Tattoo question

July 27, 2006 11:55 AM

I am about to get my first tattoo. I would like to get the zen enso symbol on my upper back. My question to the mefi community is does anyone have any good example pictures for me to bring to the artist.

I am partial to the enso that have a similarity to Ouroboros. I've done all the standard google image searches, I'm just looking for anyone that might have access to some obscure images and anyone that might have some suggestions for my first tattoo.

posted by wavering to clothing, beauty, & fashion (22 comments total)

By similarity I mean wider on one side and thinner on the opposite side.
posted by wavering at 12:00 PM on July 27, 2006

Slightly different idea: create your own Enso. Practice calligraphy until you feel like you are expressing your own personality in drawing Enso. Then select your favorite drawing, scan, resize and print for the tattoo artist.

Or find a tattoo artist who practices Enso as well -- surely there must be quite a few around.
posted by La Cieca at 12:08 PM on July 27, 2006

A tattoo is forever. Take some time now and learn how to draw your own enso...

[on preview, what La Ceica said]
posted by notyou at 12:10 PM on July 27, 2006

posted by ootsocsid at 12:13 PM on July 27, 2006

My first thought when I clicked on your link was "Hey, that's the Lucent logo!"

I guess ootsocsid is on the same page. Anyway, I can't offer you any pictures but I think that drawing your own would have the most meaning (and probably less of a corporate-logo resemblance),
posted by Ostara at 12:28 PM on July 27, 2006

Which, in turn, reminds us of Dogbert's "Brown Ring of Quality".
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 12:44 PM on July 27, 2006

my g/f's response to this question:
Whilst I would hate to be so bold as to talk anyone out of getting a certain tattoo.. I would urge you to think carefully about doing this. There are two reasons. 1. My first two tattoos were symbols - which I ended up having covered because I got sick to death of everyone (and I mean everyone) asking me what they meant. 2. Should 10 years down the line like me you decide you want to cover this - it will not be easy because its a solid black shape. I would urge you to reconsider it and if you absolute must do it then seek out a really good artist who care recreate brush strokes on the skin as its not easy.

my answer:
a friend of mine has something similar to the Ouroboros on his back and he gets a lot of crap for it. not many people know what it is and just assume the snake is fellating itself.
posted by dieguido at 1:06 PM on July 27, 2006

Perhaps you would best be served by asking the artist yourself. It feels counterintuitive to ask an artist to draw someone else's enso. Ask if they know what an enso is. If they do, ask to see one of theirs. It may not be as common as asking to see works of roses, crosses, or burning skulls, but knowing what an artist sees and does will be more important than recreating from a picture.

If you chose an enso for meaning, find an artist who creates one whose meaning you can embrace. If you see the ink, you may find flaws. If you see the symbol, the flaws are part of the perfection.
posted by Saydur at 1:13 PM on July 27, 2006

I hate that Lucent used this symbol. That's been bothering me for years, and one of the reasons I've held off getting an enso as a tattoo, myself.

If you go for it and do not create one yourself, perhaps go with one of the famous ones.

Personally, I think I would prefer to spend some time in personal retreat mode, do zazen meditation long and hard over a weekend, and then arise from that to see what comes forth. It would mean a lot more.
posted by Kickstart70 at 2:27 PM on July 27, 2006

And try to have an idea for a 'master design' in your head because if the tattoo bug bites you in the way it bit me, then you'll end up with more than one!

I also agree with all the above comments, however, if you're looking for ideas or inspiration for unusual designs then there are plenty of places to start (warning, links are usually NSFW in some way):

Inked Blog
Inked Nation
ModBlog and BME - very NSFW
Needled
Tattooartists.org
Tattoos.com
Vanishing Tattoo

All the above sites are good starting points and should help you find something interesting.

And for examples of bad tattoos or what not to get (again, may be NSFW):

Bad Tattoos
Hanzi Smatter

And finally, the stupid tattoo on ModBlog.. (again, it's NSFW. But that's what makes it fun!)
posted by Nugget at 2:46 PM on July 27, 2006

I would second the posters who recommend drawing it yourself -- or get an artistic close friend to draw it for you.

Also, I'm glad you posted this. I've been thinking of getting an ouroborus on my upper back too, but after dieguido's comment, I'm rethinking it. (Also, I guess it's even a little more common than I thought.)
posted by diocletian at 3:03 PM on July 27, 2006

I agree on creating it yourself, if you can. I created my first tattoo, and I have a second one created "on paper" that I just have to figure out some minor details, like exactly where I want to put it, and then reshape it to fit in that place. It feels more personal that way.
posted by [insert clever name here] at 3:29 PM on July 27, 2006

I'd suggest going to the tattoo artist and drawing it together. You get what you want, and since he/she has drawn it too, they know exactly what to do.

Oh, and please make sure you pay well for it. Don't go to the cheapest place you can find. Here it is definitely worth paying for someone brilliant.
posted by twirlypen at 4:44 PM on July 27, 2006

I'm not an expert on calligraphy or tattoos but the feel of the enso in your pic is hugely dependent on the medium (dry brush and rough paper) and this effect may be difficult if not impossible to replicate with a tattoo needle on human skin. See if you can get someone to create an enso with a fine point pen on smooth paper. If you like the look of that, take it to your tattoo artist.
posted by zanni at 5:01 PM on July 27, 2006

I'm not an expert on calligraphy or tattoos but the feel of the enso in your pic is hugely dependent on the medium (dry brush and rough paper) and this effect may be difficult if not impossible to replicate with a tattoo needle on human skin.

I'd say this is pretty true. In fact, all enso means is "circle", so why go through all the trouble of drawing a circle to make it look painted when you could just get an open circle tattoo? Actually, how is any open circle tattoo not an enso? If the whole point of creating a calligraphic enso is entailed in the process of you drawing a circle with one brushstroke, how is that translated into a tattoo? How is copying something that looks one way in a certain medium into a medium where it will look completely different a 'zen' action at all?
posted by LionIndex at 6:03 PM on July 27, 2006

[Wouldn't it be even more zen to not have the tattoo?]
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 7:20 PM on July 27, 2006

[I mean, if it's on your upper back, you won't ever be able to see it anyway, so how would you know whether it was there or not?]
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 7:21 PM on July 27, 2006

I am going to babble a little because I got my first tattoo this year, and I was pondering the same images you are.

I have the same reaction as LionIndex. The skin and a tattoo machine are very different from rice paper and a brush. A tattoo is made for hours, bit by bit. Not a single stroke. but if you don't mind trying for a sumi-e appearance in a tattoo, why not look through some of the online tattoo image sites, and also paper magazines looking to see what type of effects are technically possible.

I did that while searching for my tattoo--I like the enso, but did not want a picture of one. But I do also like the sumi-e style and did not mind having some of it influence what would go into the design of my tattoo. (it includes a pine tree done in a style similar to what I've seen in such scroll worlk.)

...If I were to get an enso on my back, I think I would want a zen master to paint it directly on my back right before getting the tattoo, and then have the tattoo artist make it permanent, right then and there. that would be a combination of both worlds. This type of synthesis has a personal meaning to me, perhaps something similar also works for you.

My advice is to go at this as though you are making up your own myth, your own meaning. But, know that it's personal and don't expect an artist to completely understand the symbol language you've created.

oh, and read the rec.arts.body-art faqs and other places for advice on finding an artist. that's useful.
posted by bleary at 8:40 PM on July 27, 2006

For my first tattoo, I was planning on getting an Ouroboros as well but I never quite found a design I liked. Even though I abandoned the specific design, I was unable to move away from the circle. The aesthetic/meaning appeals to me on so many levels. So, I know where you're coming from. Don't give up.

I ended up getting a 15cm full colour mandala on my chest. (See it [before the final touch-ups] here.) The circle is a very universal symbol, so don't give up the search, there's bound to be one that resonates with you. When I saw the mandala, I knew it was the design/image I had been searching for for 4 years.

I'd also recommend ignoring deguido's and his girlfriend's warnings. (No offense.) The symbol should be of personal significance to you, the fact that Joe Average might not 'get it' shouldn't really be an issue. This is the reason I got my tattoo done on my chest, not my back. As a reminder to myself. I do get quite a bit of shit for my forearm tattoo ('This is who I am' in my own handwriting) and though it is occasionally unpleasant, it's worth it.

And in preview, bleary says it much more eloquently than I ever could:
My advice is to go at this as though you are making up your own myth, your own meaning. But, know that it's personal and don't expect an artist to completely understand the symbol language you've created.
posted by slimepuppy at 3:56 AM on July 28, 2006

Agreeing with slimepuppy. also, do a brainstorming session with yourself. maybe you already have? write down everything that comes to mind when you are thinking about the ouroboros, the enso, circles, &c. Is it unity? infinity? nothingness? but be more specific than that. try to drill down from the abstract to the specific. also, it's personal, so try to expand your brainstorming session to specific feelings and episodes about you.

think of this as though you are suddenly growing a huge tangle of plants--and then later you will prune them. programmer speak -- prune your search tree.

Make sure you prune it enough so that you don't try to put everything all at once into too small a space on your skin. loose analogy: I tried to write a story, and was carried away with ideas and tried to do them all at once in that one story.

So anyway, circles -- slimepuppy's mandala. what about the wheel of law from Buddhism? infinity -- some ouroboros are twisted into an infinity symbol. such as the one in Crowley's tarot deck. go find the picture and see if you like it. I assume you have already done a google search and found many pictures of the ouroboros--you will have found out what it represented to alchemists. are you attracted to the hermetic philosophers? expand your brainstorming to their imagery. find John Dee's glyph:



and see Francis Yates' book, Giodordano Bruno and the Hermetic Tradition. and for symbols in general, The Hermetic Museum: Alchemy & Mysticism.

but don't stop there. what of Yggdrasil, the world tree? go to town exploring all the meanings and symbols from all cultures who have thought about the things you are thinking.

but, as I said, go back down to your own life, your own personal symbols. As a child, I loved the Spanish moss in the trees in my area, the sensitive plant, the red winged blackbird, the mud towers the crawfish built in ditches. the alligator and lizards are my dragons, not the dragons in the scrolls--though I love them.

This is your tattoo, it will last as long as you do. I think you should do your homework. Go to museums, take notes, read books like Suzuki's Zen and Japanese Culture, art histories...
posted by bleary at 6:49 AM on July 28, 2006

er...



as found here in this wikipedia entry.
posted by bleary at 6:50 AM on July 28, 2006

I would just look at the skin of someone thirty years older than you and think - Would a tatoo look good on that skin? Then decide what you really want.

Hint: gravity.
posted by trii at 5:10 PM on July 29, 2006