Comments on: Variations on "Ottawa, Kingdom of the Netherlands".

Question: Variations on "Ottawa, Kingdom of the Netherlands".

goodnewsfortheinsane — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 12:12:55 -0800

People born in administratively unusual places?

When part of the Dutch royal family lived in exile in Canada during WWII, Princess Margriet (daughter of Princess Juliana) was born. At the time of her birth, a wing of the hospital was temporarily declared Dutch territory to ensure her being born on Dutch soil. (Under Canadian law, had she been born in Canadian territory she would have automatically received Canadian citizenship.) Thus, effectively, Princess Margriet was born in "Ottawa, Kingdom of the Netherlands".

Do you know of any comparable examples?

By: goodnewsfortheinsane

goodnewsfortheinsane — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 12:14:00 -0800

And yes, I might use your examples for a future FPP.

By: Rumple

Rumple — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 12:27:31 -0800

Emilio Marcos de Palma, first human baby born in Antarctica, and is subject to an unusual, deliberately uncertain legal status with respect to national sovereignty. Wikipedia notes he could claim Argentine or British Citizenship (or both?) due to overlapping treaty/sectoral claims.

By: cillit bang

cillit bang — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 12:35:17 -0800

The same story goes for Crown Prince Alexander of Yugoslavia at Claridge's in London (allegedly Yugoslav soil was sprinkled under the bed).

You might also like to look at French overseas departements and regions, which are considered part of France itself. Among other things, this means the European Union has a land border with Brazil. Spain has similar places in North Africa.

By: fire&wings

fire&wings — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:00:22 -0800

The footballer Rio Mavuba was born in a boat in international waters off the coast of Angola and was able to choose which country to represent at international level. He chose France.

By: Milkman Dan

Milkman Dan — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:04:40 -0800

All his back-of-the-book biographies state that Canadian writer & artist Douglas Coupland was "born on a Canadian Air Force base near Baden-Baden, Germany."

By: ijsbrand

ijsbrand — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:20:57 -0800

I wasn't born in an administratively unusual place, yet customs all around the world have had trouble to belief this. For the Frisian municipality in which I was born, is called 'Smallingerland'. And it too often takes time to explain the status of this other 'land' in my passport.

By: Rumple

Rumple — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 15:42:05 -0800

Babies born on airplanes
"British" born but not british

By: grouse

grouse — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 15:52:18 -0800

Douglas Coupland was "born on a Canadian Air Force base near Baden-Baden, Germany."

Now it's a commercial airport.

By: Rumple

Rumple — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 16:15:42 -0800

I'm Sorry, pleased to meet you.

By: Saucy Intruder

Saucy Intruder — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 17:27:45 -0800

John McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone, which apparently does not affect his natural-born citizenship for purposes of a presidential run.

By: atrazine

atrazine — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 17:46:37 -0800

Saucy Intruder, to be a natural born citizen you just have to have citizenship by birth (American parents OR born on US soil), not both.

By: languagehat

languagehat — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 17:48:12 -0800

I was born in a military hospital in Tokyo during the Occupation; it was technically U.S. soil, so despite having been born in Japan I am eligible to be president. I trust I can count on all your votes.

By: Pollomacho

Pollomacho — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 18:41:22 -0800

Saucy Intruder, to be a natural born citizen you just have to have citizenship by birth (American parents OR born on US soil), not both.

We'll see about that now won't we?

By: krautland

krautland — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 21:24:58 -0800

a friend of mine was actually born in international waters.

it happened in the north sea, they were sailing towards germany when his mother went into labor - far premature. a german rescue cruiser called Wilhelm Kaisen (pic: similar ship, different name) came out from the island of helgoland. he was born in their onboard hospital. the germans offered two entries for the birth certificate, either "on board of sea emergency cruiser wilhelm kaisen" or the first port they went to, which happened to be Cuxhaven. they took the first one.

By: frogan

frogan — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 00:16:20 -0800

There have been several instances of children born at Disneyland. Here's but one example.

The park offers them honorary "citizenship."

By: unmusic

unmusic — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 00:30:11 -0800

I was born in a tiny village in rural South East England (think Miss Marple) that declared itself an independent state after some legal wrangles involving a donkey derby.

True story.

By: unmusic

unmusic — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 00:31:27 -0800

Re the above:

Passports, stamps and currency were issued. The stamps were used locally during the national postal strike and "Cuckoo" notes were legal tender in Cuckfield. Five Cuckoos were worth one shilling.

By: bingo

bingo — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 07:03:39 -0800

Similar to languagehat, I was born on an American air force base in Japan. My passport is about ten pages long, but I'm an American citizen and always have been. I used to think it would have been cool if I'd been born on Japanese soil, but the reality is that Japan is tough on awarding citizenship to non-indigenous people in general, so it probably would have just made things more complicated.

By: MattD

MattD — Fri, 24 Nov 2006 07:24:08 -0800

Just a note that this has more practical consequence in American terms than otherwise, because America is one of the relatively few countries that grants citizenship based upon where one is born. Most other countries grant citizenship based upon parental citizenship, reglardless of place of birth. (Sometimes it's the mother's citizenship, sometimes it's the father's, sometimes either.) The U.S. also grants citizenship based upon either parent being American, but you have to prove paternity if you're a foreign-born child of an unmarried foreign woman.