Help me be a nice mom
July 25, 2015 11:52 PM Subscribe
How can I interact more with my kid at times when I'm super annoyed by her?
This question is so... weird sounding... I felt like I had to make in anon. Plus I don't want her to find it. But basically, I have an awesome 12 year old precocious, bright kid. She's an only child and has a hard time making friends and doesn't really text or call or hang out with peers. She has some spectrumy/ADHD type traits - so you get a sense of her. Trust me, we are working on this stuff, really hard, but it's a long game.
She gets bored and just talks at me in a way that, if I'm tired or grumpy, drives me straight up the wall. She describes episodes of TV shows in endless details. She asks really boring hypothetical questions, and then persevorates on parsing the answers. Again, I do coach her about this, but every interaction can't be a lesson and I want to think about how to sometimes give her that sense of connection without driving me up the wall.
Soo, one thing we just came up with tonight is, I asked her to read me questions from her trivia book, and then I could guess the answer. She loved getting to interact, I was interested enough to keep the interaction going, no one got annoyed or mean or their feelings hurt. We also play a lot of board games together and sometimes read out loud, so these are activities that again, allow interaction.
What other things can we do, similar to the trivia book, where we can interact and I don't have to listen to a really tedious, 10 minute replay of a comic she read or something.
This question is so... weird sounding... I felt like I had to make in anon. Plus I don't want her to find it. But basically, I have an awesome 12 year old precocious, bright kid. She's an only child and has a hard time making friends and doesn't really text or call or hang out with peers. She has some spectrumy/ADHD type traits - so you get a sense of her. Trust me, we are working on this stuff, really hard, but it's a long game.
She gets bored and just talks at me in a way that, if I'm tired or grumpy, drives me straight up the wall. She describes episodes of TV shows in endless details. She asks really boring hypothetical questions, and then persevorates on parsing the answers. Again, I do coach her about this, but every interaction can't be a lesson and I want to think about how to sometimes give her that sense of connection without driving me up the wall.
Soo, one thing we just came up with tonight is, I asked her to read me questions from her trivia book, and then I could guess the answer. She loved getting to interact, I was interested enough to keep the interaction going, no one got annoyed or mean or their feelings hurt. We also play a lot of board games together and sometimes read out loud, so these are activities that again, allow interaction.
What other things can we do, similar to the trivia book, where we can interact and I don't have to listen to a really tedious, 10 minute replay of a comic she read or something.
Oh man, Jamaro's advice jogged a memory: one thing one of my teachers did with me and students like me who kind of just never shut up was have a shared journal that she and I could write letters. It was like having a pen pal but I saw her every day and the super bonus was that she would correct my writing so I became Super Skilled at writing letters at age 11 thanks to her. Maybe when you're too tired to talk, she could write to you and you could spend some time writing back to her and reading her writing (which would be great for any precocious 12 year old IMO.)
posted by Hermione Granger at 12:17 AM on July 26, 2015 [35 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 12:17 AM on July 26, 2015 [35 favorites]
I'd just like to suggest trying really hard to make your reactions fall on the side of "I'm having a hard time relating to this for [generational, whatever] reasons," not "your interests are objectively boring and tedious." Honestly, the more effort you can make to find out about what it is she's into and why she's into it, the more common ground you'll find. For example, I cannot abide the shrieking YouTubers my daughter finds endlessly fascinating, but sometimes they clue her into pop cultural artifacts we can discuss together.
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:20 AM on July 26, 2015 [10 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:20 AM on July 26, 2015 [10 favorites]
I recommend How to Talk So Kids Will Listen and the other books in the series. Great stuff!! Here's a list of ways to communicate more effectively as a parent; I'm sure you're already doing a lot of the suggestions but a refresher is always helpful.
posted by smorgasbord at 12:21 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by smorgasbord at 12:21 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
She's plenty old enough, if she's as intelligent as you say, AND if you have a positive relationship with her where you actually communicate well, for you to have a discussion with her about "sometimes, when you're really excited by something, you go kind of overboard and tell people way more than they were interested in hearing."
Teach her also that there are tricks for noticing when someone has heard enough. She doesn't catch the cues and body language naturally, but I guarantee you, she can be taught to notice them most of the time. While you're talking about this, come up with a way you can give her a hint that she's doing this - something that ALWAYS means this and only this exact thing. To start with, though, it might have to be as obvious a trigger as "Hey Chris... you know that thing we talked about?" to which my son would reply "Oh yeah!" and then tell the person he'd been overwhelming that "TOPIC is something I'm very interested/excited/whatever in, and you've probably heard enough for today. Thanks for letting me share!" and then allow them to extricate themselves.
Getting him to deliberately seek body language has made a HUGE improvement in this.
On the flip side, make sure that when you're listening, you're really actively listening so that her need to be heard gets fulfilled. Don't turn out. Use gentle interruptions to ask questions, and steer the conversation. The more she practices mutual conversation, the better she'll get at it. If need be, tell her you need a break from TOPIC right now, and change TOPIC to something else.
He's also been asked, on occasion, to think about how much his listener is interested in TOPIC. Once he's thought that through, he often realizes that he's overwhelmed someone... it's given him another tool in the toolbox, because sometimes it occurs to him to consider interest level first, not in hindsight.
And yes, these might sound rude... but I know exactly what OP is talking about, I have a 15 yo one at home. And he thanked me for explaining it to him, because he knows he had a hard time telling when people had heard enough. He couldn't parse the body language naturally, but he could do it in a methodical, almost scientific manner.
posted by stormyteal at 12:28 AM on July 26, 2015 [28 favorites]
Teach her also that there are tricks for noticing when someone has heard enough. She doesn't catch the cues and body language naturally, but I guarantee you, she can be taught to notice them most of the time. While you're talking about this, come up with a way you can give her a hint that she's doing this - something that ALWAYS means this and only this exact thing. To start with, though, it might have to be as obvious a trigger as "Hey Chris... you know that thing we talked about?" to which my son would reply "Oh yeah!" and then tell the person he'd been overwhelming that "TOPIC is something I'm very interested/excited/whatever in, and you've probably heard enough for today. Thanks for letting me share!" and then allow them to extricate themselves.
Getting him to deliberately seek body language has made a HUGE improvement in this.
On the flip side, make sure that when you're listening, you're really actively listening so that her need to be heard gets fulfilled. Don't turn out. Use gentle interruptions to ask questions, and steer the conversation. The more she practices mutual conversation, the better she'll get at it. If need be, tell her you need a break from TOPIC right now, and change TOPIC to something else.
He's also been asked, on occasion, to think about how much his listener is interested in TOPIC. Once he's thought that through, he often realizes that he's overwhelmed someone... it's given him another tool in the toolbox, because sometimes it occurs to him to consider interest level first, not in hindsight.
And yes, these might sound rude... but I know exactly what OP is talking about, I have a 15 yo one at home. And he thanked me for explaining it to him, because he knows he had a hard time telling when people had heard enough. He couldn't parse the body language naturally, but he could do it in a methodical, almost scientific manner.
posted by stormyteal at 12:28 AM on July 26, 2015 [28 favorites]
She sounds curious, and she doesn't have many people to share that curiosity with, so she chose you.
Since she's asking a lot of hypothetical questions, maybe you can direct her to some interesting philosophical books. Maybe something on logic or Buddhism. You also might encourage her to write essays or give debates (both sides) about what she reads and learn to "sum up" ideas. This will be useful for education as well as social interaction.
posted by Ms. Moonlight at 12:48 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Since she's asking a lot of hypothetical questions, maybe you can direct her to some interesting philosophical books. Maybe something on logic or Buddhism. You also might encourage her to write essays or give debates (both sides) about what she reads and learn to "sum up" ideas. This will be useful for education as well as social interaction.
posted by Ms. Moonlight at 12:48 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
All good ideas above though mine hates writing so we fight about that. Shared editing on digital media.
We ended up steering conversations like the above posters. And we do give ourselves quiet time while making time to share time too.
posted by tilde at 1:43 AM on July 26, 2015
We ended up steering conversations like the above posters. And we do give ourselves quiet time while making time to share time too.
posted by tilde at 1:43 AM on July 26, 2015
What about something like taking turns answering questions from the Book of Questions? (There's probably one for kids without some of the sex and career related questions.)
posted by salvia at 2:02 AM on July 26, 2015
posted by salvia at 2:02 AM on July 26, 2015
This might strike you as a little old fashioned, but one of my most favorite things to do with my most beloved friends is to read out loud to each other. When I'm doing the reading, I get the selfish pleasure of listening to the sound of my own voice and the fun of inflection and pacing and it's good for things like diction and learning to pronounce words I might have never heard out loud before (this is a trait of voracious readers that can sometimes cause moments of shame at important times so it's solid practice to have pronounced a word incorrectly and be gently corrected by a loved one). When my friend is reading I have the pleasure of listening to their voice and thinking about why they wanted to read whatever they did to me and I can practice stuff like active listening and it's extremely relaxing. Either direction it's flattering and low-stress while being a sort of bonding activity. Do you have any special interests of your own? Your kid might be really flattered if you asked her to read to you about something you're into, even if she's not immediately enamored, like fascinating histories or science subsets. Or if you wanted to keep apprised on the YA lit she's probably neck-deep into, she could read her favorite one to you.
posted by Mizu at 3:01 AM on July 26, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by Mizu at 3:01 AM on July 26, 2015 [5 favorites]
Physical games you can play one-on-one versions of: racquetball, soccer, basketball, tennis, etc.
If she loves taking hypothetical questions too seriously, she might enjoy XKCD's What If? book, and you could do something similar to the trivia game--each make a prediction, and then read together.
Similarly, a variant on reading aloud would be to alternate chapters of a book--when it's your turn you read the chapter ahead of time, then retell it your own way from memory. Maybe a more deliberate form of "let me tell you this story I read/saw" would be more palatable.
Situation puzzles can be fun but are pretty non-demanding if you're the one who knows the answer, so they might be a good go-to activity when you're walking/driving somewhere together and getting a little tired of the media replays.
posted by cogitron at 4:42 AM on July 26, 2015
If she loves taking hypothetical questions too seriously, she might enjoy XKCD's What If? book, and you could do something similar to the trivia game--each make a prediction, and then read together.
Similarly, a variant on reading aloud would be to alternate chapters of a book--when it's your turn you read the chapter ahead of time, then retell it your own way from memory. Maybe a more deliberate form of "let me tell you this story I read/saw" would be more palatable.
Situation puzzles can be fun but are pretty non-demanding if you're the one who knows the answer, so they might be a good go-to activity when you're walking/driving somewhere together and getting a little tired of the media replays.
posted by cogitron at 4:42 AM on July 26, 2015
Oh, I so hear you; play-by-plays of my 15-year-old's most recent computer game, paeans to yet-to-be-released graphics cards, and repetitive arguments about politics are huge parts of my life. In addition to the great ideas you've had yourself, I've had some success with:
Turning the conversation to something I find more interesting
Distraction; having a snack together or watching a video together or playing a strategy game
If I'm REALLY done, admitting that I'm just too tired to talk right now; since he also highly values alone time, he gets it even though it can be disappointing
He gets out some of his human interaction needs by talking to people who actually care about the topics he does on the internet
I have a few adult friends who are tolerant of this kind of thing and he and I both appreciate it when they come over and we all hang out for a while. (I'll eventually rescue my friend and we'll go for a walk, which my son doesn't enjoy so he voluntarily declines to join us.)
I can sometimes get away with only half listening; being able to think about my own stuff makes it less painful
Doing chores (making lunches, cleaning kitchen, etc.) while he's talking makes it feel less like he's stealing my personal relaxation time; ideally he'll get it out of his system while I'm working so I still get time to myself
posted by metasarah at 4:45 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Turning the conversation to something I find more interesting
Distraction; having a snack together or watching a video together or playing a strategy game
If I'm REALLY done, admitting that I'm just too tired to talk right now; since he also highly values alone time, he gets it even though it can be disappointing
He gets out some of his human interaction needs by talking to people who actually care about the topics he does on the internet
I have a few adult friends who are tolerant of this kind of thing and he and I both appreciate it when they come over and we all hang out for a while. (I'll eventually rescue my friend and we'll go for a walk, which my son doesn't enjoy so he voluntarily declines to join us.)
I can sometimes get away with only half listening; being able to think about my own stuff makes it less painful
Doing chores (making lunches, cleaning kitchen, etc.) while he's talking makes it feel less like he's stealing my personal relaxation time; ideally he'll get it out of his system while I'm working so I still get time to myself
posted by metasarah at 4:45 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Silliness can be another way to short circuit blow-by-blow accounts of a comic or TV show - "Is this the episode where her eyebrows turn to stone fruit? Are you sure there wasn't a talking bucket of coal? Tell me when get to _that_ episode." It can be easier to move on to something else when you offer them a part in another fun, silly conversation rather than saying that this one's boring.
posted by hawthorne at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2015
posted by hawthorne at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2015
It sounds like we have similar daughters, and I'll agree completely with what stormyteal said above. It will help her to relate to others better about more peer-appropriate topics, which will give you the break you need - and I see you do coach her, but maybe introduce some games where she has to read your body language? When I was working from home, I used to wear pink headphones (with nothing playing) as a visual clue to my kid that I needed space and for her to be careful about interrupting my thoughts. I also do things like cross my arms when it's time to wind up the conversation.
This is what we do together:
* We cook and bake together.
* We go out for meals, and do either comic jams or the Keri Smith books or exercises from Lynda Barry's Syllabus.
* We go on long drives and listen to audio books for a chapter or two in one direction (Neil Gaiman's a favourite) then turn around and discuss them on the way home.
* We watch a show together (Currently it's Once Upon a Time) and then yes, I get silly about it - "Not it's time for Hook to clench his jaw and look pensive about Emma's independence!"- and then she likes to go on Pinterest and pin things to a board about it, and as I get a few minutes throught the day at work, I might look up a meme or an article about the show and send it to her to read.
* We seek out and squee over funny and cute animal pics and videos, and when we find a particularly funny one, often adopt something from it as a way to either break the ice, break the tension, end a conversation/argument or begin an interaction. (This one is currently a favourite. Poom!)
* In the car we do Brain Quest books too.
*She has started working as a "Mother's Helper" for neighbourhood kids, until she's old enough to babysit. She gets to talk to other adults, but she also gets to interact with kids who think she's great, and I like to hear about her day and their activities.
*Soon there'll be dog-walking in our lives, and I can imagine that will take up a lot of energy and we'll have a mutually enjoyable topic, and then she can go and chat the puppy's ears off all she wants too.
posted by peagood at 6:04 AM on July 26, 2015 [8 favorites]
This is what we do together:
* We cook and bake together.
* We go out for meals, and do either comic jams or the Keri Smith books or exercises from Lynda Barry's Syllabus.
* We go on long drives and listen to audio books for a chapter or two in one direction (Neil Gaiman's a favourite) then turn around and discuss them on the way home.
* We watch a show together (Currently it's Once Upon a Time) and then yes, I get silly about it - "Not it's time for Hook to clench his jaw and look pensive about Emma's independence!"- and then she likes to go on Pinterest and pin things to a board about it, and as I get a few minutes throught the day at work, I might look up a meme or an article about the show and send it to her to read.
* We seek out and squee over funny and cute animal pics and videos, and when we find a particularly funny one, often adopt something from it as a way to either break the ice, break the tension, end a conversation/argument or begin an interaction. (This one is currently a favourite. Poom!)
* In the car we do Brain Quest books too.
*She has started working as a "Mother's Helper" for neighbourhood kids, until she's old enough to babysit. She gets to talk to other adults, but she also gets to interact with kids who think she's great, and I like to hear about her day and their activities.
*Soon there'll be dog-walking in our lives, and I can imagine that will take up a lot of energy and we'll have a mutually enjoyable topic, and then she can go and chat the puppy's ears off all she wants too.
posted by peagood at 6:04 AM on July 26, 2015 [8 favorites]
That's my 13 year old! I sometimes get overstimulated, and absolutely cannot listen to her without getting panicky. I've explained that to her, which means she doesn't take it personally when I tell her I need her to stop talking. We've also had the conversation about going overboard with details and created a hand signal for when she starts doing it.
What has worked for her is writing fan fiction and monitored social media so she could find her tribe of other people who want to discuss too in excruciating detail.
posted by Ruki at 6:18 AM on July 26, 2015 [3 favorites]
What has worked for her is writing fan fiction and monitored social media so she could find her tribe of other people who want to discuss too in excruciating detail.
posted by Ruki at 6:18 AM on July 26, 2015 [3 favorites]
Me and my bf play a lot of 20 questions on long car rides, but difficult 20 questions (and no question limit, and we tend to give slightly more detailed answers than yes or no).
So rather than an animal or a vegetable or something, we open it up to anything, concrete or abstract. Yesterday we did "totem" and "dormer" for instance.
posted by geegollygosh at 6:49 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
So rather than an animal or a vegetable or something, we open it up to anything, concrete or abstract. Yesterday we did "totem" and "dormer" for instance.
posted by geegollygosh at 6:49 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Do something together while talking. Go for a walk, cook dinner, bake a cake, get her to help with jobs around the house, gardening etc. The trick is both of you have to be doing the thing as it will help encourage a more natural conversation flow. It will also give you something distracting to do while she's talking, that doesn't leave you trapped, say cooking while she sits and talks at you.
posted by wwax at 7:13 AM on July 26, 2015
posted by wwax at 7:13 AM on July 26, 2015
I was very much like your daughter when I was her age. I'm sure that I was insufferable, but on the inside I was desperately lonely and starved for conversation about the things I was invested in. So this question kind of brought some shit back for me, and I'm going to be very careful in answering it such that I'm not just getting my damage all over you.
I absolutely agree with people above who're suggesting ways you can help her learn some interpersonal skills -- it'll be much better for her if she can figure out how to have REAL conversations with people, particularly people who aren't her family or super-close friends, sooner rather than later.
I just wanted to also add another vote in favor of making an effort, when you can, to genuinely engage with some of her interests, or present your own interests in a way that she might be able to click with. As in, watch that TV show she's obsessed with, and use that as an opportunity to help her learn better give-and-take with conversation instead of just talking AT you. If you have a job or hobby that involves a lot ticky-tak details or procedures that took you some time to learn, maybe talk to her about them in a way that makes her feel cool and insidery and grown-up -- my step-father was a lawyer, and I used to love listening to him describe the technical details of cases he was working on. My dad taught me how to cook when I was about that age, and had me meaningfully help with dinner as well as baking for events.
The thing that was damaging for me was being told, over and over again, that my interests and enthusiasms were boring and no one wanted to hear about them, and I needed to just learn how to talk about things that other people were interested in. As long as you're communicating the need for balance -- that your daughter is cool and interesting and smart, but that she also needs to learn to listen and to be kind and mindful of other people's needs -- I'm sure that you'll both be fine.
Sorry, hope some of this was helpful! Your daughter is extremely lucky to have a parent who's taking this issues so seriously and giving it so much thought.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2015 [20 favorites]
I absolutely agree with people above who're suggesting ways you can help her learn some interpersonal skills -- it'll be much better for her if she can figure out how to have REAL conversations with people, particularly people who aren't her family or super-close friends, sooner rather than later.
I just wanted to also add another vote in favor of making an effort, when you can, to genuinely engage with some of her interests, or present your own interests in a way that she might be able to click with. As in, watch that TV show she's obsessed with, and use that as an opportunity to help her learn better give-and-take with conversation instead of just talking AT you. If you have a job or hobby that involves a lot ticky-tak details or procedures that took you some time to learn, maybe talk to her about them in a way that makes her feel cool and insidery and grown-up -- my step-father was a lawyer, and I used to love listening to him describe the technical details of cases he was working on. My dad taught me how to cook when I was about that age, and had me meaningfully help with dinner as well as baking for events.
The thing that was damaging for me was being told, over and over again, that my interests and enthusiasms were boring and no one wanted to hear about them, and I needed to just learn how to talk about things that other people were interested in. As long as you're communicating the need for balance -- that your daughter is cool and interesting and smart, but that she also needs to learn to listen and to be kind and mindful of other people's needs -- I'm sure that you'll both be fine.
Sorry, hope some of this was helpful! Your daughter is extremely lucky to have a parent who's taking this issues so seriously and giving it so much thought.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2015 [20 favorites]
She needs to learn to respect other people's boundaries, how to amuse herself when she's bored, how to be still. These are skills she needs. Help her develop a list of things to do when bored, like do a puzzle, read a book, learn to juggle, do crafts, etc. When she's bored, send her outside to ride her bike around the block; while she's out, think of something she can do. There's a very good chance that she'll find something to do on her own. Many kids don't get enough exercise, and the pent-up energy makes any boredom worse, so a course - karate, cycling, dance - anything physical - is a good idea. Maybe a music class - music is excellent for brain development, and practicing 30 minutes a day is a great task.
When you're irritable and tired, give yourself some space. Kiddo, I need some time to myself right now. Why don't you play SomeGame, read Somebook, do Somecraft. I'm going to have a cup of tea and read my book. in 1 hour, we can make some brownies. Start that with in 20 minutes and lengthen it.
posted by theora55 at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
When you're irritable and tired, give yourself some space. Kiddo, I need some time to myself right now. Why don't you play SomeGame, read Somebook, do Somecraft. I'm going to have a cup of tea and read my book. in 1 hour, we can make some brownies. Start that with in 20 minutes and lengthen it.
posted by theora55 at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
You're probably already thinking about this, but your daughter could really use a nerdy friend, or friends.
I wish I knew a great answer for this (tell me if you find one!). You might hit up the comic book stores and see if there are any gaming or roleplaying groups with kids her age. Ideally, ones meeting there at the store at a regular time. Maybe she can stay up late one night a week playing Carcassone while you sit in the corner with a book.
Magic the Gathering, if your daughter gets turned on to that, has lot of regular, structured events. It can be a little pricey if you try to keep current and competitive, though.
Our daughter has had to resign herself to mostly hanging out with boys. I am sure there are girls out there that she could connect with, and I know she'd really like to find a nerdy girlfriend, but it hasn't happened yet. (Again, if you find something clever here, please tell me.) She's 14 and there are hints of romantic interest from boys now, which she is happily oblivious to but we are not. Something to keep in mind if your daughter does hang out with boys.
posted by mattu at 8:48 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
I wish I knew a great answer for this (tell me if you find one!). You might hit up the comic book stores and see if there are any gaming or roleplaying groups with kids her age. Ideally, ones meeting there at the store at a regular time. Maybe she can stay up late one night a week playing Carcassone while you sit in the corner with a book.
Magic the Gathering, if your daughter gets turned on to that, has lot of regular, structured events. It can be a little pricey if you try to keep current and competitive, though.
Our daughter has had to resign herself to mostly hanging out with boys. I am sure there are girls out there that she could connect with, and I know she'd really like to find a nerdy girlfriend, but it hasn't happened yet. (Again, if you find something clever here, please tell me.) She's 14 and there are hints of romantic interest from boys now, which she is happily oblivious to but we are not. Something to keep in mind if your daughter does hang out with boys.
posted by mattu at 8:48 AM on July 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
I was your daughter. I had to learn to do some meta-cognitive work to try and recognize body language and other social clues. My kiddo is a little bit like me and your daughter, but one of my partner's kids sounds a lot like her, and has notable difficulty socializing with stepkiddo's peers. Stepkid has responded really, really well when I've paused in conversation to say, "Hey, can we make eye contact while we talk? That really makes me feel like you're listening to me." Or, "Hey, we've talked a lot about TOPIC, see how my arms are folded? That means I'm reading to change topics now. What should we talk about next?" Or, "Hey, if you were going to ask me a question now about what I think or about myself, what would it be? People really warm up to you when you ask them questions." This has helped stepkiddo a lot.
But. I wonder if part of this is also learning to help your kiddo learn about your socialization preferences? What helped my kid, who socializes a lot more intuitively than me but can still get on a hobbyhorse are two things: 1. I sat my kiddo down once and explained the difference between introverts and extroverts, with the help of the internet. Kiddo recognized immediately that kiddo is more extroverted than I am, and so now when I. just. can't. with. the. talking., kiddo knows not to take it personally. We actually have a secret hand clue for this, but it's really more for me than him - I make half a heart with my fingers, and he finishes the other half with his, and it's a shorthand way for me to remind him that I love him, and in this moment, if things aren't going so great in our social dynamic, it's ok and part of our differing personalities - we still love each other. This works especially well when the socializing gets chaotic when we're navigating our blended families and the kids have to figure out how to socialize with each other and the adults.
2. For myself and in my own head, I set aside some time most days to remind myself to ask my kiddo (or if we're all together, all the kiddos) about their specific interests and to really, actively listen. For me, this is usually between homework and the screen time that happens while I make dinner, a space of about half an hour or so I devote to letting the kiddos hold conversational court, as it were. This means that the kiddos feel heard and have a regular outlet for hobbyhorsical conversation, which actually lessens the interrupting and court-holding at other times. And because it is a bracketed part of my day/schedule, I can really listen and enjoy it - when I'm present and loving in that moment I can also be more comfortable/confident/less prickly and guilty about demurring from hobbyhorsical conversations in the other moments.
If you're feeling tired and besieged, I suspect that this means you might need to do more to bracket kid-centered time and you-centered time. We are a pretty routinized family, with almost daily special things (like taco night, or game night; they're all pretty low impact) that let the kids/kid be the center of attention for a limited amount of time. This also frees us up to have some scheduled time every day where it's adult time. You could make reading from the trivia book a weekly thing, Tuesday Trivia! - and put it on a calendar your kiddo can see and look forward to. You can say to yourself that you'll ask kiddo about TOPIC over breakfast every morning, and feel freer to stop that conversation when it hits you at dinner time when you're tired and harried.
Other interactive things that have worked for our family include: board game night, a Saturday walk with the dogs, a shared tv show night, everyone gets a Sudoku puzzle book and works on their Sudokus together in the family room for an hour, printouts of 20 question like things that we answer together, impromptu talent shows where we can sohelpusgod get through half an hour where one kid shows off beatboxing, another their drum skillz, and a third can cheerlead. The key to all of this, though, is that my partner and I also have a pretty regular cocktail hour together on our porch or in a room separate from where the kids are - and we try religiously to protect that as time for just us. And we also have set times where an adult is working and that should also not be interrupted. We can always remind kiddos that we already did X kid-centered thing and/or X kid-centered thing is coming up.
For what it's worth, this parenting modus operandi not only tries to help our kids learn what we hope will be skills that help them navigate their social worlds a little easier than my partner and I have been able to do, but also responds to our history of loneliness as the children of parents who didn't really (and still don't) do a great job of asking us about our lives/interest/experiences and making us feel heard and validated.
posted by pinkacademic at 9:06 AM on July 26, 2015 [7 favorites]
But. I wonder if part of this is also learning to help your kiddo learn about your socialization preferences? What helped my kid, who socializes a lot more intuitively than me but can still get on a hobbyhorse are two things: 1. I sat my kiddo down once and explained the difference between introverts and extroverts, with the help of the internet. Kiddo recognized immediately that kiddo is more extroverted than I am, and so now when I. just. can't. with. the. talking., kiddo knows not to take it personally. We actually have a secret hand clue for this, but it's really more for me than him - I make half a heart with my fingers, and he finishes the other half with his, and it's a shorthand way for me to remind him that I love him, and in this moment, if things aren't going so great in our social dynamic, it's ok and part of our differing personalities - we still love each other. This works especially well when the socializing gets chaotic when we're navigating our blended families and the kids have to figure out how to socialize with each other and the adults.
2. For myself and in my own head, I set aside some time most days to remind myself to ask my kiddo (or if we're all together, all the kiddos) about their specific interests and to really, actively listen. For me, this is usually between homework and the screen time that happens while I make dinner, a space of about half an hour or so I devote to letting the kiddos hold conversational court, as it were. This means that the kiddos feel heard and have a regular outlet for hobbyhorsical conversation, which actually lessens the interrupting and court-holding at other times. And because it is a bracketed part of my day/schedule, I can really listen and enjoy it - when I'm present and loving in that moment I can also be more comfortable/confident/less prickly and guilty about demurring from hobbyhorsical conversations in the other moments.
If you're feeling tired and besieged, I suspect that this means you might need to do more to bracket kid-centered time and you-centered time. We are a pretty routinized family, with almost daily special things (like taco night, or game night; they're all pretty low impact) that let the kids/kid be the center of attention for a limited amount of time. This also frees us up to have some scheduled time every day where it's adult time. You could make reading from the trivia book a weekly thing, Tuesday Trivia! - and put it on a calendar your kiddo can see and look forward to. You can say to yourself that you'll ask kiddo about TOPIC over breakfast every morning, and feel freer to stop that conversation when it hits you at dinner time when you're tired and harried.
Other interactive things that have worked for our family include: board game night, a Saturday walk with the dogs, a shared tv show night, everyone gets a Sudoku puzzle book and works on their Sudokus together in the family room for an hour, printouts of 20 question like things that we answer together, impromptu talent shows where we can sohelpusgod get through half an hour where one kid shows off beatboxing, another their drum skillz, and a third can cheerlead. The key to all of this, though, is that my partner and I also have a pretty regular cocktail hour together on our porch or in a room separate from where the kids are - and we try religiously to protect that as time for just us. And we also have set times where an adult is working and that should also not be interrupted. We can always remind kiddos that we already did X kid-centered thing and/or X kid-centered thing is coming up.
For what it's worth, this parenting modus operandi not only tries to help our kids learn what we hope will be skills that help them navigate their social worlds a little easier than my partner and I have been able to do, but also responds to our history of loneliness as the children of parents who didn't really (and still don't) do a great job of asking us about our lives/interest/experiences and making us feel heard and validated.
posted by pinkacademic at 9:06 AM on July 26, 2015 [7 favorites]
Your daughter is my son. Same age, same quirks. I admit I am a little too good at switching off and making listening sounds, which only perpetuates the gap in communication that's going on. I've also expressed my frustration at his inability to let go of a topic. He commandeered a 1.5 hour hike with a friend the other day with a lecture about rockets that just didn't stop no matter what my friend and I were talking about. So I feel your pain. He loves talking to adults about his knowledge base, because his peers don't get it. It's kind of something you get to deal with if you have a smart kid, I guess.
When I am trying really hard to parent well, I will often tell him that he's been talking about x for five minutes and that's a long time to expect someone to listen, can you give me two highlights please? Or nudge him about body language: see how x is looking out the window while you're talking? That's a sign that they're thinking about something else and you could change the subject/take a break.
If it's a particular topic that he's fixated on (in his case, comics, rockets, physics, coding right now), I look for outlets. I send him to free coding workshops for kids, give him space to upload his comics to a blog, send him off with his dad to build a rocket, or take him to a museum where he can go wild for an afternoon. Rather than starting another long chain of one-sided conversations, that tends to quiet him down while he processes internally for a while.
I'm interested in the answers here!
posted by tracicle at 10:01 AM on July 26, 2015
When I am trying really hard to parent well, I will often tell him that he's been talking about x for five minutes and that's a long time to expect someone to listen, can you give me two highlights please? Or nudge him about body language: see how x is looking out the window while you're talking? That's a sign that they're thinking about something else and you could change the subject/take a break.
If it's a particular topic that he's fixated on (in his case, comics, rockets, physics, coding right now), I look for outlets. I send him to free coding workshops for kids, give him space to upload his comics to a blog, send him off with his dad to build a rocket, or take him to a museum where he can go wild for an afternoon. Rather than starting another long chain of one-sided conversations, that tends to quiet him down while he processes internally for a while.
I'm interested in the answers here!
posted by tracicle at 10:01 AM on July 26, 2015
She describes episodes of TV shows in endless details
If she's obsessive about particular shows/books/comics/etc, can you nudge her towards getting involved in fandom (assuming you're okay with her having an active engagement online)? I know when I was around that age, being involved in fandom was certainly a good outlet for my obsessiveness. (In fact, it still is.) I'm sure she can find plenty of people who would be happy to spend hours and hours at a time engaging on topics that might bore you to tears. It's also a way for her to get social contact outside of you and her peer group.
Now to more directly answer your question:
You two might enjoy this book, Are You Smart Enough to Work for Google? The title is kind of misleading, because from what I can tell, it's really a book of logic games/brain teasers/that kind of thing. I don't think it really has much to do with actually getting a job at google. (I haven't read all of it, but I looked through it because a friend was reading it.) It could be a fun thing for you two to work through together.
Also, what about crossword puzzles? I would try to find some geared towards your daughter's age range so they don't end up asking about obscure 1950s films or something that may not hold her interest. Alternatively, part of the game could be researching the answers.
When are a lot of these conversations happening? If she's talking at you while you're preparing dinner or something, you could always get her more involved in helping you out around the kitchen. It might curb her endless conversing a little bit.
Maybe you guys could also cultivate some shared interests. You could pick out some books to read (either together or in your own time) which you could then discuss when you're hanging out. Same thing would work with movie or TV shows, as well.
posted by litera scripta manet at 11:14 AM on July 26, 2015
If she's obsessive about particular shows/books/comics/etc, can you nudge her towards getting involved in fandom (assuming you're okay with her having an active engagement online)? I know when I was around that age, being involved in fandom was certainly a good outlet for my obsessiveness. (In fact, it still is.) I'm sure she can find plenty of people who would be happy to spend hours and hours at a time engaging on topics that might bore you to tears. It's also a way for her to get social contact outside of you and her peer group.
Now to more directly answer your question:
You two might enjoy this book, Are You Smart Enough to Work for Google? The title is kind of misleading, because from what I can tell, it's really a book of logic games/brain teasers/that kind of thing. I don't think it really has much to do with actually getting a job at google. (I haven't read all of it, but I looked through it because a friend was reading it.) It could be a fun thing for you two to work through together.
Also, what about crossword puzzles? I would try to find some geared towards your daughter's age range so they don't end up asking about obscure 1950s films or something that may not hold her interest. Alternatively, part of the game could be researching the answers.
When are a lot of these conversations happening? If she's talking at you while you're preparing dinner or something, you could always get her more involved in helping you out around the kitchen. It might curb her endless conversing a little bit.
Maybe you guys could also cultivate some shared interests. You could pick out some books to read (either together or in your own time) which you could then discuss when you're hanging out. Same thing would work with movie or TV shows, as well.
posted by litera scripta manet at 11:14 AM on July 26, 2015
I'm assuming this is a single-parent or shared custody situation, because otherwise, WHERE IS THE DAD? If you have a co-parent and they are not stepping up and distracting or otherwise engaging with your kiddo when they can tell that you are at your limit, you need to have a talk with them about sharing the burden of child-rearing. It doesn't end at diapers.
posted by Rock Steady at 9:43 AM on July 27, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Rock Steady at 9:43 AM on July 27, 2015 [2 favorites]
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