Rental Improvement - toilet, tub, kitchen grout
July 6, 2016 11:54 AM Subscribe
Asking for relative: who is responsible for these aesthetic repairs when the tenant has lived in the apartment for 6+years and intends to remain?
Toilet seat - the one that they put in is cheap and falling apart literally. Sawdust appears near the seat hinges. Bottom portion is fine. Who replaces the toilet seat? Tenant or landlord?
Kitchen grout -the landlord replace/repair the moldy grout maybe 2 years ago, but mold continues to appear. Can relative ask landlord to replace/repair again without repercussions ( like increase in rent)? Might the problem be low quality grout or unprofessional work? Is there an easy way to whitening/clean/replace grout by relative that is easy and will make an aesthetic impact?
Tub - original tub was peeling in certain places so landlord re-glazed only 1/4 of the tub (only the parts that were peeling). This was 2 years ago. The glaze is a different color from original tub. (Gross). But main problem is that area is bubbling/peeling again. Might this be caused by bad/unprofessional repair the first time? Can relative ask landlord to reglaze? AND/OR is there an easy DIY fix that is effective? Special treat: would be awesome if tube could be one uniform color (white).
Toilet seat - the one that they put in is cheap and falling apart literally. Sawdust appears near the seat hinges. Bottom portion is fine. Who replaces the toilet seat? Tenant or landlord?
Kitchen grout -the landlord replace/repair the moldy grout maybe 2 years ago, but mold continues to appear. Can relative ask landlord to replace/repair again without repercussions ( like increase in rent)? Might the problem be low quality grout or unprofessional work? Is there an easy way to whitening/clean/replace grout by relative that is easy and will make an aesthetic impact?
Tub - original tub was peeling in certain places so landlord re-glazed only 1/4 of the tub (only the parts that were peeling). This was 2 years ago. The glaze is a different color from original tub. (Gross). But main problem is that area is bubbling/peeling again. Might this be caused by bad/unprofessional repair the first time? Can relative ask landlord to reglaze? AND/OR is there an easy DIY fix that is effective? Special treat: would be awesome if tube could be one uniform color (white).
Replacing the toilet seat will cost you maybe $20 and half an hour's worth of work. You could probably get the landlord to do it since I'd say it's normal maintenance, but if he's hesitant, it would definitely be the simplest thing to fix.
posted by possibilityleft at 12:05 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by possibilityleft at 12:05 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
These are all questions for the landlord. My impulse is that your relative should replace cheap/easy stuff like the toilet seat and arrange with the landlord to deduct that from rent. Major improvements like regrouting and a new tub are probably best contracted through the landlord, since ultimately it's their property and those are big permanent jobs.
One thing that might be possible if your relative is the one who wants things to be nicer than the landlord's standards would be for them to bring up contracting the work themselves and deducting it from the rent. Or potentially even eating the difference between the quick fix and the work your relative would like done.
If this was an ongoing thing in an apartment I didn't have plans to ever vacate, and the landlord wasn't amenable to the two of us coming to an arrangement that worked for everyone, I'd probably start looking for a new apartment. I'm not sure dealing with penny ante cheap fixes and bad landlord communication would be worth it in the long run.
posted by Sara C. at 12:09 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
One thing that might be possible if your relative is the one who wants things to be nicer than the landlord's standards would be for them to bring up contracting the work themselves and deducting it from the rent. Or potentially even eating the difference between the quick fix and the work your relative would like done.
If this was an ongoing thing in an apartment I didn't have plans to ever vacate, and the landlord wasn't amenable to the two of us coming to an arrangement that worked for everyone, I'd probably start looking for a new apartment. I'm not sure dealing with penny ante cheap fixes and bad landlord communication would be worth it in the long run.
posted by Sara C. at 12:09 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
A lot depends on the state, but structural mold is a health issue and in most cases the landlord will be required to address it.
posted by praemunire at 12:10 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 12:10 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
Can relative ask landlord to replace/repair again without repercussions ( like increase in rent)?
This is not something we can answer. The landlord can raise the rent as long as it is legal and there is no way of knowing if they would do so in response to a simple request. Some would just deny the request if they felt the repair was not warranted, while some would do it and then increase the rent to make up for the cost. It is not unusual for rental properties to be maintained at the cheapest level that will keep the landlord out of legal trouble. Since a partial job was done on the tub, it is possible that the landlord is operating in that mode.
In general, if something was there when they moved in, the landlord should maintain or replace it. That said, a toilet seat is cheap and easy to replace. Six years seems like enough time to get out of one seat. There are bleach pens for grout and also sealer that can help with stains. I wouldn't tackle the tub on your own at all since those changes would be permanent.
posted by soelo at 12:27 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is not something we can answer. The landlord can raise the rent as long as it is legal and there is no way of knowing if they would do so in response to a simple request. Some would just deny the request if they felt the repair was not warranted, while some would do it and then increase the rent to make up for the cost. It is not unusual for rental properties to be maintained at the cheapest level that will keep the landlord out of legal trouble. Since a partial job was done on the tub, it is possible that the landlord is operating in that mode.
In general, if something was there when they moved in, the landlord should maintain or replace it. That said, a toilet seat is cheap and easy to replace. Six years seems like enough time to get out of one seat. There are bleach pens for grout and also sealer that can help with stains. I wouldn't tackle the tub on your own at all since those changes would be permanent.
posted by soelo at 12:27 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
I have always bought my own toilet seats. Tenant should be venting the bathroom better. Is there an exhaust fan in the bathroom? If not, one needs to be installed. The grout should be treated with Tilex every few months, by the tenant.
The tenant can get estimates on reglazing the tub and offer to take care of it for a reduction in rent until the cost is paid off. Otherwise, it's just going to be another slap on repair job. If there isn't a vent in the bathroom, the tenant should also get an estimate on having one installed, as any improvements made will just fall apart if the bathroom is left warm and damp.
posted by myselfasme at 12:31 PM on July 6, 2016
The tenant can get estimates on reglazing the tub and offer to take care of it for a reduction in rent until the cost is paid off. Otherwise, it's just going to be another slap on repair job. If there isn't a vent in the bathroom, the tenant should also get an estimate on having one installed, as any improvements made will just fall apart if the bathroom is left warm and damp.
posted by myselfasme at 12:31 PM on July 6, 2016
My general feeling, as a house renter of many years (and owner/landlord for a bit), is that easily-reversible changes/upgrades are all on the renter. You want a padded/lit/raised/newer/untouched-by-other-butts toilet seat, that's on you. You can pull the old one off and store it and put it back when you leave, or you can leave the one you put in, depending on your attachment to the seat.
Stuff like grout, which can mean serious structural damage if it's done wrong, has to be some sort of collaboration. Either you get permission to do it yourself (or to pay someone) with or without recompensation or you can try to get them to do it or have it done. But you can't make them do most things - there's a few things so serious that your local code compliance department or health department requires them, you'd be surprised how low the bar is on that stuff.
Certainly anything you think is contributing to property damage needs to be reported in writing so they know and can choose not to mitigate it but not be able to put the blame on you. But that will not force a repair.
In this specific case, the substance that grout is made from is intentionally mold-resistant, so the fact that it has molded again so quickly is creepy and suggestive of a larger problem. Replacing it is not probably the primary fix, just the secondary. I would argue that tenants are not required to "vent bathrooms better" as you can't reasonably force a person to, say, shower or use the toilet with the door open. If the bathroom has a ventilation problem under normal and customary use, the landlord would be responsible for putting in an exhaust.
In most situations you really only have the leverage of "I might leave if you don't do this" which may be a motivating amount of pressure on one landlord and a desired outcome for another. You have no idea what any landlord might do in response to a request, up to retaliation in all kinds of subtle and unsubtle ways. People's standards vary wildly depending on personality, motivation, available funds, and the rental market, so there is no way to predict what one individual landlord might do.
posted by Lyn Never at 12:57 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
Stuff like grout, which can mean serious structural damage if it's done wrong, has to be some sort of collaboration. Either you get permission to do it yourself (or to pay someone) with or without recompensation or you can try to get them to do it or have it done. But you can't make them do most things - there's a few things so serious that your local code compliance department or health department requires them, you'd be surprised how low the bar is on that stuff.
Certainly anything you think is contributing to property damage needs to be reported in writing so they know and can choose not to mitigate it but not be able to put the blame on you. But that will not force a repair.
In this specific case, the substance that grout is made from is intentionally mold-resistant, so the fact that it has molded again so quickly is creepy and suggestive of a larger problem. Replacing it is not probably the primary fix, just the secondary. I would argue that tenants are not required to "vent bathrooms better" as you can't reasonably force a person to, say, shower or use the toilet with the door open. If the bathroom has a ventilation problem under normal and customary use, the landlord would be responsible for putting in an exhaust.
In most situations you really only have the leverage of "I might leave if you don't do this" which may be a motivating amount of pressure on one landlord and a desired outcome for another. You have no idea what any landlord might do in response to a request, up to retaliation in all kinds of subtle and unsubtle ways. People's standards vary wildly depending on personality, motivation, available funds, and the rental market, so there is no way to predict what one individual landlord might do.
posted by Lyn Never at 12:57 PM on July 6, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is the landlord-does-everything-half-assed scenario, yes?
You can ask them to do any of this, but they're (probably) not going to do it.
I will entirely handwave here, but places I've lived, the law covered major habitability stuff (heat doesn't work, no hot water, front door doesn't lock, etc.), not aesthetics.
posted by zippy at 3:14 PM on July 6, 2016 [3 favorites]
You can ask them to do any of this, but they're (probably) not going to do it.
I will entirely handwave here, but places I've lived, the law covered major habitability stuff (heat doesn't work, no hot water, front door doesn't lock, etc.), not aesthetics.
posted by zippy at 3:14 PM on July 6, 2016 [3 favorites]
ou can pull the old one off and store it and put it back when you leave, or you can leave the one you put in, depending on your attachment to the seat.
Long-term renter here. This is our general approach. If we're replacing something with a nicer something that we might want to keep, well, we'll take it with us when we move and put the old one back. If it's cheap/minor/just involves some elbow grease, we'll do it. So for example we often put in our own shower head/back door with a cat door in it/curtains instead of blinds, and then store the landlord's stuff and put it back when we move out. (Also we would not want to cut a hole for the cat door in his door).
Things we save for the landlord:
1. Things that might break in an expensive way (right now I need the landlord to move out/fix the dishwasher. He owns the dishwasher. If I attempted to fix it and broke it, I'd have to buy him a new one, so I don't).
2. Things that pose a risk: electricity and plumbing. We know nothing about how to do that safely, and don't want to risk fire or flooding. We call the landlord for those fixes.
3. Long-term issues that will affect the property's overall liveability: for example, if we notice new cracks that indicate a foundation is settling, or termites in the yard, we tell them, not just for us but because it's his house and that stuff can get very very expensive very quickly.
posted by emjaybee at 3:46 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
Long-term renter here. This is our general approach. If we're replacing something with a nicer something that we might want to keep, well, we'll take it with us when we move and put the old one back. If it's cheap/minor/just involves some elbow grease, we'll do it. So for example we often put in our own shower head/back door with a cat door in it/curtains instead of blinds, and then store the landlord's stuff and put it back when we move out. (Also we would not want to cut a hole for the cat door in his door).
Things we save for the landlord:
1. Things that might break in an expensive way (right now I need the landlord to move out/fix the dishwasher. He owns the dishwasher. If I attempted to fix it and broke it, I'd have to buy him a new one, so I don't).
2. Things that pose a risk: electricity and plumbing. We know nothing about how to do that safely, and don't want to risk fire or flooding. We call the landlord for those fixes.
3. Long-term issues that will affect the property's overall liveability: for example, if we notice new cracks that indicate a foundation is settling, or termites in the yard, we tell them, not just for us but because it's his house and that stuff can get very very expensive very quickly.
posted by emjaybee at 3:46 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]
Is there an exhaust fan in the bathroom? If not, one needs to be installed.
Not necessarily true - in our state, the building codes require either a window that can be opened or an exhaust fan.
posted by onecircleaday at 5:16 PM on July 6, 2016
Not necessarily true - in our state, the building codes require either a window that can be opened or an exhaust fan.
posted by onecircleaday at 5:16 PM on July 6, 2016
I'm with cnc.
Toilet seat? Technically landlord responsibility but probably easier to replace yourself. (Doesn't cost much, easy to do, no chance of damaging anything)
Mold on grouting - would probably try to fix (I've rented in the Pacific NW and while you won't get stung for it when you move out, it's considered to be the tenants problem here. Your location may be different)
The bath? Your landlord needs to fix that. I'd go into that discussion pointing out that you replaced the toilet seat and are dealing with the moldy grouting (i.e. establishing that you're a good long term tenant) but that he needs to sort out the bathtub.
Good luck! Most decent landlords value long term tenants and should be receptive to fixing this kind of stuff.
posted by finding.perdita at 1:16 AM on July 7, 2016
Toilet seat? Technically landlord responsibility but probably easier to replace yourself. (Doesn't cost much, easy to do, no chance of damaging anything)
Mold on grouting - would probably try to fix (I've rented in the Pacific NW and while you won't get stung for it when you move out, it's considered to be the tenants problem here. Your location may be different)
The bath? Your landlord needs to fix that. I'd go into that discussion pointing out that you replaced the toilet seat and are dealing with the moldy grouting (i.e. establishing that you're a good long term tenant) but that he needs to sort out the bathtub.
Good luck! Most decent landlords value long term tenants and should be receptive to fixing this kind of stuff.
posted by finding.perdita at 1:16 AM on July 7, 2016
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Toilet seat - the one that they put in is cheap and falling apart literally. Sawdust appears near the seat hinges. Bottom portion is fine. Who replaces the toilet seat? Tenant or landlord?
I just bought another one, but I replaced mine because it looked bad, not because it was falling apart. I would think falling apart is a landlord issue. If the landlord wouldn't do it, I would.
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Is there an easy way to whitening/clean/replace grout by relative that is easy and will make an aesthetic impact?
Three parts water, one part bleach. Spray it, open the windows, maybe turn on a fan (AFTER YOU SPRAY) and leave it. You may not even need to scrub. Test your bleach mixture on a little corner of tile first.
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original tub was peeling in certain places so landlord re-glazed only 1/4 of the tub (only the parts that were peeling).
Landlord should just reglaze the whole thing.
posted by cnc at 12:05 PM on July 6, 2016 [1 favorite]