Should you voice your insecurities to your partner?
March 15, 2018 9:28 AM Subscribe
What is reasonable to voice? What should you keep to yourself (and just tell your therapist or close friend instead)? How much should you reasonably expect for your partner to try to understand or is it just a burden? I don’t have any good relationship models (besides TV) and I am lost.
Mid-20s F with a SO in the same age range, M. Dating for 1+ year. My past question talked about my suprising discomfort about his open porn/Snapchat nude models/instagram model usage. We addressed this and found a middle point. I still find myself irrationally bothered by it at times, but I am working on it. It seems since then, more and more insecurities on my end have been popping up. I find myself comparing to those women he may still follow (I’m POC, they are not, we look very different, etc etc.) I found some of his comments around it to be objectifying, and I would get bothered by his making audible “Mm.” Sounds in public when he saw something “sexy.” He said he did this unconsciously and didn’t even notice, and felt really bad about it. I guess it bothered me because it felt...gross. And he would do it in front of friends who would notice, and I would then feel bad. Especially since he himself wasn’t aware.
Anyways, after working with my therapist, I found the strength to voice my concerns and insecurities. I had rarely felt comfortable to do this in other relationships (and even in my family) and was afraid to do it. I did and it went well! He was very understanding and not aggressive or reactive, and kind and apologetic. It made me feel more secure to be able to voice my thoughts and concerns.
However, now I’m wondering where I should draw the line, and if I’m overly sharing too many things that bother me.
A lot of the things that bother me seem to be internal. I know it’s a Me problem. I have a lot of anxiety and insecurity and was cheated on in my last relationship, so I know that it is the fearful voice in my head that’s the loudest. Externally, besides that hiccup we had and now discussed, I don’t have any logical reason to feel so insecure. I don’t think. But I find myself going through waves of “I feel great about myself and us” to “I hate myself and I think I should run away because emotional entwinement is hard.”
For instance, he has an old crush/now friend who has triggered my insecurity (for no good reason. It’s just my anxiety.) Sure, they talk about sex and what not when they were both single (something he would tell me about) but now that they’re both in relationships, that’s stopped. He rarely brings her up, but I know they talk everyday. I wonder why he doesn’t talk about her much, but I don’t tell him about my every conversation with my friends. An opportunity for us all to meet has come up. I’m really nervous about it, and my insecurity and anxiety is in high gear. However, I don’t know if this is something I should voice, or be burdensome? Like, this is my insecurity to deal with, not yours?
But I feel my mood flux, and I do what my dad used to do to me and my mom—shut down. I hate doing it and am working on this in therapy. He can be aloof, so he doesn’t notice when this is happening, but I do, and I feel like the only way I can snap out of it is by getting what’s off my chest. But I feel like this is unfair, because I am having these anxious/insecure moments more frequently, and no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over.
So I guess I’m looking for practical solutions about what to do when these moods come on, or know if it’s ok to be able to discuss these with my partner when they do happen? But there must be a limit right? At some point, it’s too much? I don’t want anyone to walk on eggshells because I keep telling them I’m insecure or bothered by X. I also know my feelings are valid, but at times can be irrational thinking.
Any help or advice is so appreciated. I don’t have any models for healthy relationships and I’m doing my best to work on it. I feel like this is my healthiest relationship to date (although y’all may pinpoint on this issues that I discussed here, but we are both willing to work on our relationship.) My partner is the most kind, understanding, and loving person I’ve dated. He is trying to work on things which I have never had someone do! It’s so crazy to experience it! And he doesn’t get angry when I bring things up! (This May be a low standard, but man, it’s exciting for me.) There are many other reasons I love this person and I don’t want to burden them unnecessarily with my insecurities. But is there reasonable ways to ask for reassurance or...help?
Mid-20s F with a SO in the same age range, M. Dating for 1+ year. My past question talked about my suprising discomfort about his open porn/Snapchat nude models/instagram model usage. We addressed this and found a middle point. I still find myself irrationally bothered by it at times, but I am working on it. It seems since then, more and more insecurities on my end have been popping up. I find myself comparing to those women he may still follow (I’m POC, they are not, we look very different, etc etc.) I found some of his comments around it to be objectifying, and I would get bothered by his making audible “Mm.” Sounds in public when he saw something “sexy.” He said he did this unconsciously and didn’t even notice, and felt really bad about it. I guess it bothered me because it felt...gross. And he would do it in front of friends who would notice, and I would then feel bad. Especially since he himself wasn’t aware.
Anyways, after working with my therapist, I found the strength to voice my concerns and insecurities. I had rarely felt comfortable to do this in other relationships (and even in my family) and was afraid to do it. I did and it went well! He was very understanding and not aggressive or reactive, and kind and apologetic. It made me feel more secure to be able to voice my thoughts and concerns.
However, now I’m wondering where I should draw the line, and if I’m overly sharing too many things that bother me.
A lot of the things that bother me seem to be internal. I know it’s a Me problem. I have a lot of anxiety and insecurity and was cheated on in my last relationship, so I know that it is the fearful voice in my head that’s the loudest. Externally, besides that hiccup we had and now discussed, I don’t have any logical reason to feel so insecure. I don’t think. But I find myself going through waves of “I feel great about myself and us” to “I hate myself and I think I should run away because emotional entwinement is hard.”
For instance, he has an old crush/now friend who has triggered my insecurity (for no good reason. It’s just my anxiety.) Sure, they talk about sex and what not when they were both single (something he would tell me about) but now that they’re both in relationships, that’s stopped. He rarely brings her up, but I know they talk everyday. I wonder why he doesn’t talk about her much, but I don’t tell him about my every conversation with my friends. An opportunity for us all to meet has come up. I’m really nervous about it, and my insecurity and anxiety is in high gear. However, I don’t know if this is something I should voice, or be burdensome? Like, this is my insecurity to deal with, not yours?
But I feel my mood flux, and I do what my dad used to do to me and my mom—shut down. I hate doing it and am working on this in therapy. He can be aloof, so he doesn’t notice when this is happening, but I do, and I feel like the only way I can snap out of it is by getting what’s off my chest. But I feel like this is unfair, because I am having these anxious/insecure moments more frequently, and no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over.
So I guess I’m looking for practical solutions about what to do when these moods come on, or know if it’s ok to be able to discuss these with my partner when they do happen? But there must be a limit right? At some point, it’s too much? I don’t want anyone to walk on eggshells because I keep telling them I’m insecure or bothered by X. I also know my feelings are valid, but at times can be irrational thinking.
Any help or advice is so appreciated. I don’t have any models for healthy relationships and I’m doing my best to work on it. I feel like this is my healthiest relationship to date (although y’all may pinpoint on this issues that I discussed here, but we are both willing to work on our relationship.) My partner is the most kind, understanding, and loving person I’ve dated. He is trying to work on things which I have never had someone do! It’s so crazy to experience it! And he doesn’t get angry when I bring things up! (This May be a low standard, but man, it’s exciting for me.) There are many other reasons I love this person and I don’t want to burden them unnecessarily with my insecurities. But is there reasonable ways to ask for reassurance or...help?
Best answer: Next time he says 'mmm' in public when he's looking at an Insta model on his phone or whatever, tell him to knock it off because it's gross, because it is gross public behaviour, and you don't want to be around that.
Ask him what the deal is with him and this girl.
These aren't insecurities; this is your partner being kind of gross and shady. Yes, you should absolutely voice these concerns. You will gain nothing by trying to therapy away these squicky feelings.
posted by nerdfish at 9:51 AM on March 15, 2018 [49 favorites]
Ask him what the deal is with him and this girl.
These aren't insecurities; this is your partner being kind of gross and shady. Yes, you should absolutely voice these concerns. You will gain nothing by trying to therapy away these squicky feelings.
posted by nerdfish at 9:51 AM on March 15, 2018 [49 favorites]
I wouldn't be in a relationship unless I felt comfortable expressing how I feel to my partner about anything, at any time.
In this situation, reading your question, I'm thinking: What do you want to get out of telling him about your feelings? You want him to change the behaviors. There's no point in bringing it up otherwise, right? Saying "I feel bad about this and I know I shouldn't" is not productive and it's probably not truthful, either. You do want him to stop doing these things. And, if you're asking my opinion, I'm telling you that I would want him to stop, too. He's doing some stuff that I wouldn't consider okay in my relationship.
The thing, though, is that he probably isn't going to change - he certainly isn't going to change if you're telling him about your feelings and then backpedaling with excuses about why you know your insecurities are your own problem. (They aren't.) Your only real option is to decide if you want to stay in a relationship with somebody whose day to day behavior consistently makes you feel insecure and anxious, or whether you want to be with somebody else who doesn't. Maybe you're an insecure and anxious person by nature, but it's hard to see how virtually anyone wouldn't be bothered by your boyfriend's attitudes toward and relationships with other women.
posted by something something at 9:52 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
In this situation, reading your question, I'm thinking: What do you want to get out of telling him about your feelings? You want him to change the behaviors. There's no point in bringing it up otherwise, right? Saying "I feel bad about this and I know I shouldn't" is not productive and it's probably not truthful, either. You do want him to stop doing these things. And, if you're asking my opinion, I'm telling you that I would want him to stop, too. He's doing some stuff that I wouldn't consider okay in my relationship.
The thing, though, is that he probably isn't going to change - he certainly isn't going to change if you're telling him about your feelings and then backpedaling with excuses about why you know your insecurities are your own problem. (They aren't.) Your only real option is to decide if you want to stay in a relationship with somebody whose day to day behavior consistently makes you feel insecure and anxious, or whether you want to be with somebody else who doesn't. Maybe you're an insecure and anxious person by nature, but it's hard to see how virtually anyone wouldn't be bothered by your boyfriend's attitudes toward and relationships with other women.
posted by something something at 9:52 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
His behaviour is rude and immature and it isn't your job to help him adult. That you are amazed he isn't aggressive or reactive when called on shit that two year children have been socialized not to do isn't really a ringing endorsement - he is failing to be a basic decent human being but at least he isn't abusive. It sounds like you are doing a lot of work on yourself - what is HE doing to mature? Is HE is therapy, or seeking out positive male role models? It sounds like you are becoming the "identified patient" in your relationship as a way for him to avoid taking responsibility for his actions. I would expect him to be proactive about solving his own immaturity and rudeness and not expecting you to be the gatekeeper. As others noted, his behaviour is crazy-making, pretty much anyone would be insecure in a relationship where the other person is creating insecurty.
posted by saucysault at 9:56 AM on March 15, 2018 [10 favorites]
posted by saucysault at 9:56 AM on March 15, 2018 [10 favorites]
Response by poster: Thank you for your comments so far! Just to steer it a bit away from the “mm.” We have addressed that. I haven’t brought up my discomfort with his friend though. Is that something I would be ok to bring up?
posted by socky bottoms at 9:58 AM on March 15, 2018
posted by socky bottoms at 9:58 AM on March 15, 2018
You are asking for permission to bring up something so basic I just want to hug you. Yes, this is okay and I therfore give you permission (spoiler: you don't need mine or anyone else's but your own).
Having friends of the gender(s) one prefers to be romanic with is not off limits in this modern world, but having friends and friendships that cross established boundaries in your personal relationship is. You need to establish these boundaries. You have the right.
posted by oflinkey at 10:05 AM on March 15, 2018 [17 favorites]
Having friends of the gender(s) one prefers to be romanic with is not off limits in this modern world, but having friends and friendships that cross established boundaries in your personal relationship is. You need to establish these boundaries. You have the right.
posted by oflinkey at 10:05 AM on March 15, 2018 [17 favorites]
Also, this? "no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over. " and "I don’t want anyone to walk on eggshells" and "I don’t want to burden them unnecessarily" and feeling your behaviour is "irrational" when he expects you to have to explain over and over why the same behaviour is unacceptable, or that you have to walk on eggshells about how his gross irrational behaviour is affecting you and others or that your expectations are too much of a burden to actually make significant changes ... why does he get consideration from you that he isn't reciprocating?
You are uncomfortable about his friendship because his track record has been that he makes poor decisions without considering how you feel. I think you are breaking each instance down to the specifics to avoid looking at the systemic problem of him lacking empathy or awareness of how his actions affect others - especially his girlfriend. Step back and address the systemic problem because if you just address the friendship in a couple of weeks he will be doing something else "thoughtlessly". This is a conscious tactic to avoid responsibly. Talk to him, but expect HIM to do the work in adulting.
posted by saucysault at 10:11 AM on March 15, 2018 [6 favorites]
You are uncomfortable about his friendship because his track record has been that he makes poor decisions without considering how you feel. I think you are breaking each instance down to the specifics to avoid looking at the systemic problem of him lacking empathy or awareness of how his actions affect others - especially his girlfriend. Step back and address the systemic problem because if you just address the friendship in a couple of weeks he will be doing something else "thoughtlessly". This is a conscious tactic to avoid responsibly. Talk to him, but expect HIM to do the work in adulting.
posted by saucysault at 10:11 AM on March 15, 2018 [6 favorites]
Best answer: At times, it is good to question your feelings and behavior, especially when there are circumstances in your life that may have led you to process things differently. That is to say, it's good that you are aware that you didn't have healthy role models and are working through your issues with a therapist.
That doesn't mean however, that all of your feelings are to be mistrusted! Maybe the fact that you feel uncomfortable is telling you something important about you, your boundaries, your relationship? I feel like your feelings here are not unreasonable at all. I mean, sure, there might be people who would have zero problems with your boyfriends behavior, but you are not one of them. And that's completely fine. He is entitled to have this porn habit and you are entitled to not be ok with that. You do not NEED to bend you level of comfort for him. Maybe you two are not a great match, and why settle for less? (I'm absolutely sure there are plenty of guys out there who don't do this.)
posted by leopard-skin pill-box hat at 10:31 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
That doesn't mean however, that all of your feelings are to be mistrusted! Maybe the fact that you feel uncomfortable is telling you something important about you, your boundaries, your relationship? I feel like your feelings here are not unreasonable at all. I mean, sure, there might be people who would have zero problems with your boyfriends behavior, but you are not one of them. And that's completely fine. He is entitled to have this porn habit and you are entitled to not be ok with that. You do not NEED to bend you level of comfort for him. Maybe you two are not a great match, and why settle for less? (I'm absolutely sure there are plenty of guys out there who don't do this.)
posted by leopard-skin pill-box hat at 10:31 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
Best answer: I don't have specific advice for you but I do very, VERY strongly recommend The Dance of Intimacy by Dr. Harrier Lerner. It's a fucking brilliant book that had for me an aha moment on every page, and the stuff she talks about is exactly the kind of thing you are asking about here.
posted by MiraK at 10:32 AM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by MiraK at 10:32 AM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Here's a mostly-workable guideline you can use: you should bring up your feelings when something new triggers them. -Incident- happens, you tell him when you are next able that -incident- is giving you bad feelings, you talk it out, and there is either resolution or there is not. New thing happens, you bring it up. You suddenly obtain/put together the information that he's got a girlfriend he talks to every day that he never talks to you about and didn't pro-actively make any attempt to be transparent about it, you bring that up. There's not much productivity in bringing up incident1 over and over again - if you are routinely unable to resolve incidents you should break up instead - but you should voice new concerns as you have them.
I mean, you should break up with him instead of gaslighting yourself out of holding him responsible for his behavior, but you don't seem to be ready yet. You might consider journaling for now, and maybe keeping a list of these things, and maybe reviewing the list frequently to see if any of your concerns ever get to drop off the list, and eventually you are going to catch him undeniably in the act of either cheating on you or such blatant misogynist objectification you can't continue to look at the list and still make yourself believe that being with this guy is better than being alone and that there are better men out there and you deserve to be with one.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:42 AM on March 15, 2018 [8 favorites]
I mean, you should break up with him instead of gaslighting yourself out of holding him responsible for his behavior, but you don't seem to be ready yet. You might consider journaling for now, and maybe keeping a list of these things, and maybe reviewing the list frequently to see if any of your concerns ever get to drop off the list, and eventually you are going to catch him undeniably in the act of either cheating on you or such blatant misogynist objectification you can't continue to look at the list and still make yourself believe that being with this guy is better than being alone and that there are better men out there and you deserve to be with one.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:42 AM on March 15, 2018 [8 favorites]
Best answer: "...I would get bothered by his making audible “Mm.” Sounds in public when he saw something "sexy.""
"I still find myself irrationally bothered by it at times, but I am working on it."
Those two sentences are slightly out of order, but I had to stop there and write to you.
- Why are you putting in too much emotional labor to accept a juvenile behavior of his that is unambiguously objectionable?
I guess I will go read the rest. No, you should not date someone who objectifies others in this fashion. No. This is almost never acceptable unless it is in private directed at you as a compliment.
posted by jbenben at 10:46 AM on March 15, 2018 [8 favorites]
"I still find myself irrationally bothered by it at times, but I am working on it."
Those two sentences are slightly out of order, but I had to stop there and write to you.
- Why are you putting in too much emotional labor to accept a juvenile behavior of his that is unambiguously objectionable?
I guess I will go read the rest. No, you should not date someone who objectifies others in this fashion. No. This is almost never acceptable unless it is in private directed at you as a compliment.
posted by jbenben at 10:46 AM on March 15, 2018 [8 favorites]
Also, he knows he does it. Especially after it has been pointed out to him.
...Read the rest. I think you are putting yourself unnecessarily through the ringer trying to date someone who legitimately triggers what are valid concerns. I can't imagine this is healthy longterm even if you contort yourself into enjoying this outing with his friend. You're doing great. The relationship was a learning experience. It's ok to tap out.
posted by jbenben at 10:48 AM on March 15, 2018 [10 favorites]
...Read the rest. I think you are putting yourself unnecessarily through the ringer trying to date someone who legitimately triggers what are valid concerns. I can't imagine this is healthy longterm even if you contort yourself into enjoying this outing with his friend. You're doing great. The relationship was a learning experience. It's ok to tap out.
posted by jbenben at 10:48 AM on March 15, 2018 [10 favorites]
Best answer: For instance, he has an old crush/now friend ... I know they talk everyday. ... An opportunity for us all to meet has come up. I’m really nervous about it, ....
One way to think about this is to recognize that arranging a meeting between an SO and a friend is the exact opposite of what a cheating or lying or secretive person would do. He talks to this friend every day, so she is important to him on some level. And he has a healthy relationship with you, in which past conversations about difficult subjects have gone well between you. And he wants these two important people in his life to meet.
This is a good thing.
(I agree with others that the objectifying is uncool and that your response to it is not irrational.)
posted by headnsouth at 10:51 AM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
One way to think about this is to recognize that arranging a meeting between an SO and a friend is the exact opposite of what a cheating or lying or secretive person would do. He talks to this friend every day, so she is important to him on some level. And he has a healthy relationship with you, in which past conversations about difficult subjects have gone well between you. And he wants these two important people in his life to meet.
This is a good thing.
(I agree with others that the objectifying is uncool and that your response to it is not irrational.)
posted by headnsouth at 10:51 AM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
tbh I was hoping after the last question that you would dump this guy. The porn thing comes up a lot and I know it's supposedly feminist now to say that porn is empowering, but I strongly disagree with that and I think you have every right to be uncomfortable with it. Men don't NEED porn and if he somehow "needs" to masturbate he can use his imagination and his hands. We have multiple pieces of evidence here showing that he objectifies women, and those all override any of the supposedly good qualities he has. I'm so depressed that the baseline is so low for dating now but this guy is definitely not good enough for you and is bad for your mental health and self esteem.
posted by masquesoporfavor at 11:01 AM on March 15, 2018 [14 favorites]
posted by masquesoporfavor at 11:01 AM on March 15, 2018 [14 favorites]
Best answer: Cishet male here. Your discomfort with his friend is absolutely something you should feel able to bring up. You should be gauging his response too, and if his reassurances don't make you feel reassured, you should trust yourself that there's a reason for that. After all it's not like he's going to tell you that you need to be worried even if you should be, so you need to assume that his response will be an attempt to reassure you and that it's your job to decide if you feel like he's being sincere or not. He's given you reason to worry, after all—it's clear that he has a roving eye, and frankly as an outsider knowing only what you've given in your question I feel like this is a guy who would cheat on you if he thought he would definitely get away with it.
Setting all that aside though, these types of insecurities are things that anybody should be able to talk about in the context of a healthy relationship. Everybody has insecurities! The ones you've presented here don't sound irrational or unfounded at all, but that's actually not the point. The point is that as partners, it is both of your jobs to help the other person feel safe and secure. Building trust and security should be an active, ongoing thing that both of you do all the time even when there isn't any specific issue at hand. When there is something specific though, you should be able to voice it and you should expect your partner to try and help you with it.
Insecurity is normal. Irrational insecurity is normal. Reassuring our partners, making them feel safe and relaxed, is a basic relationship responsibility. Many men do not seem to realize that (and many women seem to think that they need to hide this stuff from their partners and deal with it on their own by squishing that little doubting voice deep down inside and ignoring it until their partner does something truly blatant and awful to them) but it's no less true for all that.
When you have fears, your partner should always be someone you can safely bring them to—even if those fears involve your partner. If you can't do that, he's not treating you like you deserve.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 11:02 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
Setting all that aside though, these types of insecurities are things that anybody should be able to talk about in the context of a healthy relationship. Everybody has insecurities! The ones you've presented here don't sound irrational or unfounded at all, but that's actually not the point. The point is that as partners, it is both of your jobs to help the other person feel safe and secure. Building trust and security should be an active, ongoing thing that both of you do all the time even when there isn't any specific issue at hand. When there is something specific though, you should be able to voice it and you should expect your partner to try and help you with it.
Insecurity is normal. Irrational insecurity is normal. Reassuring our partners, making them feel safe and relaxed, is a basic relationship responsibility. Many men do not seem to realize that (and many women seem to think that they need to hide this stuff from their partners and deal with it on their own by squishing that little doubting voice deep down inside and ignoring it until their partner does something truly blatant and awful to them) but it's no less true for all that.
When you have fears, your partner should always be someone you can safely bring them to—even if those fears involve your partner. If you can't do that, he's not treating you like you deserve.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 11:02 AM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
Best answer: There are many other reasons I love this person and I don’t want to burden them unnecessarily with my insecurities. But is there reasonable ways to ask for reassurance or...help?
This feeling -- that I'm burdening someone when I share my insecurities with them -- is something my therapist has been helping me with a lot lately. I have always felt like sharing insecurities was followed by an implicit (if unspoken) demand for the other person to change their behavior.
But I'm learning that this isn't necessarily the case. Sharing insecurities can also be about giving the other person more context about what's going on in your head, without expecting them to do anything right then. Just so they can understand how you feel.
It's also good to have an idea of what would make the situation better for you. My bf and I are long-distance right now, and one of the first "asks" I made was, "Hey, I'm having a hard time with the distance. Can we agree to text/talk/snapchat a little more often? Getting the chance to hear from you once a day would really help." (And it did.)
posted by schroedingersgirl at 11:08 AM on March 15, 2018 [3 favorites]
This feeling -- that I'm burdening someone when I share my insecurities with them -- is something my therapist has been helping me with a lot lately. I have always felt like sharing insecurities was followed by an implicit (if unspoken) demand for the other person to change their behavior.
But I'm learning that this isn't necessarily the case. Sharing insecurities can also be about giving the other person more context about what's going on in your head, without expecting them to do anything right then. Just so they can understand how you feel.
It's also good to have an idea of what would make the situation better for you. My bf and I are long-distance right now, and one of the first "asks" I made was, "Hey, I'm having a hard time with the distance. Can we agree to text/talk/snapchat a little more often? Getting the chance to hear from you once a day would really help." (And it did.)
posted by schroedingersgirl at 11:08 AM on March 15, 2018 [3 favorites]
Best answer: I haven’t brought up my discomfort with his friend though. Is that something I would be ok to bring up?
Yes.
I'm not your s/o, but once my wife said "hey, I don't think you're doing anything wrong, and I'm not asking you to change your behavior, but I thought you should know that your relationship with [$ female friend] makes me jealous or uncomfortable for reasons I can't entirely put my finger on."
She was right; there was nothing going on besides friendship between me and female friend, though there was probably some glimmer of a crush there, looking back on it. And here's the thing: I care about my wife and how she feels about my relationships. If she had asked me to stop seeing Friend I would have pushed back against it because I'd probably think the request was unreasonable. But in light of the new information she gave, I paid more attention to how I was managing my relationship with Friend, and made a conscious effort to avoid anything I expected would make my wife feel uncomfortable. So, while I'm usually happy to make one-on-one plans with female friends to get a drink after work or do something together on a weekend, with this particular friend I would try to avoid that sort of one-on-one interaction.
This is a long way of getting around to the idea that there is a difference between letting your s/o know about your feelings and demanding a specific response from them in return. In my mind, the former is always okay, and the latter may or may not be okay based on the circumstances.
posted by craven_morhead at 11:27 AM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
Yes.
I'm not your s/o, but once my wife said "hey, I don't think you're doing anything wrong, and I'm not asking you to change your behavior, but I thought you should know that your relationship with [$ female friend] makes me jealous or uncomfortable for reasons I can't entirely put my finger on."
She was right; there was nothing going on besides friendship between me and female friend, though there was probably some glimmer of a crush there, looking back on it. And here's the thing: I care about my wife and how she feels about my relationships. If she had asked me to stop seeing Friend I would have pushed back against it because I'd probably think the request was unreasonable. But in light of the new information she gave, I paid more attention to how I was managing my relationship with Friend, and made a conscious effort to avoid anything I expected would make my wife feel uncomfortable. So, while I'm usually happy to make one-on-one plans with female friends to get a drink after work or do something together on a weekend, with this particular friend I would try to avoid that sort of one-on-one interaction.
This is a long way of getting around to the idea that there is a difference between letting your s/o know about your feelings and demanding a specific response from them in return. In my mind, the former is always okay, and the latter may or may not be okay based on the circumstances.
posted by craven_morhead at 11:27 AM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks again! So, it was definitely established with my boyfriend that his “Mm” noises was definitely not ok. And we have addressed that and he’s very sorry for it. But I think I am also looking for what exactly to say/address with the discomfort with the friend that makes sense. Someone mentioned having in mind a situation that might make it better for me. I don’t think cutting off the friend is the right option (though no one mentioned this, it just popped to my mind) because I don’t want him to do that. I still feel hesistant on how to find the right words for a solution for this, either knowing more about her (which could backfire) or just being reassured that he’s still keeping good boundaries with her. And please believe me that I don’t think my partner is not being empathetic! I know I sound like every other commenter saying “not my partner, he’s different!” But in everything I’ve brouvht up to him, he has been understanding and willing to listen. I am just REALLY used to past partners passing the blame to me, or saying I am limiting their behavior, or yell at me, that every time I face this situation, I get scared. I’m trying my best to break this pattern in this relationship, where I’m not experiencing it. It’s just taking me a lot of time to get the courage to do it.
But also you’ve given me lots to think about as far as emotional labor. Didn’t think about it from that perspective but yeah. It’s not just me in this relationship, I shouldn’t put it all on myself.
posted by socky bottoms at 11:34 AM on March 15, 2018
But also you’ve given me lots to think about as far as emotional labor. Didn’t think about it from that perspective but yeah. It’s not just me in this relationship, I shouldn’t put it all on myself.
posted by socky bottoms at 11:34 AM on March 15, 2018
Romantic relationships are supposed to feel good.
In good relationships,
Both partners are keen to let each other know that they find one another uniquely and especially attractive.
Both partners value and are curious about how the other person sees things.
Both partners want to know what makes the other partner feel secure in the relationship (and what undercuts that security) because they want the relationship to be strong.
Both partners are willing to compromise and to help maintain equal reciprocity in the relationship.
When I've found myself feeling insecure in a relationship, it has usually meant that:
1) I didn't really believe that I was a lovable person who deserved to be in a relationship that felt good, and
2) I was in a relationship with someone who wasn't right for me because we had, for whatever reasons, different relationship styles/needs/expectations that proved to be incompatible. See also: 1.
The kinds of things you're describing would certainly make me feel insecure. And if I found myself needing to have conversations about my insecurities on the regular, I would wonder why I was in a relationship that didn't feel good.
posted by pinkacademic at 11:44 AM on March 15, 2018 [13 favorites]
In good relationships,
Both partners are keen to let each other know that they find one another uniquely and especially attractive.
Both partners value and are curious about how the other person sees things.
Both partners want to know what makes the other partner feel secure in the relationship (and what undercuts that security) because they want the relationship to be strong.
Both partners are willing to compromise and to help maintain equal reciprocity in the relationship.
When I've found myself feeling insecure in a relationship, it has usually meant that:
1) I didn't really believe that I was a lovable person who deserved to be in a relationship that felt good, and
2) I was in a relationship with someone who wasn't right for me because we had, for whatever reasons, different relationship styles/needs/expectations that proved to be incompatible. See also: 1.
The kinds of things you're describing would certainly make me feel insecure. And if I found myself needing to have conversations about my insecurities on the regular, I would wonder why I was in a relationship that didn't feel good.
posted by pinkacademic at 11:44 AM on March 15, 2018 [13 favorites]
I just went back and read your prior question about this guy's porn-on-social-media addiction and I have to tell you I think this guy is WELL beyond what's normal or emotionally healthy, in his consumption patterns and in the normalization and integration of porn into his daily life. Obviously you feel insecure with him: he sounds like someone with poor sexual impulse control overall.
I know you'll feel attacked by that; I am sorry. But when you get out of this relationship - whenever that happens - you'll be deeply relieved down in your innermost guts.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:53 AM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
I know you'll feel attacked by that; I am sorry. But when you get out of this relationship - whenever that happens - you'll be deeply relieved down in your innermost guts.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:53 AM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
I keep trying to understand what is likable about this guy as I read your question. Your answer, near the end, is that he's better than everyone else you've dated, but that may be saying more about the others. I imagine you don't feel you deserve much, hence you feel so much insecurity that expressing it would be a terrible burden on him. And that would drive him away and thus you then feel even more insecure which, if you express it, would drive him away etc. It's a loop from which there is no escape. He should want to do his best to make you feel loved enough not to feel insecure. The only reason he should feel burdened is because he loves you and you're not taking it in, but somehow I doubt that's the problem.
posted by Obscure Reference at 11:57 AM on March 15, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by Obscure Reference at 11:57 AM on March 15, 2018 [3 favorites]
I think it's telling that you favorited all the comments that sandwiched mine--I am sorry if I sound mean but I have read probably a thousand of these questions and had nearly as many relationships (only slightly exaggerating), and I'm being honest with you in the hopes it will save you the time and emotion I wasted. The partner you want to be with long term should make you feel good, not bad. The partner you end up with in the "happily ever after" should be the one you can't imagine NOT telling when you're upset about something because of COURSE he would want to know and fix it for you. That's not too much to ask, I'm telling you!
posted by masquesoporfavor at 11:59 AM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
posted by masquesoporfavor at 11:59 AM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
Response by poster: Ok gonna try to make this a last comment, mods, sorry!
I know I’m layering on a lot of questions here around the same subject. I have discovered today that 1) it is alright to voice this concern around the friend and other insecurities. Woo. 2) I may not have a solution, though as someone mentioned, it may be just having him stop talking to them, which I don’t want to happen. It’s not like he is doing anything wrong, per say. He’s talking to a friend via text like his other friends and from what I can tell, they aren’t talking in detail about sex lives or something. He probably will bring these conversations we have now to her though. If he asks why this bothers me, it’s ok to say because of his past behaviors (??) 3) I may find out at the end of this conversation(s) that we are not meant to be. I don’t want to go into this attacking him or being extra emotional, so I’m going to write it down and practice it (I do this often, my therapist says I do catastrophic thinking at times, where I go through every possible bad ending. But uh it helps sometimes.) Hopefully I’m on the right track.
And @masques, sorry, the not best answering you wasn’t me trying to be mean or telling! I’m still going through all of them bottom to top and top to bottom. I hear y’all. Just processing. The best answer thing can be tricky too...
posted by socky bottoms at 12:10 PM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
I know I’m layering on a lot of questions here around the same subject. I have discovered today that 1) it is alright to voice this concern around the friend and other insecurities. Woo. 2) I may not have a solution, though as someone mentioned, it may be just having him stop talking to them, which I don’t want to happen. It’s not like he is doing anything wrong, per say. He’s talking to a friend via text like his other friends and from what I can tell, they aren’t talking in detail about sex lives or something. He probably will bring these conversations we have now to her though. If he asks why this bothers me, it’s ok to say because of his past behaviors (??) 3) I may find out at the end of this conversation(s) that we are not meant to be. I don’t want to go into this attacking him or being extra emotional, so I’m going to write it down and practice it (I do this often, my therapist says I do catastrophic thinking at times, where I go through every possible bad ending. But uh it helps sometimes.) Hopefully I’m on the right track.
And @masques, sorry, the not best answering you wasn’t me trying to be mean or telling! I’m still going through all of them bottom to top and top to bottom. I hear y’all. Just processing. The best answer thing can be tricky too...
posted by socky bottoms at 12:10 PM on March 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
For a certain type of guy, it's actually a thrill to put an insecure girlfriend and a woman he did/does want to be with together in social situations. It is absolutely untrue that introducing someone to a partner is universally a sign of honesty and good intentions. I know because I have been the woman on either side of the equation in this type of situation multiple multiple times. In fact, at least once while I was still in the "friendzone" this sort of performative demonstration was absolutely the prelude to an affair where the guy in question had no intention of leaving his partner. (Many years later she left him, but that is a tragic tale for another time unless you feel the need to know about her experience since in some ways it mirrors yours... I'm only talking about my personal experience now...)
Anyone above who pegged this relationship as unhealthy for you whether he is cheating or not is spot on. He doesn't have to be sleeping with his ex crush to covertly enjoy your discomfort.
This is question #2 with the feature of an escalation from "porn discomfort" towards a "woman in real life discomfort" for you.
Why are you ignoring your gut? It's on your side. I beg you to reconsider and give your feelings a higher priority.
posted by jbenben at 12:12 PM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
Anyone above who pegged this relationship as unhealthy for you whether he is cheating or not is spot on. He doesn't have to be sleeping with his ex crush to covertly enjoy your discomfort.
This is question #2 with the feature of an escalation from "porn discomfort" towards a "woman in real life discomfort" for you.
Why are you ignoring your gut? It's on your side. I beg you to reconsider and give your feelings a higher priority.
posted by jbenben at 12:12 PM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
He probably will bring these conversations we have now to her though.
A person should not be discussing relationship problems with a friend of the same gender to whom they are attracted. And, with respect to her, it's not really a negotiation process. The two of you should work out between yourselves what the boundaries are, and then he communicates them, directly or indirectly, to her. She doesn't get a say, except of course in the sense that she's always free to reject the new conditions and break off the friendship. I am very big on the importance of friendship, but this is a situation where the relationship absolutely trumps the friendship.
posted by praemunire at 12:25 PM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
A person should not be discussing relationship problems with a friend of the same gender to whom they are attracted. And, with respect to her, it's not really a negotiation process. The two of you should work out between yourselves what the boundaries are, and then he communicates them, directly or indirectly, to her. She doesn't get a say, except of course in the sense that she's always free to reject the new conditions and break off the friendship. I am very big on the importance of friendship, but this is a situation where the relationship absolutely trumps the friendship.
posted by praemunire at 12:25 PM on March 15, 2018 [9 favorites]
When you've had cruddy relationships, it can feel like a giant leap forward to have a boyfriend who, as you wrote, "doesn’t get angry when I bring things up." The thing is, there are men out there who don't have massive porn consumption habits that need to be negotiated with their girlfriends. These men would have never made that 'mmmm" slavering sound in public, much less in public in the company of their significant others, having already realized the utter grossness of such behavior. Men who can last a day without a conversation with their ex-crushes.
You're a thoughtful, generous person willing to put in a great deal of effort to be a good partner. You're acting like you're a finishing school for immature young men, and, once they "graduate" (because few people want a gratitude-based romance), other women are going to reap the benefits of your hard work. (While you're left feeling less and less secure and confident in yourself and your abilities.) Keep sorting yourself out in therapy, pour your creative energies into a more fulfilling outlet, and date someone with similar values from the start.
posted by Iris Gambol at 1:12 PM on March 15, 2018 [18 favorites]
You're a thoughtful, generous person willing to put in a great deal of effort to be a good partner. You're acting like you're a finishing school for immature young men, and, once they "graduate" (because few people want a gratitude-based romance), other women are going to reap the benefits of your hard work. (While you're left feeling less and less secure and confident in yourself and your abilities.) Keep sorting yourself out in therapy, pour your creative energies into a more fulfilling outlet, and date someone with similar values from the start.
posted by Iris Gambol at 1:12 PM on March 15, 2018 [18 favorites]
it's strange to me that you call your own thoughts and behaviors "irrational" while not labelling his porn habits, model preferences, weird vocalizations and so on, irrational. The reason behind all his impulses and behaviors is going to be "because I want to" or, if the question is why do you want to, the reason is "because I just do." no rationality to be found, unless he's willing and able to consider his own conditioning and complicity with the social structures that perpetuate this conditioning upon other men. Does his lack of rationality make his thoughts and feelings therefore illegitimate or not worthy of being voiced to you?
I personally don't think you don't need a rational basis for your personal weird predilections and likes/dislikes/aversions. you may disagree; that's fair. but when you are carrying all these burdens of knowing about his distasteful habits and alienating arousal triggers, you have a right and a reason to wonder where are the signs that he's agonizing over burdening you with his inner life, the way you're agonizing over the mere idea of burdening him with yours.
I also know my feelings are valid, but at times can be irrational thinking.
take every statement like this and replace "my" with "his. His feelings and sexual behaviors are irrational; whether you consider them valid or not. they are no more rational than yours. and he's made you aware of them. please try to remember this when you're trying to work out how to limit yourself for his comfort. if you think you must do that for him, you can ask him to do it for you.
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:07 PM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
I personally don't think you don't need a rational basis for your personal weird predilections and likes/dislikes/aversions. you may disagree; that's fair. but when you are carrying all these burdens of knowing about his distasteful habits and alienating arousal triggers, you have a right and a reason to wonder where are the signs that he's agonizing over burdening you with his inner life, the way you're agonizing over the mere idea of burdening him with yours.
I also know my feelings are valid, but at times can be irrational thinking.
take every statement like this and replace "my" with "his. His feelings and sexual behaviors are irrational; whether you consider them valid or not. they are no more rational than yours. and he's made you aware of them. please try to remember this when you're trying to work out how to limit yourself for his comfort. if you think you must do that for him, you can ask him to do it for you.
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:07 PM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
Nothing about this dude sounds good. Honestly, you're doing yourself a disservice by staying with them.
Look, there are actually guys out there that don't watch porn. If you don't like a partner that is into porn, that's okay! It's not something all women who date men have to "deal with". Porn use in my opinion is part of sexual compatibility.
My husband and I both are not into porn. I couldn't date someone who was into porn. It's just.. not something I want in a person. There are also people who who don't use porn if their partner asks or they're in a relationship.
There are too many red flags about this dude and it's making you question your VALID feelings and totally NORMAL requests or relationship preferences. You're feeling insecure because he's not trustworthy.
I mean, he's talking to a crush EVERY DAY and somehow making you feel like it's something you just have to deal with? Nah, bro.
Don't date someone who have to monitor or feel insecure about. Date someone that makes you feel like their complete and total fantasy!
posted by Crystalinne at 4:46 PM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
Look, there are actually guys out there that don't watch porn. If you don't like a partner that is into porn, that's okay! It's not something all women who date men have to "deal with". Porn use in my opinion is part of sexual compatibility.
My husband and I both are not into porn. I couldn't date someone who was into porn. It's just.. not something I want in a person. There are also people who who don't use porn if their partner asks or they're in a relationship.
There are too many red flags about this dude and it's making you question your VALID feelings and totally NORMAL requests or relationship preferences. You're feeling insecure because he's not trustworthy.
I mean, he's talking to a crush EVERY DAY and somehow making you feel like it's something you just have to deal with? Nah, bro.
Don't date someone who have to monitor or feel insecure about. Date someone that makes you feel like their complete and total fantasy!
posted by Crystalinne at 4:46 PM on March 15, 2018 [7 favorites]
He probably will bring these conversations we have now to her though.
So, I know this probably just seems like a feature of your relationship that you're used to, with this person being open with certain friends, but to me this indicates an almost-complete lack of confidence you have in him. It may even be that you assume that nothing you say to him would stay between you, and that this is a normal way to have a relationship. It doesn't have to be. It's possible to have a two person relationship where you have all kinds of you-two things that you share, which is different than having a social circle that includes the person you currently bang.
posted by rhizome at 4:48 PM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
So, I know this probably just seems like a feature of your relationship that you're used to, with this person being open with certain friends, but to me this indicates an almost-complete lack of confidence you have in him. It may even be that you assume that nothing you say to him would stay between you, and that this is a normal way to have a relationship. It doesn't have to be. It's possible to have a two person relationship where you have all kinds of you-two things that you share, which is different than having a social circle that includes the person you currently bang.
posted by rhizome at 4:48 PM on March 15, 2018 [4 favorites]
Agreeing with others that your feelings are actually perfectly rational and reasonable. Both my husband and I are amazed that there are men out there who act like this. It is one thing to watch porn from time to time and quite another to act like your boyfriend does.
posted by thereader at 8:04 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by thereader at 8:04 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
Your follow-up question -- "If he asks why this bothers me, it’s ok to say because of his past behaviors (??)" -- suggests you're still not really "getting it," even after reading everyone's answers.
You're hoping you can give your partner a reason why their daily communication with "old crush/new friend" bothers you that's so fool-proof that your partner
a) won't think that you're asking for too much or that you're crazy and needy for feeling a certain way, and
b) will have no choice but to agree with you and adjust course, accordingly.
In good, healthy relationships, partners generally don't
a) think that the other person asks for too much or is crazy and needy,
b) contort themselves or their requests until they're in a gotcha point knot that means the other person will have no choice but to concede to and affirm a specific point of view or course of action.
If your partner conducts their friendships in ways that make you uncomfortable, you tell them that it makes you uncomfortable. And you can explain why to the best of your ability -- outlining all the reasons you've brought up here on metafilter, which some would say are perfectly "reasonable" and others might find "unreasonable," who cares -- because you feel confident that you're a fair-minded, thoughtful, comprising kind of lover. And then you can describe what would be a-okay with you on that front.
And you partner will either change how they conduct those friendships... or they won't, or they'll discover (and you will, too) that changing how they conduct those relationships does or doesn't help you to feel more secure in the relationship.
I'm not going to say whether how your partner conducts those friendships is okay or not. That's very specific to individual relationship dynamics.
But I will say: There's no fool-proof way to convince someone to be the kind of partner you need them to be.
You come to your partner as you are, and you see them as they are, and then you both get to decide if you two can make it work or not based on who you are and who you're willing to be.
posted by pinkacademic at 8:06 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
You're hoping you can give your partner a reason why their daily communication with "old crush/new friend" bothers you that's so fool-proof that your partner
a) won't think that you're asking for too much or that you're crazy and needy for feeling a certain way, and
b) will have no choice but to agree with you and adjust course, accordingly.
In good, healthy relationships, partners generally don't
a) think that the other person asks for too much or is crazy and needy,
b) contort themselves or their requests until they're in a gotcha point knot that means the other person will have no choice but to concede to and affirm a specific point of view or course of action.
If your partner conducts their friendships in ways that make you uncomfortable, you tell them that it makes you uncomfortable. And you can explain why to the best of your ability -- outlining all the reasons you've brought up here on metafilter, which some would say are perfectly "reasonable" and others might find "unreasonable," who cares -- because you feel confident that you're a fair-minded, thoughtful, comprising kind of lover. And then you can describe what would be a-okay with you on that front.
And you partner will either change how they conduct those friendships... or they won't, or they'll discover (and you will, too) that changing how they conduct those relationships does or doesn't help you to feel more secure in the relationship.
I'm not going to say whether how your partner conducts those friendships is okay or not. That's very specific to individual relationship dynamics.
But I will say: There's no fool-proof way to convince someone to be the kind of partner you need them to be.
You come to your partner as you are, and you see them as they are, and then you both get to decide if you two can make it work or not based on who you are and who you're willing to be.
posted by pinkacademic at 8:06 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
You wrote: He probably will bring these conversations we have now to her though.
See: For a certain type of guy, it's actually a thrill to put an insecure girlfriend and a woman he did/does want to be with together in social situations.
posted by jbenben at 10:09 PM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
See: For a certain type of guy, it's actually a thrill to put an insecure girlfriend and a woman he did/does want to be with together in social situations.
posted by jbenben at 10:09 PM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
I don’t want to burden them unnecessarily with my insecurities
Like, this is my insecurity to deal with, not yours?
But I feel like this is unfair, because I am having these anxious/insecure moments more frequently, and no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over.
I don't have a ton of relationship experience but if I found myself in a relationship in which I didn't feel OK to talk about my insecurities it would be over. Your partner should be the safest person in your life to talk to about your insecurities.
Remove the phrase "no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over" from your vocabulary completely. And I know. I know. I had that one for over forty years. I know.
Don't think about if you're bothering or burdening or inconveniencing someone. You don't have the time to think about how people are going to react to your behaviors. That is called setting someone else's boundaries and it doesn't work at all.
You have to trust that people will set their own boundaries and wait until they show them to you. If a partner doesn't set their own boundaries, many of us would tend to decide that we're bothering them if we text them during a work day. If you're in a relationship and the other person isn't communicating their boundaries, especially if you cross them, then they're probably not mature enough to be in a serious equal relationship.
Have you lived in a big city? Anything goes. Sometimes when I question whether I should do something I ask myself, "could I see a mentally ill person doing this on a street corner in New York or San Francisco?" Inevitably the answer is yes and I know that I'm 100% in the realm of the real world.
Please put yourself first. Don't ask if he should listen to you, demand that he do. If he won't then move on. There's someone else who will.
posted by bendy at 10:19 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
Like, this is my insecurity to deal with, not yours?
But I feel like this is unfair, because I am having these anxious/insecure moments more frequently, and no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over.
I don't have a ton of relationship experience but if I found myself in a relationship in which I didn't feel OK to talk about my insecurities it would be over. Your partner should be the safest person in your life to talk to about your insecurities.
Remove the phrase "no one deserves having that unpacked on them over and over" from your vocabulary completely. And I know. I know. I had that one for over forty years. I know.
Don't think about if you're bothering or burdening or inconveniencing someone. You don't have the time to think about how people are going to react to your behaviors. That is called setting someone else's boundaries and it doesn't work at all.
You have to trust that people will set their own boundaries and wait until they show them to you. If a partner doesn't set their own boundaries, many of us would tend to decide that we're bothering them if we text them during a work day. If you're in a relationship and the other person isn't communicating their boundaries, especially if you cross them, then they're probably not mature enough to be in a serious equal relationship.
Have you lived in a big city? Anything goes. Sometimes when I question whether I should do something I ask myself, "could I see a mentally ill person doing this on a street corner in New York or San Francisco?" Inevitably the answer is yes and I know that I'm 100% in the realm of the real world.
Please put yourself first. Don't ask if he should listen to you, demand that he do. If he won't then move on. There's someone else who will.
posted by bendy at 10:19 PM on March 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
What is reasonable to voice? What should you keep to yourself (and just tell your therapist or close friend instead)? How much should you reasonably expect for your partner to try to understand or is it just a burden? I don’t have any good relationship models (besides TV) and I am lost.
Good relationship models on TV are few and far between, because the entire point of TV is drama, and the entire point of a good relationship is the lack of it.
You know you're in a good relationship when you feel less uncertainty about bringing stuff up with your partner than you would with your therapist or close friend.
The single most important thing you can do in order to secure a good relationship is partner selection: some people are just intractably self-centred arseholes with no desire to become anything else, and these are not good relationship material. You can tell if your current partner is one of these if you usually find yourself feeling worse, not better, after talking out some difficult emotional issue with them.
posted by flabdablet at 11:14 PM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
Good relationship models on TV are few and far between, because the entire point of TV is drama, and the entire point of a good relationship is the lack of it.
You know you're in a good relationship when you feel less uncertainty about bringing stuff up with your partner than you would with your therapist or close friend.
The single most important thing you can do in order to secure a good relationship is partner selection: some people are just intractably self-centred arseholes with no desire to become anything else, and these are not good relationship material. You can tell if your current partner is one of these if you usually find yourself feeling worse, not better, after talking out some difficult emotional issue with them.
posted by flabdablet at 11:14 PM on March 15, 2018 [5 favorites]
One thing I've noticed is that when I spend more time sitting with my thoughts and anxieties in my head, rather than talking about them with the person they concern, I discount the value of simple information exchange. And, I can end up way far down the wrong pathway. When I don't talk to people about how I feel about something, they may have no idea it bugs me. In the absence of information, I might make up more and more specific theories about what's going on. And I might not bring it up until I'm to the point of wanting to demand action. It's better to lower the bar: to talk early on, seeking info, sharing your feelings, and hearing his feelings. schroedingersgirl and craven_morhead have great scripts.
posted by salvia at 12:07 AM on March 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by salvia at 12:07 AM on March 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
My past question talked about my suprising discomfort about his open porn/Snapchat nude models/instagram model usage. We addressed this and found a middle point. I still find myself irrationally bothered by it
A lot of the things that bother me seem to be internal. I know it’s a Me problem.
I disagree that the only problem is you or your feelings about this person's behavior. I think your feelings and boundaries are absolutely valid and that there isn't One Magical Standard! of what is and isn't acceptable behavior in a relationship. Boundaries should be an agreement between two people, not one person always taking and the other always giving. You shouldn't have to make yourself anxious and uncomfortable to fulfill someone else's idea of what relationship boundaries are acceptable.
There's nothing necessarily wrong with (most?) of what this person is doing, but there's also nothing necessarily wrong with your discomfort. The issue is the mismatch. That's something that I think you should talk about and work out (or not). There are people out there who will better match your reasonable expectations and boundaries, if this person won't.
posted by cnc at 2:00 PM on March 16, 2018
A lot of the things that bother me seem to be internal. I know it’s a Me problem.
I disagree that the only problem is you or your feelings about this person's behavior. I think your feelings and boundaries are absolutely valid and that there isn't One Magical Standard! of what is and isn't acceptable behavior in a relationship. Boundaries should be an agreement between two people, not one person always taking and the other always giving. You shouldn't have to make yourself anxious and uncomfortable to fulfill someone else's idea of what relationship boundaries are acceptable.
There's nothing necessarily wrong with (most?) of what this person is doing, but there's also nothing necessarily wrong with your discomfort. The issue is the mismatch. That's something that I think you should talk about and work out (or not). There are people out there who will better match your reasonable expectations and boundaries, if this person won't.
posted by cnc at 2:00 PM on March 16, 2018
This thread is closed to new comments.
It's not irrational at all, and crushing those feelings down is not being true to yourself. Yeah ok, a lot of men like porn. Also, decent men keep that shit private if their partners aren't into it. They don't go "mmm" in front of their partners and friends (?!)
As far as the friend goes, you know, you do what you want, but I shut that kind of thing down hard when my relationship got serious, and we're both glad I did. People will tell you that you need to not infringe on your partner's friendships; but we all know there are friendships and friendships, and ones that involve crushes should be scaled back, not up, when a person is partnered.
What I'm saying is that instead of worrying about how you can pretzel yourself up to crush your feelings down, or continue processing and worrying incessantly, you should be deciding where your own comfort limits are and communicating THOSE to your partner.
posted by fingersandtoes at 9:46 AM on March 15, 2018 [71 favorites]