An ND in Toronto for migraine therapy including cannabis?
July 19, 2007 10:41 AM Subscribe
Experiences with naturopathic doctors and 5-HTP for chronic migraine?
I live in Toronto and would like to see a naturopathic doctor about my chronic migraine with aura. I would like to consult with an ND with experience treating migraine and who is open to including cannabis as part of my ongoing therapy.
Like this poster, I guess I ultimately desire a letter to a compassion club; unlike that poster, however, I'm legit.
I have been treated by my GP(s) -- my from-birth GP retired, and I was handed off to another -- for this since high school, with only moderate improvements. I'm now in my mid-20s. I have used various triptan drugs as migriane abortifacients, and have tried several low-dose tryciclics and as well as blood pressure drugs for prophylaxis. This effectively exhausts the first-line and most second-line drug treatments for migraine. My MD's solution is to up the dose, up the dose, then switch drugs, then up the dose, etc.
I've had an MRI, which came back clean. My MD feels that the diagnosis of chronic migraine with aura is solid.
The triptans work some of the time at maximum daily dose, but none of the daily-use drugs I've been on have substantially reduced the frequency with which I get migraines. At best, I'm hit once per week, at most daily for several days in a row.
As far as tricyclics are concerend, both amitriptylene and nortriptylene made me very drowsy (a plus if I'm having trouble sleeping, but a problem when I'm groggy through much of the morning) and have given me extremely disturbing dreams of a sort I'd never, ever experienced before along with profuse night sweats. What's more, my dentist feels that the nerve-pain relief and deeper-sleeping effect of the drug prevented me from noticing that I was grinding my teeth at night, which progressed very far before it was noticed in my last dental exam.
Based on research, I've tried substituting 5-HTP for the tricyclics, along with a small daily amount of marijuana. When a migraine starts, I still use the triptans -- but with marijuana, which mitigates the triptan side effects and helps deal with the pain if the drug doesn't work. This has gotten me to the point where I've only had one severe migraine in three weeks -- the best result in years! -- but I want to talk to a professional about the risks or other potential complementary therapies before I settle on this long-term.
I have considered applying to Health Canada for medical marijuana access, but migraine seems to be in a class that requires referral to TWO specialists and endorsements from both, which is onerous. The one specialist I have talked to is perfectly content to keep bumping up my tricyclic dose and insists that the side effects and semi-effectiveness are "the price you pay for relief". I am also concerned about 'poisoning' my relationship with my GP by asking about marijuana, as I have talked with others who have experienced a significant degradation in their care after doing so. I know that such a fear probably indicates I should find a new GP, but in Ontario right now that's far easier said than done.
How hard will it be to find a naturopath who won't see my continued use of triptans as interfering with their treatment, is willing to consider a compassion club note, and won't (ideally) won't insist that I first spend years iteratively abstaining from various foods (again, which never worked for me)?
Migraines have alread substantially affected my life, in that I could not hande the workload of the full-scholarship Masters' program in which I was previously enrolled. I've had enough of "settling for less" and underachieving to accomodate my health problems. I fear that unless I am able to find support and knowledgeable advice for the continuation of my current therapeutic regimen I will backslide and have serious difficulties reaching my full potential and holding down the sort of decent job for which I am qualified but fear I will lose because of absenteeism.
I live in Toronto and would like to see a naturopathic doctor about my chronic migraine with aura. I would like to consult with an ND with experience treating migraine and who is open to including cannabis as part of my ongoing therapy.
Like this poster, I guess I ultimately desire a letter to a compassion club; unlike that poster, however, I'm legit.
I have been treated by my GP(s) -- my from-birth GP retired, and I was handed off to another -- for this since high school, with only moderate improvements. I'm now in my mid-20s. I have used various triptan drugs as migriane abortifacients, and have tried several low-dose tryciclics and as well as blood pressure drugs for prophylaxis. This effectively exhausts the first-line and most second-line drug treatments for migraine. My MD's solution is to up the dose, up the dose, then switch drugs, then up the dose, etc.
I've had an MRI, which came back clean. My MD feels that the diagnosis of chronic migraine with aura is solid.
The triptans work some of the time at maximum daily dose, but none of the daily-use drugs I've been on have substantially reduced the frequency with which I get migraines. At best, I'm hit once per week, at most daily for several days in a row.
As far as tricyclics are concerend, both amitriptylene and nortriptylene made me very drowsy (a plus if I'm having trouble sleeping, but a problem when I'm groggy through much of the morning) and have given me extremely disturbing dreams of a sort I'd never, ever experienced before along with profuse night sweats. What's more, my dentist feels that the nerve-pain relief and deeper-sleeping effect of the drug prevented me from noticing that I was grinding my teeth at night, which progressed very far before it was noticed in my last dental exam.
Based on research, I've tried substituting 5-HTP for the tricyclics, along with a small daily amount of marijuana. When a migraine starts, I still use the triptans -- but with marijuana, which mitigates the triptan side effects and helps deal with the pain if the drug doesn't work. This has gotten me to the point where I've only had one severe migraine in three weeks -- the best result in years! -- but I want to talk to a professional about the risks or other potential complementary therapies before I settle on this long-term.
I have considered applying to Health Canada for medical marijuana access, but migraine seems to be in a class that requires referral to TWO specialists and endorsements from both, which is onerous. The one specialist I have talked to is perfectly content to keep bumping up my tricyclic dose and insists that the side effects and semi-effectiveness are "the price you pay for relief". I am also concerned about 'poisoning' my relationship with my GP by asking about marijuana, as I have talked with others who have experienced a significant degradation in their care after doing so. I know that such a fear probably indicates I should find a new GP, but in Ontario right now that's far easier said than done.
How hard will it be to find a naturopath who won't see my continued use of triptans as interfering with their treatment, is willing to consider a compassion club note, and won't (ideally) won't insist that I first spend years iteratively abstaining from various foods (again, which never worked for me)?
Migraines have alread substantially affected my life, in that I could not hande the workload of the full-scholarship Masters' program in which I was previously enrolled. I've had enough of "settling for less" and underachieving to accomodate my health problems. I fear that unless I am able to find support and knowledgeable advice for the continuation of my current therapeutic regimen I will backslide and have serious difficulties reaching my full potential and holding down the sort of decent job for which I am qualified but fear I will lose because of absenteeism.
This post was deleted for the following reason: poster's request -- jessamyn
Response by poster: Cgg: Yeah, I find that daunting as well. I've tried doing that for many, but not all such foods. One step-by-step program I've looked at would have taken something like 15 years to complete if you eliminated foods one by one (which you'd have to, if you wanted to isolate which food(s) made a difference).
posted by onshi at 11:29 AM on July 19, 2007
posted by onshi at 11:29 AM on July 19, 2007
Yes. Didn't work in the least, and considering I had to pay for the visits and medications out of pocket it turned out to be an extremely expensive waste of time.
Oh, and when it didn't work it was my fault for not trying hard enough (or not spending enough money on it, I suppose).
posted by watsondog at 11:31 AM on July 19, 2007
Oh, and when it didn't work it was my fault for not trying hard enough (or not spending enough money on it, I suppose).
posted by watsondog at 11:31 AM on July 19, 2007
Response by poster: Watsondog: yes, you saw a naturopathic doctor? Yes, you tried 5-HTP? If you're comfortable discussing it, I'd very much like to know more about your experience.
posted by onshi at 11:40 AM on July 19, 2007
posted by onshi at 11:40 AM on July 19, 2007
Yeah.. this book takes the opposite approach, saying it's a combination of the foods that cause the migraine, not just any single one. He says to eliminate them all, all at once, cold turkey. When your migraines have stabilized (ie none for 4 months), then you can slowly start adding foods one at a time. Worth a read tho (especially given your dependence on triptans, and the rebound misery they're causing you. Once again tho, it's all part of the plan, one you may or may not be able to go thru with). Another part of the book I especially liked is where he places some blame on doctors for not understanding, for using out of date theories, and for blaming the patient. For that reassurance alone, that no, it's not your fault, it's worth a read.
posted by cgg at 11:43 AM on July 19, 2007
posted by cgg at 11:43 AM on July 19, 2007
The Buchholz list of foods has helped me a lot. I've also tryied non-prescription preventatives like B-2, magnesium, and fish oil. Next up, CoQ10 and butterbur.
I have not tried 5-HTP. I looked into it when I was researching the above. It didn't seem promising to me. I don't remember the specifics, but the main sources I trust for this kind of info are:
www.drweil.com
www.headachedrugs.com
www.whfoods.com
Good luck!
posted by egk at 12:57 PM on July 19, 2007
I have not tried 5-HTP. I looked into it when I was researching the above. It didn't seem promising to me. I don't remember the specifics, but the main sources I trust for this kind of info are:
www.drweil.com
www.headachedrugs.com
www.whfoods.com
Good luck!
posted by egk at 12:57 PM on July 19, 2007
5-HTP has never done anything for my chronic pain, and I've never gone to a naturopath. I can, however, recommend butterbur extract for migraine. It has made a nearly miraculous difference in my life. It's available for around $20 in well-stocked natural medicine stores or online (just for an example). I take one of those capsules in the morning and one at night; that pretty well takes care of me. If a migraine gets through that, I just pop one more and I'm good again.
posted by bryon at 9:16 AM on July 20, 2007
posted by bryon at 9:16 AM on July 20, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
(Personally, I've done steps 1 & 3 and it has helped, but Step 2 where he wants you to eliminate every single food that has ever caused a migraine for anybody, ever, for at least 4 moths, is too daunting for me right now.)
posted by cgg at 11:16 AM on July 19, 2007