Can/Should I invite my caucus comrades to a party?
June 11, 2018 6:00 AM Subscribe
Hey, I've got an event coming up in about a month. Nominally it's in celebration of my birthday, but it's just meant to be a good excuse to get a sizeable number of people (c.30) together for a convivial event. My concern is whether I'm able to invite my comrades from my uni caucus to this event. As I don't know them from a social gathering, I'm concerned it may not be appropriate. I know them because we're in the same party, and work together towards the same political goals.
I don't exactly have a work relationship with them either though. There's a concern that these people who I've become quite close with quite quickly would be offended at not being included. There's also a fear of doing so.
It'll be an event ideally centred around a fire, with food being cooked over and in that fire. People will be drinking, possibly some light drug use, but nothing I'd expect to get out of control or intense. It'll start in the afternoon, some people might stay over if they've travelled far, but probably not most people. The majority will be in their 20s, maybe a 19 or two and a couple of people in their early 30s. A pretty even spread of invitees, attendance might bias younger.
My comrades would be the third distinct group I'd be inviting. The other two groups of people, about whom I have no concern inviting, are my old friends from high-school (bias younger) and a friend group that grew out of a weekly event / pop-culture group (bias older). Roughly 15 people from each will be invited, although I'd be shocked if a full 10 came from each, especially my old high-school friends who might be travelling some way.
I'd be inviting around 10 comrades from my university caucus to this event. I've known them for just over three months, going on five months by the time the event happens. They're great people who I have a lot of fun hanging around with, but we've not really hung out purely socially for anything. There's been a couple of times when after or inbetween political events we've hung out socially, and every week after branch meetings most of branch goes to a restaurant for a meal and lighter talk. Yet this is where most of my concern stems from. I've not been invited to any purely social events by any of the people in my caucus, events that were unaffiliated with the party. Events have been non-political, but have followed on from political events. That said, I'm not really aware of anyone having anything major in the time I've known them. A couple of coms have been to concerts or events with other friends outside of the party that I know of, but it's not like I've known that Com X had a big event and either didn't invite Coms YZB or did. I think I've heard references to things that happened at events in the past with say Coms XZB but I don't know if they were political in some sense or purely social.
We're a revolutionary socialist party, if that makes much difference. I guess it's really the political cadre aspect of this that's got me unsure. I've only been with the party for three months and I don't fully understand yet how comrades relate to eachother within a caucus. I guess I'm cadreised, and a lot of our work is trying to cadreise others. In the second sense of the word defined here. As I understand it, this process has happened a little faster for me than is standard, as I am an eager learner who had a lot of time on my hands earlier this year.
I would most certainly not be inviting my full branch, partially because I know them a lot less, and many are much older, I'm certain that wouldn't be a good move on my part, and there's a few dozen of us. It would just be the members of my university caucus, which also covers another uni close by. As I've said, roughly 10 people, who on an active week I'd see maybe 2-4 of for several hours a day, several days a week. That depends on how much postering, stall running, reading groups, meetings/talks-running etc we'd be doing. Whoever can make it to something goes, and we do as much as we can, within reason. An inactive week I'd still make it to our weekly branch meeting, and see most of the uni caucus at that, or I'd make it to the uni caucus itself, again seeing most of the caucus there.
One person IRL who I've asked for advice thinks that I shouldn't invite them, because they're not my friends. I'm not sure how this person defines friend though. They seem to think because the vast majority of our discussions have a political bent, we're not friends, but frankly I mostly have political discussions with all of my friends. It's not that I wouldn't or couldn't talk about something else, but most of the time we're going to turn to the political dimension of that thing. This is probably something that partially arises because I get worried people will think I'm not serious if I spend to much time discussing slightly more frivolous matters. How's a white cis guy supposed to be considerate of others if I just blather on about whatever without considering the political dimensions of like, anything I say and that I'm saying something at all.
My main concern is that my coms will somehow think it's not appropriate, that I'm not serious enough if I invite them to this. I guess I'm not really worried about catching flak for not expanding beyond caucus, because I think everyone's pretty reasonable in that regard, and my caucus are the ones I spend a lot of time with. But I am concerned that I will be viewed as not sufficiently invested in the party, as treating it as a social group rather than a serious body with political aims.
To be clear, I'd love to have them there. I think they're great people, who share my political views, even if we sometimes disagree about the details. I think they're friendly, motivated, personable people, and union members, every one. <3 Also, even though this is perhaps a reason not to invite them, I'm interested in how they'll interact with my other friends, who I think are good people but have very low levels of class consciousness and political motivation. That's a scary aspect, but it's not what I'm worried about. I'm worried about them thinking less of me for inviting them, basically. I do not yet fully understand life in a cadre, and how that goes down. Maybe I shouldn't mix social and political spaces, although I think all my coms would agree that the personal is political.
I would appreciate any advice people could offer, if by chance someone was a member or ex-member of a similar political org and could offer advice that would probably be ideal, but rgeardless I'd like the hivemind's opinion on whether I can invite my coms to a party.
I don't exactly have a work relationship with them either though. There's a concern that these people who I've become quite close with quite quickly would be offended at not being included. There's also a fear of doing so.
It'll be an event ideally centred around a fire, with food being cooked over and in that fire. People will be drinking, possibly some light drug use, but nothing I'd expect to get out of control or intense. It'll start in the afternoon, some people might stay over if they've travelled far, but probably not most people. The majority will be in their 20s, maybe a 19 or two and a couple of people in their early 30s. A pretty even spread of invitees, attendance might bias younger.
My comrades would be the third distinct group I'd be inviting. The other two groups of people, about whom I have no concern inviting, are my old friends from high-school (bias younger) and a friend group that grew out of a weekly event / pop-culture group (bias older). Roughly 15 people from each will be invited, although I'd be shocked if a full 10 came from each, especially my old high-school friends who might be travelling some way.
I'd be inviting around 10 comrades from my university caucus to this event. I've known them for just over three months, going on five months by the time the event happens. They're great people who I have a lot of fun hanging around with, but we've not really hung out purely socially for anything. There's been a couple of times when after or inbetween political events we've hung out socially, and every week after branch meetings most of branch goes to a restaurant for a meal and lighter talk. Yet this is where most of my concern stems from. I've not been invited to any purely social events by any of the people in my caucus, events that were unaffiliated with the party. Events have been non-political, but have followed on from political events. That said, I'm not really aware of anyone having anything major in the time I've known them. A couple of coms have been to concerts or events with other friends outside of the party that I know of, but it's not like I've known that Com X had a big event and either didn't invite Coms YZB or did. I think I've heard references to things that happened at events in the past with say Coms XZB but I don't know if they were political in some sense or purely social.
We're a revolutionary socialist party, if that makes much difference. I guess it's really the political cadre aspect of this that's got me unsure. I've only been with the party for three months and I don't fully understand yet how comrades relate to eachother within a caucus. I guess I'm cadreised, and a lot of our work is trying to cadreise others. In the second sense of the word defined here. As I understand it, this process has happened a little faster for me than is standard, as I am an eager learner who had a lot of time on my hands earlier this year.
I would most certainly not be inviting my full branch, partially because I know them a lot less, and many are much older, I'm certain that wouldn't be a good move on my part, and there's a few dozen of us. It would just be the members of my university caucus, which also covers another uni close by. As I've said, roughly 10 people, who on an active week I'd see maybe 2-4 of for several hours a day, several days a week. That depends on how much postering, stall running, reading groups, meetings/talks-running etc we'd be doing. Whoever can make it to something goes, and we do as much as we can, within reason. An inactive week I'd still make it to our weekly branch meeting, and see most of the uni caucus at that, or I'd make it to the uni caucus itself, again seeing most of the caucus there.
One person IRL who I've asked for advice thinks that I shouldn't invite them, because they're not my friends. I'm not sure how this person defines friend though. They seem to think because the vast majority of our discussions have a political bent, we're not friends, but frankly I mostly have political discussions with all of my friends. It's not that I wouldn't or couldn't talk about something else, but most of the time we're going to turn to the political dimension of that thing. This is probably something that partially arises because I get worried people will think I'm not serious if I spend to much time discussing slightly more frivolous matters. How's a white cis guy supposed to be considerate of others if I just blather on about whatever without considering the political dimensions of like, anything I say and that I'm saying something at all.
My main concern is that my coms will somehow think it's not appropriate, that I'm not serious enough if I invite them to this. I guess I'm not really worried about catching flak for not expanding beyond caucus, because I think everyone's pretty reasonable in that regard, and my caucus are the ones I spend a lot of time with. But I am concerned that I will be viewed as not sufficiently invested in the party, as treating it as a social group rather than a serious body with political aims.
To be clear, I'd love to have them there. I think they're great people, who share my political views, even if we sometimes disagree about the details. I think they're friendly, motivated, personable people, and union members, every one. <3 Also, even though this is perhaps a reason not to invite them, I'm interested in how they'll interact with my other friends, who I think are good people but have very low levels of class consciousness and political motivation. That's a scary aspect, but it's not what I'm worried about. I'm worried about them thinking less of me for inviting them, basically. I do not yet fully understand life in a cadre, and how that goes down. Maybe I shouldn't mix social and political spaces, although I think all my coms would agree that the personal is political.
I would appreciate any advice people could offer, if by chance someone was a member or ex-member of a similar political org and could offer advice that would probably be ideal, but rgeardless I'd like the hivemind's opinion on whether I can invite my coms to a party.
Best answer: I have a very hard time believing that there is even a tiny chance this group of people will go "this person invited us, their college acquaintances, to a social event?? Gasp! How counter-revolutionary! How dare they presume to mix these Very Important Politics with [shudder] a mere PARTY?" If they did, THEY WOULD BE THE ASSHOLES.
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:11 AM on June 11, 2018 [7 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:11 AM on June 11, 2018 [7 favorites]
Best answer: This is a fantastic way to attempt to transition from "activist friends" to friends-friends, or activist-friends-friends.
If when you say "cadre" you just mean "we're relatively serious marxists", then charge ahead. A casual evening around the fire is great for several reasons - people generally feel very free to say yes or no since it's obvious that their absence won't ruin the party; people can generally stop by for a little bit rather than hang out all evening, which makes the stakes even lower; and people can interact in a lot of different ways. Also, you have the fire to poke at and talk about if things get awkward. I have been to, have hosted and have dropped by many a fire-based party, and I am a very shy person. Many of these have been hosted by marxists, since you can't swing a cat, etc.
My caveat would be that TBH I don't think orgs where you are constantly being judged on your "seriousness" over very trivial things are very good orgs. It's one thing to judge people on their commitment over showing up to things, doing what they say they'll do, etc, it's another to judge them on their commitment over, eg, whether they think they might like to be social friends with people they spend a gazillion hours a week with - or other stuff, like how they do their hair, casual patterns of speech, whether their other friends are "good enough", etc. That stuff spins out into cultishness really easily, and it pulls in people who are shy or socially vulnerable. (I mean, I'm not making this up - it's my observation from more than twenty years around activist things.)
Even Lenin had, like, friend-friends.
In fact, I'd say this is a great test of your group - if you get some flak about how inviting people to a party means that you're not "serious", then it's a lousy group and you should seek another. Folks don't have to show up - maybe they don't want to cross the streams, and that's fine -but if they think you're not a good enough revolutionary because you invited them to a bonfire, I promise you that you want no part of their movement.
I guess I'd say that you should take care of yourself - it worries me a little when a person falls in with a political group that they perceive as both meanly judgmental and very, very right-on. That's the road to ruin for someone who is a kind and obliging person.
In any case, assuming that your people are lovely people, I think inviting them to a casual event such as a bonfire is a great idea.
posted by Frowner at 6:24 AM on June 11, 2018 [15 favorites]
If when you say "cadre" you just mean "we're relatively serious marxists", then charge ahead. A casual evening around the fire is great for several reasons - people generally feel very free to say yes or no since it's obvious that their absence won't ruin the party; people can generally stop by for a little bit rather than hang out all evening, which makes the stakes even lower; and people can interact in a lot of different ways. Also, you have the fire to poke at and talk about if things get awkward. I have been to, have hosted and have dropped by many a fire-based party, and I am a very shy person. Many of these have been hosted by marxists, since you can't swing a cat, etc.
My caveat would be that TBH I don't think orgs where you are constantly being judged on your "seriousness" over very trivial things are very good orgs. It's one thing to judge people on their commitment over showing up to things, doing what they say they'll do, etc, it's another to judge them on their commitment over, eg, whether they think they might like to be social friends with people they spend a gazillion hours a week with - or other stuff, like how they do their hair, casual patterns of speech, whether their other friends are "good enough", etc. That stuff spins out into cultishness really easily, and it pulls in people who are shy or socially vulnerable. (I mean, I'm not making this up - it's my observation from more than twenty years around activist things.)
Even Lenin had, like, friend-friends.
In fact, I'd say this is a great test of your group - if you get some flak about how inviting people to a party means that you're not "serious", then it's a lousy group and you should seek another. Folks don't have to show up - maybe they don't want to cross the streams, and that's fine -but if they think you're not a good enough revolutionary because you invited them to a bonfire, I promise you that you want no part of their movement.
I guess I'd say that you should take care of yourself - it worries me a little when a person falls in with a political group that they perceive as both meanly judgmental and very, very right-on. That's the road to ruin for someone who is a kind and obliging person.
In any case, assuming that your people are lovely people, I think inviting them to a casual event such as a bonfire is a great idea.
posted by Frowner at 6:24 AM on June 11, 2018 [15 favorites]
Best answer: I think you should clearly explain the nature of the event to your newer friends, as this sounds somewhat unusual or atypical compared to other birthday celebrations.
Make it very clear what will be provided versus what people are expected to bring. It sounds like, based on what you've said, that people should come prepared with food and possibly camping gear.
I'd also make it clear that people can come for just a short period of time.
...
But if you're stressing about this and will continue stressing about this, don't invite them.
posted by k8t at 6:27 AM on June 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
Make it very clear what will be provided versus what people are expected to bring. It sounds like, based on what you've said, that people should come prepared with food and possibly camping gear.
I'd also make it clear that people can come for just a short period of time.
...
But if you're stressing about this and will continue stressing about this, don't invite them.
posted by k8t at 6:27 AM on June 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
Best answer: (Also, when you say "cadre", are any of these things true:
- You're routinely evaluated on how "serious" or "correct" you are by people higher in the org
- You routinely find yourself in conversations about how your politics are really X but you should say that they're Y in order to achieve your aims, and that this involves active lying rather than proposing compromises; you are discouraged from talking about the group to people outside of it
- If someone joined your group and was religious, they would be bullied into stopping
- The people in your group are routinely, casually hateful toward similar-but-different activists - they don't just disagree or make the occasional joke, they organize their conversations around how shitty/stupid/blind the Judean People's Front is, and you would never feel comfortable saying "but there are some questions raised by the JPF that are actually kind of legit"
- You feel anxiety around these people that is more intense and more pervasive than your typical anxiety around new acquaintances, to the point where you find yourself worrying about what you wear or your word choice, and you find yourself avoiding books, movies and locations that you feel would get you criticized by the group. You feel that they would never cut you any slack or consider that you might have experiences that they did not.
If any of these things are true, be cautious about this group. It is not uncommon at all for activist groups of any tendency to fall into these patterns - I've seen it in a pan-left bookstore collective, and it was a Very Bad Time Indeed For Me.
If you just have social anxiety and people are basically nice, don't worry about it, of course.)
posted by Frowner at 6:33 AM on June 11, 2018 [10 favorites]
- You're routinely evaluated on how "serious" or "correct" you are by people higher in the org
- You routinely find yourself in conversations about how your politics are really X but you should say that they're Y in order to achieve your aims, and that this involves active lying rather than proposing compromises; you are discouraged from talking about the group to people outside of it
- If someone joined your group and was religious, they would be bullied into stopping
- The people in your group are routinely, casually hateful toward similar-but-different activists - they don't just disagree or make the occasional joke, they organize their conversations around how shitty/stupid/blind the Judean People's Front is, and you would never feel comfortable saying "but there are some questions raised by the JPF that are actually kind of legit"
- You feel anxiety around these people that is more intense and more pervasive than your typical anxiety around new acquaintances, to the point where you find yourself worrying about what you wear or your word choice, and you find yourself avoiding books, movies and locations that you feel would get you criticized by the group. You feel that they would never cut you any slack or consider that you might have experiences that they did not.
If any of these things are true, be cautious about this group. It is not uncommon at all for activist groups of any tendency to fall into these patterns - I've seen it in a pan-left bookstore collective, and it was a Very Bad Time Indeed For Me.
If you just have social anxiety and people are basically nice, don't worry about it, of course.)
posted by Frowner at 6:33 AM on June 11, 2018 [10 favorites]
Best answer: This is an excellent way to strengthen ties with your comrades so that you can do more important, more difficult work together, which requires trust. Invite them!
posted by shalom at 7:10 AM on June 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by shalom at 7:10 AM on June 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I'm close friends with the wife of a man who is a pretty important figure in Canadian socialism and they have parties. Birthday parties, summer BBQs, etc. I have been to several of them. He often invites his comrades to those parties. Some of them show up, some of them presumably do not or the parties would be a whole lot bigger.
I do now know how his socialist groups are structured in relation to what you describe above, so ymmv, obviously, but there's one data point in favour of inviting people.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:36 AM on June 11, 2018
I do now know how his socialist groups are structured in relation to what you describe above, so ymmv, obviously, but there's one data point in favour of inviting people.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:36 AM on June 11, 2018
Best answer: It sounds like the comrades you're wanting to invite are basically your friends at this point. What you seem to want to do is start transitioning them from friends who you see only in this one specific context (political organizing) to friends who you hang out with in a wider variety of contexts. Nothing wrong with that, and a mixed-group party where there will already be a bunch of people who don't know each other and the only common denominator is that they're all friends of the organizer/guest-of-honor (you) sounds like a perfect setting. Go for it.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:01 PM on June 12, 2018
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:01 PM on June 12, 2018
Response by poster: Thanks everyone. I invited them, and it all seems to be fine.
I really appreciate your concerns Frowner, especially the listen of concerning features. They're very similar to the things I've been worried about and looking for (probably partially cribbed from some old comment of yours) but I don't think they apply, I think it is a matter of my anxiety. As in, it's not that I'd get in trouble from the group, it's that I'd be harsh on myself for not meeting some absurd standard. I am continually re-evaluating as I become more integrated though. People are very much nice though.
I asked one comrade just before I invited people and they said the only way it would be inappropriate is if I didn't want them there and felt obliged to invite them, which is certainly not the case. I'm keen to have them there and happy to see that some have already RSVP'd in the affirmative.
Thanks again to y'all for your help and re-assurances :) Have a lovely day, you helped someone.
posted by AnhydrousLove at 5:50 AM on June 13, 2018
I really appreciate your concerns Frowner, especially the listen of concerning features. They're very similar to the things I've been worried about and looking for (probably partially cribbed from some old comment of yours) but I don't think they apply, I think it is a matter of my anxiety. As in, it's not that I'd get in trouble from the group, it's that I'd be harsh on myself for not meeting some absurd standard. I am continually re-evaluating as I become more integrated though. People are very much nice though.
I asked one comrade just before I invited people and they said the only way it would be inappropriate is if I didn't want them there and felt obliged to invite them, which is certainly not the case. I'm keen to have them there and happy to see that some have already RSVP'd in the affirmative.
Thanks again to y'all for your help and re-assurances :) Have a lovely day, you helped someone.
posted by AnhydrousLove at 5:50 AM on June 13, 2018
That's great! I would much prefer that everyone turn out to be nice marxists and not creepy-cult-activists, and I completely agree that one's own anxiety can turn every political interaction into "am I not good enough".
Enjoy your bonfire! Sometimes people need one or two meet-ups to really start mingling, so if your different friend groups clump up a little, don't feel bad - you just need another party. (I mean, they may all get on super well from go, but I myself always worry about people mingling.)
posted by Frowner at 6:12 AM on June 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
Enjoy your bonfire! Sometimes people need one or two meet-ups to really start mingling, so if your different friend groups clump up a little, don't feel bad - you just need another party. (I mean, they may all get on super well from go, but I myself always worry about people mingling.)
posted by Frowner at 6:12 AM on June 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by james33 at 6:04 AM on June 11, 2018 [4 favorites]