Dealing with store security

July 1, 2006 5:48 PM

On the coattails of the thread Ridiculousness at the Grocery Store, what's the smart way to handle being approached by store security in the United States? Assuming that you absolutely did not intentionally shoplift, and either (A) you have no goods at all or (B) you have some trivial item you forgot to pay for? Also please cite the state if you're talking about specific laws where you're at.
posted by chef_boyardee to law & government (17 comments total)

Also if anyone here works retail, it might shed some light if you can explain what the staff is & isn't allowed to do. I promise I'm not planning a heist or anything.
posted by chef_boyardee at 5:53 PM on July 1, 2006

I think the standard advice in this case is:

a) don't say anything; which is to say, don't admit to anything.

b) don't sign anything without a lawyer.

c) cooperate fully except were it might conflict with a) or b).

d) insist that they call the police.

e) if they do, in fact, call the police, continue to follow a) and b) and insist that you speak with a lawyer.

But I have little/no experience with this.
posted by maxreax at 6:09 PM on July 1, 2006

Related threads.
posted by youarenothere at 6:12 PM on July 1, 2006

I worked in retail, though not in loss prevention. I'm not a lawyer, or a policeman. What I've written below is based on my understanding of my local laws, but it's not legal advice.

That being said, I'll start with your "A" scenario -- where you have no goods, or no goods that are unpaid. If I were already outside the store, I wouldn't even stop. Even if you did shoplift, retail loss prevention staff are generally trained that, once someone's left the store, they can't do anything but call the police.

If I were still inside the store, I certainly wouldn't follow them anywhere. I'd just ask if they were accusing me of shoplifting, and if not, I'd be on my way. They can only detain you if they're calling the police, and if they aren't accusing you of shoplifing, then they aren't calling the police. If they were accusing me of shoplifting, I (knowing I was perfectly innocent) would gladly wait in the store (in a public area of it, not some back room) and say nothing and sign nothing until the police arrived.

I've put thought into this for one simple reason: I pay absolutely no attention to those alarms that go off at the doors if a sensor tag trips them. Most of the time, of course, the staff don't either. But I know there's a chance than an overzealous LP staffer will ignore his training and come after me, so I wanted to be sure of what my rights are.

Now, your scenario "B" is a little different. If you've gone past the checkouts with unpaid merchandise and are heading for the exit, you are showing an intent to shoplift, intentional or not. If you leave the store, you have shoplifted, again intentional or not. Now, nearly every shoplifter (the intentional ones) offer to pay for the goods in a last-ditch effort to get away without police attention, so no matter how honest your mistake was, they aren't going to pay any heed.

If you've already gotten outside the store, just leave. If your conscious is going to bother you, come back later to pay for it. After their LP has stopped looking for you. Ask for a manager, explain it as an honest mistake, pay, and leave. If you go back inside right away, you have a good chance of being detained, and at the very least made to sign a tresspass notice.

If you're outside and they're coming after you, and telling you to go back inside...well, don't. Even if you've legitimately shoplifted something, they don't have the right to force you back inside, especially not physically. You have to be careful here, though. If they have you on video doing something like, say, eating a bag of chips and then leaving without paying for it, they're unlikely to come after you, but some stores (like, say, Publix) are willing. And at that point, you have shoplifted. I have no good advice for this scenario, except that either you can wait until after you've paid and the merchanside is actually yours before chowing down, or you need to get help for your eating disorder. Well, that or you're just inconsiderate.
posted by CrayDrygu at 6:14 PM on July 1, 2006

Yep. As I said in that thread, they can't do shit once you're out of the store. I remember working at one national record chain that paid $50 USD for every shoplifter you caught. But, see, you couldn't be a shoplifter if you were still in the store, right? So they had to let the person get out the door and then do the please-step-back-in-the-building spiel in order for it to count.

This requires a certain kind of assertiveness and authoritatively toned neuro-linguistic rap that, amazingly, makes many people just fall right into line. It's the sort of thing you see in cellphone salespeople at mall kiosks, or televangelists, or telemarketers, or Hare Krishnas at the airport. The people I saw make the most bounty in that particular store had the whole rap down like a Jedi mind trick. Many sad faces walking with them to the back, resigned to their fate, going to sit and wait for the cops. But hey, I mean, fifty bucks.

In your scenario, at one time I might have gone through the whole drama thing with them just because I thought it was the Right Thing To Do. Nowadays I confess that I would just laugh and walk away instead.
posted by First Post at 6:39 PM on July 1, 2006

I know a guy who was at a convenience store, buying a bunch of stuff for college. He accidentally put a toothbrush in his pocket while reaching for his wallet, forgot to pay for it, and left. Some meddling old lady was like "He shoplifted!" and he had to show up to this court date where the judge was like "Why the hell am I looking at the case of someone supposedly stealing a court case?" and the charges were "dismissed with prejudice"
posted by dagnyscott at 6:47 PM on July 1, 2006

"Why the hell am I looking at the case of someone supposedly stealing a court case?"

Should this be "...supposedly stealing a toothbrush?" or was the judge just confused?
posted by bshort at 8:17 PM on July 1, 2006

But, see, you couldn't be a shoplifter if you were still in the store, right?

Depends on the jurisdiction. In Canada, concealment with the intent to remove the item from the store is enough.
posted by solid-one-love at 8:20 PM on July 1, 2006

From the time you step out of your car in the parking lot of a modern supermarket, until you are safely back in your car with your sanity and necessary groceries, you are in hostile territory. The supermarket staff are not your friends. They intentionally didn't put the milk and bread where it would be convenient for you, but where it would generate the most profit for them, by trying to subconsciously trip your impulse shopping habits. The gum and candy are at the register, at kid's eye level, because that's where they generate the most sales. Every aspect of the store's layout, lighting, product placement, and merchandising is carefully studied so as to most efficiently separate fools and their money. The store management does not regard you as a neighborhood friend, or even a customer, but as a loss risk and a revenue traffic point, period.

If you wander around with the typical "shopper's glaze" and pace, you're toast. Mindless, manipulated toast. Keep your wits about you at all times!

Don't shop lift, and don't act like you ever have or might, under any circumstances. If you sample food at all in the store, do it only with food from uniformed sample people. Otherwise, do not eat, drink, or chew in the store. Do not put your hand in your pockets, and do not wear unseasonably heavy outer garments while in the store. If you have a large purse, valise, or briefcase, lock it in the trunk of your car, and take in only your money, credit and ID cards.

If accosted or directed by other shoppers or uniformed store people, be pleasant, but non-committal, and remember that the only directions with which you are required to cooperate are generally regarding fire safety and emergency egress from the building. Do not pass more than superficial pleasantries with the staff at service counters, or at checkout, and watch their hands and registers closely, and directly, as if you expect to be shortchanged, at every visit. As others have said over and over, if accused point blank of theft or shoplifting, say nothing, do not submit to searches, wait for the police if necessary, sign nothing except a police ticket or recognizance bond. Never ask if you are being accused, or arrested, since it is up to anyone trying to do so to make that clear to you verbally as the reason they are requesting you to remain on their property. Do not return to the store if you are outside. Do not become involved in an altercation with the store staff.

If questioned by the police, politely deny wrong doing, and answer identification questions truthfully, but volunteer no information, until you have spoken with an attorney.
posted by paulsc at 8:51 PM on July 1, 2006

paulsc, that is ridiculous. There was a Fred Meyer's a few blocks away from my high school that we'd go over to during lunch. We'd take our backpacks in every day, and it was never an issue. Its insane to live that afraid of a store that you've done nothing wrong in. Maybe you should switch the stores you frequent.
posted by devilsbrigade at 11:20 PM on July 1, 2006

Do not pass more than superficial pleasantries with the staff at service counters, or at checkout, and watch their hands and registers closely, and directly, as if you expect to be shortchanged, at every visit.

Thanks for the laugh, paulsc. I'm with devilsbrigade - you seriously need to find a different store. Maybe different meds, too.
posted by letitrain at 12:00 AM on July 2, 2006

I think paulsc forgot to mention that, if possible, you should photograph the person who rings up your groceries, and get their first and last names (maiden name if applicable) and keep them on file for at least ten years. Also, wear a second pair of underwear, because modern security cameras can see through clothes.
posted by Bugbread at 12:20 AM on July 2, 2006

I'd just ask if they were accusing me of shoplifting

Don't do this, it indicates that you have some indication that they might be accusing you of shoplifting. Instead try these phrases: "Am I being detained? Why are you detaining me? Am I free to go now?" Repeat the last one ad nauseum.
posted by grouse at 1:02 AM on July 2, 2006

If I had to shop at the store paulsc shops at, I'd probably just kill myself and get it over with.
posted by Justinian at 1:23 AM on July 2, 2006

"paulsc, that is ridiculous. ..."
posted by devilsbrigade at 2:20 AM EST on July 2

This is, after all, the follow on thread to the Ridiculousness at the Grocery Store thread.

"Thanks for the laugh, paulsc. ... Maybe different meds, too."
posted by letitrain at 3:00 AM EST on July 2

You're welcome. As for the meds, I dunno. It's taken years to arrive at this delightful and effective combination. And there are real benefits to being Scary Guy at the local Publix...:-) Nobody says anything anymore when I pull a full basket into the "10 items or less" lane, although I always make it a point to mutter that it should read "10 items or fewer."
posted by paulsc at 1:42 AM on July 2, 2006 [1 favorite has favorites]

The supermarket staff are not your friends. They intentionally didn't put the milk and bread where it would be convenient for you, but where it would generate the most profit for them, by trying to subconsciously trip your impulse shopping habits.

The floor staff didn't do this! Sure, there's a manipulative science to how supermarkets are designed, but you are hella paranoid!
posted by crabintheocean at 7:58 PM on July 3, 2006

CrayDrygu writes "I've put thought into this for one simple reason: I pay absolutely no attention to those alarms that go off at the doors if a sensor tag trips them."

I don't either and I rarely have a staff member even try to flag me down. The joy of ignoring those pavloian like devices is something everyone should experience.
posted by Mitheral at 12:29 PM on July 4, 2006