Plant extracts and staying out of jail
April 16, 2007 6:51 AM Subscribe
I would like to bring 300ml of Ayahuasca tea from Brazil to the United States for personal use.
I had the opportunity to experience Ayahuasca, and would like to continue this experience in the states. It appears that this is a quase-legal state. However, I would like to get home and see my family and stay out of jail. Do I have the right (under the law)? Am I better off mailing it?
I had the opportunity to experience Ayahuasca, and would like to continue this experience in the states. It appears that this is a quase-legal state. However, I would like to get home and see my family and stay out of jail. Do I have the right (under the law)? Am I better off mailing it?
It's illegal.
BTW, I'm a criminal defense attorney, and I know a lot about this particular topic.
You might be interested in checking out the UDV case decided by the Supreme Court a couple years ago:
http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/022206supcourt.cfm
The UDV church had their tea confiscated and the members were threatened with prosecution, but they eventually won the right to use the tea under the Religious Freedom Restoration Act.
If you read that case, you'll see that there's no question but that ayahuasca is illegal under federal law (and likely most state laws as well). I wouldn't count on being so fortunate (read: wealthy enough to hire excellent attorneys) as the UDV was.
posted by mikeand1 at 8:55 AM on April 16, 2007
BTW, I'm a criminal defense attorney, and I know a lot about this particular topic.
You might be interested in checking out the UDV case decided by the Supreme Court a couple years ago:
http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/022206supcourt.cfm
The UDV church had their tea confiscated and the members were threatened with prosecution, but they eventually won the right to use the tea under the Religious Freedom Restoration Act.
If you read that case, you'll see that there's no question but that ayahuasca is illegal under federal law (and likely most state laws as well). I wouldn't count on being so fortunate (read: wealthy enough to hire excellent attorneys) as the UDV was.
posted by mikeand1 at 8:55 AM on April 16, 2007
mikeand1: Do you know, as a criminal defense attorney, if the ingredients are illegal, or just the tea? Looks like there are still suppliers of the bark and root in the States.
posted by billysumday at 9:27 AM on April 16, 2007
posted by billysumday at 9:27 AM on April 16, 2007
Best answer: The tea itself is illegal, as are the ingredients.
Re the tea: According to the most common recipe, one of the ingredients contains DMT, a Schedule I controlled substance under federal law. Federal law prohibits not only DMT itself, but also any "mixture or substance" containing a detectable amount of it. There's no doubt that tea is a "mixture" under federal law.
Re the plant materials themselves: It is a slightly closer call judging from the language, but 99% of courts are going to say that they are a "mixture or substance" containing the scheduled chemical (just as the federal district court handling the UDV case did.)
For example, consider hallucinogenic mushrooms, which typically contain the scheduled substance psilocybin. Off the top of my head, I'm aware of exactly one (1) case in which a court said mushrooms were not a "mixture or substance". It was a Florida state court case, if I recall correctly (construing an identically worded state law). Every other court to consider the matter has decided they're illegal.
Yes, there are suppliers, but that doesn't make it legal. It just means that law enforcement doesn't spend a lot of time and resources pursuing them.
So, while the chances you get caught may be small, you still must keep in mind that it is illegal.
BTW, one way to use it legally in the States: Join the UDV church! Of course, they're Christians, and you may not be into the whole organized religion thing.
posted by mikeand1 at 9:47 AM on April 16, 2007
Re the tea: According to the most common recipe, one of the ingredients contains DMT, a Schedule I controlled substance under federal law. Federal law prohibits not only DMT itself, but also any "mixture or substance" containing a detectable amount of it. There's no doubt that tea is a "mixture" under federal law.
Re the plant materials themselves: It is a slightly closer call judging from the language, but 99% of courts are going to say that they are a "mixture or substance" containing the scheduled chemical (just as the federal district court handling the UDV case did.)
For example, consider hallucinogenic mushrooms, which typically contain the scheduled substance psilocybin. Off the top of my head, I'm aware of exactly one (1) case in which a court said mushrooms were not a "mixture or substance". It was a Florida state court case, if I recall correctly (construing an identically worded state law). Every other court to consider the matter has decided they're illegal.
Yes, there are suppliers, but that doesn't make it legal. It just means that law enforcement doesn't spend a lot of time and resources pursuing them.
So, while the chances you get caught may be small, you still must keep in mind that it is illegal.
BTW, one way to use it legally in the States: Join the UDV church! Of course, they're Christians, and you may not be into the whole organized religion thing.
posted by mikeand1 at 9:47 AM on April 16, 2007
^^^ Re the above, where I said "(just as the federal district court handling the UDV case did.)"
That may be wrong; it may be that the court was considering only the tea, and not the plant materials themselves. It's been a while since I looked over those opinions.
posted by mikeand1 at 9:50 AM on April 16, 2007
That may be wrong; it may be that the court was considering only the tea, and not the plant materials themselves. It's been a while since I looked over those opinions.
posted by mikeand1 at 9:50 AM on April 16, 2007
You probably know this already, but FWIW -- DMT can be found in some very common and ubiquitous plants. Phalaris grass, for instance.
posted by treepour at 11:03 AM on April 16, 2007
posted by treepour at 11:03 AM on April 16, 2007
Actually, I believe the sources say that the ingredients are not illegal at all, as the DEA has tried but failed to get the non-active plants explicitly classified as Schedule 1; you can buy and sell them quite readily from several sources in the US. Buying online, you won't likely be arrested (broken windows theory and all) even if there were zealous arrests.
The DMT-containing leaf is by itself not psychoactive orally (unlike mushrooms, which come out of the ground as ready-to-eat hallucinogens), it's the mixture that makes the tea. So... once you make the tea, you're breaking the law. Transporting the tea itself = Schedule 1 drug. Transporting the leaf and vines, and a 8.5x11 sheet of paper with instructions on how to make the tea = should be perfectly legal. But yeah, you can buy the ingredients online, they aren't that expensive.
Also (since I was the poster of the previously cited AskMe in this thread's first comment), I can attest that www.ayahuasca.org has some good recipes and forums, but that it's actually surprisingly hard to make a good batch.
posted by hincandenza at 12:40 PM on April 16, 2007
The DMT-containing leaf is by itself not psychoactive orally (unlike mushrooms, which come out of the ground as ready-to-eat hallucinogens), it's the mixture that makes the tea. So... once you make the tea, you're breaking the law. Transporting the tea itself = Schedule 1 drug. Transporting the leaf and vines, and a 8.5x11 sheet of paper with instructions on how to make the tea = should be perfectly legal. But yeah, you can buy the ingredients online, they aren't that expensive.
Also (since I was the poster of the previously cited AskMe in this thread's first comment), I can attest that www.ayahuasca.org has some good recipes and forums, but that it's actually surprisingly hard to make a good batch.
posted by hincandenza at 12:40 PM on April 16, 2007
The ingredients aren't illegal, processing them is. DMT which, besides an MOAI, is the primary ingredient in the tea.
As others have said, you can find DMT in many plants. It's also present in minute quantities in humans.
posted by melt away at 3:17 PM on April 16, 2007
As others have said, you can find DMT in many plants. It's also present in minute quantities in humans.
posted by melt away at 3:17 PM on April 16, 2007
"Actually, I believe the sources say that the ingredients are not illegal at all..."
What sources are you referring to?
posted by mikeand1 at 3:18 PM on April 16, 2007
What sources are you referring to?
posted by mikeand1 at 3:18 PM on April 16, 2007
It's also present in minute quantities in humans.
Are you suggesting that the OP harvest pineal glands instead?
posted by exlotuseater at 12:24 AM on April 17, 2007
Are you suggesting that the OP harvest pineal glands instead?
posted by exlotuseater at 12:24 AM on April 17, 2007
« Older Looking for a cognitive behavioral therapist in... | Help Nuts and Volts make sense! Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by prostyle at 6:56 AM on April 16, 2007