What do I not understand about (actual, literal) windows?

August 18, 2015 5:22 PM

I need to replace a window in my house, and I want a window that opens from the top in some manner. Why is this so completely baffling to all of the window professionals that I deal with? Is this really not possible?

In my house I've got a window that's flush with a window seat. On the second floor. Hence, a hideous hazard. Someone could fall out of that window quite easily. And I have a kid, and generally a house full of kids, so it's just incredibly dangerous. So, the window is never open. Never, ever, ever. I've lived in my house 20+ years and it's been open, like, once, before I closed it in horror.

But the location of this window is a great spot for air circulation. I'm always dying to open it. Now the frame got done in by the termites so it's time to replace it. Yippee! We'll get a window that opens from the top. Except...no? This has literally gotten to the stage of me dealing with people who build entirely custom windows and everyone is looking at me like I've just said the most baffling thing ever. I remember transom windows from the olden days when I was in school. I had imagined just a "regular" window, except instead of pulling up from the bottom you pull down from the top. Do these really not exist? The best someone's been able to offer me is a casement window with a block so it only opens a few inches. But seriously, that is not. What. I. Want.

I feel like I am trapped in the window twilight zone. Help?

posted by BlahLaLa to Home & Garden (27 answers total)

I think the magic words you want are "bottom hung window".

This page may also be helpful. (No idea if the vendor is good; I'm only suggesting this as a place to look for definitions of terms.)
posted by sourcequench at 5:27 PM on August 18, 2015

Best answer: Are you thinking of something like a hopper window?
posted by turbid dahlia at 5:28 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]

I think it's just a regular window. You just have to make sure that the top storm window isn't affixed permanently. I used to open my upstairs regular windows from the top, then draw the curtains over the lower half, for privacy, and could still get a breeze through. I can't do that where I live now because the top storm window doesn't budge.
posted by bentley at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2015

I would have thought you'd want a double hung window where you only operate the top portion.
posted by vunder at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2015 [13 favorites]

The graphic on this page supports the Hopper window perspective and may be worth pointing people to when you talk to them (as it has pictures!)

http://www.allianz.com.au/home-insurance/news/securing-exterior-doors-and-windows
posted by Brockles at 5:32 PM on August 18, 2015

I have double hung windows; they open from the top or the bottom. I imagine there's some way to permanently disable the bottom part—you could even nail it shut. Or install a window guard.

On preview: seconding vunder.
posted by (Over) Thinking at 5:32 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]

Response by poster: I really like that hopper window turbid dahlia pointed to. So let me ask another question: if I say to the guy "I want a solid window that does not open -- just a pane of glass -- topped by a hopper window that opens" do you think he'll have any idea what I'm talking about? I mean, I know you don't know that, but is that a thing? A solid, unopenable pane topped by a hopper window?
posted by BlahLaLa at 5:36 PM on August 18, 2015

You want a double-hung window. Like this. You leave the bottom at the bottom and slide the top paert up and down.
posted by GuyZero at 5:42 PM on August 18, 2015

Sure, that would be just what it sounds like: two separate windows installed together in the same opening. But keep in mind that hopper windows are only appropriate under a big roof overhang, lest they funnel rain into your house.
posted by jon1270 at 5:42 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]

Search for "tilt turn windows". They are common in Europe but you can get them elsewhere too. Worst case scenario from an importer. They open either sideways or, if you turn the handle differently, they tilt inwards at the top. You can definitely put a pane of unopenable glass at the bottom and the window above.
posted by lollusc at 6:05 PM on August 18, 2015 [4 favorites]

I redid a house with tilt-turn windows. They're a little more expensive, but they are pretty close to what you want.
posted by bonehead at 6:10 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]

Where I come from, sash windows are a very common thing. I think that's a term that isn't used where you live, but it might help?

As a child, the bottom half of the sash window in my bedroom was NEVER EVER opened, we only slid the top half down. It wasn't until I was in my twenties that I saw that window with the bottom part slid up, and it took me a little while to get used to how wrong it seemed (even though other sash windows in the house were quite happily opened in whichever way seemed most convenient).

(on actually reading the link I posted, it seems that, as other people have said, the name you are looking for in your country is a double hung window. good luck with finding one!) (and it would be easy enough to stick a couple of screws in to jam the bottom bit shut if you are concerned about safety while there are little kids around).
posted by Lebannen at 6:43 PM on August 18, 2015

My 10-year-old house has double-hung windows. I doubt that they've stopped making them in that interval. Unless there's something odd about the wall you want the window in, you should be able to get a contractor to buy one at the local big box store and frame it in.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 7:07 PM on August 18, 2015

The sort of window you want is called an Awning Window.
The glass is hinged at the top and opens outward. I put one in my bathroom, and it's great.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:16 PM on August 18, 2015

I too leapt to the idea of screwing shut the bottom half of a double-hung window.
posted by salvia at 7:50 PM on August 18, 2015

We have double hung windows that have stoppers so that our toddlers windows will only open from the top down lest she try to climb in and out. We just bought these windows about 3 months ago and they're just standard double hung windows.
posted by julie_of_the_jungle at 8:18 PM on August 18, 2015

I think you should install a (nonopenable) picture window and install an awning style window above it as a transom.

Here are a bunch of transom examples, the first picture is a window seat with an openable sash with a transom above. Make that a picture window and you are set. Also note the picture of the open transom over french doors. Very pretty!
Transom examples
posted by littlewater at 9:21 PM on August 18, 2015

I am sometimes surprised that a steel grill outside the windows is not so common in the US. In many parts of the world, including the UK and Canada, having an ornamental, yet functional grill provides some additional security as well as safety for the residents.

I could not find a similar link, but here is what I am talking about - http://www.safeguardsecurity.co.uk/window-grilles

Not sure if there is a different name for it here - maybe you could ask the contractor.
posted by theobserver at 10:02 PM on August 18, 2015

Tilt and turn is really going to be best for this application as they are generally designed to only open a certain amount in the tilt position (the one you are interested in).

That said, if you are doing a fixed glazing with an operable window above, why does it matter which way the top portion opens? Presumably the fixed section would be enough of a barrier.
posted by ssg at 10:06 PM on August 18, 2015

Friends had Kolbe windows installed. They had safety grid screens, breakin proof. The windows unlatched and opened inward, both sides, tall rectangles. Or else they opened at a slant in one piece with the top out at about 6 inches, and the lower edge in by that much. He mentioned his friend was locked out of his house in a foreign city, and there was no getting in these windows.
posted by Oyéah at 10:07 PM on August 18, 2015

The man who built my parents' house put the lower windows in upside-down *on purpose*. He didn't want to be responsible for a child falling out. So he put them in upside-down, which mean you had to reach way up to open them.
posted by Chaussette and the Pussy Cats at 12:34 AM on August 19, 2015

Response by poster: Okay, thanks everybody. You've given me a bunch of ideas and pictures to use when I'm talking to the window guy, hopefully this week. Much appreciated!
posted by BlahLaLa at 6:07 AM on August 19, 2015

Some terminology that may help you:
An awning window is hinged at the top. It can be joined to a standard window.

The bottom window can be a fixed glass if you do not ever want it to open.

Double hung window means that both the top and bottom panes move.

Single hung window means that only the bottom pane moves.

Chaussette's window as described above, hung "upside down" so only the top pane moves. Not the best idea, since the window sill (bottom) is usually sloped to shed rain, plus windows are often fabricated with internal water channels that drain at the bottom (sill). Installing upside down defeats the entire premise of shedding water via that system. I guess if one is living in a dry climate, it would be a good solution.
posted by mightshould at 6:23 AM on August 19, 2015 [1 favorite]

A double-hung window with the bottom pane secured with a safety latch is probably the easiest, cheapest way to accomplish this. You could also install a fixed (or picture) window on the lower portion with an operable window of some sort above it, but keep in mind this could end up costing significantly more because you'll have to pay for two separate windows plus some kind of carpentry to frame them. We recently got all new windows and ended up replacing two side-by-side double hung windows with one large sliding window, because it was half the price (about $600 less) even though the one window was twice as large as each of the double hungs would have been.
posted by Jemstar at 7:29 AM on August 19, 2015

I think what probably needs to happen is if the window guy can't figure out what you mean when you say "a window that opens in from the top" while probably making some kind of arc-describing gesture with your arm, you need to find a new window guy.
posted by turbid dahlia at 1:00 PM on August 19, 2015 [1 favorite]

Response by poster: (Just wanted to add -- most of the communication with the window guys was over the phone, so I'm thinking that must have been the issue.)
posted by BlahLaLa at 2:09 PM on August 19, 2015

Response by poster: Hard to believe that a month later this project isn't even close to being done, but here's what I've learned: Like you all suggested, I wasn't crazy to want such a window, and they do exist in various options. Turns out the window guy I was dealing with was a super flake and a total idiot. So he's gone. Hooked up with another window person, went to her office and saw samples, and now we have two options: a double-hung window that is installed with the bottom portion basically nailed into the frame so it will never open unless a carpenter gets in there and redoes it. Or a solid pane of glass topped by a hopper window. Both are stupidly expensive, and require still more money to be installed. Why are windows so expensive? Guess that is another question so I will mark this resolved.
posted by BlahLaLa at 10:41 AM on September 22, 2015