Screw the pooch?
September 1, 2006 7:33 AM   Subscribe

ApartmentFilter: A friend received a note inside her apartment yesterday telling her she has 24 hours to get rid of her dog. She's lived in the apartment for nearly three years, with the dog the whole time. What are her rights and can the apartment complex do this?

The reason for the sudden notice is that the apartment complex has recently changed their pet rules to exclude pets weighing over twenty pounds. The fact that they went in to her apartment without notice also is an issue. The lease does not specify that pets need to be below a specific size and when she renewed her lease recently there was no mention of a change to the pet policy.
posted by DragonBoy to Pets & Animals (33 answers total)
 
What state?
posted by Optimus Chyme at 7:35 AM on September 1, 2006


What state?

As a general matter, if a person has a pet openly and obviously, and the landlord doesn't immediately object, they lose the right to object to that pet. They can't suddenly enforce a no pets rule that has not previously been enforced. (If you hid the pet from the landlord for a while, that doesn't count.) You need to check the laws and legal rulings in your state, however.
posted by jellicle at 7:37 AM on September 1, 2006


Response by poster: Ah - sorry about that. The state is Texas. The apartment complex has had at least two management companies since she moved in.
posted by DragonBoy at 7:37 AM on September 1, 2006


A lease is a contract. If the lease doesn't say anything about pets, then there is nothing the landlord can do. It is also in no way legal for the owners of the building to enter the apartment without prior notice, unless there's an emergency or something.
posted by delmoi at 7:44 AM on September 1, 2006


If this were me, I would personally re-read the lease carefully and see if there is anything that might allow them to do this. Then I would try to get a hold of a lawyer. Unfortunately, getting a lawyer in 24 hours isn't easy so for now I would just call the landlord and tell them that you will not be getting rid of the dog, and that they have no legal right to force her to do it. Then they'll need to get a lawyer themselves if they want to do anything, which they probably won't.
posted by delmoi at 7:46 AM on September 1, 2006


On the contrary. I used to be an apartment manager in Texas.

Under the Texas Apartment Association lease, the management has the right to enter the apartment anytime, as long as it is for a legitimate purpose. This includes such things as smoke detector inspection and, yes, pet checks.

Also, the TAA lease prohibits pets without pet agreement, and your friend is lucky they are not being charged the monetary penalties for breaking this clause, which iirc is $10/day. Now, on the other hand, if your friend has a pet agreement signed by the previous management, current management has to abide by it. But if that happens, friend should expect not to get their lease renewed.
posted by ilsa at 7:54 AM on September 1, 2006


Yeah definitely go through the lease with a fine toothed comb. I don't know about Texas, but in New York, if a lease doesn't specifically prohibit pets, then they are allowed. At least last time I checked (last year).

Also, a lot of landlord tenant things don't need a lawyer, as long as you do your research and you know you are legally correct, small claims is much cheaper and more accessible. And a touch less intimidating.
posted by unsigned at 7:55 AM on September 1, 2006


if the lease indicates that your friend was allowed a pet without the new weight restriction, you should be ok. they can't just change the rules and then enforce them immediately. even if the lease implys that they can, it will probably not be enforceable: adding a weight restriction for a pet would significantly change the lease itself, since the dog is also a legal resident.

however, the fact that they put this kind of notice IN the apartment raises MAJOR ALARM BELLS. They have gone in the apaprtment without notice: bad. Management companies who know what they are doing send certified letters for these kinds of things. something is not right with this situation.

if i was your friend, i'd throw away the note and deny knowing about it. if and when the management company mentioned it, i'd have them put it in writing where they left the note last time.
posted by lester's sock puppet at 7:58 AM on September 1, 2006


in texas they can enter without notice... and its done whenever they feel like it. you cant do anything about that.
posted by trishthedish at 8:01 AM on September 1, 2006


Yuck. What assholes. If she's lived there a while with no problems, perhaps she can come to an agreement with management. Also, perhaps a long shot but, if she has depression or another psychiatric condition, and her treating mental health professional says that her having the dog stabilizes her health, it may be a reasonable accommodation under the Fair Housing Act to modify a "no pets" policy. (The pdoc would have to explain why it has to be this particular dog rather than another dog within the weight limit.)
posted by ClaudiaCenter at 8:08 AM on September 1, 2006


Yes, again as in every legal AskMe question, laws vary gratly by jurisdiction, especially in the US. And in this case, Texas law greatly favors landlords over tenants. I think it's among the worst in the nation in this regard. So, as a general rule, you should probably assume the worst (from the aspect of tenant's rights) when Texas is concerned.

It well may be the case that even if the current lease allows pets and doesn't directly endorse the new rule, there may be a clause that nevertheless allows the landlord to implement such a rule. And even if this isn't the case, she's almost certainly screwed when this leasing term comes to an end.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 8:10 AM on September 1, 2006


I'd personally go to the TAA site directly for information. yes there will be folks (like ilsa above) who know specifics, but for up to date statutes and such, there's nothing like the real enchilada.

and mark this as reason #4,834,126 why I'll never live in Texas...
posted by lonefrontranger at 8:23 AM on September 1, 2006


Well regardless of whether you wind up moving or not, the 24 hours thing is bullshit. Leave that dog right where it is. And an eviction in any state takes time.

The first thing I'd do is ask the owners why they think it's justified to enter someone's apartment just to leave a note. Are they pervs???

As others have said, look your lease over carefully. I don't believe that the owners get to change the rules of the game midway through -- just because they feel like it. And do check into seeing if there are any tenant's rights groups in your area.

In short, don't wuss out. Put up a fight.
posted by bim at 8:26 AM on September 1, 2006


Also, perhaps a long shot but, if she has depression or another psychiatric condition, and her treating mental health professional says that her having the dog stabilizes her health, it may be a reasonable accommodation under the Fair Housing Act to modify a "no pets" policy.

Slight derail, and I don't advocate it, but this is not a long shot. I've known a few people in college who "needed" their dog at an apartment where it was explicitly not allowed in the lease. They first signed the lease and then got a psychologist to say they needed the dog to help with their depression. It happened at more than one complex, and in each situation, the management company/landlords shrugged and though unhappy about it, said, "OK." This was in Georgia.
posted by jmd82 at 8:29 AM on September 1, 2006


If you're going to ask the hive, then there is no reason to ignore ilsa's advice. Sounds like ilsa has the direct experience for which you are looking.

Otherwise, see a lawyer or read the lease and regs yourself.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 9:01 AM on September 1, 2006


"In short, don't wuss out. Put up a fight."

I don't think this is a wise answer given the differences which we know exist between jurisdictions. You write, And an eviction in any state takes time, but that's not true assuming you intend "time" to mean "weeks to months". In Texas a landlord can have you physically removed from their property in the matter of a handful of days. And a previous eviction is legitimate cause to deny housing, meaning that this can have undesirably consequences which are not worth it.

Other states are much more tenant-friendly where fighting this would almost certainly be the best course of action. I'm pretty sure that Texas isn't one of those states. But she should rely on someone who knows, not one of us on AskMe who have nothing but personal experience (even personal experience in Texas) to rely upon as "expertise".

This woman should find out exactly where she stands by contacting experts who can help her, and then determine her course of action based upon her evaluation of risk and reward.

lonefrontranger, I think your conclusion about living anywhere in Texas is false. I think that Austin was progressive enough, and having in such abundance other virtues which we might consider as being related to progressivism, that it more than made up for the negatives of living in Texas. It's legitimate to disagree, of course, but I think that there's such great local diversity everywhere in the US that you can't simply evaluate where it's good or bad to live based solely on the larger geographical context such as state or region.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 9:27 AM on September 1, 2006


Under the Texas Apartment Association lease, the management has the right to enter the apartment anytime, as long as it is for a legitimate purpose. This includes such things as smoke detector inspection and, yes, pet checks.

Also, the TAA lease prohibits pets without pet agreement, and your friend is lucky they are not being charged the monetary penalties for breaking this clause, which iirc is $10/day. Now, on the other hand, if your friend has a pet agreement signed by the previous management, current management has to abide by it. But if that happens, friend should expect not to get their lease renewed.
posted by ilsa at 7:54 AM PST on September 1


DragonBoy hasn't indicated that it's a TAA lease. He also said that the signed lease does not have a weight requirement on pets.

As for your assertion that management may enter the unit at any time, I need you to quote something from either the lease or the TX property code, because I don't see anything of the sort.

I strongly suggest DragonBoy and his friend not trust anything said by anyone who has worked for a landlord in any capacity. Even the grubbiest, most dishonest and destructive tenants cannot hope to match the soullessness of your typical landlord or management company.

I should also point out that state law trumps any lease, although management will lie to you and say it doesn't.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 10:02 AM on September 1, 2006


Response by poster: Many thanks for all the advice. Tenant rights in Texas are pathetic but there is a lot of merit in the suggestions posted here. My friend is obviously seeking professional legal advice but for the mean time she's goinng to ignore the note (I suggested 'the dog ate it' as an excuse) and look into the practically of other suggestions.

On a side note, Texas isn't that bad a place to live. Sure the tenant rights suck and the mass transit in Houston sucks even worse but the people are friendly, the food is awesome and George W. Bush is no longer our governor.
posted by DragonBoy at 11:24 AM on September 1, 2006 [1 favorite]


I should also point out that state law trumps any lease, although management will lie to you and say it doesn't.

You are absolutely right about that. That's why every reputable apartment management company in the state of Texas uses the Texas Apartment Association lease, which is updated every 2 years by a bunch of lawyers who are experts in housing law to comply fully with both federal and state law.

But -- assuming this is a TAA lease for reasons explained in the previous paragraph -- here it is for you to read. Paragraph 27 states no pets, and that if you have a pet without a pet agreement they will leave a notice in your apartment to remove the pet within 24 hours. This sounds remarkably like what happened. Paragraph 28 furthermore says they can enter the apartment anytime for any of a long list of reasons as long as they leave conspicuous notice inside the apartment. Again, according to DragonBoy, this appears to be exactly what happened.

How did they find out about the dog in the first place? Maybe the manager saw friend walking the dog, maybe the neighbors complained, maybe the maintenance dude noticed it when he went to repair something.

Please consider this the long version of what I said earlier.
posted by ilsa at 12:56 PM on September 1, 2006


ilsa: that's fucked up. leaving a legal notice like that INSIDE of the apartment? The landlord basically does not even really have the obligation to make sure the note was even read.
posted by lester's sock puppet at 2:09 PM on September 1, 2006


lester: yeah but that's the rules. And if you think about it, the electric company has no obligation to make sure I read my bill; if I don't pay it they turn off my power.

Basically the choices for the landlord are a) put it in the apartment in a conspicuous place (I think if I were still doing this crap I'd take a digital photo of where I put it); b) post it on the door in front of God and Everybody (and hope it doesn't vanish before the Resident gets home) or c) registered letter that they might not pick up (yes, I have had that happen). Three sucky options to be sure. I suppose the right thing to do would be to follow up such a notice with a phone call.

Oh, and be careful about pretending you never got the note. One of the things they can legally enter without notice to do is remove an unauthorized animal. I would really hate for you to find out the hard way that your friend's landlord is a big enough tool to have doggy taken to the pound.
posted by ilsa at 3:28 PM on September 1, 2006


Also, one long-term option that hasn't been discussed: join a tenant's association or cooperative. (And stay away from the TAA; they seem to be pretty virulently pro-landlord.)
posted by koeselitz at 4:07 PM on September 1, 2006


I've definitely rented from people in Texas who did not use a TAA lease. They didn't seem to be any less reputable than the TAA people I've rented from.
posted by grouse at 5:18 PM on September 1, 2006


One of the things they can legally enter without notice to do is remove an unauthorized animal. I would really hate for you to find out the hard way that your friend's landlord is a big enough tool to have doggy taken to the pound.
posted by ilsa at 3:28 PM PST on September 1


Why is this not theft?
posted by Optimus Chyme at 5:44 PM on September 1, 2006


Optimus, because they are removing unwanted items from their own property. This would not be functionally different than towing a vehicle with expired plates off property. Never forget that a rented thing is not yours.
posted by ilsa at 10:02 PM on September 1, 2006


Never forget that a rented thing is not yours.

That's definitely not true in Iowa (which uses a slightly modified version of the uniform landlord tenant act, implemented by many states). Rented property is your property as long as you keep up your end of the lease.

Another reason to stay away from Texas. Yuck.
posted by delmoi at 4:52 AM on September 2, 2006


Optimus, because they are removing unwanted items from their own property. This would not be functionally different than towing a vehicle with expired plates off property. Never forget that a rented thing is not yours.
posted by ilsa at 10:02 PM PST on September 1


Anyone who believes that entering someone's home and taking a companion animal is an acceptable substitute for initiating eviction proceeding is a vile wretch.

Your attitude about the landlord-tenant relationship is pretty disturbing, to be frank. I'm still waiting for a quote from the TX property code stating that one can enter rented property at any time without notice for anything other than a real emergency. And I don't think needing to steal someone's dog because you're a chickenshit passive-aggressive whore counts as an emergency.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 9:04 AM on September 2, 2006


delmoi: In what way is rented property "yours" in Iowa in a way that it isn't in Texas? I don't understand what you're getting at.

Optimus Chyme: The chapters of the Texas Property Code dealing with landlord and tenant, and residential tenancies are pretty short. You can pretty easily see that there is nothing that explicitly allows entering the property without notice. Neither is there anything explicitly preventing entering the property without notice. Especially if you sign a contract where you explicitly agree that this is okay.

Of course, the TAA contract does not say that the landlord may enter at any time without notice. It says that the landlord and representatives may peacefully enter the apartment at reasonable times. What is peaceful is probably defined in common law. Here in England "using violence to secure entry to premises" when there is an opposed occupant present is actually a crime (Criminal Law Act 1977).
posted by grouse at 5:45 PM on September 2, 2006


here is the bit of iowa code that defines access, as you can see other then an emergency, the landlord can't enter without 24 hours notice.

delmoi: In what way is rented property "yours" in Iowa in a way that it isn't in Texas? I don't understand what you're getting at.

I think it's just a general principle, but it might be different in Texas. Or it may be that ilsa is just smoking crack. I mean taking a property manager's view of landlord tenant laws is like asking the RIAA about intellectual property laws, a bush administration member about torture, or a drug dealer about search and seizure laws.
posted by delmoi at 11:07 PM on September 2, 2006


delmoi: I don't think the general principle is different in any common law jurisdiction. Property is owned by the owner. Tenants have exclusive right of occupancy, subject to their contract with the property owner. But even if not letting the property, the property owner's exclusive occupancy and use is limited by easements and restrictive covennats.

It's funny, under the Iowa statute you cited, sometimes tenants have fewer rights. I have a friend in Texas who was able to keep her landlord from showing the place to prospective purchasers because her lease didn't explicitly permit it. In general I think a statutory notice period is a good thing, but if your jurisdiction doesn't have one, you should get it put into the lease.
posted by grouse at 1:31 AM on September 3, 2006


"I'm still waiting for a quote from the TX property code stating that one can enter rented property at any time without notice for anything other than a real emergency."

Here's a portion of the TX property code. You'll find in it various mentions of the property owner entering the property.

Not incidentally, a landlord can actually enter the apartment and take property in lieu of a rent payment if they want, as long as they don't "break the peace". Meaning they do it when you're not there. I think that broadly speaking, if a landlord can prove the tenant has broken the lease then many of the protections afforded the tenant, including when the landlord can enter the property, are no longer in effect.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 10:10 AM on September 3, 2006


Here's a portion of the TX property code. You'll find in it various mentions of the property owner entering the property.

Like where?
posted by grouse at 11:02 AM on September 3, 2006


Here's a portion of the TX property code. You'll find in it various mentions of the property owner entering the property.

No; I read the whole goddamn thing when this thread was first posted, and I'm still waiting for a direct quote.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 12:16 PM on September 3, 2006


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