What is the right word for the building that houses a museum?
October 5, 2015 7:37 PM Subscribe
The building that houses The Menil Collection is one of my all-time favorite buildings that houses art. But "building" isn't the right word. Nor is gallery, nor is exhibition, though it is close to all of these. What is the right word, accurately defines the buildings which house the art in The Louvre, The Art Institute, Museum Fine Arts Houston, San Antonio Museum of Art, etc and etc.
I'm writing up the ideal Thursday Houston museum run for a friend. The building that houses The Menil Collection is one of my all-time favorite buildings that houses art; it's so cool, really well done, the lighting perfect.
But "building" isn't the word I'm looking for. Yes, it *is* a building, yes, it *is* a hall, yes, it *does* house the exhibit. But none of those is the right word, which I do know, which flits in and out of my brain like a gnat year by year, mostly out.
It's totally annoying to me that I don't have a hold of it -- the word "pick-up" for example, describing my truck, that word is *always* readily available, and so is "Cheerios" though I don't even eat them, "aardvark" is ever-present; "birdshit" and "keyboard", hey, I could be in the midst of a force five hurricane and there they'd be.
It's humbling to ask for it here, but no online thesaurus is helping and none ever has helped and none ever will, my life is crumbling, almost, I figure if I ask for it here I'll get it, and I'll always know where to go and find the lowdown, rotten, contemptible tease that it is to me.
Any help appreciated.
I'm writing up the ideal Thursday Houston museum run for a friend. The building that houses The Menil Collection is one of my all-time favorite buildings that houses art; it's so cool, really well done, the lighting perfect.
But "building" isn't the word I'm looking for. Yes, it *is* a building, yes, it *is* a hall, yes, it *does* house the exhibit. But none of those is the right word, which I do know, which flits in and out of my brain like a gnat year by year, mostly out.
It's totally annoying to me that I don't have a hold of it -- the word "pick-up" for example, describing my truck, that word is *always* readily available, and so is "Cheerios" though I don't even eat them, "aardvark" is ever-present; "birdshit" and "keyboard", hey, I could be in the midst of a force five hurricane and there they'd be.
It's humbling to ask for it here, but no online thesaurus is helping and none ever has helped and none ever will, my life is crumbling, almost, I figure if I ask for it here I'll get it, and I'll always know where to go and find the lowdown, rotten, contemptible tease that it is to me.
Any help appreciated.
Can you clarify why museum isn't the word you're looking for? When I look up the dictionary definition of museum, this is what I get: "a building in which objects of historical, scientific, artistic, or cultural interest are stored and exhibited."
posted by joan_holloway at 7:51 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by joan_holloway at 7:51 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: The building itself is the museum. It houses collections.
posted by Thorzdad at 9:47 PM on October 5
There is a more accurate word.
posted by dancestoblue at 7:52 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by Thorzdad at 9:47 PM on October 5
There is a more accurate word.
posted by dancestoblue at 7:52 PM on October 5, 2015
Hm...structural work.
posted by unknowncommand at 7:52 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 7:52 PM on October 5, 2015
Consevatory? Exhibition? Gallery?
Do you have experience with more languages than English? I feel like this might be a word in other languages and you are having a polyglot problem.
posted by Mizu at 7:53 PM on October 5, 2015
Do you have experience with more languages than English? I feel like this might be a word in other languages and you are having a polyglot problem.
posted by Mizu at 7:53 PM on October 5, 2015
Site.
posted by unknowncommand at 7:53 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by unknowncommand at 7:53 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
I am a career museum person and I have no idea what you're aiming for here.
Galleries and halls and atriums (atria, whatever) are inside of buildings.
Even on the Menil site: "The main building houses special exhibitions and the permanent collection, and it anchors a campus with three other museum buildings: "
posted by Miko at 7:54 PM on October 5, 2015 [10 favorites]
Galleries and halls and atriums (atria, whatever) are inside of buildings.
Even on the Menil site: "The main building houses special exhibitions and the permanent collection, and it anchors a campus with three other museum buildings: "
posted by Miko at 7:54 PM on October 5, 2015 [10 favorites]
Structure, facility, edifice? Institution? The Louvre specifically is also a palace, though I can't imagine that's what you're looking for. The Guggenheim uses building, which also has a rotunda and tower.
Museum does also cover the building, though, which might have several galleries, each housing a collection.
posted by Andrhia at 7:54 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Museum does also cover the building, though, which might have several galleries, each housing a collection.
posted by Andrhia at 7:54 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
There's a German word, Kunsthalle, but it's a serious term of art meaning a museum that doesn't have its own collection but shows changing exhibitions.
each housing acollection display. It may or may not house a whole collection - a collection is a larger notion and normally less than 5% of any collection is on display.
posted by Miko at 7:56 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
each housing a
posted by Miko at 7:56 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
As someone who used to be in the architectural field, I would say the word you're looking for is "structure".
posted by Specklet at 7:59 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by Specklet at 7:59 PM on October 5, 2015
It's not a basilica, exactly, but maybe that's the word you're looking for?
posted by unknowncommand at 8:08 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 8:08 PM on October 5, 2015
As someone who used to be in the architectural field, I would say the word you're looking for is "structure".
But that can also mean basically anything that stands up, not just specifically one that houses art (or something like that). Same with building, edifice, construction, etc.
I think a thorough explanation of why "museum" doesn't work would help. A museum is specifically the type of building you're describing, and all other suggestions in here so far are more general in the type of buildings they describe, or describe parts of buildings rather than the whole.
posted by LionIndex at 8:12 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
But that can also mean basically anything that stands up, not just specifically one that houses art (or something like that). Same with building, edifice, construction, etc.
I think a thorough explanation of why "museum" doesn't work would help. A museum is specifically the type of building you're describing, and all other suggestions in here so far are more general in the type of buildings they describe, or describe parts of buildings rather than the whole.
posted by LionIndex at 8:12 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Bauen (cf. Heidegger?)
posted by unknowncommand at 8:17 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 8:17 PM on October 5, 2015
Vessel!
posted by unknowncommand at 8:18 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 8:18 PM on October 5, 2015
I can understand wanting something more specific than "museum," since museum can also mean the institution more generally. But I have never heard anything other than "museum building," sorry.
posted by three_red_balloons at 8:19 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by three_red_balloons at 8:19 PM on October 5, 2015
Response by poster: if I can't find the word, it's okay, I'll just use museum. But there's a word that fits; maybe any of you database people would understand it as a class , or a type; I'm not a database guy, so I don't even know the exact word for that.
But let's say Schwinn,Cannondale, Giant - they're all different types of a certain class. So let's say you were building a database, what would be the word that they all fell under?
I can use museum - I've used it before, but there's a word that fits it with exact precision, and I was hoping I can find it here.
Thx for all the answers thus far!
posted by dancestoblue at 8:42 PM on October 5, 2015
But let's say Schwinn,Cannondale, Giant - they're all different types of a certain class. So let's say you were building a database, what would be the word that they all fell under?
I can use museum - I've used it before, but there's a word that fits it with exact precision, and I was hoping I can find it here.
Thx for all the answers thus far!
posted by dancestoblue at 8:42 PM on October 5, 2015
just a bunch of possibly related terms; are any of these kind of in the right direction?
facility
complex
installation
institution
compound
campus
conservatory
annex
hangar
archive
mausoleum
temple
shrine
sanctum
court
vault
amphitheater
arena
forum
rotunda
pagoda
pavilion
monumental
posted by LobsterMitten at 8:49 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
facility
complex
installation
institution
compound
campus
conservatory
annex
hangar
archive
mausoleum
temple
shrine
sanctum
court
vault
amphitheater
arena
forum
rotunda
pagoda
pavilion
monumental
posted by LobsterMitten at 8:49 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
Cultural repository?
But personally I think "museum" is a precise enough word.
posted by Sternmeyer at 8:52 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
But personally I think "museum" is a precise enough word.
posted by Sternmeyer at 8:52 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
Another museum person here, and I'm baffled as well. I would use museum as the top term for a set that includes things like gallery, exhibition space...are you thinking of something archaic like Wunderkammer? (Sp?)
posted by PussKillian at 8:56 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by PussKillian at 8:56 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
In the bike example, are you saying museum is like Cannondale? Or are you saying museum is like bike? In either case, can provide any of the (other) words of the class?
posted by ssg at 9:11 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by ssg at 9:11 PM on October 5, 2015
Not to go all "the dictionary defines..." but, um, Merriam Webster's first definition is:
a building in which interesting and valuable things (such as paintings and sculptures or scientific or historical objects) are collected and shown to the public
Secondary definitions start with "a place where..." or "an institution where..."
I looked up a couple other dictionaries, and they all yielded similar results. I think maybe what's throwing you off is that we use museum when the more precise term with exhibit, display, gallery, or collection.
Museum really does seem like exactly the word you're looking for. Any other term that I can think of would be less precise (building, structure, etc) or more inaccurate (exhibit, collection, etc).
posted by litera scripta manet at 9:15 PM on October 5, 2015
a building in which interesting and valuable things (such as paintings and sculptures or scientific or historical objects) are collected and shown to the public
Secondary definitions start with "a place where..." or "an institution where..."
I looked up a couple other dictionaries, and they all yielded similar results. I think maybe what's throwing you off is that we use museum when the more precise term with exhibit, display, gallery, or collection.
Museum really does seem like exactly the word you're looking for. Any other term that I can think of would be less precise (building, structure, etc) or more inaccurate (exhibit, collection, etc).
posted by litera scripta manet at 9:15 PM on October 5, 2015
The thing is, museums are housed in a myriad of building classes--palaces, purpose-built structures, important houses, on important locations.
So in your formulation, maybe you might be looking at something like "the collections are housed in the [Name] Building, originally built as the city home of the Duffile-Wharfingtons, blah blah blah."
Basically you're not looking for a class name, you're looking for names of specific buildings and their history.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 9:27 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
So in your formulation, maybe you might be looking at something like "the collections are housed in the [Name] Building, originally built as the city home of the Duffile-Wharfingtons, blah blah blah."
Basically you're not looking for a class name, you're looking for names of specific buildings and their history.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 9:27 PM on October 5, 2015 [1 favorite]
But there's a word that fits; maybe any of you database people would understand it as a class , or a type; I'm not a database guy, so I don't even know the exact word for that.
But let's say Schwinn,Cannondale, Giant - they're all different types of a certain class. So let's say you were building a database, what would be the word that they all fell under?
I am a librarian. I can't tell if you want these things classified or are using them as an example, so I will do both!
These are Library of Congress subject headings; museums as topic as PDF, and the H class as HTML so you can look through other social sciences topics. Links to science and other areas can be found on that page too.
The goal of these documents is for a cataloger to look at an object or book and be able to put a number on it that arranges it thematically with everything else in the collection of the library. The cataloging rules per se won't be of interest likely but they do use descriptive language throughout that may unearth your word-- the poor cataloger may know nothing about topic X but need to describe it from the book in their hand, so there are lots of thorough uses of words. Because cataloging can need to get very granular in a big collection, there are a lot of tiny differentiations.
If I had to classify Schwinn, Cannondale, Giant-- they are bicycl manufacturers, so would all fall under the category :Sporting Goods Industry: in Library of Congress.
If I had to classify databases -- they'd fall under LOC heading :databases:.
If I had to classify museums as a group, like thinking of buildings and their associated grounds that house collections, displays, restoration areas, storage areas-- so art museums, and sculpture parks, and interactive science museums, and a lot more kinds-- LOC says museum. This is why I linked to the museum section above; it talks a lot about museums and alternate names and specific types.
If that doesn't help: Can you tell us what letter it starts with? If it's long or short? Multi- or single syllable? Have you heard a specific type of person use it-- only one family, only people from New York City, only when on tour in Athens Greece, etc.? Have you heard it or only read it? How old were you when you first heard it? Other details to help us think of it...
posted by holyrood at 9:27 PM on October 5, 2015 [6 favorites]
But let's say Schwinn,Cannondale, Giant - they're all different types of a certain class. So let's say you were building a database, what would be the word that they all fell under?
I am a librarian. I can't tell if you want these things classified or are using them as an example, so I will do both!
These are Library of Congress subject headings; museums as topic as PDF, and the H class as HTML so you can look through other social sciences topics. Links to science and other areas can be found on that page too.
The goal of these documents is for a cataloger to look at an object or book and be able to put a number on it that arranges it thematically with everything else in the collection of the library. The cataloging rules per se won't be of interest likely but they do use descriptive language throughout that may unearth your word-- the poor cataloger may know nothing about topic X but need to describe it from the book in their hand, so there are lots of thorough uses of words. Because cataloging can need to get very granular in a big collection, there are a lot of tiny differentiations.
If I had to classify Schwinn, Cannondale, Giant-- they are bicycl manufacturers, so would all fall under the category :Sporting Goods Industry: in Library of Congress.
If I had to classify databases -- they'd fall under LOC heading :databases:.
If I had to classify museums as a group, like thinking of buildings and their associated grounds that house collections, displays, restoration areas, storage areas-- so art museums, and sculpture parks, and interactive science museums, and a lot more kinds-- LOC says museum. This is why I linked to the museum section above; it talks a lot about museums and alternate names and specific types.
If that doesn't help: Can you tell us what letter it starts with? If it's long or short? Multi- or single syllable? Have you heard a specific type of person use it-- only one family, only people from New York City, only when on tour in Athens Greece, etc.? Have you heard it or only read it? How old were you when you first heard it? Other details to help us think of it...
posted by holyrood at 9:27 PM on October 5, 2015 [6 favorites]
Oh, are you looking for a higher-level category, so it would apply to museums, opera houses, symphony halls, etc? Something like:
cultural attraction
civic amenity
posted by LobsterMitten at 9:32 PM on October 5, 2015
cultural attraction
civic amenity
posted by LobsterMitten at 9:32 PM on October 5, 2015
cultural attraction
Or maybe cultural institution?
posted by litera scripta manet at 9:39 PM on October 5, 2015
Or maybe cultural institution?
posted by litera scripta manet at 9:39 PM on October 5, 2015
Ninety-nine times out of a hundred, the museum is the building. This is sort of like asking "what is the name for the building where an airport is located?" or "what is the name for the building where a high school is located?"
The only situation I can think of where the museum and the building aren't one and the same are a few museums I've been to in Europe, where there are multiple specific collections housed within an old villa or something. Or, sometimes, one museum with parts of its collections on multiple specific sites. And then the building is called by its own specific name, with specifically (usually differently named) museums inside. So, for example, you go to the Palazzo Barberini or the Palazzo Corsini to see the Museo Nazionale D'Arte Antica, in Rome.
posted by Sara C. at 9:41 PM on October 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
The only situation I can think of where the museum and the building aren't one and the same are a few museums I've been to in Europe, where there are multiple specific collections housed within an old villa or something. Or, sometimes, one museum with parts of its collections on multiple specific sites. And then the building is called by its own specific name, with specifically (usually differently named) museums inside. So, for example, you go to the Palazzo Barberini or the Palazzo Corsini to see the Museo Nazionale D'Arte Antica, in Rome.
posted by Sara C. at 9:41 PM on October 5, 2015 [3 favorites]
With regards to The Menil Collection specifically, it seems to break down as:
Specific Name Of Building: The Menil Collection
Specific Name Of Institution: (also) The Menil Collection
Specific Name Of Exhibition: (also, again) The Menil Collection.
All of these are instances of specific classes. They're all related, of course, and for a lot of art-exhibiting-cultural institutions they will all be identical.
There are cases where they won't be, but as mentioned above they're rare.
Some questions to answer which might hone in on the exact meaning. You might not be able to answer them without knowing the word, and on the other hand you might. Memory is weird.
* Would the word you're looking for still be applicable to the Building if the Institution moved out of it?
* Would the word you're looking for still be applicable if the Institution acquired another simultaneous Building with another Exhibition?
* Is the word used for anything else?
* Can the word be a verb?
posted by Jon Mitchell at 9:48 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
Specific Name Of Building: The Menil Collection
Specific Name Of Institution: (also) The Menil Collection
Specific Name Of Exhibition: (also, again) The Menil Collection.
All of these are instances of specific classes. They're all related, of course, and for a lot of art-exhibiting-cultural institutions they will all be identical.
There are cases where they won't be, but as mentioned above they're rare.
Some questions to answer which might hone in on the exact meaning. You might not be able to answer them without knowing the word, and on the other hand you might. Memory is weird.
* Would the word you're looking for still be applicable to the Building if the Institution moved out of it?
* Would the word you're looking for still be applicable if the Institution acquired another simultaneous Building with another Exhibition?
* Is the word used for anything else?
* Can the word be a verb?
posted by Jon Mitchell at 9:48 PM on October 5, 2015 [2 favorites]
I don't see how you can get any closer than "repository" or "site." Cultural heritage site?
posted by thetortoise at 10:21 PM on October 5, 2015
posted by thetortoise at 10:21 PM on October 5, 2015
dancestoblue: "But there's a word that fits; maybe any of you database people would understand it as a class , or a type"
I can't make out if the word you're looking for is supposed to be less specific than "museum" or more specific. Let's say your word is X. Are all museums also X's but certain X's are not museums (less specific)? Or are all X's museums but some museums are not X's (more specific)?
If the former, can you provide examples of things that are X but are not museums? And if the latter, can you provide examples of museums that are not X?
posted by mhum at 10:26 PM on October 5, 2015 [5 favorites]
I can't make out if the word you're looking for is supposed to be less specific than "museum" or more specific. Let's say your word is X. Are all museums also X's but certain X's are not museums (less specific)? Or are all X's museums but some museums are not X's (more specific)?
If the former, can you provide examples of things that are X but are not museums? And if the latter, can you provide examples of museums that are not X?
posted by mhum at 10:26 PM on October 5, 2015 [5 favorites]
By the same words, I mean - the Menil website calls it the Main Building
posted by gt2 at 1:15 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by gt2 at 1:15 AM on October 6, 2015
Flagship, maybe?
posted by unknowncommand at 3:26 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 3:26 AM on October 6, 2015
Pinacotheca
posted by unknowncommand at 3:50 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by unknowncommand at 3:50 AM on October 6, 2015
Repository?
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 4:44 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 4:44 AM on October 6, 2015
Wait, are you looking for the word wing? Wing, annex, addendum...all are words I would use to describe "additional buildingy part of an extant museum."
posted by phunniemee at 5:11 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by phunniemee at 5:11 AM on October 6, 2015
I was wondering if it were "wing" as well. But not all museums have wings.
posted by Miko at 5:49 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by Miko at 5:49 AM on October 6, 2015
I guess I would say that I liked the architecture, or the site, if I was trying to separate museum-as-physical-structure from museum-as-collection.
posted by tchemgrrl at 6:34 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by tchemgrrl at 6:34 AM on October 6, 2015
Or the facade (looks like Menil has a cool facade. And a pergola. But it doesn't seem like those are your words, either).
posted by Miko at 7:13 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by Miko at 7:13 AM on October 6, 2015
Your question resonates with me in a strange way, and I think you have a point, but there may just not yet be a word for that concept. I'd say "structure" gets nearest.
posted by fivesavagepalms at 7:58 AM on October 6, 2015
posted by fivesavagepalms at 7:58 AM on October 6, 2015
Please let us know when you do find it! I'm intrigued and slightly puzzled what you're getting at, because as an academic librarian who holds a masters' degree in museum studies, I'd use "museum" or "institution" in the cases you mention.
posted by telophase at 9:01 AM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by telophase at 9:01 AM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I do love this site, and the members here. We haven't found the word though, it's been zinging 'round my head as I've written this thing for my buddy but I just cannot access it. I truly do appreciate all of you also reaching for it.
EDIT: And there *is* a word, and it is an English word, that is precise, accurate. I've gone ahead and used "building" and it does the job but it sure isn't precise.
I will absolutely leave this AskMe open (I can do this, right?) and when the answer finally shows up on the screen inside my mind, I will update the Ask.
Thank you so much, all of you, for trying to help me.
posted by dancestoblue at 10:27 AM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
EDIT: And there *is* a word, and it is an English word, that is precise, accurate. I've gone ahead and used "building" and it does the job but it sure isn't precise.
I will absolutely leave this AskMe open (I can do this, right?) and when the answer finally shows up on the screen inside my mind, I will update the Ask.
Thank you so much, all of you, for trying to help me.
posted by dancestoblue at 10:27 AM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: (Mod(s) -- no problem if you delete this if it's outside the pale, your call of course.)
A Houston Thursday.
Leave Austin maybe 9:15, maybe before -- you'll be headed out 71 so needn't worry much about traffic, though Bastrop has gotten to where it's a pain sometimes; cross your fingers about the time you see that fireworks joint on the right-hand side of 71. You needn't go over the speed limit, not really, maybe five mph over, it's a two hour run mostly, at 65-70 mph once you've cleared Bastrop, 71 to I-10 and on into Houston.
Right about when you pick up I-10 off 71 you'll begin to be able to pick up KPFT 90.1. It's the best radio station in Houston, it's the best in many places IMO. Commercial free, completely listener supported, far to the left of the dial, far to the right politically (Amy Goodman etc and etc), great shows of all kinds, generally 3 hours long (all the DJs on all shows are volunteers, labor of love.) Their radio tower was blown up by the Ku Klux Klan about a week after they began broadcasting, they were up and running again inside a week. I do not want to live in Houston again but if I had to KPFT is one of the things that would make it bearable, that and the Tex/Mex/Louisiana mix of food.
Inside the 610 loop in Houston, exit I-10 @ Shepard (turn right -- south) 2-3 miles on the left (just a shade past San Felipe) you'll get to The Hot Bagel Shop @ 11:40 at the latest. The best bagels in Texas, pretty much the best bagels outside NYC. Ask them what's hot, what's just out of the oven, though you've missed the morning rush where most *everything* is at least warm, if not hot. They'll be fresh, hot or not, but hot is The Way, The Truth, and The Light. Etc. Onion bagels, they're great, cinnamon raisin, salt, garlic and/or bialy (if you're not going to kiss Kim that day), even just their plain bagels, they're really good. I generally bring home a dozen. The owner is there every day, he's a really happy guy, been there over 30 flippin' years. Tell him I said hi.
Next. The Menil collection. Free/donation -- your call. Park on Sul Ross if you can, it's best to approach the building the north side, it's set back nicely, pretty impressive. The Menil has got a pretty cool collection, large enough that much of it rotates, though the antiquities are all pretty much stable; I don't generally spend too much time in that area because I know it well, seen it a million times etc. The Menil collection is housed in a really great building, one of my favorites anywhere -- the lighting is perfect, controlled by shades that open/close depending upon what's happening outside, it's got these creaky wooden floors, it's a really simple design inside, really tall, nice expanses, it's not cramped at all. If you're lucky, they'll have a lot of their Magritte stuff out -- he's fun. They've got one (maybe two?) pen/ink sketches by Mr. Van Gogh, a nice surprise that was to me....
The Menil bookstore right across Sul Ross, lots of fun books, or you can just buy some Magritte post cards or what-have-you.
Dead south of The Menil is a beautiful building housing a collection of paintings by Cy Twombley. Free/donation -- your call. Again, a really nice set-up, the lighting perfect. I don't much care for Twombly's paintings on display (other than the two really rich green ones on circular canvas, you'll see them), but you may.
Rothko Chapel. Free/donation. A short walk from The Menil. Designed by Rothko, I heard somewhere or other that he said that he could die content having done this; I don't know that he said that or not but if he didn't he ought to have. Used to be a great place to meditate but not so much anymore -- the minute you walk into the chapel, a docent steps in and watches every move you make; it's like as if someone was watching me take a dump. I understand -- they don't want anyone hacking up the canvas or spray-painting it etc, but I've offered them whatever -- "Hey, here's my drivers license, my credit card, the keys to the pickup, my first-born -- can't you plz just buzz off?" No cigar. Bummer...
Lunch break. Baba Yega, on Grant Street, just off Montrose and Westheimer. A window seat, if you can get it, is best IMO. Or outside on the deck if it's a pretty day. Really great people watching, live oaks keeping it all shaded; I used to go there with a lesbian running buddy -- Jonny -- and together we'd check out the gals. Great fun. Great iced tea, made with orange and lemon, really interesting taste. Everything is pretty good (I'd bet their menu is online), the cheeseburgers are great -- these huge monsters, good meat, home fries, huge dill pickle slice, cole slaw; if my cardiologist saw me eating one of those beauties I wouldn't have to worry about another heart attack, he'd choke me to death. You'll get out for sixty bucks, both of you, maybe more depending upon wine etc.
MFAH -- open til 9 and free on Thursdays. A great collection, truly world class. Two buildings, the newest maybe ten years old now, a wonderful addition to the overall, the original building is nice but it's small -- I know the collection well, they always had to rotate it, much less to rotate now, many more paintings and sculpture now pretty much permanently displayed. It's like going to see old friends, for me -- I do love the collection. The tunnel that goes under the street from one building to the other is really well done, it's fun. The newer building generally has more of the permanent collection on display. MFAH has a really sweet collection of Remington paintings; watching his progression in life in his paintings is very cool, starts out with cowboys and Indians and ends up with deep paintings showing lots of heart. The Rothko exhibit is $23 bucks admission. I think it said 60 canvas's, which is more than I've ever seen in one spot. Pro Tip: In my experience, not just at MFAH but all touring exhibits, once your inside the show, you can stay in and wander 'round inside it as long as you want -- if it's crowded, a docent may try to give you a bums rush and push you out, just essentially tell him you're deaf or something, or "Me no speaka the English!", whatever -- but once you're out the door it's no going back in without forking over another 23 bucks. So head to the john or what-have-you before you enter.
If you were with me, you'd not walk out the door of the museum til they pull you out by your ear, 9 PM. Stop at Starbux on Shepard at West Gray on your way back to I-10, get a huge honkin' latte (or 2), and head on home, tired but happy...
posted by dancestoblue at 10:42 AM on October 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
A Houston Thursday.
Leave Austin maybe 9:15, maybe before -- you'll be headed out 71 so needn't worry much about traffic, though Bastrop has gotten to where it's a pain sometimes; cross your fingers about the time you see that fireworks joint on the right-hand side of 71. You needn't go over the speed limit, not really, maybe five mph over, it's a two hour run mostly, at 65-70 mph once you've cleared Bastrop, 71 to I-10 and on into Houston.
Right about when you pick up I-10 off 71 you'll begin to be able to pick up KPFT 90.1. It's the best radio station in Houston, it's the best in many places IMO. Commercial free, completely listener supported, far to the left of the dial, far to the right politically (Amy Goodman etc and etc), great shows of all kinds, generally 3 hours long (all the DJs on all shows are volunteers, labor of love.) Their radio tower was blown up by the Ku Klux Klan about a week after they began broadcasting, they were up and running again inside a week. I do not want to live in Houston again but if I had to KPFT is one of the things that would make it bearable, that and the Tex/Mex/Louisiana mix of food.
Inside the 610 loop in Houston, exit I-10 @ Shepard (turn right -- south) 2-3 miles on the left (just a shade past San Felipe) you'll get to The Hot Bagel Shop @ 11:40 at the latest. The best bagels in Texas, pretty much the best bagels outside NYC. Ask them what's hot, what's just out of the oven, though you've missed the morning rush where most *everything* is at least warm, if not hot. They'll be fresh, hot or not, but hot is The Way, The Truth, and The Light. Etc. Onion bagels, they're great, cinnamon raisin, salt, garlic and/or bialy (if you're not going to kiss Kim that day), even just their plain bagels, they're really good. I generally bring home a dozen. The owner is there every day, he's a really happy guy, been there over 30 flippin' years. Tell him I said hi.
Next. The Menil collection. Free/donation -- your call. Park on Sul Ross if you can, it's best to approach the building the north side, it's set back nicely, pretty impressive. The Menil has got a pretty cool collection, large enough that much of it rotates, though the antiquities are all pretty much stable; I don't generally spend too much time in that area because I know it well, seen it a million times etc. The Menil collection is housed in a really great building, one of my favorites anywhere -- the lighting is perfect, controlled by shades that open/close depending upon what's happening outside, it's got these creaky wooden floors, it's a really simple design inside, really tall, nice expanses, it's not cramped at all. If you're lucky, they'll have a lot of their Magritte stuff out -- he's fun. They've got one (maybe two?) pen/ink sketches by Mr. Van Gogh, a nice surprise that was to me....
The Menil bookstore right across Sul Ross, lots of fun books, or you can just buy some Magritte post cards or what-have-you.
Dead south of The Menil is a beautiful building housing a collection of paintings by Cy Twombley. Free/donation -- your call. Again, a really nice set-up, the lighting perfect. I don't much care for Twombly's paintings on display (other than the two really rich green ones on circular canvas, you'll see them), but you may.
Rothko Chapel. Free/donation. A short walk from The Menil. Designed by Rothko, I heard somewhere or other that he said that he could die content having done this; I don't know that he said that or not but if he didn't he ought to have. Used to be a great place to meditate but not so much anymore -- the minute you walk into the chapel, a docent steps in and watches every move you make; it's like as if someone was watching me take a dump. I understand -- they don't want anyone hacking up the canvas or spray-painting it etc, but I've offered them whatever -- "Hey, here's my drivers license, my credit card, the keys to the pickup, my first-born -- can't you plz just buzz off?" No cigar. Bummer...
Lunch break. Baba Yega, on Grant Street, just off Montrose and Westheimer. A window seat, if you can get it, is best IMO. Or outside on the deck if it's a pretty day. Really great people watching, live oaks keeping it all shaded; I used to go there with a lesbian running buddy -- Jonny -- and together we'd check out the gals. Great fun. Great iced tea, made with orange and lemon, really interesting taste. Everything is pretty good (I'd bet their menu is online), the cheeseburgers are great -- these huge monsters, good meat, home fries, huge dill pickle slice, cole slaw; if my cardiologist saw me eating one of those beauties I wouldn't have to worry about another heart attack, he'd choke me to death. You'll get out for sixty bucks, both of you, maybe more depending upon wine etc.
MFAH -- open til 9 and free on Thursdays. A great collection, truly world class. Two buildings, the newest maybe ten years old now, a wonderful addition to the overall, the original building is nice but it's small -- I know the collection well, they always had to rotate it, much less to rotate now, many more paintings and sculpture now pretty much permanently displayed. It's like going to see old friends, for me -- I do love the collection. The tunnel that goes under the street from one building to the other is really well done, it's fun. The newer building generally has more of the permanent collection on display. MFAH has a really sweet collection of Remington paintings; watching his progression in life in his paintings is very cool, starts out with cowboys and Indians and ends up with deep paintings showing lots of heart. The Rothko exhibit is $23 bucks admission. I think it said 60 canvas's, which is more than I've ever seen in one spot. Pro Tip: In my experience, not just at MFAH but all touring exhibits, once your inside the show, you can stay in and wander 'round inside it as long as you want -- if it's crowded, a docent may try to give you a bums rush and push you out, just essentially tell him you're deaf or something, or "Me no speaka the English!", whatever -- but once you're out the door it's no going back in without forking over another 23 bucks. So head to the john or what-have-you before you enter.
If you were with me, you'd not walk out the door of the museum til they pull you out by your ear, 9 PM. Stop at Starbux on Shepard at West Gray on your way back to I-10, get a huge honkin' latte (or 2), and head on home, tired but happy...
posted by dancestoblue at 10:42 AM on October 6, 2015 [3 favorites]
The Menil collection is housed in a really great building, one of my favorites anywhere
Is this the one you're trying to replace?
site, structure, complex, campus...building...?
I know what you mean about feeling like there's a better word that goes there. I don't know what that word is and I'm not sure it exists.
p.s. you missed a preposition in that approach sentence
posted by phunniemee at 10:56 AM on October 6, 2015
Is this the one you're trying to replace?
site, structure, complex, campus...building...?
I know what you mean about feeling like there's a better word that goes there. I don't know what that word is and I'm not sure it exists.
p.s. you missed a preposition in that approach sentence
posted by phunniemee at 10:56 AM on October 6, 2015
The Menil collection is housed in a really great building, one of my favorites anywhere
In the context above, "building" is perfectly fine, though I hear you on it not feeling quite right, as "building" is sometimes assumed to denote the fundamental architecture and not so much the role of layout, lighting, exhibit design, etc. I might say "facility" or "space" instead.
But "museum" really is understood to include the whole package of the building, the art, and the presentation of the exhibits. Maybe saying "museum building" would solve your quandary?
posted by desuetude at 11:26 AM on October 6, 2015
In the context above, "building" is perfectly fine, though I hear you on it not feeling quite right, as "building" is sometimes assumed to denote the fundamental architecture and not so much the role of layout, lighting, exhibit design, etc. I might say "facility" or "space" instead.
But "museum" really is understood to include the whole package of the building, the art, and the presentation of the exhibits. Maybe saying "museum building" would solve your quandary?
posted by desuetude at 11:26 AM on October 6, 2015
dancestoblue: "And there *is* a word, and it is an English word, that is precise, accurate."
If I'm interpreting you correctly, you're saying that none of the words so far offered have been sufficiently precise or accurate. Taking for example the word "museum", can you elaborate on what you feel is imprecise or inaccurate about that word? Do you feel that there are certain buildings covered by your mystery term that are not covered by the term "museum"? Or are there buildings that are covered by the term "museum" that are not covered by your mystery term? Or maybe both? Examples along either of these lines (whether vis-a-vis "museum" or "gallery" or "conservatory" or any of the other terms offered in this thread) I think would greatly help track down what you're looking for.
posted by mhum at 11:42 AM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
If I'm interpreting you correctly, you're saying that none of the words so far offered have been sufficiently precise or accurate. Taking for example the word "museum", can you elaborate on what you feel is imprecise or inaccurate about that word? Do you feel that there are certain buildings covered by your mystery term that are not covered by the term "museum"? Or are there buildings that are covered by the term "museum" that are not covered by your mystery term? Or maybe both? Examples along either of these lines (whether vis-a-vis "museum" or "gallery" or "conservatory" or any of the other terms offered in this thread) I think would greatly help track down what you're looking for.
posted by mhum at 11:42 AM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
EDIT: And there *is* a word, and it is an English word, that is precise, accurate
I am having real trouble imagining how anything could be more precise or accurate than "museum building". I think if we knew in what way it was more precise or accurate we might be able to get at it.
Can you write out the meaning of the word as a phrase with as few words as possible? I think the biggest problem here is that without understanding the meaning of the word you're looking for, we can't find the word.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 11:46 AM on October 6, 2015
I am having real trouble imagining how anything could be more precise or accurate than "museum building". I think if we knew in what way it was more precise or accurate we might be able to get at it.
Can you write out the meaning of the word as a phrase with as few words as possible? I think the biggest problem here is that without understanding the meaning of the word you're looking for, we can't find the word.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 11:46 AM on October 6, 2015
Hmmm. I might say "space" in that particular sentence. (I still don't know what word you're thinking of). The Menil collection is housed in a really great space, one of my favorite museum buildings anywhere...
posted by three_red_balloons at 1:15 PM on October 6, 2015
posted by three_red_balloons at 1:15 PM on October 6, 2015
The Menil collection is housed in a really great building, one of my favorites anywhere -- the lighting is perfect, controlled by shades that open/close depending upon what's happening outside, it's got these creaky wooden floors, it's a really simple design inside, really tall, nice expanses, it's not cramped at all.
The rest of that sentence makes me think that "atmosphere" might work to replace "building" in that instance.
posted by jabes at 1:25 PM on October 6, 2015
The rest of that sentence makes me think that "atmosphere" might work to replace "building" in that instance.
posted by jabes at 1:25 PM on October 6, 2015
I think maybe your descriptive terms are getting tangled up because the the slightly unusual situation of a Collection being the named entity itself in a way that kind of trips up the typical hierarchical nomenclature conventions. (After all, many fine art museums have collections, usually behests, which get discrete acknowledgement and handling, but those collections are clearly a subset of The Museum.)
In this case, the Menil Collection is the name of the museum and it includes works of art beyond the de Menil's original establishing art collection. The Cy Twombly Gallery and some of the other nearby spaces are part of the Menil Collection. (The Rothko Chapel is actually an independent organization.)
So, as a museum, the Menil Collection's...collections...are housed in a number of museum buildings.
posted by desuetude at 1:26 PM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
In this case, the Menil Collection is the name of the museum and it includes works of art beyond the de Menil's original establishing art collection. The Cy Twombly Gallery and some of the other nearby spaces are part of the Menil Collection. (The Rothko Chapel is actually an independent organization.)
So, as a museum, the Menil Collection's...collections...are housed in a number of museum buildings.
posted by desuetude at 1:26 PM on October 6, 2015 [2 favorites]
prospect?
elevation?
facade and edifice have both been mentioned, those are the other two things I can think of for "the building has a beautiful ____ "
posted by LobsterMitten at 3:19 PM on October 6, 2015
elevation?
facade and edifice have both been mentioned, those are the other two things I can think of for "the building has a beautiful ____ "
posted by LobsterMitten at 3:19 PM on October 6, 2015
I feel very strongly that such a word should exist, there's a space for it, but also that it doesn't - at least, not in English. I've looked through technical articles on museum building design from the point of view of architects, and on museum architecture from the view of historians, and there's nothing. The buildiing that houses a museum collection is itself the museum. If the British Museum was emptied of every last artefact and left a shell, it would still be the BM - at least until the collections ended up in a new building, when that would be the New BM and the old building, regardless of its emptiness, would be the Old BM.
It's the same as churches. There are endless technical terms for the components of a church builing, and many different definitions of church, but there is no one word that embodies the concept of the whole church building and nothing but, other than 'church'. There should be. But, there isn't.
(Is there?)
posted by Devonian at 7:45 PM on October 6, 2015
It's the same as churches. There are endless technical terms for the components of a church builing, and many different definitions of church, but there is no one word that embodies the concept of the whole church building and nothing but, other than 'church'. There should be. But, there isn't.
(Is there?)
posted by Devonian at 7:45 PM on October 6, 2015
Pedantic quibble train coming down the line here, but I'd say that a museum is an incorporated organizational entity and a building cannot be one, except by metonymy. I know we think of a museum as a building but it's really an organization, one that's often housed in a building. A museum is not a building and vice versa - buildings house museums.So I would say in response to this:
If the British Museum was emptied of every last artefact and left a shell, it would still be the BM
...what the building would be would be not still the BM but "the British Museum Building," the museum (ie, organizational entity) having already packed up and left. And then if they found a new building this old one would be "the Old British Museum Building" and only colloquially (and not in any technical sense) the "old British Museum." The museum is something bigger than and independent from a building. As sort of a way of thinking about this, I'll add that a lot of museums have no buildings at all. The MOFAD is a prominent example - they just got a building but they've been in exestence as a formal, organized nonprofit educational museum, though building-less, for many years.
There should be. But, there isn't. (Is there?)
Well...less my area of expertise, but in our church building, we have the sanctuary. The big room where services take place. "House of worship" also works for church building. But "church" is like museum - churches use buildings, but are bigger than and to some degree independent from buildings. Sometimes old church buildings become restaurants or houses and we say they're "old churches" but often those churches are still in existence as active congregations, just elsewhere, or merged with another congregation. They're just old church structures - buildings with ecclesiastical architecture built to hold a particular church congregation.
posted by Miko at 7:59 PM on October 6, 2015
If the British Museum was emptied of every last artefact and left a shell, it would still be the BM
...what the building would be would be not still the BM but "the British Museum Building," the museum (ie, organizational entity) having already packed up and left. And then if they found a new building this old one would be "the Old British Museum Building" and only colloquially (and not in any technical sense) the "old British Museum." The museum is something bigger than and independent from a building. As sort of a way of thinking about this, I'll add that a lot of museums have no buildings at all. The MOFAD is a prominent example - they just got a building but they've been in exestence as a formal, organized nonprofit educational museum, though building-less, for many years.
There should be. But, there isn't. (Is there?)
Well...less my area of expertise, but in our church building, we have the sanctuary. The big room where services take place. "House of worship" also works for church building. But "church" is like museum - churches use buildings, but are bigger than and to some degree independent from buildings. Sometimes old church buildings become restaurants or houses and we say they're "old churches" but often those churches are still in existence as active congregations, just elsewhere, or merged with another congregation. They're just old church structures - buildings with ecclesiastical architecture built to hold a particular church congregation.
posted by Miko at 7:59 PM on October 6, 2015
Here's another data source: the Getty Art & Architecture Thesaurus Hierarchy. It lists the term "museum (buildings)" (separate from term "museum (institution)") in its hierarchy under "exhibition buildings" which itself is under "single built works (built environment)". You can poke around different parts of that hierarchy to see if anything sticks out.
posted by mhum at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by mhum at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2015 [1 favorite]
Mise en scene? I know, I know English word, but still.
posted by tchemgrrl at 7:18 AM on October 8, 2015
posted by tchemgrrl at 7:18 AM on October 8, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:47 PM on October 5, 2015 [11 favorites]