Save Christmas with Your Audio Advice!
January 11, 2007 12:55 PM Subscribe
Audio/Video help needed - suggest small mic to help me fight Canon Elura 100 (evil) motor hum! (Help me love my Christmas gift!)
[Rambling background time!] I did my time in the Radio/TV/Film degree (in the dark ages of the 90s) using the Canon L2 High 8 (owned by the school), so I'm probably pretty spoiled. I have happily used an old Panasonic Palmcorder (I forget the model) - so I'm used to lower quality and built in mics. However, the Canon Elura 100 was a Christmas gift and I both love and hate the thing. The visuals are great - the size is wonderful, especially since I travel with a larger Canon digital for photographs and I plan to take both to Ireland and on treks around the US - I need something this size and weight. What I was not prepared for was the evil motor hum that is mentioned in many reviews of this thing (and my camera seems to have a quieter version of the noise that others complain of, so maybe I'm lucky). Even if I lay down some background music on the video it's going to obvious enough to me to make me crazy, and then there are my plans to get audio from family members that may in time be more of interest (to family) than the video. Thankfully the camera does have a mic terminal, which is the main reason I'm ok with keeping it. I've decided to invest in a good small mic that will allow me to get ambiant noise and small interviews with family - and that's what I need the advice on. A good mic is something I can use in the future for podcasts, etc., but since it will travel a bit I don't want to spend vast sums.
[The question!] ]What's a good lav (or small mic) you can recommend in the $100-200 neighborhood - and then give me any recommendations that assume I have all the money in the world, just so I can torture myself. Cheaper would be better - but I understand that cheap audio equipment almost always gives poor sound. I've had bad luck in the past with cordless lav mics, but that was back in the dark ages, so perhaps they're better now. Anyone? Anyone?
[And since this will now be searchable for random googlers - I don't recommend this camera for anyone who doesn't plan to use a mic and/or remove audio and edit in your own narration. Unless you know you will have as much fun editing the video as shooting it, be wary of any of the newer small Canons, as they all may have some problem with the motor noise being picked up by the mics. Apparently some people don't notice it as much, and it can be less extreme on some of the models. This is apparently the trade off for the small size and the price. Or so I gather from the reading I've done on this camera.]
[Rambling background time!] I did my time in the Radio/TV/Film degree (in the dark ages of the 90s) using the Canon L2 High 8 (owned by the school), so I'm probably pretty spoiled. I have happily used an old Panasonic Palmcorder (I forget the model) - so I'm used to lower quality and built in mics. However, the Canon Elura 100 was a Christmas gift and I both love and hate the thing. The visuals are great - the size is wonderful, especially since I travel with a larger Canon digital for photographs and I plan to take both to Ireland and on treks around the US - I need something this size and weight. What I was not prepared for was the evil motor hum that is mentioned in many reviews of this thing (and my camera seems to have a quieter version of the noise that others complain of, so maybe I'm lucky). Even if I lay down some background music on the video it's going to obvious enough to me to make me crazy, and then there are my plans to get audio from family members that may in time be more of interest (to family) than the video. Thankfully the camera does have a mic terminal, which is the main reason I'm ok with keeping it. I've decided to invest in a good small mic that will allow me to get ambiant noise and small interviews with family - and that's what I need the advice on. A good mic is something I can use in the future for podcasts, etc., but since it will travel a bit I don't want to spend vast sums.
[The question!] ]What's a good lav (or small mic) you can recommend in the $100-200 neighborhood - and then give me any recommendations that assume I have all the money in the world, just so I can torture myself. Cheaper would be better - but I understand that cheap audio equipment almost always gives poor sound. I've had bad luck in the past with cordless lav mics, but that was back in the dark ages, so perhaps they're better now. Anyone? Anyone?
[And since this will now be searchable for random googlers - I don't recommend this camera for anyone who doesn't plan to use a mic and/or remove audio and edit in your own narration. Unless you know you will have as much fun editing the video as shooting it, be wary of any of the newer small Canons, as they all may have some problem with the motor noise being picked up by the mics. Apparently some people don't notice it as much, and it can be less extreme on some of the models. This is apparently the trade off for the small size and the price. Or so I gather from the reading I've done on this camera.]
Response by poster: This definitely gives me something to search for - the Sennheisers I'd seen in the past were all largeish in size. Annoyingly there isn't a shoe to mount mic or light on this camera (seems to be becoming the norm), but I have no problem with rigging something or simply holding the mic.
posted by batgrlHG at 2:37 PM on January 11, 2007
posted by batgrlHG at 2:37 PM on January 11, 2007
How large is large-ish? The one I used was about 1/2" in diameter and ~10" long. That's "large-ish" by some definitions, but not nearly so long as the 12-18" modular Sennheisers I've used for more serious work. For mounting options, you might look into getting (or building, if you are so inclined) a shoe mount that screws into the 1/4" tripod mount on your camera. I've not looked into these, but I know they exist and they may be a sane mounting option..
Regarding cordless lavs: I used an AudioTechnica set with XLR outputs (again, never got the model number) when I was shooting a 'talking-heads'-heavy documentary in film school. Freaking amazing sound for the effort involved. Not as nice as the Rolls-Royce-level wireless set I got to play with on an indie set last summer (hundreds of dollars a week.. to rent!), but also much more affordable.
posted by Alterscape at 5:12 PM on January 11, 2007
Regarding cordless lavs: I used an AudioTechnica set with XLR outputs (again, never got the model number) when I was shooting a 'talking-heads'-heavy documentary in film school. Freaking amazing sound for the effort involved. Not as nice as the Rolls-Royce-level wireless set I got to play with on an indie set last summer (hundreds of dollars a week.. to rent!), but also much more affordable.
posted by Alterscape at 5:12 PM on January 11, 2007
Is it something you could remove in post processing? I would assume that it's a constant noise, which should be able to be identified and removed by most audio programs, (I know that both Sound Forge and Audacity have noise removal filters.) Though as wav editors, that might be kind of a drag to have to extract the audio, process it, and then reassemble it. Something in my head says that Final Cut Pro has this ability as well, but since my Mac bricked itself, I can't verify.
A new Mic is probably a better idea, but this might be an option to salvage your existing footage.
posted by quin at 5:41 PM on January 11, 2007
A new Mic is probably a better idea, but this might be an option to salvage your existing footage.
posted by quin at 5:41 PM on January 11, 2007
All your basic choices can be found listed here. (B&H Video, in NYC -- the pro's choice for such things). They start at $40 for a basic on-camera mic and go as high as you can imagine. The Sony ECM 908 is about as well as you can do for under $100. Alterscape is probably talking about the Audio-Technica AT-825, which has XLR connectors (you'd need an adapter for the Elura, and it's overkill -- the XLRs mean it can run on phantom power). If you can swing the $250 or so, AT makes the same mic in a standard mini-plug version, called the AT-822, and it's my basic camcorder mic of choice for semi-pro purposes -- a beautiful sounding mic for music, especially -- but has no shotgun effect (where the mic zooms with the camera).
I'd start with one of the $50-100 options from B&H and see how happy that made me.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:42 AM on January 12, 2007
I'd start with one of the $50-100 options from B&H and see how happy that made me.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:42 AM on January 12, 2007
And yes, the motor hum can be removed by filtering and EQ, but it probably does overlap other usable frequencies. I use BIAS SoundSoap for such things, but a little experimentation in audacity might get a decent result. You won't get it entirely, though. This (motor noise through onboard mics) is a fatal flaw of consumer camcorder design.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:48 AM on January 12, 2007
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:48 AM on January 12, 2007
Aggh, my B&H link doesn't work. Here is the correct link:
Shotgun and on camera mics.
You should resort by "Price (low to high)" so you don't have a heart attack looking at $800 mics, and you'll see lots of choices under $100. Apparently, the sorted views don't have stable URLS, which is why my link above is no good.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:52 AM on January 12, 2007
Shotgun and on camera mics.
You should resort by "Price (low to high)" so you don't have a heart attack looking at $800 mics, and you'll see lots of choices under $100. Apparently, the sorted views don't have stable URLS, which is why my link above is no good.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:52 AM on January 12, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Alterscape at 2:12 PM on January 11, 2007