Tires: Winter 16"/Summer 17" or All Season 17"?

January 26, 2015 7:41 AM

I have a 2011 GTI with stock 18" Detroit wheels. I'm tired of the pothole slalom. Should I just get all-season tires on 17" wheels? Or should I get winter tires on 16" wheels and the in the spring get summer tires on 17" wheels?

I've got a 2011 GTI (love it!) with the stock 18" Detroit rims. Last week I bent one because I didn't pothole slalom well enough. I've gotten tire bubbles in the past. I'm not the type to install coilovers or bags and am fine with my stock suspension. (FWIW, I did disconnect the soundaktor and will probably get a stage one tune in a year or so.)

I live in metro NY (just outside of Queens FWIW) and the roads here are going to be getting worse after this snow storm, probably as bad as last winter. I've read that 17" wheels will allow for tires with a taller sidewall and thus less likely to have bubbles and bent rims as a result of failing to avoid a pothole. Sure, it won't look as nice (whatever), but in terms of performance, it looks like slightly better mileage/acceleration at the expense of handling turns, neither of which I'll probably actually notice.

It looks like the simpler (cheaper) solution is to get 17" VW wheels (e.g., the OEM Golf wheels like these, since they have not just the same bolt pattern (5x112) but the same offset (51mm) and I'm assuming the same centerbore (57.1mm) so I don't need to mess with hub rings because I understand the benefits of hub-centric over lug-centric wheel mounting) and tires.

Or is it worth the extra money (plus the hassle of storing the extra set of wheels and tires in my parents' garage ... I rent) to get 16" wheels with dedicated winter tires (I'd go with the tirerack.com package, so they'd be shipped to me mounted and balanced, I'd just swap them myself) and in the spring, looking for Golf wheels and dedicated summer tires.

Am I overthinking things and is messing with spacers and hub rings just not that big a deal and I should just go third-party with yet another option?

I don't autocross. It doesn't snow all the time, just once in a while and when it does, the roads are plowed pretty decently. I'm not doing anything silly like planning in driving in tomorrow's blizzard. I plan on keeping my car for at least 3 more years and will probably get a mk7 then (which keeps the same bolt pattern). Either way, I'll sell my current wheels/tires on vortex/golfmk6/CL to help fund the switch. Thanks!

posted by Brian Puccio to Travel & Transportation (9 answers total)

Best answer: You'd need to check that the 16" wheels fit over the GTi brakes - if the car is offered with 16" at some point that may not be an issue, but 16" might be pretty tight on first guess.

But, either way, full winter tyres plus dedicated full summer tyres is absolutely the best path to go. It isn't primarily about snow, but road surface temperature. If roads are below 7 deg C (45 F) for sustained periods then winter tyres are superior for grip because of the compound of rubber they are made from. The tread patter is what also makes them good in snow and ice.

So yes, it is certainly worth the extra money to get dedicated summer/winter tyre options. The only reason NOT to do it is because you simply can't afford it, but safety is not something people should be too penny-wise with, in my opinion.

Hassle: Store a small hydraulic jack and a breaker bar/torque wrench at your parents with the off-season wheels and you can swap them yourself in about 30 minutes to an hour. This will be quicker than at any tyre place, much cheaper after the second swap and also probably get you dinner thrown in if you hang around afterwards? Win win?

Other points:
The only difference between 18" and 17" wheels that you will notice is ride quality and aesthetic. It is extraordinarily unlikely you will see any tangible handling improvements on the road.

Yes, bigger sidewalls are much better at absorbing road imperfections than smaller ones. Yes, you will see less wheel damage.

Larger sidewalls also give better control in colder/adverse conditions so smaller wheels for winter tyres is best. I have 18" summers and 17" winters on my BMW 330i Sport, and would have gone to 16" winters if they would have fitted over the brakes (they don't! Check yours...).
posted by Brockles at 8:01 AM on January 26, 2015 [2 favorites]

Best answer: All of my friends with sports cars that they Daily Drive have a winter set of wheels. I'd recommend you just get the 17s and put winter tires on them. Swap out to 18s in the summer. Will take like an hour to do, it's really easy.

Also, road salt won't destroy your nice lightweight rims.

If you can fit the 16s, then do that - more sidewall = better traction, generally - but if you have to mess with spacers and whatnot to get them to fit, then I wouldn't bother.
posted by Pogo_Fuzzybutt at 8:09 AM on January 26, 2015

Best answer: Regardless of rim size, getting dedicated winter tires is a good thing. Having a separate set of rims will save on the cost of mounting/remounting twice a year and as noted is a simple diy.
posted by Dip Flash at 8:51 AM on January 26, 2015

Best answer: 16s will fit over GTI brakes, we've got a 2013 and the recommended snow tire is indeed a 16". Best part about doing 16s is that the size already pre-programmed in the computer to adjust the speedometer for tire diameter differences.

I'd do separate 16 snows and 17 summers. More expensive, but not only do you have easy swappability (you shouldn't really drive on snows in temps over 40), but you can get crummy steel wheels that you don't care about destroying in winter driving and you can spec full-on summer-only tires for when it's over 40deg.
posted by hwyengr at 10:08 AM on January 26, 2015

Best answer: My experience with the Detroits on a 2010 GTI and the standard 17"s on a 2011 TDI (that's how badly the GTI worked for me) were night and day. I lost five tires in a year to the Detroits in Chicago, and none the following Chicago winter (I left in the spring) with the 17"s. 16" with snows would definitely be safer, but I'd be reasonably confident on a four season all season (note that, for instance, the Michelin Pilot AS has a bit of a reputation as a three season (spring/winter/summer) tire) tires. The Detroits look bad too imnsho, while the standard wheels are not brilliant, but inoffensive.
posted by wotsac at 7:43 PM on January 26, 2015

Response by poster:

¶ You'd need to check that the 16" wheels fit over the GTi brakes

Yup, I'm good, the doughnut in the trunk is a 16" and I've put that on before.

Store a small hydraulic jack and a breaker bar/torque wrench at your parents with the off-season wheels and you can swap them yourself in about 30 minutes to an hour. This will be quicker than at any tyre place, much cheaper after the second swap and also probably get you dinner thrown in if you hang around afterwards? Win win?

That's probably what I'd do. (And that dinner thing? The GF and I call is scamming dinner off of our parents. Though in my case, it usually involves and hour or two of tech support, which I don't mind at all. I owe them anyhow.)

The only difference between 18" and 17" wheels that you will notice is ride quality and aesthetic.

Yeah, I think I'm looking forward to a softer ride at this point.

¶ If you can fit the 16s, then do that - more sidewall = better traction, generally - but if you have to mess with spacers and whatnot to get them to fit, then I wouldn't bother.

According to the TireRack.com and their rep, no need for spacers, wobble bolts, longer lugs or anything if I get the 16" cheap-steel wheels in the 16" package so I'm ordering those this afternoon.

¶ Having a separate set of rims will save on the cost of mounting/remounting twice a year and as noted is a simple diy.

Yeah, at $240 for a set of four, I'm going to save the money in mounting/remounting in the first year.

¶ 16s will fit over GTI brakes, we've got a 2013 and the recommended snow tire is indeed a 16". Best part about doing 16s is that the size already pre-programmed in the computer to adjust the speedometer for tire diameter differences.

Weird, I thought since the tire was taller, that the final outer diameter was pretty much the same so the speedometer doesn't really know the difference?

I'd do separate 16 snows and 17 summers.

I think this is what I'm going to aim for.

¶ I lost five tires in a year to the Detroits in Chicago, and none the following Chicago winter (I left in the spring) with the 17"s.

Kinda what I wanted to hear (well, not really, but you know ...).

Thanks again everyone, much appreciated.
posted by Brian Puccio at 10:25 AM on January 27, 2015

Best answer: Weird, I thought since the tire was taller, that the final outer diameter was pretty much the same so the speedometer doesn't really know the difference?

Yes, as long as the tyre size on the 16's is correct to the car spec there is no need to programme the speedometer at all. Not sure where that came from - the speedo doesn't care at all what size wheels you have, it's on rolling diameter of the tyre.
posted by Brockles at 10:47 AM on January 27, 2015

The settings menu on the GTI's dashboard has a checkbox for "snow tires". Since the recommended snow tire size is different than the standard equipped tires, I just figured it was for speedo calibration.
posted by hwyengr at 8:49 PM on February 1, 2015

Response by poster: I did some digging around, it just sets a speed warning:

http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8277

VAGCOM is needed if the actual circumference of the tire changes.
posted by Brian Puccio at 5:51 AM on February 2, 2015