How do I tell my close friend that Other Friend is toxic to me?
December 23, 2016 3:05 AM Subscribe
I'm one of 8 people Debbie has invited to her birthday celebration. She and I are close friends. All the invitees are great and I am fine with them. Except for Eric.
Eric is the worst sort of toxic narcissist, and sucks the energy out of every situation. He is a mean girl in 30-something gay-manchild form. He is a gossip, liar, shade-thrower and loves to instigate drama and feed his own ego at everyone else's expense. He is someone I must very strictly limit my exposure to, and most of the time it's not a difficult task. But this is different.
I love Debbie and very much want to be part of her special celebration but the prospect of being anywhere near Eric in concentrated form is making me break out in hives. I just cannot do it. I'm in an uber-self protection mode right now after a year of many emotionally shattering experiences. I have zero capital to invest on anyone else. Sitting through an evening of Eric's BS and attention-whore drama makes me feel sick. To expect me to just suck it up for one evening, even for a close dear friend, is asking the impossible right now.
But it feels just as impossible to tell Debbie this. I have never directly articulated the depths of my distaste for Eric to her. One main reason is, she carries around her own matched set of insecurities and would very likely take it the wrong way, and think I tar her with the same brush for even choosing him as a friend. There is some accuracy to this, since one reason I dislike him so intensely is he brings out in her many of the behaviors and personality elements that make him so unpleasant. I forgive her those tendencies because she's usually smart and caring enough to rise above them. But together, she and Eric feed off each other and validate those shared negative traits. When he is there, she smokes a whole pack, drinks herself to puking, verbally trashes others, and devolves into the person you hated in high school. In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around. How can you unpack that to someone you consider one of your best friends, when you've kept it hidden for so long?
We're part of a social circle related to a common interest and will never not find ourselves in each others' orbit. I do not want to put her in a position of having to "choose between us," or manage her life around making sure that I only spend time with her when Eric is not part of the situation. Because he will always be part of so many social things we participate in. I can (and usually) do choose to engineer my time & attendance at (or avoid outright) any events where I know he'll be. But this birthday thing is not something I can treat like that. She already knows I am not busy on the day of her event (it's next week). I have thus far avoided responding to her direct question via text about why I have not replied to the Evite. But time's a-wasting.
Eric is the worst sort of toxic narcissist, and sucks the energy out of every situation. He is a mean girl in 30-something gay-manchild form. He is a gossip, liar, shade-thrower and loves to instigate drama and feed his own ego at everyone else's expense. He is someone I must very strictly limit my exposure to, and most of the time it's not a difficult task. But this is different.
I love Debbie and very much want to be part of her special celebration but the prospect of being anywhere near Eric in concentrated form is making me break out in hives. I just cannot do it. I'm in an uber-self protection mode right now after a year of many emotionally shattering experiences. I have zero capital to invest on anyone else. Sitting through an evening of Eric's BS and attention-whore drama makes me feel sick. To expect me to just suck it up for one evening, even for a close dear friend, is asking the impossible right now.
But it feels just as impossible to tell Debbie this. I have never directly articulated the depths of my distaste for Eric to her. One main reason is, she carries around her own matched set of insecurities and would very likely take it the wrong way, and think I tar her with the same brush for even choosing him as a friend. There is some accuracy to this, since one reason I dislike him so intensely is he brings out in her many of the behaviors and personality elements that make him so unpleasant. I forgive her those tendencies because she's usually smart and caring enough to rise above them. But together, she and Eric feed off each other and validate those shared negative traits. When he is there, she smokes a whole pack, drinks herself to puking, verbally trashes others, and devolves into the person you hated in high school. In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around. How can you unpack that to someone you consider one of your best friends, when you've kept it hidden for so long?
We're part of a social circle related to a common interest and will never not find ourselves in each others' orbit. I do not want to put her in a position of having to "choose between us," or manage her life around making sure that I only spend time with her when Eric is not part of the situation. Because he will always be part of so many social things we participate in. I can (and usually) do choose to engineer my time & attendance at (or avoid outright) any events where I know he'll be. But this birthday thing is not something I can treat like that. She already knows I am not busy on the day of her event (it's next week). I have thus far avoided responding to her direct question via text about why I have not replied to the Evite. But time's a-wasting.
Say you will attend, fake an illness or emergency on the day, then the next day contact her with profuse apologies and beg her to let you make it up to her by treating her to a lavish fancy restaurant dinner, just the two of you.
posted by tel3path at 3:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [39 favorites]
posted by tel3path at 3:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [39 favorites]
Just Say No, and lie about the reason bc real reason is too drama causing for a birthday party.
You have a family thing.
You have a work thing.
You have a norovirus thing.
posted by sacchan at 3:19 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
You have a family thing.
You have a work thing.
You have a norovirus thing.
posted by sacchan at 3:19 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
Show up super early, hug Debbie and give her a present, Oh No you're feeling really sick, just gross, rain check, lavish makeup dinner later.
posted by moonlight on vermont at 4:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by moonlight on vermont at 4:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [25 favorites]
Agreed with those above. You need to pull a Bunbury on this one. I think Eric falls into the category of 'bad old friends' with Debbie. People often behave in out-of-character ways and refuse to listen to wisdom around their old friends. And when called on it, they cut you out of their lives, not them. Loyalty to childhood good times is a powerful thing. I'd tread carefully here and avoid the subject of Eric with Debbie altogether as much as possible.
posted by backwards compatible at 4:35 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by backwards compatible at 4:35 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
Or you know, suck it up for a few hours and deal with the toxic narcissist because Debbie is your friend. You know the limits of your tolerance. You can go and suck it up, not go and tell debbie why and create your own version of drama, or not go and make up an excuse. It's just a birthday party, not a wedding. People miss those.
posted by spitbull at 5:23 AM on December 23, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by spitbull at 5:23 AM on December 23, 2016 [11 favorites]
I think it's entirely overkill to make Debbie's birthday party into a referendum about you, your emotional state, and your response to one of her other friends. You can just a) not like the guy, b) send your regrets and a lovely gift while hoping her party is fabulous, and c) go on with your life. There is no reason to tell Debbie how you feel about Eric, unless she specifically asks you for advice, much less use her birthday party as the opportunity where you dump all your baggage on her and put her in a shitty position where she has to choose between her friends. Damn.
It's just a party. Skip it, avoid the jerk, and take care of yourself. If Debbie eventually notices that you skip events where Eric is present, tell her that you don't care for him and it's not a reflection on her. But this is not the time to unload a bunch of TMI about the dynamic between her and Eric, or you and Eric. Maybe some other time, when you are in a better head space, and it's not in the middle of trying to plan a big event. But not now, when she is trying to make a nice thing happen for herself and her friends. That would be entirely inappropriate.
posted by Autumnheart at 6:27 AM on December 23, 2016 [43 favorites]
It's just a party. Skip it, avoid the jerk, and take care of yourself. If Debbie eventually notices that you skip events where Eric is present, tell her that you don't care for him and it's not a reflection on her. But this is not the time to unload a bunch of TMI about the dynamic between her and Eric, or you and Eric. Maybe some other time, when you are in a better head space, and it's not in the middle of trying to plan a big event. But not now, when she is trying to make a nice thing happen for herself and her friends. That would be entirely inappropriate.
posted by Autumnheart at 6:27 AM on December 23, 2016 [43 favorites]
Agree with above comments. A headache can be a pretty good reason to leave early.
If it's on a weeknight and you are known for having a somewhat demanding job - unexpected issue at work meant you had to work really late.
posted by bunderful at 6:28 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
If it's on a weeknight and you are known for having a somewhat demanding job - unexpected issue at work meant you had to work really late.
posted by bunderful at 6:28 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
Just tell her you can't make it on that evening but you would love to make it up to her and take her out for a birthday drink or meal or movie 1:1 at another time. You really don't need to make a federal case about it. You're feeling uncomfortable explaining your reasons to Debbie because you should . Her choice in friends is not your concern. If you don't want to be around her when she is around him, then don't. You are making this whole thing about you, and it's not about you, it's about Debbie and how she wants to celebrate her birthday. She'll get on with her 7 friends and see you later!
posted by pazazygeek at 7:06 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by pazazygeek at 7:06 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
And it's not even to say that the conversation about Eric/her isn't worth having. Just have it on one of the 358 days of the year that are not her birthday and the planning thereof. Don't stink up someone else's special occasion, that should just be a rule. There are loads of opportunities for conversations and relationship-building, but let people have their hour of recognition. It's not a mismanagement of priorities to share the spotlight.
posted by Autumnheart at 7:27 AM on December 23, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by Autumnheart at 7:27 AM on December 23, 2016 [10 favorites]
I probably wouldn't lie to her, if this is going to be an ongoing issue every time she has a party and Eric is invited. Are you going to be mysteriously sick every year? Just come out and tell her the truth.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:31 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:31 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Tell her something has come up but that you can come by for one drink, or whatever the group is doing. Bring a gift and leave after half an hour. It will mean something to her that you showed up even if it is hit and split. (Something has come up = the thing with Eric has gotten too much, but you don't have to say that. If pressed I would say I just have too much going on or am very overwhelmed or something since that is true; you have a bunch going on.)
posted by BibiRose at 7:37 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by BibiRose at 7:37 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
On this occasion, show your face and leave early. No drama, it's a birthday, etc.
But for later - is there a reason you're not calling him on his bullshit when you see it? Take him down a peg when he's being a wiener. Use humour if you can, but don't let him get away with really nasty things, in the moment. It'll feel better than stewing quietly for the whole duration of The Eric Show. (Debbie loves the Eric Show because she finds it entertaining, not a lot you can do about that, but guaranteed that others don't, so much.) It'll teach him to back off a bit around you, at least. (He will likely mock you for it initially - stand your ground!)
posted by cotton dress sock at 7:53 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
But for later - is there a reason you're not calling him on his bullshit when you see it? Take him down a peg when he's being a wiener. Use humour if you can, but don't let him get away with really nasty things, in the moment. It'll feel better than stewing quietly for the whole duration of The Eric Show. (Debbie loves the Eric Show because she finds it entertaining, not a lot you can do about that, but guaranteed that others don't, so much.) It'll teach him to back off a bit around you, at least. (He will likely mock you for it initially - stand your ground!)
posted by cotton dress sock at 7:53 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Honestly, 8 people is a large enough party to be able to avoid someone during the festivities. Unless he is planning on jumping onto the table in the middle of dinner, I think you can successfully go to this party and just avoid this person, i.e. sit on the other side of the table, chat closely with others when out dancing etc.
I've successfully done something similar. It takes the power to politely ignore and not engage.
posted by Toddles at 7:54 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
I've successfully done something similar. It takes the power to politely ignore and not engage.
posted by Toddles at 7:54 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
I agree with the others, the one thing you should not do is make Debbie's party about you. It sounds like you have very legitimate reasons to want to not be around Eric but they are your reasons and your friend gets to choose her other companions, even if you don't like them, based on her own experience of them.
In your shoes, I'd have two priorities: maintaining my own mental health, and second, being kind to my friend and helping her enjoy her birthday. Only you know how far you can go in trying to balance the two. If you don't think you can be around the dude at all, then come down with the "diplomatic flu" on the night, wish your friend well, and take her out for special drinks/dinner etc. in a day or two.
Just don't make her do the emotional labour of sorting out your problems with this guy when she should be enjoying herself, by having some kind of drama-filled discussion before--or worse, during--her party.
posted by rpfields at 8:04 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
In your shoes, I'd have two priorities: maintaining my own mental health, and second, being kind to my friend and helping her enjoy her birthday. Only you know how far you can go in trying to balance the two. If you don't think you can be around the dude at all, then come down with the "diplomatic flu" on the night, wish your friend well, and take her out for special drinks/dinner etc. in a day or two.
Just don't make her do the emotional labour of sorting out your problems with this guy when she should be enjoying herself, by having some kind of drama-filled discussion before--or worse, during--her party.
posted by rpfields at 8:04 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I have some friends who don't all jibe with one another. I recently had a friend cancel on an event where one of my other friends was going to be there and she just dropped me an email and said "Hey I'm feeling a little less resilient than usual and really don't feel like engaging with this sort of energy today, so I'm going to stay home but let's find another time to get together. Thanks for being the kind of friends I can say this to."
In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around.
At some level though, this is also about your friend. She is different with Eric than with you and this is your issue with her and not really with him. You don't like him, that's totally fine, but it seems like one of the issues you have is that she DOES like him. You can bring that up at some other not-her-birthday time as an issue of your friendship (i.e. "this is affecting me and you in THIS way") and she can really decide how she wants to manage being friends with both Eric and you. And it may be that you have to have an honest "Hey when you are with Eric, you act in ways I don't like" talk with her and see what she says, maybe she agrees, maybe she doesn't.
I have a few close friends and a lot of acquaintances that I mix and match at events. Some of them don't get along. I do (in my head) have sort of a triage of which people's opinions I care about more/less in case I do need to mitigate "Well THIS person won't go unless THAT person doesn't go" at dinner party sorts of things but on my birthday I'm inviting whoever I want to and I expect friends to sort that stuff out themselves. Sounds like you don't want to go to this even or maybe just want to make a brief appearance?
posted by jessamyn at 8:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around.
At some level though, this is also about your friend. She is different with Eric than with you and this is your issue with her and not really with him. You don't like him, that's totally fine, but it seems like one of the issues you have is that she DOES like him. You can bring that up at some other not-her-birthday time as an issue of your friendship (i.e. "this is affecting me and you in THIS way") and she can really decide how she wants to manage being friends with both Eric and you. And it may be that you have to have an honest "Hey when you are with Eric, you act in ways I don't like" talk with her and see what she says, maybe she agrees, maybe she doesn't.
I have a few close friends and a lot of acquaintances that I mix and match at events. Some of them don't get along. I do (in my head) have sort of a triage of which people's opinions I care about more/less in case I do need to mitigate "Well THIS person won't go unless THAT person doesn't go" at dinner party sorts of things but on my birthday I'm inviting whoever I want to and I expect friends to sort that stuff out themselves. Sounds like you don't want to go to this even or maybe just want to make a brief appearance?
posted by jessamyn at 8:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
I guess I feel like an adult should be able to tolerate sharing a room with someone... Intolerable. It's not Dick Cheney or your abusive ex husband. With respect I say, this party is about Debbie, not you. Suck it up and don't stand on his side of the room.
If you are absolutely unwilling to do this, then make up a plausible lie and get her an awesome birthday present.
posted by latkes at 8:31 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
If you are absolutely unwilling to do this, then make up a plausible lie and get her an awesome birthday present.
posted by latkes at 8:31 AM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
BTW. I sort of agree with the people telling you to either suck it up or lie because this party is about Debbie, but only sort of, because I think this is really the core of your question--
When he is there, she smokes a whole pack, drinks herself to puking, verbally trashes others, and devolves into the person you hated in high school. In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around. How can you unpack that to someone you consider one of your best friends, when you've kept it hidden for so long?
There's going to be a time when you will probably have to tell Debbie that you don't want to be around her when she's shitfaced drunk. If this involves a years-long pattern of binge drinking on her part and she's regularly getting drunk to the point of vomiting when you're in your 30's, this might be a big conversation that you're going to want to time correctly. A birthday isn't an appropriate occasion for a "no, I can't RSVP, sorry, I hoped I wouldn't have to confront you about your destructive alcoholism but I just can't handle it anymore." This is going to be a hard conversation to have and I wish you the best whenever you do have to have it, but I really don't think this particular social event is the time for it.
posted by moonlight on vermont at 8:51 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
When he is there, she smokes a whole pack, drinks herself to puking, verbally trashes others, and devolves into the person you hated in high school. In his presence she turns into someone I simply don't want to be around. How can you unpack that to someone you consider one of your best friends, when you've kept it hidden for so long?
There's going to be a time when you will probably have to tell Debbie that you don't want to be around her when she's shitfaced drunk. If this involves a years-long pattern of binge drinking on her part and she's regularly getting drunk to the point of vomiting when you're in your 30's, this might be a big conversation that you're going to want to time correctly. A birthday isn't an appropriate occasion for a "no, I can't RSVP, sorry, I hoped I wouldn't have to confront you about your destructive alcoholism but I just can't handle it anymore." This is going to be a hard conversation to have and I wish you the best whenever you do have to have it, but I really don't think this particular social event is the time for it.
posted by moonlight on vermont at 8:51 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
Best answer: Hey I've been in this situation!
In my case the toxic person in question has a history of targeting certain "special" friends, ignoring their boundaries, and going out their way to fuck with their lives. I figured out I was next on her list and nope'd the fuck out, HARD. She pushed a lot of buttons for me, and that is exacerbated by the fact that stress very demonstratively and negatively affects my health. I have to make a lot of choices about where I spend my spoons etc. Being around this person, knowing I was being targeted, literally made me sick.
So, I told people I couldn't go, and didn't give a reason. When it came up later on (sometimes months later), I was just like, yeah, I can't be around her, she stresses me out and I get sick. It really bugs me that I have to rely on the medical stuff--like I don't think I should have to point to "provable" medical problems when mental distress is valid on its own. It did help that other people know she has this history of huge blow ups and crazy drama.
Anyway. "I'm sorry, there's a lot going on right now and I'm not going to be able to make it. I'd love to see you another time." And then I would feel out how to explain future Eric avoidance necessity further down the road. If she flips out at the idea that someone is really bad for you to be around and this is just a boundary you need to set, I'm gonna suggest that maybe she's not the greatest friend right now.
I also kind of feel like the people in this thread saying to just get over it have maybe never been really hurt by someone with this pathology, because...yeah. "Just ignore them" is emphatically not how malevolent narcissism works.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:00 AM on December 23, 2016 [19 favorites]
In my case the toxic person in question has a history of targeting certain "special" friends, ignoring their boundaries, and going out their way to fuck with their lives. I figured out I was next on her list and nope'd the fuck out, HARD. She pushed a lot of buttons for me, and that is exacerbated by the fact that stress very demonstratively and negatively affects my health. I have to make a lot of choices about where I spend my spoons etc. Being around this person, knowing I was being targeted, literally made me sick.
So, I told people I couldn't go, and didn't give a reason. When it came up later on (sometimes months later), I was just like, yeah, I can't be around her, she stresses me out and I get sick. It really bugs me that I have to rely on the medical stuff--like I don't think I should have to point to "provable" medical problems when mental distress is valid on its own. It did help that other people know she has this history of huge blow ups and crazy drama.
Anyway. "I'm sorry, there's a lot going on right now and I'm not going to be able to make it. I'd love to see you another time." And then I would feel out how to explain future Eric avoidance necessity further down the road. If she flips out at the idea that someone is really bad for you to be around and this is just a boundary you need to set, I'm gonna suggest that maybe she's not the greatest friend right now.
I also kind of feel like the people in this thread saying to just get over it have maybe never been really hurt by someone with this pathology, because...yeah. "Just ignore them" is emphatically not how malevolent narcissism works.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:00 AM on December 23, 2016 [19 favorites]
Yeah also agreed that this sort of mean girl party behavior is weird in your thirties. I have a straight female friend who ran into this as she came up on thirty -- the kinds of things she did with her gay boys was no longer...totally sustainable. You can't go out and do a shit ton of coke so you can drink until 5am as an actual adult -- except there is still a subculture of gay dudes who apparently do this. Frankly I wonder if they just recover faster than women of the same age (testosterone?), so it doesn't like literally ruin their lives for a week? Because otherwise I just do not understand.
But even the dudes in that subculture seem to be aging out of it. Idk. It is...really hard to have a conversation with someone about how they're holding on to their youth in all the wrong ways. I might suggest that you don't take on that burden--all you can do is set the boundaries that matter to you, for you. If you push her on this you will make your reasonable boundaries feel like a personal attack on her, and it will go badly.
Set the boundaries that work for you. You don't have to give her all the details, but tell her Eric is a problem for you (eventually). For YOU, not her. If she eventually comes around to realizing that Eric is also a problem for her, this will make it a lot more likely that she's able to talk to you about it.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:09 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
But even the dudes in that subculture seem to be aging out of it. Idk. It is...really hard to have a conversation with someone about how they're holding on to their youth in all the wrong ways. I might suggest that you don't take on that burden--all you can do is set the boundaries that matter to you, for you. If you push her on this you will make your reasonable boundaries feel like a personal attack on her, and it will go badly.
Set the boundaries that work for you. You don't have to give her all the details, but tell her Eric is a problem for you (eventually). For YOU, not her. If she eventually comes around to realizing that Eric is also a problem for her, this will make it a lot more likely that she's able to talk to you about it.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:09 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
Whatever you do, please don't say you will attend and then cancel on the day of, that is super rude and actually kind of cruel.
posted by bq at 9:45 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by bq at 9:45 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
"I'm sorry, there's a lot going on right now and I'm not going to be able to make it. I'd love to see you another time." And then I would feel out how to explain future Eric avoidance necessity further down the road. If she flips out at the idea that someone is really bad for you to be around and this is just a boundary you need to set, I'm gonna suggest that maybe she's not the greatest friend right now.
schadenfrau is spot on. Since you waited so long to RSVP, this is probably the most gracious way to get out of going. If you fake an illness on the day, or try to suck it up and attend, then leave early, it might come off as manipulative and unintentionally sabotage any latter attempt you make to talk to your friend about Eric and her problematic behavior around him.
posted by LuckySeven~ at 10:26 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
schadenfrau is spot on. Since you waited so long to RSVP, this is probably the most gracious way to get out of going. If you fake an illness on the day, or try to suck it up and attend, then leave early, it might come off as manipulative and unintentionally sabotage any latter attempt you make to talk to your friend about Eric and her problematic behavior around him.
posted by LuckySeven~ at 10:26 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Hey when you are with Eric, you act in ways I don't like" talk with her and see what she says, maybe she agrees, maybe she doesn't.
How about instead you say: I care about you, and I believe that when you're around Eric, you act in waysI don't like that feel hurtful to me, and more importantly, I feel they're hurtful to you and not who you normally are as a person. You normally don't do X, Y, and Z (smokes a whole pack, drinks herself to puking, verbally trashes others, and I wonder if you are entirely comfortable with that? It is your choice whether or not to set boundaries with regard to your relationship with Eric. I know that I need to set certain boundaries for my personal health, and they will be these .... Let's talk about it again later.
posted by BlueHorse at 11:59 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
How about instead you say: I care about you, and I believe that when you're around Eric, you act in ways
posted by BlueHorse at 11:59 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
I have an alternate suggestion. Go there, bring a gift, plaster a smile on your face. Join in the festivities with an open heart and try and engage with both of these people. Then, when they get shitfaced drunk and start ripping into you or the waiter's hair or your mother, or cross whatever boundary you have, step back and tell them you've had just about enough of this and you're going home. Do it quietly without making a scene, but do it. Keeping in mind it might happen five minutes into the evening.
That way you've been the bigger person, maintained your boundaries and comfort zone and the onus is back on them for ruining the night, there's no way they can blame you because they're catty bitches that made a party so bad that guests walked out. They now know what you will or won't put up with and next time you want to bow out of a get together, no one will be surprised and no explanation will be needed. And who knows, if more did it, these people might actually be forced to examine their drinking and behaviour. Wouldn't that be terrible. The fact that she is your friend doesn't mean she doesn't have to bear responsibility for her actions.
posted by Jubey at 1:25 PM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
That way you've been the bigger person, maintained your boundaries and comfort zone and the onus is back on them for ruining the night, there's no way they can blame you because they're catty bitches that made a party so bad that guests walked out. They now know what you will or won't put up with and next time you want to bow out of a get together, no one will be surprised and no explanation will be needed. And who knows, if more did it, these people might actually be forced to examine their drinking and behaviour. Wouldn't that be terrible. The fact that she is your friend doesn't mean she doesn't have to bear responsibility for her actions.
posted by Jubey at 1:25 PM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm not really sure what him being gay has to do with anything.
You can either ask to hang out with Debbie one on one, or plan your own events without inviting Eric. If anyone asks why he's not invited, say you don't find binge drinking to be a fun activity anymore.
posted by blackzinfandel at 3:32 PM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
You can either ask to hang out with Debbie one on one, or plan your own events without inviting Eric. If anyone asks why he's not invited, say you don't find binge drinking to be a fun activity anymore.
posted by blackzinfandel at 3:32 PM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
Please don't lie. Just tell her you can't make it and make plans to treat her 1:1 later on.
I'd talk to her about it in a non confrontational way later. There's a guy in my social circle that I'm not very comfortable with and i just got angrier and angrier until i finally talked to some of the people who organize things more often and now they make sure to do things like make sure, for instance, i wouldn't be paired up with him for a secret santa exchange, or, in dinners, they low-key make sure there's no way that we'll be seated together. I still have to put up with him bc i've accepted that the guys are very good friends with him and i'd rather put up with him every once in awhile than avoid the entire group, but talking about it frankly to some trusted people has helped.
posted by raw sugar at 6:12 PM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'd talk to her about it in a non confrontational way later. There's a guy in my social circle that I'm not very comfortable with and i just got angrier and angrier until i finally talked to some of the people who organize things more often and now they make sure to do things like make sure, for instance, i wouldn't be paired up with him for a secret santa exchange, or, in dinners, they low-key make sure there's no way that we'll be seated together. I still have to put up with him bc i've accepted that the guys are very good friends with him and i'd rather put up with him every once in awhile than avoid the entire group, but talking about it frankly to some trusted people has helped.
posted by raw sugar at 6:12 PM on December 23, 2016 [1 favorite]
I would tell the truth, say that you think having you and Eric in the same room will create an unpleasant atmosphere and that you don't want to spoil her birthday, and offer to take her out another time instead.
posted by intensitymultiply at 12:48 AM on December 24, 2016
posted by intensitymultiply at 12:48 AM on December 24, 2016
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by crocomancer at 3:14 AM on December 23, 2016 [26 favorites]