Pimp my walls

January 10, 2008 3:56 PM

The original wallpaper in my house was applied directly to the drywall. I'm guessing this is/was a pretty popular builder's trick, at least in the 80s (and oh, the horror of the peach and navy wallpapers), but even with careful scoring and steaming I am losing the very outer epidermis of the drywall paper in a lot of places.

It's leaving me with a pretty scabby-looking surface, and my original plan to prime and paint isn't going to be enough, I don't think. I hate wall texture, but obviously something thick needs to go down at some point in the process to hide the flaws.

What, exactly, should that process be? Mud the walls, gently texture, prime and paint, or something like that? What technologies should I apply to each point in the process? I really want to do this myself, even the navy-with-little-apples vaulted ceiling in the kitchen, and I would like to do it relatively right. I don't want to paint over the wallpaper, I know how wrong that ends up looking.

Two of the rooms slated for re-do are bathrooms, do I need to do anything special in there, since they tend to get more humidity?

posted by Lyn Never to home & garden (18 comments total)

Welcome to the club.
Our current home suffers from the same builder's shortcut (among others).
Your best bet will be to remove the wallpaper as best you can. Then contract with the best drywall man you can find, and get him to skim-coat the walls. A good mudder will be able to lay-down a very smooth surface. It might take a couple of coats and sanding, but they can do the job.

As for prime and paint without the skim coat...we tried that. It will flake off in spots.
posted by Thorzdad at 4:06 PM on January 10, 2008

Two of the rooms slated for re-do are bathrooms, do I need to do anything special in there, since they tend to get more humidity?

Your bathrooms should have moisture-resistant drywall (AKA greenboard) on the walls, but since the drywall in the rest of your house was apparently unsealed before the application of the drywall, I wouldn't count on it being there. If it's not there, it might be too much for you to replace the existing drywall with it. If it is there by some miracle, the builders may have pulled the same trick as in the rest of the house, meaning you'll damage the water resistant paper on the board by pulling off the wallpaper; but I don't know if it would be enough to make a difference.

There may be waterproofing products that you can apply to existing drywall that will work well as a substitute for greenboard, but I'm not aware of them.

As for the regular walls in the house, it's entirely possible to just coat the walls with a thin coat of mud to even out the walls and just leave it at that. Sometimes builders call that procedure "diamond" or "imperial" plaster, and it's intended to give look of plaster walls without having to do a full float of plaster. I've only ever seen professional drywall installers do that, however. I'm not sure how easy it is to DIY, but it sounds like you're going to be doing something pretty labor intensive no matter what you do.
posted by LionIndex at 4:09 PM on January 10, 2008

A footnote to Thorzdad's good advice: A glass-smooth skim coat looks great, but is a lot of work, and reveals every flaw. A sheetrocker can apply a subtle texture (nothing like popcorn) that might turn out to be cheaper and more fault-tolerant. So you might want to ask about that.
posted by adamrice at 4:17 PM on January 10, 2008

I'll third the skimcoat. If you're lucky, you might be able to find an actual plasterer. I wouldn't count on it, though- that's a dying trade. Most who call themselves plasterers actually apply synthetic stucco on the exterior of buildings. I'd try to find one, though, because if by chance you can locate one, he or she will have a better skillset for this than the average drywall guy.

You may be largely SOL on the bathrooms, short of tearing out the current wall board and replacing it with the water-resistant stuff that LionIndex mentioned. At the very least, apply a coat of Kilz primer before you paint. It's great stuff, and it will help.

Good Luck!
posted by Shohn at 4:18 PM on January 10, 2008

Nightmare, isn't it? Thorzdad has it right. I know you want to do this yourself, but heed the sad voice of experience: You will regret it. If you insist on joining the thousands who have rued the day they attempted to do their own drywalling, do yourself a favor and study up with this book. It's pretty much the drywall Bible. But I'm telling you, you'll be sorry. Drywall guys are not that expensive for what they do, as long as you can find one who's competent (and that's a whole 'nother bitter thread).
posted by Enroute at 4:18 PM on January 10, 2008

Enroute's book is a good resource, but I'll disagree with the majority here that drywall is that difficult to do well. I would say that drywall is very difficult to do well quickly. After gutting our bathroom and doing all the drywall work ourselves, the finished seams and other mudded areas look smooth and purty, but it took a long time and lots of patience. A pro can do in 2-3 coats what took us 7 and lots of touch-up.

Also, re: greenboard -- it's way overrated and doesn't provide the moisture protection that it claims to, since you're penetrating it with dozens of screws to secure it to the studs. It's not going to hurt anything in a bathroom, but don't even think about putting it in a locale where it will get direct water contact, even under tile (like a shower, or tub surround).
posted by Pantengliopoli at 4:31 PM on January 10, 2008

Also, re: greenboard -- it's way overrated and doesn't provide the moisture protection that it claims to, since you're penetrating it with dozens of screws to secure it to the studs. It's not going to hurt anything in a bathroom, but don't even think about putting it in a locale where it will get direct water contact, even under tile (like a shower, or tub surround).

So they should use.....what?

Building paper, the stuff that waterproofs the outside of your house, isn't really all that waterproof to begin with either. And it's attached with nails, and then has lath or siding attached to it with nails, so you have nails penetrating the exterior of your home all over the place. If there's a better thing to use in a bathroom than greenboard, I'd like to know what it is, but it's still better than just plain drywall.
posted by LionIndex at 4:40 PM on January 10, 2008

The point is not that greenboard is bad, per se, it's that the additional (marginal) protection may not be worth the cost in an adequately ventilated bathroom. If you don't have a fan or can't install one, by all means, go for the extra protection if it gives you more confidence in the installation. Outside of our shower enclosure we've got plain drywall and latex paint. I assume you're not debating whether it should be used in a shower or tub surround as a tiling substrate.
posted by Pantengliopoli at 4:52 PM on January 10, 2008

If you're planning on replacing the window / door trims as well it may be simpler to just put up a 1/4 inch drywall board over the whole mess (paper, drywall, etc). Alternatively I would HIGHLY recommend you have a professional drywaller take care of the repairs. They can make it look new again and it's about the least expensive trade to hire. Looking at your location I imagine that you could find as many skilled drywallers as you could possibly want off Craigslist. This advice is coming from someone who does almost all his own work, but drywall finishing is as much of an art as a science. I understand the drive to do it yourself, but this is one of the two cases I would recommend hiring out (the other is large scale floor refinishing).

Bathroom should be greenboard as mentioned, except behind tile where it should be durock or other waterproof cement board. And install a vent fan if non already exists. Good luck!
posted by true at 6:06 PM on January 10, 2008

I feel your pain. I removed all the paper, including the wallboard paper, then washed off the wallpaper glue. (Additional motivation for this is that it was the color and odor of 40 years of smoke.)

We mudded the imperfections, then sanded, sanded, sanded again, primed with Kilz, applied base coat, top coat. (We are anti-texture.) We did it ourselves, we're not pros, and it looks fabulous. But it is a lot of work.
posted by desuetude at 6:11 PM on January 10, 2008

If you are steaming, try spraying instead, see here.

And, take your time. I'm with desuetude, with plenty of patience I think you can do this yourself.
posted by beagle at 6:25 PM on January 10, 2008

If you're going to be doing any tiling in those bathrooms, I'd highly recommend this site as a resource:

http://johnbridge.com/vbulletin/index.php

Lots of great information, including proper cement board installation, tiling, you name it. One of the friendliest forums on the web, to boot.
posted by Pantengliopoli at 6:35 PM on January 10, 2008

Oh, and I didn't steam. I wet down the walls with a roller and warm water and scraped with a putty knife, getting under the paper so that I could push swaths of it off the wall. Some areas came off like a dream, some came off in itsy stubborn bits.
posted by desuetude at 7:00 PM on January 10, 2008

A sheetrocker can apply a subtle texture....

I did this sort of thing when I worked for a remodeler in college, and it can be done pretty simply by watering down some mud to the thickness of paint or a little thicker, then rolling it on like paint. Depending on the final look you want, a lot of the other suggestions are good, too.
posted by TedW at 7:20 PM on January 10, 2008

Places like Home Depot have texturing kits, such as orange peel. Some just come in a spray can. Not sure how good they are but they come in different roughnessessess.
posted by Foam Pants at 7:31 PM on January 10, 2008

We mudded the imperfections, then sanded, sanded, sanded again, primed with Kilz, applied base coat, top coat. (We are anti-texture.) We did it ourselves, we're not pros, and it looks fabulous. But it is a lot of work.

I've pretty much done this on fresh gypsum board- mud the seams, two thoroughly dried and well sanded coats of thin drywall mud all over, then paint. I had never done it before, and it came out quite smooth. It took much patience, especially when it came to sanding, but I'm kind of a perfectionist so I actually find that sort of task enjoyable.
posted by oneirodynia at 7:40 PM on January 10, 2008

Seconding true. It's the easiest and fastest solution and 1/4 inch drywall is pretty inconspicuous (though surprisingly delicate to handle.)

The biggest problem with skim-coating is the moisture from the compound('mud') can lift any paper left on the wall, which means lots of going back over what you've already done.

And hiring 'professionals' is a very good idea (as long as you can be sure they actually are 'professionals' and not just shmoes.)
posted by From Bklyn at 1:02 AM on January 11, 2008

skimcoating with mud/compound is actually not that hard, just time consuming. It's more like frosting a cake.

And you can cut down the sanding considerably if you let it dry slightly, but not all the way, and "sand" with a large wrung out sponge. it takes off all the ridges and smoothes things out nicely. you may still have a couple of spots to hit with a sanding block later, but it saves a ton of time and dust.
posted by kumquatmay at 7:42 AM on January 11, 2008