used Windows XP machine versus new Vista

September 24, 2007 12:57 PM

A poor friend needs a newer computer (Has Win98), but is leary of new machines w/ Vista. Is it a good idea to buy a used machine w/ WinXP? She only needs to do the basics, web + word process. Best way to buy used?

I'm a Mac user, so can't help much. Archives here seem to lean to XP. She really needs to get something soon. Can she get a new machine with XP?

posted by judybxxx to computers & internet (26 comments total)

A used or refurbished iMac, iBook or MacBook could be useful for her. Regardless, you can buy computers with XP these days, but it may need to be a special request.
posted by madh at 12:59 PM on September 24, 2007

Windows XP licenses will only be available through January 2008

I ordered mine with XP because Vista seems to be a lot slower.
posted by Comrade_robot at 1:04 PM on September 24, 2007

Yes, XP is still the preferred PC operating system. You can get a new PC with XP from certain vendors (Dell?) and places like Fujitsu, Lenovo and HP will sell Vista pre-installed but you can request an XP "downgrade disc" to install XP over it.
posted by lou at 1:05 PM on September 24, 2007

Seems the used market for computers is hit or miss as far as actual good deals. Through dell you can usually get a great desktop for $300-$400. Wal-mart carries decent computers at low prices, and their return policy is great if issues arise.

But, if you can find a good deal on a used computer go for it. You can always install Ubuntu or some other Linux flavor.

L
posted by peripatew at 1:07 PM on September 24, 2007

Oh, that's a good point re: Ubuntu. It's free and comes with the core office applications and web browser. For basic users it's awesome and support is getting better all the time.
posted by lou at 1:16 PM on September 24, 2007

You can get a Dell with a 17" flatscreen for $449 or less if you keep your eyes open. A couple of weeks ago the same system was $399 but with only 512Mb of memory.
posted by Ferrari328 at 1:21 PM on September 24, 2007

And it comes with XP
posted by Ferrari328 at 1:22 PM on September 24, 2007

It seems that the January 08 date is going to give. In any event, you can buy XP right now on a new machine.
posted by caddis at 1:26 PM on September 24, 2007

forget the link
posted by caddis at 1:26 PM on September 24, 2007

I'd recommend against a used machine. Shop the circulars for places like Staples, Best Buy, and CompUSA and there are $400-ish computers every week. That way you get a warranty and all that as well.

You can get XP machines still. Microsoft actually just made it clear that OEMs are allowed to offer "downgrades" to XP, so it may get even easier to get an XP machine. (That said, those I've talked to have enjoyed Vista. But there are certainly horror stories too. It might be easier starting with a new computer.)
posted by fogster at 1:27 PM on September 24, 2007

Check out one of the most recent MeFi FPPs -- HURF DURF VISTA EATER -- with links to:

Vista Backlash: Microsoft Quietly Lets Vista Users Revert to XP.

Microsoft quietly unveils Vista-to-XP downgrade.
posted by ericb at 1:34 PM on September 24, 2007

look at that, quonsar put that same info on the front page, and he even spelled better than i did
posted by caddis at 1:35 PM on September 24, 2007

Here's one at Staples, for $430. I've never heard of ZT Affinity, though. BestBuy has a $330 machine, but it's Vista.
posted by fogster at 1:36 PM on September 24, 2007

Option 1) - Get her a used Mac. Pretty good option since you can give her basic support since you use one as well.

Option 2) - Buy a Dell Vostro. Get XP. Get a 3-year warranty = $478 total (+ tax and S/H). Includes 1 GB of RAM.
posted by mysterious1der at 1:54 PM on September 24, 2007

I have had good experiences getting used corporate-surplus machines from places like RetroBox (now "Intechra Outlet"). You generally get a much higher-quality machine than if you buy a 'blue light special' from a big-box store that's had every possible corner cut when assembling it.

The machine will come with a bare hard drive, so she'll either need to install Windows herself or get someone to do it. That's not terribly hard, but it requires having actual Windows install discs (not 'restore' discs). Looking on eBay, there are legitimate NIB copies of XP going for around $80, if she doesn't have access to one already. But that way she's guaranteed to start off with a spyware/malware/adware-free machine and not the load of crap most consumer-targeted ones come with.

The stock of most corp-surplus places fluctuates by week or even by day, so it's worth checking frequently and jumping on something if it appears.
posted by Kadin2048 at 2:01 PM on September 24, 2007 [1 favorite]

Tigerdirect has 104 XP desktops and 46 XP laptops.
posted by jbickers at 2:02 PM on September 24, 2007

Thanks for the Mac suggestions - but she's freaked enough about a new Windows system, I'm sure that won't work.

I think the used corporate machines sound good, but she's not a techie. Are you recommending Intechra outlet, Kadin2048? are there other recommendations?
and what is NIB? (Not in Box?). I don't know if she's ready to deal with those outlets, but maybe.
Judy
posted by judybxxx at 2:27 PM on September 24, 2007

As someone who has Vista, I can say it's nowhere near as bad as it's made out to be. I'm not going to go into super detail because I'm tired of the Vista debate but I will say this. For the average, non expert user, Vista is a perfectly fine OS. And mind you, this is a web designer/applications guy saying this.

Hey I was able to write this whole post on Vista with no major problems.
posted by wile e at 3:06 PM on September 24, 2007 [1 favorite]

I'll second Ubuntu. It's definitely getting better and better and at this point I think it's a decent OS for many users. Do you know the specs (amount of RAM, processor speed, and HD size) of the machine? It's completely free to try and would be my first choice in her position.

Barring that, do you have a budget for her new(er) computer?
posted by 6550 at 3:25 PM on September 24, 2007

Some sound advice above.
But:
Your friend might need a newer machine, but perhaps she'd be better off upgrading the old one slightly - assuming that it still works - and then running XUbuntu off of it.

Just minutes ago I finished installing XUbuntu on my non-techie friends old Athlon 1GHz. I threw in 256M of RAM up to a total of 378M. That cost around 40$ here in Denmark.
For that money he gets another few years of usable computing out of the old box and XUbuntu is slicker and (for the most part) faster than Win ME. Plus it's WAY safer.

You don't have to be a techie to do basic stuff in Linux anymore.

It sounds like your friend is going to be freaked out anyway, so why not try?
Get a live cd and have a go at it :-)

Good luck!
posted by Thug at 3:26 PM on September 24, 2007

No, 6550, no budget. As little as possible, basically, so she can do a job search without total frustration from her old, Windows 98 machine, but she'll have to pay for help for getting it all together anyway, so there are trade-offs. She's a pretty basic user at the systems level, has used some software at jobs (Word, Excel).

Judy
posted by judybxxx at 8:24 PM on September 24, 2007

Used can be hit or miss, to be sure, but it seems that so few people actually look for used computers, that great deals can be had. I bought two nice, small PIII 1.2 Ghz, 256 mb ram desktops from craigslist for $60 each (oddly, they turned out to be 2Ghz P4s). Reuse your old monitor, or get an LCD which is <$100 nowadays. If you have the skills and time to reinstall windows and find the right drivers, used can be great. One of them is my parents' computer, the other is running a dental office. So check the local craigslist, if possible.
posted by alexei at 11:41 PM on September 24, 2007

If she has the ability to download and burn a CD or if you can do it for her give Ubuntu a shot (I'd recommend it over Kubuntu because it's more popular). The Live CD is the standard download. But my experience is you really need 512MB to do an install from the Live CD. 256 MB just didn't cut it. But given the fact that she's running 98 it may be old enough that she doesn't have that much RAM. At that point the Alternate Install, an option to check, is the way to go. But it's not nearly as user friendly, unfortunately. There are other Linux variants designed to run on very low resource machines but, like the Ubuntu Alternate Install, they probably aren't going to be as easy for her to install. Whereas the Live CD I think is easy enough for most people to use with a bit of computer experience. But now that I think about Damn Small Linux and Puppy Linux are both pretty easy to use and have Live CDs as well. The benefit with Ubuntu, though, is that it comes with Open Office as part of the install which basically should do all the spread sheet and word processing she needs.

She should make sure to back up any important documents first, though, and then during the install just wipe the hard drive clean (basically starting from scratch).

I'm only going on so much about Linux because it's free to try and others have already given you good advice on finding low-cost computers.
posted by 6550 at 11:43 PM on September 24, 2007

Microsoft quietly unveils Vista-to-XP downgrade
posted by chuckdarwin at 6:03 AM on September 25, 2007

I'm not sure of Ask Mefi etiquette - so please correct me if appropriate and I won't do it again. This is kind of an offshoot question-

6550 = you are actually tempting me to think about Ubuntu. As a mostly (95%) retired programmer, it's not likely I'd actually try it (the thought of learning another programming language after FORTRAN, assembler, BMDP, SAS, and now Stata, is not appealing,) But --- it's possible. please tell me briefly about Open Office. Can you exchange Word documents and Excel spreadsheets with others? And does it come for a Mac? Would it be cheaper than buying new Office?

Thanks,
Judy
posted by judybxxx at 4:02 PM on September 25, 2007

I'm not sure of Ask Mefi etiquette - so please correct me if appropriate and I won't do it again. This is kind of an offshoot question-

I'm certainly not the official word here but I don't think typically people take issue with offshoot questions or hijacks from other users, as long as it's topical. I sort of sidetracked it anyway with the suggestion for Ubuntu. It didn't actually answer your question but I thought it was relevant because it sounds like your friend needs a usable computer for as little money as possible, and Ubuntu does fit that bill.

The only etiquette problem I see is signing your comments!

You don't need to know programming to use Ubuntu anymore than you need it for XP or OS X, at least not at this point. Open Office, which comes in the standard install, can open and save MS Office files. One thing to pay attention to is the default save is OO's format, not MSO's, but that can be changed. Just something to watch out for, because MSO can't open the OO format files. But OO handles MSO files just fine in terms of opening and saving as them. There is an occasional formatting issue, but that's not often a big deal, at least I've never run into anything problematic.

I've used OO Writer and Calc (Word and Excel) and Draw quite a bit and have basically been happy. The one thing Writer doesn't handle as well is Track Changes; it works but it's clunkier. But that's a feature not many people use, particularly for home use. Impress is their version of Powerpoint. I've not used it but I hear it's not a satisfactory substitute for Powerpoint.

NeoOffice is the Mac OS X port of OO. There's also this port but my understanding is that NeoOffice is designed to look and function more like an OS X program than OO.

Would it be cheaper than buying new Office?

OpenOffice and NeoOffice are completely free! It's also available for Windows.

Maybe one day Microsoft will get a clue and release MS Office for Linux which would, a I suspect, put a serious damper on the development of OO. But for now I think OO is a viable alternative. For full disclosure I do have MS Office on my laptop (a Mac) because I bought it used and it was installed. But I honestly don't think I'll ever go back to Windows, unless work required it. My desktop has Ubuntu and I installed it on my previous laptop. I'd go back to Ubuntu on a laptop in a second if I needed a new one, unless Apple comes out with a smaller model than their current ones (mine is a 12" PowerBook).
posted by 6550 at 10:57 PM on September 25, 2007