The war on daydreaming
May 2, 2016 7:03 PM Subscribe
I have been working on meditating. It's definitely helped me in several ways. But now this app is telling me to stop daydreaming. I love daydreaming. I'm conflicted! Can I ignore this?
I've been following the Headspace ap for awhile now. Apparently I'm supposed to be focusing on what I'm doing, and according to the calm British voice stop daydreaming so much. I love daydreaming and have a strong aversion to giving it up.
However, I've noticed better sleep, more calm, and it's been easier to focus at work. I get more work done more easily and my house stays clean with less effort. More benefits than I could have hoped for. This calm British voice has been AMAZING!
Are you fighting your urge to daydream as part of your meditative practice? Is it worth it? Can I continue to meditate for a few minutes a day and reap more benefits while daydreaming for extended perions of time?
I've been following the Headspace ap for awhile now. Apparently I'm supposed to be focusing on what I'm doing, and according to the calm British voice stop daydreaming so much. I love daydreaming and have a strong aversion to giving it up.
However, I've noticed better sleep, more calm, and it's been easier to focus at work. I get more work done more easily and my house stays clean with less effort. More benefits than I could have hoped for. This calm British voice has been AMAZING!
Are you fighting your urge to daydream as part of your meditative practice? Is it worth it? Can I continue to meditate for a few minutes a day and reap more benefits while daydreaming for extended perions of time?
Best answer: Not an expert, just a fellow practitioner. But I don't think you need to stop daydreaming; you just want to be more intentional about when you daydream and when you apply mindfulness. My old therapist told me to think about it like, if mindfulness training is like training a puppy, daydreaming is like giving the puppy some off-leash time. You don't want to let your dog run off-leash all the time in any old situation, and you want to be able to step in if the puppy is getting into trouble, but it's okay to take the lead off occasionally once you've identified the right time and place.
posted by en forme de poire at 7:17 PM on May 2, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by en forme de poire at 7:17 PM on May 2, 2016 [7 favorites]
It sounds to me like your question is whether you can continue meditating, and gain the benefits of meditating, and then in the rest of your life you can have fun and daydream? Is that right? If so, YES.
When I am meditating, I do my best to continue to bring my mind back to whatever it is I am meditating on, my breath, counting, whatever the object is. My mind still continuously drifts off into daydreaming, but I just keep bringing it back over and over again to the object until the timer rings and I am done. Meditation over. It is mind training, and as you have noticed, you get a lot of interesting benefits throughout the rest of your life just by a few minutes of training your mind to notice the daydreaming and come back to the present moment. After I have done my sitting, I am perfectly happy to let my mind run wild again.
posted by nanook at 7:22 PM on May 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
When I am meditating, I do my best to continue to bring my mind back to whatever it is I am meditating on, my breath, counting, whatever the object is. My mind still continuously drifts off into daydreaming, but I just keep bringing it back over and over again to the object until the timer rings and I am done. Meditation over. It is mind training, and as you have noticed, you get a lot of interesting benefits throughout the rest of your life just by a few minutes of training your mind to notice the daydreaming and come back to the present moment. After I have done my sitting, I am perfectly happy to let my mind run wild again.
posted by nanook at 7:22 PM on May 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
Most people meditate at least in part to gain mindfulness, which is gained by using the practice time to grow awareness and control over the focus of the mind. When you use meditation to daydream you are not gaining control or focus, so you're not generally increasing mindfulness as much as you could.
That being said, I will sometimes let myself daydream during meditation. It is totally fun to let your mind go deep into ideas while meditating. I try very hard not to let anything but idea-driven daydreaming happen, and even then, that's not really the goal, but it happens and I understand the appeal.
If you want to progress in your mindfulness, you need to start trying to daydream less. If you are totally pleased with where you are, you don't have to, but pay attention to the impact of your meditation over time. It may be that if you stop your progression at the state of strong distraction that you seem to be in, you will lose some of the mindfulness benefits that you are seeing. The worst thing would be having your daydreams slip into focus on negative events that drag you down. But keep having fun with it as long as you're seeing positive impact on your life. Meditation should definitely not feel like a punishment.
posted by ch1x0r at 7:35 PM on May 2, 2016
That being said, I will sometimes let myself daydream during meditation. It is totally fun to let your mind go deep into ideas while meditating. I try very hard not to let anything but idea-driven daydreaming happen, and even then, that's not really the goal, but it happens and I understand the appeal.
If you want to progress in your mindfulness, you need to start trying to daydream less. If you are totally pleased with where you are, you don't have to, but pay attention to the impact of your meditation over time. It may be that if you stop your progression at the state of strong distraction that you seem to be in, you will lose some of the mindfulness benefits that you are seeing. The worst thing would be having your daydreams slip into focus on negative events that drag you down. But keep having fun with it as long as you're seeing positive impact on your life. Meditation should definitely not feel like a punishment.
posted by ch1x0r at 7:35 PM on May 2, 2016
Response by poster: Clarification: I mean daydreaming outside of meditation time.
posted by Kalmya at 7:40 PM on May 2, 2016
posted by Kalmya at 7:40 PM on May 2, 2016
There's no reason you can't be mindfully aware of the fact you're daydreaming and having a great time. (It's turtles all the way down.)
posted by WidgetAlley at 8:43 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by WidgetAlley at 8:43 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
I like Headspace. I like to daydream. That said, Headspace helped me sort of figure out when it was a good time to daydream and when I was losing something by not being in the moment and being mindful of where I was or what i was doing. That is, there's nothing wrong with daydreaming but there's less utility to taking yourself out of the present time and place to go somewhere else. Daydreaming can be escapist and that can be the opposite of being mindful. When I'm actually actively meditating (with Headspace or other stuff, you might like other guided meditations that you can do when walking or something else) I do try to gently push aside thoughts that are intruding and just focus on breath and being there. However when I'm just relaxing on the couch or doing something not requiring my present attention, I can noodle in my own mind and go places.
The big thing with daydreaming for me was that when I'd walk around outside I was often in my own head thinking about things (not daydreaming per se, but making plans and doing other enjoyable things with my brain) and it was taking me out of the present moment which wasn't great for being attentive of my surroundings. Someone would wave from a car and I'd be all "Huh, who was that...?" and while that's not the end of the world, I'd enjoyed meditation helping me put my idle thinking time sort of in its own intentional place and not leaking into places where I should be doing other things. I think the big thing is to be intentionally daydreaming and not just doing it as a default or because you don't want to be where you are.
posted by jessamyn at 9:08 PM on May 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
The big thing with daydreaming for me was that when I'd walk around outside I was often in my own head thinking about things (not daydreaming per se, but making plans and doing other enjoyable things with my brain) and it was taking me out of the present moment which wasn't great for being attentive of my surroundings. Someone would wave from a car and I'd be all "Huh, who was that...?" and while that's not the end of the world, I'd enjoyed meditation helping me put my idle thinking time sort of in its own intentional place and not leaking into places where I should be doing other things. I think the big thing is to be intentionally daydreaming and not just doing it as a default or because you don't want to be where you are.
posted by jessamyn at 9:08 PM on May 2, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh outside of meditation PLEASE continue to daydream! That's just another way of framing plans and wishes, and plans and wishes and hopes and dreams are the first step in making you happy, fulfilling you, and making the world a better place!
posted by janey47 at 9:11 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by janey47 at 9:11 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ok, so some people want to take mindfulness past just meditation, and try to live in that headspace most of the time. That's cool. It can be great for mental clarity and all that stuff. You don't actually have to, though, to still get the benefits of a regular meditation practice.
If you feel like you want to try this full-time mindfullness thingy, set up daydreaming time just like you now set up meditation time.
posted by ananci at 10:32 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
If you feel like you want to try this full-time mindfullness thingy, set up daydreaming time just like you now set up meditation time.
posted by ananci at 10:32 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]
you just want to be more intentional about when you daydream and when you apply mindfulness
You can do some interesting meta-daydreaming structured activities. They will keep you mindful-in-fantasy, and can also help with increasing the intensity and quality of your sleeping dream life.
-focus on other people within your field of view, and imagine what they are daydreaming about
-imagine how your current environment might change were it to occur in your sleeping dreams
-if you catch yourself muindlessly daydreaming, imagine how whatever the current subject might continue if it were a sleeping dream
-etc. etc.
posted by Meatbomb at 3:43 AM on May 3, 2016 [2 favorites]
You can do some interesting meta-daydreaming structured activities. They will keep you mindful-in-fantasy, and can also help with increasing the intensity and quality of your sleeping dream life.
-focus on other people within your field of view, and imagine what they are daydreaming about
-imagine how your current environment might change were it to occur in your sleeping dreams
-if you catch yourself muindlessly daydreaming, imagine how whatever the current subject might continue if it were a sleeping dream
-etc. etc.
posted by Meatbomb at 3:43 AM on May 3, 2016 [2 favorites]
daydreaming outside of meditation time.
not a problem.
posted by andrewcooke at 5:20 AM on May 3, 2016
not a problem.
posted by andrewcooke at 5:20 AM on May 3, 2016
I think ananci has it. The point of doing a meditative practice is to do the meditative practice. If your practice is a regular part of your life then you're doing it right, and don't let anybody (whether calm and British or not) tell you different.
posted by flabdablet at 6:35 AM on May 3, 2016
posted by flabdablet at 6:35 AM on May 3, 2016
Daydreaming is perfectly fine.
Not daydreaming is perfectly fine.
Awareness is perfectly fine. Not-awareness is, too.
Be kind to yourself and give yourself the room and the right to not assign labels to this practice.
Be gentle with yourself.
Just by starting this you're already aware.
:)
posted by Lipstick Thespian at 7:26 AM on May 3, 2016 [1 favorite]
Not daydreaming is perfectly fine.
Awareness is perfectly fine. Not-awareness is, too.
Be kind to yourself and give yourself the room and the right to not assign labels to this practice.
Be gentle with yourself.
Just by starting this you're already aware.
:)
posted by Lipstick Thespian at 7:26 AM on May 3, 2016 [1 favorite]
Mindfulness is important, and it's not possible to be mindful all the time. Daydreaming is also important, especially for letting the creative parts of our brain develop. I love the puppy off-leash analogy. The point is knowing what the right time is for each.
posted by Brittanie at 9:35 AM on May 3, 2016
posted by Brittanie at 9:35 AM on May 3, 2016
Best answer: I've done quite a lot of meditating, including long silent retreats, and when I first started out I was pretty damn pissed off by being told to stop daydreaming. I also thought the idea of being mindful 100% of the time - NEVER lost in thought - was kind of brutal and oppressive and ridiculous.
The only thing that changed my mind about that was seeing, through even more meditation and reflection and just continuing to watch my own mind through all kinds of situations, all the many different kinds of "daydreaming", and how most of them actually kinda sucked, even though I hadn't really noticed before. Making plans sometimes makes me tense and rigid, even if I'm excited about the thing I'm planning. Gotta let go more. Thinking about nice things in the past makes me feel kinda... mildly groggy and disconnected. Replaying conversations can make me obsess about things in an unhelpful way. Remembering painful things in the past obviously sucks... but I was surprised by how unimproved my mood and day were after even being distracted or lost in things that I initially thought were pleasant.
I wouldn't have believed this before I saw it in my own mind. Didn't believe it, in fact.
So my advice is: don't worry about not daydreaming. I really doubt you're doing it totally on purpose, like you think to yourself "I could use some quality daydreaming right now, let's thing of something nice to get started". If you find yourself doing it, just keep noticing how it makes you feel, what kinds of thoughts come up, and so on. Form your own opinion.
And if you ARE using daydream consciously, choosing it as an activity you value, then who knows, maybe it's skillful means, and you're using the power of your imagination and mind in a healthy way. That's possible too.
posted by Cygnet at 3:49 PM on May 3, 2016 [3 favorites]
The only thing that changed my mind about that was seeing, through even more meditation and reflection and just continuing to watch my own mind through all kinds of situations, all the many different kinds of "daydreaming", and how most of them actually kinda sucked, even though I hadn't really noticed before. Making plans sometimes makes me tense and rigid, even if I'm excited about the thing I'm planning. Gotta let go more. Thinking about nice things in the past makes me feel kinda... mildly groggy and disconnected. Replaying conversations can make me obsess about things in an unhelpful way. Remembering painful things in the past obviously sucks... but I was surprised by how unimproved my mood and day were after even being distracted or lost in things that I initially thought were pleasant.
I wouldn't have believed this before I saw it in my own mind. Didn't believe it, in fact.
So my advice is: don't worry about not daydreaming. I really doubt you're doing it totally on purpose, like you think to yourself "I could use some quality daydreaming right now, let's thing of something nice to get started". If you find yourself doing it, just keep noticing how it makes you feel, what kinds of thoughts come up, and so on. Form your own opinion.
And if you ARE using daydream consciously, choosing it as an activity you value, then who knows, maybe it's skillful means, and you're using the power of your imagination and mind in a healthy way. That's possible too.
posted by Cygnet at 3:49 PM on May 3, 2016 [3 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Of course daydreaming has its place in our lives, but it's not meditation.
You may find it helpful to do a concentration practice, such as the lovingkindness practice or a mantra practice. Because these practices concentrate the mind, they transfer well to an awareness practice.
memail me if you'd like more info on concentration practices.
posted by janey47 at 7:06 PM on May 2, 2016 [1 favorite]