Home Backup Power Options
October 6, 2015 12:32 PM Subscribe
I live in Toronto and my neighbourhood has above-ground powerlines and lots of trees. We get blackouts every year, usually from something happening at a transformer station, but during the ice storm it was because of trees taking out power lines. If I want to protect my family and house against power outages it seems like my options are either getting an installed generator, a portable generator or some kind of backup battery. How do these compare, and is anything going to change much in the next couple of years?
We haven't broken ground on our new house yet but it will be coming soon. Because this is a new house I can get everything set up now with minimal fuss or disruption. The heating and stoves will be natural gas so the backup power would be for keeping the fridge, hot water tank (the tank uses gas to heat the water, but without electricity it won't turn on), some lights and alarm system running.
Here's how I think the pros and cons of each work:
Permanent generator:
We already have natural gas lines to the house which it would connect to so in the event of a blackout this would kick in and automatically power the house until the power comes back on. The generator itself will take up a decent amount of space outside (which we have) and also make a lot of noise. This is probably the most expensive option but in the event of a multi-day outage the best as well.
Portable generator:
This would be the cheapest option and it ought to be powerful enough for our usage. It will power the house as long as I keep filling it up. It isn't automatic though so I would have to fill it with gas, connect to the house and start it myself. If I'm not around I don't know if anyone else in the house would be able to do this. Also, I don't like the prospect of lining up for gas during a blackout - assuming that the gas station is even open. If I go this route and then change to one of the others later it wouldn't be such a big deal as the wiring would have to be done in any event and I could sell it to someone else.
Battery backup
This would work automatically as well and wouldn't take up very much space - it could go in the basement with the furnace. The main worry about this would be capacity. For outages of a few hours, which are the most common ones, it would be fine, but for longer ones this would be a problem. Once the battery is drained then there isn't a way to recharge it until the power comes back. I don't know how this would cost compared to the other two options. I think it would be the most likely to improve in the future though, and replacing one battery set-up with another would be less involved then replacing a gas generator with one for example. The price of electricity here depends on the time of day so I could also use it as a way of reducing the regular electricity costs by charging at night and powering part of the house during the day.
Do any of you have one of these systems? If so how did you come to your decision and how happy are you with it? What other factors should I be looking at?
We haven't broken ground on our new house yet but it will be coming soon. Because this is a new house I can get everything set up now with minimal fuss or disruption. The heating and stoves will be natural gas so the backup power would be for keeping the fridge, hot water tank (the tank uses gas to heat the water, but without electricity it won't turn on), some lights and alarm system running.
Here's how I think the pros and cons of each work:
Permanent generator:
We already have natural gas lines to the house which it would connect to so in the event of a blackout this would kick in and automatically power the house until the power comes back on. The generator itself will take up a decent amount of space outside (which we have) and also make a lot of noise. This is probably the most expensive option but in the event of a multi-day outage the best as well.
Portable generator:
This would be the cheapest option and it ought to be powerful enough for our usage. It will power the house as long as I keep filling it up. It isn't automatic though so I would have to fill it with gas, connect to the house and start it myself. If I'm not around I don't know if anyone else in the house would be able to do this. Also, I don't like the prospect of lining up for gas during a blackout - assuming that the gas station is even open. If I go this route and then change to one of the others later it wouldn't be such a big deal as the wiring would have to be done in any event and I could sell it to someone else.
Battery backup
This would work automatically as well and wouldn't take up very much space - it could go in the basement with the furnace. The main worry about this would be capacity. For outages of a few hours, which are the most common ones, it would be fine, but for longer ones this would be a problem. Once the battery is drained then there isn't a way to recharge it until the power comes back. I don't know how this would cost compared to the other two options. I think it would be the most likely to improve in the future though, and replacing one battery set-up with another would be less involved then replacing a gas generator with one for example. The price of electricity here depends on the time of day so I could also use it as a way of reducing the regular electricity costs by charging at night and powering part of the house during the day.
Do any of you have one of these systems? If so how did you come to your decision and how happy are you with it? What other factors should I be looking at?
Best answer: I don't own any home generators, but I know for a fact they have portable gas generators that run both on Propane and Natural Gas. You could get someone out to install a gas valve somewhere accessible and just turn it on and start up the generator when you need it, as opposed to having it installed permanently.
posted by mayonnaises at 12:38 PM on October 6, 2015
posted by mayonnaises at 12:38 PM on October 6, 2015
You could also do solar + battery backup (like Tesla's new Powerwall).
posted by three_red_balloons at 1:01 PM on October 6, 2015
posted by three_red_balloons at 1:01 PM on October 6, 2015
Best answer: My mum has the natural gas version in her place and it's worked really well so far. It is noisy and it does come on with every outage but for her, it's been great. Hers also services an outdoor recepticle, so the neighbours can tap into it as well.
Remember that your furnace fan will need power! Also your sump pump!
posted by bonobothegreat at 1:04 PM on October 6, 2015
Remember that your furnace fan will need power! Also your sump pump!
posted by bonobothegreat at 1:04 PM on October 6, 2015
Response by poster: There are too many large trees around our house for solar to work well. We'll be using most of the roof as a garden which I think is a better use anyway.
A portable natural gas generator would definitely deal with most of the cons I can think of for a portable generator.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:25 PM on October 6, 2015
A portable natural gas generator would definitely deal with most of the cons I can think of for a portable generator.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:25 PM on October 6, 2015
I would avoid solar+batteries in your situation. If your outages are sometimes caused by ice storms I would suspect that ice and snow would cut the light getting to your solar panels to basically zero.
I would go with a natural gas generator. Your energy needs seem to be low. So you don't need a huge generator, and if you roll it into a mortgage it should be pretty cheap month to month. Also, nice gasoline generators are pretty expensive, and like you said, you have to figure out how to get gas during a disaster.
I have no idea how good they are, but HomeDepot sells some small natural gas generators for a couple thousand dollars.
Just a few ballpark numbers for your energy usage:
An efficient fridge uses 225watts.
Incandescent lights are going to use ~60watts (ie 60w bulb uses 60w)
CFL or LED lights are going to use more like 5watts per bulb.
Hot water heater/alarm system/etc probably use a few watts each
posted by gregr at 1:39 PM on October 6, 2015
I would go with a natural gas generator. Your energy needs seem to be low. So you don't need a huge generator, and if you roll it into a mortgage it should be pretty cheap month to month. Also, nice gasoline generators are pretty expensive, and like you said, you have to figure out how to get gas during a disaster.
I have no idea how good they are, but HomeDepot sells some small natural gas generators for a couple thousand dollars.
Just a few ballpark numbers for your energy usage:
An efficient fridge uses 225watts.
Incandescent lights are going to use ~60watts (ie 60w bulb uses 60w)
CFL or LED lights are going to use more like 5watts per bulb.
Hot water heater/alarm system/etc probably use a few watts each
posted by gregr at 1:39 PM on October 6, 2015
Best answer: I live in Buffalo, NY. (for those unfamiliar, not far from Toronto - about 3.5 hours travel)
I have a generator with a natural gas feed and a diesel backup. I had it installed after I bought the home. It was expensive to install as a retrofit. Having one installed as part of a new build would be cheaper, I am sure.
It is not a noisy as you may think. Still, I would have it placed away from sleeping areas if possible. This generator has a diesel backup and as a result starts up using the diesel from time to time. This is noisy, but tolerable.
I did this because of the many storms we get in Western New York. I have family members with serious health conditions in my home, and the possibility of a long power outage is a grave risk to health and safety. Since the device was installed, we have had no long power outages. (Figures.)
I remind you that regular maintenance is a necessity, and a reoccuring cost. Eventually, the device will need to be replaced. My only advice is the wattage of the device. I purchased a device that will run what I need, but has little excess capacity. I see now that I may have been cheap: I should have bought a bigger (more wattage) device. I may replace this generator with a larger generator at some future time.
Make sure you know how to switch it on! Practice doing this! All the family should know how to do this! My device is automatic, but you may choose another option. We do test the automatic function from time to time. (A tech guy comes out for this test. Yes, I pay for this.)
My friends in Real Estate Sales tell me this device is a plus should I sell my home.
posted by Colonel Sun at 1:43 PM on October 6, 2015
I have a generator with a natural gas feed and a diesel backup. I had it installed after I bought the home. It was expensive to install as a retrofit. Having one installed as part of a new build would be cheaper, I am sure.
It is not a noisy as you may think. Still, I would have it placed away from sleeping areas if possible. This generator has a diesel backup and as a result starts up using the diesel from time to time. This is noisy, but tolerable.
I did this because of the many storms we get in Western New York. I have family members with serious health conditions in my home, and the possibility of a long power outage is a grave risk to health and safety. Since the device was installed, we have had no long power outages. (Figures.)
I remind you that regular maintenance is a necessity, and a reoccuring cost. Eventually, the device will need to be replaced. My only advice is the wattage of the device. I purchased a device that will run what I need, but has little excess capacity. I see now that I may have been cheap: I should have bought a bigger (more wattage) device. I may replace this generator with a larger generator at some future time.
Make sure you know how to switch it on! Practice doing this! All the family should know how to do this! My device is automatic, but you may choose another option. We do test the automatic function from time to time. (A tech guy comes out for this test. Yes, I pay for this.)
My friends in Real Estate Sales tell me this device is a plus should I sell my home.
posted by Colonel Sun at 1:43 PM on October 6, 2015
You need to calculate what your load will be and how long you want it to run for, and work from that point.
Does the hot water heater need a lot of electric, or can it be run from a backup battery (UPS) installed nearby?
Fridges will stay cold if you leave them alone, do you really need it to maintain temp (for medications?)
Is the alarm necessary or optional? Can you all camp in the living room while the power is out, keeping lighting to a minimum.
For instance, I have a small Honda portable generator (eu20000), gas powered.
It will run for an entire day, powering a few lights and keeping the fridge cool but not cold, on a gallon or two of gas.
Filling with gas isn't much of a hassle at all, I keep 5 gallons stored and rotate it through lawn appliances, so it's reasonably fresh.
Hot water is gas, winters are generally mild, and power outages generally last less than 48 hours here, so it is suitable for our needs.
But, if you want to essentially live as though the power had never gone out, you'll almost certainly need a much larger, permanent installation with a transfer switch.
If you have natural gas already run, it's an easy install, but as you say, expensive.
Have you investigated propane-powered generators?
If you've got the space to put a tank, they might be worth looking into.
Not as convenient as natural gas, in that you need to keep the tank maintained, but in the event of a disruption of natural gas flow (which can occur in long blackouts, or earthquakes, for example), your lights will stay on.
I would discourage a large battery bank. The installed cost of a bank large enough to run a house is huge, and with no way to recharge it, it will be essentially worthless after the second day of a full blackout.
posted by madajb at 1:48 PM on October 6, 2015
Does the hot water heater need a lot of electric, or can it be run from a backup battery (UPS) installed nearby?
Fridges will stay cold if you leave them alone, do you really need it to maintain temp (for medications?)
Is the alarm necessary or optional? Can you all camp in the living room while the power is out, keeping lighting to a minimum.
For instance, I have a small Honda portable generator (eu20000), gas powered.
It will run for an entire day, powering a few lights and keeping the fridge cool but not cold, on a gallon or two of gas.
Filling with gas isn't much of a hassle at all, I keep 5 gallons stored and rotate it through lawn appliances, so it's reasonably fresh.
Hot water is gas, winters are generally mild, and power outages generally last less than 48 hours here, so it is suitable for our needs.
But, if you want to essentially live as though the power had never gone out, you'll almost certainly need a much larger, permanent installation with a transfer switch.
If you have natural gas already run, it's an easy install, but as you say, expensive.
Have you investigated propane-powered generators?
If you've got the space to put a tank, they might be worth looking into.
Not as convenient as natural gas, in that you need to keep the tank maintained, but in the event of a disruption of natural gas flow (which can occur in long blackouts, or earthquakes, for example), your lights will stay on.
I would discourage a large battery bank. The installed cost of a bank large enough to run a house is huge, and with no way to recharge it, it will be essentially worthless after the second day of a full blackout.
posted by madajb at 1:48 PM on October 6, 2015
Best answer: I'm curious about your statement about a portable generator running the house, as they rarely have enough juice to cover all the items in a home and you can't just wire one in without some sort of way to make sure you don't push power back out into the community supply lines. Both because it would prevent it from working and because you can kill someone(s).
But, presuming you have all that worked out I'd just share my experience in dealing with them in hurricane country: stuff that requires regular gasoline but is used infrequently is a massive pain in the ass. You want it full so it's ready to use and because storing it mostly empty opens you up to condensation damage. But fuel goes bad (why do zombie movies/shows never deal with this?) and will clog up the carburetor.
In Miami our process was basically
This is a very long winded way of saying that if I were you I'd invest in the permanently installed one.
posted by phearlez at 2:04 PM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
But, presuming you have all that worked out I'd just share my experience in dealing with them in hurricane country: stuff that requires regular gasoline but is used infrequently is a massive pain in the ass. You want it full so it's ready to use and because storing it mostly empty opens you up to condensation damage. But fuel goes bad (why do zombie movies/shows never deal with this?) and will clog up the carburetor.
In Miami our process was basically
- Need generator
- Buy generator
- Use generator
- Get power back and stop using generator
- Need generator again months or years later
- Spend hours/days screwing around with generator to get it running.
This is a very long winded way of saying that if I were you I'd invest in the permanently installed one.
posted by phearlez at 2:04 PM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
Best answer: We moved into an older home with a whole house generator about a year ago, and we've had outages that kicked the generator on several times. It keeps the boiler, oven, well, and most of the house outlets running and is powered by propane (our primary fuel). There's only one kitchen outlet that's live when it's on, but that's in addition to the refrigerator and stove, so it's been plenty.
The whole house generator kicks on once a week automatically and runs for about 5 minutes, then shuts down. It's loud enough to notice when it turns on, but it's not obnoxious - especially if the alternative is NO power. When the power goes out, the system kicks on automatically within about 60 seconds. It's been an incredibly nice security to have. Generators of this size sell new here at Home Depot for around $4500 - installation would be on top of that.
The difference I've seen between our friends who use a portable generator and our setup is that they have just one or two outlets that they have to juggle between critical appliances for the duration of the outage, and ours which just kicks in and life immediately goes back to almost normal. The other huge difference is not having to continually feed it with fuel. Both of those are nice differences!
My only complaint about our setup is that many of the electrical breakers run through the generator somehow, making it tough to figure out what breaker an individual circuit is on sometimes. (I think I just need to have an electrician come out and show me how the thing is wired into our system.)
All in all, it's been a comforting enough security that I would spend the extra to include one if I ever built a home in the future - and I wouldn't have said that before we experienced life with one.
posted by summerstorm at 3:22 PM on October 6, 2015
The whole house generator kicks on once a week automatically and runs for about 5 minutes, then shuts down. It's loud enough to notice when it turns on, but it's not obnoxious - especially if the alternative is NO power. When the power goes out, the system kicks on automatically within about 60 seconds. It's been an incredibly nice security to have. Generators of this size sell new here at Home Depot for around $4500 - installation would be on top of that.
The difference I've seen between our friends who use a portable generator and our setup is that they have just one or two outlets that they have to juggle between critical appliances for the duration of the outage, and ours which just kicks in and life immediately goes back to almost normal. The other huge difference is not having to continually feed it with fuel. Both of those are nice differences!
My only complaint about our setup is that many of the electrical breakers run through the generator somehow, making it tough to figure out what breaker an individual circuit is on sometimes. (I think I just need to have an electrician come out and show me how the thing is wired into our system.)
All in all, it's been a comforting enough security that I would spend the extra to include one if I ever built a home in the future - and I wouldn't have said that before we experienced life with one.
posted by summerstorm at 3:22 PM on October 6, 2015
Just a heads-up that most gas boilers/ furnaces do require electricity to work, so make sure you size whatever you get to account for that if necessary. (I so wish they had “power outage” settings that let them be used during outages!)
posted by metasarah at 12:04 PM on October 7, 2015
posted by metasarah at 12:04 PM on October 7, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
It's probably a good middle-of-the-road solution that could work for small outages of just a couple of days, possibly only during the summer months. It might still be worthwhile to get a solar installer to do an eval and give you all the numbers on it.
posted by slacy at 12:37 PM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]