Wiring Recording Panel - need help
November 10, 2014 3:59 PM Subscribe
I am about to wire some audio cables in my wall. It's two 1/4" jacks, stereo, one is microphone and the other headphones, going to a recording computer in a different room. Need help figuring out the proper parts.
The set-up is this:
2 Microphones (left and right channel) to mixing board. Mixing board output to wall jack. Then other wall jack to "Mic in" on computer.
"Headphone out" on computer to wall jack, other wall jack to splitter, splitter to two sets of cans.
I found what, I think, is the perfect wall plate at http://www.amazon.com/Seismic-Audio-SA-PLATE21-Stainless-4-Inch/dp/B00FPWEUW2/ref=pd_sxp_f_pt
But what wire would I need for an in-wall installation of this that would work in stereo for these jacks? I see wire listed on the page but just because it's "frequently bought together" doesn't mean it's exactly what I need.
Thanks for the help!
The set-up is this:
2 Microphones (left and right channel) to mixing board. Mixing board output to wall jack. Then other wall jack to "Mic in" on computer.
"Headphone out" on computer to wall jack, other wall jack to splitter, splitter to two sets of cans.
I found what, I think, is the perfect wall plate at http://www.amazon.com/Seismic-Audio-SA-PLATE21-Stainless-4-Inch/dp/B00FPWEUW2/ref=pd_sxp_f_pt
But what wire would I need for an in-wall installation of this that would work in stereo for these jacks? I see wire listed on the page but just because it's "frequently bought together" doesn't mean it's exactly what I need.
Thanks for the help!
That "microphone cable" listed on the page is what you need.
The jacks on that plate are stereo or TRS, which stands for Tip Ring Sleeve.
The Tip and the Ring connections are "hots", the Sleeve is the "ground" connection.
Mic cable is "balanced" cable - there are two individually insulated wires plus a bare copper wire inside the outer covering of the wire. Each individually covered wire is a "hot", the bare copper is "ground."
Although to be honest your description of your signal flow is a little confusing. I'm guessing you intend to have two of these plates, one in each room, but I'm not sure what kind of mics you have and how you intend to connect them as "2 Microphones (left and right channel)."
posted by soundguy99 at 5:03 PM on November 10, 2014
The jacks on that plate are stereo or TRS, which stands for Tip Ring Sleeve.
The Tip and the Ring connections are "hots", the Sleeve is the "ground" connection.
Mic cable is "balanced" cable - there are two individually insulated wires plus a bare copper wire inside the outer covering of the wire. Each individually covered wire is a "hot", the bare copper is "ground."
Although to be honest your description of your signal flow is a little confusing. I'm guessing you intend to have two of these plates, one in each room, but I'm not sure what kind of mics you have and how you intend to connect them as "2 Microphones (left and right channel)."
posted by soundguy99 at 5:03 PM on November 10, 2014
> Although to be honest your description of your signal flow is a little confusing. I'm guessing you intend to have two of these plates, one in each room, but I'm not sure what kind of mics you have and how you intend to connect them as "2 Microphones (left and right channel)."
My reading is that arniec intends to take two unbalanced mics and feed them into one stereo mixer input with one on the left channel and the other on the right, then send that mixer's output into a jack in the wall that eventually comes out of a jack in the other room and into the computer, which presumably applies some effects of its own to the signal and records it. That's one pair of stereo jacks.
The second pair of stereo jacks takes the output of the computer and sends it back to the room with the mics to feed two pairs of monitor headphones, which are both connected to the same jack by means of a passive splitter.
I'm not sure how professional a setup you're after here, arniec, but the fact that you're bothering to run wiring through the walls makes it sound like you want this to be reasonably nice. There are a couple problems with the scenario you've described, the first being that you appear to be running unbalanced audio between rooms which is very likely to introduce hum and other interference to the signal. if you need to convert from unbalanced to balanced and back it can be done with something like this, or you could upgrade to a mixer with balanced out. The second problem is the use of a passive splitter on your studio monitor headphones. Consider replacing this with a distribution amplifier, or a headphone amp with multiple outputs.
If you're really trying to keep costs down and using balanced signals just isn't in the cards, you can cut down the interference a bit by using foil-shielded audio cables and keeping them well away from any power wiring. If you do need to intersect with power wires, do it at a right angle. But as long as you're pulling wire through the walls it's relatively cheap to pull enough to upgrade to balanced wiring in the future, just run some extra 3-conductor cables and you can hook them up to the appropriate gear whenever you feel ready to upgrade.
posted by contraption at 7:38 PM on November 10, 2014
My reading is that arniec intends to take two unbalanced mics and feed them into one stereo mixer input with one on the left channel and the other on the right, then send that mixer's output into a jack in the wall that eventually comes out of a jack in the other room and into the computer, which presumably applies some effects of its own to the signal and records it. That's one pair of stereo jacks.
The second pair of stereo jacks takes the output of the computer and sends it back to the room with the mics to feed two pairs of monitor headphones, which are both connected to the same jack by means of a passive splitter.
I'm not sure how professional a setup you're after here, arniec, but the fact that you're bothering to run wiring through the walls makes it sound like you want this to be reasonably nice. There are a couple problems with the scenario you've described, the first being that you appear to be running unbalanced audio between rooms which is very likely to introduce hum and other interference to the signal. if you need to convert from unbalanced to balanced and back it can be done with something like this, or you could upgrade to a mixer with balanced out. The second problem is the use of a passive splitter on your studio monitor headphones. Consider replacing this with a distribution amplifier, or a headphone amp with multiple outputs.
If you're really trying to keep costs down and using balanced signals just isn't in the cards, you can cut down the interference a bit by using foil-shielded audio cables and keeping them well away from any power wiring. If you do need to intersect with power wires, do it at a right angle. But as long as you're pulling wire through the walls it's relatively cheap to pull enough to upgrade to balanced wiring in the future, just run some extra 3-conductor cables and you can hook them up to the appropriate gear whenever you feel ready to upgrade.
posted by contraption at 7:38 PM on November 10, 2014
Response by poster: Contraption, thank you for the information. I have read about the balanced audio but not sure I know if I have balanced or unbalanced out from the mixer. Is the only difference the types of cables used? Is balanced at all related to the fact that I'm running stereo or am I confused on this?
For example, if I strip this balanced cable and use it for the in wall wiring would that give me the balanced connection without the hum? http://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Balanced-Patch-Cable/dp/B004MNTIL8/ref=sr_1_2?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1415676599&sr=1-2&keywords=balanced+cable
posted by arniec at 7:46 PM on November 10, 2014
For example, if I strip this balanced cable and use it for the in wall wiring would that give me the balanced connection without the hum? http://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Balanced-Patch-Cable/dp/B004MNTIL8/ref=sr_1_2?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1415676599&sr=1-2&keywords=balanced+cable
posted by arniec at 7:46 PM on November 10, 2014
I have read about the balanced audio but not sure I know if I have balanced or unbalanced out from the mixer.
This info should be in the user manual or available from the manufacturer's website.
Is the only difference the types of cables used?
No. The physical connectors need to allow for balanced wiring, and the circuitry of both the input and output devices will be at least slightly different between balanced and unbalanced. Balanced audio allows for longer cable runs with less noise. This can be very important with microphones, which put out a very low level signal.
Is balanced at all related to the fact that I'm running stereo or am I confused on this?
I think you're confused on this, but it's understandable, because the same kind of physical plugs and jacks can be used for stereo applications or balanced audio applications, depending.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:53 PM on November 10, 2014
This info should be in the user manual or available from the manufacturer's website.
Is the only difference the types of cables used?
No. The physical connectors need to allow for balanced wiring, and the circuitry of both the input and output devices will be at least slightly different between balanced and unbalanced. Balanced audio allows for longer cable runs with less noise. This can be very important with microphones, which put out a very low level signal.
Is balanced at all related to the fact that I'm running stereo or am I confused on this?
I think you're confused on this, but it's understandable, because the same kind of physical plugs and jacks can be used for stereo applications or balanced audio applications, depending.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:53 PM on November 10, 2014
Response by poster: Soundguy99, Contraption:
I checked, my mixer does balanced outputs, both LR and Stereo, through a 1/4" TRS Jack.
In regards to the headphone jack, that is coming out of a Mac Mini at the moment, so I'm not sure if that is balanced or not.
So given that, it means I can, for the microphones at least (the one where the audio fidelity need is highest), use cables that will transmit balanced signals.
Given ALL that, is the cable I linked above ( http://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Balanced-Patch-Cable/dp/B004MNTIL8/ref=sr_1_2?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1415676599&sr=1-2&keywords=balanced+cable ) the right one for this connection?
posted by arniec at 7:11 AM on November 11, 2014
I checked, my mixer does balanced outputs, both LR and Stereo, through a 1/4" TRS Jack.
In regards to the headphone jack, that is coming out of a Mac Mini at the moment, so I'm not sure if that is balanced or not.
So given that, it means I can, for the microphones at least (the one where the audio fidelity need is highest), use cables that will transmit balanced signals.
Given ALL that, is the cable I linked above ( http://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Balanced-Patch-Cable/dp/B004MNTIL8/ref=sr_1_2?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1415676599&sr=1-2&keywords=balanced+cable ) the right one for this connection?
posted by arniec at 7:11 AM on November 11, 2014
Yep, that cable looks right, though you might be better served buying a spool of raw cable and cutting it to length yourself. Also be aware that you will need 3 cables like that for the scenario you've described, and I would highly recommend pulling 4 while you're at it so you can easily upgrade the monitors to balanced in the future by adding converters on each end of the run from the Mac Mini. (You need two of these cables per balanced run since each 3-conductor TRS cable will give you one channel of audio and you need two channels for left and right.)
posted by contraption at 7:34 AM on November 11, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by contraption at 7:34 AM on November 11, 2014 [1 favorite]
Seconding that cable is fine, and seconding that buying cable without ends already on it will save you some time and trouble.
In regards to the headphone jack, that is coming out of a Mac Mini at the moment, so I'm not sure if that is balanced or not.
It's not balanced, but you can use the same wire. Also, headphone outputs are a higher signal level than microphones, so it's OK for them to run unbalanced.
Also, lots of gear these days, especially consumer or "Pro-sumer", is OK with either balanced or unbalanced connections - you'll get less noise from the run of cable itself if you use a balanced run, but it's not like you're gonna blow anything up if you use an unbalanced wire.
Out of curiosity, what mixer do you have? I might be able to answer in a bit more detail with that info.
posted by soundguy99 at 3:35 PM on November 11, 2014
In regards to the headphone jack, that is coming out of a Mac Mini at the moment, so I'm not sure if that is balanced or not.
It's not balanced, but you can use the same wire. Also, headphone outputs are a higher signal level than microphones, so it's OK for them to run unbalanced.
Also, lots of gear these days, especially consumer or "Pro-sumer", is OK with either balanced or unbalanced connections - you'll get less noise from the run of cable itself if you use a balanced run, but it's not like you're gonna blow anything up if you use an unbalanced wire.
Out of curiosity, what mixer do you have? I might be able to answer in a bit more detail with that info.
posted by soundguy99 at 3:35 PM on November 11, 2014
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by contraption at 4:04 PM on November 10, 2014 [1 favorite]