The ghost of Christmas Past came calling. Now what?
June 3, 2014 8:10 PM Subscribe
My best friend and I had a big, ugly, dramatic falling out six years ago and we haven't spoken since. Today, out of the blue, she cold calls me at work to say hello and asks if we can meet for dinner. I'm not sure what I want to do. Wall of text inside.
Six years ago my best friend who I'd known for 20 years (since middle school) was going through a bitter divorce. At the time she was a stay-at-home mom of two small kids, ages 3 and 5. She'd been unhappy in her marriage for a while and she would call me daily, sometimes several times a day, to cry, vent, or talk about an ongoing crush she had on a man she knew from her town.
The crush turned into a full-blown affair, which went on for about six months before her husband discovered what was going on. He was devastated and wanted to try to make the marriage work. She wanted to be with the other man and she and her husband divorced after a lengthy battle over custody and financial arrangements. It got ugly.
She was not at her best during this time and a lot of her friendships and relationships with her family members took a hit. I was angry at her for how selfish she was being and we had a number of big arguments over the whole situation.
The guy she had the affair with (and who she is still with today) had a really unsavory background. When their affair began he had just been disbarred from practicing law after it was discovered that he had siphoned 300K from his clients. That, and a number of other things, made me really question his character and her judgment.
We stopped talking after a huge argument and since then we have had no contact. It took me about a year to really come to terms with losing that friendship, but once I did, I was okay and moved forward with my life. Looking back on it, I realized that (even before the affair situation) the friendship was not a healthy one for me and that it always seemed like she took way more than she gave. She unloaded a lot of her emotional drama on me but didn't allow space for me to do the same.
Six years later I'm in a pretty good place. I've gotten married, have a career I like, and have some really good friendships. She has also moved forward in some ways - though she is still with the unsavory character. She has a good career, her kids are growing up, and she seemed to be happy with her life. Granted, this was what I gathered from a ten minute conversation.
I am not angry with her for any of this. I realize now that people behave in all sorts of irrational ways in the midst of affairs and divorce. And I also recognize that I was not as kind or compassionate as I could have been at the time.
But it's six years on and I've gotten to a better place in my life. She totally caught me off guard by calling me at work after all this time, and frankly, I wish she had chosen to email me so I wouldn't have been put on the spot. We talked for a bit and then she asked if we could meet up for dinner in a couple of weeks. I said yes, but now I'm rethinking it and I don't know if I want to re-open that can of worms.
Should I give her a chance? On the one hand, it's just a dinner and she may just want to explain what happened from her point of view. On the other hand, this was all very painful for me and a large part of me doesn't want to re-visit all of this. But there's that nagging voice that says I miss having a best friend (even if this friendship wasn't a healthy one), and what if I'm making a decision based on fear?
What would you do?
Six years ago my best friend who I'd known for 20 years (since middle school) was going through a bitter divorce. At the time she was a stay-at-home mom of two small kids, ages 3 and 5. She'd been unhappy in her marriage for a while and she would call me daily, sometimes several times a day, to cry, vent, or talk about an ongoing crush she had on a man she knew from her town.
The crush turned into a full-blown affair, which went on for about six months before her husband discovered what was going on. He was devastated and wanted to try to make the marriage work. She wanted to be with the other man and she and her husband divorced after a lengthy battle over custody and financial arrangements. It got ugly.
She was not at her best during this time and a lot of her friendships and relationships with her family members took a hit. I was angry at her for how selfish she was being and we had a number of big arguments over the whole situation.
The guy she had the affair with (and who she is still with today) had a really unsavory background. When their affair began he had just been disbarred from practicing law after it was discovered that he had siphoned 300K from his clients. That, and a number of other things, made me really question his character and her judgment.
We stopped talking after a huge argument and since then we have had no contact. It took me about a year to really come to terms with losing that friendship, but once I did, I was okay and moved forward with my life. Looking back on it, I realized that (even before the affair situation) the friendship was not a healthy one for me and that it always seemed like she took way more than she gave. She unloaded a lot of her emotional drama on me but didn't allow space for me to do the same.
Six years later I'm in a pretty good place. I've gotten married, have a career I like, and have some really good friendships. She has also moved forward in some ways - though she is still with the unsavory character. She has a good career, her kids are growing up, and she seemed to be happy with her life. Granted, this was what I gathered from a ten minute conversation.
I am not angry with her for any of this. I realize now that people behave in all sorts of irrational ways in the midst of affairs and divorce. And I also recognize that I was not as kind or compassionate as I could have been at the time.
But it's six years on and I've gotten to a better place in my life. She totally caught me off guard by calling me at work after all this time, and frankly, I wish she had chosen to email me so I wouldn't have been put on the spot. We talked for a bit and then she asked if we could meet up for dinner in a couple of weeks. I said yes, but now I'm rethinking it and I don't know if I want to re-open that can of worms.
Should I give her a chance? On the one hand, it's just a dinner and she may just want to explain what happened from her point of view. On the other hand, this was all very painful for me and a large part of me doesn't want to re-visit all of this. But there's that nagging voice that says I miss having a best friend (even if this friendship wasn't a healthy one), and what if I'm making a decision based on fear?
What would you do?
How did it feel when you were talking? Were you glad to be reconnecting? Or just awkward and apprehensive?
It sounds like you were not happy to hear from her. It's ok if you don't want to reconnect. (But it's also ok if you want to defer the decision until after the dinner. The dinner invitation may be more her wanting to explain than trying to strike the friendship back up.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 8:16 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
It sounds like you were not happy to hear from her. It's ok if you don't want to reconnect. (But it's also ok if you want to defer the decision until after the dinner. The dinner invitation may be more her wanting to explain than trying to strike the friendship back up.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 8:16 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
Go to dinner with her *then* decide if you want to re-establish the friendship. You don't have to make that decision right now. If you don't at least meet with her you'll always wonder what she might have had to say.
posted by ThatCanadianGirl at 8:20 PM on June 3, 2014
posted by ThatCanadianGirl at 8:20 PM on June 3, 2014
Best answer: If you feel comfortable, ask if you could try coffee or a drink first instead. I'm about 1.5 years into a similar estrangement, and I would want an easier escape hatch than a dinner would provide.
posted by sallybrown at 8:25 PM on June 3, 2014 [19 favorites]
posted by sallybrown at 8:25 PM on June 3, 2014 [19 favorites]
What's the worst that can happen if you go to dinner? RIGHT AWAY after, sit is your car close your eyes and just check in with your body to see how you feel being around her energy again, or it that is too weird, just write a bit about it. I am leaning towards moving on from this relationship, so I say be careful she could be toxic. but i have no idea, and no bad could come from seeing her. it could be great and you get your friend back. but this biz about this douche bag, ehh i don't know, i mean why does she want to be around this jerk?
posted by TRUELOTUS at 8:29 PM on June 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by TRUELOTUS at 8:29 PM on June 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
yay! coffee so smart and have another appointment after, quick out!
posted by TRUELOTUS at 8:30 PM on June 3, 2014
posted by TRUELOTUS at 8:30 PM on June 3, 2014
I would give her a chance, in that going to dinner and catching up is a chance.
You don't have to have her in your life if you don't want to. You don't have to be close to her, or let her drama into your life, or be her shoulder to cry on.
But considering she did nothing to you other than be too much for you to handle half a decade ago, and you've known her since childhood, yeah, have dinner.
posted by Sara C. at 8:30 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
You don't have to have her in your life if you don't want to. You don't have to be close to her, or let her drama into your life, or be her shoulder to cry on.
But considering she did nothing to you other than be too much for you to handle half a decade ago, and you've known her since childhood, yeah, have dinner.
posted by Sara C. at 8:30 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
Yup, have dinner and see how you feel. No reason to tie yourself in knots before you've gotten together with her.
posted by xingcat at 8:33 PM on June 3, 2014
posted by xingcat at 8:33 PM on June 3, 2014
Best answer: No need to have dinner right away. Or ever. You could catch up over the phone with her sometime when you are 1) not at work and 2) not being put on the spot. In other words, on your own terms.
"But there's that nagging voice that says I miss having a best friend (even if this friendship wasn't a healthy one)"
She was never a true "best friend," nor even a healthy person to involve yourself with, because, as you said:
"Looking back on it, I realized that (even before the affair situation) the friendship was not a healthy one for me and that it always seemed like she took way more than she gave. She unloaded a lot of her emotional drama on me but didn't allow space for me to do the same."
"and what if I'm making a decision based on fear?"
So what if fear is part of your decision-making process? Last I checked, wanting to protect yourself from foreseeable pain is a GOOD thing. The negative reaction you had - that made you write an AskMe - when she cold called you at work, out of the blue, without emailing first, and put you on the spot ... that's your best self saying "proceed with caution." Take this slooooow.
Just because she is in a hurry to get back in your life and have a big long catch-up dinner with you does not mean you need to be in a hurry to do any of that, too. You get to choose the pace, and this idea sounds out of your comfort zone.
posted by hush at 8:37 PM on June 3, 2014 [15 favorites]
"But there's that nagging voice that says I miss having a best friend (even if this friendship wasn't a healthy one)"
She was never a true "best friend," nor even a healthy person to involve yourself with, because, as you said:
"Looking back on it, I realized that (even before the affair situation) the friendship was not a healthy one for me and that it always seemed like she took way more than she gave. She unloaded a lot of her emotional drama on me but didn't allow space for me to do the same."
"and what if I'm making a decision based on fear?"
So what if fear is part of your decision-making process? Last I checked, wanting to protect yourself from foreseeable pain is a GOOD thing. The negative reaction you had - that made you write an AskMe - when she cold called you at work, out of the blue, without emailing first, and put you on the spot ... that's your best self saying "proceed with caution." Take this slooooow.
Just because she is in a hurry to get back in your life and have a big long catch-up dinner with you does not mean you need to be in a hurry to do any of that, too. You get to choose the pace, and this idea sounds out of your comfort zone.
posted by hush at 8:37 PM on June 3, 2014 [15 favorites]
I would probably meet up with her on nothing if more than morbid curiosity to see how everything had turned out, but I certainly would not be rushing back into a sisterly bond of any sort.
But I am a bit of a bitch, with no tolerance for affairs.
posted by celtalitha at 8:37 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
But I am a bit of a bitch, with no tolerance for affairs.
posted by celtalitha at 8:37 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
Best answer: To me it sounds like you have put it all behind and don't want her to be part of your life. You have no obligation to meet her, to listen to her or whatever. If you don't want to, don't go. People grow apart, it's a normal part of life.
Let her know something about your thought process: "Your call the other day caught me off guard and I initially agreed to meet. However, I realized that over the course of the last 6 years, I rarely thought of you. Frankly, I didn't miss our old friendship. Don't take it the wrong way, I am glad to hear that you're doing good career-wise, are happy and the kids are fine, but I don't see any way forward with our friendship. Thanks for reaching out. Best to you and yours.."
I would avoid mentioning anything about the past or your opinion about her or her partner. Good luck.
(Yes, I am straightforward like that. No regrets.)
posted by travelwithcats at 8:38 PM on June 3, 2014 [16 favorites]
Let her know something about your thought process: "Your call the other day caught me off guard and I initially agreed to meet. However, I realized that over the course of the last 6 years, I rarely thought of you. Frankly, I didn't miss our old friendship. Don't take it the wrong way, I am glad to hear that you're doing good career-wise, are happy and the kids are fine, but I don't see any way forward with our friendship. Thanks for reaching out. Best to you and yours.."
I would avoid mentioning anything about the past or your opinion about her or her partner. Good luck.
(Yes, I am straightforward like that. No regrets.)
posted by travelwithcats at 8:38 PM on June 3, 2014 [16 favorites]
I'd say skip the dinner and don't bother with coffee or whatever other alternative. It sounds as though you've long since wrapped up this friendship in a way that was satisfactory to you; you acknowledge that you may not have known the full story where your friend was concerned, but you haven't really been pining to know that story, anyway. From what you've said, she sounds like an unpleasant and high-drama person-- but even if this dinner revealed her to be a saint (and it's far likelier you'd just be in for more self-justification and emotional energy-sucking on her part), you have plenty of existing friendships already, don't you? Who cares about dredging up and reanimating this particular tired, suboptimal relationship from your distant past?
Maybe the risks of the dinner would be low, but the potential benefits seem nonexistent, given that you're perfectly happy with your life as it is-- and especially since just talking to her on the phone seems to have been mildly upsetting to you. You don't have to turn her down flat, but if it were me I'd find myself suddenly too busy for new social engagements for the foreseeable future.
posted by Bardolph at 8:42 PM on June 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
Maybe the risks of the dinner would be low, but the potential benefits seem nonexistent, given that you're perfectly happy with your life as it is-- and especially since just talking to her on the phone seems to have been mildly upsetting to you. You don't have to turn her down flat, but if it were me I'd find myself suddenly too busy for new social engagements for the foreseeable future.
posted by Bardolph at 8:42 PM on June 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
I have a similar situation in my life, and I've often wondered to myself what I would do in exactly this situation.
I think that you've glossed over some important details. You don't need to elaborate them to us, but you need to be honest with yourself about them - namely, do you feel that you respected her, as a person, before all the ugliness happened? Are you convinced that she respected you? Finally, if it turns out that she is exactly the same person she was the last time that you knew her, would you want her in your life?
In my case, the falling out occured because my friend did not respect some choices that I'd made in my life. Rather than have a frank and caring conversation with me about it, as I would want from a friend, she manufactured a different conflict with me, and then cited that conflict as her reason to break her relationship with me.
After some time had passed, I realized what had happened, and I decided that I would never be able to trust her again. So, if she called me today, I might possibly go to dinner (coffee is better) to satisfy my curiosity, but I would not make room for her in my life again.
Basically, I think it's very rare to be able to trust someone again who has betrayed you. As always, ymmv.
posted by vignettist at 8:54 PM on June 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
I think that you've glossed over some important details. You don't need to elaborate them to us, but you need to be honest with yourself about them - namely, do you feel that you respected her, as a person, before all the ugliness happened? Are you convinced that she respected you? Finally, if it turns out that she is exactly the same person she was the last time that you knew her, would you want her in your life?
In my case, the falling out occured because my friend did not respect some choices that I'd made in my life. Rather than have a frank and caring conversation with me about it, as I would want from a friend, she manufactured a different conflict with me, and then cited that conflict as her reason to break her relationship with me.
After some time had passed, I realized what had happened, and I decided that I would never be able to trust her again. So, if she called me today, I might possibly go to dinner (coffee is better) to satisfy my curiosity, but I would not make room for her in my life again.
Basically, I think it's very rare to be able to trust someone again who has betrayed you. As always, ymmv.
posted by vignettist at 8:54 PM on June 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
For god's sake, go to dinner. Yes, you've moved on blah blah blah. Life's too fucking short to stay angry, or meh, or whatever. If no connection re-forms, so be it.
Always, always err on the side of friendship and kindness.
posted by notsnot at 9:05 PM on June 3, 2014 [12 favorites]
Always, always err on the side of friendship and kindness.
posted by notsnot at 9:05 PM on June 3, 2014 [12 favorites]
Always, always err on the side of friendship and kindness.
...Unless you know for a fact she has the potential of being argumentative/running over your boundaries/being a source of drama again.
But there's only one way to find out.
I'd say go to dinner, but have "an appointment/obligation" for after, so you don't end up getting wrapped into things.
Don't divulge too much info. Don't ask for too much. Don't apologize. Don't ask for one, either. Just shoot the shit like you would if you were acquaintances. Because you kind of are.
posted by functionequalsform at 9:10 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
...Unless you know for a fact she has the potential of being argumentative/running over your boundaries/being a source of drama again.
But there's only one way to find out.
I'd say go to dinner, but have "an appointment/obligation" for after, so you don't end up getting wrapped into things.
Don't divulge too much info. Don't ask for too much. Don't apologize. Don't ask for one, either. Just shoot the shit like you would if you were acquaintances. Because you kind of are.
posted by functionequalsform at 9:10 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
Life is so short. When you consider that fact, do you feel like this relationship is a waste of precious time, or does the idea of living the rest of your life without her make you sad?
Also consider that it is entirely possible to reconcile yet not be close again. I reconciled with a former best friend after a falling out, and now our relationship consists entirely of commenting on each other's facebook pages and liking photos of each other's kids. I'm very ok with that.
posted by gatorae at 9:14 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
Also consider that it is entirely possible to reconcile yet not be close again. I reconciled with a former best friend after a falling out, and now our relationship consists entirely of commenting on each other's facebook pages and liking photos of each other's kids. I'm very ok with that.
posted by gatorae at 9:14 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Nope.
I was prepared to give her the benefit of the doubt because having young children is difficult and I have EVERY reason to deduce that hormones and maybe a bit of untreated PPD made her do some crazy shit...
BUT
She's still with a sneaky user, she was an immature (and possibly emotional vampire) type back in the day, and lord knows what manipulative crap she's picked up from living with her new man.
Follow your gut.
The answer is: NO.
(Go ahead and see her if you feel you can remain dispassionate. But she's no longer "friend material" long term whether you see her this one time or not.)
posted by jbenben at 10:06 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
I was prepared to give her the benefit of the doubt because having young children is difficult and I have EVERY reason to deduce that hormones and maybe a bit of untreated PPD made her do some crazy shit...
BUT
She's still with a sneaky user, she was an immature (and possibly emotional vampire) type back in the day, and lord knows what manipulative crap she's picked up from living with her new man.
Follow your gut.
The answer is: NO.
(Go ahead and see her if you feel you can remain dispassionate. But she's no longer "friend material" long term whether you see her this one time or not.)
posted by jbenben at 10:06 PM on June 3, 2014 [4 favorites]
I would go. I try never to slam shut a door unless I know what's on the other side.
posted by clarkstonian at 10:16 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by clarkstonian at 10:16 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
I'd go but only if she initiates the arrangements/scheduling.
posted by spunweb at 10:40 PM on June 3, 2014
posted by spunweb at 10:40 PM on June 3, 2014
Best answer: Having been in a roughly similar situation, I agree with travelingwithcats. You've moved on, you did a lot of work to move on, and you're doing well. It sounds like you are in a place where you can look back on the friendship and see the good, the bad, and the ugly, and come to rest on some memories of the good. I'd keep it that way, by letting it be a thing of the past.
The fact that she did call you at work and put you on the spot like that says, to me, that she's still not particularly sensitive to others or aware of fairly typical boundaries after all this time (who calls someone at work to break such an emotionally loaded and lengthy estrangement)? I would see that as a good sign that she's something of a continuing emotional risk.
To end it again, I would also let her know (in writing, not person) something about your thought process, and land on a final kind word. My email to my former friend was a bit different than the one travelingwithcats scripted, and went something like this:
Your call the other day caught me off guard. I am so glad to know you are doing well and it was good to hear your voice. However, I'm not up for meeting after all; it's not a good idea for me and not something I want. I'm at peace with keeping our friendship as a cherished memory. I don't hold any grudges about how it ended, but I don't see a path forward. Best wishes for the future, I hope all continues to go well for you.
posted by beanie at 10:43 PM on June 3, 2014 [23 favorites]
The fact that she did call you at work and put you on the spot like that says, to me, that she's still not particularly sensitive to others or aware of fairly typical boundaries after all this time (who calls someone at work to break such an emotionally loaded and lengthy estrangement)? I would see that as a good sign that she's something of a continuing emotional risk.
To end it again, I would also let her know (in writing, not person) something about your thought process, and land on a final kind word. My email to my former friend was a bit different than the one travelingwithcats scripted, and went something like this:
Your call the other day caught me off guard. I am so glad to know you are doing well and it was good to hear your voice. However, I'm not up for meeting after all; it's not a good idea for me and not something I want. I'm at peace with keeping our friendship as a cherished memory. I don't hold any grudges about how it ended, but I don't see a path forward. Best wishes for the future, I hope all continues to go well for you.
posted by beanie at 10:43 PM on June 3, 2014 [23 favorites]
Before any of the drama with her started, it sounds like the supportive aspect of the friendship wasn't a two-way street. Then, she made you her sounding board while burning her life down, drawing you into the chaos. It all blew up and you moved on, growing into a happy, accomplished person with a non-con-artist husband and emotionally healthy friends. You two are very different now.
If you want to go for a fun dose of nostalgia or out of curiosity, that's an option. But, I honestly don't think that there's much there for you beyond that. It's fine to say no thank you.
posted by quince at 11:27 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
If you want to go for a fun dose of nostalgia or out of curiosity, that's an option. But, I honestly don't think that there's much there for you beyond that. It's fine to say no thank you.
posted by quince at 11:27 PM on June 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
Personally I would go to dinner with her. It sounds like she was very unhappy before which might account for her taking too much energy from you. Maybe she wants to show you that six years on she is in a happier place, and maybe now there would be room for both of you in the friendship. If the dinner turns into another session of her venting about her situation and not listening to you then you can put the meeting down to gaining closure and leave it in your past.
I'm not criticising you, but it sounds like you weren't the best friend you could have been to her either. She was unhappy, going through the turmoil of an affair and then a divorce, and it sounds like you were very judgemental and not there for her like she needed you to be. That's ok, you were doing your best, but so was she I'd imagine. Sometimes we imagine that our best friends will be there for us no matter what and it hurts a lot to discover that's not true. So it might be a good opportunity for you both to see if you can pick things up again from a different place. I understand that you have reservations about her partner, but as he has stayed with her for six years it's possible that they've both found happiness and stability and she would like to show you that things have worked out ok.
I generally think you only regret the things you don't do, so rather than wondering if things might have worked out if you'd met her, I'd just meet her and then you'll know for sure how you feel about her now.
posted by billiebee at 2:28 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'm not criticising you, but it sounds like you weren't the best friend you could have been to her either. She was unhappy, going through the turmoil of an affair and then a divorce, and it sounds like you were very judgemental and not there for her like she needed you to be. That's ok, you were doing your best, but so was she I'd imagine. Sometimes we imagine that our best friends will be there for us no matter what and it hurts a lot to discover that's not true. So it might be a good opportunity for you both to see if you can pick things up again from a different place. I understand that you have reservations about her partner, but as he has stayed with her for six years it's possible that they've both found happiness and stability and she would like to show you that things have worked out ok.
I generally think you only regret the things you don't do, so rather than wondering if things might have worked out if you'd met her, I'd just meet her and then you'll know for sure how you feel about her now.
posted by billiebee at 2:28 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'd do coffee or lunch first; dinner is a bit more involvement, start simpler.
And remember, you do NOT have to resume this friendship exactly as it was: look at it as a brand-new relationship, not a continuation of an old one.
posted by easily confused at 2:33 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
And remember, you do NOT have to resume this friendship exactly as it was: look at it as a brand-new relationship, not a continuation of an old one.
posted by easily confused at 2:33 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Best answer: What would you do?
I would probably not go. It's possible she's changed, and that she's now someone you might want a relationship with. It's also possible that she hasn't changed, and is still no longer someone you want a relationship with.
Not going doesn't mean you hate her or think she's a terrible, awful person. It just means that you don't actually care that much, which is an OK thing. You don't have to care, especially about someone who treated you badly. You can just go on with your life, knowing that a particular person is likely to behave in a particular way and that that's not good for you.
Having a best friend is really nice. But this person wasn't a best friend. I don't know what the actual term for what this person was actually is, perhaps "best frenemy" or something? But knowing a lot about someone doesn't mean that they're actively good for you. Don't have people in your life who aren't actively good for you, just because they've been there for a long time.
As others have said, life is too short. Trust your gut, which seems to be telling you not to go. The only reason you've given for going is based on her and what she wants. You haven't said much about why you want to go, other than that you want a best friend. It seems that you know, deep down, that this person is not a suitable candidate for that job.
Please don't go just to see what happened after you left. She's not your personal soap opera.
posted by Solomon at 3:00 AM on June 4, 2014 [3 favorites]
I would probably not go. It's possible she's changed, and that she's now someone you might want a relationship with. It's also possible that she hasn't changed, and is still no longer someone you want a relationship with.
Not going doesn't mean you hate her or think she's a terrible, awful person. It just means that you don't actually care that much, which is an OK thing. You don't have to care, especially about someone who treated you badly. You can just go on with your life, knowing that a particular person is likely to behave in a particular way and that that's not good for you.
Having a best friend is really nice. But this person wasn't a best friend. I don't know what the actual term for what this person was actually is, perhaps "best frenemy" or something? But knowing a lot about someone doesn't mean that they're actively good for you. Don't have people in your life who aren't actively good for you, just because they've been there for a long time.
As others have said, life is too short. Trust your gut, which seems to be telling you not to go. The only reason you've given for going is based on her and what she wants. You haven't said much about why you want to go, other than that you want a best friend. It seems that you know, deep down, that this person is not a suitable candidate for that job.
Please don't go just to see what happened after you left. She's not your personal soap opera.
posted by Solomon at 3:00 AM on June 4, 2014 [3 favorites]
Best answer: I am you! Hello!
Similar situation - friends for years, very close. We were in our early 20s, and yes, she had children and was married. She too cheated on her husband with an odd character. Long story short, she would also offload on me one too many times and, yeah, we had a big fight which resulted in a fall-out of epic proportions.
She reached out to me five years later when she heard I got married and wanted "to hang". I didn't think there was any harm, even though I had stewed about our friendship ending, analysed the sequence of events and got over it. I hate drama, and she was one that brought drama into my life just by telling me her stories.
We went out for coffee and dessert. Reminisced and had a couple of laughs. Kept it light and "on the surface" Didn't discuss the fall out.
Turns out, 5 years is a lot of water under the bridge. In our "coffee talk" we didn't really have much in common with our interests. That was the last time I heard from her. We haven't reached out and that was almost 20 years ago. I never made an effort either, but I am glad for the closure.
All this to say: there is no harm in coffee. Keep it light. And, don't be surprised if you never hear from her again. Or, who knows, you might re-kindle something? Didn't work out for me. Things turn out like they are supposed to - in life and, evidently in friendships.
posted by MeatheadBrokeMyChair at 3:25 AM on June 4, 2014 [9 favorites]
Similar situation - friends for years, very close. We were in our early 20s, and yes, she had children and was married. She too cheated on her husband with an odd character. Long story short, she would also offload on me one too many times and, yeah, we had a big fight which resulted in a fall-out of epic proportions.
She reached out to me five years later when she heard I got married and wanted "to hang". I didn't think there was any harm, even though I had stewed about our friendship ending, analysed the sequence of events and got over it. I hate drama, and she was one that brought drama into my life just by telling me her stories.
We went out for coffee and dessert. Reminisced and had a couple of laughs. Kept it light and "on the surface" Didn't discuss the fall out.
Turns out, 5 years is a lot of water under the bridge. In our "coffee talk" we didn't really have much in common with our interests. That was the last time I heard from her. We haven't reached out and that was almost 20 years ago. I never made an effort either, but I am glad for the closure.
All this to say: there is no harm in coffee. Keep it light. And, don't be surprised if you never hear from her again. Or, who knows, you might re-kindle something? Didn't work out for me. Things turn out like they are supposed to - in life and, evidently in friendships.
posted by MeatheadBrokeMyChair at 3:25 AM on June 4, 2014 [9 favorites]
You stand nothing to gain, you've moved on and this wasn't a good fit to begin with. Don't fall into the trap of feeling you always have to be "nice" even when you don't want to be around someone.
Do you really want to risk getting sucked back into her vortex?
posted by spaltavian at 5:52 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
Do you really want to risk getting sucked back into her vortex?
posted by spaltavian at 5:52 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
Best answer: It's really great to have a friend that has known you for most of your life. BUT. Not if that person ends up being dysfunctional and drama filled and selfish, etc.
I get why you might think about reconnecting, but at the end of the day, if you don't want to, don't.
If she calls back to make those plans (and there's a 50% chance that she won't) you can say, "I've been giving it some thought, and while it sounds like things are going well for you, I'm in a good place with my life now, and I think it's best that we don't meet. I wish you all the best."
In 6 years, if you feel differently, you can call her.
If you do want to meet her, I agree, coffee would be the way to go.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 8:17 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
I get why you might think about reconnecting, but at the end of the day, if you don't want to, don't.
If she calls back to make those plans (and there's a 50% chance that she won't) you can say, "I've been giving it some thought, and while it sounds like things are going well for you, I'm in a good place with my life now, and I think it's best that we don't meet. I wish you all the best."
In 6 years, if you feel differently, you can call her.
If you do want to meet her, I agree, coffee would be the way to go.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 8:17 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
Geeze, do we not give people a chance to mature and evolve anymore?
Maybe she wants to apologise, or explain, or maybe she's a recovering addict and doing 12 steps or maybe she has a terminal illness or just wants to make peace but not resume the friendship. Coffee or a drink doesn't seem like a huge engagement to me (but then, neither does dinner.)
The only person making this about "should we be best friends again or not?" is you. You can have a meal or a drink, have a pleasant time (or not!) and not resume the friendship at all if that's what you want. You can also simply maintain a peripheral friendship if you want; you're allowed to have boundaries and the only way you're going to get "sucked in" is if you let youself get sucked in. You're an adult! With autonomy! Yay!
posted by DarlingBri at 8:26 AM on June 4, 2014 [5 favorites]
Maybe she wants to apologise, or explain, or maybe she's a recovering addict and doing 12 steps or maybe she has a terminal illness or just wants to make peace but not resume the friendship. Coffee or a drink doesn't seem like a huge engagement to me (but then, neither does dinner.)
The only person making this about "should we be best friends again or not?" is you. You can have a meal or a drink, have a pleasant time (or not!) and not resume the friendship at all if that's what you want. You can also simply maintain a peripheral friendship if you want; you're allowed to have boundaries and the only way you're going to get "sucked in" is if you let youself get sucked in. You're an adult! With autonomy! Yay!
posted by DarlingBri at 8:26 AM on June 4, 2014 [5 favorites]
If she's still with a shady character and called you out of the blue at work to put you on the spot for dinner, I'd wonder if she's not looking to get you involved in some shady business operations like pyramid marketing or worse.
I'd go for coffee but if she shows up with him or starts a business spiel I'd hit the eject button.
posted by winna at 8:38 AM on June 4, 2014 [5 favorites]
I'd go for coffee but if she shows up with him or starts a business spiel I'd hit the eject button.
posted by winna at 8:38 AM on June 4, 2014 [5 favorites]
Best answer: Been there, although the circumstances were different. My best friend and I had a huge, ridiculous falling out in our early twenties -- on the surface it was because I didn't want her inviting her disagreeable, unpleasant boyfriend along on a trip we'd planned, but the argument itself touched on some deep-seated, long-term resentments we both held and got ugly and hurtful. Overnight we went from being besties, hanging out several times a week, etc., to not talking at all.
I was hurt, but the change gave me an opportunity to evaluate the overall friendship and realize how toxic it had become for me. My inner "mean girl" really came out around her, and she constantly dealt with her low self-esteem by projecting her issues onto me and being emotionally manipulative. It was a huge mess, but I eventually found peace with it and stopped being angry.
About four years later, she emailed and asked if I'd meet her for dinner. She was about to move out of town. I went, it was awkward at first, but we soon fell into a lot of our old inside jokes and spent a few hours reminiscing, and that did a lot to clear the air.
We never see each other since we live so far away, but we're Facebook friends now. It's very casual. I would never, ever go back to being close with her -- I've forgiven her, but I'll never forget the true colors she showed. But for me, the casual acquaintanceship we have now brings me peace. This was someone I cared about a lot once upon a time.
YMMV, of course. For me it worked out well, and I'm glad I went.
posted by QuickedWeen at 8:42 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
I was hurt, but the change gave me an opportunity to evaluate the overall friendship and realize how toxic it had become for me. My inner "mean girl" really came out around her, and she constantly dealt with her low self-esteem by projecting her issues onto me and being emotionally manipulative. It was a huge mess, but I eventually found peace with it and stopped being angry.
About four years later, she emailed and asked if I'd meet her for dinner. She was about to move out of town. I went, it was awkward at first, but we soon fell into a lot of our old inside jokes and spent a few hours reminiscing, and that did a lot to clear the air.
We never see each other since we live so far away, but we're Facebook friends now. It's very casual. I would never, ever go back to being close with her -- I've forgiven her, but I'll never forget the true colors she showed. But for me, the casual acquaintanceship we have now brings me peace. This was someone I cared about a lot once upon a time.
YMMV, of course. For me it worked out well, and I'm glad I went.
posted by QuickedWeen at 8:42 AM on June 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
You're questioning whether you'd regret not meeting up, and you say you "miss having a best friend" - but in my opinion those have to be very different issues. You're definitely not going to "get your friend back" but that's not what this is about. You've moved on, and she's moved on (obviously she has or she would have said something years ago). If you reconciled, she wouldn't go back to being the good friend of 15+ years ago, but with any luck she's had some growing up and she wouldn't be the bad friend of 6 years ago either. She'll probably end up being more of a "person I used to know" than a real BFF kind of relationship.
I think part of it has to do with how good you are at recognizing an "ought to" versus a "want to" activity in general, and whether you think you'll be able to say no to this person if she decided she wants to "be friends" and she's trying to set up monthly lunch dates that you find kind of excruciating. If you don't think you're going to be good at saying no later, you might prefer to say no now just in case things were to develop awkwardly. But it's just as likely that things would go in a comfortable direction and there's no need to pre-worry. I think you should see her. It's frustrating, because you used to have closure, kind of, but now she's gone and wrecked it by calling you up today, so to re-closure the situation you'd probably be best off going and talking with her a bit more.
posted by aimedwander at 11:20 AM on June 4, 2014
I think part of it has to do with how good you are at recognizing an "ought to" versus a "want to" activity in general, and whether you think you'll be able to say no to this person if she decided she wants to "be friends" and she's trying to set up monthly lunch dates that you find kind of excruciating. If you don't think you're going to be good at saying no later, you might prefer to say no now just in case things were to develop awkwardly. But it's just as likely that things would go in a comfortable direction and there's no need to pre-worry. I think you should see her. It's frustrating, because you used to have closure, kind of, but now she's gone and wrecked it by calling you up today, so to re-closure the situation you'd probably be best off going and talking with her a bit more.
posted by aimedwander at 11:20 AM on June 4, 2014
I wouldn't go. If there is anything really important she needs to apologize for, she can do it through email. Then if she does that, graciously accept the apology and move on. No need to add drama to your life, you will find another best friend.
posted by eq21 at 12:27 PM on June 4, 2014
posted by eq21 at 12:27 PM on June 4, 2014
Response by poster: Thank you all for your responses. Hush, you hit it on the head with this:
The negative reaction you had - that made you write an AskMe - when she cold called you at work, out of the blue, without emailing first, and put you on the spot ... that's your best self saying "proceed with caution." Take this slooooow.
and beanie with this:
The fact that she did call you at work and put you on the spot like that says, to me, that she's still not particularly sensitive to others or aware of fairly typical boundaries after all this time (who calls someone at work to break such an emotionally loaded and lengthy estrangement)? I would see that as a good sign that she's something of a continuing emotional risk.
The cold calling at work (this is a new job for me, so she had to go to the trouble of looking up the number) really made me feel uncomfortable. It felt very much like the calls she would make to me at work back in the days of all the drama. I don't think we can go back to the way it was, nor do I want to, so I think what I will do is decline the invitation with wording similar to beanie's suggestion.
I am glad that things have worked out okay for her. But at the same time, I do think ending friendships that aren't healthy is a good thing, and I'd like to leave this one in the past.
posted by Sal and Richard at 2:06 PM on June 4, 2014 [8 favorites]
The negative reaction you had - that made you write an AskMe - when she cold called you at work, out of the blue, without emailing first, and put you on the spot ... that's your best self saying "proceed with caution." Take this slooooow.
and beanie with this:
The fact that she did call you at work and put you on the spot like that says, to me, that she's still not particularly sensitive to others or aware of fairly typical boundaries after all this time (who calls someone at work to break such an emotionally loaded and lengthy estrangement)? I would see that as a good sign that she's something of a continuing emotional risk.
The cold calling at work (this is a new job for me, so she had to go to the trouble of looking up the number) really made me feel uncomfortable. It felt very much like the calls she would make to me at work back in the days of all the drama. I don't think we can go back to the way it was, nor do I want to, so I think what I will do is decline the invitation with wording similar to beanie's suggestion.
I am glad that things have worked out okay for her. But at the same time, I do think ending friendships that aren't healthy is a good thing, and I'd like to leave this one in the past.
posted by Sal and Richard at 2:06 PM on June 4, 2014 [8 favorites]
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posted by killdevil at 8:14 PM on June 3, 2014