Comments on: Fancy a melee?

Question: Fancy a melee?

Octaviuz — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:18:50 -0800

Are there any sports that are contested by more than two teams simultaneously? three or

My apologies to cyclists, NCAA golfers and relay runners but I mean multiple teams on the field of play; perhaps all trying move an object or objects into designated areas.

This question is inspired by a childhood notion of a version of soccer played on a square field with four teams and four goals. (It has since grown in my mind into a hexagonal field with six teams and three balls, scoring not permitted in neighboring goals.) Before I patent this stroke of genius, I feel I should do due dilligence here.

By: Paragon

Paragon — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:26:31 -0800

Not a real example, but in the book The Great Waldo Search (aka Where's Waldo: The Fantastic Journey) there's a page named 'The Great Ball-Game Players' that looks just like you describe (four teams, four goals), with the addition of a giant pit in the middle where you could throw your opponents' balls.

By: smackfu

smackfu — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:30:58 -0800

They want to add ballroom dancing to the Olympics. It meets your conditions if not your intent.

By: washburn

washburn — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:33:20 -0800

That's funny; I thought of the Where's Waldo game, too. I also think I remember reading about a similar game played in the nineteenth century by students at my university, where multiple teams tried to climb up an oiled pole and ring a bell or something. The sort of crazy thing that just isn't done anymore but that may once have been pretty widespread. Neat question, anyhow.

By: sindas

sindas — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:34:51 -0800

Sometimes a version of basketball is played with more than two teams... using one goal, usually.

By: krisjohn

krisjohn — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:43:32 -0800

Bowling?

By: ikkyu2

ikkyu2 — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:48:07 -0800

Chinese Checkers, although it's a board game, not an athletic contest.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:00:24 -0800

Chessapeak is Chess for four players.

By: ontic

ontic — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:09:09 -0800

I don't really know anything about it, but people have told me that car racing is mostly about "teams" nowadays. Pit crews and drivers could all be said to be on a field.

I'm also pretty sure you can be on more than two teams at any one time in Calvinball since you can make up rules as you go along.

By: kisch mokusch

kisch mokusch — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:17:19 -0800

Swimming and athletics relays.

By: aubilenon

aubilenon — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:22:03 -0800

Competitive cycling, especially the Tour de France, maybe fits your criteria. Though the individuals get a lot of the credit and glory, it is very much at team sport, with team-oriented strategies and so on.

By: aubilenon

aubilenon — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:22:58 -0800

(sorry, I missed your acknowledgment and disqualification of cycling.)

By: fair_game

fair_game — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:27:49 -0800

darts, pool (sometimes), and four square.

By: kisch mokusch

kisch mokusch — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:42:42 -0800

(sorry, I missed your acknowledgment and disqualification of relays.)

By: Justinian

Justinian — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:46:11 -0800

Paintball? Ok, so "sport" is relative...

By: MadamM

MadamM — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:01:21 -0800

I played soccer like you describe in elementary school PE. Four teams, four goals, two balls. So I dunno if you can patent the idea :).

By: b1tr0t

b1tr0t — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:43:52 -0800

Are there any sports that are contested by more than two teams simultaneously?

Sailboat racing. Except for match racing, most regattas consist of a large group of boats trying to make it around the course. Each boat typically has between two and a dozen people working on it.

Many forms of auto racing involve teams, however the teamwork has more to do with team prestige (which often means better sponsorship) than a "team win." ontic mentions the pit crew, which is important. In 24-hour races like Le Mans, multiple drivers are required. Many racing teams enter multiple into a race.

Eastern European coalition elections. I don't have any Serbian friends at the moment, but if you found one who could narrate the current process for forming a government, you'd probably find it vastly more interesting than our so-called western sports.

By: dammitjim

dammitjim — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:45:55 -0800

Crew and most other sailing races like the America's Cup feature many teams at once, and each car in a Rally has a team of two inside. But it sounds like you want teams on foot, on a field, where the entire teams are engaged at once. Can't think of any.

By: dammitjim

dammitjim — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:46:09 -0800

Curses!

By: niles

niles — Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:46:21 -0800

eh, dodgeball? We would play massive (like, ~60 people per team) 2 to 4 team dodgeball at camp over the summer.

Yes, we had a lot of refs.

By: rongorongo

rongorongo — Mon, 29 Jan 2007 04:01:21 -0800

Adventure Racing might be an interesting one to read up on for ideas. It involves teams (typically of 4 or 5) which compete against each other on a variety of tasks such as trekking or kayaking. The whole team is involved in each activity at any one time and teams are separated from each other either by a staggered start or by a circus arrangement whereby all teams start with a different activity and all teams change activities at a given time. (of course this is also the model for countless other activities in training and education - they just tend not to be "sports" in their own right).

My guess is that to make your game a success you would need to to consider time management very carefully - you have a limited amount of space and not all teams will be able to occupy all of it at the same time.

I would also consider looking at handicapping systems carefully - this could be a help when it comes to establishing an overall winner in an environment where not everybody will be competing head on with every other team. Yacht racing has a relatively complex rolling handicap system that accounts for both the type of vessel and the past performance of it and its crew for example.

By: Plutor

Plutor — Mon, 29 Jan 2007 05:03:15 -0800

It looks like there are three types of competitions that people are suggesting here:

1) Modified versions of usually two-competitor games, like chess, soccer, or dodgeball.
2) Authentically multi-player board games, like Chinese checkers.
3) Racing sports or achievement sports like golf or NASCAR.

The most interesting solution to this question would be a team sport that is natively n-team, like Chinese checkers. The soccer variant mentioned in the question, while cool, doesn't really meet the criteria, since it falls under type #1.

By: afx237vi

afx237vi — Mon, 29 Jan 2007 05:57:59 -0800

Definitely pro cycling. Nine team-mates in a team, and anywhere between a dozen and twenty-four teams (22 in the Tour de France) all on the same road, each trying to manoeuvre their leader into the right position.

By: Doofus Magoo

Doofus Magoo — Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:26:49 -0800

In one or two of the books in Robert Asprin's M.Y.T.H. series, they played a soccer-type game similar to what you describe, but on a triangular field with three teams.

By: poppo

poppo — Mon, 29 Jan 2007 09:46:07 -0800

Your use of [more inside] has been deemed overly-clever. Consider yourself on watch.

By: rongorongo

rongorongo — Tue, 30 Jan 2007 03:16:52 -0800

Assume you have a straightforward example of 4 team soccer - team A plays team B while team X plays Y. You use a cross shaped pitch, 2 balls and 2 referees. Chaotic and quite fun to participate in or watch once. But there are two problems that would prevent the game from being anything more than a novelty:

1. If teams A and X win in the individual games how do you fairly determine the overall winner without having to hold a playoff between them?

2. There is a problem of, say, A vs B contest turning into a farce because of irrelevant interruptions from the X vs Y play. If the interruptions appear in some pattern then there is a chance that the teams could use skill to overcome them - but if they are random then it is the sporting equivalent of a sudden hailstorm stopping play of a dog running off with the ball.

If you can solve these problems you will be onto something.

By: Octaviuz

Octaviuz — Tue, 30 Jan 2007 20:44:47 -0800

I'm not sure I would describe your example as four-team soccer. It appears to be two separate games on fields which intersect.
My game would permit each team to shoot at three goals. Each team's final score would be reported as a two number group (GF, GA).

Yes, I have overthought this (no, I do not actually mean to do anything with it)