How do I break up with my friend, and how do I get over it?
June 2, 2021 1:20 AM Subscribe
The friend in question and I have been close friends since we were 10 (we're 29 now, and also both female just for context). We've had major arguments before but this most recent one has just made me feeling like I really just don't want her in my life anymore. It's been such a significant friendship that ending it feels pretty fraught, and I've been struggling to figure out how to end it respectfully but still definitively, and also struggling to get over it.
When we were younger we talked all the time, saw each other almost every weekend; she's present in so many of my memories from back then. As adults we still talked a lot, have traveled together, lived together for a while. We get along really well and have a lot of fun together, but we're also both very reserved people who haven't been the best at communication, so in a lot of ways it actually feels like a surprisingly shallow relationship. On several occasions throughout the years we've gotten in fights that resulted in us not talking for a while before reconciling. Neither of us is great at resolving conflict, so we'd argue in very not constructive ways and we'd resolve them by basically just exchanging cursory apologies and then never mentioning it again and pretending nothing had happened. This is, as I now recognize, not a particularly effective strategy especially over so much time and proximity, the end result has been a lot of baggage and unresolved hostility.
There's been this tension between us lately that just kept growing until we had one of those sitcom-style arguments where the argument is ostensibly about one thing but it's actually about a bunch of shit that happened years ago that we haven't even begun to really resolve. She lashed out at me and it was especially upsetting for me this time around because I was dealing with a lot of health issues and it just brought up a bunch of unresolved shit for me around her being unsupportive when I was going through something difficult, since a lot of our biggest arguments have been caused by exactly that (and in all fairness I've certainly played a part in that by handling it very poorly and immaturely, to be sure). She apologized several times and has made some effort to make it up to me, but I feel like after this last argument something just changed for me and I just don't want her in my life anymore, much more definitively than I've ever felt before.
I thought about trying to talk through all our baggage and even considered getting us to see a therapist to facilitate the whole "healthy communication" thing, but I just couldn't bring myself to do even that. I just felt this very visceral aversion to the thought of being around her. I told her I needed to process things and tried to give myself some time to cool down but it hasn't gotten any better, I still just get this visceral "sick to my stomach" feeling at the thought of her continuing to be in my life, and this really feels like the end for this relationship in a way that I've never felt before.
So what I need to do now, and what I want advice on, is communicate to her that the relationship is over. So: what do I say? How much do I say and disclose? It feels disrespectful to our friendship to just end things with a very generic "It's been fun but I think we should go our separate ways" type of message. But I don't see the point in going into much detail about how I'm feeling and what my perspective is, nor do I have any desire to lay out a bunch of angry recriminations. I really just have no idea what to say. And, how do I do it? I'm living in another state at the moment so I can't do it in person. I was planning to just send a message, in part so I could carefully think through what I said instead of just getting hostile and reactive which would be a risk if we talked on the phone, and honestly also in part because I'm still so upset that I just don't really want to talk to her anymore. But I'm interested in hearing other perspectives on this.
I know I might be overthinking this, but she was just such a big part of my life for so long and we're both going to remember how things ended between us probably for a long time, and I just want to be thoughtful about how I handle this. And I get that there's no rulebook for this type of thing and everyone will have their own take on what's appropriate or how to proceed. I'd just appreciate any insight or perspective here.
And if anyone has any insight to share on getting over something like this, I'd certainly welcome that too. I know it'll get better with time and all that, but it feels like an actual break-up and I've just been really sad about it and kind of at a loss about what to make of all of it.
Thank you!
When we were younger we talked all the time, saw each other almost every weekend; she's present in so many of my memories from back then. As adults we still talked a lot, have traveled together, lived together for a while. We get along really well and have a lot of fun together, but we're also both very reserved people who haven't been the best at communication, so in a lot of ways it actually feels like a surprisingly shallow relationship. On several occasions throughout the years we've gotten in fights that resulted in us not talking for a while before reconciling. Neither of us is great at resolving conflict, so we'd argue in very not constructive ways and we'd resolve them by basically just exchanging cursory apologies and then never mentioning it again and pretending nothing had happened. This is, as I now recognize, not a particularly effective strategy especially over so much time and proximity, the end result has been a lot of baggage and unresolved hostility.
There's been this tension between us lately that just kept growing until we had one of those sitcom-style arguments where the argument is ostensibly about one thing but it's actually about a bunch of shit that happened years ago that we haven't even begun to really resolve. She lashed out at me and it was especially upsetting for me this time around because I was dealing with a lot of health issues and it just brought up a bunch of unresolved shit for me around her being unsupportive when I was going through something difficult, since a lot of our biggest arguments have been caused by exactly that (and in all fairness I've certainly played a part in that by handling it very poorly and immaturely, to be sure). She apologized several times and has made some effort to make it up to me, but I feel like after this last argument something just changed for me and I just don't want her in my life anymore, much more definitively than I've ever felt before.
I thought about trying to talk through all our baggage and even considered getting us to see a therapist to facilitate the whole "healthy communication" thing, but I just couldn't bring myself to do even that. I just felt this very visceral aversion to the thought of being around her. I told her I needed to process things and tried to give myself some time to cool down but it hasn't gotten any better, I still just get this visceral "sick to my stomach" feeling at the thought of her continuing to be in my life, and this really feels like the end for this relationship in a way that I've never felt before.
So what I need to do now, and what I want advice on, is communicate to her that the relationship is over. So: what do I say? How much do I say and disclose? It feels disrespectful to our friendship to just end things with a very generic "It's been fun but I think we should go our separate ways" type of message. But I don't see the point in going into much detail about how I'm feeling and what my perspective is, nor do I have any desire to lay out a bunch of angry recriminations. I really just have no idea what to say. And, how do I do it? I'm living in another state at the moment so I can't do it in person. I was planning to just send a message, in part so I could carefully think through what I said instead of just getting hostile and reactive which would be a risk if we talked on the phone, and honestly also in part because I'm still so upset that I just don't really want to talk to her anymore. But I'm interested in hearing other perspectives on this.
I know I might be overthinking this, but she was just such a big part of my life for so long and we're both going to remember how things ended between us probably for a long time, and I just want to be thoughtful about how I handle this. And I get that there's no rulebook for this type of thing and everyone will have their own take on what's appropriate or how to proceed. I'd just appreciate any insight or perspective here.
And if anyone has any insight to share on getting over something like this, I'd certainly welcome that too. I know it'll get better with time and all that, but it feels like an actual break-up and I've just been really sad about it and kind of at a loss about what to make of all of it.
Thank you!
“I feel we’ve outgrown each other, and it would be best for both of us if we went our separate ways. I wish you the best”, with whatever additional trimmings you feel are appropriate. Keep it simple and brief.
posted by myotahapea at 2:41 AM on June 2, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by myotahapea at 2:41 AM on June 2, 2021 [5 favorites]
Best answer: I ended a similarly enduring friendship with a letter explaining why I didn't want to be friends with my (ex) friend any longer. I referred to our recent interaction - a day spent together - and how some experiences from that day made me realise that we were no longer compatible as friends. I then referred to an event many years earlier which demonstrated a similar dynamic to illustrate the pattern I now found untenable in a friendship. In other words, I attributed some blame without an equal acceptance of responsibility.
She never contacted me again. I later heard from a friend of her sister that my ex-friend was going to write back and ... but then she shrugged her shoulders and said 'whatever'.
My friend was fun and there are times when I miss her, especially as we were so close as kids and many of my childhood memories involve her. But I don't miss some of the feelings our friendship induced in me, and some of the ways she acted against my interests.
It's been over 20 years since I wrote that letter and while hindsight lets me see my own blinkers, my culpabilities, I can better see her vulnerabilities now too. At the time I posted that letter from my high horse of righteousness, I only thought of my reasons to disengage the friendship. But from her perspective, I might have been hard work as well.
In other words, you and your friend will have differing perspectives on these issues and neither of you needs the other to validate your point of view. So, if you are going to send an email or letter, make it cool, clean, clear, bloodless, and the end of things. Neither of you should come away feeling guilt or shame from reading or writing the missive that ends the friendship.
posted by Thella at 2:58 AM on June 2, 2021 [15 favorites]
She never contacted me again. I later heard from a friend of her sister that my ex-friend was going to write back and ... but then she shrugged her shoulders and said 'whatever'.
My friend was fun and there are times when I miss her, especially as we were so close as kids and many of my childhood memories involve her. But I don't miss some of the feelings our friendship induced in me, and some of the ways she acted against my interests.
It's been over 20 years since I wrote that letter and while hindsight lets me see my own blinkers, my culpabilities, I can better see her vulnerabilities now too. At the time I posted that letter from my high horse of righteousness, I only thought of my reasons to disengage the friendship. But from her perspective, I might have been hard work as well.
In other words, you and your friend will have differing perspectives on these issues and neither of you needs the other to validate your point of view. So, if you are going to send an email or letter, make it cool, clean, clear, bloodless, and the end of things. Neither of you should come away feeling guilt or shame from reading or writing the missive that ends the friendship.
posted by Thella at 2:58 AM on June 2, 2021 [15 favorites]
It sounds like you feel quite strongly about ending this friendship now, so take the following not as an attempt to change your mind but an offering of some options between the all-or-nothing ones that you are free to discard. Another caveat: I'm an old fogey that thinks that friendship is not a yes/no proposition but a set of points on the gradient between "ignore" and "BFF", above "acquaintance".
You could
- redefine what kind of friendship you want to have with her given your experience, e.g. limit it to
"we get along well and have fun together" and not consider her as part of your support network. Not all friendships are alike.
- take a break from each other, however long, short, or indefinite, and re-evaluate when you're not in the middle of a health crisis on top of a year of global pandemic. Perhaps you gain a different perspective, or she does, or you both develop in some direction that may or may not bring you closer.
posted by meijusa at 3:08 AM on June 2, 2021 [32 favorites]
You could
- redefine what kind of friendship you want to have with her given your experience, e.g. limit it to
"we get along well and have fun together" and not consider her as part of your support network. Not all friendships are alike.
- take a break from each other, however long, short, or indefinite, and re-evaluate when you're not in the middle of a health crisis on top of a year of global pandemic. Perhaps you gain a different perspective, or she does, or you both develop in some direction that may or may not bring you closer.
posted by meijusa at 3:08 AM on June 2, 2021 [32 favorites]
I think one of the best things you can do to get over this is to work on your communication and conflict resolution skills. Building those skills so you don't have to repeat past mistakes will make you feel more confident, nature, steady. The knowledge that you can grow and change will seve you well.
In the process of learning these skills you will have to examine the past and consider this relationship, but not from a place of guilt, but in a place of understanding. Take an active listening class, work with a therapist, read books.
posted by brookeb at 4:46 AM on June 2, 2021 [4 favorites]
In the process of learning these skills you will have to examine the past and consider this relationship, but not from a place of guilt, but in a place of understanding. Take an active listening class, work with a therapist, read books.
posted by brookeb at 4:46 AM on June 2, 2021 [4 favorites]
I think brookeb’s advice is especially important and all this advice is prescient. You mention you live in separate states. This seems like a situation to decrease contact and fade away. Like a ladder - climb down from best friends to close friends, to friends who don’t see each other much but enjoy reconnecting or one hobby, to friends who chat at events, to acquaintances. You’re also going through an illness and that can be your reason for not wanting to talk as much. I think a letter or long text can be helpful for you to process your feelings about it (and you could write one and burn it for that reason), but is not helpful to the other person. You don’t need to explain the situation in just the right way, that’s not really possible, and I think a big “we’re done!” would be more hurtful to her. You can decrease contact with her, pull away, and fulfill your goal of not being close friends with her that way.
I may be wrong about this. I’m speaking from my perspective of a person who has received the friend break-up text and someone who has been the “drifter” and been drifted from. I preferred that. It also sets up a situation where you can eventually see each other and it’s not as awkward or emotionally upsetting for both of you.
posted by areaperson at 5:34 AM on June 2, 2021 [11 favorites]
I may be wrong about this. I’m speaking from my perspective of a person who has received the friend break-up text and someone who has been the “drifter” and been drifted from. I preferred that. It also sets up a situation where you can eventually see each other and it’s not as awkward or emotionally upsetting for both of you.
posted by areaperson at 5:34 AM on June 2, 2021 [11 favorites]
You're allowed to grow and change. You are allowed to tell someone that you love them but feel like the relationship has run its course and it would be healthier for you both to wish each other well and move on. It doesn't have to be done with hostility or rancor.
posted by DarlingBri at 5:37 AM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by DarlingBri at 5:37 AM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
I politely suggest a calm, quiet exit for now. Take the energy and fret that you have about how to end this appropriately and channel it into making yourself feel good and comfortable about closing up a relationship that is causing you distress.
Perhaps I'm missing something, but is there a reason you need a demonstrative action here? If you fell like you do need something active like that, do you need to put that out to her as an opening move to this break-up, or can you take your time formulating what you want to say and how you want to say it so that you're ready if and when she reaches out to you again?
The situation you're in with her isn't a formal one--there are no contracts to dissolve, no property to divide, no living situations that must be changed. What would you be accomplishing by putting out a missive that makes it clear that this relationship is irredeemable? If the answer is something along the lines of "the satisfaction of closure," I'd suggest that closure is something that you generate within yourself. Reaching out to your former friend might help you feel like you've taken steps that feel like closure to you, but I would imagine that to have that feeling you'd be seeking one of two responses: either silence from her, or a calm, brief "Okay." Given what you've said about each of your styles of confrontation, are either of those responses likely? Or will a message like this prompt a more involved response, or anger, or something else that lends a deepening sense of dread to how you two communicate?
Many of us who've ended relationships (of varying sorts) have found the value of going "no contact." Which, in essence, means that you strive to engage as little as possible, if at all. Any communication that does need to happen is handled as mechanically as possible. Even if you receive a screed in response, you only answer the direct questions within it. Rather than get drawn into conversation, debate, and conflict, you stay as close to "yes, no, maybe, I don't know" in what you're willing to give back.
In the meantime, I agree that it's better to (as the comments above recommend) focus on yourself, your senses of communication and conflict resolution, without necessarily using this particular relationship as the focus.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 5:38 AM on June 2, 2021 [4 favorites]
Perhaps I'm missing something, but is there a reason you need a demonstrative action here? If you fell like you do need something active like that, do you need to put that out to her as an opening move to this break-up, or can you take your time formulating what you want to say and how you want to say it so that you're ready if and when she reaches out to you again?
The situation you're in with her isn't a formal one--there are no contracts to dissolve, no property to divide, no living situations that must be changed. What would you be accomplishing by putting out a missive that makes it clear that this relationship is irredeemable? If the answer is something along the lines of "the satisfaction of closure," I'd suggest that closure is something that you generate within yourself. Reaching out to your former friend might help you feel like you've taken steps that feel like closure to you, but I would imagine that to have that feeling you'd be seeking one of two responses: either silence from her, or a calm, brief "Okay." Given what you've said about each of your styles of confrontation, are either of those responses likely? Or will a message like this prompt a more involved response, or anger, or something else that lends a deepening sense of dread to how you two communicate?
Many of us who've ended relationships (of varying sorts) have found the value of going "no contact." Which, in essence, means that you strive to engage as little as possible, if at all. Any communication that does need to happen is handled as mechanically as possible. Even if you receive a screed in response, you only answer the direct questions within it. Rather than get drawn into conversation, debate, and conflict, you stay as close to "yes, no, maybe, I don't know" in what you're willing to give back.
In the meantime, I agree that it's better to (as the comments above recommend) focus on yourself, your senses of communication and conflict resolution, without necessarily using this particular relationship as the focus.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 5:38 AM on June 2, 2021 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: Forgot to mention, I am in therapy working on communication and conflict resolution type things (among other things) and reading books on the topics and practicing them with people and so on. It's definitely been enlightening reflecting on the friendship and trying to learn from the mistakes we made, and that's helpful for going forward and I think important to do, it doesn't really help address the pain I'm feeling in the context of this specific relationship though. Those of you who have mentioned ending similar relationships, I'd be really interested to hear what your emotional experience was in the aftermath.
posted by toska at 6:04 AM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by toska at 6:04 AM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
“I feel we’ve outgrown each other, and it would be best for both of us if we went our separate ways. I wish you the best”
My wife parted ways with a formerly close childhood friend a few years back. They had a face-to-face conversation about it, and the above was basically the gist of what she had to say. My understanding is that the other person felt more or less the same way, which in that case may have made it easier for both of them.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:27 AM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
My wife parted ways with a formerly close childhood friend a few years back. They had a face-to-face conversation about it, and the above was basically the gist of what she had to say. My understanding is that the other person felt more or less the same way, which in that case may have made it easier for both of them.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:27 AM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
Best answer: My emotional experience has been that it’s really hard! It’s similar to a romantic breakup. I think it helps to recognize that this is something really difficult and treat yourself kindly. I have my own “coping” strategies like I read or watch something really depressing to sort of remind myself other people have it worse. Sometimes I get a haircut or maybe try a new workout routine. I remember watching 30 Rock and Tracy Morgan had a joke where he said, “white women are terrified of their best friends!” And that really hit home - I don’t know why it would be a racial thing and I don’t assume you’re white, but I think that joke could be made about a lot of women. that statement definitely made me realize “yes, that is a fraught kind of relationship!” And recognizing that made it easier for me to look at in perspective. I think you’re doing some impressive reflection. I think noting the physical reaction you’re having to this situation is really good. That’s a big step. I think you’re going through a transition and it’s awesome you’re talking to a therapist. Sometimes I talk about these situations with my husband or my dad and I find that helpful because they seem to have much more casual friendships. They’ll easily call their friends out or confront a situation that I would stress over, and sometimes I try to model that sort of behavior. I don’t know how this became a reflection on gender, but I guess it did! Still, good on you for your commitment to self reflection and improvement, and I hope you’re on your way to feeling better about this relationship.
posted by areaperson at 7:07 AM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by areaperson at 7:07 AM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
I think you need time to pass before you write a/the letter. Perspective is a good thing. I do not in any way think you should not write a letter or an email, I just think a month or two of time will help clarify your thoughts. Unless this is some sort of exercise for therapy where you are testing your new communication and conflict resolution skills. the letter can be written at any time. It does not need immediacy.
Reading all the responses above, it seems like looking back on this sort of thing years later they would still do it, but maybe write or communicate something differently. myotahapea, above, puts it pretty succinctly and says really all you need to say.
If you think it cathartic to get everything off your chest, write the letter and delay sending it. A few months later reread the leeter and make your decision about what to say then.
posted by AugustWest at 7:31 AM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
Reading all the responses above, it seems like looking back on this sort of thing years later they would still do it, but maybe write or communicate something differently. myotahapea, above, puts it pretty succinctly and says really all you need to say.
If you think it cathartic to get everything off your chest, write the letter and delay sending it. A few months later reread the leeter and make your decision about what to say then.
posted by AugustWest at 7:31 AM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
Write whatever you want, but don't send it.
Adult friendships default to fading. If you don't actively get in touch with her, she'll fade out naturally, and with a lot, LOT less awkwardness, hurt and irretrievability. You probably have good reasons for thinking you'll never want to see her again, but life is long, your 30s are a time of MAJOR change, and it's entirely possible that you may want to hear her voice again one of these days.
So just don't reach out. If you never see her again, well, that's what you say you want. If things change for you and/or her, the door stays open. Yes, this course of action robs you of the chance to "say your piece." That's ok. Being an adult often involves taking the less dramatic path.
By all means write out your anger and pain for yourself if it feels useful, though.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:51 AM on June 2, 2021 [23 favorites]
Adult friendships default to fading. If you don't actively get in touch with her, she'll fade out naturally, and with a lot, LOT less awkwardness, hurt and irretrievability. You probably have good reasons for thinking you'll never want to see her again, but life is long, your 30s are a time of MAJOR change, and it's entirely possible that you may want to hear her voice again one of these days.
So just don't reach out. If you never see her again, well, that's what you say you want. If things change for you and/or her, the door stays open. Yes, this course of action robs you of the chance to "say your piece." That's ok. Being an adult often involves taking the less dramatic path.
By all means write out your anger and pain for yourself if it feels useful, though.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:51 AM on June 2, 2021 [23 favorites]
I would write something like, "Dear friend, I've given it some/a lot of thought, and I think it would be best if we end this friendship. I'm sorry. Please take care and best wishes." Short and simple. Maybe it's generic, but that's pretty much the message you want to get across, right? No need to get into details and relitigate anything; there's no point. If the goal is to communicate you want to end the friendship, the above accomplishes that. However, I also like the advice to sit on it and revisit this in a month or two.
posted by foxjacket at 8:04 AM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by foxjacket at 8:04 AM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Hey there toska, I am coming at this from the other side. I had a friend breakup last year with someone I had been very close to for almost 20 years. We had an argument which I thought was amicably resolved, and then she just...never responded or spoke to me again. I'm sure she had her reasons, and I absolutely respect her decision, but the way she chose to carry it out hurt so much. Before this, we talked on the phone several times a week for many years. We each supported the other through major changes and hard times. We were privy to the intricacies of our lives the way few other people ever were. In short, she was very important to me, but her ghosting left me feeling confused and devalued.
I would have been so grateful for a conversation or even a brief note to state her intention. I had no way of knowing if she just needed a temporary break or if this was permanent - the uncertainty made it do much worse, especially since this all went down at the start of the pandemic. Some acknowledgement of the relationship we had up to then, and a drop of kindness, would have went a long way. I would still feel sad and sorry that the friendship ended, but I would have had a sense of respectful closure.
Obviously you are not my friend, and your situation is different, but I think your instinct to say goodbye is a decent one. If this is the last time you ever interact, what would you want her to know? Think only including what is true, necessary and kind. If you don't plan to work things through with her, naming specific conflicts won't be productive.
I agree with others that you may change your mind in the future - you already communicated that you need a break for now, so there is no rush.
posted by prewar lemonade at 8:40 AM on June 2, 2021 [6 favorites]
I would have been so grateful for a conversation or even a brief note to state her intention. I had no way of knowing if she just needed a temporary break or if this was permanent - the uncertainty made it do much worse, especially since this all went down at the start of the pandemic. Some acknowledgement of the relationship we had up to then, and a drop of kindness, would have went a long way. I would still feel sad and sorry that the friendship ended, but I would have had a sense of respectful closure.
Obviously you are not my friend, and your situation is different, but I think your instinct to say goodbye is a decent one. If this is the last time you ever interact, what would you want her to know? Think only including what is true, necessary and kind. If you don't plan to work things through with her, naming specific conflicts won't be productive.
I agree with others that you may change your mind in the future - you already communicated that you need a break for now, so there is no rush.
posted by prewar lemonade at 8:40 AM on June 2, 2021 [6 favorites]
I received an email ending a long term friendship that had been getting worse for years, and honestly it makes me feel glad about not being friends with her anymore. Her perspective was completely selfish and said I was a bad friend when I had been putting in more effort than I wanted to for years (because she kept asking / she made it clear she resented the other people who said no). I finally yelled at her when driving her and her friends an hour to her birthday party, because she couldn’t tell me where we were going despite me asking her to nail it down a week before - poor behavior on my part but not monstrous in context, IMO. I didn’t even want to go to the party but felt guilted into it. I wish I had slow faded more effectively and avoided the dramatic breakup.
All that to say that your friend probably has a really different perspective on things than you do. I recommend not sending the letter and also not hanging out with her or maybe even responding unless you want to talk to her. Write the letter for yourself, do not send. Maybe share with your therapist.
posted by momus_window at 12:29 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
All that to say that your friend probably has a really different perspective on things than you do. I recommend not sending the letter and also not hanging out with her or maybe even responding unless you want to talk to her. Write the letter for yourself, do not send. Maybe share with your therapist.
posted by momus_window at 12:29 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
In my circumstance, my red flag was the now-distanced friend asked me to find out why a mutual friend was no longer in touch with her, which raised my eyebrows. Lo and behold, we are downgraded to cordial-among-common-friends and civil, but I was tiring of some of the behaviors in high school and after a few decades of this-is-who-I-am on her part, I just don’t engage. I have enough on my plate.
posted by childofTethys at 12:45 PM on June 2, 2021
posted by childofTethys at 12:45 PM on June 2, 2021
To clarify: there is a vast difference between ghosting and a friendship drifting away. Ghosting would be cruel, but decreasing the level of intimacy and connection is natural for most friendships over time. It may be more work than you want to invest or your friend may confront you on it (but it sounds like she’s conflict avoidant?), if she does then it’s time for a brief goodbye. I’m wondering if some of this is being affected by a regional cultural standard. I’m midwestern US and the “fade away” would be standard practice here.
posted by areaperson at 1:06 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by areaperson at 1:06 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
I do think there are personal differences in whether people would prefer to be told explicitly, and it might relate to Ask / Infer culture (or Ask / Guess as an Asker calls it).
But IMO if you're doing a normal friendship climb-down rather than a ghosting, you're not on the hook to produce an explicit notification regardless.
posted by away for regrooving at 1:15 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
But IMO if you're doing a normal friendship climb-down rather than a ghosting, you're not on the hook to produce an explicit notification regardless.
posted by away for regrooving at 1:15 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I think it might be helpful to provide some context around where things stand between us and why I feel the need to explicitly "break up" with her. After our argument she apologized and expressed a desire to continue our friendship and work things out. I told her I thought we needed to talk about our issues but I needed time to process everything. Given those circumstances, I think it's appropriate to give her an explicit answer one way or another, and I imagine I would want one if the situations were reversed.
If that hadn't happened I would probably be angling for more of a "slow fade", though even then I think at least some type of explicit communication would be in order. I disagree with the implicit assumption just because there's no formal agreement involved in a friendship all things are permissible, and I don't think that a ghost/slow fade is as unambiguously tactful of an option as some of you seem to think it is; there is an entire book about people struggling to deal with friendships that were ended in this way. I don't think sending an angry, dramatic, accusatory breakup letter is much better, but I don't think the only alternative to that is "say nothing".
Context is certainly important here and I think an approach like that might make more sense for a casual friendship. I mentioned that it was a somewhat "shallow" relationship mostly to clarify that it wasn't the stereotypical highly enmeshed friendship people tend to imagine when it comes to close female friendships, not to convey that it wasn't a close relationship in its own right. She's not just a buddy I grab drinks with every once in a while, she was my best friend for nearly two decades and I absolutely don't think it's appropriate to ghost her, and I would be really hurt if she did that to me.
In any case, I do really appreciate the insight and the perspective from others who have been on both sides of similar situations, it's given me plenty of food for thought.
posted by toska at 5:01 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
If that hadn't happened I would probably be angling for more of a "slow fade", though even then I think at least some type of explicit communication would be in order. I disagree with the implicit assumption just because there's no formal agreement involved in a friendship all things are permissible, and I don't think that a ghost/slow fade is as unambiguously tactful of an option as some of you seem to think it is; there is an entire book about people struggling to deal with friendships that were ended in this way. I don't think sending an angry, dramatic, accusatory breakup letter is much better, but I don't think the only alternative to that is "say nothing".
Context is certainly important here and I think an approach like that might make more sense for a casual friendship. I mentioned that it was a somewhat "shallow" relationship mostly to clarify that it wasn't the stereotypical highly enmeshed friendship people tend to imagine when it comes to close female friendships, not to convey that it wasn't a close relationship in its own right. She's not just a buddy I grab drinks with every once in a while, she was my best friend for nearly two decades and I absolutely don't think it's appropriate to ghost her, and I would be really hurt if she did that to me.
In any case, I do really appreciate the insight and the perspective from others who have been on both sides of similar situations, it's given me plenty of food for thought.
posted by toska at 5:01 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
It was advice on my relationship to my sister, but my mother once told me that I should work to maintain my relationship with her, because it's so valuable to have people in your life who knew you as a child. Obviously in the case of a truly toxic/abusive dynamic, I would think of this differently, but I really think you should pause before killing a friendship of this length. This is almost certainly as much about you and your issues as it is about her, and a friend who knows the childhood you is a precious thing. Based on what you have written, it sounds kind of like you're just tired and in your own head about some stuff (as we all are at this late stage of the pandemic, I think), and she's annoying you in her own way, but not like you have stopped caring about her or think she's bad for you in a way that demands a permanent break.
In particular, the fact that you feel "sick to your stomach" about the idea of dealing with the issues around keeping her in your life does not really sound like a place where you are making a thoughtful decision. I've been in exactly that place with a friend. For various reasons, I didn't cut her out (although I did drastically reduce our interactions for quite some time), and in retrospect what I have realized is that I was as much pissed off at myself and my own bad behavior towards her as I was mad at her. I wanted someone to blame and I didn't want to take responsibility for my role in the situation, I was overwhelmed with other life stuff, and it was easy to make her the target of my ire. When I got over that life stuff, I was glad that I hadn't shut her out completely because despite her flaws she has been there for me through a lot of stuff, and I am glad for our relationship.
I have cut people out of my life as an adult. People who I felt created nothing but stress and negativity for me, people I found to be unethical or immoral in important ways. So I'm not against cutting someone out of your life. But I think a decision like that is best made with much less emotion behind it. When you can look in the mirror and think, I'm not mad or upset I just feel this person is a bad presence in my life, cut them out. Tell them very simply, or don't tell them, you will KNOW that you're done and the resolution will be clearer.
But if you have any doubt about whether this is coming from a clearheaded need to set healthy permanent boundaries for yourself, don't make a permanent break. Since you've told her you need time to process issues, I think it's fine to say, look, I really need some time and I just feel like right now it's not great for me to interact a bunch with you. And then just, well, fade for a while. But check in with yourself about your feelings over time. You may realize in a year or five that you were unhappy about totally unrelated things, she was unhappy about other unrelated things, you were both taking it out on each other, but now that you're both in a better place resuming at least a friendly acquaintance feels right.
posted by ch1x0r at 5:20 PM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
In particular, the fact that you feel "sick to your stomach" about the idea of dealing with the issues around keeping her in your life does not really sound like a place where you are making a thoughtful decision. I've been in exactly that place with a friend. For various reasons, I didn't cut her out (although I did drastically reduce our interactions for quite some time), and in retrospect what I have realized is that I was as much pissed off at myself and my own bad behavior towards her as I was mad at her. I wanted someone to blame and I didn't want to take responsibility for my role in the situation, I was overwhelmed with other life stuff, and it was easy to make her the target of my ire. When I got over that life stuff, I was glad that I hadn't shut her out completely because despite her flaws she has been there for me through a lot of stuff, and I am glad for our relationship.
I have cut people out of my life as an adult. People who I felt created nothing but stress and negativity for me, people I found to be unethical or immoral in important ways. So I'm not against cutting someone out of your life. But I think a decision like that is best made with much less emotion behind it. When you can look in the mirror and think, I'm not mad or upset I just feel this person is a bad presence in my life, cut them out. Tell them very simply, or don't tell them, you will KNOW that you're done and the resolution will be clearer.
But if you have any doubt about whether this is coming from a clearheaded need to set healthy permanent boundaries for yourself, don't make a permanent break. Since you've told her you need time to process issues, I think it's fine to say, look, I really need some time and I just feel like right now it's not great for me to interact a bunch with you. And then just, well, fade for a while. But check in with yourself about your feelings over time. You may realize in a year or five that you were unhappy about totally unrelated things, she was unhappy about other unrelated things, you were both taking it out on each other, but now that you're both in a better place resuming at least a friendly acquaintance feels right.
posted by ch1x0r at 5:20 PM on June 2, 2021 [3 favorites]
Response by poster:
posted by toska at 5:21 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
- redefine what kind of friendship you want to have with her given your experience, e.g. limit it toThis is definitely a good suggestion and one I had considered and tried to talk myself into. But like I said, something really changed for me and I just don't want her around at all anymore.
"we get along well and have fun together" and not consider her as part of your support network. Not all friendships are alike.
take a break from each other, however long, short, or indefinite, and re-evaluate when you're not in the middle of a health crisis on top of a year of global pandemic. Perhaps you gain a different perspective, or she does, or you both develop in some direction that may or may not bring you closer.Also a good suggestion which is why before making this call I gave it six months, waited for health issues and other life changes to resolve, discussed it in therapy, and did a lot of personal reflection. I did not make this decision casually or impulsively. I don't see that an "indefinite break" is that different from a "break up", but I do take the overall point made by you and a few others to not necessarily slam the door shut, and this is something I'll keep in mind.
posted by toska at 5:21 PM on June 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Maybe talk about how you care about them and want them to have a good life but it doesn't seem like the two of you make each other happy anymore. The blow ups are hard for you and probably her too. You'd like the both of you to just go your separate ways without having some huge fight that makes the both of you angry at each other. Wish her a good life but say it doesn't seem like a good idea any longer to stay in touch.
posted by stray thoughts at 8:45 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by stray thoughts at 8:45 PM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]
Best answer: I don't see that an "indefinite break" is that different from a "break up",
Should have phrased it as "however short, long, or indefinite it turns out to be" or "however long you need" or "for now" or "until you change your mind (which could be never!)".
Continuing on the theme of in-between options, to me both complete ghosting someone I've been a close friend with for a very long time and an explicit friendship breakup are extremes. An option in between would be to say that I need space, that I can't be a good friend to her for now, that I don't feel good about the friendship now, that I don't want to talk it through now but need some distance. Or whatever expression of my needs and emotions in my current situation, not about her. Again, you may feel that you need to just go all the way to an explicit breakup and the in-between is not what you want.
(Hadn't understood from the question that the last blowup was half a year ago. Or perhaps I'm misunderstanding the update; it's not clear to me whether you've interacted at all since then.)
posted by meijusa at 1:07 AM on June 3, 2021
Should have phrased it as "however short, long, or indefinite it turns out to be" or "however long you need" or "for now" or "until you change your mind (which could be never!)".
Continuing on the theme of in-between options, to me both complete ghosting someone I've been a close friend with for a very long time and an explicit friendship breakup are extremes. An option in between would be to say that I need space, that I can't be a good friend to her for now, that I don't feel good about the friendship now, that I don't want to talk it through now but need some distance. Or whatever expression of my needs and emotions in my current situation, not about her. Again, you may feel that you need to just go all the way to an explicit breakup and the in-between is not what you want.
(Hadn't understood from the question that the last blowup was half a year ago. Or perhaps I'm misunderstanding the update; it's not clear to me whether you've interacted at all since then.)
posted by meijusa at 1:07 AM on June 3, 2021
Best answer: I would do email, and I would do (what I feel goes) one step of specificity above 'we've outgrown each other.' I would write that the argument the last time you got together deeply affected you, and when you put that together with previous arguments and tension, that's not the kind of friendship that you want to maintain. Maybe one more sentence about hoping she'll understand or wishing her well or whatever fits your style and lets her know you're not giving her an ultimatum, your mind's made up. Sprinkle in kindness as appropriate; if you don't feel any towards her, you don't owe it to her. Based on your question's wording, you seem thoughtful and not a psychopath, and so you have internet-stranger permission to think primarily of yourself and what you're willing and unwilling to do as you end this.
posted by troywestfield at 3:08 PM on June 3, 2021
posted by troywestfield at 3:08 PM on June 3, 2021
Response by poster: Thanks again for all the responses, everyone, they've been extremely helpful for me. And apologies for any lack of clarity in my original question (or defensiveness in my clarifications, for that matter) - trying to summarize a personal situation can end up being as much of an exercise in "continuing fraught conversations I've had with myself about it" as one of "actually providing a useful description", which I think happened for me in this case. Anyways, like I said, really helpful and I'm really glad I asked for advice on this.
posted by toska at 3:13 PM on June 5, 2021
posted by toska at 3:13 PM on June 5, 2021
This thread is closed to new comments.
I think you are on the right track steering clear of angry accusations and line-by-line details. Over a decade later, I'm still 100% convinced it was the right decision to dump this person. But I do feel bad about sending them personal insults that in my 30s I thought were stinging and clever. No matter what terrible behavior the person has engaged in, you will thank yourself for not being drawn into something petty.
And yeah, it's been hard disentangling memories of the person from memories of what it was like to grow up, to find out about what sleepovers and 5th grade birthday parties and trips to the woods, if the person just embodies all of that for you.
But re-reading your question, I do kinda think the generic message might be the way to go?? Kind but firm. Unless you think there could be some kind of closure coming out of your discussion. Hope it goes well.
posted by johngoren at 2:17 AM on June 2, 2021 [2 favorites]