in Canada, the US or Europe.
Still, it must be said that Japan has long had the practice of 'water babies,' unwanted children drowned at birth by farming families with too many mouths to feed.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:55 PM on February 17, 2008
Children in Japan are required by law to be registered in the 戸籍謄本 (koseki tohon or family register) at birth. Not registering children would be considered a crime. Of course, as noted above, there are children who may not be registered. They would then become wards of the state if no adult were able to claim or prove parentage or guardianship.
If a child is abandoned (perhaps a more technical term for being 'disowned') and is not entered on a family register, s/he is ineligible for Japanese citizenship, cannot enter the national health insurance system and cannot married. In certain cases it is possible to create one's own koseki, which solves this problem.
Some prefectures, such as Kumamoto, have introduced a 'baby hatch' system to deal with unwanted children (akachan posuto). Parents or guardians are found for these children; adoptees enter the foster parents' koseki. Children in orphanages typically were registered in their parents' koseki at birth.
However, it is a crime to refrain from register the birth of a child. And it is pretty uncommon to 'disown' or abandon a child to boot (the children in the movie 'Nobody Knows' were registered on the mother's koseki tohon). It is also extremely difficult to remove one's child from one's family register or 'disown them.' One cannot just go down to the local city or ward office and do this sort of thing.
I don't think abandonment is an "Asian" thing, as the same problem can exist in Canada, the US or Europe.
Still, it must be said that Japan has long had the practice of 'water babies,' unwanted children drowned at birth by farming families with too many mouths to feed.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:55 PM on February 17, 2008
My wife's mother (Japanese) disowned her adult eldest son. Mostly it was an "engiri", a semi-formalized cutting of all connections. This meant removing him from her will, making sure that he would not inherit anything after her death, and also emotionally distancing herself from him. My wife says her mom couldn't remove him from their koseki touhon, so it's not quite the same as a divorce.
posted by bakerybob at 5:08 AM on February 18, 2008
posted by bakerybob at 5:08 AM on February 18, 2008
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