Busybee is getting tired
October 2, 2007 10:07 PM Subscribe
How to run a busy schedule and not lose friends along the way.
I run a very tight schedule with two jobs, volunteer work, and a full load of university classes. This means that I have to be very selective in terms of who I want to hang out with and when so I could get everything done. Lately I'm finding that I'm offending a lot of people because I'm having to arrange meet-ups and such on my own schedule. I'm fine keeping in touch through the occasional phone call and email, but they want to do stuff with me, and they turn down invitations to just come to my house and hang out.
I've had this problem in the past and I've never dealt with it well. I have a lot of interests and I like to keep myself busy (though if I go anywhere and mention it to someone like a friend, I often try to extend an invitation to them to join me), and that seems to alienate a lot of people. I just don't have enough time in one week to see everybody when they want it, and anyway, I'm a total introvert--I can't take company for long periods of time. I don't know if this is a case where I should find people who share more of my own interests or personal circumstances, so that people aren't constantly accomodating to me and vice versa.
So for all the busy people out there with hectic schedules, how do you juggle that and a satisfactory social life?
I run a very tight schedule with two jobs, volunteer work, and a full load of university classes. This means that I have to be very selective in terms of who I want to hang out with and when so I could get everything done. Lately I'm finding that I'm offending a lot of people because I'm having to arrange meet-ups and such on my own schedule. I'm fine keeping in touch through the occasional phone call and email, but they want to do stuff with me, and they turn down invitations to just come to my house and hang out.
I've had this problem in the past and I've never dealt with it well. I have a lot of interests and I like to keep myself busy (though if I go anywhere and mention it to someone like a friend, I often try to extend an invitation to them to join me), and that seems to alienate a lot of people. I just don't have enough time in one week to see everybody when they want it, and anyway, I'm a total introvert--I can't take company for long periods of time. I don't know if this is a case where I should find people who share more of my own interests or personal circumstances, so that people aren't constantly accomodating to me and vice versa.
So for all the busy people out there with hectic schedules, how do you juggle that and a satisfactory social life?
Do you actually like your friends at all?
If I were you, I would try to reread my post through the eyes of an unbiased stranger. Do you realize that you - one hopes unintentionally - seem to be operating from the belief that your needs outrank the needs of your friends? And that they should be thrilled with however and whenever you want to see them?
Put another way, if you're constantly telling your friends that you're waaaaaaaay too busy to hang out with them, and then you turn around and go "Oh, by the way, I'm going to this fascinating gallery opening on Thursday, you should come..." you may think that very kind of yourself, but surely you can see that there's a meta-message there about how much you value your time and their company? Same with "I'm way too busy to come to your party this weekend, but you can come over to my house and hang out next Thursday between 9 and 10. Oh, you don't want to? Well screw you!"
This is sort of what having friends is. Sometimes you get to do things you both really enjoy. But sometimes you have to help them move-- or, in your case, go over to their house, or say yes to one of their plans. If someone isn't willing to put themselves out for me a little, they're not my friend, they're an acquaintance.
It's okay if you just want acquaintance-level relationships right now. Maybe that's more your style.
posted by thehmsbeagle at 10:33 PM on October 2, 2007 [3 favorites]
If I were you, I would try to reread my post through the eyes of an unbiased stranger. Do you realize that you - one hopes unintentionally - seem to be operating from the belief that your needs outrank the needs of your friends? And that they should be thrilled with however and whenever you want to see them?
Put another way, if you're constantly telling your friends that you're waaaaaaaay too busy to hang out with them, and then you turn around and go "Oh, by the way, I'm going to this fascinating gallery opening on Thursday, you should come..." you may think that very kind of yourself, but surely you can see that there's a meta-message there about how much you value your time and their company? Same with "I'm way too busy to come to your party this weekend, but you can come over to my house and hang out next Thursday between 9 and 10. Oh, you don't want to? Well screw you!"
This is sort of what having friends is. Sometimes you get to do things you both really enjoy. But sometimes you have to help them move-- or, in your case, go over to their house, or say yes to one of their plans. If someone isn't willing to put themselves out for me a little, they're not my friend, they're an acquaintance.
It's okay if you just want acquaintance-level relationships right now. Maybe that's more your style.
posted by thehmsbeagle at 10:33 PM on October 2, 2007 [3 favorites]
I shoot for seeing my friends once a month. However, if I'd done that when I was in University, people would have thought I was a bad person. Don't you eat? Sharing meals with people is the time-honored way of maintaining friendships while accomplishing something. Hanging out at your house doesn't sound exciting....
I'm not really sure what to tell you. I have no idea if the quality of your friendships is worth making more of an effort. In general, having friends should be a priority. Priorities involve time and energy. At the same time, I've always preferred friendships that were low-maintenance and guilt-free. Maybe you need to work on being a better friend. Or maybe you just need to find and cultivate better friends for you. In any case, both people in a friendship need to initiate and accept invitations or else it isn't balanced.
Maybe your friends are also sort of homebodies? In that case, it isn't fair to ask them to leave their house when you don't want to lave yours.
If you are a goal-oriented person, maybe make being a better friend a goal? And make yourself do 1-2 real actions a week towards that goal?
posted by Mozzie at 10:58 PM on October 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
I'm not really sure what to tell you. I have no idea if the quality of your friendships is worth making more of an effort. In general, having friends should be a priority. Priorities involve time and energy. At the same time, I've always preferred friendships that were low-maintenance and guilt-free. Maybe you need to work on being a better friend. Or maybe you just need to find and cultivate better friends for you. In any case, both people in a friendship need to initiate and accept invitations or else it isn't balanced.
Maybe your friends are also sort of homebodies? In that case, it isn't fair to ask them to leave their house when you don't want to lave yours.
If you are a goal-oriented person, maybe make being a better friend a goal? And make yourself do 1-2 real actions a week towards that goal?
posted by Mozzie at 10:58 PM on October 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
I put work first. This is why I have no friends and see everyone on facebook.
posted by parmanparman at 11:06 PM on October 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by parmanparman at 11:06 PM on October 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
It doesn't sound much like you want those friends, or else they'd have some amount of priority in your life.
The thing is, if you neglect your friends now when things are humming along, you can't expect people to be there for you when things aren't going so well.
To me a completely booked-solid life with no meaningful connections to people sounds joyless, but if it's your bag, just be honest about it. Quite truthfully they're probably already well aware that you don't really need/want them in your life anyway.
posted by loiseau at 1:11 AM on October 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
The thing is, if you neglect your friends now when things are humming along, you can't expect people to be there for you when things aren't going so well.
To me a completely booked-solid life with no meaningful connections to people sounds joyless, but if it's your bag, just be honest about it. Quite truthfully they're probably already well aware that you don't really need/want them in your life anyway.
posted by loiseau at 1:11 AM on October 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I agree with all the people saying you need to decide what you value. No system or trick or technique is going to give you more hours in the day.
Meanwhile, however, I really like the idea (though not the cheesy name) of the "strength date" suggested by Tal Ben-Shahar, who teaches positive psychology at Harvard. Ask someone to show you something you know they love doing, or that they're expert at, or to take you somewhere they love and are knowledgeable about. If you actively ask them to do this, I think it would reduce the sting of their having to do it at a time you can manage. I know it sounds a bit cynical so you have to be careful not to come across that way. But I know that if a friend of mine asked me to take them to a museum I really love (or whatever) I'd be very willing to do it when they could fit it in.
posted by game warden to the events rhino at 1:51 AM on October 3, 2007 [2 favorites]
Meanwhile, however, I really like the idea (though not the cheesy name) of the "strength date" suggested by Tal Ben-Shahar, who teaches positive psychology at Harvard. Ask someone to show you something you know they love doing, or that they're expert at, or to take you somewhere they love and are knowledgeable about. If you actively ask them to do this, I think it would reduce the sting of their having to do it at a time you can manage. I know it sounds a bit cynical so you have to be careful not to come across that way. But I know that if a friend of mine asked me to take them to a museum I really love (or whatever) I'd be very willing to do it when they could fit it in.
posted by game warden to the events rhino at 1:51 AM on October 3, 2007 [2 favorites]
I'm a student also. Lots of my friends are do-it-all, high-achiever types, and most of us are busy all the time. So I'm pretty used to the strategy you describe of letting friends know your small windows of time when you're available to hang out, and unlike others here, I don't think it's rude or selfish, particularly when the alternative is just not seeing your friends at all.
Have you tried meeting up with people for short intervals of time you might have in your schedule-- eg, if you have two classes an hour apart, grabbing a quick coffee in the interim with a friend? Even really short visits with pals can be important, as it demonstrates a committment to spending time with that person despite your business, and I imagine your friends are probably busy too.
posted by ITheCosmos at 5:51 AM on October 3, 2007
Have you tried meeting up with people for short intervals of time you might have in your schedule-- eg, if you have two classes an hour apart, grabbing a quick coffee in the interim with a friend? Even really short visits with pals can be important, as it demonstrates a committment to spending time with that person despite your business, and I imagine your friends are probably busy too.
posted by ITheCosmos at 5:51 AM on October 3, 2007
I sort of agree that you sound maybe too busy for the number of people who want to hang out with you. I have a similar situation in my life but it's less of a problem. I don't know anything about you except what you wrote so here are some observations and ideas.
- Hanging out. you say you friends don't want to come over and just hang out. Now, are you sure you're not extending an invitation like "hey I have to go muck out the basement, we could hang out while I do that!" and trying to sort of multitask friend-maintenance and house maintenance? I know some friends are into that sort of thing, but others really aren't. If that is not the case maybe your friends are event-oriented friends and you're a chitchat oriented friend? If that's the case then something has to give somewhat. With people who are more event-oriented, it can be tough to find ways to go to events together if you're really busy and yet if you can't get it together to attend or plan an event you don't see them as much.
- Communication. how do your friends like to communicate? I have a few friends who are busy like me and we chat over IM a few minutes a day, maybe several times a day in-between times when we can really hang out. I also know when they're doing things that would be okay with an occasional drop-in [hey our friends from out of town are here, you should come say hi] and when they aren't [we're making dinner for six, see you tomorrow?]. It's also important to know what are busy imtes and what aren't. For example, right now in Vermont the foliage is amazing and anyone who was planning a trip to VT is coming here. So, most people who have friends who travel have their house full of people right now. So, we all sort of put hanging out with each other on hold for a few weeks. Do your volunteer jobs have busy times and non-busy times?
- Family. you don't mention whether you also have family that you juggle in with all this. I don't have local family, but I find that my friends with families need more lead-time to do things with, are less likely to drop by and often prefer to have people over, especially if they have kids [some don't feel this way, naturally, some friends with kids think their house is a mess and don't want anyone over wihtout warning] so again if you're a run around busy person you may find that you have to plan seeing these people a week or two in advance. Also in families where there is someone working and someone working at home, or with the kids or whatever, after work time [which is free time for me!] may be family time, catch up time and whatnot, so the "what's a good date and time?" question may be opposite for them than it is for you
- Priorities. I have some firends who I have had for the better part of a decade or two and I've been getting the same "sorry it took me a week to reply to your email, I've just been really busy!" messages from them that whole time. These people, while still dear friends, just don't prioritize our friendship the way I do and they're never going to get unbusy, that's just the way they are. I don't mean "waaah they like me less than I like them!" but just the way I mostly communicate/interact isn't a priority to them the sam way it is to me. I'm sure there are people in my life who get the same feeling from me in the other direction. You have to be honest about your priorities: what do you like about having friends? Do you feel that good friends see each other every week, every month, once a year, on holidays? How do your friends feel about that? If you wanted to prioritize your friendships more what would that look like? Often this will mean getting outside of your comfort zone and either taking up some of your alone time with semi-social stuff or letting some friends sort of drop down to less-frequent friends. It seems to me that they're going to do that anyhow if it seems like you don't have time for them unless you can fond another way to get that across to them.
- What works for me. I have a hard time with this same thing. I like to do a lot of working from home, I travel a lot, I like to spend a lot of time alone messing with my own projects and then all of the sudden I'll hit a wall and be like "who wants to hang out with me!?" and really that doesn't work for most of my friends, they're not on a similar schedule they don't have impulsive hang-out time available all the time. So what I try to do is plan an event a week or two out -- metafilter meetups are great for this sort of thing, but whatever, have people over for soup or photo album maintenance or whatever the heck it is that you like to do together -- and invite a bunch of people and really do something up. Make food, have nice music, make it a nice event. This way you are making an effort to make them feel welcome and included, but you can interact with a few friends at once (hopefully they get along with each other), have one big thing instead of a lot of little things, and you'll be on the guest list next time they do something.
My last bit of advice is just to make sure you're honest with them and with yourself about where your time is going and why. If you're turning down invitations because you're already overextended and want to curl up with a good book instead of going out, just tell people that and don't say "gee I've been really busy lately" because people know the difference between too-busy for anything and too-busy for them.
posted by jessamyn at 6:17 AM on October 3, 2007 [4 favorites]
- Hanging out. you say you friends don't want to come over and just hang out. Now, are you sure you're not extending an invitation like "hey I have to go muck out the basement, we could hang out while I do that!" and trying to sort of multitask friend-maintenance and house maintenance? I know some friends are into that sort of thing, but others really aren't. If that is not the case maybe your friends are event-oriented friends and you're a chitchat oriented friend? If that's the case then something has to give somewhat. With people who are more event-oriented, it can be tough to find ways to go to events together if you're really busy and yet if you can't get it together to attend or plan an event you don't see them as much.
- Communication. how do your friends like to communicate? I have a few friends who are busy like me and we chat over IM a few minutes a day, maybe several times a day in-between times when we can really hang out. I also know when they're doing things that would be okay with an occasional drop-in [hey our friends from out of town are here, you should come say hi] and when they aren't [we're making dinner for six, see you tomorrow?]. It's also important to know what are busy imtes and what aren't. For example, right now in Vermont the foliage is amazing and anyone who was planning a trip to VT is coming here. So, most people who have friends who travel have their house full of people right now. So, we all sort of put hanging out with each other on hold for a few weeks. Do your volunteer jobs have busy times and non-busy times?
- Family. you don't mention whether you also have family that you juggle in with all this. I don't have local family, but I find that my friends with families need more lead-time to do things with, are less likely to drop by and often prefer to have people over, especially if they have kids [some don't feel this way, naturally, some friends with kids think their house is a mess and don't want anyone over wihtout warning] so again if you're a run around busy person you may find that you have to plan seeing these people a week or two in advance. Also in families where there is someone working and someone working at home, or with the kids or whatever, after work time [which is free time for me!] may be family time, catch up time and whatnot, so the "what's a good date and time?" question may be opposite for them than it is for you
- Priorities. I have some firends who I have had for the better part of a decade or two and I've been getting the same "sorry it took me a week to reply to your email, I've just been really busy!" messages from them that whole time. These people, while still dear friends, just don't prioritize our friendship the way I do and they're never going to get unbusy, that's just the way they are. I don't mean "waaah they like me less than I like them!" but just the way I mostly communicate/interact isn't a priority to them the sam way it is to me. I'm sure there are people in my life who get the same feeling from me in the other direction. You have to be honest about your priorities: what do you like about having friends? Do you feel that good friends see each other every week, every month, once a year, on holidays? How do your friends feel about that? If you wanted to prioritize your friendships more what would that look like? Often this will mean getting outside of your comfort zone and either taking up some of your alone time with semi-social stuff or letting some friends sort of drop down to less-frequent friends. It seems to me that they're going to do that anyhow if it seems like you don't have time for them unless you can fond another way to get that across to them.
- What works for me. I have a hard time with this same thing. I like to do a lot of working from home, I travel a lot, I like to spend a lot of time alone messing with my own projects and then all of the sudden I'll hit a wall and be like "who wants to hang out with me!?" and really that doesn't work for most of my friends, they're not on a similar schedule they don't have impulsive hang-out time available all the time. So what I try to do is plan an event a week or two out -- metafilter meetups are great for this sort of thing, but whatever, have people over for soup or photo album maintenance or whatever the heck it is that you like to do together -- and invite a bunch of people and really do something up. Make food, have nice music, make it a nice event. This way you are making an effort to make them feel welcome and included, but you can interact with a few friends at once (hopefully they get along with each other), have one big thing instead of a lot of little things, and you'll be on the guest list next time they do something.
My last bit of advice is just to make sure you're honest with them and with yourself about where your time is going and why. If you're turning down invitations because you're already overextended and want to curl up with a good book instead of going out, just tell people that and don't say "gee I've been really busy lately" because people know the difference between too-busy for anything and too-busy for them.
posted by jessamyn at 6:17 AM on October 3, 2007 [4 favorites]
So for all the busy people out there with hectic schedules, how do you juggle that and a satisfactory social life?
I don't think it's necessarily rude or selfish either, to have a busy schedule.
I began an insanely busy work/travel schedule about 18 months ago. Immediately, my social schedule changed: I couldn't do lunches or happy hours on the spur of the moment, I couldn't pick up and road-trip across the state, I was constantly turning people down for activities of all sizes.
I identified which of my friends were likely to take it as a personal affront if I dialed their time back or was constantly sending regrets... and which friends were understanding and supportive. (Sadly, I make extra effort for the former, although I appreciate the latter group far more in my heart.)
I take great care to keep everyone informed as to my general schedule, whenever we talk, so they know in advance that I'm barely able to return calls in August or September, but that October and November free up significantly, etc. It properly sets the expectation levels. And, I've found that the same trick that helps make long-distance romances bearable (always having the next visit planned on the calendar, in pen), works for friends. I might not be able to go out on the town every week with Jane, like I used to, but if we have a special 'girls' night' on the books for three weeks from now, she's not likely to feel ignored in the meantime.
And, I make an extra-special effort to send a card or note for birthdays. 'You already know I'm insanely busy but look, I can still take the time to think of you on your special day' is a powerful message that is easy to execute.
Adding on to what Jessamyn said about "hanging out": Even if you are not inviting people over to clean house, you have to remember that what constitutes fun for busy people versus normal people is very different. Example: I have a group of college buddies who love love love to plan last-minute trips to Vegas. But, even if my schedule accommodates the impromptu trip, the last thing I want to do is get on another flight to stay in another hotel, when my comfy bed and spouse and cat and full closet are right here at home. "Staying in" sounds like a huge fun party to me. But for my friends with 9-to-5 M-F jobs with zero travel, staying in is what they do five nights a week anyway, and the idea of burning a Saturday night to do that sounds about as excited as watching paint dry.
So if you need to stay home and nest on your off-nights, be sure to think about how that invitation sounds to your pals. Consider jazzing up the plans so that it's more of an event than just "I'm going to veg and you're free to sit on the couch with me." Maybe games night, fondue night, grilling out, movie night, book club, anything that says "this isn't throwaway, I care about you and spending time with you Having Fun."
posted by pineapple at 6:45 AM on October 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I don't think it's necessarily rude or selfish either, to have a busy schedule.
I began an insanely busy work/travel schedule about 18 months ago. Immediately, my social schedule changed: I couldn't do lunches or happy hours on the spur of the moment, I couldn't pick up and road-trip across the state, I was constantly turning people down for activities of all sizes.
I identified which of my friends were likely to take it as a personal affront if I dialed their time back or was constantly sending regrets... and which friends were understanding and supportive. (Sadly, I make extra effort for the former, although I appreciate the latter group far more in my heart.)
I take great care to keep everyone informed as to my general schedule, whenever we talk, so they know in advance that I'm barely able to return calls in August or September, but that October and November free up significantly, etc. It properly sets the expectation levels. And, I've found that the same trick that helps make long-distance romances bearable (always having the next visit planned on the calendar, in pen), works for friends. I might not be able to go out on the town every week with Jane, like I used to, but if we have a special 'girls' night' on the books for three weeks from now, she's not likely to feel ignored in the meantime.
And, I make an extra-special effort to send a card or note for birthdays. 'You already know I'm insanely busy but look, I can still take the time to think of you on your special day' is a powerful message that is easy to execute.
Adding on to what Jessamyn said about "hanging out": Even if you are not inviting people over to clean house, you have to remember that what constitutes fun for busy people versus normal people is very different. Example: I have a group of college buddies who love love love to plan last-minute trips to Vegas. But, even if my schedule accommodates the impromptu trip, the last thing I want to do is get on another flight to stay in another hotel, when my comfy bed and spouse and cat and full closet are right here at home. "Staying in" sounds like a huge fun party to me. But for my friends with 9-to-5 M-F jobs with zero travel, staying in is what they do five nights a week anyway, and the idea of burning a Saturday night to do that sounds about as excited as watching paint dry.
So if you need to stay home and nest on your off-nights, be sure to think about how that invitation sounds to your pals. Consider jazzing up the plans so that it's more of an event than just "I'm going to veg and you're free to sit on the couch with me." Maybe games night, fondue night, grilling out, movie night, book club, anything that says "this isn't throwaway, I care about you and spending time with you Having Fun."
posted by pineapple at 6:45 AM on October 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I'd look for a way to ditch the two jobs. I found out late in my University career that stashed away in the student union building there was a giant bookshelf full of government and private programs to help students pay for school. A lot of those involve loans that have to be paid back in some way but some are "work in kind" where you just agree to be employed for a certain period. So, guaranteed job in the future, money to pay for school now. If you could ditch even one of the jobs, that would do wonders for your schedule.
Otherwise, you could take a "this too shall pass" philosophy and just not have friends for a small number of years while you set up your future life.
posted by TeatimeGrommit at 8:05 AM on October 3, 2007
Otherwise, you could take a "this too shall pass" philosophy and just not have friends for a small number of years while you set up your future life.
posted by TeatimeGrommit at 8:05 AM on October 3, 2007
I just lost a friend because she was too busy. Well, that's what she told me, but I highly suspect it was fallout from a big fight we'd had.
The reason I gave up on her is because every time I asked to hang out, she was too busy. Really, you need to make some time to accept their invitations once in a while.
It's good that you're inviting them along, though... I'd have been thrilled if my friend had invited me to go grocery shopping with her. Maybe some of your friends would not be grateful, maybe they'd even be insulted, by such an invitation, but I'd gone grocery shopping with my friend before when it was the only way she had to spend time with me. We always had a great time.
Finally, what hurt the most was that she was a foster mother, but when she got one particular new baby, everyone else got to see her but me. She had the girl for 8 months and everyone else gushed about her but she was so busy that I didn't get to see her. When I told her that I was really disappointed that she wouldn't let me share such a big event in her life, well, she told me it was no big deal, and that did it for me.
So if something big happens in your life, like an engagement, set aside some time for each friend (even if you've already broken the news to them) to invite them over and introduce your fiancee. Just an example, of course.
I can deal with busy friends, but when it goes on and on for months, I just take the hint that they really don't want to spend time with me any more. So I think the key is that even though you have to turn friends down sometimes, to make time to accept their invitations or else call them up and say "I'd like to get together, when is good for you? You decide what we do together."
posted by IndigoRain at 8:27 AM on October 3, 2007
The reason I gave up on her is because every time I asked to hang out, she was too busy. Really, you need to make some time to accept their invitations once in a while.
It's good that you're inviting them along, though... I'd have been thrilled if my friend had invited me to go grocery shopping with her. Maybe some of your friends would not be grateful, maybe they'd even be insulted, by such an invitation, but I'd gone grocery shopping with my friend before when it was the only way she had to spend time with me. We always had a great time.
Finally, what hurt the most was that she was a foster mother, but when she got one particular new baby, everyone else got to see her but me. She had the girl for 8 months and everyone else gushed about her but she was so busy that I didn't get to see her. When I told her that I was really disappointed that she wouldn't let me share such a big event in her life, well, she told me it was no big deal, and that did it for me.
So if something big happens in your life, like an engagement, set aside some time for each friend (even if you've already broken the news to them) to invite them over and introduce your fiancee. Just an example, of course.
I can deal with busy friends, but when it goes on and on for months, I just take the hint that they really don't want to spend time with me any more. So I think the key is that even though you have to turn friends down sometimes, to make time to accept their invitations or else call them up and say "I'd like to get together, when is good for you? You decide what we do together."
posted by IndigoRain at 8:27 AM on October 3, 2007
elisynn:
Reading through your previous questions, I see that you...
...resent your 'interesting' friends and are bored by your nice ones.
...don't trust people, ascribe that fact to a 'breakup' with your best friend and unsupportive parents, and have screwed up several attempts to make new friends by 'pulling back, becoming cool or taking everything lightly' just when that person was learning about you.
...don't have any perspective at all about how much space work should take up in your life.
...are 'obsessed' with finding the right career even though by your own admission '[your] passion lies elsewhere.'
Now you 'run a very tight schedule with two jobs, volunteer work, and a full load of university classes,' and you justify your (let's cut to the chase here) asocial or antisocial management of your daily life with 'I have a lot of interests and I like to keep myself busy,' as if having 'lots of interests' is a Grade-A life and hanging out with friends barely a B+. You're 'a total introvert' and don't evince in your post any particular interest in your friends themselves, but here you are, writing to AskMe your third question in 14 months about how to make and maintain friendships.
OK then.
[Disclaimer: I'm not your shrink and so forth.]
1. Lots of people have lots of interests. Most of them learn to put themselves in social situations where they can't fuck off to entertain themselves all alone, and then adapt to those situations. That's a basic process of socialization, it begins when you're a tiny babychild, and if you desire to be a social creature rather than a run-down lonely one with an excellent résumé and a wide reading list, you must resume that process. If you want the pleasure of the company of other human beings, then you can't use 'I like to do things' as an excuse for staying away from them - not least because it's insulting to people who do plenty but still find time for rich mutual emotional exchange.
2. Do you have any idea how to relax? Have you literally investigated mechanisms by which your mind and body can slow down enough for you to enjoy what everyone else is into? You were mulling over being a librarian so I assume you're accustomed to sitting still, but that's not particularly relaxing to everyone. There are methods people use to take an edge off and lower their defenses to other people. Do you drink? Smoke dope? Rock out to the Rolling Stones or slow way down with Kind of Blue? Do you masturbate? Or get someone else to help? Do you write letters longhand, an activity that requires patience, stillness, and empathy?
Do you exercise? Like lungs-heaving work-up-a-good-sweat must-shower-afterward smiling-all-day exercise? It's a remarkable social equalizer (like video games) in addition to quieting body and mind.
You're a 'busybee' and you're 'getting tired' but you're definitely not asking advice on how to relax - you're asking commenters here to ratify your current lifestyle. Fortunately many of the people here are irascible bastards and are happy to point out when someone's crazytalking a little.
3. Why do the people who interest you seem unreliable? Because they're interested in stuff other than, y'know, you? Why do you get bored around your other friends? Because they're not 'busybees' too? If you desire to be like the people you can count on then you have to let yourself learn from them. If you desire to be like the people you can't depend on when you're in a crisis, then by all means go on, but if you make that choice you have only yourself to blame for close relationships that vanish.
4. You're inviting people to do stuff. Do what stuff, exactly? I wouldn't crochet with Jesus Himself but that reflects less on Him than on crocheting (and on me, of course). You can put together activities that other friends will find friendly but you've got to take that task seriously.
[Shit. I had two more long entries here but - Mac note - apparently the 'Edit in Textmate' input manager can't send Textmate output to a text field that isn't front-n-center in Safari, so they were lost. Shit! One of them was to do with finding new ways to volunteer with friends. One of them was to say, if you don't have time for everything then you need to drop some activities. Figure out what you can't live without and get rid of something else. Be honest with yourself - ultimately, plenty of other people hope you do well, but no one really cares what choices you make about how you spend your time. No one worth worrying about anyhow.]
7. Small thing, perhaps indicative, perhaps not: you've posted 8 questions to the Green but only 22 comments. Baby, you've got the time to read this shit - you've got the time to give it back. I imagine you're a good deal more connected than you realize if you'll...connect.
8. I hate everyone.
posted by waxbanks at 1:54 PM on October 3, 2007 [3 favorites]
Reading through your previous questions, I see that you...
...resent your 'interesting' friends and are bored by your nice ones.
...don't trust people, ascribe that fact to a 'breakup' with your best friend and unsupportive parents, and have screwed up several attempts to make new friends by 'pulling back, becoming cool or taking everything lightly' just when that person was learning about you.
...don't have any perspective at all about how much space work should take up in your life.
...are 'obsessed' with finding the right career even though by your own admission '[your] passion lies elsewhere.'
Now you 'run a very tight schedule with two jobs, volunteer work, and a full load of university classes,' and you justify your (let's cut to the chase here) asocial or antisocial management of your daily life with 'I have a lot of interests and I like to keep myself busy,' as if having 'lots of interests' is a Grade-A life and hanging out with friends barely a B+. You're 'a total introvert' and don't evince in your post any particular interest in your friends themselves, but here you are, writing to AskMe your third question in 14 months about how to make and maintain friendships.
OK then.
[Disclaimer: I'm not your shrink and so forth.]
1. Lots of people have lots of interests. Most of them learn to put themselves in social situations where they can't fuck off to entertain themselves all alone, and then adapt to those situations. That's a basic process of socialization, it begins when you're a tiny babychild, and if you desire to be a social creature rather than a run-down lonely one with an excellent résumé and a wide reading list, you must resume that process. If you want the pleasure of the company of other human beings, then you can't use 'I like to do things' as an excuse for staying away from them - not least because it's insulting to people who do plenty but still find time for rich mutual emotional exchange.
2. Do you have any idea how to relax? Have you literally investigated mechanisms by which your mind and body can slow down enough for you to enjoy what everyone else is into? You were mulling over being a librarian so I assume you're accustomed to sitting still, but that's not particularly relaxing to everyone. There are methods people use to take an edge off and lower their defenses to other people. Do you drink? Smoke dope? Rock out to the Rolling Stones or slow way down with Kind of Blue? Do you masturbate? Or get someone else to help? Do you write letters longhand, an activity that requires patience, stillness, and empathy?
Do you exercise? Like lungs-heaving work-up-a-good-sweat must-shower-afterward smiling-all-day exercise? It's a remarkable social equalizer (like video games) in addition to quieting body and mind.
You're a 'busybee' and you're 'getting tired' but you're definitely not asking advice on how to relax - you're asking commenters here to ratify your current lifestyle. Fortunately many of the people here are irascible bastards and are happy to point out when someone's crazytalking a little.
3. Why do the people who interest you seem unreliable? Because they're interested in stuff other than, y'know, you? Why do you get bored around your other friends? Because they're not 'busybees' too? If you desire to be like the people you can count on then you have to let yourself learn from them. If you desire to be like the people you can't depend on when you're in a crisis, then by all means go on, but if you make that choice you have only yourself to blame for close relationships that vanish.
4. You're inviting people to do stuff. Do what stuff, exactly? I wouldn't crochet with Jesus Himself but that reflects less on Him than on crocheting (and on me, of course). You can put together activities that other friends will find friendly but you've got to take that task seriously.
[Shit. I had two more long entries here but - Mac note - apparently the 'Edit in Textmate' input manager can't send Textmate output to a text field that isn't front-n-center in Safari, so they were lost. Shit! One of them was to do with finding new ways to volunteer with friends. One of them was to say, if you don't have time for everything then you need to drop some activities. Figure out what you can't live without and get rid of something else. Be honest with yourself - ultimately, plenty of other people hope you do well, but no one really cares what choices you make about how you spend your time. No one worth worrying about anyhow.]
7. Small thing, perhaps indicative, perhaps not: you've posted 8 questions to the Green but only 22 comments. Baby, you've got the time to read this shit - you've got the time to give it back. I imagine you're a good deal more connected than you realize if you'll...connect.
8. I hate everyone.
posted by waxbanks at 1:54 PM on October 3, 2007 [3 favorites]
I have busy friends who remember to call me, call back fairly promptly, and make some effort to see me. And I have busy friends who wouldn't mind seeing me if I came to their neck of the woods at a time that's convenient for them and who don't always call back, where it feels like they don't really care one way or another if we're friends. So, I agree that it's probably not the fact that you have a busy life that's the issue.
posted by salvia at 8:49 PM on October 3, 2007
posted by salvia at 8:49 PM on October 3, 2007
pineapple: busy people versus normal people
I think in most cases this is a false dichotomy. Most people are "busy". Just because I am not booked to the point of alienating people does not mean I have a less full life than (for example) the OP. I simply prioritize different things. Maybe the difference is that I (and others) prioritize friends and activities that we care about most highly, and some others prioritize their career and "obligations" most highly. I know I certainly don't envy the OP's lifestyle.
To be honest, with the people I know who continually overcommit themselves and never seem to have any fun, I sometimes wonder if they are not doing so to avoid the personal aspect of their life.
posted by loiseau at 12:16 PM on October 4, 2007
I think in most cases this is a false dichotomy. Most people are "busy". Just because I am not booked to the point of alienating people does not mean I have a less full life than (for example) the OP. I simply prioritize different things. Maybe the difference is that I (and others) prioritize friends and activities that we care about most highly, and some others prioritize their career and "obligations" most highly. I know I certainly don't envy the OP's lifestyle.
To be honest, with the people I know who continually overcommit themselves and never seem to have any fun, I sometimes wonder if they are not doing so to avoid the personal aspect of their life.
posted by loiseau at 12:16 PM on October 4, 2007
loiseau, I was merely answering the OP's question without trying to pass judgment. Sounds like you took the question -- and subsequent supportive responses -- personally, but that's about you, not me or the OP. If you believe that those of us who identify with the OP are somehow oppressing you or implying superiority over you, there are more appropriate places to work that out than AskMe.
posted by pineapple at 12:55 PM on October 4, 2007
posted by pineapple at 12:55 PM on October 4, 2007
Response by poster: Hi everyone,
Thanks for your responses, and I think I need to clear a few things up.
I used to be the type of person who only accommodated my friends, to the point where it was almost exclusively me going to places they wanted and planning outings that suited their schedules. That didn't work out because very few of them reciprocated and I didn't like feeling as though I had to revolve around their wants and preferences.
I do call and I do email, and I'm perfectly thrilled to just go to a friend's house (or follow them grocery shopping)--I don't care, so long as I get to see them. But frankly I've always done that a lot, and I've been trying to figure out how to strike a better balance--and sometimes that may involve me being a total ass as I try to figure out my limits and what kind of friend I'd like to be. I suppose that came across in the tone of my post.
Maybe I worded this posting very badly. Some great advice here, including ones saying that maybe I need to step back and get a better perspective on a bunch of things. I only meant to strictly ask for what people do to manage a busy life and friends, but I’m getting a lot of different responses. By the way, this is a temporary situation, and I have a very good reason to be so focused on school and career and all my extra-curricular stuff at the moment, so yes, right now my needs do trump everybody else's except for emergencies, a close friend, and family members.
Waxbanks: I post here because I find people on mefi to generally give some fantastic, no-nonsense and impartial advice. And I only comment when I feel I have something constructive or helpful to say or I can give some support. I also don't see the point of dragging my other posts into this, since taken together they don't reflect all that I am and I think I'm doing an ok job resolving the problems and questions I posted (and as I said, mefi has been a big help). You don't know the whole story or where I am now. I appreciate you taking the time to read through my past entries and making those suggestions (and I assume it was so you have a better understanding of where I was coming from), but I think I could do without the public airing and judgemental comments on half the stuff I wrote in the past. Please tell me if I'm off-base here.
Again, thanks for all your comments, everyone.
posted by elisynn at 11:06 PM on October 4, 2007
Thanks for your responses, and I think I need to clear a few things up.
I used to be the type of person who only accommodated my friends, to the point where it was almost exclusively me going to places they wanted and planning outings that suited their schedules. That didn't work out because very few of them reciprocated and I didn't like feeling as though I had to revolve around their wants and preferences.
I do call and I do email, and I'm perfectly thrilled to just go to a friend's house (or follow them grocery shopping)--I don't care, so long as I get to see them. But frankly I've always done that a lot, and I've been trying to figure out how to strike a better balance--and sometimes that may involve me being a total ass as I try to figure out my limits and what kind of friend I'd like to be. I suppose that came across in the tone of my post.
Maybe I worded this posting very badly. Some great advice here, including ones saying that maybe I need to step back and get a better perspective on a bunch of things. I only meant to strictly ask for what people do to manage a busy life and friends, but I’m getting a lot of different responses. By the way, this is a temporary situation, and I have a very good reason to be so focused on school and career and all my extra-curricular stuff at the moment, so yes, right now my needs do trump everybody else's except for emergencies, a close friend, and family members.
Waxbanks: I post here because I find people on mefi to generally give some fantastic, no-nonsense and impartial advice. And I only comment when I feel I have something constructive or helpful to say or I can give some support. I also don't see the point of dragging my other posts into this, since taken together they don't reflect all that I am and I think I'm doing an ok job resolving the problems and questions I posted (and as I said, mefi has been a big help). You don't know the whole story or where I am now. I appreciate you taking the time to read through my past entries and making those suggestions (and I assume it was so you have a better understanding of where I was coming from), but I think I could do without the public airing and judgemental comments on half the stuff I wrote in the past. Please tell me if I'm off-base here.
Again, thanks for all your comments, everyone.
posted by elisynn at 11:06 PM on October 4, 2007
elisynn, you said:
I don't consider that 'public airing [or] judgemental comments.' Besides, you did just complain that I was bringing in your old posts and complain that I didn't have enough context - in the same paragraph. All of which is not a big deal - I'm sorry I made you uncomfortable beyond what I take to be a product level of discomfort - but I would take that defensiveness as indicative of the same things I responded to in the first place. (Isn't this what AskMe is for?)
And I don't call out your relative lack of comments in order to guilt you; rather, I find that the best AskMe threads are the ones where the original poster responds to comments with clarifications, provocations, and additional questions, turning the whole thing into a conversation rather than a pile-on. I like to give stark advice because I find the prevailing emotional orthodoxy on AskMe to be wishy-washy and far too mired in the languages of therapy and victimhood-as-ideal-state. I hope it's taken generously rather than as abuse.
posted by waxbanks at 7:11 AM on October 8, 2007
By the way, this is a temporary situation, and I have a very good reason to be so focused on school and career and all my extra-curricular stuff at the moment, so yes, right now my needs do trump everybody else's except for emergencies, a close friend, and family members.Since it's obvious to most adults that maintaining friendships is work, work sucks, and therefore (at least sometimes) maintaining friendships sucks, I assumed the thread only needs one well-worded 'You have to put in the time' comment. A number of people have pointed out that it sounds like you're looking for justification for not putting in the social time, rather than advice for actually doing so. I thought it would be helpful to you to show that your various AskMe posts lend plausibility to that quick analysis. As I said, I'm surely no one's shrink, but there's a common phenomenon in AskMe 'Human Relations' threads, namely that posters tend to ask for advice about problems adjacent to their actual problems. You're asking how to lead a busy life and still have friends; it sounds to me like having a busy life isn't necessarily the root of your social problems, such as they are.
I don't consider that 'public airing [or] judgemental comments.' Besides, you did just complain that I was bringing in your old posts and complain that I didn't have enough context - in the same paragraph. All of which is not a big deal - I'm sorry I made you uncomfortable beyond what I take to be a product level of discomfort - but I would take that defensiveness as indicative of the same things I responded to in the first place. (Isn't this what AskMe is for?)
And I don't call out your relative lack of comments in order to guilt you; rather, I find that the best AskMe threads are the ones where the original poster responds to comments with clarifications, provocations, and additional questions, turning the whole thing into a conversation rather than a pile-on. I like to give stark advice because I find the prevailing emotional orthodoxy on AskMe to be wishy-washy and far too mired in the languages of therapy and victimhood-as-ideal-state. I hope it's taken generously rather than as abuse.
posted by waxbanks at 7:11 AM on October 8, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
You don't have to be perfect and are allowed friendships, or less friendships if that's what you want.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:30 PM on October 2, 2007