Who was this Nazi my great-grandmother met?
October 10, 2020 9:11 AM Subscribe
In Spring and Summer 1933, my great-grandmother, an immigrant American Jew, went alone on a trip to Russia and Palestine. She took a Soviet steamer around the Black Sea to Batoum. At Poti, one of the ports on the way, another tourist boarded. He didn't speak English. She calls him Herr Kliss.
She describes him at various points as a lieutenant in the German army, a Hitlerite, and a Nazi. He was handsome and about 27 years old. They were headed on a very similar tour. From Batoum they took an overnight train to Tiflis, and then took a car on the Gruzenian Military Highway across the Caucasus mountains. From there they spent two days in a hotel in Vlakikavkas, and then they took two trains to Rostov. From there they seem to have separated; she meets him again a few days later at the Hotel Metropole in Moscow. (All these place names are from her account.) She makes clear he was obviously anti-Semitic, but they spent quite a bit of time together.
I am curious about Herr Kliss. Who was he? What was he doing on this trip in Russia in 1933? (Why would he be interested to go as a tourist? He was not traveling in uniform from what I can gather.) What type of lieutenant was he? Was he in the Wehrmacht? Was he SS? In a perfect world I'd be able to identify him, but failing that, does anybody have any guesses that might lead me to more information about who he was and what his story was after July 1933?
She describes him at various points as a lieutenant in the German army, a Hitlerite, and a Nazi. He was handsome and about 27 years old. They were headed on a very similar tour. From Batoum they took an overnight train to Tiflis, and then took a car on the Gruzenian Military Highway across the Caucasus mountains. From there they spent two days in a hotel in Vlakikavkas, and then they took two trains to Rostov. From there they seem to have separated; she meets him again a few days later at the Hotel Metropole in Moscow. (All these place names are from her account.) She makes clear he was obviously anti-Semitic, but they spent quite a bit of time together.
I am curious about Herr Kliss. Who was he? What was he doing on this trip in Russia in 1933? (Why would he be interested to go as a tourist? He was not traveling in uniform from what I can gather.) What type of lieutenant was he? Was he in the Wehrmacht? Was he SS? In a perfect world I'd be able to identify him, but failing that, does anybody have any guesses that might lead me to more information about who he was and what his story was after July 1933?
Response by poster: Being a junior officer and a true believer that early in the Nazi timeline, leads me to wonder if he had room for advancement, if you will. And pointers to where such folks could be found would be appreciated! Thanks!
posted by shadygrove at 9:42 AM on October 10, 2020
posted by shadygrove at 9:42 AM on October 10, 2020
https://www.familysearch.org/blog/en/finding-german-world-war-ii-service-records/
posted by bashing rocks together at 9:51 AM on October 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by bashing rocks together at 9:51 AM on October 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
If he was in the army in 1933, then he probably wasn't part of the SS then, since the SS was merged with the police force when the Nazi's came to power. They became more part of the army later in the 1930s.
The German army (the Reichswehr) in 1933 was relatively small as it was still limited by the treaty of Versailles, but it expanded massively after the Nazis came to power (from 1935 the combined military forces were the Wehrmacht). There was definitely scope for advancement and if he was a career soldier then he could easily still have been in the army in 1938-39 when war began. About 4 million German military personnel were killed or missing in action at the end of the way from an estimated 18 million in service so there's a non-zero chance he didn't live to see the end of the war. The German agency responsible for the relevant records has a website (in German).
It wouldn't have been that unusual to be a party supporter or member. About 1 in 3 Germans voted for the Nazis in November 1932 and the party had 2 million members by 1933. Lots of people also joined in the first couple or months after Hitler became Chancellor before a membership freeze was put in place for a few months to prevent infiltration/entryism. However, in the early 1930s you couldn't formally be a party member and serve in the army, so he may have been more of an adherent.
I'm sure you realise that either or both, your grandmother may have misremembered details or he may have exaggerated them to impress her.
Finally (and sorry if you already know this), the name Kliss may be more commonly spelled Kliß in German.
posted by plonkee at 12:41 PM on October 10, 2020
The German army (the Reichswehr) in 1933 was relatively small as it was still limited by the treaty of Versailles, but it expanded massively after the Nazis came to power (from 1935 the combined military forces were the Wehrmacht). There was definitely scope for advancement and if he was a career soldier then he could easily still have been in the army in 1938-39 when war began. About 4 million German military personnel were killed or missing in action at the end of the way from an estimated 18 million in service so there's a non-zero chance he didn't live to see the end of the war. The German agency responsible for the relevant records has a website (in German).
It wouldn't have been that unusual to be a party supporter or member. About 1 in 3 Germans voted for the Nazis in November 1932 and the party had 2 million members by 1933. Lots of people also joined in the first couple or months after Hitler became Chancellor before a membership freeze was put in place for a few months to prevent infiltration/entryism. However, in the early 1930s you couldn't formally be a party member and serve in the army, so he may have been more of an adherent.
I'm sure you realise that either or both, your grandmother may have misremembered details or he may have exaggerated them to impress her.
Finally (and sorry if you already know this), the name Kliss may be more commonly spelled Kliß in German.
posted by plonkee at 12:41 PM on October 10, 2020
It might be worth looking for vessel passenger lists and exit and entry records. Especially if part of the voyage was international - though perhaps less so if he didn't leave the country. If you can find the vessel and date of specific stops by searching for your great-grandmother, you might be able to narrow down the list of names considerably. I don't actually know the best way to do that, short of finding a friend who is excited about genealogy. I also don't know how many records survived from those countries in the '30s. (But, I have family with searchable online passenger records from USSR within a few years of that, so it's not impossible they exist.)
posted by eotvos at 1:22 PM on October 10, 2020
posted by eotvos at 1:22 PM on October 10, 2020
Response by poster: I've wondered if "German Army" was the part that wasn't quite accurate. Could he have been paramilitary rather than in the army? (i.e. SS or SA or something?) Thanks for these thoughts so far! (Also probably not misremembered -- these are from contemporaneous letters, but could be misunderstood. They spoke in Russian and German. Her Russian wasn't perfect, and her German was mostly Yiddish.)
posted by shadygrove at 2:16 PM on October 10, 2020
posted by shadygrove at 2:16 PM on October 10, 2020
Could he have been paramilitary rather than in the army? (i.e. SS or SA or something?)
Yes, he could have been, they certainly had a lot of members, particularly the SA. I don't know how well those paid, whereas being an officer in the German Army would have provided an income and would probably have put you in the upper middle class by birth in 1933. I'm assuming you'd need money to get to the Soviet Union in 1933, even if expenses were relatively cheap there, since Germany was still suffering from the depression (and, in fact cheap living expenses might have been part of the attraction of the location).
posted by plonkee at 2:35 PM on October 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Yes, he could have been, they certainly had a lot of members, particularly the SA. I don't know how well those paid, whereas being an officer in the German Army would have provided an income and would probably have put you in the upper middle class by birth in 1933. I'm assuming you'd need money to get to the Soviet Union in 1933, even if expenses were relatively cheap there, since Germany was still suffering from the depression (and, in fact cheap living expenses might have been part of the attraction of the location).
posted by plonkee at 2:35 PM on October 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Germany still had access to Soviet testing facilities for most of that year. There had just been a severe famine in the Ukraine and Caucasus he might have wanted to see the effects of. He could have been attached to the embassy as a military attache.
If you plotted the points at which they traveled together you might see something in the gaps.
posted by Mr. Yuck at 8:53 PM on October 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
If you plotted the points at which they traveled together you might see something in the gaps.
posted by Mr. Yuck at 8:53 PM on October 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
Germany and Soviet Union had quite extensive military cooperation, joint training, research, etc. until about 1933. It is not written about much, but there are some articles and academic papers about it.
posted by zeikka at 11:45 AM on October 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by zeikka at 11:45 AM on October 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
That rank is the lowest officer. For example, the US Army alone had 20k+ of them. If he got promoted up and was at a higher rank in a famous battle in the actual war, there might be more info. But maybe he just ran a fuel logistics office or something.
posted by sideshow at 9:32 AM on October 10, 2020