Its another relationship question, or I'm a commitaphobe, please help!
January 11, 2016 9:56 AM   Subscribe

Oh geeze… Help me get over being a commitaphobe… Or reassure me that sometimes relationships that start in your teens are not doomed to failure just because conventional wisdom says they are.

Holy cow, this thing is poorly written, I apologize in advance about my poor grammar and rambling, I’m worried the more I proofread the more I will change the content or not post this at all. If you want to skip the paragraphs I will list my actual questions at the end. I have been wiring this post in my head for months and I think I only got down about half of what I wanted to write originally, but it's hard to think of in the moment, and I really should be working right now, but I have finally worked up the nerve to get this typed out. If you want more detail please ask here or PM me.

To start, I (mid 20’s male) want to propose to my long term (nearly 9 years) girlfriend (mid 20’s female), but I am horrid at making permanent decisions, and even though we are practically married right now and I really want to be together with her forever I need some nudging over the hump (or tell me i’m totally crazy and not ready). To give it some perspective, buying a car was absolutely crippling to me and I antagonized for months before finally committing; and that's only a car! at the end of the day it just cost me money, so something as big seeming as marriage is stressing me out way more then it ought to.

Our background:
We met my senior year of high school, her junior year. We went to different colleges in the same city and dated from high school into college, never broke up but we slowed down to practically friends who only saw each other once a month for a year or so. I think at that point the relationship was going to peter out or spark back up, and my junior year it sparked back up majorly. By my senior year I spent every weekend living at her house. After graduation I move to a different city to start a job, when I moved I don't even think we ever talked about her moving up with me, it was just assumed she would by both of us. Three months later she was able to leave her job and moved in with me. She immediately got a job and started looking at the next phase of her education. We have since lived together for four years, she has gone back and forth on a few jobs part time jobs while attending school for some prerequisite classes, then go into a highly competitive graduate program that she will finish up December of this year. Even though we have been ‘dating’ for nearly 9 years, I think of the first 4 as training wheel years, we were both young, and have changed so much since then, that relationship was a pair of teenagers exploring life. I think after moving in together our relationship really blossomed into what we have now.

The strong points in our relationship:
-We are absolutely each others best friends. We love spending time together, and will opt for a night in eating dinner and watching Netflix over most anything else. Even though we both can do things that annoy each other, overall we are very compatible and love spending time together.
-We communicate very well, we have our own language for our feelings and have ways to signal feeling to each other when in public without drawing attention. We are very open and honest with our feelings. I have never felt the need to hide anything from her, and can be completely honest, even when something is either negative or embarrassing.
-I think over time we have grown together, looking back we were both different people when we met, and I think we both went through one of the biggest growth periods of life together, leaning on each other when we needed support, and encouraging each other to branch out when we wanted to ‘hide in our shells’.
-We have many shared passions, like cooking (then eating) food and outdoor activities. But we also have our own interests and hobbies we can do for some alone time.
-We have our own way of communicating and are always doing small things for each other, I think we both take the idea of never stop dating your spouse to heart.
-We are constantly trying to improve ourselves and our relationship, and we have a yearly state of the relationship summate, where we talk about what we have done, what we want to do, and things we would like to improve on.
-I think we are very sexually compatible (each others first), we have a very good dialog about wants/needs and we are constantly exploring together. Every do often we have a nice long conversation about sex, sexuality, what we like, don’t like, want to try, and more. We are both very comfortable with each other and are able to share thoughts without fear of judgment.
-For the most part it feels like we are all but married already, we have lived together for 4 years, we share medical insurance, we attend social events and travel together, she is the beneficiary of my life insurance and we plan long term life goals together. We have discussed marriage on and off for a long time, early on in our relationship we were ‘too young’ to get married, and one day the switch was flipped from too young to everyone wanted to know when we are getting married and having kids. We have felt and resisted pressure from outside to get married because of things like social pressure, taxes, and other legal reasons (we have to pay more to get on a lease together, pay tax on her health insurance, and it was really hard to be with her in the hospital during surgery since I was ‘only’ her boyfriend). It felt like if we got married at those times we were only doing it to appease society or the government, but the more I have thought on it, it seems silly to think like that and if we keep delaying until people stop asking, we will never get married. We also recognize that their is a chance that we get married, and years down the road it does not work out, and if that's the case, so be it. I don’t want to keep life on hold forever because we don’t know exactly the future.

Some other relationship facts:
-I have been the sole breadwinner for most of the four years we have lived together (since she has been a student with part time jobs at most), which I have no problem with, and we budget together. I pay the rent and utilities since it's our largest expense and she has no income right now. When she does have an income, I encourage her to save a good chunk of it, for times when she does not have an income, and we split expenses proportionally between my salary and what she has left after putting some in savings. I also pay for our health insurance (via my work) and pay most of our grocery budget. When we are out shopping I will pay for everything, it's one of those things that is a given between us since she has no income right now and I do, but I sometimes worry it tips the ‘balance of power’ in our relationship to me. To mitigate that she uses her own money saved up from when she had a job to pay for for her own gas, car insurance, and most of her spending when she is on her own. I have always tried to make sure she had enough money in savings that if we were to breakup she would be able to move without be totally destitute, I never wanted her to feel financially trapped. We both agree on our short term financial goals, and how we will split expenses once she graduates and has a full time job.
-We have talked about the possibly of kids one day, we talk about religion and our feelings on that.

The things that have given me pause:
-Early in our relationship I had anger management problems, never against people, but against inanimate objects and things. When we first met I was an easily frustrated person who expressed it poorly. After many Christmases visiting the family, it clear to use that this was a learned behavior from my father who is still like this), and something that was not acceptable. My frustration was almost entirely based around inanimate objects, like my phone crashing when I’m in a hurry, a bunch of things falling over in the kitchen, or unexpectedly tripping over something. Those are all frustrating events, but I would react by tossing my phone across the room, shouting in the kitchen, or kicking whatever I tripped over. At some point my girlfriend told me that these things would startle or frighten her. I knew that was unacceptable for her to feel that way in any relationship, so I worked on reevaluating why I got angry, and how to mitigate things that would frustrate me, and to see the humor in things instead of instantly reacting negatively. I think I have a good handle now on my reactions, and I have not had any outbursts in quite a long time, but I am worried this has made me unfit as a spouse. She disagrees and thinks I have made massive strides in improving, I just want to make sure I never stop one day and slide back into my old ways.
-One of the biggest ‘fears’ I have is based around the modern advice that you should never marry your first love (or first sexual partner). Its a silly blanket statement, and I know it exists because most teenagers have no idea what they want in life and they pigeonhole themselves into a relationship well before they are mature enough to make long term decisions. But it is still an attage that is prevalent in our society and it gnaws at the back of my mind sometimes. Should we have both gotten more relationship experience before we ‘settled down’? Can we truly know this is what we want unless we try something different? My internal counter to this, is the fact that I am very happy right now and could not picture a happier relationship, and after a bad car accident she was in last year confirmed I want to spend the rest of our lives together and I don’t know what I would do without her.
-Another issue that developed recently is one of my best friends in life got engaged to someone that everyone else who knows him does not like. I don’t know why it bother me to much, he is an adult, and he is the one in that relationship so he should do whatever he wants. I think it scares me to see two people getting married who I think are wrong for each other, and I’m afraid that from the inside of a relationship it's hard to see.

I know I have missed typing so much extra detail into this, but I am already nervous about imaginary internet judgement that I should just get it out now. Please follow up with questions if you have any.

I guess here is what I want to know:
-Do you know of relationship success where the two met and started dating young? What do you think helped the success? Are their red flags we should look into our relationship for?

-Is it bad that I am this nervous? I think nerves are typical before a proposal, but I have never done this myself so I’m not 100% sure.

-In general, do you have advice for someone who antagonizes over every major decision? I can’t spend life paralyzed when I have to decide on something permanent which seems to be one of my bigger fears.
posted by token-ring to Human Relations (40 answers total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
We are constantly trying to improve ourselves and our relationship, and we have a yearly state of the relationship summate, where we talk about what we have done, what we want to do, and things we would like to improve on.

THIS IS AWESOME, and this is one of the reasons why I think you guys would be fine if you got married.

If I were you, I would consider going in for a few sessions of relationship counselling - not 'we have a Relationship Issue' type counselling, but like premarital counselling. My parents did this and have always recommended it to me for when that time comes. It will give you the outsider's perspective on your relationship that you seem to be looking for.

For what it's worth: I had some of these very same questions about my first serious relationship... and we wound up breaking up. BUT! We had some larger incompatibilities that I wasn't quite able to see until right before the breakup, due to both my inexperience and my (at the time) massive insecurity. And reading this question, I don't see anything like that jumping out at me. You do sound anxious, but this is the sort of thing that makes everybody anxious...

Finally, I'll say this: the progress you've made on the anger management thing speaks incredibly well of you, and also, you were a teenage boy! Forgive yourself.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:07 AM on January 11, 2016 [7 favorites]


I definitely don't think you are a comittmentphobe- you have been in this relationship for several years.

"agonizing" over major decisions is normal when you're not certain the decision is the right one- I don't think you have a problem with indecision either. My gut tells me that you are agonizing over the proposal because it may not be what you really want now. What is your gut telling you?
posted by bearette at 10:07 AM on January 11, 2016


If you had to choose between proposing in the next few months or never getting married to your girlfriend, would your choice be obvious? Trying to equalize the degree of commitment between your options can help clarify how much of your nerves are due to permanent-decision making versus concerns about the actual outcomes.

In reality, your options are to propose now or wait and keep your options open at basically no cost. Of course at any particular moment you want to wait! But if eventually getting married is something you both want, you're missing out on long-term happiness by postponing the nervewracking period of actually making a decision.
posted by cogitron at 10:10 AM on January 11, 2016 [2 favorites]


-Do you know of relationship success where the two met and started dating young? What do you think helped the success? Are their red flags we should look into our relationship for?
Yes, two close friends of mine. They met at university and just married last year. I think they both have occasional what if" moments about what it would have been like to have a few more experiences, but they are also well aware of how lucky they are to have had such a lot of wonderful time together, and so many shared memories. they're well aware of the "grass is greener on the other side" thing.

-Is it bad that I am this nervous? I think nerves are typical before a proposal, but I have never done this myself so I’m not 100% sure.

I think it's probably natural, but I was more excited than nervous when I did it. What are you more nervous about, the proposal, or the commitment of marriage? If the former, hold off a while - there's no rush - and consider for more time why this is. Talk to a therapist about it, to figure it out. If the latter, I'd suggest a long engagement, to settle into the idea of being married and see how it feels after you've adjusted to it. It sounds like it might not be practical to plan a wedding for the near future anyway.

-In general, do you have advice for someone who antagonizes over every major decision? I can’t spend life paralyzed when I have to decide on something permanent which seems to be one of my bigger fears.

Another reason to try therapy, it sounds like you've got some proper anxiety going on.

Honestly? I was reading your question waiting to hear the big problem, and it never came. It sounds like you guys are really good for each other. But you have some stuff yourself going on which it sounds like you'd be much happier in general if you worked through, proposal or no. So, prioritise that, propose when you're ready.
posted by greenish at 10:12 AM on January 11, 2016 [6 favorites]


Here's my takeaway from what I read here: y'all seem pretty good. Making pretty smart decisions, taking care of business, being present with each other in a way that a lot of couples never achieve.

You must deal with your anxiety, though.

The care and maintenance of your mental health is your responsibility. It is not hers to manage, or contort herself to accommodate. You know you have a problem, you acknowledge it in the car-buying anecdote, so to not deal with it is a lie, basically.

A tip: the explosive frustration with things was my husband's largest outward symptom of ADHD. He spent a year - the first year of our marriage - on medication for that to give him brain-space for learning coping skills and time management and frustration. We would not still be married if that had not happened. He takes medication for his depression/anxiety during times when that is necessary to his functioning, and it is his responsibility and obligation to take care of that too. I'm supportive, but I can't do that work for him.

So, you need to get a handle on those things before you get any farther along. Worry about proposing when you have some skills for managing your anxiety and frustrations in your toolbox so that making this decision isn't so needlessly dramatic and fraught with tension.

(Having sex with more than one person is not, looking back at it many years later, a particularly important contributor to quality of life. If you've only slept with one person because that person is exploiting you or because you are prevented from having any other options by outside forces intending to oppress you, that's bad. But if you are a person who has generally chosen to do that, and you have exposure to the world in a general way so that you are capable of understanding human nature in all its complexity, the actual experience is not that critical to your perception of the world.)
posted by Lyn Never at 10:16 AM on January 11, 2016 [5 favorites]


Anecdotally, I know a couple in their 30's who were more or less inseparable since early childhood (age 4 or so), and while it sounds strange, everyone who knows them seem to agree they have something magical and beautiful. So, yeah. They've been each other's one and only in a big way.
posted by little_dog_laughing at 10:16 AM on January 11, 2016


Hey also, talk to your girlfriend about this. Unless she has specifically requested a surprised proposal should you make one, have a conversation about it. We are now in an age where a lot of women (most?) would like to be involved in the decision to get married. Me and my partner decided between us when we were ready to get engaged. It didn't mean we didn't have a lovely proposal, and it didn't make it any less romantic!
posted by greenish at 10:17 AM on January 11, 2016 [19 favorites]


I'm 39 and married to the guy I've loved since he took me to junior prom. We are very, very happy. That relationship is the bedrock of my life - I've never regretted marrying him for one second. Be grateful that you met someone you're so compatible with when you were a teenager and have managed to grow up together and remain committed and in love! It's a rare, special thing.

Your relationship sounds pretty wonderful - I notice that your reservations are all amorphous worries that don't have much to do with the reality of your day to day life. This makes me wonder if your main problem isn't general anxiety, rather than doubt about your relationship specifically.
posted by something something at 10:17 AM on January 11, 2016 [7 favorites]


My cousin got knocked up by her boyfriend when she was a junior in high school and he and I were seniors. This is not a good basis for a marriage, IMHO, and I never expected it to last. And there they were, still happily married, at the 40th reunion for my class. What happens to most young couple (or couples) doesn't determine what will happen to you and your girlfriend. I'm impressed by your annual relationship summit, your determination that she never feel financially trapped, etc. That I separated from my husband after 25 years didn't mean my marriage was a failure. It was a success for a long time, longer than many relationships. As you say, no one knows what the future may hold. If the two of you want to get married, by all means do so. Just beware of the patriarchal stranglehold our culture has on marriage and look out for inequitable divisions of labor (emotional and otherwise) that can creep into a marriage because assumptions! Good luck.
posted by Bella Donna at 10:19 AM on January 11, 2016 [2 favorites]


Nthing the advice to tackle your anxiety and also involve your girlfriend in the marriage discussion. Words of wisdom above.
posted by Bella Donna at 10:24 AM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


(particularly, congrats on fixing the anger thing).
posted by andrewcooke at 10:29 AM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


I don't know, I think these "first love" relationships, if they're good, are often the ones that stand the test of time. Also, look at how many people go on to marry other people and then after they're widowed or divorced get back together with their first love. It seems like a kind of imprinting goes on, some kind of hormonal bonding. Your relationship sounds pretty great to me and I don't see why you shouldn't get married if you want to.
posted by HotToddy at 10:31 AM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: OK, not to thread sit but I think a little free mefi therapy is what I needed.

My gut tells me that you are agonizing over the proposal because it may not be what you really want now. What is your gut telling you?

Thats a good question! I guess some of the pressure comes from our upcoming anniversary of when we started dating (that I am super excited about). Longer story: I had kind of decided early last year that 2015 was going to be the year I proposed, but several life events (car accident, surgeries, a death in my family….) kind of got in the way and it never felt like a good time. Now at the start of this year, we are going into 2016 fresh and I have time to think about this more, and I briefly got excited about proposing on our anniversary. But as that time approaches I think I have set an artificial deadline that is stressing me. That being said, I think at some point I need to get the nerve up and actually propose or spend the rest of our lives dating. I’m sure we could live together forever just dating, but their are tangible and emotional benefits from marriage. Having a target date i’m mind has forced me to grapple with my emotions and insecurities. It has also shown how badly I need to do something about anxiety.

If you had to choose between proposing in the next few months or never getting married to your girlfriend, would your choice be obvious? Trying to equalize the degree of commitment between your options can help clarify how much of your nerves are due to permanent-decision making versus concerns about the actual outcomes.

Touched on it a bit above, but honestly I think we would be happy either way. I know sometimes we get upset when a roadblock is placed in front of us because we are not married, and that makes us resentful of the process, but we have always talked about marriage as something we want, so if in your situation it was either now or never, I would say now.

What are you more nervous about, the proposal, or the commitment of marriage? If the former, hold off a while - there's no rush - and consider for more time why this is. Talk to a therapist about it, to figure it out. If the latter, I'd suggest a long engagement, to settle into the idea of being married and see how it feels after you've adjusted to it. It sounds like it might not be practical to plan a wedding for the near future anyway.

I guess I am nervous about being wrong, even though I am quite sure about our relationship. I think even if we got engaged tomorrow the wedding would not be until after she graduates, so a long engagement is probable. I think I might you are right about seeing how it feels, and I also really need to get out of my head sometimes.

Having sex with more than one person is not, looking back at it many years later, a particularly important contributor to quality of life. If you've only slept with one person because that person is exploiting you or because you are prevented from having any other options by outside forces intending to oppress you, that's bad. But if you are a person who has generally chosen to do that, and you have exposure to the world in a general way so that you are capable of understanding human nature in all its complexity, the actual experience is not that critical to your perception of the world.

This actually comes up sometimes when we talk about sex, we are both very happy and though we both acknowledge the grass sure seems greener on the other side, if she were my only sexual partner I don’t think that would fill me with regret when I’m old. A couple close to us experimented with an open relationship, which sparked the same conversation with us, and came to the conclusion it was not for us right now, but we understand how someone can develop a want for new experience and if one of develops that want in the future, we will discuss it in detail and revise our agreement if we both agree to.

Hey also, talk to your girlfriend about this.

Oh, we talk about these topics! We had a great chat not too long ago, and like always she was very supportive and said she would be happily married to me tomorrow or in ten years. I have avoided specifically asking about a timeframe for engagement right now because I absolutely love surprising her with positive things when I am able. If we talked about this I’m sure she would tell me to stop stressing.
posted by token-ring at 10:45 AM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


Dude, nothing you've written sounds like this would be anything but a good idea, provided you work on your anxiety and don't make that her burden. You both sound extremely mature, and I love the annual relationship summit. The fact that you've discussed an open relationship and decided it's not for you right now but remained open to one or both of you changing your minds in the future? That is not a discussion I've heard many mid-twenties people having. It sounds like you have a really healthy relationship, that you're both generous and giving and have good boundaries, and like this will continue to be a good, supportive relationship for both of you. I agree with a previous poster, that I kept reading expecting there to be a red flag somewhere, and there's just... nothing but lovely relationship as far as you've talked about. Get to work on that anxiety and enjoy your wonderful partnership, whether that looks like staying the course, doing a long engagement, running to the courthouse tomorrow, or some other option.

Also, I am really impressed that you took your girlfriend's fear of your angry outbursts seriously and, what's more, actually worked hard and overcame that issue. That speaks very highly of your character.
posted by Illuminated Clocks at 10:54 AM on January 11, 2016 [5 favorites]


I guess I am nervous about being wrong, even though I am quite sure about our relationship.

Well, what if you are wrong? It's not like a buzzer will go off and you'll be exiled to a Siberian hard-labor camp. It'll suck, but it's not like your life would have been perfect if you'd gone some other route instead. It's entirely possible you'll only get ten or twenty good years out of it. That doesn't meant you were guaranteed 50 with someone else.

You will, in fact, know people like your friend who are walking stupidly into a terrible mistake, and they too will likely survive it. It may even be the thing that makes it possible for them to achieve greatness afterwards.

Life is a continuum. All you can ever do is try to make decent decisions with the information you have, and if you can accept that you will always later discover information that changes what you thought you knew before, you will live at more peace with those decisions being inherently imperfect from the second they are made.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:58 AM on January 11, 2016 [8 favorites]


I'm sure what you label the "modern advice" about relationships is great for some people, but if you're looking for anecdotes: I've been on a date with one person, ever, and I married her, and we're very happy.

It's possible to live your life in ways that don't gibe with the college-educated-American standard. That's not an indictment of the college-educated-American standard; it's just a word of advice I wish I had gotten earlier. The idea that you need experience with a variety of people to find what you want in a relationship must surely appeal to somebody, but I figured out what I wanted in a relationship by being in a relationship with the person I planned to be in a relationship with forever. It sounds like you've done the same.

When you've been in a relationship for a long time it's easy to become paralyzed by choice—without the chance to run a million experiments or turn on God Mode or whatever it's impossible to know what the Very Best relationship you could possibly be in is. Marriage felt very liberating to me because we were taking a bunch of choices off the table, and agreeing to work together to make the best relationship out of the thing we'd chosen.
posted by Polycarp at 11:01 AM on January 11, 2016 [3 favorites]


Wow, you are the exception that proves the rule. What I find really impressive is that neither of you sacrificed any important life decisions for the sake of your relationship, and yet, you found a way to make it all work.

If you believe that this is the person you want as the partner in your life, you should get married. It really is that simple.

Don't wrap yourself around the axel about the proposal, but rather suggest that you're thinking about marriage and ask her if she is too. Suggest taking a pre-marriage course, either through your church or through some other institution (some of those church ones are pretty good.) This will ensure that you're on the same page about the big topics (money, religion, child-rearing,) and you will learn new tools.

You can ease into it. It's not as romantic, but it's very practical and ultimately, practicality is what makes a marriage work over the long haul.

For young folks, you have your shit together in some pretty impressive ways. Go. Be happy.

Mazel-tov
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 11:21 AM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


It sounds like the only problem here is your anxiety making you doubt your own judgement. Sometimes an article deadline is the best way to yourself to stop hovering at the edge of the diving board and just jump.

But, before you jump, it doesn't hurt to do one last reality check and it sounds like this post is exactly that. You know what you want and you just need to double check that it makes sense. Reading through all the answers above (and I agree with them) I hope you are feeling more confident.

Now, all you have to do is figure out how to turn down the anxiety. The best way I know is to tell myself over and over (and over) again, "It's going to be all right. And if there are problems, we can deal with them so everything will all be Ok in the end. Take a deep breath. There is nothing bad happening here. Everything is just fine, it will turn out OK and it is doesn't we can fix it and will be OK in the end" Anxiety likes to argue but it isn't actually very rational so I just try to be as reassuring as I possibly can.

And if you read some of the answers above, you will see people saying that you and your gf seem to have good skills, so you probably can deal with anything that comes up. And if, worse comes to worse and you realize that the right thing to do is separate, then you will deal with that too. Furthermore, as long as you don't have kids, breaking up after 10 or 20 years of cohabitating isn't going to be all that much easier than a divorce, so don't think you are saving yourself heartbreak by not getting married.
posted by metahawk at 11:25 AM on January 11, 2016


It sounds like you've got a good thing going there. And just for a little bit of perspective...

"Do you know of relationship success where the two met and started dating young?"

My partner and I have been together for the last fifteen years; he was 17 when we met (although a bit older when we became a couple). It absolutely can work - especially since you seem to have really thought about how things work, about your relationship strengths and your future plans.
posted by Blue_thing at 11:36 AM on January 11, 2016


> I am very happy right now and could not picture a happier relationship

Is the most important thing if it's true for both of you.

I was definitely in your headspace in the relationship with the person I have since married. (We were 18 when we met, he was my first boyfriend, and we've been together almost half our lives now.) Like you, it wasn't so much a fear of commitment as a fear of marriage. There was no one big thing that changed my mind; mostly I decided that I had already given my husband the marriage vows in my heart, and that saying them out loud in front of people wouldn't change them.

Sometimes you just meet the right person first. It sounds like you have both chosen to give yourselves enough independence to grow, and have, wonderfully, grown in ways that complement each other. And you've chosen to live a life together and have been successful and happy with that. No way do you NEED to get married, but it sounds like your life as a family is going great and would be just as great after marrying as it is right now.
posted by tchemgrrl at 11:37 AM on January 11, 2016


Also, wanted to chime in as another example of meeting young (17 and 18) and marrying moderately young (21 and 22) and it has worked well for over 30 years.We took some time off when we were dating so we could date other people ('cause you know, we were young and we aren't supposed to find the right person without dating lots of others) but very quickly found we rather be with someone we knew and cared about and had a deep connection with than trying to date relative strangers. There have been times when my husband might have wished for sexual variety but a combination of experimentation in the bedroom, some pornagraphy/fantasy and a recognition that being an adult means accepting that you can't have very single thing you want has kept that from being more than a minor regret. Just saying that even you may have some regrets about not having more experience, those regrets don't need to turn into a problem.
posted by metahawk at 11:37 AM on January 11, 2016


Examples of marrying someone you met in your teens and having it work out:

My mom's best friend, who secretly married her high school boyfriend, in high school, then went to separate colleges and finally told everyone after they graduated from college. They've been married 50 years now.

My cousin, who met her husband when she was 19 years old at a party. He was 21. They got married after dating for 6 years and just celebrated their 10th wedding anniversary.

My aunt, who met her husband when she was 18 (he was 19) and got married two years later. They were married for almost 30 years, before she passed away.

My friend who shocked all of us by dropping out of college and marrying her 18 year old boyfriend when she was barely 19. They've been married for over 15 years. And both of them have college degrees now.

I think the best thing you have going for you here is that you've waited until you were well into your twenties before talking about marriage. There's some statistic that couples who wait until they're 25 to get married (even if they've been dating from a young age) are more likely to not get divorced than couples who get married before age 25.

My bossy advice:
Don't worry about a Proposal with a capital P. Take the pressure off. You can also get engaged by having a talk together and making the decision, together, to get married. Then you can go buy rings or have a fancy dinner or get tattoos or take a romantic weekend trip whatever else would feel celebratory. You can surprise your friends and family with the announcement in some fun way if you want that.

Go to pre-marital couples counseling, because everyone should. It sounds like you have great communication about money, sex, and conflict resolution. Awesome! Another big one is the kid thing. I know couples my age (35) who are having strife over that now. The big questions are how many, bio or adoption or both, and when to get started (because you don't know if you can have bio kids, really, until you start trying). If you both want kids, what happens if you can't have them naturally? I have a friend who was really disappointed to find out her partner was not interested in adopting in the event that they couldn't get pregnant.

Congratulations on your relationship! It sounds like you really have something special and I hope you move forward with it. It sounds like you're ready. You've already weathered a lot together, and I'm sure you have a great future.
posted by Pearl928 at 11:55 AM on January 11, 2016


Based on what you've written, it doesn't sound like there are any major red flags. And, it sounds like the choice you're trying to make is "should we get married or should we keep dating indefinitely?" which is really different from the indecision around "should we get married or should we break up?" In the latter scenario, I think that level of indecision is a big red flag; in your case, it seems like it's more worry about timing than anything else.

Some things to consider:

1. There is nothing especially magical about being married versus long-term dating, especially in a case like yours where you are living together and have comingled finances. I know a few couples that have decided, for various reasons, that they really never do want to get married, even though they intend to stay together indefinitely. You can get legal documentation for things like being a person's health care proxy, etc. that can make certain things easier (think: all the things gay couples would have done pre-marriage equality). Ultimately, it will probably be more expense and hassle to not get married, but it's not like you can't have a really amazing and special relationship without that.

2. I will second the benefits of seeing a counselor or religious advisor just to talk through some of these issues -- NOT because anything is really wrong, but because it might help both of you clarify exactly why you guys do (or don't) want to be married. What does marriage mean to you? What do you think it would change or not change about your relationship. The answers to those questions may be really different for every couple, and that's ok! It's just good to get clarity on what it is, because there's a huge difference between, say "This is a major religious sacrament that we want to take part in" and "We're doing this for tax reasons." :) Nothing wrong with either one of those answers, or anything in between, but I think it would help you get clarity on this question if you guys talked this through.

3. If a big suprise proposal is really stressing you out, maybe it's better not to do that? Not every couple needs to go this route, and engagement/marriage can still be really special without that. You could also do something "in between" -- for example, my husband and I went ring shopping together so he would know what I liked, but the specific date of the proposal was sort of a surprise (although I could pretty much tell because it was a significant date in our relationship and he was all cagey about what we were doing!). That "in between" level of surprise was actually really perfect for us and our personalities, and I wonder if something similar would be nice for you guys, as well?
posted by rainbowbrite at 12:57 PM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


Do you love each other? Has your love stayed strong or grown over the years, or banked down to the embers of habit? Imagine yourself in another nine years. You wake up next to your partner of 18 years. Are you psyched by this mental image, or are you deep down already regretting the idea of spending almost 20 years of your life with the same person?

If you can answer the above with an unequivocal FUCK YEAHHHHH!!!!!!, get married.

If you really did feel the regret deep down, don't get married.

I generally think it's a bad idea for people to settle down with their high school sweetheart without ever dating anyone else. I also see a lot of people who get married to a long-term boyfriend/girlfriend out of habit and then inevitably divorce, because they approached the marriage as an inevitable next step and not something you actively choose because you want to spend the rest of your life with someone.

However, hey, sometimes people really do luck out and find the person for them at a young age. And if you really have that kind of love, it would be stupid to break up just because most people don't experience that.

I'm in my 30s and for various reasons never got to experience that "first love" that seems to strike most people in high school or college. I dated at that time, and I have had relationships where I loved my partner, but I never had a Big Young Love. Sometimes I get bummed about this and feel like no future relationship I could have would be a truly legitimate thing, because I didn't have this formative experience that most people seem to. However, of course thinking this way is stupid, because we're all different and not having exactly the same experience as other people doesn't make you wrong or broken. The same goes for your situation right now. You're not wrong simply because your high school sweetheart happened to *actually* be the love of your life for real, as long as you're not lying to yourselves about any of it.
posted by Sara C. at 1:03 PM on January 11, 2016


Just another anecdotal-data point:
Your story reminds me of my and my bf's best friends from college. They started dating when he was a senior in high school and she was a sophomore in high school. They were each other's firsts for pretty much everything beyond a simple kiss (and they actually waited for pregnancy-risk sex until she was out of college, IIRC). They got married several years ago, after dating since 2001, through different colleges in different cities and a lot of other stress. They're just *right* for each other, and they put the effort in (then and now) to grow together as a team. Sometimes it takes you a long time to find the person for you, and sometimes you get lucky and find them right away. (And the sex aspect, something both my buddy and my boyfriend agreed on when asked about having less experience: they both said, in a very matter-of-fact, unromantic way, "why would I need to try more people when I already found the one I want?" And hey, if y'all ever get to a point where you do feel like you need to sample the population a little, that doesn't necessarily have to be a dealbreaker if y'all don't want it to be.)

So yeah, no one but you and your lady can tell you what the right thing to do here is, but high school sweethearts who go the distance are not always just fairy tales. Maybe they're rare birds, but they're not dodos, y'know?
posted by dust.wind.dude at 1:54 PM on January 11, 2016


It's worth noting that most of the reason we say that first loves don't work out, or teen loves don't work out, is to discourage teenagers from making serious life commitments while under the influence of massive loads of hormones. If you've already made it past that point, that advice no longer applies to you.
posted by corb at 2:39 PM on January 11, 2016 [2 favorites]


I know lots of happily married people in which someone had this kind of anxiety around the engagement. You guys should like a great couple. Engagement can just naturally raise a whole slew of anxieties. I think you might really enjoy being married and having the commitment made.

One resource to look at is Conscious Transitions and that author's book. For instance, it has a list of possible sources of anxiety to consider: leaving one's parents house or a sense of "leaving" the family to some extent, a partial shift in identity from being A Daughter to being A Wife (or Son to Husband, one's relationship morphing into one's parents' relationship, etc.
posted by salvia at 4:15 PM on January 11, 2016


My partner and I met when we were 18/19. Lots of what you've written above sounds like it could have been written about us. We were together for a bit over a decade by the time we decided to get married--it was an unexpectedly nervewracking decision for both of us. But we got married a little over a year ago, we've got a kid on the way, and it's been fantastic! I'm not sure now what we were so worried about.

Anecdata, for what it's worth.
posted by JuliaJellicoe at 4:52 PM on January 11, 2016


Every sane person contemplating marriage has that moment when they freak out over "but, OMG, it's for forever and ever and I don't know if it's good enough for that!" Looking at the big picture is all well and good but do that to any relationship for any length of time and you will get vertigo. Reel it in. You've been together for a long-ass time and you still prefer her company to anybody else's. You still enjoy fucking and you have your finances figured out. You two totally got this! Put on the rings and then forget about them and live your lives. That's what worked for me. I panicked. Then a year after the rings went on, I realized my life was still pretty much the same happy hanging with my best friend kind of life as before.

Most people you date are not the one, not at 18, not at 48. Through trial, error, and a huge helping of luck, you meet someone. You lucked out early.
posted by Foam Pants at 6:07 PM on January 11, 2016 [1 favorite]


Early in our relationship I had anger management problems, never against people, but against inanimate objects and things. When we first met I was an easily frustrated person who expressed it poorly. After many Christmases visiting the family, it clear to use that this was a learned behavior from my father who is still like this), and something that was not acceptable. My frustration was almost entirely based around inanimate objects, like my phone crashing when I’m in a hurry, a bunch of things falling over in the kitchen, or unexpectedly tripping over something. Those are all frustrating events, but I would react by tossing my phone across the room, shouting in the kitchen, or kicking whatever I tripped over.

This behavior is unacceptable for yourself or any partner you're with. You'd never want to submit someone to a lifetime of that. However! You realized this was a problem, and you were very young, so, those are things that happen.

At some point my girlfriend told me that these things would startle or frighten her. I knew that was unacceptable for her to feel that way in any relationship, so I worked on reevaluating why I got angry, and how to mitigate things that would frustrate me, and to see the humor in things instead of instantly reacting negatively. I think I have a good handle now on my reactions, and I have not had any outbursts in quite a long time, but I am worried this has made me unfit as a spouse. She disagrees and thinks I have made massive strides in improving, I just want to make sure I never stop one day and slide back into my old ways.


So this is a really great thing to do. It's good that you started working on your anger, and it's great that your girlfriend is seeing improvement.

The bummer is that you're putting SO much pressure on yourself. This is your anxiety, and this is the problem you really, really need to address.

a little free mefi therapy


for a lot of reasons, Metafilter isn't therapy. I consider a Metafilter question something like a first step - like, it's a good first step that you reached out here, but the second step is getting into therapy - maybe couples, but definitely individual.

Your relationship sounds strong and marriage sounds like a great idea, but I see red flags here, not for your relationship, your girlfriend or your marriage, but for your own emotional health. There seem to be some things you need to work through.
posted by sweetkid at 6:25 PM on January 11, 2016


I know four couples from college who met their first year in college or the final year in high school (one couple actually met on a summer mission trip when they were 12!) and are extremely happy with each other and have kids and all that jazz now.

I know just as many couples (including me! and my partner!) who got married later than that who are now no longer married.

It's about compatibility and I can't see anything in your post that says you aren't compatible. Too much beanplating, sure. But dude: you seem to have a great relationship. If you can separate out the anxiety over the proposal and making it just right, it sounds like you are happy.

And personally, I think not having any other sexual partners is awesome - you guys set each other's standard of what sex is. That's something most people don't get to experience with their life partner.

Good luck - I also believe in the jointly-decided proposal. Still romantic and much more in line with an adult relationship of equals. That's my opinion. YMMV.
posted by guster4lovers at 10:07 PM on January 11, 2016


You sound like you are already pretty commited to one another, and make a good couple. Don't overthink the actual paper part of it. A marriage is not about the contract, it is about the relationship and about deciding you want to be together and to grow together. Which you seem to be doing already. You won't be making a mistake if you propose, go for it.

Oh and, just as others have mentioned, you wouldn't be the first (or last) couple who've only ever had sex with each other. It still works out ok. My husband and I were each other's firsts, if it matters.
posted by CrazyLemonade at 10:11 PM on January 11, 2016


I too kept waiting for the "but" but it never came. You guys sound great and kudos for recognising and dealing with the anger thing. Definitely a positive sign.

Anecdotally one of my best friends has been with her husband since they were 16. At one point in their 20s they broke up because they thought they should, not having experienced dating others etc... lasted about 4 hours lol. They've been together 18 years now, have a child and are by all accounts very happy together.
posted by lifethatihavenotlivedyet at 10:24 PM on January 11, 2016


You guys sound like you have a better relationship than most married couples, and that's awesome. Sure, most "first loves" don't work out, but those that do have relationships like yours, that allow for and support change and growth. That's the magic bullet.

To address your three "pause for thought" points:
1. She is right. You are working through these issues and while this undoubtedly put a strain on your relationship and gave your girlfriend pause for thought herself, she is still right there by your side. You know, like a life partner would be...
2. The rest of the world should be so lucky. The reason first loves often don't work out is because people change, and they don't change with each other, and they don't recognize that changing is okay and support each other through change, they just go "oh, you are not the guy I knew in high school" as if that's a bad thing. Or you realize that you have different values. My high school boyfriend is now someone who shares anti-immigration posts on facebook. I have no regrets. You're not me!
3. If you're happy, your friends and family will be happy. I suspect that if your friends or family had a problem with your partner, you'd know by now. The fact that you're getting the "so, when are you guys going to set the date?" means that they love her for the same reasons that you do.

I think you need to accept that you are one of the fortunate few that found your "one" early. You've been through massive change, adversity (her car accident), and you're still together and stronger than ever.

Wishing you both a long and happy life together!
posted by finding.perdita at 1:26 AM on January 12, 2016


My husband and I started dating when we were 14 (actually he was still 13, he's a few months younger). We married at 25 and I just turned 30 a couple days ago. I certainly don't feel like I missed out on anything. We stayed together through college (where we made sure to make other friends and have our own interests) and health problems and everything else, supporting each other. Life hasn't always taken us exactly where we were planning, individually, but I don't think we ever held each other back or limited each other - the opposite, in fact. We fused our finances when we were 23. We weren't honestly all that naive, I don't think, there just wasn't anything more we wanted. When we married we each had some issues that we knew might be life-long challenging issues, and as we've gotten older and grown up even more they've actually gotten much better. I think we're at a better place now - both personally AND together - than ever before. We have a 2-year-old, and I think that our child has brought us closer together, if anything. We are a good team.

It's true that most first loves don't work out. Until recently I had never met another couple that started dating so young and stayed together, but I just started a new job and found that both of my officemates (my age, and 10 years older) also met their partners at 14. One of them got married at 19 (thinking, hey, why not, I'm certain) and is still married at 39. The other waited until 28, after being (like you) basically married for 10 years. It was kind of cool to meet these other folks. It doesn't usually work, but you know, sometimes it does and that's great.
posted by Cygnet at 3:48 AM on January 12, 2016


Response by poster: I want to thank everyone for their replies! Reading through this post has definitely made me focus on the source on my anxiety and realize it's not being married that make me nervous, but the process of getting married. I think I need to get a handle on my anxiety in general, especially when it comes down to making decisions. That will be a good life goal for 2016.

I ended up talking to a close friend at work, who told me the hardest part of his engagement was getting the ball rolling, and once he started everything seemed easier. I totally get that, and today everything seems much more straightforward and I'm starting to get very excited about the process.

I know a bunch of approval from the internet does not guarantee long term relationship success, but it sure helped to calm me down. Thank you everyone who took the time to read my awful writing (four years of engineering has degraded what little wiring skills I had).
posted by token-ring at 5:06 AM on January 12, 2016 [3 favorites]


I met my wife freshman year in college. We got married in our mid-twenties. Still married. No regrets. If you're happy and in love, go for it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
posted by trbrts at 2:35 PM on January 12, 2016


The only red flag is that sense of missing out on something and not knowing who else is out there - this can really wreck marriages (resentment, cheating, divorce, epic midlife crisis, 7 year itch etc). If you are confident that you're not missing out then you'll do great, but if not then I would instead take a 1-2 year break before marrying so your wild oats are totally sown (you do risk losing her to someone else during this time though).
posted by meepmeow at 7:48 PM on January 12, 2016


Foam Pants said what I was getting at much better than I did.
posted by salvia at 10:43 PM on January 12, 2016


You've been with your partner for 9 years. I married my first love after a year and half together. Our one year anniversary (for our marriage) is coming up this April. My husband had the same reservations actually when we were dating in our first year. He is my first relationship and I'm his second but first love as well. I point blank told him that it was obvious we both wanted to build a life together. We actually even referred to each other as life partners. You two sound like you're each other's life partners.

I wish I had the 9 years you did, if only to feel more socially validated about our decision but you know what, when you have that kind of connection with someone you want to build your life with, you know. You just got lucky, like me, that you didn't have to date a lot to find that someone.

Marriage is an extension of what you've already been doing: growing together and building a life with each other.

Just talk with your life partner and establish your expectations, fears, etc. That's what she's there for.

You sound like you want to get married but even if you don't, you have an amazing relationship so just talk about it with her and make some sort of decision together.
posted by thischarmingirl at 3:01 PM on January 13, 2016


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