International relationship, visa, money and red flags
April 23, 2022 3:20 PM Subscribe
Family member is in a relationship with someone from another country whom he met online, and has met in person in her country since then. He is in the UK and she is from a poorer country (not in the EU). He wants her to visit him in the UK. She has asked him to give her £5K so that she is able to get a visa (I assume so she can show means of support whilst in the UK). This is raising red flags for the rest of us. Is this likely to be a scam?
Family member has asked us (other family members) to give or lend him the money. We want him to be happy but we are worried that this is the start of the woman asking him for more money, and also that she may be being coerced by someone else. She is not an especially young woman (in her 40s) so coercion feels less likely than if she were younger, but this may be a naïve assumption on our part. She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty; she is looking into getting this record scrubbed somehow in her own country so it does not affect her visa. I realise the several red flags in this.
We can afford between us to lose the money if he is not able to pay it back, though obviously would rather not lose it. I guess the worst case scenario is that we provide the money and he gets drawn into providing more, possibly getting into debt to do so. There has been a suggestion from her that he buy a property in her country, although framed partly as a joke.
What would you do? Are there any resources you can point us to to support our family member, both emotionally and practically?
Family member has asked us (other family members) to give or lend him the money. We want him to be happy but we are worried that this is the start of the woman asking him for more money, and also that she may be being coerced by someone else. She is not an especially young woman (in her 40s) so coercion feels less likely than if she were younger, but this may be a naïve assumption on our part. She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty; she is looking into getting this record scrubbed somehow in her own country so it does not affect her visa. I realise the several red flags in this.
We can afford between us to lose the money if he is not able to pay it back, though obviously would rather not lose it. I guess the worst case scenario is that we provide the money and he gets drawn into providing more, possibly getting into debt to do so. There has been a suggestion from her that he buy a property in her country, although framed partly as a joke.
What would you do? Are there any resources you can point us to to support our family member, both emotionally and practically?
Best answer: Romance scams spiked last year. Read up on them and educate yourself on what might be pulled on your family member. The fact that they have met makes it less likely that it's a scam but it's certainly not unheard of.
If this is a scam, I bet 100% that the criminal record thing will require even more money to clear up. Repeatedly. It's also a classic trust technique in social engineering.
Bellingcat has some resources that will teach you how to use things like reverse image searches to gather info on the scammers.
Can you afford to hire a detective to do a background check on her to see if her story lines up?
posted by Candleman at 4:21 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
If this is a scam, I bet 100% that the criminal record thing will require even more money to clear up. Repeatedly. It's also a classic trust technique in social engineering.
Bellingcat has some resources that will teach you how to use things like reverse image searches to gather info on the scammers.
Can you afford to hire a detective to do a background check on her to see if her story lines up?
posted by Candleman at 4:21 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
After reading a bit more into the legalities, it looks like an applicant can have a sponsor submit documents in lieu of proof of their own funds. Definitely the option to pursue in this case.
posted by givennamesurname at 4:23 PM on April 23, 2022 [12 favorites]
posted by givennamesurname at 4:23 PM on April 23, 2022 [12 favorites]
Best answer: It is possible that this is a deliberate scam, although my understanding is that it is unusual for a scammer to meet their mark in person (and I would suggest some probing to be sure that this has really happened).
However, there are pitfalls even if everything is exactly as it is portrayed to be.
Firstly, the hostile climate is real. To get a visitor visa you need to show you have 'enough' money. This blog suggests that giving her a lump sum may not work because they are looking for a regular income which demonstrates that the trip is genuinely affordable.
Secondly, if she can get a visa, she may need/use the £5k for her plane ticket and living expenses in the UK. Even without a scam, if your relative can't afford to repay the money you may not get it back.
Thirdly, it's not clear what the end state is here. If this visit is going to cost £5k then I would assume that any future visits are also likely to cost money that your relative does not have without borrowing. It may be difficult/impossible for her to immigrate here without a substantial amount of cash from somewhere.
I suggest you make a decision about how much money you personally want to contribute to this, and stick to that limit.
On preview, being sponsored may result in a visa refusal. If the sponsorship is by a romantic partner then they are likely to assume that she will overstay. If the sponsorship is by someone who on paper has no ties to her, then they are likely to assume it is not a genuine offer and that she does not have enough money to afford the trip.
posted by plonkee at 4:32 PM on April 23, 2022 [4 favorites]
However, there are pitfalls even if everything is exactly as it is portrayed to be.
Firstly, the hostile climate is real. To get a visitor visa you need to show you have 'enough' money. This blog suggests that giving her a lump sum may not work because they are looking for a regular income which demonstrates that the trip is genuinely affordable.
Secondly, if she can get a visa, she may need/use the £5k for her plane ticket and living expenses in the UK. Even without a scam, if your relative can't afford to repay the money you may not get it back.
Thirdly, it's not clear what the end state is here. If this visit is going to cost £5k then I would assume that any future visits are also likely to cost money that your relative does not have without borrowing. It may be difficult/impossible for her to immigrate here without a substantial amount of cash from somewhere.
I suggest you make a decision about how much money you personally want to contribute to this, and stick to that limit.
On preview, being sponsored may result in a visa refusal. If the sponsorship is by a romantic partner then they are likely to assume that she will overstay. If the sponsorship is by someone who on paper has no ties to her, then they are likely to assume it is not a genuine offer and that she does not have enough money to afford the trip.
posted by plonkee at 4:32 PM on April 23, 2022 [4 favorites]
Another vote in the scam column. There was a Hidden Brain episode about this sort of thing a while ago. Started in the envelopes-and-stamps era, easily updated for the internet age. In that version, the scammer hired women to pose as the love interests; I don't see why that should have changed.
Interestingly, when the scam was revealed (one of the models/actresses turned in the scammer), several of the scammed people testified for the defense. The person interviewed for the Hidden Brain episode was still enamored of "Pamala" 30 years later. So be prepared for your relative to be in it for the long-haul.
a suggestion from her that he buy a property in her country, although framed partly as a joke
Was the suggestion that she live in said property? Because if so, that was not a joke.
posted by basalganglia at 5:14 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Interestingly, when the scam was revealed (one of the models/actresses turned in the scammer), several of the scammed people testified for the defense. The person interviewed for the Hidden Brain episode was still enamored of "Pamala" 30 years later. So be prepared for your relative to be in it for the long-haul.
a suggestion from her that he buy a property in her country, although framed partly as a joke
Was the suggestion that she live in said property? Because if so, that was not a joke.
posted by basalganglia at 5:14 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
What would I do?
I would verify that it costs £5K for a visa from her country. I found this. Don't know how accurate or useful it is.
>She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty
If she was found not guilty then how does she have a criminal record... IANAL and maybe you don't have all the details but I would definitely look into this. I have all sorts of questions. What did she do/is accused of? If she was found not guilty, how is that recorded in her country? Can you find this record online? What is the process of having this record expunged? I would ask these questions on Reddit - there should be a subreddit specific to her country.
In terms of travelling with a criminal record, I found this. But if she was found not guilty, I don't know how this applies.
I also googled "family member romance scam UK" and came up with a bunch of hits.
But let's say this is not a scam and it really costs £5K to get her visa and other costs, she really does have some kind of record and there really is a way to get it expunged. If he's serious about her (or even not), then you (and other family members) should meet her online first. It sounds like she is real, but also get a sense of who she is.
>we provide the money and he gets drawn into providing more, possibly getting into debt to do so
I think your instincts are right about this. Even if this is legit, it's going to cost money to keep this relationship going, what with visits and potentially moving, etc. Is family member going to keep asking you to fund this relationship? I'm thinking if he can't afford this relationship, then maybe he shouldn't be in it?
posted by foxjacket at 5:44 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
I would verify that it costs £5K for a visa from her country. I found this. Don't know how accurate or useful it is.
>She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty
If she was found not guilty then how does she have a criminal record... IANAL and maybe you don't have all the details but I would definitely look into this. I have all sorts of questions. What did she do/is accused of? If she was found not guilty, how is that recorded in her country? Can you find this record online? What is the process of having this record expunged? I would ask these questions on Reddit - there should be a subreddit specific to her country.
In terms of travelling with a criminal record, I found this. But if she was found not guilty, I don't know how this applies.
I also googled "family member romance scam UK" and came up with a bunch of hits.
But let's say this is not a scam and it really costs £5K to get her visa and other costs, she really does have some kind of record and there really is a way to get it expunged. If he's serious about her (or even not), then you (and other family members) should meet her online first. It sounds like she is real, but also get a sense of who she is.
>we provide the money and he gets drawn into providing more, possibly getting into debt to do so
I think your instincts are right about this. Even if this is legit, it's going to cost money to keep this relationship going, what with visits and potentially moving, etc. Is family member going to keep asking you to fund this relationship? I'm thinking if he can't afford this relationship, then maybe he shouldn't be in it?
posted by foxjacket at 5:44 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
I'd be putting 99% of my money into this being a scam. Just meeting a lady somewhere isn't an expensive thing for them to set up. Ultimate aim is usually to get to the destination country, along with "brother / cousin", get married and thus permanent residency, then a divorce, then they marry the "brother" to get him residency too. This is the ultimate aim, and she will be paid from more than one source. If they can get 5k out of you first so much the better, and the numbers will get higher. And the more the mark is "in" for, the harder it is for him to get out.
posted by tillsbury at 5:46 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by tillsbury at 5:46 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
It might not be a scam, but there's no way I would ever consider lending money to someone for this purpose. Sorry, but if he doesn't have 5K of his own to spend, he shouldn't be trying to sponsor someone for a visa. Why doesn't he just go see her in her country using his own money?
posted by emd3737 at 6:46 PM on April 23, 2022 [20 favorites]
posted by emd3737 at 6:46 PM on April 23, 2022 [20 favorites]
Best answer: So many red flags, I would also think SCAM. Nthing if he doesn't have the money he shouldn't be entertaining the thought of pursuing this further. Even if he did have the 5k, there are a lot of people who have lost $$$$ because of romance scams.
IMO, best way to support them is NOT give them money and help them realize it's a scam. If he won't accept that, at the very least try to understand why he feels the way he does. Maybe that will help you come up with another way to help. He's an adult and can make his own choices. Caring about your family member doesn't mean you're obligated to give him money or solve his problems.
posted by VyanSelei at 7:56 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
IMO, best way to support them is NOT give them money and help them realize it's a scam. If he won't accept that, at the very least try to understand why he feels the way he does. Maybe that will help you come up with another way to help. He's an adult and can make his own choices. Caring about your family member doesn't mean you're obligated to give him money or solve his problems.
posted by VyanSelei at 7:56 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Best answer: This really does have scam written all over it.
I doubt your family member will be able to hear that however. I would go ahead and suggest the sponsorship plan whether you think it would work or not. I suspect more complications will immediately arise in which case you can safely step back.
Even if everything is completely above board borrowing 5K to give your girlfriend an English vacation seems like a poor use of resources.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 12:05 AM on April 24, 2022 [4 favorites]
I doubt your family member will be able to hear that however. I would go ahead and suggest the sponsorship plan whether you think it would work or not. I suspect more complications will immediately arise in which case you can safely step back.
Even if everything is completely above board borrowing 5K to give your girlfriend an English vacation seems like a poor use of resources.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 12:05 AM on April 24, 2022 [4 favorites]
I’ve had a family member lose money to a romance scam recently, they are becoming sadly more common for a certain generation of men, I would push back about sponsoring a visa for a visit here if he’s already visited her in her home country.
posted by ellieBOA at 12:53 AM on April 24, 2022
posted by ellieBOA at 12:53 AM on April 24, 2022
Best answer: I would verify that it costs £5K for a visa from her country.
It doesn't. It costs £100 for a 6 month visitor visa. However, to get the visa you need to show that you have enough money to fund a trip to the UK. There are no clear guidelines on what this amount is, but some people believe it to be around £100-£150 per day when the visitor is planning to stay in hotels etc. In addition, it is believed that the UK authorities are looking for the total cost of the trip to be about half the amount available in savings. Depending on the cost of flights, this can all plausibly stack up. But having an unexplained lump sum will cause red flags in the visa application by itself.
>She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty
If she was found not guilty then how does she have a criminal record...
I am assuming that she was found guilty, but continues to assert her innocence. From the point of view of visa applications, it's the criminal record that matters. She may be able to get a visa depending on the crime but it will be significantly more challenging. Without knowing more it is impossible to say whether getting her record expunged is possible.
If everything described in the OP is legit, there is still an excellent chance that this woman be refused a UK visa and be unable to visit the relative in the UK. The money may well have been spent or be otherwise unreturned. If the visa application is successful, the money may be spent or otherwise unreturned.
This may be a romance scam, in which case the money will definitely not be returned. But many people who are victims of romance scams have trouble accepting that. If it is a scam, then there is an excellent chance that your relative will lose as much money as they can lay their hands on (ie borrow from friends, family, banks, credit cards etc) and still never admit that she is anything other than what she claims to be. Given that your relative has met this woman, they are even less likely to believe that it is a scam right now.
You may find it easier to help your relative if you treat this as potentially legit because it doesn't necessarily matter. This is more likely than not to be the start of requests for money either way. I think the best thing to do is decide how much you personally are comfortable losing/wasting on this regardless of the real circumstances. That may be £0. And then stick to that, using 'no that won't be possible' as needed.
posted by plonkee at 2:02 AM on April 24, 2022 [13 favorites]
It doesn't. It costs £100 for a 6 month visitor visa. However, to get the visa you need to show that you have enough money to fund a trip to the UK. There are no clear guidelines on what this amount is, but some people believe it to be around £100-£150 per day when the visitor is planning to stay in hotels etc. In addition, it is believed that the UK authorities are looking for the total cost of the trip to be about half the amount available in savings. Depending on the cost of flights, this can all plausibly stack up. But having an unexplained lump sum will cause red flags in the visa application by itself.
>She has told him she has a criminal record but that she was not guilty
If she was found not guilty then how does she have a criminal record...
I am assuming that she was found guilty, but continues to assert her innocence. From the point of view of visa applications, it's the criminal record that matters. She may be able to get a visa depending on the crime but it will be significantly more challenging. Without knowing more it is impossible to say whether getting her record expunged is possible.
If everything described in the OP is legit, there is still an excellent chance that this woman be refused a UK visa and be unable to visit the relative in the UK. The money may well have been spent or be otherwise unreturned. If the visa application is successful, the money may be spent or otherwise unreturned.
This may be a romance scam, in which case the money will definitely not be returned. But many people who are victims of romance scams have trouble accepting that. If it is a scam, then there is an excellent chance that your relative will lose as much money as they can lay their hands on (ie borrow from friends, family, banks, credit cards etc) and still never admit that she is anything other than what she claims to be. Given that your relative has met this woman, they are even less likely to believe that it is a scam right now.
You may find it easier to help your relative if you treat this as potentially legit because it doesn't necessarily matter. This is more likely than not to be the start of requests for money either way. I think the best thing to do is decide how much you personally are comfortable losing/wasting on this regardless of the real circumstances. That may be £0. And then stick to that, using 'no that won't be possible' as needed.
posted by plonkee at 2:02 AM on April 24, 2022 [13 favorites]
Best answer: I'm less inclined than some folks above to think this is an out-and-out scam, since the family member has actually met the woman in question. (Though I suppose it still could be.) The more charitable interpretation is that the woman needs to show "sufficient financial resources" for the trip and wants to have a larger bank balance for that purpose. The folks at Travel StackExchange call this funds parking and it's a common reason for visa refusals. There's also an exhaustive answer about what your bank statements say about you that might be useful.
If you're willing to part with something on the order of £5K to help your your family member & his girlfriend, it might be worth using that money to hire a solicitor instead, in order to help craft her visa application (particularly given her criminal record) and/or to discuss long-term options.
posted by Johnny Assay at 5:48 AM on April 24, 2022 [7 favorites]
If you're willing to part with something on the order of £5K to help your your family member & his girlfriend, it might be worth using that money to hire a solicitor instead, in order to help craft her visa application (particularly given her criminal record) and/or to discuss long-term options.
posted by Johnny Assay at 5:48 AM on April 24, 2022 [7 favorites]
Even if it is not a scam, i would, before anything else, find out if it is realistic that she obtains a visa with a criminal record. Or that said record be scrubbed within a reasonable timeframe.
Scrubbing a criminal record may not be easy, cheap or quick, depending which country and what the crime was. These are things you maybe able to Google if you know the country and what she was accused of.
posted by 15L06 at 7:45 AM on April 24, 2022
Scrubbing a criminal record may not be easy, cheap or quick, depending which country and what the crime was. These are things you maybe able to Google if you know the country and what she was accused of.
posted by 15L06 at 7:45 AM on April 24, 2022
Out of curiosity, are they having regular video chats?
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 8:22 AM on April 24, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 8:22 AM on April 24, 2022 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Ask him to join the 'I Love My Foreign Spouse' Facebook group. Sorry to redirect to another source, but this is UK focused and has a wide range of members experienced in applying for visit visas (often successfully!). The Files section of the group includes for example checklists for applications for many types of visas (including visit visas for partners) in the past and is really one of the best resources available for those UK people with foreign partners, as a source of knowledge and experience.
This does seem a bit suss for me for a few reasons -
For one thing, I am aware of spousal (rather than visit) visas being refused when the UK spouse has tried to use Western Union etc. receipts as evidence of an ongoing relationship, and this has been cited in the refusal. Intuitively financial support should seem like evidence of a relationship, but to some entry clearance officers the exchange of funds can look fishy and as though the relationship is based on money. It's generally not the -only- reason for refusal, but it can add to the overall picture.
I agree with Johnny Assay's comments overall - it sounds like 'funds parking' and is not a good strategy for a visit visa for the reasons he and I both stated.
It's also worth pointing out re the criminal record that depending on how long ago it was, and what the sentence was, there's a strong chance of a refusal on those grounds alone. The rules are complex and are here - ask him to check that. She would come under the 'Visitors and those seeking entry for less than 6 months –
mandatory refusal of entry clearance or permission to
enter' section. There's really no point in even applying if she falls foul of the criminality requirement. (For example, a 12 months or more must have expired after the end of a custodial sentence, assuming it was 12 months or less; the rules are obviously stricter if longer).
posted by plep at 2:27 AM on April 25, 2022 [4 favorites]
This does seem a bit suss for me for a few reasons -
For one thing, I am aware of spousal (rather than visit) visas being refused when the UK spouse has tried to use Western Union etc. receipts as evidence of an ongoing relationship, and this has been cited in the refusal. Intuitively financial support should seem like evidence of a relationship, but to some entry clearance officers the exchange of funds can look fishy and as though the relationship is based on money. It's generally not the -only- reason for refusal, but it can add to the overall picture.
I agree with Johnny Assay's comments overall - it sounds like 'funds parking' and is not a good strategy for a visit visa for the reasons he and I both stated.
It's also worth pointing out re the criminal record that depending on how long ago it was, and what the sentence was, there's a strong chance of a refusal on those grounds alone. The rules are complex and are here - ask him to check that. She would come under the 'Visitors and those seeking entry for less than 6 months –
mandatory refusal of entry clearance or permission to
enter' section. There's really no point in even applying if she falls foul of the criminality requirement. (For example, a 12 months or more must have expired after the end of a custodial sentence, assuming it was 12 months or less; the rules are obviously stricter if longer).
posted by plep at 2:27 AM on April 25, 2022 [4 favorites]
Best answer: You know, if between the two of them, they need to borrow £5K from friends and family to even manage a visa for one visit, they cannot really afford to pursue this at all. How will they afford their costs during this visit, future visits, eventually residency/sponsorship costs, etc? It sounds like neither of them has sufficient income or assets to actually maintain an international relationship like this. Rather than treating this like a scam, maybe talk to your relative about the financial realities and ask how he plans to manage in the future.
posted by JuliaIglesias at 6:54 PM on April 25, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by JuliaIglesias at 6:54 PM on April 25, 2022 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks for all of this, it has been helpful, especially understanding more about the visa process. When we expressed concerns to family member after this, he responded by reducing his request to £2k and saying he will repay within two months. Fairly cynical about whether this will happen, but have given him the money. My part in this is partly to prevent another family member (my mother) handing over more than she can easily afford - we split the money between us rather than she paying it all.
There are a number of things we don't understand, including why our family member doesn't have this money available. His income is by some way the highest in our extended family. We think he has been giving the woman money regularly for some time. We have been open with him that we think this could be a scam, and he has lost one long-standing friend over it after the friend was candid with him.
Yes, he has been having daily video chats with the woman for months, it's definitely the same person. I have seen recordings of the chats and another family member has spoken to her. Yes, the conviction, which is for drug-smuggling, was, she says, because someone else was guilty but she said that she was as it was better for her to go to prison than the other person. I'm twitchy about giving the name of the country.
One new piece of information which rang further alarms for me. When he was in her country to meet her, "friends" rang her who were her former prison guards. My family member spoke to them on a video call. They were in prison uniform and calling from the prison. He told us about this because he wanted to show that she is someone whom people care about - he said they were calling because they knew he was there and wanted to make sure she was ok. I see this as possibly coercive rather than the sunny interpretation he has put on it.
Thanks again, and I may have to come back with a further question at some point about how to continue to raise concerns without alienating my family member.
posted by paduasoy at 12:54 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
There are a number of things we don't understand, including why our family member doesn't have this money available. His income is by some way the highest in our extended family. We think he has been giving the woman money regularly for some time. We have been open with him that we think this could be a scam, and he has lost one long-standing friend over it after the friend was candid with him.
Yes, he has been having daily video chats with the woman for months, it's definitely the same person. I have seen recordings of the chats and another family member has spoken to her. Yes, the conviction, which is for drug-smuggling, was, she says, because someone else was guilty but she said that she was as it was better for her to go to prison than the other person. I'm twitchy about giving the name of the country.
One new piece of information which rang further alarms for me. When he was in her country to meet her, "friends" rang her who were her former prison guards. My family member spoke to them on a video call. They were in prison uniform and calling from the prison. He told us about this because he wanted to show that she is someone whom people care about - he said they were calling because they knew he was there and wanted to make sure she was ok. I see this as possibly coercive rather than the sunny interpretation he has put on it.
Thanks again, and I may have to come back with a further question at some point about how to continue to raise concerns without alienating my family member.
posted by paduasoy at 12:54 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
Yes, the conviction, which is for drug-smuggling, was, she says, because someone else was guilty but she said that she was as it was better for her to go to prison than the other person.
She is almost certainly not going to get a visa with a drug smuggling conviction. Drugs-related convictions are usually considered 'serious harm', which means a mandatory visa refusal regardless of length of sentence. In case it's helpful, the current rules about visa refusals in relation to criminality are available online.
I lean more towards scam than before based on your update, but I can definitely see why you want to protect your mother.
posted by plonkee at 2:40 PM on May 3, 2022 [1 favorite]
She is almost certainly not going to get a visa with a drug smuggling conviction. Drugs-related convictions are usually considered 'serious harm', which means a mandatory visa refusal regardless of length of sentence. In case it's helpful, the current rules about visa refusals in relation to criminality are available online.
I lean more towards scam than before based on your update, but I can definitely see why you want to protect your mother.
posted by plonkee at 2:40 PM on May 3, 2022 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks, plonkee. What I'm not clear about is whether and how the Home Office checks with the applicant's country about any convictions. If she answers No to the question about whether she's been convicted of anything (either directly lying or because she thinks the conviction has been somehow deleted, which she's mentioned trying to get done), would the HO have any way of knowing this is untrue? It doesn't look as if she would automatically need an overseas criminal record certificate.
posted by paduasoy at 1:46 PM on May 4, 2022
posted by paduasoy at 1:46 PM on May 4, 2022
Best answer: That's difficult to establish and no one is likely to openly advise breaking immigration law.
The Home Office don't ask for a police certificate for a visitor visa, but do for other kinds of visas. They may ask for a police certificate in relation to a wider range of visas in the future. For many people, lying about convictions leaves them in a much worse place if it's discovered later (including impacting visas for other countries) than just dealing with them in the first visa application. But this assumes that they could have received a visa if the conviction had been declared.
posted by plonkee at 7:37 AM on May 5, 2022
The Home Office don't ask for a police certificate for a visitor visa, but do for other kinds of visas. They may ask for a police certificate in relation to a wider range of visas in the future. For many people, lying about convictions leaves them in a much worse place if it's discovered later (including impacting visas for other countries) than just dealing with them in the first visa application. But this assumes that they could have received a visa if the conviction had been declared.
posted by plonkee at 7:37 AM on May 5, 2022
Response by poster: Updating that relative has paid us back. His partner or girlfriend - unsure what terminology they are using - has been denied a UK visa, as expected, on the grounds that she hasn’t shown she can support herself whilst here. Relative is contacting an immigration lawyer. We - family members - continue to be concerned about him, both from an emotional and financial point of view, but don’t think there is anything we can do to intervene at the moment.
posted by paduasoy at 3:47 PM on June 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by paduasoy at 3:47 PM on June 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
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Assuming the criminal record isn't a barrier, instead of pursuing a general visitor visa maybe encourage him to look into a Short-Term Study Visa for her? If English is her second language, she can take classes and even have independent accommodation if she studies full time. This could give both of them some breathing room in case the relationship doesn't work out and you can offer to help with tuition costs instead of depositing 5K in a bank account and hoping everything works out. Classes are location dependent, but a quick search in the offical course finders shows a number of options in the under 100GBP and 100-200GBP a week range.
The only major downside is she has to commit to stay for a 6 month course.
posted by givennamesurname at 3:52 PM on April 23, 2022 [3 favorites]