I repent

January 10, 2007 12:12 PM

I may have filled out inaccurate information on my first car insurance application a month ago, namely "forgetting" to mention an accident I had 2.5 years ago when I was driving someone else's car (their insurance covered it) in another state with a different license. Now I am worried sick and have a bunch of questions and I don't want to ask the insurance company.

It was probably my fault and I got a ticket for it. Basically, I thought it was 3.5 years ago (so avoiding the "have you been in an accident in the last 3 years" question) but now I realize it's not. Now I am afraid of getting future claims denied or getting busted if I make them in the future.

Can I be fined for this if they find out?
Does that accident really count because it was not on my insurance?
Can they find it even though I had a different license?
Do insurance companies ever re-check your record?
Will they deny me claims in the future because of misrepresentation on the insurance application?

Also, I don't remember if I have had any traffic violations (I put none on the form) because once I got it deferred and once I took driving school, so I don't know if they are on my record.

posted by anonymous to travel & transportation (21 comments total)

Of course if you have a claim and they find any inaccuracy, you are going to be dinged for it. Now that you "remember" it, the smart thing to do would be to update them with the facts.
posted by Listener at 12:22 PM on January 10, 2007

The only way they have to check up on you is via C.L.U.E., and they ran that report anyways. They don't actually trust people to tell the truth.
posted by smackfu at 12:23 PM on January 10, 2007

I don't think you have anything to worry about - don't sweat it.

On a side note - that C.L.U.E. site is cool - I didn't know that existed - and it's free!
posted by internal at 12:32 PM on January 10, 2007

Don't worry about it, usually they'll just raise your rate to what it would be with this bit included. Done it before for tickets. The only time it's a big problem is with a suspended license (disclaimer: your insurance company may be more asshole-like than mine were). See also.
posted by IronLizard at 12:33 PM on January 10, 2007

This comment in particular.
posted by IronLizard at 12:34 PM on January 10, 2007

I think the usual terms you agree to when filling out this kind of thing states specifically "knowingly providing false information." I think they'd have to go a long way to prove you did so knowingly. Your rates might go up, I expect, but not much else.
posted by loiseau at 12:39 PM on January 10, 2007

Tell them now, before you file a claim. Your rates may or may not change, but you won't be in any trouble.
posted by alms at 1:03 PM on January 10, 2007

Always always always short-change insurance people with your info.

The accident was not on your current license, so they won't know about it as long as you don't give them any reason to check.

Insurance people's primary job is not to provide you with coverage, it's to soak you for as much money as possible.
posted by wfc123 at 1:14 PM on January 10, 2007

Well first off not realizing the accident was sooner then 3 years is not a crime but knowing it now and not informing your insurer is!! 1. Yes you can be fined now since you are knowingly and willingly defrauding the insurance company. Plus I might add admitting to it on the internet.
when you say different license what does that mean? under a false name an alias?
Yes the insurance companies recheck your record
The insurance company has the rite to deny a claim but most likely wouldn't.
If you received a ticket you probably got points on your license and because of that you most likely have insurance points making some or part of the accident chargeable.
If the actual accident can be charged to you the insurance companies don't go back to the date of accident but to the date they close the claim. So if the accident happened 3/21/03 and the insurance company didn't settle the claim till 3/21/04 the accident wont go of your record till 3/21/07.
hope that helps
posted by antisocialiting at 1:19 PM on January 10, 2007

Always always always short-change insurance people with your info. commit insurance fraud.

Or maybe you shouldn't do that. Tell them.
posted by grouse at 1:39 PM on January 10, 2007

This isn't insurance fraud. Insurance fraud is when you claim you were injured or robbed and actually weren't, so you've got no need to worry about prosecution.

What you *do* have to worry about though, is that your failure to provide full and accurate information on past accidents and convictions almost certainly voids your insurance. If you injure someone in an accident while driving in this state, your insurer won't pay and you'll be liable for damages that could easily run into millions.

Call your insurer and get it sorted immediately.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 1:58 PM on January 10, 2007

I guess it might depend on the state, and I don't know which state the OP is in. In Texas, certainly, this would be insurance fraud under Penal Code § 35.02(a-1).
posted by grouse at 2:09 PM on January 10, 2007

Grouse, even in Texas, that ordinance only covers falsification "in support of a claim for payment under an insurance policy."

It has nothing to do with getting insurance in the first place.

Original Poster-

Do not under any circumstances say a thing. You are fine. There are no penalties. There are no repercussions.

It is completely up to the insurance provider to determine and rate you depending on your accident history and record.

Trust me- do you want to pay $300+ a month for insurance?

I don't recommend it. It sucks.
posted by id at 2:35 PM on January 10, 2007

id, you are reading the wrong subsection. Subsection (a) is falsification "in support of a claim for payment under an insurance policy." See subsection (a-1) and following:

(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person, with intent to defraud or deceive an insurer and in support of an application for an insurance policy:

(1) prepares or causes to be prepared a statement that:

(A) the person knows contains false or misleading material information; and
(B) is presented to an insurer; or

(2) presents or causes to be presented to an insurer a statement that the person knows contains false or misleading material information.

...
(d) An offense under Subsection (a-1) is a state jail felony.
(e) The court shall order a defendant convicted of an offense under this section to pay restitution, including court costs and attorney's fees, to an affected insurer.

Anyway, don't know where the OP is, but it's certainly a criminal offence is in at least one state.

Trust me- do you want to pay $300+ a month for insurance?... I don't recommend it. It sucks.

I imagine that going to jail sucks more, but that's just me. Of course you would have to get caught first. I imagine they are unlikely to recheck your record... unless you make a claim. Or you are involved in a disputed collision and the other side drags up the information.
posted by grouse at 3:11 PM on January 10, 2007

wouldn't it be more of a danger for future accidents? right now it may be a-okay to wax over it, but like others mentioned, isn't it entierly possible that some future accident means some kind of investigation into your record?
posted by Lockeownzj00 at 3:31 PM on January 10, 2007

The answer, as I'm sure you can tell from the thread so far, is "it depends."

But to toss in another anecdote, I got a speeding ticket in Connecticut for going 72 in a 45 zone. (Why the speed limit on I-84, a major, divided, 6-8 lane interstate highway drops to 45mph, I don't know. I suspect it's related to how CT has some of the highest speeding fines in the country.)

Anyway, CT leaves you to option of a "nolo contendere" plea for speeding tickets (meaning "no contest" -- in other words, I don't admit guilt, but I also don't care to fight it.) As it happens, nolo contendere pleas cannot be counted against you for insurance, or even reported to other states. I lived in MA at the time, and then moved to NJ.

It doesn't even show up on my C.L.U.E. report.
posted by CrayDrygu at 4:45 PM on January 10, 2007

Amend that post to say "nolo contendere pleas cannot be counted against you in CT..."
posted by CrayDrygu at 4:46 PM on January 10, 2007

I think they'd have to go a long way to prove you did so knowingly.

Yeah, no kidding. The burden of proof would be on them to show that the original poster knew about a car accident he'd been involved in.

Sounds tough, doesn't it?
posted by ikkyu2 at 9:55 PM on January 10, 2007

When you applied for your policy, they ran your Motor Vehicle Report and CLUE report. If these incidents had shown up on the MVR or CLUE report, then you would have been charged accordingly. Depending on your state, your insurance company has between 30-60 days to cancel your policy flat for underwriting reasons, but even if it does come up, you're not likely to be canceled because of it - they may just tack on the extra premium.

However, here's something to consider. Insurance companies look at certain types of accidents as chargeable and non-chargeable. There's a good chance that the information popped up on your CLUE or MVR and it just so happens that the accident wasn't costly enough to be chargeable. This has been the policy at both past and present companies where I have been employed as an agent.

To answer your questions:

Can I be fined for this if they find out?
Not fined, per se - they can increase your premium or in rare cases cancel your policy flat - but in my experience, for a flat cancellation to occur, you'd have to have a lot of activity.

Does that accident really count because it was not on my insurance?
Yes. They want to underwrite for the type of driver you are as well as how much was paid out as a result of your negligence.

Can they find it even though I had a different license?
In some states, the MVR will refer to a driver record in a different state. If that happens, the insurance agent will run a check on that one as well, and if the accident is on the report, then yes. However, if they don't know about the license, don't run the report, or the accident isn't on the report, then no.

Do insurance companies ever re-check your record?
Yes, they can check at renewal, but this usually won't happen for a few years, by which time the experience period will have expired.

Will they deny me claims in the future because of misrepresentation on the insurance application?
This is unlikely. You didn't knowingly misrepresent yourself on the application, and as far as they're concerned, you were being truthful. You have no idea how many people neglect to volunteer accident and violation information at the time of application. If it's been reported on your MVR or CLUE report, the insurance company will find out. I've worked extensively as a Claims Adjuster as well as an agent. Claims Adjusters don't have any interest in running your MVR just because you're filing a claim (unless the claim that you are filing seems shady), and if they weren't charging you for the accident before, then I don't see how it could present a problem. If, however, the information becomes known to them, they'll probably drop you after that.

The thing is, insurance companies are far too busy going after the guy who torched his car and left it in a parking lot, then filed a theft claim to go after the multitudes of people who omit information by miscalculation (like you) or dishonesty. There are too many to count (which, again, is why MVR and CLUE exist).
posted by mewithoutyou at 9:59 PM on January 10, 2007

I think they'd have to go a long way to prove you did so knowingly.

ikkyu2: "Yeah, no kidding. The burden of proof would be on them to show that the original poster knew about a car accident he'd been involved in.

Sounds tough, doesn't it?"

I didn't say to prove he knew about the accident. I said to prove he mixed up the dates intentionally.

Just a theory like everyone else's -- the only person here who has the answer is his insurance company.
posted by loiseau at 11:26 PM on January 10, 2007

wouldn't it be more of a danger for future accidents?

Exactly. Your real problem here is one you hope you never have: that if the time comes for them to pay out for some reason they THEN discover this issue. Then your worry isn't that they think you've defrauded them or try to file suit. They don't need to do any such complicated thing. They just. don't. pay.

Because what'd the downside for them? They've happily taken your money every month/quarter/year. You're not getting it back - you're in breach of contract, not them. So you've just made payments for some period of time for which in exchange you're going to get absolutely nothing. Which, if that's the service you want, you can just paypal me every month - I'll be happy to take your cash and provide no services now or later.

Now it's entirely possible some of the people upstream are correct and they're never going to figure this out. The two problems with operating on this assumption this are:

1) There's a clear motivation for them to put more effort into discovering this when the time comes that they have to send money OUT rather than IN. I'm not saying they do this deliberately, nor that any company the size and capitalization of an insurance company takes anything personally. You're just another line item in a leger. However it's their job to make money. You can be sure that there's a process to make sure they're not being defrauded when time comes to pay out. Do you want to risk it?

2) There is almost certainly clauses in your contract and laws such that their writing you a check after the conclusion of (1) isn't the end of the story. If they subsequently discover you were not honest with them - say, some new database comes online and they find that entry - they can come after you for the money after the fact. Odds are they have more lawyers than you and you'll probably be liable for interest and possible 'damages.'

You should call them up and come clean and pay the increased rate (if any). The analysis on this isn't the 10% you might pay every month, it's the 100% of what you're spending now that might not yield you a dime if you need to collect.
posted by phearlez at 12:16 PM on January 11, 2007