My girlfriend wants to have a child next year. I'm not sure.
October 3, 2017 5:09 AM Subscribe
My partner has proposed the idea of having a child next year. I'm unsure about the idea.
I'm 37, she is 32. I love her, we get on well. We have been together about 2 years.
I want what is best for her. So on the one hand, I'm willing to put aside my doubts for her sake. But on the other hand, I think she deserves someone who is not on the fence. I worry she is 'spending' these critical years with someone who is unsuitable for her.
If I get her hopes up about this, is a non-zero chance I will change my mind by next year (I often change my mind about things) which is wasting her precious time. So if I am not 100% about this, I worry that we should part. But this makes me very sad as I feel we are more compatible in most other ways, than anyone I've ever met.
We differ slightly on approaches to money. She is fairly standard, works a steady job etc. I have a bit of an 'early retirement' fetish. So my preference is to spend very little and save hard. At current rate of spending (30k a year) I could now retire next year based on 'current' spending. A child would change this drastically, and I worry about my future employability. My current gig has a short shelf life.
On the plus side, a kid would mean extra challenge, a reason to work, to leave the house every day, more motivation. On the negative side, I've never held down a real job before.
My family has a history of mental health issues, including myself, and I worry that I would be ill suited to raising a child who also suffered similar issues to myself and my parents. Family get togethers are often quite emotionally draining and if my own new family was even slightly similar to this, I don't think I would necessarily enjoy the experience.
I have a deep anxiety over of marriage, not related to my partner, but more generically, things like the ceremony, divorce, split of assets, and worry that if I have doubts over this level of commitment, should I really be committing to a child?
I could write a lot, lot more, but I am interested to hear other perspectives so will keep it a little vague. Any thoughts gratefully received.
I'm 37, she is 32. I love her, we get on well. We have been together about 2 years.
I want what is best for her. So on the one hand, I'm willing to put aside my doubts for her sake. But on the other hand, I think she deserves someone who is not on the fence. I worry she is 'spending' these critical years with someone who is unsuitable for her.
If I get her hopes up about this, is a non-zero chance I will change my mind by next year (I often change my mind about things) which is wasting her precious time. So if I am not 100% about this, I worry that we should part. But this makes me very sad as I feel we are more compatible in most other ways, than anyone I've ever met.
We differ slightly on approaches to money. She is fairly standard, works a steady job etc. I have a bit of an 'early retirement' fetish. So my preference is to spend very little and save hard. At current rate of spending (30k a year) I could now retire next year based on 'current' spending. A child would change this drastically, and I worry about my future employability. My current gig has a short shelf life.
On the plus side, a kid would mean extra challenge, a reason to work, to leave the house every day, more motivation. On the negative side, I've never held down a real job before.
My family has a history of mental health issues, including myself, and I worry that I would be ill suited to raising a child who also suffered similar issues to myself and my parents. Family get togethers are often quite emotionally draining and if my own new family was even slightly similar to this, I don't think I would necessarily enjoy the experience.
I have a deep anxiety over of marriage, not related to my partner, but more generically, things like the ceremony, divorce, split of assets, and worry that if I have doubts over this level of commitment, should I really be committing to a child?
I could write a lot, lot more, but I am interested to hear other perspectives so will keep it a little vague. Any thoughts gratefully received.
Sorry to be adding questions to the pile, and not answers, but these seem relevant:
- Do you (ever/sometimes) enjoy the company of children? Do you ever think that being a parent could be fun?
- Have you considered being a/the stay-at-home parent? If not, why not?
posted by Too-Ticky at 5:21 AM on October 3, 2017
- Do you (ever/sometimes) enjoy the company of children? Do you ever think that being a parent could be fun?
- Have you considered being a/the stay-at-home parent? If not, why not?
posted by Too-Ticky at 5:21 AM on October 3, 2017
Having kids is, indeed, an irrevocable commitment that is certain to be expensive, time consuming, effortful far beyond your current imagining, and in many ways completely out of your control.
On the other hand, it is a life experience absolutely beyond compare, and it is completely different when it's your own child. The vast majority of parents will acknowledge all of the scary and difficult things I mention in the first paragraph and say that the experience is still amazing enough to make it all worthwhile.
Most people, are scared, intimidated, and unsure about the prospect of parenthood. You're not alone in that, not by far.
The key for you, based on what you've written, is to take ownership of your decision--either way. You are framing this question as being about her, about her wants and needs. This is a common human trait that attempts to put a noble front on failing to be accountable about one's own choices. If you make the decision to have a child with her, it is your decision and you have accepted the responsibility for the time, money, effort, expense (and also reward, joy, love, growth, expansion...) If you convince yourself that you're making this choice "for her", it practically guarantees that you will blame her when, not if, things get challenging, and that is the route to failure.
It is an amazing and it sounds like you have a great partner to make a family with. It's up to you to be great enough for her to make a family with.
posted by Sublimity at 5:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [23 favorites]
On the other hand, it is a life experience absolutely beyond compare, and it is completely different when it's your own child. The vast majority of parents will acknowledge all of the scary and difficult things I mention in the first paragraph and say that the experience is still amazing enough to make it all worthwhile.
Most people, are scared, intimidated, and unsure about the prospect of parenthood. You're not alone in that, not by far.
The key for you, based on what you've written, is to take ownership of your decision--either way. You are framing this question as being about her, about her wants and needs. This is a common human trait that attempts to put a noble front on failing to be accountable about one's own choices. If you make the decision to have a child with her, it is your decision and you have accepted the responsibility for the time, money, effort, expense (and also reward, joy, love, growth, expansion...) If you convince yourself that you're making this choice "for her", it practically guarantees that you will blame her when, not if, things get challenging, and that is the route to failure.
It is an amazing and it sounds like you have a great partner to make a family with. It's up to you to be great enough for her to make a family with.
posted by Sublimity at 5:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [23 favorites]
No, don't have a child to try to figure out your own stuff. That's a really bad reason to bring somebody into this world.
It sounds to me like you might benefit from some therapy so that you can talk through this over time. I don't know that you are going to get the answers that you seek from a thread on the internet; I think that this is a bigger question that you need to explore with a neutral third party.
posted by sockermom at 5:43 AM on October 3, 2017 [57 favorites]
It sounds to me like you might benefit from some therapy so that you can talk through this over time. I don't know that you are going to get the answers that you seek from a thread on the internet; I think that this is a bigger question that you need to explore with a neutral third party.
posted by sockermom at 5:43 AM on October 3, 2017 [57 favorites]
So - as a guy who will start trying in the next year or so, a lot of what you are feeling is normal.
The notion of not being on the fence and having to "know" it's time is a falsehood - after-all, if your life is already really enjoyable, it's natural to wonder if it will be made worse by any change that will take huge amounts of time, money, and patience.
It's also very normal to feel awkward or intimidated to the point of avoidance of other kids - it is through time and experience that one figures out how kids operate and how to connect with them.
It's also natural to feel like your own baggage, familial history, and experience is going to mess your child up. Lots of us were raised in topsy turvy households and came out with varying degrees of peculiarity to us.
Here is something that helped get me from being really anxious/negative about the idea to very jazzed about it - spend the next month or two mentally in the headspace of definitely having a kid. The point is to get past the "what if" anxieties and into the actual anxieties - exploring the job market, actually calculating how your financial situation and goals will change, reading a book or two on parenting. I found that once I got out of this unknowing stage and into the knowing stage that my perspective completely changed - that I wanted to do this, that I could do this, and that most of my fears were the same fears I have doing anything the first time. I figured out that one kid (our goal) is going to be a lot of work but really won't impact the other goals we have as individual adults that much which was a key worry of mine.
If after that two month period, you've figured out how you could make it work and you're still very much not wanting to have a kid, then that's a point where you need to start having very serious conversations with your partner. You owe it to your partner to start putting these worries down in a concrete list and put in some work exploring them with the goal of getting past them.
posted by notorious medium at 5:53 AM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
The notion of not being on the fence and having to "know" it's time is a falsehood - after-all, if your life is already really enjoyable, it's natural to wonder if it will be made worse by any change that will take huge amounts of time, money, and patience.
It's also very normal to feel awkward or intimidated to the point of avoidance of other kids - it is through time and experience that one figures out how kids operate and how to connect with them.
It's also natural to feel like your own baggage, familial history, and experience is going to mess your child up. Lots of us were raised in topsy turvy households and came out with varying degrees of peculiarity to us.
Here is something that helped get me from being really anxious/negative about the idea to very jazzed about it - spend the next month or two mentally in the headspace of definitely having a kid. The point is to get past the "what if" anxieties and into the actual anxieties - exploring the job market, actually calculating how your financial situation and goals will change, reading a book or two on parenting. I found that once I got out of this unknowing stage and into the knowing stage that my perspective completely changed - that I wanted to do this, that I could do this, and that most of my fears were the same fears I have doing anything the first time. I figured out that one kid (our goal) is going to be a lot of work but really won't impact the other goals we have as individual adults that much which was a key worry of mine.
If after that two month period, you've figured out how you could make it work and you're still very much not wanting to have a kid, then that's a point where you need to start having very serious conversations with your partner. You owe it to your partner to start putting these worries down in a concrete list and put in some work exploring them with the goal of getting past them.
posted by notorious medium at 5:53 AM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
Your comments are concerning in terms of deciding to have children:
I don't enjoy the company of children of other children much. I avoid my friends kids and I am even more averse to relatives. My sister suggested my 16 year old nephew stay with me for a few days as he had some spare time over the summer holidays. But I wriggled out of it. I was very relieved. Assuming you remain in this relationship, to show good faith, you could try spending some time with friends' and relatives' children instead of avoiding them. Still, that's giving those children the job of helping you, the adult, without considering what you might give to the children--companionship, time, fun.
But on the other hand, maybe this is all unhealthy behaviour that a family helps address. So having a kid is what I need to live a fuller life, even though it's not necessarily what I would actively choose. Often, children do bring out qualities we might not have developed otherwise: nurturing, sharing, playfulness, responsibility. But your phrasing suggests that children and a new family configuration would have the job of helping you not the other way around.
You are thoughtful and empathetic about your partner by considering that she deserves a different kind of partner who is fully onboard with becoming a parent. Accept your deep introversion, which seems pretty fixed and not conducive to parenting. You both deserve different partners since your goals don't seem compatible.
posted by Elsie at 5:57 AM on October 3, 2017 [5 favorites]
I don't enjoy the company of children of other children much. I avoid my friends kids and I am even more averse to relatives. My sister suggested my 16 year old nephew stay with me for a few days as he had some spare time over the summer holidays. But I wriggled out of it. I was very relieved. Assuming you remain in this relationship, to show good faith, you could try spending some time with friends' and relatives' children instead of avoiding them. Still, that's giving those children the job of helping you, the adult, without considering what you might give to the children--companionship, time, fun.
But on the other hand, maybe this is all unhealthy behaviour that a family helps address. So having a kid is what I need to live a fuller life, even though it's not necessarily what I would actively choose. Often, children do bring out qualities we might not have developed otherwise: nurturing, sharing, playfulness, responsibility. But your phrasing suggests that children and a new family configuration would have the job of helping you not the other way around.
You are thoughtful and empathetic about your partner by considering that she deserves a different kind of partner who is fully onboard with becoming a parent. Accept your deep introversion, which seems pretty fixed and not conducive to parenting. You both deserve different partners since your goals don't seem compatible.
posted by Elsie at 5:57 AM on October 3, 2017 [5 favorites]
I discourage people from having children unless they urgently want them. Most people can step up to the task and eventually find pleasure in it, yes. But you never know what kind of kid you're going to get, and it can become an endless lifetime slog. Why take such a big risk unless you anticipate big rewards?
posted by metasarah at 6:22 AM on October 3, 2017 [57 favorites]
posted by metasarah at 6:22 AM on October 3, 2017 [57 favorites]
I am deeply, deeply introverted. I'm also a pretty great parent who was ambivalent to UGH NO before having my kid.
I also come from a family where the dynamics are super fucking fraught, and where I would actually prefer not to spend time with, like, anyone but my sister and one cousin. One of the most validating and important parts of being a parent to me is that I can give my child the safety and security and unconditional love that I didn't have as a kid.
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:29 AM on October 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
I also come from a family where the dynamics are super fucking fraught, and where I would actually prefer not to spend time with, like, anyone but my sister and one cousin. One of the most validating and important parts of being a parent to me is that I can give my child the safety and security and unconditional love that I didn't have as a kid.
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:29 AM on October 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
Would you be willing to end the relationship forever so she can have kids with somebody else? Would you be willing to give her up so that you don't have to have children?
You have reasons, which pretty much seem to vary. You have good reason to be ambiguous about it. You could probably go either way in some respects and would be okay if you did and okay if you didn't. Going to therapy might help. Left to your own devices you could probably wish and wash back and forth forever about this topic until her eggs rot, though.
I think all of your quibbles mostly sound like things you could deal with if you have to. You'd figure out the finances. If you have to figure out how to hold down a real job, you'll do it. (Which would probably be a good idea regardless of whether or not you have kids.)
As for the mental health issues....I don't know what to say there. But it sounds like you're going to be anxious and freaked out about commitment to anything no matter what, so...therapy. Other than the mental health issues (and since you're not specific about it I don't know how extensive of a problem this is), none of this is red flagging me as Absolutely Should Not Do It stuff.
But the real question is: the price of staying with her is to have kids. Package deal. Do you want to give her up so that you can avoid having kids? Or are you willing to suck it up and have kids soonish in order to keep her? Which would you rather do/avoid doing?
Imagine what it would be like if you broke up with her tomorrow and she finds someone else to have kids with--would you be miserable and regret it or just feel relief? Or alternately, how would you feel if there was a birth control failure and she turned up pregnant now?
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:32 AM on October 3, 2017 [4 favorites]
You have reasons, which pretty much seem to vary. You have good reason to be ambiguous about it. You could probably go either way in some respects and would be okay if you did and okay if you didn't. Going to therapy might help. Left to your own devices you could probably wish and wash back and forth forever about this topic until her eggs rot, though.
I think all of your quibbles mostly sound like things you could deal with if you have to. You'd figure out the finances. If you have to figure out how to hold down a real job, you'll do it. (Which would probably be a good idea regardless of whether or not you have kids.)
As for the mental health issues....I don't know what to say there. But it sounds like you're going to be anxious and freaked out about commitment to anything no matter what, so...therapy. Other than the mental health issues (and since you're not specific about it I don't know how extensive of a problem this is), none of this is red flagging me as Absolutely Should Not Do It stuff.
But the real question is: the price of staying with her is to have kids. Package deal. Do you want to give her up so that you can avoid having kids? Or are you willing to suck it up and have kids soonish in order to keep her? Which would you rather do/avoid doing?
Imagine what it would be like if you broke up with her tomorrow and she finds someone else to have kids with--would you be miserable and regret it or just feel relief? Or alternately, how would you feel if there was a birth control failure and she turned up pregnant now?
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:32 AM on October 3, 2017 [4 favorites]
I actually (father of two) think the whole "Do you enjoy kids" question is bullshit. I don't find children other than my own remotely interesting outside of the context of parenting and them being my kids friends. The relationship most people have with their own children is not remotely the same thing as how you interact with other people's children.
Like I enjoy hanging out with my four year old's other four year old buddies, but nfw I'm gonna go volunteer to hang out with a bunch of 8 year olds I don't know.
I'm not saying the question doesn't matter, just that saying "no" doesn't imply you'll be a bad parent or not enjoy parenting. No more than saying "yes" means anything when you can always give those other kids back.
Sure you should be nervous. You've got no fucking idea what its like until you are in middle of it.
Everything else can kind of work itself out if you let it. But yeah - the "retire early" dream is dead if you have kids.
posted by JPD at 6:37 AM on October 3, 2017 [28 favorites]
Like I enjoy hanging out with my four year old's other four year old buddies, but nfw I'm gonna go volunteer to hang out with a bunch of 8 year olds I don't know.
I'm not saying the question doesn't matter, just that saying "no" doesn't imply you'll be a bad parent or not enjoy parenting. No more than saying "yes" means anything when you can always give those other kids back.
Sure you should be nervous. You've got no fucking idea what its like until you are in middle of it.
Everything else can kind of work itself out if you let it. But yeah - the "retire early" dream is dead if you have kids.
posted by JPD at 6:37 AM on October 3, 2017 [28 favorites]
It is different with your own kids. So not enjoying other people's kids doesn't necessarily mean you're not cut out to be a parent. Have you ever had a pet? If you've had pets you really bonded with and loved, that's a good sign that you could do the same with a kid. On the other hand, if having a pet has never really appealed to you and sounds like too much work and commitment, that's a sign you might not be cut out for parenthood. Have you ever had any strong positive feelings about any kid? Thinking they looked really cute or cracking up at the funny thing they said or thinking that if you ever had a kid you'd like them to be like that kid in some way? If that's an experience you've never had, I'd say that's a bad sign.
How do you feel about all the work involved in parenting? Are you imagining that of course you'd help, but your girlfriend would no doubt take the lead and do more of the work because she's the one who wants the kid, she knows more about kids, she'll probably care more about doing everything just so, and she'll find it more fulfilling than you will? That's an attitude that will lead to lot of tension between you and quite possibly make her regret having had kids with you. Think about all the details of parenting - finding a pediatrician, making doctor's appointments, deciding when to start giving solid foods, reading aloud at bedtime, teaching your kid how to tie shoes or load the dishwasher, setting up playdates, picking a preschool, noticing when your kid needs new shoes and getting some, etc. Can you see yourself being just as on top of all that as your girlfriend, participating equally? Does it at least seem fair and reasonable for you to participate equally? If not, you probably should be hesitant to have a kid.
posted by Redstart at 6:45 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
How do you feel about all the work involved in parenting? Are you imagining that of course you'd help, but your girlfriend would no doubt take the lead and do more of the work because she's the one who wants the kid, she knows more about kids, she'll probably care more about doing everything just so, and she'll find it more fulfilling than you will? That's an attitude that will lead to lot of tension between you and quite possibly make her regret having had kids with you. Think about all the details of parenting - finding a pediatrician, making doctor's appointments, deciding when to start giving solid foods, reading aloud at bedtime, teaching your kid how to tie shoes or load the dishwasher, setting up playdates, picking a preschool, noticing when your kid needs new shoes and getting some, etc. Can you see yourself being just as on top of all that as your girlfriend, participating equally? Does it at least seem fair and reasonable for you to participate equally? If not, you probably should be hesitant to have a kid.
posted by Redstart at 6:45 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
My perspective is that of someone who has both personal and family history of mental health issues, and a partner with same, and has chosen not to parent partly for that reason, so take this for what it's worth. But: I tend to think that all of the "it'll be different when it's your child, it's so rewarding when it's your child, it will be the best thing you ever did" responses in the world aren't not relevant to my (and your) situation unless they are coming from people with similar personal and family histories to ours. Which is difficult to figure out because it's not as if people should have to self-disclose to offer you advice that you've asked for. But it's something to consider. If you have friends or family who you know have parented with challenges similar to your own, they might have really valuable perspectives for you.
It sounds like you're asking a lot of the right questions, and I hope that you and your partner can talk through those questions and come up with an answer that lets you move forward with a decision you're confident in and can take ownership of, one way or the other. Good luck!
posted by Stacey at 6:50 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
It sounds like you're asking a lot of the right questions, and I hope that you and your partner can talk through those questions and come up with an answer that lets you move forward with a decision you're confident in and can take ownership of, one way or the other. Good luck!
posted by Stacey at 6:50 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
Would be nice to be able to comment anonymously here! But ...
Imagine that I was (at the age of 34) a person with depression, pervasive family history of depression, grotesque dysfunction in family of origin, believing that marriage was a horrible idea (but that lifelong non-government-enforced, non-religiously-enforced commitment was a great aspiration), and believing that to bring a new life into being was NOT a favor to that new life.
Then imagine that that guy agreed to have a baby because (1) he was getting very good treatment for depression, (2) was deeply in love, and (3) was easily able to envision that raising a baby/child/person would be great fun even though enormous responsibility, because babies and kids are awesome. And imagine that it worked out INCREDIBLY well, for (imagine) 17 years so far.
But that imagined guy, reading your question and comment, says "oh hell no don't do it," I guess because your question and comment carry at least a strong possibility that you will NOT find child-raising to be fun and that you WILL find it to be a source of financial-obligation resentment, and you don't sound SO madly in love with your partner that you are sure that you will navigate any problems very well together.
posted by sheldman at 7:12 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Imagine that I was (at the age of 34) a person with depression, pervasive family history of depression, grotesque dysfunction in family of origin, believing that marriage was a horrible idea (but that lifelong non-government-enforced, non-religiously-enforced commitment was a great aspiration), and believing that to bring a new life into being was NOT a favor to that new life.
Then imagine that that guy agreed to have a baby because (1) he was getting very good treatment for depression, (2) was deeply in love, and (3) was easily able to envision that raising a baby/child/person would be great fun even though enormous responsibility, because babies and kids are awesome. And imagine that it worked out INCREDIBLY well, for (imagine) 17 years so far.
But that imagined guy, reading your question and comment, says "oh hell no don't do it," I guess because your question and comment carry at least a strong possibility that you will NOT find child-raising to be fun and that you WILL find it to be a source of financial-obligation resentment, and you don't sound SO madly in love with your partner that you are sure that you will navigate any problems very well together.
posted by sheldman at 7:12 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
The problem with "going along with what is best for her" is that a child is a human being. It would probably be okay if it was a puppy and you were "going along with what is best for her" if she really wanted the companionship of a puppy and was willing to do most of the puppy care. But a child is not a puppy. A child is only object-like for one or two years max, and quickly starts to show signs of a separate, intelligent personality and vivid, undeniable human psychology. And it only gets worse from there! If you think it's hard to be judged by a 2 year old, wait until that 2 year old is 15! That child will absolutely judge you as its father. 1000% guaranteed, no way to escape this.
Also, why are you bringing up marriage? Is your partner asking to get married and have a child in the next year? That's a lot. I started reading your question under the impression that she wanted to have a child while unmarried, but you bring up marriage at the end.
I think you should absolutely break up with your partner. It will suck, but it will suck a lot less than having a child and regretting it. And let's be real, you can only stall with her so long before she breaks up with you. Better all around to "get the jump on it" so to speak and emotionally prepare without living in denial.
posted by stockpuppet at 7:16 AM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
Also, why are you bringing up marriage? Is your partner asking to get married and have a child in the next year? That's a lot. I started reading your question under the impression that she wanted to have a child while unmarried, but you bring up marriage at the end.
I think you should absolutely break up with your partner. It will suck, but it will suck a lot less than having a child and regretting it. And let's be real, you can only stall with her so long before she breaks up with you. Better all around to "get the jump on it" so to speak and emotionally prepare without living in denial.
posted by stockpuppet at 7:16 AM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
Don't have kids until you desire to have kids.
Don't desire to have kids until you get married.
Don't get married until you resolve your mental health issues.
posted by Lord Fancy Pants at 7:19 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Don't desire to have kids until you get married.
Don't get married until you resolve your mental health issues.
posted by Lord Fancy Pants at 7:19 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
On the negative side, I've never held down a real job before.
Looking through your previous asks, you seem to have been really down on things stemming from your work life over the past getting on for a decade. Like you've had this ongoing, reasonably settled, objectively enviable life setup from your passive income stream, but you've never been able to convince yourself that this is a worthwhile or laudable achievement, or something you fully deserve to use as a platform for just doing a chunk of whatever the hell new stuff you want to for your own sake.
Having a kid will be the polar opposite of all of that in many ways. Things won't be settled, best laid plans will be bowled over. You'll have a hell of a lot less opportunity to do anything for your own sake, for a while, whether you feel like you deserve to or not.
But if you take the plunge, you certainly won't lack for active challenges, completely new experiences and the chance to feel deep down in your gut that you're doing something selflessly laudable.
But on the other hand, maybe this is all unhealthy behaviour that a family helps address. So having a kid is what I need to live a fuller life, even though it's not necessarily what I would actively choose.
I think this is the question you most need to dwell upon. You come across here, and in your previous asks, as very self aware and focused. This may have caused you more doubt and angst than anything else personally - but that doesn't mean it couldn't be turned outwards and become a source of strength for you and your future family.
There are heights and depths and sideways excursions in parenthood that reveal things about life, you and your place in it that you simply cannot anticipate in the same way you've planned things for yourself before. It's a jump into the deep end, a kick up the arse and a rock to ground yourself upon all at once.
posted by protorp at 7:20 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
Looking through your previous asks, you seem to have been really down on things stemming from your work life over the past getting on for a decade. Like you've had this ongoing, reasonably settled, objectively enviable life setup from your passive income stream, but you've never been able to convince yourself that this is a worthwhile or laudable achievement, or something you fully deserve to use as a platform for just doing a chunk of whatever the hell new stuff you want to for your own sake.
Having a kid will be the polar opposite of all of that in many ways. Things won't be settled, best laid plans will be bowled over. You'll have a hell of a lot less opportunity to do anything for your own sake, for a while, whether you feel like you deserve to or not.
But if you take the plunge, you certainly won't lack for active challenges, completely new experiences and the chance to feel deep down in your gut that you're doing something selflessly laudable.
But on the other hand, maybe this is all unhealthy behaviour that a family helps address. So having a kid is what I need to live a fuller life, even though it's not necessarily what I would actively choose.
I think this is the question you most need to dwell upon. You come across here, and in your previous asks, as very self aware and focused. This may have caused you more doubt and angst than anything else personally - but that doesn't mean it couldn't be turned outwards and become a source of strength for you and your future family.
There are heights and depths and sideways excursions in parenthood that reveal things about life, you and your place in it that you simply cannot anticipate in the same way you've planned things for yourself before. It's a jump into the deep end, a kick up the arse and a rock to ground yourself upon all at once.
posted by protorp at 7:20 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'll be a data point as someone who is madly in love with my own children despite not enjoying other children, OR animals, at all. Honestly I think it's really weird someone suggested that you need to enjoy animals in order to enjoy parenting. There's no nexus there.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:34 AM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:34 AM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
I love having kids, and I have a pretty introverted husband who is a great "home base." It can work. But I do not advise you have to children in order to keep a relationship.
Here's what I think you should add to your thoughts around this. I agree with the thought experiment to spend a month thinking about having a child, like "I have a child now..." But I would add to that thought: What if your girlfriend died in childbirth, or of cancer, or got hit by a bus a year after you have this child? Are you prepared to love and raise that child alone? Relatively joyfully despite the obvious difficulties?
Because that's what each parent needs to consider.
Financially you seem to have your stuff really together. I see no reason to assume that would change, even if it means a change in your plans...you clearly know how to make money, budget, and save money. That's huge. How much you need, how you accomplish that - that may change. But seriously, dude. Well done.
On a final philosophical note...parenting has changed me and my lifestyle in ways I could never have predicted and sometimes that change was really hard. But going through those changes have expanded me and change is no longer The Thing I Find Hardest. As I get older (46) and my parents get into their 70s I see that the people who seem to be aging best are those who keep running at life as a passion (this is not the same as extroversion.) So if what you fear the most in all this is change, I would consider whether that's actually in your own interests or not.
But don't have a child, a human being, unless you get closer to sure it's a change you want to take on.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
Here's what I think you should add to your thoughts around this. I agree with the thought experiment to spend a month thinking about having a child, like "I have a child now..." But I would add to that thought: What if your girlfriend died in childbirth, or of cancer, or got hit by a bus a year after you have this child? Are you prepared to love and raise that child alone? Relatively joyfully despite the obvious difficulties?
Because that's what each parent needs to consider.
Financially you seem to have your stuff really together. I see no reason to assume that would change, even if it means a change in your plans...you clearly know how to make money, budget, and save money. That's huge. How much you need, how you accomplish that - that may change. But seriously, dude. Well done.
On a final philosophical note...parenting has changed me and my lifestyle in ways I could never have predicted and sometimes that change was really hard. But going through those changes have expanded me and change is no longer The Thing I Find Hardest. As I get older (46) and my parents get into their 70s I see that the people who seem to be aging best are those who keep running at life as a passion (this is not the same as extroversion.) So if what you fear the most in all this is change, I would consider whether that's actually in your own interests or not.
But don't have a child, a human being, unless you get closer to sure it's a change you want to take on.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
I was on the fence, so the "am I 100% sure I want kids?" question just gave me more anxiety. But questions like "Do I believe I will enjoy raising kids?" and "do I believe our relationship is strong enough to handle the stress of parenting?" helped me. I wasn't sure I wanted a kid, but I was sure I'd be happy with a kid and I was sure I could handle it. There needs to be some certainty somewhere in your mind.
There also needs to be some willingness to live with uncertainty, because there is so much that could happen in the course of raising a child. To love is to accept the risk of loss; if you're hesitant to get married because the marriage could end, parenting is like that times a million.
Having a kid does force you to step up to the plate a little. But don't have a kid just to have something to get out of bed for. Parenting will not give your life answers or directions; it'll put your life on rails, in a sense, but it'll also feel like a runaway train at times. It seems like you've got a lot of unresolved feelings about your life and what you want out of it, and I don't think having a kid will settle them. It might distract you from them a little bit, but it might not.
You've thought a lot about this, and ultimately you're the only person who can answer the question. But based on what you've said here, it seems like the answer will probably be no.
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:48 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
There also needs to be some willingness to live with uncertainty, because there is so much that could happen in the course of raising a child. To love is to accept the risk of loss; if you're hesitant to get married because the marriage could end, parenting is like that times a million.
Having a kid does force you to step up to the plate a little. But don't have a kid just to have something to get out of bed for. Parenting will not give your life answers or directions; it'll put your life on rails, in a sense, but it'll also feel like a runaway train at times. It seems like you've got a lot of unresolved feelings about your life and what you want out of it, and I don't think having a kid will settle them. It might distract you from them a little bit, but it might not.
You've thought a lot about this, and ultimately you're the only person who can answer the question. But based on what you've said here, it seems like the answer will probably be no.
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:48 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
The problem with "going along with what is best for her" is that it is entirely your own choice whether you want to be a parent. Making a commitment like this based on someone else's desires is horribly unfair to you. If the only reason you want to become a parent is to fulfill someone else's expectations then maybe you should back out.
Make the decision based on what you want and don't waste any time informing your partner about your decision. Just as you deserve autonomy as a human, she deserves to be fully informed so she can maker her own decisions.
That said, for kids there is no "perfect time" if that's what's holding you back. If everyone waited until every little thing in their life was in order we would die out as a species in a single generation. Raising kids isn't easy but it's been done about a hundred billion times so far by people who would consider your situation beyond the luxury of the mightiest kings.
posted by FakeFreyja at 7:49 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
Make the decision based on what you want and don't waste any time informing your partner about your decision. Just as you deserve autonomy as a human, she deserves to be fully informed so she can maker her own decisions.
That said, for kids there is no "perfect time" if that's what's holding you back. If everyone waited until every little thing in their life was in order we would die out as a species in a single generation. Raising kids isn't easy but it's been done about a hundred billion times so far by people who would consider your situation beyond the luxury of the mightiest kings.
posted by FakeFreyja at 7:49 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
Having kids might work out for you, or it might not. There is no way of knowing, no way of planning for your reaction.
Obviously, your partner is confident in your potential as a parent. That means a lot. You're also asking all the right questions about yourself, your abilities, and the strengths of your relationship, so you clearly have the self-awareness for the job.
Yes, taking the great Kierkegaardian leap of faith is intimidating, but it's what makes life worthwhile, isn't it? If we are not contributing to something greater and outside of ourselves, what are we doing here?
This random internet stranger says to go for it. Take the leap.
posted by Capt. Renault at 7:51 AM on October 3, 2017
Obviously, your partner is confident in your potential as a parent. That means a lot. You're also asking all the right questions about yourself, your abilities, and the strengths of your relationship, so you clearly have the self-awareness for the job.
Yes, taking the great Kierkegaardian leap of faith is intimidating, but it's what makes life worthwhile, isn't it? If we are not contributing to something greater and outside of ourselves, what are we doing here?
This random internet stranger says to go for it. Take the leap.
posted by Capt. Renault at 7:51 AM on October 3, 2017
I was never that interested in having a child and I now have (bore, nursed, etc.) a nearly-2 year old. The solid foundation for the whole process has been my partnership with my spouse, who actively wanted to have a child, and with whom I talked it over in the ways that we talk over big decisions - obliquely, as a joke, then more seriously, until we were timing ovulation and having totally weird procreative sex and all the rest of it. If he hadn't been on board, if he wasn't a completely committed co-parent, none of this shit would have worked.
I was the weak link, and honestly if when I remembered to ask him whether he wanted kids (a mere nine or ten years into our relationship) he had said no, we would have proceeded merrily along together with our cats into some other future.
If spouse and I ever split up, I believe we will co-parent well because we both love our kid so very much. But having a baby with someone who was wishy washy through the process would have been unbearable.
Please don't if you are doing her a favor.
posted by Lawn Beaver at 8:03 AM on October 3, 2017 [7 favorites]
I was the weak link, and honestly if when I remembered to ask him whether he wanted kids (a mere nine or ten years into our relationship) he had said no, we would have proceeded merrily along together with our cats into some other future.
If spouse and I ever split up, I believe we will co-parent well because we both love our kid so very much. But having a baby with someone who was wishy washy through the process would have been unbearable.
Please don't if you are doing her a favor.
posted by Lawn Beaver at 8:03 AM on October 3, 2017 [7 favorites]
I was 6 months pregnant when I was taking care of my 3 month old nephew one day a week so his mom could work. Every time I gave him back to his mom at the end of the day I wondered what in the ever loving fuck was I thinking having a baby because I did not enjoy spending time with an infant at all. AT ALL. In fact, I hated it.
Turns out, your own kids are a whole other thing. I love my niece and nephew, but I LOVE my own kids. I can put up with my kids having tantrums, I can be patient and loving and kind even when I just want them to shut up, I can parent them the way I think will work the best, and I can love love love love them when they are smearing half chewed food on my pants.
It is different with your own kids. Now, that obviously doesn't mean you should have kids if you don't want them, but please, don't let a question like "do you enjoy spending time with kids" have any bearing on your decision.
posted by lydhre at 8:06 AM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
Turns out, your own kids are a whole other thing. I love my niece and nephew, but I LOVE my own kids. I can put up with my kids having tantrums, I can be patient and loving and kind even when I just want them to shut up, I can parent them the way I think will work the best, and I can love love love love them when they are smearing half chewed food on my pants.
It is different with your own kids. Now, that obviously doesn't mean you should have kids if you don't want them, but please, don't let a question like "do you enjoy spending time with kids" have any bearing on your decision.
posted by lydhre at 8:06 AM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
I've pointed this out in other threads on the green and blue, but the whole "it's different when it's your children" is not universal. Not everyone experiences that after they have children. This is not a given, especially depending on what stripe your mental health comes in. YMMV, widely, on this point.
posted by furnace.heart at 8:14 AM on October 3, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by furnace.heart at 8:14 AM on October 3, 2017 [17 favorites]
+1 to what Furnace Heart said - it's not always different when it's your own. Some kids are easier to love than others, quite frankly, and that can be a matter of the kid meshing with your individual temperament, or the colicky baby who turns into a high needs kid, or any number of things.
And you mention that you are frugal - kids are expensive, and not just because they need extracurriculars and clothes and college and what not. Kids spill things, they break things, they waste things, because they are young and unformed and still learning about the world. And that can drive some people nuts. Will you be seeing little winged cartoon dollars flying away every time your kid spills milk or needs an emergency-room visit or accidentally breaks Aunt Minnie's antique vase?
This might be something you can visit in therapy, individual, couples or both.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 8:24 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
And you mention that you are frugal - kids are expensive, and not just because they need extracurriculars and clothes and college and what not. Kids spill things, they break things, they waste things, because they are young and unformed and still learning about the world. And that can drive some people nuts. Will you be seeing little winged cartoon dollars flying away every time your kid spills milk or needs an emergency-room visit or accidentally breaks Aunt Minnie's antique vase?
This might be something you can visit in therapy, individual, couples or both.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 8:24 AM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
If you are unsure about or averse to having kids, and she wants kids, and you have a deep anxiety about marriage and sharing of assets, I would say these are excellent reasons to go separate ways.
But I'd also suggest therapy to get at where these anxieties come from, not because it's wrong to have them, but because there might be a source of them that is getting in the way of you and someone you love being together.
posted by zippy at 8:37 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
But I'd also suggest therapy to get at where these anxieties come from, not because it's wrong to have them, but because there might be a source of them that is getting in the way of you and someone you love being together.
posted by zippy at 8:37 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
So I did the thing I was "supposed" to do and relented to my first wife's desire to have kids when I wasn't at all ready. The result: I have two amazing kids and an ex-wife.
What happened was that, of course, the kids are amazing and I'm grateful for them every day. But also, I was deeply stressed, angry, resentful and exhausted all the time for the last 3 years of my first marriage.
Having and raising children is hard. You're tired all the time. You have to be your best self because the children depend on you for emotional and physical safety, well-being and growth. But of course no one can be their best self all the time so you're also constantly being shown your limitations and flaws which is itself exhausting and frustrating. If you're contemplating being the at-home parent, know that you will be alone with just the kids a LOT. You will do about 95% less of things you like doing.
Especially the weird, isolated way we do it here in western countries. You and your partner need to have rock-solid mutual trust, respect and a common vision if your relationship is going to survive it. My ex and I didn't have those things because I mistakenly thought it was my "duty" to accept that because other people thought it was time for me to be a parent then well it must be time for me to be a parent.
I'm not saying don't do it. I'm saying, yes, be certain you want this. Right now you're thinking of going along with what your partner wants because you're afraid you might lose her. I'm saying (based on my experience and that of several friends in similar situations) that the odds are really high that if you're not certain, you'll lose her anyway.
posted by eustacescrubb at 8:40 AM on October 3, 2017 [15 favorites]
What happened was that, of course, the kids are amazing and I'm grateful for them every day. But also, I was deeply stressed, angry, resentful and exhausted all the time for the last 3 years of my first marriage.
Having and raising children is hard. You're tired all the time. You have to be your best self because the children depend on you for emotional and physical safety, well-being and growth. But of course no one can be their best self all the time so you're also constantly being shown your limitations and flaws which is itself exhausting and frustrating. If you're contemplating being the at-home parent, know that you will be alone with just the kids a LOT. You will do about 95% less of things you like doing.
Especially the weird, isolated way we do it here in western countries. You and your partner need to have rock-solid mutual trust, respect and a common vision if your relationship is going to survive it. My ex and I didn't have those things because I mistakenly thought it was my "duty" to accept that because other people thought it was time for me to be a parent then well it must be time for me to be a parent.
I'm not saying don't do it. I'm saying, yes, be certain you want this. Right now you're thinking of going along with what your partner wants because you're afraid you might lose her. I'm saying (based on my experience and that of several friends in similar situations) that the odds are really high that if you're not certain, you'll lose her anyway.
posted by eustacescrubb at 8:40 AM on October 3, 2017 [15 favorites]
I'm pretty sure I won't be having children. I tend to view almost all questions like, "Do you plan to have children?" in shades of grey, because I cannot foresee exactly how my future will unfold, but I'm as certain about this as I am about anything else. I think I would be a good parent, if I did it. But for a myriad of reasons, it's not something I intend to do. I fondly hope to eventually adopt a dog or cat or possibly both, but even that for various self-chosen lifestyle reasons is out of the picture for the present.
I also think it's ridiculously narrow-minded to believe that procreation is the only way to have a meaningful life.
posted by vegartanipla at 8:40 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
I also think it's ridiculously narrow-minded to believe that procreation is the only way to have a meaningful life.
posted by vegartanipla at 8:40 AM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
I don't have any kids and frankly enjoy the flexibilty (last weekend I took off and drove about 800 miles, hiking at Crater Lake and the incomparable Smith Rock). You can have a fulfilling life without having children.
My brother had two children late in life, probably under similiar circumstances to your situation (adores his wife, wife wanted children). While he loves his kids, one is mellow and easy going and one is high strung and dramatic and frankly, pretty demanding. If you ask him to rate the fatherhood experience, he will honestly answer that it is both rewarding and very challenging/trying at times. It's not massive bliss for everyone; it's piles of laundry and tiring and stressful, too. Other times it's funny, enjoyable and sweet.
There are no guarantees with kids, you cannot order in advance the variety you'd like, and it is a big/long term/round the clock commitment. Some people LOVE it, but not everyone does. Do you have friends with kids? Could you spend some time with a variety of ages soon to see how you feel about babies, toddlers, and beyond - the demands of their schedules and care, and also the tender moments?
posted by OneSmartMonkey at 8:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
My brother had two children late in life, probably under similiar circumstances to your situation (adores his wife, wife wanted children). While he loves his kids, one is mellow and easy going and one is high strung and dramatic and frankly, pretty demanding. If you ask him to rate the fatherhood experience, he will honestly answer that it is both rewarding and very challenging/trying at times. It's not massive bliss for everyone; it's piles of laundry and tiring and stressful, too. Other times it's funny, enjoyable and sweet.
There are no guarantees with kids, you cannot order in advance the variety you'd like, and it is a big/long term/round the clock commitment. Some people LOVE it, but not everyone does. Do you have friends with kids? Could you spend some time with a variety of ages soon to see how you feel about babies, toddlers, and beyond - the demands of their schedules and care, and also the tender moments?
posted by OneSmartMonkey at 8:42 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
Nobody can answer this question but you. But speaking as somebody who desperately wanted children, and is happy to have them, here are some questions I'd advise you to consider:
Being a parent makes everything more intense. Your highs will be higher and your lows will be lower. It also makes life much less predictable. How will this increased intensity and decreased stability affect your mental health issues?
Being a parent is irrevocable. You can quit jobs, breakup with romantic partners, and sell houses. But once you have children, you will never stop being a parent. As somebody who is anxious about the less permanent commitment of marriage to a woman you know and love, are you willing to make an irrevocable lifelong commitment to a helpless human you haven't met yet?
It's true that the vast majority of people love their kids in a way they don't love anybody else. But that's not terribly useful information. Good parents love their kids. Bad parents love their kids. Happy parents love their kids. Miserable parents love their kids.
But bad and miserable parents are not doing their children any favors. Bringing a child into the world when you are not capable of raising them without resentment is an act of cruelty. Please make sure that's not what you would be doing.
posted by yankeefog at 8:46 AM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
Being a parent makes everything more intense. Your highs will be higher and your lows will be lower. It also makes life much less predictable. How will this increased intensity and decreased stability affect your mental health issues?
Being a parent is irrevocable. You can quit jobs, breakup with romantic partners, and sell houses. But once you have children, you will never stop being a parent. As somebody who is anxious about the less permanent commitment of marriage to a woman you know and love, are you willing to make an irrevocable lifelong commitment to a helpless human you haven't met yet?
It's true that the vast majority of people love their kids in a way they don't love anybody else. But that's not terribly useful information. Good parents love their kids. Bad parents love their kids. Happy parents love their kids. Miserable parents love their kids.
But bad and miserable parents are not doing their children any favors. Bringing a child into the world when you are not capable of raising them without resentment is an act of cruelty. Please make sure that's not what you would be doing.
posted by yankeefog at 8:46 AM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'll answer your question with a question: have you read any of the emotional labor threads? Has your girlfriend? How would you each talk about the other's emotional labor contributions? the first of the Metafilter emotional labor threads, and most recent. There link labeled "also" in the most recent fpp shows that there are 29 emotional labor threads so far.
I'm asking this because having kids is non stop emotional labor for at least one parent and can build a lot of resentment into the constellation of relationships. Do you know which chocolate your girlfriend means when she says "chocolate?" How she takes her coffee? Which cleaning products and procedures she uses in the kitchen/bathroom/clothes washing? Have you ever mailed a birthday card in your life? This year? Who would you call in the middle of the night if your apartment caught fire and you needed to go somewhere? Does someone in your neighborhood have your spare key? Is there anyone in your life who relies on you to be their spare key person? In what ways are you involved in/committed to your community? Do you volunteer?
If you read those emotional labor threads and don't think you can do better, or don't want to do better, than you currently are, please do not have a kid. Also do not have a kid if you say to yourself, but I'm better than these other guys...I keep my socks off the floor and I wash the dishes some (or all) of the time. Especially don't have a kid if you think the people who are so wound up about all of this should just kick back and do less of the emotional labor.
Further, one of the reasons that people in a relationship fixate on achieving a milestone is a culturally ingrained idea that such achievements mark successful relationships or can spur one party to deepen the commitment. Relationships don't become successful because a baby has arrived or two people have walked down an aisle. So many people end up with an unsuccessful relationship PLUS A BABY. You don't have to end up on that path.
Work on the relationship now. Do the emotional labor stuff first. Read the threads. At the very least read the entirety of the first. Then go get some books by John and Julie Gottman about what happy couples do. Start doing the things. Don't assign these as homework to your partner. Just do them yourself. Maybe mention, once and only once that you're doing them, with no expectation that you'll get a cookie for it.
Build your community. Strengthen your relationship. Even the very strongest of relationships are tested by the arrival of a baby. Sleep is short, sex takes a backseat, money disappears, physical labor around babies is intense for many people. Don't expect a baby to be enough motivation for folks to "work things out" after the fact. and definitely don't expect that "working things out" means you keep whistling along while your partner does all the "compromising."
posted by bilabial at 8:55 AM on October 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
I'm asking this because having kids is non stop emotional labor for at least one parent and can build a lot of resentment into the constellation of relationships. Do you know which chocolate your girlfriend means when she says "chocolate?" How she takes her coffee? Which cleaning products and procedures she uses in the kitchen/bathroom/clothes washing? Have you ever mailed a birthday card in your life? This year? Who would you call in the middle of the night if your apartment caught fire and you needed to go somewhere? Does someone in your neighborhood have your spare key? Is there anyone in your life who relies on you to be their spare key person? In what ways are you involved in/committed to your community? Do you volunteer?
If you read those emotional labor threads and don't think you can do better, or don't want to do better, than you currently are, please do not have a kid. Also do not have a kid if you say to yourself, but I'm better than these other guys...I keep my socks off the floor and I wash the dishes some (or all) of the time. Especially don't have a kid if you think the people who are so wound up about all of this should just kick back and do less of the emotional labor.
Further, one of the reasons that people in a relationship fixate on achieving a milestone is a culturally ingrained idea that such achievements mark successful relationships or can spur one party to deepen the commitment. Relationships don't become successful because a baby has arrived or two people have walked down an aisle. So many people end up with an unsuccessful relationship PLUS A BABY. You don't have to end up on that path.
Work on the relationship now. Do the emotional labor stuff first. Read the threads. At the very least read the entirety of the first. Then go get some books by John and Julie Gottman about what happy couples do. Start doing the things. Don't assign these as homework to your partner. Just do them yourself. Maybe mention, once and only once that you're doing them, with no expectation that you'll get a cookie for it.
Build your community. Strengthen your relationship. Even the very strongest of relationships are tested by the arrival of a baby. Sleep is short, sex takes a backseat, money disappears, physical labor around babies is intense for many people. Don't expect a baby to be enough motivation for folks to "work things out" after the fact. and definitely don't expect that "working things out" means you keep whistling along while your partner does all the "compromising."
posted by bilabial at 8:55 AM on October 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
But in general I'm increasingly reclusive in most aspects of life. I hate weddings and family events, and selfishly prefer my own company.
on the one hand, isolation from the regular activities and rhythms of modern adult social life is one of the biggest things that stay-at-home parents struggle with. so if this is a selling point and not a drawback for you, you might make a great primary parent, especially in the early years.
however, and I am always shocked to see anybody contemplate children without considering this, your partner could die. in childbirth, or any time afterwards, for any reason. She could also leave you and offer you no childrearing support beyond whatever financial help is required by law. You think you could do OK with her and a baby if forced into it, and you probably could. but you need to know that you could do OK just you and a child and nobody else, because that is what parenthood is a commitment to. it doesn't matter how solid your relationship is or whether you're married -- you have a kid, you are promising to be a single parent if you need to. and you can't control the circumstances that might mean you need to. if her presence is the only thing that makes the thought of a child tolerable, you can't possibly have one.
finally, with all respect to your worries about wasting her time, she's only 32. you're almost 40. You are the one with time running out, if you think there's any chance you'll break up over this and then change your mind in the direction of really wanting children someday. technical physical fertility is not interchangeable with social desirability, for single women assessing potential fathers. this is not a reason to have a child but it is something to be aware of when treating this as a thing you'd be doing for her, not for yourself.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:14 AM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
on the one hand, isolation from the regular activities and rhythms of modern adult social life is one of the biggest things that stay-at-home parents struggle with. so if this is a selling point and not a drawback for you, you might make a great primary parent, especially in the early years.
however, and I am always shocked to see anybody contemplate children without considering this, your partner could die. in childbirth, or any time afterwards, for any reason. She could also leave you and offer you no childrearing support beyond whatever financial help is required by law. You think you could do OK with her and a baby if forced into it, and you probably could. but you need to know that you could do OK just you and a child and nobody else, because that is what parenthood is a commitment to. it doesn't matter how solid your relationship is or whether you're married -- you have a kid, you are promising to be a single parent if you need to. and you can't control the circumstances that might mean you need to. if her presence is the only thing that makes the thought of a child tolerable, you can't possibly have one.
finally, with all respect to your worries about wasting her time, she's only 32. you're almost 40. You are the one with time running out, if you think there's any chance you'll break up over this and then change your mind in the direction of really wanting children someday. technical physical fertility is not interchangeable with social desirability, for single women assessing potential fathers. this is not a reason to have a child but it is something to be aware of when treating this as a thing you'd be doing for her, not for yourself.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:14 AM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
Holy Moly, you could retire next year?? At age 38? Man, you are better off than every other 30 something person I know financially, so I wouldn't worry about that part very much. I mean, I know there's always something to worry about, but still, seems pretty secure.
The rest of your concerns, yeah, you'll have to work through that with yourself and her for sure before you decide to go ahead or leave. I have a 2 year old, it's a gas and exhausting. We do have a lot of family around to help and it's made a lot of difference for me (as the mom and primary caregiver). Is there anyone else she can get support from besides you if ya'll do decide to have a kid? Everyone I know also says it gets dramatically easier when they go to school, and at this point that's only 3 years away, so I'm actually starting to savor these toddler days, they do grow fast.
I will say that being in a fairly secure financial situation does make it easier, as you could outsource a lot of the childcare if needed/wanted. It's still hard, but having the ability to do that is useful sometimes.
posted by Rocket26 at 10:13 AM on October 3, 2017
The rest of your concerns, yeah, you'll have to work through that with yourself and her for sure before you decide to go ahead or leave. I have a 2 year old, it's a gas and exhausting. We do have a lot of family around to help and it's made a lot of difference for me (as the mom and primary caregiver). Is there anyone else she can get support from besides you if ya'll do decide to have a kid? Everyone I know also says it gets dramatically easier when they go to school, and at this point that's only 3 years away, so I'm actually starting to savor these toddler days, they do grow fast.
I will say that being in a fairly secure financial situation does make it easier, as you could outsource a lot of the childcare if needed/wanted. It's still hard, but having the ability to do that is useful sometimes.
posted by Rocket26 at 10:13 AM on October 3, 2017
Wow. These comments. I bet I can guess who has kids and who doesn't...
To the extent that one random internet person's opinion matters, I'll add to the heap.
I have no doubt that having and raising kids is a great and fulfilling experience the likes of which does not exist. From my understanding, it's also a lot of work, and has the potential to be rather expensive.
I guess my question to you would be: if you retire next year, what are you going to do? I could be perfectly happy spending my days on a beach in Thailand sipping drinks and diving for the rest of my life. Or any other place. What's your plan?
I mean, don't just have a kid for something to do. But if you've got a plan, and this is throwing a wrench in it, bail. There are a lot of other people out there, like, a lot. Chances are you'll find another one who is as amazing as this one.
posted by booooooze at 11:39 AM on October 3, 2017 [4 favorites]
To the extent that one random internet person's opinion matters, I'll add to the heap.
I have no doubt that having and raising kids is a great and fulfilling experience the likes of which does not exist. From my understanding, it's also a lot of work, and has the potential to be rather expensive.
I guess my question to you would be: if you retire next year, what are you going to do? I could be perfectly happy spending my days on a beach in Thailand sipping drinks and diving for the rest of my life. Or any other place. What's your plan?
I mean, don't just have a kid for something to do. But if you've got a plan, and this is throwing a wrench in it, bail. There are a lot of other people out there, like, a lot. Chances are you'll find another one who is as amazing as this one.
posted by booooooze at 11:39 AM on October 3, 2017 [4 favorites]
An utterly unhelpful anecdote: I had something of a similar turning point in a relationship several years ago, although we were younger and talking about marriage as a starting point. I spent several months trying to wrap my mind around it and I couldn't do it and I succumbed to some pretty bad anxiety that led to a break-up.
I don't know. My life is significantly more interesting for having gone down this path, but also significantly more miserable. I've dated some amazing people, had almost every kind of relationship that I'd care to have, and I've been living abroad and traveled a pretty significant chunk of the world. On the other hand, I went through years of an incredibly stressful neighborhood conflict that would have been much better with a spouse/ally, had some long periods of doing nothing but working and going home and I was downsized from my job without the moral support and security of having a spouse. Now I'm pretty doubtful about anything moving forward from dating to career.
That said, if you have the kind of savings that you're alluding to, then you're insanely better off than almost everyone who has had a kid. Retirement isn't all it's cracked up to be -- I've at least seen elders who have had mental breakdowns after retirement but maybe it would be better younger.
I think you're correct that you would have to give up your dream of early retirement if you had a child, but I also think that you would be better financially prepared than almost anyone who has a kid. And you're thoughtful about your mental health, which is also more than many people can say when it comes to child-rearing. It seems like your choices are pretty clear: trade "early retirement" for keeping your partner and starting a family in relative security or leave the relationship and strike out alone. I don't envy your choice, but, for what it's worth, if I had significant savings I might have chosen to stay with my ex. Security is more than just money, it's also knowing who will be there for you when you are ill or times are difficult.
posted by Skwirl at 12:56 PM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
I don't know. My life is significantly more interesting for having gone down this path, but also significantly more miserable. I've dated some amazing people, had almost every kind of relationship that I'd care to have, and I've been living abroad and traveled a pretty significant chunk of the world. On the other hand, I went through years of an incredibly stressful neighborhood conflict that would have been much better with a spouse/ally, had some long periods of doing nothing but working and going home and I was downsized from my job without the moral support and security of having a spouse. Now I'm pretty doubtful about anything moving forward from dating to career.
That said, if you have the kind of savings that you're alluding to, then you're insanely better off than almost everyone who has had a kid. Retirement isn't all it's cracked up to be -- I've at least seen elders who have had mental breakdowns after retirement but maybe it would be better younger.
I think you're correct that you would have to give up your dream of early retirement if you had a child, but I also think that you would be better financially prepared than almost anyone who has a kid. And you're thoughtful about your mental health, which is also more than many people can say when it comes to child-rearing. It seems like your choices are pretty clear: trade "early retirement" for keeping your partner and starting a family in relative security or leave the relationship and strike out alone. I don't envy your choice, but, for what it's worth, if I had significant savings I might have chosen to stay with my ex. Security is more than just money, it's also knowing who will be there for you when you are ill or times are difficult.
posted by Skwirl at 12:56 PM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Due to life circumstances, I had a child I wasn't excited about having. It was hard, and it was stressful, and as dearly as I love my child who is now an adult, it was not a super fulfilling experience. I definitely think that it's different when it's your child, but mostly because you are ultimately responsible for them. I am sure it's worked out for people who were ambivalent about having children who then went on to have them, but that's not the case for everyone. As I am nearing 40 and attempting to have a child now with my partner of 10 years, it's a completely different experience for me to be excited about the process.
If you really don't want to have a child, it's fair for that to be a deal breaker for you. Having a child is a much longer term commitment than a marriage, as they will exist in your life for all of yours/theirs. I would never tell a person to try to have a baby with someone when they aren't totally invested in having a baby with them.
posted by Nimmie Amee at 1:02 PM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
If you really don't want to have a child, it's fair for that to be a deal breaker for you. Having a child is a much longer term commitment than a marriage, as they will exist in your life for all of yours/theirs. I would never tell a person to try to have a baby with someone when they aren't totally invested in having a baby with them.
posted by Nimmie Amee at 1:02 PM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
If you do decide to have one, you have to go all in, 100%. Anything less is not fair to your kid, or your partner.
That might sound trite, but I have seen way too many guys outsource key parenting and household labour chores to their partners because they didn't want kids as much or some shit.
You can never, ever use your doubts about this to douche your responsibilities around being a parent or a partner; if you do, you may find divorce staring you in the face.
I love my kids they are the best party of my life, and I knew they would be, so I'm probably not very good on terms of giving advice about whether to have one or not. But I will say they are like an investment, the more you put in, the more you get out.
posted by smoke at 1:16 PM on October 3, 2017 [5 favorites]
That might sound trite, but I have seen way too many guys outsource key parenting and household labour chores to their partners because they didn't want kids as much or some shit.
You can never, ever use your doubts about this to douche your responsibilities around being a parent or a partner; if you do, you may find divorce staring you in the face.
I love my kids they are the best party of my life, and I knew they would be, so I'm probably not very good on terms of giving advice about whether to have one or not. But I will say they are like an investment, the more you put in, the more you get out.
posted by smoke at 1:16 PM on October 3, 2017 [5 favorites]
That should be "dodge", not douche, though it kinda works.
posted by smoke at 1:32 PM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by smoke at 1:32 PM on October 3, 2017 [10 favorites]
Really wishing for an anonymous option to reply.
I am a mother of three absolutely awesome and wonderful children. I love my kids. I adore my kids. But I hate being a parent. All three of my children were wanted and planned for. But, I didn't know myself very well or how my personality would mesh with having children. I do suffer from anxiety and depression and have struggled off and on with it for decades which may contribute to parenthood being not as awesome as I was told it would be. I, like you, need time to myself. I need copious amounts of time to myself. I keep waiting for the phase of child rearing when it's good and I'm good and I enjoy it. Sleepless infant years were brutal. I need my sleep desperately. The toddler years - honestly no clue how I got through those with having to constantly be aware and on the lookout for the safety of my children. The elementary school years - still rough navigating. And now I have two teenagers and one pre-teen and it's a new level of difficulty. People tell me that one day I'll miss the days of their infancy/toddlerhood/teen years. Hasn't happened yet. I feel like I'm just trying to survive and make sure they survive. There is no question that I love my children and that they know they are loved. It's one thing I'm very proud of - that they are secure and know they are loved. We all have our problems and issues to work through. None of us are perfect. I think my kids are the coolest and brightest and most beautiful people I know. But parenting is hard and I think it sucks. I'd love to just be their friend. But I also have to be a parent too.
Also, I think it's important to take into consideration circumstances, background, and really understand what you need to be a happy/content/stable/productive person. I think if I were doing it all over again, I'd realize the importance of sleep, my feelings of daily productiveness, physical health, and need for recharge time and make sure that even though I have children, that my needs are also met so that I could feel more like a productive contributing (my definition of those things) person.
I never liked any one else's kids, fwiw. Always disliked babysitting. Swapping babysitting with other parents was awful. I dreaded that when it came up. My nieces and nephews - love them because we're blood, but spending time with them or caring for them, was too stressful for me (and they are lovely well-behaved engaging kids!).
So, I really have no advice for you, I guess. Only that - you don't know until you're in the thick of it and it's too late to back out whether parenthood is right for you. It's an absolute leap of faith. I have friends who never wanted kids and then accidentally had a child and they absolutely love it and are all about being a parent. There are others that planned to have lots of kids but after one or two realize they aren't capable of doing much more than they currently are. I know of others who have and wanted children and have completely checked out of their lives. Who knows!
posted by Sassyfras at 1:52 PM on October 3, 2017 [14 favorites]
I am a mother of three absolutely awesome and wonderful children. I love my kids. I adore my kids. But I hate being a parent. All three of my children were wanted and planned for. But, I didn't know myself very well or how my personality would mesh with having children. I do suffer from anxiety and depression and have struggled off and on with it for decades which may contribute to parenthood being not as awesome as I was told it would be. I, like you, need time to myself. I need copious amounts of time to myself. I keep waiting for the phase of child rearing when it's good and I'm good and I enjoy it. Sleepless infant years were brutal. I need my sleep desperately. The toddler years - honestly no clue how I got through those with having to constantly be aware and on the lookout for the safety of my children. The elementary school years - still rough navigating. And now I have two teenagers and one pre-teen and it's a new level of difficulty. People tell me that one day I'll miss the days of their infancy/toddlerhood/teen years. Hasn't happened yet. I feel like I'm just trying to survive and make sure they survive. There is no question that I love my children and that they know they are loved. It's one thing I'm very proud of - that they are secure and know they are loved. We all have our problems and issues to work through. None of us are perfect. I think my kids are the coolest and brightest and most beautiful people I know. But parenting is hard and I think it sucks. I'd love to just be their friend. But I also have to be a parent too.
Also, I think it's important to take into consideration circumstances, background, and really understand what you need to be a happy/content/stable/productive person. I think if I were doing it all over again, I'd realize the importance of sleep, my feelings of daily productiveness, physical health, and need for recharge time and make sure that even though I have children, that my needs are also met so that I could feel more like a productive contributing (my definition of those things) person.
I never liked any one else's kids, fwiw. Always disliked babysitting. Swapping babysitting with other parents was awful. I dreaded that when it came up. My nieces and nephews - love them because we're blood, but spending time with them or caring for them, was too stressful for me (and they are lovely well-behaved engaging kids!).
So, I really have no advice for you, I guess. Only that - you don't know until you're in the thick of it and it's too late to back out whether parenthood is right for you. It's an absolute leap of faith. I have friends who never wanted kids and then accidentally had a child and they absolutely love it and are all about being a parent. There are others that planned to have lots of kids but after one or two realize they aren't capable of doing much more than they currently are. I know of others who have and wanted children and have completely checked out of their lives. Who knows!
posted by Sassyfras at 1:52 PM on October 3, 2017 [14 favorites]
I have a kid, I love her deeply, and I love being a parent. I don't think you should have a kid.
From your question, it sounds to me like the main reason you'd consider having a child is because your partner wants one and you love your partner. That's not a sufficient reason, IMO. If you were struggling with ambivalence more along the lines of loving sleep and alone time but also feeling some attraction to the idea of kids, I would tell you to go for it. But that's not what I'm getting from your post.
posted by JuliaJellicoe at 2:23 PM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
From your question, it sounds to me like the main reason you'd consider having a child is because your partner wants one and you love your partner. That's not a sufficient reason, IMO. If you were struggling with ambivalence more along the lines of loving sleep and alone time but also feeling some attraction to the idea of kids, I would tell you to go for it. But that's not what I'm getting from your post.
posted by JuliaJellicoe at 2:23 PM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]
I know so many women who, as a child, were abandoned/didn’t get healthy attention from their fathers. It’s destroyed their lives and made therapists richer. You sound like a great person, and it sounds like you would show up for your kid, no matter what, even if you separated. But if I’m wrong, remember this is taking on a responsibility to be a healthy presence in this child’s life for 18 years+. Do not have a human just to make someone else happy without committing to the child’s happiness as well. You will damage that child/human.
posted by Vaike at 3:11 PM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Vaike at 3:11 PM on October 3, 2017 [2 favorites]
I don't see anything in your question that suggests you should have a child.
posted by masquesoporfavor at 4:59 PM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by masquesoporfavor at 4:59 PM on October 3, 2017 [11 favorites]
Don't have kids if you don't want them. Don't do that to a kid. We can tell, even if it takes us about 30 years to realize it. Don't do it.
posted by Meow Face at 6:48 PM on October 3, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by Meow Face at 6:48 PM on October 3, 2017 [16 favorites]
All you've given us is a bunch of reasons why you shouldn't have a child and don't want one, the only reasons pro having one is because your partner wants one and you're gambling on the chance it might make you more fulfilled. These are nowhere near good enough reasons.
Even parents desperate for children can find it a very hard grind at times so I can't imagine how much harder it would be if you passionately didn't want a baby in the first place. If you're looking for fulfilment, take up Buddhism and let your girlfriend find someone who actually wants kids. It's the only fair thing to do, for everyone.
posted by Jubey at 9:59 PM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
Even parents desperate for children can find it a very hard grind at times so I can't imagine how much harder it would be if you passionately didn't want a baby in the first place. If you're looking for fulfilment, take up Buddhism and let your girlfriend find someone who actually wants kids. It's the only fair thing to do, for everyone.
posted by Jubey at 9:59 PM on October 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
Let your girlfriend go. You don’t want the same thing and this way she won’t resent you later for having wasted her time.
Let her go and let her go find someone who also wants kids.
posted by Kwadeng at 10:32 PM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Let her go and let her go find someone who also wants kids.
posted by Kwadeng at 10:32 PM on October 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Lots of answers, lots of viewpoints. Which is normal, because everyone here has some kind of family dynamic. Some are parents, some are not, but all have been someone's child, at least for a while.
So let's think a little while for the pro-parenting side.
1) Step back and use your imagination, no pressure. How many children do you want? (Again, this is just pretending.) What is the optimal spacing? Two or more in high school, or one still in grade school when the other is in college?
One of our reasons for having, and stopping at, two children close in age was that, when we are gone, they will still have each other. They may not necessarily like each other (we cannot guarantee that) but they will still have immediate family. They also have cousins, but that was not something we could plan for them.
2) Think of the best family dynamic that you have personally seen, from a friend or relative or close acquaintance. How did the father (or paternal figure) relate to the children? How did it evolve from dealing with babies, to toddlers, up to teens and young adults? This isn't a perfect blueprint for parenting, but it is one good example in your past. You can build from that.
3) All parents have the "fantasy child," right up until the moment of birth. Then we must bury the "fantasy child" and accept the human in front of us. But for a moment, who is your "fantasy child?" Bookish, outdoorsy, artistic, intellectual? A bit shy, a bit of a smarty-pants? You love your child, because he is your child. But would you honestly become a friend with the person your child is turning out to be? Do you like this person, separate from your family dynamic?
What if your actual child is quite different from the child of your imagination? Can you accept him, even if you can't understand him? One joy of parenting is looking at the world anew through your child's eyes. He is not you. He has his own perspective. Watching a child grow up is... amazing.
4) You will change as a parent. You will be confronted with your weaknesses. You will fail -- often. You will disappoint yourself. And you will survive. In fact, you may pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and try something else... and succeed. Often.
More important, your child will be just fine, sail through it, and look! You're a good parent, in spite of yourself!
It's shocking how resilient children are. After all, parenting is the biggest amateur act there is. And no one can redo their childhood -- we get it right the first time or we don't.
I'd be more worried if you were not introspective about parenting. It's a tough job. And it doesn't stop once the child becomes 18 years old.
One of my best memories is the time my mom and I visited my grandmother in California. I woke up in the middle of the night on the sleeper sofa... and Grannie was tucking the covers around Mom's neck.
There aren't many lifetime responsibilities. Parenting is one of them.
So tie a knot in your patience and just hang in there. You'll learn, and in spite of yourself, you'll do just fine.
posted by TrishaU at 12:16 AM on October 4, 2017 [1 favorite]
So let's think a little while for the pro-parenting side.
1) Step back and use your imagination, no pressure. How many children do you want? (Again, this is just pretending.) What is the optimal spacing? Two or more in high school, or one still in grade school when the other is in college?
One of our reasons for having, and stopping at, two children close in age was that, when we are gone, they will still have each other. They may not necessarily like each other (we cannot guarantee that) but they will still have immediate family. They also have cousins, but that was not something we could plan for them.
2) Think of the best family dynamic that you have personally seen, from a friend or relative or close acquaintance. How did the father (or paternal figure) relate to the children? How did it evolve from dealing with babies, to toddlers, up to teens and young adults? This isn't a perfect blueprint for parenting, but it is one good example in your past. You can build from that.
3) All parents have the "fantasy child," right up until the moment of birth. Then we must bury the "fantasy child" and accept the human in front of us. But for a moment, who is your "fantasy child?" Bookish, outdoorsy, artistic, intellectual? A bit shy, a bit of a smarty-pants? You love your child, because he is your child. But would you honestly become a friend with the person your child is turning out to be? Do you like this person, separate from your family dynamic?
What if your actual child is quite different from the child of your imagination? Can you accept him, even if you can't understand him? One joy of parenting is looking at the world anew through your child's eyes. He is not you. He has his own perspective. Watching a child grow up is... amazing.
4) You will change as a parent. You will be confronted with your weaknesses. You will fail -- often. You will disappoint yourself. And you will survive. In fact, you may pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and try something else... and succeed. Often.
More important, your child will be just fine, sail through it, and look! You're a good parent, in spite of yourself!
It's shocking how resilient children are. After all, parenting is the biggest amateur act there is. And no one can redo their childhood -- we get it right the first time or we don't.
I'd be more worried if you were not introspective about parenting. It's a tough job. And it doesn't stop once the child becomes 18 years old.
One of my best memories is the time my mom and I visited my grandmother in California. I woke up in the middle of the night on the sleeper sofa... and Grannie was tucking the covers around Mom's neck.
There aren't many lifetime responsibilities. Parenting is one of them.
So tie a knot in your patience and just hang in there. You'll learn, and in spite of yourself, you'll do just fine.
posted by TrishaU at 12:16 AM on October 4, 2017 [1 favorite]
Now... you've read that, right?
How do you feel?
That's your answer.
posted by TrishaU at 12:17 AM on October 4, 2017
How do you feel?
That's your answer.
posted by TrishaU at 12:17 AM on October 4, 2017
The assumption seems to be that his girlfriend is dead-set on having a child and that it's a dealbreaker for her, and that the OP may need to change his kids stance in order to stay with her.
And maybe that's true. But maybe it isn't. How badly does she want kids? Would she break up with you if you were to decide you don't want kids? Or would she be willing to forgo kids in order to stay with you (the opposite of the question you're grappling with)?
Food for thought, and probably food for a discussion with her.
posted by whitelily at 6:24 AM on October 4, 2017 [2 favorites]
And maybe that's true. But maybe it isn't. How badly does she want kids? Would she break up with you if you were to decide you don't want kids? Or would she be willing to forgo kids in order to stay with you (the opposite of the question you're grappling with)?
Food for thought, and probably food for a discussion with her.
posted by whitelily at 6:24 AM on October 4, 2017 [2 favorites]
I vote no. If you haven't been more on the yes-to-ambivalent spectrum by now i don't think anything will tip you in that direction, especially since you seem to have a lot of freedom in your life withwhat not having to slog to a job every day. There is no freedom with kids. They are very time intensive, even moreso than money intensive in my case.
to argue against my own stance of you should not have a kid: IF you really do love your partner, while you will be someone's parent forever, if you intend to stay together forever with your spouse over the course of a hopefully normal lifespan it will be them that you see more on a daily basis. Kids grow up and move out, but your spouse is always there. So if you are just a little ambivalent AND you believe you can be a loving and involved parent, then maybe it will all turn out good.
posted by WeekendJen at 9:51 AM on October 4, 2017
to argue against my own stance of you should not have a kid: IF you really do love your partner, while you will be someone's parent forever, if you intend to stay together forever with your spouse over the course of a hopefully normal lifespan it will be them that you see more on a daily basis. Kids grow up and move out, but your spouse is always there. So if you are just a little ambivalent AND you believe you can be a loving and involved parent, then maybe it will all turn out good.
posted by WeekendJen at 9:51 AM on October 4, 2017
Y'all who are wishing to reply anonymously: you can message the mods to post your reply for you.
posted by fiercecupcake at 12:53 PM on October 4, 2017
posted by fiercecupcake at 12:53 PM on October 4, 2017
Yes, please have a child. It's transformative, and you're right on the brink of feeling that yourself.
posted by Capri at 10:38 AM on October 5, 2017
posted by Capri at 10:38 AM on October 5, 2017
I had to break up with a long-term girlfriend over the issue of kids. While it was very painful, I don't regret it at all. Having to spend a lifetime as a parent would have been far worse.
Like you, I'm a relatively anxious person who dislikes the company of children, and being a parent is not really something I have seriously considered. I struggled with having to lose my soulmate, but looking back it was the right decision. Relationships are valuable, but they are not worth sacrificing your dreams and making choices that simply aren't compatible with who you are as a person.
I suggesting taking the pain early and finding someone who is enthusiastic about saving for an early retirement with you and spending your free time doing whatever you want. Don't settle for less.
posted by Orchestra at 7:10 AM on November 8, 2017 [1 favorite]
Like you, I'm a relatively anxious person who dislikes the company of children, and being a parent is not really something I have seriously considered. I struggled with having to lose my soulmate, but looking back it was the right decision. Relationships are valuable, but they are not worth sacrificing your dreams and making choices that simply aren't compatible with who you are as a person.
I suggesting taking the pain early and finding someone who is enthusiastic about saving for an early retirement with you and spending your free time doing whatever you want. Don't settle for less.
posted by Orchestra at 7:10 AM on November 8, 2017 [1 favorite]
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posted by corb at 5:16 AM on October 3, 2017 [3 favorites]