Should I allow this Ebay return?
September 2, 2015 1:57 PM   Subscribe

My profile indicates that I do not accept returns. Buyer wants to return item -- new high-end down jacket with tags -- that was too small for her (though accurately marked). I want to politely decline the return, but wonder what the repercussions are likely to be.

I am not a professional seller - I am just a person who occasionally sells things on ebay for cash if I don't need them, and my eBay reputation is important for this purpose. My profile is marked "returns not accepted".

What would you do, more experienced eBay sellers? What's the worst that could happen? Is she likely to report me...somehow... for something... if I say "I appreciate your business, but I don't accept returns."

(I need that $100.)
posted by chesty_a_arthur to Computers & Internet (21 answers total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
You should clarify whether the listing also said no returns / sales final / etc.

I would tell her what you wrote above. If it goes to dispute, just explain. I've found the dispute resolution process to go well, if I have had documentation.
posted by Chaussette and the Pussy Cats at 2:06 PM on September 2, 2015 [1 favorite]


I guess the big question is whether or not you want to continue selling things on eBay in the future? If not, you can certainly say no and try your luck; likely, she'd leave a bad review and your rating would go down, potentially scaring off potential customers. (I know I'd find such a review worrisome.) Therefore, if you want to continue, I'd reconsider allowing her to return it (for example, under the condition that she pays for postage?) Personally, I'd try to accept the return because customer satisfaction is very important to me, both as a buyer and a seller in general; however, I understand you have less flexibility as you need the money.
posted by smorgasbord at 2:25 PM on September 2, 2015


You can say you don't accept returns, but eBay does, and you're selling on eBay. So you do in fact accept returns. If there is a dispute, eBay tends to heavily favor the buyer. Your odds of the sale being final are not good.

Worst outcome if you refuse the return: The buyer opens a dispute, eBay refunds their money, they don't send you the jacket back, *and* leave you a negative review.

I've been on eBay for 16 years, buying and selling, and the one certainty is that eventually someone is going to rip you off royally and eBay won't do a thing about it. Prepare yourself for that outcome, and don't beat yourself up over it.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 2:27 PM on September 2, 2015 [16 favorites]


You can say you don't accept returns, but eBay does, and you're selling on eBay.

eBay does not require sellers to accept returns; it only requires sellers to have a return policy. That return policy can be "no returns accepted" (except for errors in the listing description, for which the seller must always accept returns).
posted by saeculorum at 2:29 PM on September 2, 2015 [9 favorites]


My guess is that eBay is likely to make you take the jacket back in a dispute. Did she remove the tags or wash or damage the jacket? If not, make her pay for return shipping, since the return is her choice, refund her original purchase through eBay and resell the jacket. You've lost little in this scenario, except that it's a hassle.
posted by cnc at 2:30 PM on September 2, 2015 [4 favorites]


I am just a person who occasionally sells things on ebay for cash if I don't need them, and my eBay reputation is important for this purpose.

(I need that $100.)


Which of these is more important? It sounds like it will be difficult to keep both. I think the furthest I'd push it is to ask the seller to cover both the original and return shipping, and maybe the FVF because you won't get that back unless you issue a full refund. If you value your feedback rating then even that is pushing your luck.
posted by jon1270 at 2:31 PM on September 2, 2015 [3 favorites]


You need the $100, but can you wait a few weeks to get it? A high end jacket NWT is likely to sell again for roughly the same price, and you'll protect your rating. I agree with all replies above that eBay tends to strongly favor the buyer in disputes. I would probably allow the return and then block this buyer.
posted by telegraph at 2:41 PM on September 2, 2015 [8 favorites]


eBay does not require sellers to accept returns;

I'm talking more about what eBay does, not what eBay says. When a buyer demands a refund for any number of crazy reasons, eBay will almost always give them one. With the seller's money. From the page you linked to:

"Important: Even if you specify "no returns accepted," under the eBay Money Back Guarantee the buyer can still return an item if it doesn't match the listing description. Learn more about what the eBay Money Back Guarantee means to sellers."

This is the loophole. It is a big one.

As for advice, the best long-term strategy is probably as telegraph says. Allow a refund (but do not refund the money until you have the jacket back and have established it is still in the same condition you sold it in). eBay will probably refund the listing/final value fees if you process the refund according to their rules, and you can relist it and hope the next buyer is more certain about what they want.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 2:50 PM on September 2, 2015 [5 favorites]


I sold several things on ebay earlier this year and none of the buyers left positive feedback, even when I sent them a message to confirm that the item had arrived and that they were satisfied. They all replied that the item had arrived and they were very happy, would totally leave feedback soon... and then never did. So I wouldn't risk getting negative feedback because of this, since it could really skew your rating. If you're in the northern hemisphere, you shouldn't have any problems selling the jacket again. You might even be able to put the price up slightly once the weather starts getting really cold.
posted by kinddieserzeit at 2:54 PM on September 2, 2015


Ebay does allow a seller to refuse returns IF they selected that option when filling out the listing form. That info then appears near the top of the listing below the price and the "buy it now" or "place a bid" button. There's a list with shipping, delivery,forms of payment, and then 'returns.'

Some sellers choose the ebay option of accepting returns, but then mention limitations in the item description. Maybe they say that returns are okay only if the item received isn't as it was described. Those limitations aren't allowed by ebay.

If your listing does officially prohibit returns, then you don't need to take the item back. Write to the buyer and say you're very sorry they're disappointed. Point out that the listing says that returns aren't accepted, and that the sale is final. You could say that if they want to sell the item themselves, it's okay to copy the photos you used.

If they report you, nothing will come of it. The worst that can happen is that the buyer might give you negative feedback, which will linger in your feedback history forever. You're allowed to respond, and your response will also stay in the feedback history.

Take a look here at some info from eBay's Help department. You might want to quote or link to it in your email to the buyer, or refer them to the page. "If you've just changed your mind or made a mistake, you can still request a return, but please be aware that the seller isn't obliged to accept your return."

In the future, it would be a good idea to include the measurements of the actual garment.
posted by wryly at 3:01 PM on September 2, 2015


Longtime ebay seller, as long as your listing says no returns and she's said that she wants to rerun because it doesn't fit her via ebay messages I wouldn't take the return. I would send a really friendly polite message saying that unfortunately you don't accept returns but she can resell the jacket herself and offering to let her use your pictures and resell.

If she leaves bad feedback I would contact ebay and ask them tn remove it. I've had good success with that in analogous situations
posted by arnicae at 3:17 PM on September 2, 2015 [5 favorites]


I do not accept returns on eBay and I would not do so in this case. I disagree with the conclusion that because eBay tends to err in favor of the buyer in disputes, you de facto accept returns, and should simply allow returns for whoever asks. That advice, which I'm seeing more and more lately, only encourages buyers to demand returns for any reason at all and further erodes sellers' ability to dictate their own policies.

In this case, you have emails from the buyer saying that the return reason is that the coat doesn't fit, so you have some evidence to counter a not-as-described case.

My usual response for buyer's remorse return requests is, "I'm afraid I do not accept returns, but you are welcome to use my photos to resell the item yourself." It's a little less harsh than just saying "I don't accept returns. Have a great day" or whatever, and it looks a little bit like you are trying to help solve the buyer's problem, except you don't really have to do anything.
posted by mama casserole at 3:19 PM on September 2, 2015 [3 favorites]


Something to watch out for: Did this person pay by PayPal?
If so, they could file a grievance or whatever it's called and get their money back that way.
I've heard horror stories about PayPal yanking money out of checking accounts with no notice and really leaving sellers high and dry.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 3:41 PM on September 2, 2015


There's also the possibility of the ‘attempt return then claim counterfeit’ scam. That would mean you'd be left without the money and the garment.
posted by scruss at 4:45 PM on September 2, 2015


The "Hey, I'm really sorry this didn't work out well on your end! :( Like my listing says, I'm not set up to handle returns, unfortunately. But you're welcome to use the photographs from my listing to re-sell it yourself! This would probably work out better, too, as that would mean you wouldn't have to deal with the cost of sending it back. Let me know if there's anything else I can do; I might have some other photos... Best, Yourname" approach has worked very well for me for years with buyers I expect are reasonably sane.

There is another kind of buyer who is not reasonable, and who will lie and open a INAD case and generally try to screw you, and whether or not eBay might be arsed to help out is totally up in the air; they are not customer-service-oriented and do not care. As a long-term seller I have learned to just eat it with jerk buyers; eBay does not have your back.

So I would probably try the polite note, vaguely hinting at "yeah, and, anyway, the return shipping would be on you" to try to further shut it down -- lots of eBay buyers do not get that you might be just one person just like them; they think you are either, I don't know, a brick and mortar store with an on-line department, or they bought it "from eBay," and they really have no idea it's one person with a storage box in their living room, and sometimes a personal "OMG, a return? What's that?" sort of message is enough to clue them in -- and then if I got the smallest, slightest pushback, I would take the return.

If it was a nice brand name NWT coat you sold in August I bet you could get $100, cash, no eBay or PayPal fees, from a local FB for-sale group or CL, in the first cold snap of the season...
posted by kmennie at 4:56 PM on September 2, 2015 [4 favorites]


Yes, you should accept the return. When you sell on eBay, you are running a business, and this unfortunate circumstance falls under something you should do to convey that you give good "customer service."

No one here can accurately predict what this person will do if you respond with a polite, but firm, "I'm sorry, but the listing states that I don't accept returns." However, people are loss-averse. This person has a jacket that he or she doesn't want, and you have this person's money. Whether this person is right or wrong about it, your refusal to accommodate the request is probably going to make this person feel wronged, and nothing good can come from that.

If you want to see how this person responds to a firm "no," you might try this approach: "I'm very sorry, but the listing states that I don't accept returns. How would you like to resolve this?" The response should give you an indication of how strongly this person feels about the issue.
posted by Mr. Fig at 9:44 AM on September 3, 2015 [1 favorite]


To me it depends whether you listed the actual dimensions/measurements of the garment, or just the labelled size.

Women's clothing is all over the place and I think she could make a legitimate case that if she wears, say, size M in brands A,B,C,D,E and your jacket was an M and was too small, that it wasn't accurately described. On the other hand if you listed actual measurements then it's on her.
posted by Salamandrous at 11:01 AM on September 3, 2015


Generally, I'd agree with the sentiment that sales are final, etc., but in this specific situation, I agree with Salamandrous. If the actual dimensons/measurements of the garment was posted, I would I would do a soft "no" first (encourage the buyer to just re-sell the dress, explain how expensive S/H fees are, etc.), see how that goes; if the buyer persists, I may just give in to make it go away. If only the labelled size was posted, I'd take this as a lesson and just do the return, keeping in mind next time to outline clearer sizes and a more specific return policy rather than a blanket return policy. That's what I would personally do.
posted by dubious_dude at 12:57 PM on September 3, 2015


Longtime ebayer, usually more of a buyer than a sell, but I have sold lately...

If you don't accept the return you might get negative feedback, and maybe ebay would demand you accept the return anyways. If you don't accept the return and get negative feedback, just reply with "Customer requested refund despite a strict "No Returns" policy." Try to be as friendly and straight forward in the reply.

I'll buy from people with one or two negative feedback if the have a decent explanation for how they dealt with an unhappy customer.
posted by drezdn at 8:51 AM on September 4, 2015


I have sold on eBay but not recently. My experience was that most buyers were nice and reasonable, but that a few would leave negative feedback for ridiculous reasons. I would not cotton to these people and I suggest you don't either. If your listing (not just your profile) stated your return policy and the size of the dress (labeled size is fine, if she needed more info she could have asked) you should stick by your policy.

Although I agree that eBay favors buyers, I did go through the process successfully of getting one buyer's negative feedback removed. It was annoying to have to do, but better than caving in to her insane demands (she had bought some things previously from me and I'd thrown in a freebie to thank her for the combined order, so she expected me to do the same on another order months later when I didn't even have anything extra to include).

I feel like giving in to unreasonable buyer demands just ensures that it will keep happening because they are rewarded for it. Politely but firmly stand by your policy!
posted by mysterious_stranger at 6:09 PM on September 4, 2015


Response by poster: I know you were all wondering what happened. Brace yourselves: I accepted the return and issued a refund, and sent a note, indicating that while I don't normally accept returns, she had paid promptly and been a good customer, so I'd bend my rules. I'm not delighted, and now i have this damn jacket still, but I've relisted it on EBay and there seems to be some interest. I decided it was more important to me to have good feedback, and I wasn't interested in spending the time to deal with a potential clusterfuck.
posted by chesty_a_arthur at 12:54 PM on October 3, 2015 [5 favorites]


« Older A Long Time Ago in a Podcast Far, Far, Away...   |   Find my husband a new (old) murder mystery to love... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.