My career just crashed into a wall, and now I need to pick up the pieces
January 30, 2018 4:53 PM Subscribe
There are plenty of jobs out there that I could do, but I can't move to them. This is proving insanely difficult for a job hunt. I'm starting to panic because I have no idea how to translate my skill-set to another job, let alone something that could be a career. I've never really shifted careers before, and am functionally clueless. I don't know how to identify what skills I have that will translate into another career path.
I've been a coffee roaster for most of the last 10 years, and this was me a year and a half ago. Turned out, I got damn lucky and ended up landing a couple jobs in coffee; one as a production manager at a large, highly dysfunctional facility, and jumped ship as soon as I could for a job as head roaster for a highly financially irresponsible company that couldn't afford to keep me on. My local coffee-roasting market is both saturated and fragmenting; the jobs aren't there unless I can start my own shop. I do not have a suitcase of money to start up a business (nor do I necessarily think I have the constitution for owning my own business. Not right now at least). I saw the writing on the wall over a year ago, and because of some mental health things I was working through, couldn't focus on career development. We have money saved, so this is not an emergency (yet) other than a mental one.
I've seen plenty of jobs in my field, but they're not local to me and I cannot move. My wife has an excellent job that is not portable at all (even at our highest wages, she's almost always doubled my salary, she's the breadwinner for sure). I am geographically bound to the Portland Oregon metro area. I have one weird, possible, theoretical, not really 'real yet' potential job that might materialize in the spring, but it's a long-shot to begin with and just feels like staving off the inevitable again.
I don't know what to do. I can write a fairly legit resume (so I've been told), I can write creative, eye grabbing cover letters that 'read the room' pretty well (so I've been told). I can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on. I send out 15+ resumes and tailored cover letters a week since getting laid off, but the jobs I'm applying for I know I don't have a shot in hell at getting. I mean I'm not even really getting calls back on Admin assistant jobs.
I'm using most of my mental bandwidth not to panic and let my anxiety just take the wheel, I can't come up with any sort of creative path out of this hot mess. I need help actually coming up with a plan, and I have no idea where to go, or what to do. I really hate feeling this clueless (because that also feeds the anxiety), but I am. I'm just straight clueless when it comes to how to tailor a career while you're bound to a specific market.
Other sundries:
-My network locally is pretty good, but tapped out. Everyone is bummed, and surprised that I can't find work. If a job comes up, I have plenty of folks that will vouch and support me there. It just doesn't seem like the jobs are actually there.
-I am in therapy, but my therapist has no concrete ideas to help with this concrete problem (nor is it really her job).
-I have gone to career counselors in the past, and the result is usually a raft of personality tests, advice to network better, and tell me to get on linkedin (which I am on, but loathe). I have never had concrete, functional advice or action come out of these kinds of counselors, and holy fuck are they expensive.
-The University I graduated from has been less than helpful. It's been like 11 years, they don't want to deal with me anymore. I've only tangentially used my degree to begin with.
-Speaking of my University; I just paid off my student loans, and would love to avoid taking more out, unless it could straight guarantee a damn high paying job upon graduating. I'm not opposed to retraining, and I am expecting it, I just would like to avoid a full on degree.
-The unemployment office is...well, less than helpful. I brought in all my resume and cover letter templates and they said everything was better than they'd seen, and there was nothing they could really do for me.
What's a mid 30's dude supposed to do to try and find somewhat decent pay, some modicum of stability, and in a perfect world a family-friendly schedule in Portland, Oregon?
For reasons I didn't want to get into for the last ask on this topic, consulting isn't a viable option, even for piecemeal work. It would be great if I could, but the market is currently not there. I have done splinters of consulting work for people. I might continue to do so, but consulting in this field is already kind of bananas, and at the level I could do it, beer-money compared to a full time job.
I've been a coffee roaster for most of the last 10 years, and this was me a year and a half ago. Turned out, I got damn lucky and ended up landing a couple jobs in coffee; one as a production manager at a large, highly dysfunctional facility, and jumped ship as soon as I could for a job as head roaster for a highly financially irresponsible company that couldn't afford to keep me on. My local coffee-roasting market is both saturated and fragmenting; the jobs aren't there unless I can start my own shop. I do not have a suitcase of money to start up a business (nor do I necessarily think I have the constitution for owning my own business. Not right now at least). I saw the writing on the wall over a year ago, and because of some mental health things I was working through, couldn't focus on career development. We have money saved, so this is not an emergency (yet) other than a mental one.
I've seen plenty of jobs in my field, but they're not local to me and I cannot move. My wife has an excellent job that is not portable at all (even at our highest wages, she's almost always doubled my salary, she's the breadwinner for sure). I am geographically bound to the Portland Oregon metro area. I have one weird, possible, theoretical, not really 'real yet' potential job that might materialize in the spring, but it's a long-shot to begin with and just feels like staving off the inevitable again.
I don't know what to do. I can write a fairly legit resume (so I've been told), I can write creative, eye grabbing cover letters that 'read the room' pretty well (so I've been told). I can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on. I send out 15+ resumes and tailored cover letters a week since getting laid off, but the jobs I'm applying for I know I don't have a shot in hell at getting. I mean I'm not even really getting calls back on Admin assistant jobs.
I'm using most of my mental bandwidth not to panic and let my anxiety just take the wheel, I can't come up with any sort of creative path out of this hot mess. I need help actually coming up with a plan, and I have no idea where to go, or what to do. I really hate feeling this clueless (because that also feeds the anxiety), but I am. I'm just straight clueless when it comes to how to tailor a career while you're bound to a specific market.
Other sundries:
-My network locally is pretty good, but tapped out. Everyone is bummed, and surprised that I can't find work. If a job comes up, I have plenty of folks that will vouch and support me there. It just doesn't seem like the jobs are actually there.
-I am in therapy, but my therapist has no concrete ideas to help with this concrete problem (nor is it really her job).
-I have gone to career counselors in the past, and the result is usually a raft of personality tests, advice to network better, and tell me to get on linkedin (which I am on, but loathe). I have never had concrete, functional advice or action come out of these kinds of counselors, and holy fuck are they expensive.
-The University I graduated from has been less than helpful. It's been like 11 years, they don't want to deal with me anymore. I've only tangentially used my degree to begin with.
-Speaking of my University; I just paid off my student loans, and would love to avoid taking more out, unless it could straight guarantee a damn high paying job upon graduating. I'm not opposed to retraining, and I am expecting it, I just would like to avoid a full on degree.
-The unemployment office is...well, less than helpful. I brought in all my resume and cover letter templates and they said everything was better than they'd seen, and there was nothing they could really do for me.
What's a mid 30's dude supposed to do to try and find somewhat decent pay, some modicum of stability, and in a perfect world a family-friendly schedule in Portland, Oregon?
For reasons I didn't want to get into for the last ask on this topic, consulting isn't a viable option, even for piecemeal work. It would be great if I could, but the market is currently not there. I have done splinters of consulting work for people. I might continue to do so, but consulting in this field is already kind of bananas, and at the level I could do it, beer-money compared to a full time job.
Sounds to me like you're at least familiar with concepts of supply chain and agri-sourcing, quality control in processing materials. It also sounds from your previous post like you like that work and meeting people. That makes me think of CSAs, beermaking, flowers - all big in the PacNW. Grocery stores? Point being, I think you do need to get creative with where you're looking. So understanding how those industries compartmentalize the work.
Given the sprawl I know of Portland, you might need to think a little wider in your searches - a lot of the wholesaler/light industrial have probably had to flee Portland proper due to rising rents. Can the roasters even afford to exist downtown?
Lastly, I've been considering posting on a similar topic - I'm working but my wife is struggling to find anything...for years. No one looks at applications, no one cold-reads resumes. She has 15 years of great experience, and no. one. cares. It is absolutely a networking game, and clawing your way back in from a period of demoralized search exhaustion feels impossible. Strange to be in a time of "extremely low unemployment," with a ton of folks struggling to get even basic callbacks on earnest job searches. I can wish you nothing but luck.
posted by SoundInhabitant at 6:16 PM on January 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
Given the sprawl I know of Portland, you might need to think a little wider in your searches - a lot of the wholesaler/light industrial have probably had to flee Portland proper due to rising rents. Can the roasters even afford to exist downtown?
Lastly, I've been considering posting on a similar topic - I'm working but my wife is struggling to find anything...for years. No one looks at applications, no one cold-reads resumes. She has 15 years of great experience, and no. one. cares. It is absolutely a networking game, and clawing your way back in from a period of demoralized search exhaustion feels impossible. Strange to be in a time of "extremely low unemployment," with a ton of folks struggling to get even basic callbacks on earnest job searches. I can wish you nothing but luck.
posted by SoundInhabitant at 6:16 PM on January 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
They get hired on at Amazon. Oh you think I jest! It'll solve money woes and tickle that inner "get-better-at-task-over-time" bug of yours with the bonus of having vague titles that sound impressive elsewhere as you are looking for the long-time gig. I actually want to put it out there - look into being Production Supervisor at other manufacturing companies with good benefits, great work/life balance and employee satisfaction. Branch out into any food-based work environment. Then, throw those resumes into every pool - healthcare, logistics, facilities management, you name it.
Your description of your enjoyment of previous employment speaks to so many industries. People will be hungry for you - you just have to put the right bait out in front of them.
As an education aside, look into 2 year degrees that are high-demand in your area. Find something that sounds fascinating to you and look into all potential transfers from previous degree and life experience. Investing in a workforce degree to give you flexibility on your employment situation is little risk for a bigger return, as long as you research your area's needs for those degrees and compare to your willingness to go through school once more.
posted by missh at 6:22 PM on January 30, 2018
Your description of your enjoyment of previous employment speaks to so many industries. People will be hungry for you - you just have to put the right bait out in front of them.
As an education aside, look into 2 year degrees that are high-demand in your area. Find something that sounds fascinating to you and look into all potential transfers from previous degree and life experience. Investing in a workforce degree to give you flexibility on your employment situation is little risk for a bigger return, as long as you research your area's needs for those degrees and compare to your willingness to go through school once more.
posted by missh at 6:22 PM on January 30, 2018
I haven't got much helpful for you, but I've just come off a couple of years of massive underemployment and I know it can be really corrosive. You sound like you'd be a great production manager for someone. In the few words you shared, you clearly understand process and budget. Your 10 years experience means you can very likely get on with other people and know how to get them to work well. It doesn't matter too much if it's a very different product from coffee roasting: they've all got people/process/budget/time constraints.
AskMe, though I love it as a brother, can get a bit too You must send out X many cold letters every day or you will neeeeever beee employyyeddddd ... blamey at times. This didn't help dispel the fear soup that kept me at home fretting about my unproductivity. What did help was going out and doing stuff: asking to meet people, have a coffee, and ask about what they do. It didn't have to be an industry I was interested in: I just wanted to know what people did and what they found fulfilling.
It takes a while to feel relaxed and out of work, but it can be very freeing knowing that - for a certain time, at least - your time's your own. Make art. Do cheap fun stuff. Hang out at that coffee place on the corner once a week. Cook dinner, grocery shop and do laundry. Above all, be kind to yourself. This isn't your fault. It's your time to recharge.
After a while I got a part time minimum wage gig that was way below my experience, but was fun and almost covered my outgoings. A chance interaction lead me to stick around to hear the last speaker at a community conference talk about her work in open source assistive technology and how her group needed local organizers. I now work in an area I would never have thought of, but it's rewarding and a huge difference from all the corporate crap I waded through before.
posted by scruss at 6:43 PM on January 30, 2018 [11 favorites]
AskMe, though I love it as a brother, can get a bit too You must send out X many cold letters every day or you will neeeeever beee employyyeddddd ... blamey at times. This didn't help dispel the fear soup that kept me at home fretting about my unproductivity. What did help was going out and doing stuff: asking to meet people, have a coffee, and ask about what they do. It didn't have to be an industry I was interested in: I just wanted to know what people did and what they found fulfilling.
It takes a while to feel relaxed and out of work, but it can be very freeing knowing that - for a certain time, at least - your time's your own. Make art. Do cheap fun stuff. Hang out at that coffee place on the corner once a week. Cook dinner, grocery shop and do laundry. Above all, be kind to yourself. This isn't your fault. It's your time to recharge.
After a while I got a part time minimum wage gig that was way below my experience, but was fun and almost covered my outgoings. A chance interaction lead me to stick around to hear the last speaker at a community conference talk about her work in open source assistive technology and how her group needed local organizers. I now work in an area I would never have thought of, but it's rewarding and a huge difference from all the corporate crap I waded through before.
posted by scruss at 6:43 PM on January 30, 2018 [11 favorites]
By targeting everything, it makes it much harder to figure out what to do specifically. Could you identify some aspects of your roasting job that would apply to other industries - other parts of the food industry, other production-related industries, big local employers like Amazon, Nike, Intel? It seems like "production manager" experience could be transferable even if you aren't expertly getting that perfect roast.
Sending in resumes cold is so hard and so terrible. Extend the concept of "your network" beyond your friends to all the weak ties - acquaintances, not friends. They're the ones who can often make new connections. Your friends tend to know the same people (and openings) you do. People help out near-strangers all the time - it's weird.
Sounds like you're doing all the right things, but for folks who wonder what "networking" really means, it's something like: (1) update your LinkedIn profile to emphasize results and common skills - less about coffee, more about delivered quality results, solved logistics, inventory, and sourcing problems, (2) find all those companies in the Portland area; (3) use LinkedIn and your personal network to find people in production in those companies; say Yes to every, "I know somebody at company X"; (4) here's the hard part for most - call up that production manager at, say, "John's Red Mill" and ask for an informational interview because you're looking at career transitions. Pretty common; worst that can happen is they say no; (5) if possible, go to local industry events and shake hands.
2. Also think about how your skill set might translate to corporate employers - Amazon, Nike, Intel, etc. and work your network for those companies.
posted by troyer at 6:50 PM on January 30, 2018
Sending in resumes cold is so hard and so terrible. Extend the concept of "your network" beyond your friends to all the weak ties - acquaintances, not friends. They're the ones who can often make new connections. Your friends tend to know the same people (and openings) you do. People help out near-strangers all the time - it's weird.
Sounds like you're doing all the right things, but for folks who wonder what "networking" really means, it's something like: (1) update your LinkedIn profile to emphasize results and common skills - less about coffee, more about delivered quality results, solved logistics, inventory, and sourcing problems, (2) find all those companies in the Portland area; (3) use LinkedIn and your personal network to find people in production in those companies; say Yes to every, "I know somebody at company X"; (4) here's the hard part for most - call up that production manager at, say, "John's Red Mill" and ask for an informational interview because you're looking at career transitions. Pretty common; worst that can happen is they say no; (5) if possible, go to local industry events and shake hands.
2. Also think about how your skill set might translate to corporate employers - Amazon, Nike, Intel, etc. and work your network for those companies.
posted by troyer at 6:50 PM on January 30, 2018
Masters in accounting. There are one year programs out there where your all in cost will be less than $25k. Unless the economy completely implodes before next summer you'll be making around $65k to start if you do reasonably well in school.
For the moment, the big accounting firms still have a very strong school->associate pipeline and a couple of the smaller ones are now offering competitive salaries also.
The downside to this is that your first two years of work will be basically nonstop and grueling, but there is much room for growth and it gets much easier once you aren't only doing grunt work.
posted by wierdo at 6:51 PM on January 30, 2018
For the moment, the big accounting firms still have a very strong school->associate pipeline and a couple of the smaller ones are now offering competitive salaries also.
The downside to this is that your first two years of work will be basically nonstop and grueling, but there is much room for growth and it gets much easier once you aren't only doing grunt work.
posted by wierdo at 6:51 PM on January 30, 2018
Sorry, that came off a bit ridiculously without any explanation. Since you had mentioned possible career transitions and you're good at tracking process issues, it sounds like a career in audit might work for you, and it's generally not too bad in terms of classes needed to get the degree if you took a decently broad set of classes in undergrad.
posted by wierdo at 8:02 PM on January 30, 2018
posted by wierdo at 8:02 PM on January 30, 2018
I can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on
Sorry if I'm taking this too literally, but if that's what you're doing, that's why it's not working. it is the wrong approach so just doing it better and better won't help anything. Don't give a pitch about why you have good reasons for wanting to leave the career you used to have; give one about why you want to do the job you're interviewing for.
nobody with an open position wants to know why you're making the right decision not to do some other job. even if they ask you that, it's not what they want to know. they want to hear something plausible about why you want to do this job, and why you won't quit in six months. if you can't say that in a sincere and convincing way, respond by explaining why you would do the job really well, and pretend it's answering whatever they asked.
and you're not leaving the coffee roasting field, you're staying in the people/production/project management field. or in the customer service/retail/food industry, adjusted for whatever job it is you're trying to get. as long as you're just looking for any decent job in the short to medium term, do not explain it as a radical career change even though that's what it is for you, it will rarely be a selling point and you also don't have to.
and if you're already doing all that, just keep applying to jobs that seem above you, not just ones that seem beneath you. somewhere close by is a hiring manager who is just some confused kid who has to fill an open slot by a deadline and wants to be told by a confident person that they can do the thing. I have no idea what a head coffee roaster/production manager does on an hour-to-hour daily basis, except it sounds cool, and neither do a lot of people. you can use this to your advantage.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:50 PM on January 30, 2018 [15 favorites]
Sorry if I'm taking this too literally, but if that's what you're doing, that's why it's not working. it is the wrong approach so just doing it better and better won't help anything. Don't give a pitch about why you have good reasons for wanting to leave the career you used to have; give one about why you want to do the job you're interviewing for.
nobody with an open position wants to know why you're making the right decision not to do some other job. even if they ask you that, it's not what they want to know. they want to hear something plausible about why you want to do this job, and why you won't quit in six months. if you can't say that in a sincere and convincing way, respond by explaining why you would do the job really well, and pretend it's answering whatever they asked.
and you're not leaving the coffee roasting field, you're staying in the people/production/project management field. or in the customer service/retail/food industry, adjusted for whatever job it is you're trying to get. as long as you're just looking for any decent job in the short to medium term, do not explain it as a radical career change even though that's what it is for you, it will rarely be a selling point and you also don't have to.
and if you're already doing all that, just keep applying to jobs that seem above you, not just ones that seem beneath you. somewhere close by is a hiring manager who is just some confused kid who has to fill an open slot by a deadline and wants to be told by a confident person that they can do the thing. I have no idea what a head coffee roaster/production manager does on an hour-to-hour daily basis, except it sounds cool, and neither do a lot of people. you can use this to your advantage.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:50 PM on January 30, 2018 [15 favorites]
Go to askamanager.com and look at the suggestions for resume writing, etc. She gives great advice.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 9:05 PM on January 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 9:05 PM on January 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
Applying for all the jobs is a waste of time. Apply for jobs you want* and know you will be good at, or at least mostly qualified for. Your confidence and assertiveness will come over well in the interview even in a related field. I think that Portland is quite a good place to look for other small production jobs that are very similar, although I agree with you a lot of those small businesses are run by dopes and this might be the time to move away. Still, there is a lot to be said for someone who can take charge of a thing and run it and make it work, that's a transferable skill right there. The best advice for resumes is to get a friend in the field who hires people to look at yours. I do this a lot for my peeps.
*There are various degrees of want. Sometimes you just want to make rent.
posted by fshgrl at 9:29 PM on January 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
*There are various degrees of want. Sometimes you just want to make rent.
posted by fshgrl at 9:29 PM on January 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on.
this grabbed my attention - and someone else above also commented on it. I think this is a dead end, to try and explain to a future employer why you want start over. Instead identify all the transferable skills you have.
I changed my career track two times, first time over 20 years ago, and a second time some 15 years ago for entirely different reasons than you but basically because I needed and wanted to change my life.
The first time was actually at a point in my life when I was extremely low (the "career" I needed to leave behind was fundamentalist missionary). I saw no future, however my therapist at the time encouraged me to list all skills not directly job related (eg for me one of the things was fluency in English). Of course it was not sufficient to claim the skill, so I went ahead and did the Cambridge Proficiency exam which in my country is the most widely accepted standard certificate for English proficiency. I listed the skills I had accummulated, and built a skill based resume from that. I think the idea to hire a resume writer is great! I started out temping, and wqithin 6 months I had permanent position.
I was at the time truly bad at selling myself, awkward in interviews clinically depressed etc but looking at my skills rather than at 13 years wasted as a missionary and then another year spent in bed with deep depression, brought me over that hill and rebuilt my self esteem enough to reenter the workforce.
I would say look at the skills you accumulated in 10 years of coffee roasting (it sounds intriguing to be honest), and take out the coffee (like I took out the fundamentalism) and if possible look at ways to get those skills certified.
When I changed careers the second time it was somewhat easier (having done it before) but again, what was useful was looking at the transferable skills and focus on them.
Be kind to yourself.
posted by 15L06 at 2:41 AM on January 31, 2018 [4 favorites]
this grabbed my attention - and someone else above also commented on it. I think this is a dead end, to try and explain to a future employer why you want start over. Instead identify all the transferable skills you have.
I changed my career track two times, first time over 20 years ago, and a second time some 15 years ago for entirely different reasons than you but basically because I needed and wanted to change my life.
The first time was actually at a point in my life when I was extremely low (the "career" I needed to leave behind was fundamentalist missionary). I saw no future, however my therapist at the time encouraged me to list all skills not directly job related (eg for me one of the things was fluency in English). Of course it was not sufficient to claim the skill, so I went ahead and did the Cambridge Proficiency exam which in my country is the most widely accepted standard certificate for English proficiency. I listed the skills I had accummulated, and built a skill based resume from that. I think the idea to hire a resume writer is great! I started out temping, and wqithin 6 months I had permanent position.
I was at the time truly bad at selling myself, awkward in interviews clinically depressed etc but looking at my skills rather than at 13 years wasted as a missionary and then another year spent in bed with deep depression, brought me over that hill and rebuilt my self esteem enough to reenter the workforce.
I would say look at the skills you accumulated in 10 years of coffee roasting (it sounds intriguing to be honest), and take out the coffee (like I took out the fundamentalism) and if possible look at ways to get those skills certified.
When I changed careers the second time it was somewhat easier (having done it before) but again, what was useful was looking at the transferable skills and focus on them.
Be kind to yourself.
posted by 15L06 at 2:41 AM on January 31, 2018 [4 favorites]
You need to think about how your fundamentals are transferrable. What greater category does your expertise fall into? Managing people in an industrial setting? Supply chain/sourcing? Grocery product retail logistics? Restaurant management? I know very little about the coffee business so I'm only guessing. My point is that you need to search for roles in those greater categories, where your experience is applicable.
Under no circumstances should you think of this as "starting over." Think, and write your resume, in terms of the categories of experience you have and how you can leverage it to help a prospective employer (not how it can help you. They don't care about that.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 6:21 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
Under no circumstances should you think of this as "starting over." Think, and write your resume, in terms of the categories of experience you have and how you can leverage it to help a prospective employer (not how it can help you. They don't care about that.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 6:21 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
I do not know what you want to shift into, but Providence is hiring for many roles and once you're in, you'd have access to other opportunities. OHSU would be another prime target I'd think. Large operations will have plenty of places your skills would be applicable to, while giving you the chance to learn another industry. They will have orientations and training to assist you in the new role. It is important to focus on why you want to work there in interviews in my experience - what is it you've heard or read about the org that made you apply? Yes, in reality you just want a job, but find something to talk about. I like that OHSU received the Knight money and is doing innovative cancer research and want to be a part of that, etc.
posted by OneSmartMonkey at 7:24 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by OneSmartMonkey at 7:24 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
My whole professional life has been about remaking myself into new careers. Almost all of that was precipitated by changes in whatever industry I was in such that there was contraction, layoffs, etc.. But, also, I'm interested in a lot of different things and while right now I am the happiest I've been in any career or job, I'm still thinking about the "next thing."
The notes above about talking about why you are making the career shift is a total dead-end in interviews and conversations is so right on. For awhile, I was doing three "jobs" at once trying to piece things together and I was pretty enthusiastic about all of them and in conversations about landing a job, sometimes I'd weave them altogether and I see people kind of glaze over. Because, I think, it was overwhelming to take in all this information and the people I was speaking to didn't know what to do with it. No one will think as critically about your life as you do. Don't ask them to!
Once I identified what I was really going for (which is tough when it feels like the path is just wide open and once a real option presents itself, you'd be just as happy pursuing that as path A, B, C, or D), I was able to more finely tune my pitch. Tune your pitch to the person you are with. If they are in industry X, talk to them about what kind of role you could see yourself in in industry X. I took a 2-1/2 year career side road (different industry and different skillset) and then swerved back into a previous career (though on another track) and have used my skills on the side road to great effect. But I had to identify what I could do in that industry and find friends who could help me there.
Don't give up. One thing that helped me a lot in my job search is feeling confident in my core skills (creativity, working with people, organization and interest in strategy) and feeling very sure about how I wanted my life to be (working with good people). When you talk to people, look forward, not back and really listen to them. And, yeah, take care of yourself! When you start feeling crazy, run around the block.
posted by amanda at 8:22 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
The notes above about talking about why you are making the career shift is a total dead-end in interviews and conversations is so right on. For awhile, I was doing three "jobs" at once trying to piece things together and I was pretty enthusiastic about all of them and in conversations about landing a job, sometimes I'd weave them altogether and I see people kind of glaze over. Because, I think, it was overwhelming to take in all this information and the people I was speaking to didn't know what to do with it. No one will think as critically about your life as you do. Don't ask them to!
Once I identified what I was really going for (which is tough when it feels like the path is just wide open and once a real option presents itself, you'd be just as happy pursuing that as path A, B, C, or D), I was able to more finely tune my pitch. Tune your pitch to the person you are with. If they are in industry X, talk to them about what kind of role you could see yourself in in industry X. I took a 2-1/2 year career side road (different industry and different skillset) and then swerved back into a previous career (though on another track) and have used my skills on the side road to great effect. But I had to identify what I could do in that industry and find friends who could help me there.
Don't give up. One thing that helped me a lot in my job search is feeling confident in my core skills (creativity, working with people, organization and interest in strategy) and feeling very sure about how I wanted my life to be (working with good people). When you talk to people, look forward, not back and really listen to them. And, yeah, take care of yourself! When you start feeling crazy, run around the block.
posted by amanda at 8:22 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
In my humble experience, "networking" with acquaintances or stranger at industry meetups or whatever very close to fruitless. It's the equivalent of Facebook messages with childhood friends saying "We should meet up some time!" that never really materialize in meet space.
What does work is good old nepotism. Make sure your family, in-laws, and chosen family (if you have friends that are that tight) know you are looking for a job and see if someone can get you pulled in to a company. I've found this especially works in university and hospital systems. if you happen to get in one of those, take even some small dumb job like campus mail because once you're in its magnitudes easier to get one of the better jobs from the inside after 18 - 24 months.
posted by WeekendJen at 8:55 AM on January 31, 2018
What does work is good old nepotism. Make sure your family, in-laws, and chosen family (if you have friends that are that tight) know you are looking for a job and see if someone can get you pulled in to a company. I've found this especially works in university and hospital systems. if you happen to get in one of those, take even some small dumb job like campus mail because once you're in its magnitudes easier to get one of the better jobs from the inside after 18 - 24 months.
posted by WeekendJen at 8:55 AM on January 31, 2018
I agree. Let nepotism work for you! The older you get, the better connected your contacts are. You should look back over your co-worker network and see who you liked to work with and what they are doing, where they are at and ping the good ones for a meetup. I could not have gotten onto my weird career change without an inside connection who vouched for me. And when you do meet up be open, generous, inquisitive and thinking. Be able to state what you are looking for, "Someplace where I can use the skills I developed doing X which has a path for advancement and where the people are good."
posted by amanda at 9:26 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by amanda at 9:26 AM on January 31, 2018 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: This is all pretty helpful advice, and I'm still digging into it all.
I'd like to clarify the line "I can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on." Interviewers are specifically asking, I'm not bringing it up. I've been getting some really specific questions as to why I'm leaving that career track. One interview I went on was for a relatively adjacent food manufacturing production manager position, and even they were like "Woah, why not coffee anymore Mr. coffee guy?" Coffee roasting is kind of a weird, fetishized dream job for a lot of people, so it has this weird cache with it, especially it seems in Portland, and it makes no sense for lots of folks why one would duck out of it (this is almost doubly so for food industry folks).
posted by furnace.heart at 9:28 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
I'd like to clarify the line "I can explain why I want to leave this career track and 'start over,' but that conversation doesn't seem to be playing on the few interviews I've gone on." Interviewers are specifically asking, I'm not bringing it up. I've been getting some really specific questions as to why I'm leaving that career track. One interview I went on was for a relatively adjacent food manufacturing production manager position, and even they were like "Woah, why not coffee anymore Mr. coffee guy?" Coffee roasting is kind of a weird, fetishized dream job for a lot of people, so it has this weird cache with it, especially it seems in Portland, and it makes no sense for lots of folks why one would duck out of it (this is almost doubly so for food industry folks).
posted by furnace.heart at 9:28 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
Have a quick canned answer to that. Your real answer is fine! "Coffee's great. I've loved my time in coffee but it's real niche and there's not a lot of room to move up, and I'm ready to apply my experience in a [bigger/different/less niche/more exotic -- tailor to the opportunity] role."
posted by fingersandtoes at 9:52 AM on January 31, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by fingersandtoes at 9:52 AM on January 31, 2018 [3 favorites]
I'm in Portland. Have you considered looking for beer/brewing related positions? I understand that beer brewing is appreciably different than roasting, but both are "food" production. You're probably more trainable than most given your background. But I can also imagine that this market is also hard to break into, saturated, and low paying.
The other thought that comes to mind is the weed/marijuana industry. Outside of the actual plant cultivation/harvesting, there are many companies here doing infused food production and distillates/concentrate production. I don't have any more info that, sorry.
posted by TomFoolery at 9:53 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
The other thought that comes to mind is the weed/marijuana industry. Outside of the actual plant cultivation/harvesting, there are many companies here doing infused food production and distillates/concentrate production. I don't have any more info that, sorry.
posted by TomFoolery at 9:53 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
> ... a weird, fetishized dream job for a lot of people
Amen to that. I too was in an industry - renewable energy - that most people couldn't conceive wasn't the best thing ever, they wouldn't believe that I wasn't about to up sticks and move out west just to follow some jobs for a couple of years, and worst of all, they wouldn't respect that perhaps my 20-ish years experience in the industry meant that I knew the internal dynamics way better than some outside casual advisor might. It was exhausting.
posted by scruss at 2:57 PM on January 31, 2018
Amen to that. I too was in an industry - renewable energy - that most people couldn't conceive wasn't the best thing ever, they wouldn't believe that I wasn't about to up sticks and move out west just to follow some jobs for a couple of years, and worst of all, they wouldn't respect that perhaps my 20-ish years experience in the industry meant that I knew the internal dynamics way better than some outside casual advisor might. It was exhausting.
posted by scruss at 2:57 PM on January 31, 2018
This thread is closed to new comments.
A concrete tip - get very familiar with the STAR type of panel interviews. Even if that's not how people you run into interview, it's a great way to think about interviewing. Make sure your stories are you focused while also making sure they explain specifically why you're a good fit for them (instead of general, here's where I've been and here's where I can see myself and i'm curious about this job, etc). Think of specific stories of management or conflict avoidance/solving or how your skills at [abc coffee] will directly translate to [new industry that is nowhere near coffee]. Think of it like an algebra problem - your interviewers don't care about X, but they do care about Y, so you have to work out how to convert X into Y+2. Tell them why your career path up to know makes you a better candidate than those with all the traditional experience. It won't work on everyone, but it will land you in the right type of place.
posted by I'm Not Even Supposed To Be Here Today! at 5:34 PM on January 30, 2018 [10 favorites]