He keeps on flaking.
June 21, 2014 9:45 AM Subscribe
Today he forgot about our date, and i am really upset because it shows that he doesn't like me right? I would love to see him more regularly, but it isn't happening. At the beginning of our relationship we were both a bit nervous and getting to know eachother, but the last couple of times have been great and we really connected on a deeper level, which is why i still want to see him, but not sure if it is worth it if he flakes. Details inside.
I (23) met this guy (28) in february, and the chemistry is amazing and we get along well. He is really funny and also very interesting. We only see eachother once every 2 weeks though because either i've been away or he has, or things just didn't work out. But I realise that at the beginning i came across as too nice, i cooked for him and gave him a present and i was a bit nervous around him. I tend to fall into intense relationships, but I've realised this and have calmed down and have my own life and hobbies and friends, and also feel quite comfortable around him now!
But he has flaked on me three times, the first was a while ago because he had to pack and the second was around a month ago when he had to work. I had family over recently for 2 weeks and was with them the whole time so didn't see him for around a month, but last weekend we did see each other and had the best date, we really bonded and i saw his vulnerable side and he saw mine. I asked him how he feels about me and he said he takes a long time to fall in love but that he prioritises me above anybody else and always wants to see me over his friends and other people, and that i'm beautiful and he thinks we are almost in a relationship and that he likes me more every time. I felt like this was an honest answer because he had to think about it and got a bit embarrassed.
Today he actually completely forgot that we even had a date, even though last week he said he can finally start seeing me more regularly and asked to see me today. I'm trying not to blame him, as i realise that he has been a bit depressed about his life, where he is going in life etc and has been thinking about that a lot as he wants to leave his job, but it made me so upset that he forgot, and i told him that i feel upset and need to think about things now. He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
I am really not sure what to do about this. We are going to an event next week, that i've been really excited about for a while and he knows this. I feel like he thinks i am always available for him, and always forgive him and he takes advantage of that, but i am not sure and can't see this situation clearly. I know he likes me, but not sure how much and if it is worth going out with him.
Surely he should want to be with me much more than a couple of times a month?
Should i go to this event with him and after that painfully just move on, or should i wait and see if things do improve? We haven't slept with eachother btw, Thank you in advance!
I (23) met this guy (28) in february, and the chemistry is amazing and we get along well. He is really funny and also very interesting. We only see eachother once every 2 weeks though because either i've been away or he has, or things just didn't work out. But I realise that at the beginning i came across as too nice, i cooked for him and gave him a present and i was a bit nervous around him. I tend to fall into intense relationships, but I've realised this and have calmed down and have my own life and hobbies and friends, and also feel quite comfortable around him now!
But he has flaked on me three times, the first was a while ago because he had to pack and the second was around a month ago when he had to work. I had family over recently for 2 weeks and was with them the whole time so didn't see him for around a month, but last weekend we did see each other and had the best date, we really bonded and i saw his vulnerable side and he saw mine. I asked him how he feels about me and he said he takes a long time to fall in love but that he prioritises me above anybody else and always wants to see me over his friends and other people, and that i'm beautiful and he thinks we are almost in a relationship and that he likes me more every time. I felt like this was an honest answer because he had to think about it and got a bit embarrassed.
Today he actually completely forgot that we even had a date, even though last week he said he can finally start seeing me more regularly and asked to see me today. I'm trying not to blame him, as i realise that he has been a bit depressed about his life, where he is going in life etc and has been thinking about that a lot as he wants to leave his job, but it made me so upset that he forgot, and i told him that i feel upset and need to think about things now. He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
I am really not sure what to do about this. We are going to an event next week, that i've been really excited about for a while and he knows this. I feel like he thinks i am always available for him, and always forgive him and he takes advantage of that, but i am not sure and can't see this situation clearly. I know he likes me, but not sure how much and if it is worth going out with him.
Surely he should want to be with me much more than a couple of times a month?
Should i go to this event with him and after that painfully just move on, or should i wait and see if things do improve? We haven't slept with eachother btw, Thank you in advance!
I think this dude really does like you and is not a deliberate game-player, but I don't think his distant, hard-to-pin-down, flaky M.O. is going to change anytime soon....or ever.
He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
Translation: If you're going to place (totally reasonable) demands and expectations on me, then there is no point to us dating, because I am not going to meet them.
posted by Juliet Banana at 10:02 AM on June 21, 2014 [51 favorites]
He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
Translation: If you're going to place (totally reasonable) demands and expectations on me, then there is no point to us dating, because I am not going to meet them.
posted by Juliet Banana at 10:02 AM on June 21, 2014 [51 favorites]
Everybody at the end of a bad relationship has said "I wish I hadn't ignored the warning signs." This guy is giving you a pretty clear warning sign. His feelings towards you don't really matter; it looks like he doesn't have his shit together enough to date anyone right now.
i told him that i feel upset and need to think about things now. He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
It also looks like he's not ready to consider your emotions or feelings, and how they relate to his behavior.
posted by hydrophonic at 10:05 AM on June 21, 2014 [11 favorites]
i told him that i feel upset and need to think about things now. He said that if i feel this way then what is the point.
It also looks like he's not ready to consider your emotions or feelings, and how they relate to his behavior.
posted by hydrophonic at 10:05 AM on June 21, 2014 [11 favorites]
This sounds like one of those situations where the guy has some slight interest in you, but not enough that he really wants to be in a relationship with you. It's never worth dating someone else when you're the only person who really wants to. It's like trying to row a boat with one oar — you'll just keep going around in circles and it will be painful and frustrating and a waste of time. And given that you've been casually dating since February and he still isn't showing a sufficient level of interest, I'd say at this point there's no point waiting around any longer. I'd stop contacting him (if he wants this upcoming event date to happen, let him make it happen) and start dating other people. If he steps up and makes things happen, you can meet him half way, but otherwise just let it die a natural death.
posted by orange swan at 10:07 AM on June 21, 2014 [12 favorites]
posted by orange swan at 10:07 AM on June 21, 2014 [12 favorites]
I feel like he thinks i am always available for him, and always forgive him and he takes advantage of that
Listen to the voice that's telling you this.
Here's a thing it took me a long time to understand: when somebody's words don't match their actions, it's the actions that are actually telling you the truth.
The fact is, he has flaked on you repeatedly, and it makes you feel bad, and he keeps on doing it anyway. Not only that: he has basically given you notice that he's going to keep on doing it despite knowing how much it hurts you.
This means that when he says "he prioritises me above anybody else and always wants to see me over his friends and other people," he is not actually telling you the truth. He may not be consciously lying; he may actually believe this. But his actions tell a different story, which is that you are not really a priority.
Your gut feeling is the right one.
posted by scody at 10:08 AM on June 21, 2014 [49 favorites]
Listen to the voice that's telling you this.
Here's a thing it took me a long time to understand: when somebody's words don't match their actions, it's the actions that are actually telling you the truth.
The fact is, he has flaked on you repeatedly, and it makes you feel bad, and he keeps on doing it anyway. Not only that: he has basically given you notice that he's going to keep on doing it despite knowing how much it hurts you.
This means that when he says "he prioritises me above anybody else and always wants to see me over his friends and other people," he is not actually telling you the truth. He may not be consciously lying; he may actually believe this. But his actions tell a different story, which is that you are not really a priority.
Your gut feeling is the right one.
posted by scody at 10:08 AM on June 21, 2014 [49 favorites]
If he was into you, he would not have forgotten your date.*
It's really that simple.
*alien invasion, pet dying, house falling into a sudden sinkhole...those MIGHT be plausible excuses.
posted by Windigo at 10:17 AM on June 21, 2014 [20 favorites]
It's really that simple.
*alien invasion, pet dying, house falling into a sudden sinkhole...those MIGHT be plausible excuses.
posted by Windigo at 10:17 AM on June 21, 2014 [20 favorites]
If I was dating someone and forgot a scheduled date I would be mortified and extremely apologetic. The fact that he is turning that back on you is extremely concerning.
Some people are just profoundly disorganized and forgetful. If you can deal with that, it's not necessarily a dealbreaker.* Failing to take responsibility for mistakes which hurt your feelings is a bigger problem in my opinion.
*(If he's not this flaky and forgetful in the rest of his life, just with you, then he really doesn't care that much.)
posted by tdismukes at 10:21 AM on June 21, 2014 [7 favorites]
Some people are just profoundly disorganized and forgetful. If you can deal with that, it's not necessarily a dealbreaker.* Failing to take responsibility for mistakes which hurt your feelings is a bigger problem in my opinion.
*(If he's not this flaky and forgetful in the rest of his life, just with you, then he really doesn't care that much.)
posted by tdismukes at 10:21 AM on June 21, 2014 [7 favorites]
-don't sleep with him
-go to the event. Have a backup plan in mind in case he bails last minute.
-give it a couple more weeks
-do your absolute best to have an independent and cool life of your own. Make plans without him. Go to parties.
-if he's too busy after that, start dating other people.
Traveling, working, packing, getting a new job- all seem pretty legit. I'd let this blow over- for now. It's possible he's just in a bad place to date anyone right now.
posted by quincunx at 10:21 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
-go to the event. Have a backup plan in mind in case he bails last minute.
-give it a couple more weeks
-do your absolute best to have an independent and cool life of your own. Make plans without him. Go to parties.
-if he's too busy after that, start dating other people.
Traveling, working, packing, getting a new job- all seem pretty legit. I'd let this blow over- for now. It's possible he's just in a bad place to date anyone right now.
posted by quincunx at 10:21 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
Break up with him?
Seriously, as a third party I am concerned you are going to look back on this and wonder why you put all this effort and energy into a guy who just doesn't seem to care all that much. Don't you want to date a guy who cares like an equal amount to how much you do?
I think sometimes dating manuals give the wrong advice. It is like the idea is to come across cool and unconcerned and not sleep with the guy so he will care more. But I think it would be better to be cool and unconcerned and not sleep with him because you actually know you deserve better. So, here's the internet telling you: you deserve better.
Also why are you trying not to blame him? Blame him! He is a flake.
posted by mermily at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [5 favorites]
Seriously, as a third party I am concerned you are going to look back on this and wonder why you put all this effort and energy into a guy who just doesn't seem to care all that much. Don't you want to date a guy who cares like an equal amount to how much you do?
I think sometimes dating manuals give the wrong advice. It is like the idea is to come across cool and unconcerned and not sleep with the guy so he will care more. But I think it would be better to be cool and unconcerned and not sleep with him because you actually know you deserve better. So, here's the internet telling you: you deserve better.
Also why are you trying not to blame him? Blame him! He is a flake.
posted by mermily at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [5 favorites]
"Here's a thing it took me a long time to understand: when somebody's words don't match their actions, it's the actions that are actually telling you the truth."
I just bolded those wise words because - HA HA - I married my husband after knowing him for only two months because his words matched his actions down to a ridiculous level and I just couldn't pass him up!
Alter your plans for this event, either skip it or go with someone else. Trust me, this is the right move here.
I disagree that this guy likes you or isn't a player. You guys have had since February, and his words and actions are not in alignment. His berating your feelings after he fucked up is DTMFA territory, especially considering the timeline here and his previous words.
So, DTMFA and think no more of it.
You are a glorious 23 year old. You have so much going for you, go find someone who has time and inclination to demonstrate how glorious they find you to be!!
posted by jbenben at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [18 favorites]
I just bolded those wise words because - HA HA - I married my husband after knowing him for only two months because his words matched his actions down to a ridiculous level and I just couldn't pass him up!
Alter your plans for this event, either skip it or go with someone else. Trust me, this is the right move here.
I disagree that this guy likes you or isn't a player. You guys have had since February, and his words and actions are not in alignment. His berating your feelings after he fucked up is DTMFA territory, especially considering the timeline here and his previous words.
So, DTMFA and think no more of it.
You are a glorious 23 year old. You have so much going for you, go find someone who has time and inclination to demonstrate how glorious they find you to be!!
posted by jbenben at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [18 favorites]
I would see his flaking on you when you haven't had sex yet as a big red flag.
Shouldn't he be seeing each of these initial dates as a chance to get, or move towards, sexytimes?
Therefore, if he is flaking on you- it means he might be getting sexytimes elsewhere or might not want sexytimes with you- for some reason.
But it would be WAY to ambivalent for my tastes.
posted by misspony at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
Shouldn't he be seeing each of these initial dates as a chance to get, or move towards, sexytimes?
Therefore, if he is flaking on you- it means he might be getting sexytimes elsewhere or might not want sexytimes with you- for some reason.
But it would be WAY to ambivalent for my tastes.
posted by misspony at 10:23 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
You deserve more than this.
posted by unknowncommand at 10:30 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by unknowncommand at 10:30 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
I feel like he thinks i am always available for him
I think your gut feeling here is probably right. The older you get -- IME especially in that phase from your 20s to your 30s -- the more obvious it will be when you're with someone who genuinely *gets* that you have various needs that need to be taken care of too, vs someone who doesn't. As jbenben noted above, someone who makes your feelings the problem when they screwed up = someone who doesn't get it.
You are only 23, and you have knowledge of what worthwhile chemistry feels like. Don't be afraid to seek it in someone who values your time and attention too.
Also seconding scody's awesome date-behavior-deciphering advice above: when somebody's words don't match their actions, it's the actions that are actually telling you the truth... repeat as needed.
posted by human ecologist at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014
I think your gut feeling here is probably right. The older you get -- IME especially in that phase from your 20s to your 30s -- the more obvious it will be when you're with someone who genuinely *gets* that you have various needs that need to be taken care of too, vs someone who doesn't. As jbenben noted above, someone who makes your feelings the problem when they screwed up = someone who doesn't get it.
You are only 23, and you have knowledge of what worthwhile chemistry feels like. Don't be afraid to seek it in someone who values your time and attention too.
Also seconding scody's awesome date-behavior-deciphering advice above: when somebody's words don't match their actions, it's the actions that are actually telling you the truth... repeat as needed.
posted by human ecologist at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014
How would you feel if someone said there are partners who would never forget they were meant to see you, who would drop everyone and everything if it meant a chance of spending time with you, and who would leave you with not one iota of doubt that they were crazy about you? Would you prefer that kind of guy to this person? Well I'm hereby telling you that they exist, and you have my permission to be free to go and find one stat. This guy may be great but he's not great for you right now. End things kindly then go forth and enjoy your next chapter.
posted by billiebee at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [19 favorites]
posted by billiebee at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [19 favorites]
You could have stopped at "he forgot about our date."
Someone who does that, who doesn't have HUGE extenuating circumstances like getting hit in the head on the way to meet you, isn't interested in you.
posted by Sara C. at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
Someone who does that, who doesn't have HUGE extenuating circumstances like getting hit in the head on the way to meet you, isn't interested in you.
posted by Sara C. at 10:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
Who cares why he's flaking on you? Yeah maybe he's not in a good place to date anyone, or maybe he's just really bad at remembering stuff. But that's his problem not yours, you should be worrying about whether you like him and whether you have a good time at this point in the relationship and this sounds stressful and very unfun to me.
posted by SpaceWarp13 at 10:32 AM on June 21, 2014
posted by SpaceWarp13 at 10:32 AM on June 21, 2014
i am really upset because it shows that he doesn't like me right?
Well, maybe? But here's the thing: either he is acting like this because he is Not That Into You, or he's acting like this because he does like you but this is just how he is, but either way: he's acting like this.
You can waste years trying to puzzle out what is driving his behaviour, but whatever you figure out, it's not going to change the fact that it's not behaviour you're happy with (and who'd blame you!). I'd wish him well and be gone if I were you.
posted by Catseye at 10:37 AM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
Well, maybe? But here's the thing: either he is acting like this because he is Not That Into You, or he's acting like this because he does like you but this is just how he is, but either way: he's acting like this.
You can waste years trying to puzzle out what is driving his behaviour, but whatever you figure out, it's not going to change the fact that it's not behaviour you're happy with (and who'd blame you!). I'd wish him well and be gone if I were you.
posted by Catseye at 10:37 AM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
A fuckup like this every once in a looooong while is forgivable, doing it on a regular basis, in the early part of a relationship, and not scrambling to make amends is either medical, or just being an inconsiderate asshole.
Your call. But it looks like a friggen huge piece of red cloth on the end of a stick to me.
posted by edgeways at 10:38 AM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
Your call. But it looks like a friggen huge piece of red cloth on the end of a stick to me.
posted by edgeways at 10:38 AM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
Oh- and can I add- this is the honeymoon period.
BEST CASE SCENARIO- this IS him IMPRESSING you.
You are 23... make sure you spend the rest of your 20's dating, ditching losers and learning your lessons, and ultimately being WOW'd by someone who thinks you are the bee's knees and the cat's pajamas- and for whom you feel the same.
posted by misspony at 10:42 AM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
BEST CASE SCENARIO- this IS him IMPRESSING you.
You are 23... make sure you spend the rest of your 20's dating, ditching losers and learning your lessons, and ultimately being WOW'd by someone who thinks you are the bee's knees and the cat's pajamas- and for whom you feel the same.
posted by misspony at 10:42 AM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
Best answer: You say you don't know if you're thinking about this clearly. That's because you're very concerned with his experience, his motives, his point of view. You need to focus on what you want -- for him to what he says he's going to do.
This isn't about blaming or accusing him. You need to say straight out that it makes you feel bad when he forgets after making plans to see you, and would he be willing to let you know if he can't make it. If he says it's not a big deal/you're overreacting/you're too critical or any other excuse, he's changing the subject. Come back to the subject: "If you're not going to get together with me after we've made plans, I'd like you to let me know." If it sounds too blunt to you, start with some other facts: "I really like spending time with you, and when we make a date I look forward to it."
If he doesn't immediately agree to do that, then tell him, "It matters to me a lot." And don't discuss any of his explanations or excuses. Just nod your head. Don't apologize for making the request or suggest that he'd be doing you a special favor by respecting your wishes.
Then if he flakes again, you'll know he's not treating you as you would treat a friend. If he does cancel ahead of time, you'll still be disappointed. In that case, you can decide to stop seeing him because you want to spend more time with the guy you're seeing.
This is a good way to handle things in any new (or old) relationship. Don't try to interpret what his behavior means. Don't ever think that asking someone to show respect is unreasonable.
posted by wryly at 10:52 AM on June 21, 2014 [5 favorites]
This isn't about blaming or accusing him. You need to say straight out that it makes you feel bad when he forgets after making plans to see you, and would he be willing to let you know if he can't make it. If he says it's not a big deal/you're overreacting/you're too critical or any other excuse, he's changing the subject. Come back to the subject: "If you're not going to get together with me after we've made plans, I'd like you to let me know." If it sounds too blunt to you, start with some other facts: "I really like spending time with you, and when we make a date I look forward to it."
If he doesn't immediately agree to do that, then tell him, "It matters to me a lot." And don't discuss any of his explanations or excuses. Just nod your head. Don't apologize for making the request or suggest that he'd be doing you a special favor by respecting your wishes.
Then if he flakes again, you'll know he's not treating you as you would treat a friend. If he does cancel ahead of time, you'll still be disappointed. In that case, you can decide to stop seeing him because you want to spend more time with the guy you're seeing.
This is a good way to handle things in any new (or old) relationship. Don't try to interpret what his behavior means. Don't ever think that asking someone to show respect is unreasonable.
posted by wryly at 10:52 AM on June 21, 2014 [5 favorites]
To be honest, there are so many guys out there, and you are 23. Someone who forgets you have a date with them is not worth your time.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:52 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:52 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thank you so much for your answers so far, i love metafilter!
To answer a couple of questions, the reason that I don't blame him is because there is no point... I know he is going through a strange phase where he is flaking on his friends, and spends a lot of time with his family. He is the type who doesn't know what he wants, his relationships have mostly been long distance. He doesn't have a girlfriend, he told me recently that i am the only person he is dating (he was going on dates in february but now is only dating me). I don't blame myself either, but I was a bit too naive and not very good at playing games or getting him to earn my trust like some people have told me i should do. So i believed every word of his and he could tell that i trusted him. I guess i should of been asking this question after the FIRST time he flaked, not weeks later :/
I told him last time he flaked that it upsets me and to let me know in advance so i can make other plans, and he agreed. But this time he said he forgot, and that i am always so unsure about him and he doesn't know why.
We haven't slept with each other but have been close to, as he says he needs to be in love and that it will happen soon... This was when he invited me for dinner at his place but cancelled because of work. He told me that he lives with random people and is moving soon, but last week he let it slip that he lives with his older brother who has a family but i didn't realise until later..
I am dating other people but i haven't connected with anybody like i have with him.
posted by aivilo91 at 11:03 AM on June 21, 2014
To answer a couple of questions, the reason that I don't blame him is because there is no point... I know he is going through a strange phase where he is flaking on his friends, and spends a lot of time with his family. He is the type who doesn't know what he wants, his relationships have mostly been long distance. He doesn't have a girlfriend, he told me recently that i am the only person he is dating (he was going on dates in february but now is only dating me). I don't blame myself either, but I was a bit too naive and not very good at playing games or getting him to earn my trust like some people have told me i should do. So i believed every word of his and he could tell that i trusted him. I guess i should of been asking this question after the FIRST time he flaked, not weeks later :/
I told him last time he flaked that it upsets me and to let me know in advance so i can make other plans, and he agreed. But this time he said he forgot, and that i am always so unsure about him and he doesn't know why.
We haven't slept with each other but have been close to, as he says he needs to be in love and that it will happen soon... This was when he invited me for dinner at his place but cancelled because of work. He told me that he lives with random people and is moving soon, but last week he let it slip that he lives with his older brother who has a family but i didn't realise until later..
I am dating other people but i haven't connected with anybody like i have with him.
posted by aivilo91 at 11:03 AM on June 21, 2014
It likely has nothing at all to do with you, but flakes will always be flakes. Well, not literally always, but it takes an amount of effort that most people aren't willing to put in to change those kinds of habits. If you can't live with constant lateness and occasional forgetting of events, it's time to end things.
People who are that way are perfectly fine people, IMO, but that doesn't mean they are necessarily the best match for you. There are plenty of people who don't have that limitation and many of them would be delighted to date you.
posted by wierdo at 11:03 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
People who are that way are perfectly fine people, IMO, but that doesn't mean they are necessarily the best match for you. There are plenty of people who don't have that limitation and many of them would be delighted to date you.
posted by wierdo at 11:03 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
I read somewhere, "Don't make someone a priority in your life when you're only an option in theirs."
Gauge someone's potential as a romantic partner by how they treat you. Don't let "amazing chemistry" make you blind to what you know you deserve.
Be young. Have fun. Trust your mind and guard your heart.
Good luck to you!
posted by tackypink at 11:06 AM on June 21, 2014 [11 favorites]
Gauge someone's potential as a romantic partner by how they treat you. Don't let "amazing chemistry" make you blind to what you know you deserve.
Be young. Have fun. Trust your mind and guard your heart.
Good luck to you!
posted by tackypink at 11:06 AM on June 21, 2014 [11 favorites]
Response by poster: Also, i would be fine with flakiness once in a while if he had a valid excuse, but what upsets me is that we only see each other twice a month, so I've only seen him around 10 times since february.
posted by aivilo91 at 11:07 AM on June 21, 2014
posted by aivilo91 at 11:07 AM on June 21, 2014
Actually, on a third read, I suspect the actual problem here is depression. As in your boyfriend is depressed and he is saying he "forgot" because it doesn't bring about the feelings of extreme vulnerability that it does to say "I felt like I couldn't get out of bed/the house/my pajamas so I blew you off." Still not your problem, but it might be worth a try if he is willing to get on antidepressants. (assuming he actually needs them, of course)
posted by wierdo at 11:07 AM on June 21, 2014
posted by wierdo at 11:07 AM on June 21, 2014
Want to know a secret about humans?
There's no such thing as "a phase."
How people act is just how they act. There are no sidebars where what is actually happening doesn't really count towards what they are like.
posted by Sara C. at 11:16 AM on June 21, 2014 [14 favorites]
There's no such thing as "a phase."
How people act is just how they act. There are no sidebars where what is actually happening doesn't really count towards what they are like.
posted by Sara C. at 11:16 AM on June 21, 2014 [14 favorites]
"We haven't slept with each other but have been close to, as he says he needs to be in love and that it will happen soon... This was when he invited me for dinner at his place but cancelled because of work. He told me that he lives with random people and is moving soon, but last week he let it slip that he lives with his older brother who has a family but i didn't realise until later.."
This guy really doesn't sound ready for a relationship.
He sounds, just, really confused. Much more confused than you. Like, epically confused.
And I have only ever ONCE heard someone say that they need to be in love to have sex.... and that was from a 49 year old man who had never been married and who was actually a total baby with big commitment issues.
All of my solid, normal relationships.... nobody ever had to say that- we were falling in love, or thinking that we were falling- no question.... the sex and relationship happened easily, we tried it, it didn't work....
He says that he has to be in love, but that it will happen soon? In my experience FALLING head over into love, is just as strong as being in love. If he says it will happen soon, it means it hasn't happened. And I think that 3 months is enough time to know.
posted by misspony at 11:25 AM on June 21, 2014 [4 favorites]
This guy really doesn't sound ready for a relationship.
He sounds, just, really confused. Much more confused than you. Like, epically confused.
And I have only ever ONCE heard someone say that they need to be in love to have sex.... and that was from a 49 year old man who had never been married and who was actually a total baby with big commitment issues.
All of my solid, normal relationships.... nobody ever had to say that- we were falling in love, or thinking that we were falling- no question.... the sex and relationship happened easily, we tried it, it didn't work....
He says that he has to be in love, but that it will happen soon? In my experience FALLING head over into love, is just as strong as being in love. If he says it will happen soon, it means it hasn't happened. And I think that 3 months is enough time to know.
posted by misspony at 11:25 AM on June 21, 2014 [4 favorites]
he thinks we are almost in a relationship
He's a game player.
Also, you sound really young and inexperienced vis a vie relationships. Particularly with that in mind, the age gap seems like it is not helping you at all. I would tell him that if you're only seeing each other casually, you're going to start seeing other people again and then start dating.
posted by arnicae at 11:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
He's a game player.
Also, you sound really young and inexperienced vis a vie relationships. Particularly with that in mind, the age gap seems like it is not helping you at all. I would tell him that if you're only seeing each other casually, you're going to start seeing other people again and then start dating.
posted by arnicae at 11:31 AM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
If you have to play games, it's not a good relationship and it's not likely to be a good relationship. Unless you want a lifetime of game-playing, which some people do.
posted by warriorqueen at 11:40 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by warriorqueen at 11:40 AM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
You're almost in a relationship according to him? That means you're not at all in a relationship and he's either saying that because he's trying to string you along or because he thinks that's what you want to hear, given your apparent dedication to him. I think I'd prefer being single.
posted by destructive cactus at 11:43 AM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by destructive cactus at 11:43 AM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
You've known him since February, and have seen him about once every two weeks --- so that comes to maybe a dozen dates, right? And he's 'flaked' on you (personally I'd call his actions dumping) three times. So that means he's dumping you about 25% of the time!
That's 25% percent of your scheduled, agreed-upon dates, in what is still the honeymoon phase of your relationship, when people are on their BEST behavior: this dude isn't "going through a phase", he's just a rude self-centered jerk who obviously doesn't care for you NEARLY as much as you care for him.
Please dump him for good, you deserve much better than this guy will ever be.
posted by easily confused at 12:07 PM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
That's 25% percent of your scheduled, agreed-upon dates, in what is still the honeymoon phase of your relationship, when people are on their BEST behavior: this dude isn't "going through a phase", he's just a rude self-centered jerk who obviously doesn't care for you NEARLY as much as you care for him.
Please dump him for good, you deserve much better than this guy will ever be.
posted by easily confused at 12:07 PM on June 21, 2014 [3 favorites]
You've seen each other 10 times and he's stood you up 3 times already? Not good. If he flakes out 30% of the time now, imagine what he'd be like in a long term relationship.
I feel like he thinks i am always available for him, and always forgive him and he takes advantage of that, but i am not sure and can't see this situation clearly.
I think you are seeing this clearly but it's not the answer you're hoping for. You need to move on.
posted by sfkiddo at 12:17 PM on June 21, 2014
I feel like he thinks i am always available for him, and always forgive him and he takes advantage of that, but i am not sure and can't see this situation clearly.
I think you are seeing this clearly but it's not the answer you're hoping for. You need to move on.
posted by sfkiddo at 12:17 PM on June 21, 2014
Best answer: He didn't forget about your date. He ignored your date. Stop making excuses for this behavior. He is not treating you with kindness or respect and you deserve more. You will find more.
Please, stop contacting him immediately. You...no-one...deserves such treatment.
Forget this ass and move on.
posted by kinetic at 12:51 PM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
Please, stop contacting him immediately. You...no-one...deserves such treatment.
Forget this ass and move on.
posted by kinetic at 12:51 PM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
I hate that my mom was right about this and fought it like a big dog most of my life but she was right and so I share this with you: "If someone wants to be with you, they will. No matter what's going on in their life, they'll make space for you." and all the excuses I made for all the men who didn't want to be with me was just me trying to save myself from heartache.
If he wants to be with you, he will be. The proof (or lack thereof) is before your eyes. I wish I had accepted this at age 23 rather than much later on.
posted by Mysticalchick at 1:52 PM on June 21, 2014 [9 favorites]
If he wants to be with you, he will be. The proof (or lack thereof) is before your eyes. I wish I had accepted this at age 23 rather than much later on.
posted by Mysticalchick at 1:52 PM on June 21, 2014 [9 favorites]
Oh gosh, no Sweetie, this guy is not as into you as you are into him.
I'm sorry, that sucks. Not only is he flaking and acting like a jerk, but you're making as many excuses as he is. I'm glad you can step back and see that this isn't going to work as it sits today.
I would like to tell you that dating the right person does not involve Voo-Doo or divination. You don't have to cast the runes to know that you are not on this guy's mind the way he's on yours.
Chemistry is fine, but you can have chemistry with lots of people. It's not 10% of a good relationship though. Chemistry gets you through the door, how someone treats you is WAY more important. As great as this guy might be, he's not good to you or FOR you.
So, please call him and tell him that while you really like him, that his behavior is telling you that he's not in the right place to date you now. Wish him luck and that's that. Go to the event with a good friend.
Be sure to go no contact and block him on social media. It may seem extreme, but it's too easy for the camel to get his nose under the tent flap because just deciding to part ways is a lot friendlier than burning his shit on the lawn.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 2:06 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
I'm sorry, that sucks. Not only is he flaking and acting like a jerk, but you're making as many excuses as he is. I'm glad you can step back and see that this isn't going to work as it sits today.
I would like to tell you that dating the right person does not involve Voo-Doo or divination. You don't have to cast the runes to know that you are not on this guy's mind the way he's on yours.
Chemistry is fine, but you can have chemistry with lots of people. It's not 10% of a good relationship though. Chemistry gets you through the door, how someone treats you is WAY more important. As great as this guy might be, he's not good to you or FOR you.
So, please call him and tell him that while you really like him, that his behavior is telling you that he's not in the right place to date you now. Wish him luck and that's that. Go to the event with a good friend.
Be sure to go no contact and block him on social media. It may seem extreme, but it's too easy for the camel to get his nose under the tent flap because just deciding to part ways is a lot friendlier than burning his shit on the lawn.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 2:06 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
he invited me for dinner at his place but cancelled because of work. He told me that he lives with random people and is moving soon, but last week he let it slip that he lives with his older brother who has a family but i didn't realise until later..
Oh Jesus.
Sorry, but there' s like a 99% percent chance that this guy is married. Or living with someone. Or whatever.
But the situation you're describing is, in any case, someone who is not worthy of your attention.
posted by kinetic at 2:49 PM on June 21, 2014 [14 favorites]
Oh Jesus.
Sorry, but there' s like a 99% percent chance that this guy is married. Or living with someone. Or whatever.
But the situation you're describing is, in any case, someone who is not worthy of your attention.
posted by kinetic at 2:49 PM on June 21, 2014 [14 favorites]
This is far too much work for a relationship that is not yet actually an exclusive pairing. Tell him you wish him well and move on. It will only get worse, particularly if you keep enabling his behavior by wholesale accepting his excuses.
Trust me. Been there. Seven years later, it only got worse. Get out now.
posted by AthenaPolias at 3:00 PM on June 21, 2014
Trust me. Been there. Seven years later, it only got worse. Get out now.
posted by AthenaPolias at 3:00 PM on June 21, 2014
Best answer: Um, I'm sorry! HAVE YOU READ WHAT YOU FREAKIN' WROTE AS AN UPDATE?!?!
This guy has been lying to you about his living situation, and I am sure heaps of other things. He cancels when seeing you might reveal the truth.
He's a child. He's not mature enough to date anyone. Hon, he has long distance relationships to avoid real intimacy.
This person is wholly unavailable to you. You will NEVER earn his trust. You can't fix him!!
This is a dynamic that nice people fall for. Every time you encounter this "I'm too damaged to trust please give me time" bullshit, I want you to RUN RUN RUN.
You can't fix him, and the this wounded puppy bullshit is how weak manipulative types get other people (like you) to carry the weight of their responsibilities.
Yuk. Put down this guy's burdens. Put yourself first.
He boasts nothing but unhealthy relationships. He is not capable of a healthy relationship. All the signs are there.
Sorry.
posted by jbenben at 4:26 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
This guy has been lying to you about his living situation, and I am sure heaps of other things. He cancels when seeing you might reveal the truth.
He's a child. He's not mature enough to date anyone. Hon, he has long distance relationships to avoid real intimacy.
This person is wholly unavailable to you. You will NEVER earn his trust. You can't fix him!!
This is a dynamic that nice people fall for. Every time you encounter this "I'm too damaged to trust please give me time" bullshit, I want you to RUN RUN RUN.
You can't fix him, and the this wounded puppy bullshit is how weak manipulative types get other people (like you) to carry the weight of their responsibilities.
Yuk. Put down this guy's burdens. Put yourself first.
He boasts nothing but unhealthy relationships. He is not capable of a healthy relationship. All the signs are there.
Sorry.
posted by jbenben at 4:26 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: He told me he went to a spa instead, so it wasn't like he was home depressed, but I do think he could be a bit depressed, he admitted it to me even.
I doubt he is in a relationship, he does online dating which is how we met and it is very easy to find that out, he is still online but I took mine down a long time ago (not because of him but for other reasons).
Thank you for the replies, they've helped immensely.
posted by aivilo91 at 5:25 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
I doubt he is in a relationship, he does online dating which is how we met and it is very easy to find that out, he is still online but I took mine down a long time ago (not because of him but for other reasons).
Thank you for the replies, they've helped immensely.
posted by aivilo91 at 5:25 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
I feel like you think your updates are good reasons he has been acting like this when actually they are just more red flags. He didn't just forget your date, he actually did something fun instead? He still uses his online dating account? He won't say you're dating? He lied about where he lives and who he lives with? You aren't this guy's only girlfriend. You should just fade out of his life because he's going to bring nothing but trouble and sad feelings to yours.
Seriously, it's summer (in the Northern hemisphere) and you're 23. Hang out on the beach and drink mojitos and forget about this man.
posted by Snarl Furillo at 5:44 PM on June 21, 2014 [10 favorites]
Seriously, it's summer (in the Northern hemisphere) and you're 23. Hang out on the beach and drink mojitos and forget about this man.
posted by Snarl Furillo at 5:44 PM on June 21, 2014 [10 favorites]
A guy who's couch surfing because he has nowhere to live can afford to go to a spa?
C'mon sister, this guy is feeding you the biggest load of crap ever.
Also, i would be fine with flakiness once in a while if he had a valid excuse, but what upsets me is that we only see each other twice a month, so I've only seen him around 10 times since february.
He DOES have a valid excuse.
He's married.
posted by kinetic at 6:33 PM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
C'mon sister, this guy is feeding you the biggest load of crap ever.
Also, i would be fine with flakiness once in a while if he had a valid excuse, but what upsets me is that we only see each other twice a month, so I've only seen him around 10 times since february.
He DOES have a valid excuse.
He's married.
posted by kinetic at 6:33 PM on June 21, 2014 [8 favorites]
I think this dude really does like you and is not a deliberate game-player
I would like to note that I posted this before I found out he lied about where he lived. This dude is a huge game player, and he is not "flaking," he is lying to you. However, my other advice, which echoes basically everyone else in this thread, stays the same.
Homeboy is so not worth the tiny speck of time he's willing to give you (and withhold arbitrarily), no matter what the bullshit reality behind the excuses and lies and sweet almost-commitments he makes. Don't keep playing Nancy Drew on this one, just walk away.
posted by Juliet Banana at 7:04 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
I would like to note that I posted this before I found out he lied about where he lived. This dude is a huge game player, and he is not "flaking," he is lying to you. However, my other advice, which echoes basically everyone else in this thread, stays the same.
Homeboy is so not worth the tiny speck of time he's willing to give you (and withhold arbitrarily), no matter what the bullshit reality behind the excuses and lies and sweet almost-commitments he makes. Don't keep playing Nancy Drew on this one, just walk away.
posted by Juliet Banana at 7:04 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
Should i go to this event with him and after that painfully just move on, or should i wait and see if things do improve?
Neither, especially since it's a likely possibility that he won't even show up.
Especially in the beginning, if it's this hard, it's probably not worth it.
posted by sm1tten at 7:27 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
Neither, especially since it's a likely possibility that he won't even show up.
Especially in the beginning, if it's this hard, it's probably not worth it.
posted by sm1tten at 7:27 PM on June 21, 2014 [1 favorite]
Have you ever completely forgotten about something you were really looking forward to? Me either. Certainly not 3 times.
My money's on married too. That could explain the flakiness - he flakes when he can't get away without being found out. That can come on suddenly.
But that's just speculating wildly. The important thing here is, this guy's either not that into you or just not available and ready for you, whether physically or emotionally.
posted by ctmf at 10:52 PM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
My money's on married too. That could explain the flakiness - he flakes when he can't get away without being found out. That can come on suddenly.
But that's just speculating wildly. The important thing here is, this guy's either not that into you or just not available and ready for you, whether physically or emotionally.
posted by ctmf at 10:52 PM on June 21, 2014 [6 favorites]
I totally missed that he was married. I originally did not say so, but I was thinking he was dating someone else, just did not say it outright to be kind, OP.
It was the detail about going to a spa that put me over the top.
Yeah. Married or heavy committed.
I'm so sorry.
Block this guy EVERYWHERE and move on with your bad self!!
posted by jbenben at 11:48 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
It was the detail about going to a spa that put me over the top.
Yeah. Married or heavy committed.
I'm so sorry.
Block this guy EVERYWHERE and move on with your bad self!!
posted by jbenben at 11:48 PM on June 21, 2014 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: I woke up calm today and decided it isn't going to work, all the answers were so good so thank you.
posted by aivilo91 at 12:48 AM on June 22, 2014 [9 favorites]
posted by aivilo91 at 12:48 AM on June 22, 2014 [9 favorites]
Best answer: OP, glad to hear about your latest update. I just wanted to address some dating/relationship habits first
Chemistry - You can get that with other people. And just because you have chemistry doesn't mean that you should date them or be in a relationship with them if it leads down an unhealthy path. I've completely cut off a date at the 4th date mark despite chemistry because the amount of red flags was just crazy making waiting to make me miserable.
Time - You should value your own time more. It's easy to get caught into the habit of seeing your current date (especially when you have good chemistry) as your only shot at romance, but the opportunity cost isn't zero. The opportunity cost is a.) being a happy and healthy single person b.) the energy/time to spend looking for significantly more compatible partners.
What a good date/partner is like - S/he considers your feelings, respects your time, respects your hurt feelings and doesn't try to minimize them. S/he acknowledges ways that s/he can improve if s/he has failed you in anyway, and will work towards them. S/he will be willing to talk about how to make the dates/relationship better without feeling defensive. S/he works WITH you, not against you.
I've never had to rely on "games" or socially-approved forms of manipulation to have the relationships I've had now. It's so cliche but, healthy relationships are built on good communication, and not on the initial chase. If you have to "chase" your date/partner in a specific way that doesn't seem natural, well it sounds like you're probably not compatible after all.
If you have to fight for dating/relationship milestones instead of it just happening naturally (e.g. the exclusivity talk, seeing each other regularly and reliably, being in an actual relationship), then it's not meant to be.
Congratulations on your choice. Dating much more reliable people is gonna be so much more fun, I promise.
posted by Hawk V at 6:22 AM on June 23, 2014 [5 favorites]
Chemistry - You can get that with other people. And just because you have chemistry doesn't mean that you should date them or be in a relationship with them if it leads down an unhealthy path. I've completely cut off a date at the 4th date mark despite chemistry because the amount of red flags was just crazy making waiting to make me miserable.
Time - You should value your own time more. It's easy to get caught into the habit of seeing your current date (especially when you have good chemistry) as your only shot at romance, but the opportunity cost isn't zero. The opportunity cost is a.) being a happy and healthy single person b.) the energy/time to spend looking for significantly more compatible partners.
What a good date/partner is like - S/he considers your feelings, respects your time, respects your hurt feelings and doesn't try to minimize them. S/he acknowledges ways that s/he can improve if s/he has failed you in anyway, and will work towards them. S/he will be willing to talk about how to make the dates/relationship better without feeling defensive. S/he works WITH you, not against you.
I've never had to rely on "games" or socially-approved forms of manipulation to have the relationships I've had now. It's so cliche but, healthy relationships are built on good communication, and not on the initial chase. If you have to "chase" your date/partner in a specific way that doesn't seem natural, well it sounds like you're probably not compatible after all.
If you have to fight for dating/relationship milestones instead of it just happening naturally (e.g. the exclusivity talk, seeing each other regularly and reliably, being in an actual relationship), then it's not meant to be.
Congratulations on your choice. Dating much more reliable people is gonna be so much more fun, I promise.
posted by Hawk V at 6:22 AM on June 23, 2014 [5 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
I would be annoyed if someone flaked on me by forgetting about an agreed upon get together that they initiated even ~once~, let alone the several times you've given him. I also have a low tolerance to being strung along, due to past relationships where I've given multiple chances (a ridiculous number of them) only to find out that they'd lied to me about why they flaked (usually because they were seeing someone else).
I'd be really leery in your shoes.
posted by Meep! Eek! at 10:01 AM on June 21, 2014 [7 favorites]