To shiva or not to shiva?

December 9, 2015 8:15 AM

What's the right thing to do here?

Hi gang,

I am trapped in a sort of unfortunate cycle with my very serious ex boyfriend (the person from this question). He has a girlfriend at the moment. Over the summer (after that last question was written), we spent time together at the wedding of a mutual friend and catching up - there are clearly still feelings between us. At one point, he suddenly started crying and saying his current relationship was bad and he was sorry for hurting me and he missed me. I miss him too. But I, trying to be healthy and clearheaded, said if he really wanted to move forward and talk about us for real, I would be open to it and he should contact me. But if not, we couldn't have these uncomfortable and emotionally difficult conversations that re-open old feelings for me. Because they do - they make it very hard for me to move on.

Predictably, he seemed not to follow through - he has contacted me saying he hasn't forgotten our conversation but he isn't sure what he wants or what to do. I've just tried to be very polite and strong and say "thanks for writing," instead of encouraging more conversations, but it actually has been very emotionally difficult. Since I haven't found another serious partner since, and moving on from this relationship and my anxiety and depression and whatnot has been challenging, it has made me feel sad and bad all over again. I'm really trying not to dwell on it, but it's been tough, clearly.

Last night, he contacted me to say that his grandfather has passed away. The grandfather and I were very close once upon a time - it is sad news. For anyone else, I would travel down to his city (about 3 hours) for a shiva call; I'm a believer in "always going to the funeral," especially when it's someone I actually knew and felt close to. Paying a shiva call is just something people do, I think. Plus, this guy was so wonderful to me when my own grandmother passed away (albeit when we were in a relationship). But, realistically, I am afraid it would be too much for me emotionally - "breaking up" with his family was extremely difficult, since we were very close, and being around them all might be difficult in better circumstances, much less these weird ones. Plus, I don't want to make it harder for him - it's not about me, after all.

Sending something like a heartfelt condolence letter and/or food might be better for me emotionally, even though it feels like a cop-out. Is it a cop-out? Is it okay if I just do that instead? Does that make me a bad human?

Thanks, guys.

posted by bookgirl18 to Human Relations (20 answers total)

Funerals are for the living, and you are not trying to hang with those guys anymore, so it is not a cop-out.
Privately sit and think about the grandfather for a little while on your own, a mini-shiva, to pay respects to the relationship you used to have with him.
Send a card to the family or to the ex if you want, but you don't even have to do that if you think it will invite more contact.
Don't go in person, you will just stir up extra emotions for yourself and other people there that would be distracting and uncomfortable.
posted by rmless at 8:25 AM on December 9, 2015 [10 favorites]

Predictably, he seemed not to follow through - he has contacted me saying he hasn't forgotten our conversation but he isn't sure what he wants or what to do.

That sounds an awful lot like follow-through.

I've gone to funerals where I know exes will be there, but those have been funerals of mutual friends. I've actively avoided (after much debate) going to funerals of exes' family members (only once, but it was quite a long time after we had split--if it had been in the months after we split, I would have gone).

Nevertheless, the mental calculus on these things is inherently subjective. If you think the funeral would be too much, then it would probably be too much. You can send condolences without being physically present, and it's a pretty common thing for exes to avoid seeing one another during times of extreme duress. I would imagine this guy would understand either way. Just... don't make the conversation about you, whichever way you decide (as in, don't say "I can't come to your grandad's funeral because it would be too hard for me;" maybe a placeholder like, "I'm sorry I can't make it to the funeral, grandad was great, and I will see you once you're back").

Good luck.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 8:27 AM on December 9, 2015 [1 favorite]

Nope. You don't need to send a letter and/or food and you absolutely don't go to his city. You text him back (or email, or however he contacted you) and you offer condolences to him that way, and then you move on.

You are no longer in a relationship with this person and he's not treating either you or his current girlfriend respectfully. Looking at the prior question you linked to, he didn't even meet your needs when you were in a relationship with him. It's time for you to move on.
posted by headnsouth at 8:27 AM on December 9, 2015 [1 favorite]

You do not want to bring your own drama to the people who are sitting shiva. This is a time for them to mourn and think and pray. No one will think you are a bad person for not going.
posted by blurker at 8:30 AM on December 9, 2015 [10 favorites]

Seconding: "Don't go in person, you will just stir up extra emotions for yourself and other people there that would be distracting and uncomfortable."

Your ex has already indicated that he's not willing to do the work to get into a healthy relationship with you (romantic or otherwise). If it were me, I'd take that as an indication that I should therefore not spend a lot of time or energy making him feel better about the relationship as it stands. You are not the right support person for him right now.

I'm sorry for your losses.
posted by jaguar at 8:30 AM on December 9, 2015

I am sorry for your loss

Sending condolences, instead of attending services, is not copping out. It's kind and thoughtful in a situation where there are nontrivial reasons keeping you from attending in person. Significant travel time and uncertainty over whether you'd be intruding are nontrivial reasons.
posted by crush-onastick at 8:55 AM on December 9, 2015 [4 favorites]

Definitely do not add extra drama to a very emotional situation. Among other things, from what you're saying here, it sounds like this dude is emotionally cheating on his girlfriend with you. Is a funeral really the right place for that to blow up if she figures it out?

I would wait a bit and then tell this asshole that contact is OVER. Tell him not to contact you and then block him everywhere. Honestly, even if he breaks up with his current girlfriend and wants to get back together with you, do you really want to be with someone who would treat the woman he is dating this way?
posted by rainbowbrite at 9:01 AM on December 9, 2015 [4 favorites]

Definitely send a heartfelt letter. That's all you need to do. (Bonus level: I'm Jewish, and I'm definitely excusing you from a shiva call.)
posted by BlahLaLa at 9:07 AM on December 9, 2015 [6 favorites]

I'd go if it were me. This isn't a date, it's a shiva call. I mean, maybe I'm just naive, but who's going to try and pick you up at a shiva?

Do either one of the following:

a) Go in the middle of the day, spend your obligatory twenty minutes, make a point of talking to the whole family ("it's so strange how sad occasions brings people together") and especially make a point of talking to his new girlfriend. Say to her, in his earshot, "we should meet again when you have simchas!" I can't think of a more unmistakable message saying "I'm done with you and want you - with the best will in the world - to move on with your life."

b) Go for the evening minyan. There'll be lots of people there, so not much time to talk, but you'll be sending a signal to all the people you care about that you care, and there'll be no way anybody can induce you to stay for very long ("it's dark, I have three hours drive home!").
posted by Dreadnought at 9:16 AM on December 9, 2015 [5 favorites]

Not a bad human at all. I would think about sending a note of condolence to the family with some specific fond memories about the grandfather and leave it at that.
posted by cecic at 9:17 AM on December 9, 2015 [3 favorites]

...being around them all might be difficult in better circumstances, much less these weird ones.

Perhaps, but I've found that the ritual involved in those sorts of events can act as a shelter from actually getting into anything.

But -- this is about you, and whether you are comfortable going or not. There is nothing wrong with going to pay your respects, even when you are no longer involved. There is also nothing wrong with sending condolence cards and not attending.

Given what you've posted, I suspect that your attending may be interpreted by your ex as a signal of re-interest or re-involvement on your part, even though that's not the case. That would make me uncomfortable attending, and I am also one of these people who simply goes to these things as a matter of course.
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:18 AM on December 9, 2015 [1 favorite]

Given what you've posted here and in your previous question, I would not go to make a shivah call in this case. And really, under these circumstances, if I were a member of the family, I'd frankly think it was a bit odd if you drove down three hours to make a shivah call. Send a condolence card sharing some nice memories of the grandfather, and that's that.

(Just some anecdotal personal stuff here for a sec: my father is currently in hospice and his funeral will probably be within the next day or two; a lot of my family lives in California and Denver, and many of them, including my niece and sister-in-law, will not be coming to the funeral or the shivah here in NYC. No one is upset about that, and certainly no one is thinking that they're terrible people or that they're copping out. It is most decidedly not a cop-out to decline to travel three hours to make a shivah call to an ex-boyfriend's grandfather.)
posted by holborne at 9:29 AM on December 9, 2015 [8 favorites]

I don't think it's a good idea to make a shiva call for this circumstance. (Note, I'm Jewish, and I do get your urge to just go, I do it too.) Since you know when the shiva is and where, it wouldn't be out of the question to send over some food anonymously for delivery, since that would be kind to the family and you think fondly of them. You don't need to share your name. That way, you're doing a mitzvah and maintaining your boundaries.
posted by juniperesque at 9:36 AM on December 9, 2015 [4 favorites]

You could, instead of sending a regular condolence card, send a letter with some memories of him, or make a donation in his name to a charity that would be meaningful. Or something else along those lines. If you have any pictures of him alone or with his grandson (but, I think, without you) that would also be a kind thing to send. The type of things that would remind the family primarily of him. Basically I think you can do something that honors him and is a thoughtful gift to his family, while kind of staying away from the picture, if that makes sense.
posted by egg drop at 10:20 AM on December 9, 2015 [4 favorites]

I don't think you should go in person.

I do think sending some flowers or a delivery of appropriate purchased food to his parents' home or wherever the shiva is, would be a nice gesture, if you care about his family. (Someone above suggested doing this anonymously but I don't agree -- sending flowers and food is a gesture of respect and affection to the family; there's nothing wrong with that. It would be a lot more weird for mourners to get anonymous gifts and have to wonder who didn't want them to know they were sending them.)

Being there in person though does seem like a minefield: potentially weird/distracting for him and his family; potential drama with his current gf; and potentially very hurtful/confusing for you depending how he treats you when you're there.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:25 AM on December 9, 2015

Send a card with a sincere message. Then, maybe a month from now, communicate with the ex and say you no longer want to be in contact with him. He doesn't love you, and he's keeping you hanging anyway.
posted by wryly at 11:37 AM on December 9, 2015 [2 favorites]

(Just one note, because I'm not sure from your question whether you're Jewish, OP, so you might not be familiar with Jewish rituals: better not to send flowers. Flowers are often frowned on at shivah or at Jewish funerals. If you want to send something other than a card to the family, send food.)
posted by holborne at 12:17 PM on December 9, 2015 [2 favorites]

I like juniperesque's suggestion to send food. Mitzvah done! Ex's grandfather honored!
posted by culfinglin at 2:37 PM on December 9, 2015

I'm so sorry for your loss. Sending a heartfelt letter or food is not a cop-out.

I don't think anyone upthread intended it this way, but talk about you bringing your own drama to this event seems uncharitable. That being said, I would expect your ex to make some kind of scene about your relationship if you attend. He's already someone who tends towards emotional displays in public that aren't necessarily the best for the other people involved-- breaking down crying about your former relationship while he's currently partnered was really unfair to both you and his girlfriend. Grief tends to throw people into very intense and unstable emotional states-- funerals are a stage for a lot of intense family fights for a reason-- and being in the pain of recent bereavement is going to seriously diminish whatever filter he has. I think the chances of him engaging in some dramatic behavior that his family doesn't need to deal with during a shiva are pretty high. You don't need to go to the shiva to honor his grandfather and his memory, and I think it'll be better for everyone involved if you don't give your ex an opportunity to do something inappropriate.
posted by moonlight on vermont at 7:15 PM on December 9, 2015

Response by poster: Thanks, guys. I've gone with several suggestions above and sent a personal letter with some stories about the grandfather (that I'm not sure they knew already) and a poem that he once shared with me. My gut says that the majority opinion not to travel down is right, so thanks for the insight. The personal drama between us is probably best for another question, if at all, so I'm really trying to leave that out of all this.
(I am indeed Jewish, so I would not send flowers, but thanks also for the sensitive clarifications.) :)
posted by bookgirl18 at 11:36 AM on December 10, 2015 [1 favorite]