Comments on: What happens with borderline MIPs?

Question: What happens with borderline MIPs?

geoff. — Tue, 30 May 2006 12:51:29 -0800

My friends and I were wondering if there is any legal precedent for what happens if someone is a week or very close to turning 21 and then receives an MIP or similar charge?

Sorry this is light-hearted and has bar bet written all over it. The genesis of the debate started when we asked a cop friend at a picnic over the weekend what he would do in a situation described above. He indicated that he would be compelled to write a ticket up until the minute they turned 21, and indeed has done so.

We then began to debate whether a judge would throw it out and what would be the usual consequences, which we realize would probably vary by jurisdiction. Way back when, we knew a friend a had an MIP when he was 17 (a real minor) and had to pay a fine and all sorts of other alcohol awareness classes, piss tests and community service. That seems to be clearly a very different case, and much less borderline. The cop friend stated that as far as he knew that was usually par for the course no matter the age, but doesn't remember any cases where the minor was above 20.

Google and relevant databases turn up no search results or rulings but then none of us know quite what syntax to use.

If anyone has any anecdotal experience or rulings they can link to, it'd be great.

By: JigSawMan

JigSawMan — Tue, 30 May 2006 12:53:47 -0800

MIP = Minor In Possession?

By: fuzzbean

fuzzbean — Tue, 30 May 2006 13:04:36 -0800

I had a friend who was arrested for this (in AZ, as I recall). It was something like a week before her 21st birthday. She still had to go through the court dates and alcohol awareness seminar stuff, even though she had turned 21 before she was able to complete them. (Note: this was just being in possession or being intoxicated (not sure which), wasn't driving or being rowdy or anything; my impression was that it was a party bust.)

The funny part was when they went around the room asking if people had learned and if they were likely to reoffend. She said, "No," quite emphatically. When asked why she was so sure that she wouldn't reoffend, she said, "Because now I'm legal."

By: Plutor

Plutor — Tue, 30 May 2006 13:04:57 -0800

Vaguely related: I was arrested and charged with Criminal Mischief shortly before my 16th birthday. My court appearance was after it. I was still charged (and pleaded guilty) as a minor.

By: geoff.

geoff. — Tue, 30 May 2006 13:05:52 -0800

Yes, Minor in Possession. We don't know how that differs from a MIC (Minor in Consumption) though we guess that the latter is used when alcohol isn't seen but the minor is intoxicated. For what it's worth I've only heard of kids receiving MIPs.

I called up a lawyer friend today and he explained that he heard of a girl receiving an MIP days before her 21st (she turned 21 on a Monday or Tuesday and decided to have a party at her house on a Friday). She was caught with a slew of other charges since there was marijuana and providing alcohol to minors involved too. He didn't remember what was dropped or how it turned out but considered the providing alcohol to minors and marijuana use as charges that they couldn't just ignore and wasn't really indicitive of hypothetical situation.

By: IshmaelGraves

IshmaelGraves — Tue, 30 May 2006 13:46:09 -0800

Here's what one North Carolina court case has to say:

The State presents two possible methods for calculation of when respondent became thirteen, the "coming of age" common law rule, and the more modern "birthday" rule. Under the "coming of age" rule, a person reaches a given age at the earliest moment of the day before his day of birth. See Mason, 66 N.C. at 637 (stating common law rule that a person born on the first day of the year 1800 becomes twenty-one years old, on the last day of the year 1820, at the earliest moment of the day); see also, Ellingham v. Morton, 498 N.Y.S.2d 650, 651 (N.Y. App. Div.), appeal denied, 494 N.E.2d 112 (N.Y. Ct. App. 1986) (explaining common law rule). Under the more modern "birthday rule," a person attains a given age on the anniversary date of his or her birth.

I have a vague memory of reading about the earlier common-law method, and that it had its origins in a case contesting the will of a man who died the day before his 21st birthday in medieval Britain — but I can't find the source now. At any rate, the NC court seems to have rejected the common law method in the case cited.

By: sailormouth

sailormouth — Tue, 30 May 2006 16:35:01 -0800

A friend and myself got $180 MIPs shortly before our 21 birthdays. I was a 3 weeks away and my friend was 1 week away. Our 19 yr old friend had decided to take a stroll just minutes before, so when he walked up as the poilce took our beer they did not ticket him. They did not even ask if he'd been drinking.
We just paid our tickets. If we were going to get off it would have been when the police were writing the tickets. They told us sorry, but they were still going to write the tickets.

By: Atreides

Atreides — Tue, 30 May 2006 19:29:43 -0800

If it goes to court, I believe some judges can be willing to take a lenient look at the circumstances. It is why they're there, after all.

By: bystander

bystander — Tue, 30 May 2006 21:30:52 -0800

Somewhat related. The day before my birthday I went on a pub crawl. Only one venue asked for ID, the barman looked at my ID, looked at the calendar on the wall, shrugged and served me.

By: JMOZ

JMOZ — Wed, 31 May 2006 08:36:20 -0800

Not a direct answer, but an example of the sort of inflexibility in the criminal justice system (at least in California)-

One of the students who works for my wife was pulled over for a broken tail-light in his car. At the time, it was a week before his 21st birthday, and he was bringing his (21+) friend home from the grocery store, where the friend had bought beer. The beer was in plain view but unopened, etc. Neither person had been drinking.

Apparently, in California, it is illegal to drive a car containing alcohol if you are under 21. The guy had to go to court, and the judge gave him the mandatory sentence of a $500 fine a one year suspension of his driver's license.