Did you know that yellow and blue make green?

December 14, 2006 9:31 PM

I'm Chinese, and North-American hair-dyes seem to hate me with a passion.

Chinese, black hair:

L'Oreal highlights adapted as Caramel-coloured streaks made it turn kind of orange-ish.

About three months later, with a bit of brown still left, a kind of semi-permanent purple dye (I don't recall the brand name, but it's a mainstream type available in every pharmacy) made it turn a dark red. Which looked good, so I didn't protest.

About a year later, most of the red was gone but a large portion of my hair was dark brown. This I attributed to the two dyes inadvertently bleaching my hair mildly, and while I avoid bleaching like crazy, nothing I could do.

Around this time, I get a bit of the Manic Panic Shocking Blue. The tips of my hair were orange/blondish from both dyes, so I figured it was light enough to attempt the blue without bleaching.

(I realize this is killing my hair, but I stick mostly to the tips and avoid the roots and plan on cutting off the damage and swearing off dyeing after I've exhausted the colours I want to try)

The blue turned green. Sort of understandable, given the caramel/red turned blonde mixing with blue. Still, never happened to any of my friends. And the dye, which was supposed to stay in for a month, faded in about a week...

I assume my issues with hair-dye stems from the blond-based vs. brown-based hair debate, and the actual make-up of my hair, which is thicker/different from those of my Caucasian friends.

My Question: Are there any readily available products for brown-based/Asian hair in funky colours? I know about Special Effects. And also, is there anyway to use North American hair dyes and have them turn out /right/, other than bleaching my hair? Thanks!

posted by Phire to clothing, beauty, & fashion (9 comments total)

First: For odd-color hair-dyes [Manic Panic, Special Effects, etc.], you will need to bleach your hair fairly heavily to get the colors to work well. No dye that doesn't contain bleach will make black hair a different color - at best, you'll get hair that looks very slightly tinted under bright lights. Furthermore, if you don't bleach enough [the hair is orange or yellow], the colors often come out incorrectly [as you've seen.] The effectiveness of dye over light brown/lightly bleached hair also varies color-to-color. A blue that's meant to be darker [like Special Effects' "Blue Mayhem"] will work better over light brown/lightly bleached hair than a blue that's meant to be very bright. So to get funky colors, you're stuck with bleaching. Sorry. Non-Asians with brown or black hair also have this problem. On the other hand, I have seen plenty of people with Asian hair get fine effects from North American hair dyes, as long as they bleach first.

Second: Many "mainstream type [dyes] found in every pharmacy" contain bleaching agents as well as dying agents. Dyes alone won't bleach your hair.

Finally: Manic Panic fades very fast for many people. Special Effects is often [but not always] longer-lasting. You can try leaving the dye in longer. I generally sleep with the dye in, covering the hair with tinfoil or something plastic, and washing it out in the morning. You should also be aware that shampoo will make the colors leech out of your hair more quickly. I shower as much as I always have, but I don't use shampoo every time I shower, in order to prevent this. I tend to redye on a monthly basis.

You might find, after this, that you still have other problems that stem from differences in hair makeup, but you should look at these suggestions first.
posted by ubersturm at 9:53 PM on December 14, 2006

InOne of the major problems you're going to have with "from the box" color is that there is only one strength of bleach available. In order to change the color of your hair you have to remove the base color first.

You can put temporary rinses that will add a tone (usually a burgandy or purplish red tone with hair as dark as yours) but without bleaching it first, you'll never really "change" the color. Even if you aren't doing a separate bleach step, unless the box said no ammonia, no peroxide, temporary (stage 1 or 2) color, it's alreading bleached, though probably not completely enough to get a clear new color.

When you have your hair colored in a salon, they choose the level of bleach based on the color and texture of your hair. Chances are, most of what you're getting was never meant to totally remove the pigment from very dark hair. The caramel highlights turned orange because they weren't able to remove your base color before depositing the caramel color.

But, yeah, the relevant point is, unless you're happy with a very, very temporary tint, you gotta bleach. And if you're going to seriously bleach, you ought to have it done professionally. The potential for disaster is crazy high. Plus, every layer of color your putting on yourself is further changing the texture and porosity (is that a word?) of the hair making the results harder and harder to control.

If you still want to use box color, look online for Japanese hair color brands; I've heard of people having a lot of success with them. Plus, they're already made for Asian hair. Although they too probably already have bleach in them.
posted by mostlymartha at 10:03 PM on December 14, 2006

Your trouble with the blue, at least, has nothing to do with your hair specifically. I have dark-brown, medium-wavy (but heavy) Caucasian hair. For awhile I was trying to keep part of it blue, but it didn't matter how completely I bleached or what brand I tried; blues just wouldn't stay. I could have gotten away with redying it every two weeks, but actually keeping it looking good would've required a dye job every weekend. Any longer and it became a sort of light aquamarine, fading to pale sea-green, even though the original color didn't have noticeable green undertones and my hair was bleached past yellow almost to white.

So I don't think you're going to find a semi-permanent blue dye, no matter what amount of bleach you use or what type of hair you have. Other colors are possible -- I've seen people do well with reds and pinks (although you will have to bleach) -- but I just don't think a semi-permanent blue exists yet.
posted by booksandlibretti at 11:16 PM on December 14, 2006

[Er, and a note on bleaching: Manic Panic, Special Effects, etc. do not have bleach in them. For those sorts of dyes, you'll need to bleach separately. This is what most people - Asian and non-Asian - do before using funkily-colored hair dyes. I have lightish hair, and don't mind darkish dye colors, so I don't bleach myself, although I've bleached others' hair. However, you can vary the strength of the bleaching compound or the lenght of time that your hair is exposed to it - both of these techniques will affect how completely your hair is bleached. If I were you, though, I'd only trust someone with a fair amount of experience [or a professional] to do it right, at least the first few times. Underbleaching will get you the sort of unpredictable dye results you've had so far, while overbleaching will do nasty, nasty things to your hair.]

booksandlibretti - I've had very good luck with Special Effects' "Blue Mayhem," although like all blue dyes I've used, it fades to a nasty mossy green in the end. I generally go nearly a month before I need to redye. However, it's a deep color, I don't bleach my hair, and I do several things [listed above - primarily keeping the dye moist while letting it set overnight and not using much shampoo] to try to ensure that it lasts. These last two methods are worth trying, if you aren't doing them already, although the first [not bleaching] may not work with your hair. Of course, dye can work very differently on different sorts of hair, but [for me at least] it is possible to get a nice, deep blue to last for some time.
posted by ubersturm at 11:55 PM on December 14, 2006

Booksandlibretti: I know reds are supposed to be permanent, but I used SFX' Electric Blue on bleached hair not too long ago, and it lasted about a month before I saw any significant fading (after those first few days where there's still excess dye in the hair, of course), and another month-ish after that before it went all weird and grey-blue. Granted, I'm starting from a medium-brown, so that doesn't necessarily apply to the OP, but it is somewhat long-lasting.
posted by spaceman_spiff at 5:38 AM on December 15, 2006

Er, "reds are supposed to be more permanent".
posted by spaceman_spiff at 5:38 AM on December 15, 2006

My hairdresser confirms my experience that reds fade from their true color faster, but also stain the hair more. (So the red dyes that are supposed to wash out, don't. But they don't stay the color you started with, either.)

All blues seem to fade to that bizarre greenish color.
posted by desuetude at 6:16 AM on December 15, 2006

It's not the North American funky hair dyes that hate your hair type. I used to dye my hair regularly with Special Effects (Cherry Bomb, Virgin Rose and Pimpin' Purple if you're curious) and my own black hair is the result of African American and Korean genes, and Blasian hair is not the most mainstream hairtype.

Reinforcing above statements of "You have to bleach out your hair color entirely." Those semi permanent dyes do not have bleach in them and won't show up on dark hair. No from-a-box dye that come colors like Butterscotch or Caramel or whatever else, actual color-stripping hair bleaching. Since my hair is kind of fine, I used to just get the bleaching/streaking done in salons when I'd got my haircut. Bleached to the point that it was practically white. So I wasn't going to trust myself or over-the-counter treatments for that. Not only does the color appear better, but yes, it does stain your hair. In between recoloring, my hair didn't go back to the base white/blonde, but was always a hazy pinkish/magenta color. And in areas that got dyed more the faded color was brighter than the new patches, so it depends on how often you do it too.
posted by kkokkodalk at 8:50 AM on December 15, 2006

FWIW, I've always heard that Manic Panic dyes tend to wash out quickly regardless of color and how much bleach was used. My hairdresser also says that the blue to green problem is definitely very, very common.

As far as bleaching yourself in order to help the color set better, I definitely suggest going to the professionals for that. One caveat though: make sure it is somewhere decent and that you (possibly) have a rapport with the person doing the bleaching. (I've had one horrific bleaching incident that resulted in 2nd and 3rd degree burns on my scalp, ears, and neck.) Making a mistake with bleach can screw you over quite quickly.

Re: what brand to use, I recommend heading to the salon and chatting with your stylist. Sometimes they have better stuff (or can order it) that might have more staying power. And then you can try and find a color (or ask the stylist if they know of any good ones) that will pretty closely match what you have so you can do touchups on your own.

(2 more things I remember hearing my stylist say: red and black dyes are a bitch to cover up and that if you want to go back to your natural color, you will almost always have to go darker.)

Also, I've heard that shampoo/conditioner that is somewhat tailored for color-treated hair can be better and keep the color sticking around. Just conditioning a shitload will probably also help you from completely frying your hair.
posted by sperose at 11:41 PM on December 15, 2006