T-shirts and ties: universal no-no?
September 11, 2007 8:53 AM Subscribe
Has anyone ever worn a tie on top of a t-shirts as a fashion statement?
Yes I do really mean a t-shirt. Like a nice, designer-y fitted tee. But with no collar, and with a tie worn on top of it. I've been wondering if this has ever been in fashion or at least been some kind of fashion statement by someone or a small group of people. Or is it so hokey that everyone unilaterally agrees it should never be done?
I can't find any examples of it, so maybe I just made it up, but I could have sworn I've seen it before on an alternative rock band, or maybe in a European or Japanese fashion magazine or something. I just don't know. Any help? Pics or it didn't happen!
Yes I do really mean a t-shirt. Like a nice, designer-y fitted tee. But with no collar, and with a tie worn on top of it. I've been wondering if this has ever been in fashion or at least been some kind of fashion statement by someone or a small group of people. Or is it so hokey that everyone unilaterally agrees it should never be done?
I can't find any examples of it, so maybe I just made it up, but I could have sworn I've seen it before on an alternative rock band, or maybe in a European or Japanese fashion magazine or something. I just don't know. Any help? Pics or it didn't happen!
I've certainly seen it in magazine spreads before. I recall it specifically from some GQ spreads during the mid-eighties.
But it looked ridiculous.
posted by OmieWise at 8:58 AM on September 11, 2007
But it looked ridiculous.
posted by OmieWise at 8:58 AM on September 11, 2007
Best answer: A Google image search of Avril Lavigne should turn up at least a few instances of this.
posted by methylsalicylate at 8:59 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by methylsalicylate at 8:59 AM on September 11, 2007
As methylsalicylate said, Avril Lavigne "rocked" this look 3-4 years ago. Keeping that in mind, I would not recommend doing it, particularly if you are female, but even if you are male. Just say no to doing anything that might give Avril Lavigne the impression that people like anything she does. Please.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:02 AM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:02 AM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
I think this was a punk thing. I can't point you to any pictures but I'm pretty sure there are pictures of the Sex Pistols with one of them dressed like this and I think Billy Idol did it also in his Generation X days.
posted by crios at 9:04 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by crios at 9:04 AM on September 11, 2007
Rather than wearing a tie with your t-shirt, maybe you should get one of those tuxedo t-shirts. It's about as stylish, and not nearly as conducive to being strangled.
posted by box at 9:05 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by box at 9:05 AM on September 11, 2007
Best answer: I saw somebody doing this just last night.
And, yes, I do live in NYC. Haha.
posted by atomly at 9:37 AM on September 11, 2007
And, yes, I do live in NYC. Haha.
posted by atomly at 9:37 AM on September 11, 2007
It is a fashion thingy that a lot of people would throw up in their mouths a little over, but try topping it off with a fedora.
posted by GleepGlop at 9:40 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by GleepGlop at 9:40 AM on September 11, 2007
then you can just throw up in the fedora, it's more convenient
posted by matteo at 9:59 AM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
posted by matteo at 9:59 AM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
Yes. It was in 1997, and I liked to wear a tie with a t-shirt and faded blue overalls. But it was also a faded, old t-shirt. It worked because of the contrast with the tie (which is itself a very socially loaded accessory). Since that was a decade ago, I'm just going to assume that Avril Lavigne has just been copying me.
Only thing was, I didn't know how to tie a tie. So I had male my friend tie my one tie, and then carefully didn't untie it.
Now I have a husband, which means I have a tie-tyer conveniently at my own house. I should go back to wearing ties again.
posted by jb at 10:09 AM on September 11, 2007
Only thing was, I didn't know how to tie a tie. So I had male my friend tie my one tie, and then carefully didn't untie it.
Now I have a husband, which means I have a tie-tyer conveniently at my own house. I should go back to wearing ties again.
posted by jb at 10:09 AM on September 11, 2007
I see this pretty often in New York -- T-shirt, tie, tight vest, fedora. Please don't contribute to the problem.
posted by booksandlibretti at 10:13 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by booksandlibretti at 10:13 AM on September 11, 2007
I remember seeing Frank Zappa at the Grammys a few years ago wearing a tuxedo, with bow tie, and no shirt, but I think that's a bit more than you were asking about.
posted by mephron at 10:17 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by mephron at 10:17 AM on September 11, 2007
this is extremely common, i'd say. avril lavigne made it even more popular in the mainstream, but lots of people were doing it prior (see above)
posted by timory at 10:21 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by timory at 10:21 AM on September 11, 2007
I always thought this was primarily an 80s thing, and that hipsters who do it now are being faux-throwback ironic.
posted by solipsophistocracy at 10:36 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by solipsophistocracy at 10:36 AM on September 11, 2007
My first thought was Johnny Rotten. Not sure about this one, but I think so.
posted by xammerboy at 11:38 AM on September 11, 2007
posted by xammerboy at 11:38 AM on September 11, 2007
Ha! What timing. I bought an awesome £2 tie from an op shop today with the intention of wearing it with a t-shirt. I figure I'll do it once for fun, take it off halfway through the night, and be too self conscious to put it back on again. But there's nothing wrong with trying something silly just for fun.
So yes, people do wear ties with t-shirts. I've seen it plenty of times among indie types, and saw it last week on a girl in Barcelona (which inspired today's purchase). I think it can look great, so long as you don't take yourself too seriously.
posted by hot soup girl at 11:56 AM on September 11, 2007
So yes, people do wear ties with t-shirts. I've seen it plenty of times among indie types, and saw it last week on a girl in Barcelona (which inspired today's purchase). I think it can look great, so long as you don't take yourself too seriously.
posted by hot soup girl at 11:56 AM on September 11, 2007
To be clear: it is not only obnoxious because it is done by hipsters or fashionistas, it is obnoxious AMONG hipsters and fashionistas, because it was kind of in style five years ago. So it's a no-go either way.
posted by YoungAmerican at 12:21 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by YoungAmerican at 12:21 PM on September 11, 2007
Greg Nog thinks about other peoples' clothes a lot more than I do.
I don't like the idea or the look, but I'd hate discourage you if it'd give you pleasure or you end up bringing something new and interesting to the look.
posted by birdie birdington at 12:42 PM on September 11, 2007
I don't like the idea or the look, but I'd hate discourage you if it'd give you pleasure or you end up bringing something new and interesting to the look.
posted by birdie birdington at 12:42 PM on September 11, 2007
Universal? Not so much.
Just because so What Not To Wear loser with a stick up his ass thinks a tie over a t-shirt is a crime against humanity doesn't mean you're not allowed to wear it. Wear what you want to wear.
That said, Avril Lavigne wrung the last bit of fun out of it, so I'm going to vote No.
posted by Reggie Digest at 12:43 PM on September 11, 2007
Just because so What Not To Wear loser with a stick up his ass thinks a tie over a t-shirt is a crime against humanity doesn't mean you're not allowed to wear it. Wear what you want to wear.
That said, Avril Lavigne wrung the last bit of fun out of it, so I'm going to vote No.
posted by Reggie Digest at 12:43 PM on September 11, 2007
(Just because some...)
posted by Reggie Digest at 12:43 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by Reggie Digest at 12:43 PM on September 11, 2007
Response by poster: Well, thanks for all the spirited discussion! (Particularly Greg's editorial.) What I mean by "universal no-no" is just that it's so abhorrent that you'll never find any examples of it anywhere, which, as people have pointed out, is untrue. That said, I was hoping for some more concrete examples than pics of Avril Lavigne, such as scans of aforementioned fashion magazines, but much thanks anyway!
posted by lou at 1:41 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by lou at 1:41 PM on September 11, 2007
My first thought was Howie Mandel.
Not sure about the tie with a t-shirt, but during the early years of St. Elsewhere one of his signature looks was the white doctor coat over a tuxedo t-shirt.
I can't talk. Back in high school I had a t-shirt with a denim overalls pattern.
It was the 70s. The technology was new. I was young.
posted by dhartung at 5:28 PM on September 11, 2007
Not sure about the tie with a t-shirt, but during the early years of St. Elsewhere one of his signature looks was the white doctor coat over a tuxedo t-shirt.
I can't talk. Back in high school I had a t-shirt with a denim overalls pattern.
It was the 70s. The technology was new. I was young.
posted by dhartung at 5:28 PM on September 11, 2007
On the right boy it can be cute. Very few of those who choose to wear it are the right boy.
posted by dame at 5:59 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by dame at 5:59 PM on September 11, 2007
Perhaps you could wear it more like a scarf than a tie?
posted by BrotherCaine at 7:38 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by BrotherCaine at 7:38 PM on September 11, 2007
One year in the late mid-late 80's, a bunch from the Wall Street Lunch Club (of which I was a founder) wore such for our Gay Pride parade group. It worked okay, in that context. This was back in the old days, when people still had to wear ties to work.
posted by Goofyy at 1:52 AM on September 12, 2007
posted by Goofyy at 1:52 AM on September 12, 2007
The tie & t-shirt thing isn't about exposing the tie around the neck. It's about the subversion of pairing an accessory (the tie) which is associated with high status and a bunch of other things, like formality, older age order, social conservatism, etc, with very low status clothing (the t-shirt), which is itself associated not only with lower social status, but also with youth, informality, social change, etc.
When someone wears a t-shirt and a tie, they are disrespecting the tie, and by extension, all things that ties represent in our culture. Maybe they are also playing with the tie - claiming the right to the high status that the tie represents, while at the same time insisting that the said status must come on their own terms. And, of course, the symbolism is even more powerful for women. Even in formal business wear, women rarely claim the tie, despite the fact that no powerful man would be without one, and the fact that women look very attractive with ties.
this is may sound more pomo than I almost ever am, but it makes sense to me. It's exactly what I was doing, wearing a t-shirt with a tie, and I conciously did put it with not only a t-shirt, but also faded and torn overalls. I was playing with what is still an extremely potent symbol of maleness, establishment, high status/high class. Politicians and CEOs wear ties, not plumbers or carpenters - unless of course the politician is trying to pretend that he understands the carpenter to get elected. You can't deny that ties mean something far more than simply a bit of colour around a man's neck, or it wouldn't be such a big deal that politicians like Bush or Blair conciously abandon their ties when they want to appear less like men in power and more like those who are not in power.
posted by jb at 8:12 AM on September 17, 2007
When someone wears a t-shirt and a tie, they are disrespecting the tie, and by extension, all things that ties represent in our culture. Maybe they are also playing with the tie - claiming the right to the high status that the tie represents, while at the same time insisting that the said status must come on their own terms. And, of course, the symbolism is even more powerful for women. Even in formal business wear, women rarely claim the tie, despite the fact that no powerful man would be without one, and the fact that women look very attractive with ties.
this is may sound more pomo than I almost ever am, but it makes sense to me. It's exactly what I was doing, wearing a t-shirt with a tie, and I conciously did put it with not only a t-shirt, but also faded and torn overalls. I was playing with what is still an extremely potent symbol of maleness, establishment, high status/high class. Politicians and CEOs wear ties, not plumbers or carpenters - unless of course the politician is trying to pretend that he understands the carpenter to get elected. You can't deny that ties mean something far more than simply a bit of colour around a man's neck, or it wouldn't be such a big deal that politicians like Bush or Blair conciously abandon their ties when they want to appear less like men in power and more like those who are not in power.
posted by jb at 8:12 AM on September 17, 2007
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posted by saladin at 8:56 AM on September 11, 2007