Where to live, Bay Area, with snowflakes
April 13, 2018 1:47 PM Subscribe
It's possible I'll get a job offer in the next few weeks for a company in SF's SoMa neighborhood. I'm in Chicago now, and I'm trying to understand a neighborhood that would be a good fit.
The move will include me and my husband and dog, we're older (kids both grown). Ideally, commute is than 45 min each way; safety is a big concern, and large quiet dog allowed. Quiet with trees, parking, walkable, lots of nice restaurants, bookstores. Bonus for bike and walking trails nearby. 2-3 bedrooms, rental for 12 months. Is something under $4K a month possible? If not, what are your favorite neighborhoods, towns that otherwise fit my criteria? Thanks in advance!
The move will include me and my husband and dog, we're older (kids both grown). Ideally, commute is than 45 min each way; safety is a big concern, and large quiet dog allowed. Quiet with trees, parking, walkable, lots of nice restaurants, bookstores. Bonus for bike and walking trails nearby. 2-3 bedrooms, rental for 12 months. Is something under $4K a month possible? If not, what are your favorite neighborhoods, towns that otherwise fit my criteria? Thanks in advance!
When you say SoMa, how far from Market/BART do you mean? like are you at 1st and Howard or are you at 4th and Brannan? Will factor in timewise and commute options.
posted by vunder at 2:27 PM on April 13, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by vunder at 2:27 PM on April 13, 2018 [5 favorites]
I would say to get those things you either going to have to spend more money, or commute more, or both.
I live in North Berkeley, and it's everything you want. I commute on BART to SoMa, door to door just about 45 minutes each way. My neighborhood is very walkable, we've got literally some of the best restaurants in the country in town, and miles and miles of shops of all kinds. But the mortgage + taxes on my 1200sq ft home are far more than $4k a month. With some effort and luck, you might get a rental pretty close to that $4k mark, especially if you're willing to live in something on the small side. We have friends who rent an 800 sq ft bungalow, and they pay somewhere around $3k.
In SF itself the Richmond would provide what you're looking for, but it'll be more like $5K/month, maybe more depending on just where & how big. Commute via Muni (bus and/or trolley) would be close to 45 min, perhaps a bit less depending. The Sunset might also work, but that's more like 60 minutes on a bus, commute-wise.
A much longer commute could put you in what are basically the suburbs, towns like Walnut Creek, Lafayette, Pleasanton or San Ramon. Like most suburbs, less walkable but more house for your money. You can hit that $4k mark, but you're now 30-40 miles away from SoMa, and the commute is getting over an hour, easy.
posted by Frayed Knot at 2:29 PM on April 13, 2018 [2 favorites]
I live in North Berkeley, and it's everything you want. I commute on BART to SoMa, door to door just about 45 minutes each way. My neighborhood is very walkable, we've got literally some of the best restaurants in the country in town, and miles and miles of shops of all kinds. But the mortgage + taxes on my 1200sq ft home are far more than $4k a month. With some effort and luck, you might get a rental pretty close to that $4k mark, especially if you're willing to live in something on the small side. We have friends who rent an 800 sq ft bungalow, and they pay somewhere around $3k.
In SF itself the Richmond would provide what you're looking for, but it'll be more like $5K/month, maybe more depending on just where & how big. Commute via Muni (bus and/or trolley) would be close to 45 min, perhaps a bit less depending. The Sunset might also work, but that's more like 60 minutes on a bus, commute-wise.
A much longer commute could put you in what are basically the suburbs, towns like Walnut Creek, Lafayette, Pleasanton or San Ramon. Like most suburbs, less walkable but more house for your money. You can hit that $4k mark, but you're now 30-40 miles away from SoMa, and the commute is getting over an hour, easy.
posted by Frayed Knot at 2:29 PM on April 13, 2018 [2 favorites]
Alameda could work with a ferry commute, again depending on where in SoMa. You'd be thinking small 2BR, but Alameda is appealing and people really like that ferry commute.
posted by vunder at 2:39 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by vunder at 2:39 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
Travel times by BART:
Embarcadero* To/From:
Bay Fair: 28 min
San Leandro: 25 min
Hayward: 32 min
West Dublin: 44 min
Dublin/Pleasanton: 47 min
Rockridge: 20 min
Orinda: 25 min
Lafayette: 30 min
Berkeley: 23 min
N Berkeley: 25 min
*For Montgomery - Powell – Civic Center: Add 3 minutes each, in that order.
That's train-time only; doesn't include getting to the station or getting from the station to where you need to go. Commute hour times are very packed. Peak-hours trains run at least once every 20 minutes.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:42 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
Embarcadero* To/From:
Bay Fair: 28 min
San Leandro: 25 min
Hayward: 32 min
West Dublin: 44 min
Dublin/Pleasanton: 47 min
Rockridge: 20 min
Orinda: 25 min
Lafayette: 30 min
Berkeley: 23 min
N Berkeley: 25 min
*For Montgomery - Powell – Civic Center: Add 3 minutes each, in that order.
That's train-time only; doesn't include getting to the station or getting from the station to where you need to go. Commute hour times are very packed. Peak-hours trains run at least once every 20 minutes.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:42 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
There are few nice restaurants, and relatively few bookstores, between Castro Valley and Oakland, and I wouldn't call those cities very walkable, either. One thing about the SF Bay Area is that historically they've zoned everything such that retail and residential tend to be extremely segregated. It's not like "real" cities like SF, Oak, Berk, or Chicago where you have mini commerical areas in every neighborhood. North Berkeley was my first thought.
posted by rhizome at 2:52 PM on April 13, 2018
posted by rhizome at 2:52 PM on April 13, 2018
Inner Sunset has what you need - close to the park, good commercial district at 9th & Irving (and another around 20th), and you can take the N-Judah train. Looking at Craigslist, there are certainly 2 and even a few 3 BR rentals under $4K/month. (Haven't lived there for years, so I'm assuming those are accurate prices.) As you get more in Outer Sunset (towards the ocean), it gets less convenient.
West Portal is cute and also has access to a train downtown. Less rental stock, longer commute.
Also Lower Rockridge/Temescal in Oakland is nice, walkable, and close to BART and faster downtown than western parts of SF. Caveat: friends who live there say they are more safety/crime conscious these days, but also hear similar in SF. YMMV.
For all these, your commute might be - 10 min walk to train, 20-30 min train, 10 min walk to office.
Renting with dogs is always a challenge in SF - I've seen advice here to make a dog resume and appeal to the landlord personally even if it says no dogs.
posted by troyer at 2:59 PM on April 13, 2018
West Portal is cute and also has access to a train downtown. Less rental stock, longer commute.
Also Lower Rockridge/Temescal in Oakland is nice, walkable, and close to BART and faster downtown than western parts of SF. Caveat: friends who live there say they are more safety/crime conscious these days, but also hear similar in SF. YMMV.
For all these, your commute might be - 10 min walk to train, 20-30 min train, 10 min walk to office.
Renting with dogs is always a challenge in SF - I've seen advice here to make a dog resume and appeal to the landlord personally even if it says no dogs.
posted by troyer at 2:59 PM on April 13, 2018
Possibly Sausalito? It's a small town, rather than a neighborhood, but I think it ticks many of your boxes. It's built into the hillside, which probably limits walkability, but it's also compact with an artsy downtown. There's the option of a ferry commute, or a drive *should* take less than 45 minutes. Budget will likely require some compromises.
posted by another zebra at 3:53 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by another zebra at 3:53 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
Yes to North Berkeley, Elmwood (also in Berkeley), or Rockridge. I live in Rockridge and Yelp says that I live within 1 mile of 77 restaurants. There are two bookstores and a library within blocks, lots of trees and lovely gardens, BART takes about 20 minutes to SOMA. My block has plenty of free street parking, though that varies. I would argue that in this particular neighborhood you could easily live without a car. I like Elmwood, which is nearby, even better, though the commute might be slightly longer. North Berkeley is best in terms of quiet and trees, I think, though it's a little farther away on BART and requires a transfer.
posted by pinochiette at 4:01 PM on April 13, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by pinochiette at 4:01 PM on April 13, 2018 [2 favorites]
Sounds like you're looking to live in my neighborhood! We live in north Emeryville right on the Oakland & Berkeley borders in a 1,000 sq ft 2 bedroom house with a large dog; our rent is $3k, but market is probably closer to $4k now. I really love our walkable neighborhood: great restaurants within 1 - 4 blocks, five blocks to literally one of the best grocery stores in the nation (Berkeley Bowl West), walk or bike to large green spaces (Berkeley Aquatic Park) & Emeryville & Berkeley marinas on the bay, Emeryville's bike/ped greenway a block over, a neighborhood brewery around the corner, good coffee shops, lots of good gyms. Options to get to the city are transbay bus a couple of blocks away (35 minutes in the morning, closer to 50 minutes coming back in the evening), walk 15 minutes to Ashby BART (25 minute BART ride), or bike to West Oakland BART (15 minute bike ride, 8 minute BART). My husband doesn't have a problem getting on at West Oakland with a foldable bike, but you couldn't get a regular bike on, since the trains are packed there (last stop before SF). I think of the area as perfectly safe, but it's not ritzy suburbs - you do want to avoid having things visible in your car, there are homeless encampments nearby (good luck finding a spot in the inner Bay Area that doesn't have them nearby), you see the occasional beer bottle or broken glass or whatever on the sidewalk, typical urban things like that.
South Berkeley near the Ashby BART could be an option as well, or Oakland just north of Lake Merritt (walk to 19th St. BART or take a transbay bus or casual carpool). In general, I think your best bet is to look at either the south/west sides of SF, or north Oakland & Berkeley. You didn't mention weather, but west & south SF get pretty foggy & cold, whereas East Bay will typically be much more sunnier and warmer.
posted by Jaclyn at 4:22 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
South Berkeley near the Ashby BART could be an option as well, or Oakland just north of Lake Merritt (walk to 19th St. BART or take a transbay bus or casual carpool). In general, I think your best bet is to look at either the south/west sides of SF, or north Oakland & Berkeley. You didn't mention weather, but west & south SF get pretty foggy & cold, whereas East Bay will typically be much more sunnier and warmer.
posted by Jaclyn at 4:22 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]
If you're willing to do a bike commute, Potrero's an obvious option, although there are definitely nicer and less nice parts of Potrero and even the nice parts of Potrero are a little sleepy (and hilly.
Very hilly.). Glen Park is another possibility to consider. Slightly above your price range but otherwise reasonable and bikeable options within SF include Bernal, Noe, Eureka Valley, and Diamond Heights.
posted by phoenixy at 4:28 PM on April 13, 2018
Very hilly.). Glen Park is another possibility to consider. Slightly above your price range but otherwise reasonable and bikeable options within SF include Bernal, Noe, Eureka Valley, and Diamond Heights.
posted by phoenixy at 4:28 PM on April 13, 2018
You sound like you might like my neighborhood (North Berkeley). Feels very safe, very walkable, bookstores/shops/cafés galore. There‘s a dog park here, too, if that is a concern. I think you should be able to find a 2 bedroom in your price range. Good luck!
posted by The Toad at 4:41 PM on April 13, 2018
posted by The Toad at 4:41 PM on April 13, 2018
If you're open to commuting by ferry, check out Marin County. The Larkspur/Corte Madera area ticks all of your boxes: Quiet with trees, walkable, safe, easy access to hiking/biking trails.
There's a ferry terminal in Larkspur that will take you right to the ferry building in San Francisco. From there, you can ride your bike (they allow bikes on the ferry) or ride muni to work.
The downside is that your commute will be closer to an hour than 45 minutes, but you'll be on a boat reading the news or answering email, not stuck in traffic.
posted by cleverevans at 8:16 PM on April 13, 2018
There's a ferry terminal in Larkspur that will take you right to the ferry building in San Francisco. From there, you can ride your bike (they allow bikes on the ferry) or ride muni to work.
The downside is that your commute will be closer to an hour than 45 minutes, but you'll be on a boat reading the news or answering email, not stuck in traffic.
posted by cleverevans at 8:16 PM on April 13, 2018
I second Alameda. It’s a little sleepy, but sweet. And yes, the 15-min ferry to Sf is amazing. I wouldn’t give it up for anything.
posted by greermahoney at 12:18 AM on April 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by greermahoney at 12:18 AM on April 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
I live in Rockridge near BART - it fits your requirements, and you can rent a small house with a yard here and there are decent restaurants and shops.
You may have to scale back to a two bedroom house rather than three.
It's a safe-feeling neighbourhood although there is opportunist crime. To give you an idea of the level : if I ever forget to lock my car outside my house it will likely get rummaged through by a thief that night, but nobody in the street has had a car window broken or a car stolen.
As well as BART, t's also possible to get to SF via casual carpool: at the corner of Hudson and Claremont in Rockridge, drivers pick up commuters in the morning and drop them in the SF financial district. The driver gets to use the faster carpool lane across the Bay and pay a reduced toll, the riders get a free ride. It's been going on for years and there are other known locations in the East Bay where it happens. Mrs w0mbat often does this and then takes BART home in the evening.
posted by w0mbat at 10:33 AM on April 14, 2018
You may have to scale back to a two bedroom house rather than three.
It's a safe-feeling neighbourhood although there is opportunist crime. To give you an idea of the level : if I ever forget to lock my car outside my house it will likely get rummaged through by a thief that night, but nobody in the street has had a car window broken or a car stolen.
As well as BART, t's also possible to get to SF via casual carpool: at the corner of Hudson and Claremont in Rockridge, drivers pick up commuters in the morning and drop them in the SF financial district. The driver gets to use the faster carpool lane across the Bay and pay a reduced toll, the riders get a free ride. It's been going on for years and there are other known locations in the East Bay where it happens. Mrs w0mbat often does this and then takes BART home in the evening.
posted by w0mbat at 10:33 AM on April 14, 2018
One thing to keep in mind is that if you are coming in on bart from the east bay on any station after maybe the the second (sometimes first) in the line you will never ever get to sit down. I live in concord (a bit past walnut creek) and commute to about 4th and brannan via Bart at the north concord/martinez station and it takes me roughly 2 hours door to door each way.
posted by Television Name at 5:53 PM on April 14, 2018
posted by Television Name at 5:53 PM on April 14, 2018
Our neighborhood is near Jaclyn’s, though we’re on the Oakland side closest to Macarthur BART. Longfellow neighborhood and Temescal just to the east have most of what you’re asking for. I commute to SOMA myself and typically use BART, total time ~45min. The AC Transit Transbay buses are also convenient if work is in the eastern half of SOMA or the financial district, near the bus terminal at Howard & Main.
Start with Transbay bus stops and BART stations, and expand your search from there. Here is a map of neighborhood names in Oakland that you can use to visualize locations — stick to the left third of the map starting with Lake Merritt for transit access to SF.
Alameda is also an option for you with a reliable ferry to SF, though it helps to bike to the terminal.
posted by migurski at 7:10 PM on April 14, 2018
Start with Transbay bus stops and BART stations, and expand your search from there. Here is a map of neighborhood names in Oakland that you can use to visualize locations — stick to the left third of the map starting with Lake Merritt for transit access to SF.
Alameda is also an option for you with a reliable ferry to SF, though it helps to bike to the terminal.
posted by migurski at 7:10 PM on April 14, 2018
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:27 PM on April 13, 2018 [1 favorite]