Kink is complicated
May 28, 2014 1:02 PM Subscribe
My partner accepts 90% of my, as Dan Savage puts it, "a fetish-too-far", which is pretty great, considering. We have discussed it at length, she'll never come the last 10%, and I understand that. Two issues, though...
1) I do feel somewhat in mourning that we'll never get to play out the full fantasy. Ever. And 2) She's convinced that I'm going to leave her within 10 years because of this unscratched itch.
How do I best deal with #1 to avoid #2. I do not want this to break us up, ever. Is this something you can discuss with a therapist without freaking them out?
Other pertinant details, we have a 24/7 D/s relationship going on 6 years, and everything else is pretty great. We hit about 100% right vanilla-side.
Visiting a pro is probably not a great idea because of Issues.
1) I do feel somewhat in mourning that we'll never get to play out the full fantasy. Ever. And 2) She's convinced that I'm going to leave her within 10 years because of this unscratched itch.
How do I best deal with #1 to avoid #2. I do not want this to break us up, ever. Is this something you can discuss with a therapist without freaking them out?
Other pertinant details, we have a 24/7 D/s relationship going on 6 years, and everything else is pretty great. We hit about 100% right vanilla-side.
Visiting a pro is probably not a great idea because of Issues.
Is this something you can discuss with a therapist without freaking them out?
Depends on the therapist, really. I don't know where you live but googling "kink friendly therapist" should put you on the right track - I can't do it for you what with I'm at work.
As far as how to deal with it - I guess I'd need more information. Particularly: Is this something that comes up a lot? Do you fight over this? If so, how frequently?
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:18 PM on May 28, 2014
Depends on the therapist, really. I don't know where you live but googling "kink friendly therapist" should put you on the right track - I can't do it for you what with I'm at work.
As far as how to deal with it - I guess I'd need more information. Particularly: Is this something that comes up a lot? Do you fight over this? If so, how frequently?
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:18 PM on May 28, 2014
Through the MeFi Mag, I met Dr. Susan Block (we ran an article on her looking for a live-in copy editor), who can at least point you toward some other resources — I don't know how good a therapist she is, personally. But she's in LA and is even more sex-positive than Savage. If you reach out to her and she's no help, let me know. I'm still casual acquaintances with Nina Hartley and Ernest Green, who have extensive experience in healthy kink (including d/s) stuff, and also a fantastic network of people to recommend.
posted by klangklangston at 1:25 PM on May 28, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by klangklangston at 1:25 PM on May 28, 2014 [2 favorites]
You may wanna have the mods anonymize this so you can post more info, because as is, this is VERY hard to answer - there are many different options and opinions depending on the kink in question, and depending on that the Issues regarding professionals may be.
posted by julthumbscrew at 1:34 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by julthumbscrew at 1:34 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
Is this the kind of kink you can work out in text (e.g. writing short stories/novels/plays) or via some other artistic venue? Many people deal with unattainable kinks via art.
posted by skye.dancer at 2:03 PM on May 28, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by skye.dancer at 2:03 PM on May 28, 2014 [3 favorites]
Seconding working out the kink, if possible, via another artistic venue. For example, many of my friends engage in online role-playing or illustration. This (illustration) is how I deal with some of the kinks in my head that are simply: a) not plausible in real life for whatever reason b) something my partner isn't into and c) just plain ridiculous.
But I also agree that you haven't given us much to go on here. Does the kink involve bringing another person into your sex life? Does it involve venturing into playing with someone of the same-sex? Is the kink inherently unsafe or otherwise dangerous? Does it involve humiliation/degradation? Does it involve bodily fluids that most people are repelled by?
You might get more useful help with more detail here. After all, the advice you'll get for wanting to include another person in your sexytimes will be vastly different than what you'd receive for wanting your partner to wear a specific thing or behave a certain way during sexytimes.
posted by stubbehtail at 2:37 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
But I also agree that you haven't given us much to go on here. Does the kink involve bringing another person into your sex life? Does it involve venturing into playing with someone of the same-sex? Is the kink inherently unsafe or otherwise dangerous? Does it involve humiliation/degradation? Does it involve bodily fluids that most people are repelled by?
You might get more useful help with more detail here. After all, the advice you'll get for wanting to include another person in your sexytimes will be vastly different than what you'd receive for wanting your partner to wear a specific thing or behave a certain way during sexytimes.
posted by stubbehtail at 2:37 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
Is this something you can discuss with a therapist without freaking them out?
A professional therapist: absolutely, yes! There are shitheads and wankers out there, as in every profession.
A good way to filter for those most likely to help you is to search for therapists who mention "sexual relationships" or "sexuality" as an issue they speciailize in.
posted by IAmBroom at 2:39 PM on May 28, 2014
A professional therapist: absolutely, yes! There are shitheads and wankers out there, as in every profession.
A good way to filter for those most likely to help you is to search for therapists who mention "sexual relationships" or "sexuality" as an issue they speciailize in.
posted by IAmBroom at 2:39 PM on May 28, 2014
Response by poster: I tried to avoid discussion of the kink so as not to let that get off on a tangent. It's not illegal or dangerous, but she's not being unreasonable for not being interested.
Seeing a pro domme isn't a viable option, mostly because I don't trust myself. I worry that I might in fact stray from an otherwise healthy relationship over a single aspect, after getting a taste.
posted by hwyengr at 3:19 PM on May 28, 2014
Seeing a pro domme isn't a viable option, mostly because I don't trust myself. I worry that I might in fact stray from an otherwise healthy relationship over a single aspect, after getting a taste.
posted by hwyengr at 3:19 PM on May 28, 2014
This is perhaps going to sound crazy, but it's about virtue formation and learning contentment as one of those virtues. As others have noted, cultivating an attitude of intense gratefulness over good things we do have can go a long way towards learning contentment.
We live in a time in which desires tend to be viewed as properly basic, or simply are, and as such are not always considered subject to crituqie. Considering that it might be good to sometimes have unmet desires is an okay thing. For one reason (and perhaps the least of them), it's statistically unlikely to find a life scenario in which they are all met, and as such, we would be dooming everyone to a life of discontent if we argue otherwise. But there are in fact plenty of happy people who don't get all of their desires met, so there must be something to this. A life project for most people is figuring out how to actualize that kind of reality.
posted by SpacemanStix at 4:07 PM on May 28, 2014 [15 favorites]
We live in a time in which desires tend to be viewed as properly basic, or simply are, and as such are not always considered subject to crituqie. Considering that it might be good to sometimes have unmet desires is an okay thing. For one reason (and perhaps the least of them), it's statistically unlikely to find a life scenario in which they are all met, and as such, we would be dooming everyone to a life of discontent if we argue otherwise. But there are in fact plenty of happy people who don't get all of their desires met, so there must be something to this. A life project for most people is figuring out how to actualize that kind of reality.
posted by SpacemanStix at 4:07 PM on May 28, 2014 [15 favorites]
Seeing a pro domme isn't a viable option, mostly because I don't trust myself. I worry that I might in fact stray from an otherwise healthy relationship over a single aspect, after getting a taste.
This is definitely something to talk over with a therapist. Not for strategies to prevent "straying", but because this level of anxiety/fearfulness/feeling of lacking control is not necessary. The fact that you are not compulsively engaging in...whatever...is a pretty good sign that you are able to maintain control over this aspect of your life.
The "forbidden" aspect of kinks can be part of what's fun and sexy about them, but it can also be a source of shame and anxiety for a lot of people.
(The Kink-Aware Professionals database may help you get in touch with someone.)
posted by kagredon at 4:09 PM on May 28, 2014 [3 favorites]
This is definitely something to talk over with a therapist. Not for strategies to prevent "straying", but because this level of anxiety/fearfulness/feeling of lacking control is not necessary. The fact that you are not compulsively engaging in...whatever...is a pretty good sign that you are able to maintain control over this aspect of your life.
The "forbidden" aspect of kinks can be part of what's fun and sexy about them, but it can also be a source of shame and anxiety for a lot of people.
(The Kink-Aware Professionals database may help you get in touch with someone.)
posted by kagredon at 4:09 PM on May 28, 2014 [3 favorites]
Years ago, I read the Bust Guide to the New World Order. (I think that was the book, anyway.) There was an essay called "Confusion Is Sex," written by a kinky girl who had a horrible time trying to find someone who was compatible with her kink-wise AND compatible with her outside of the sex. She described a guy who she was good with sexually but not emotionally, the guy who she was compatible with emotionally but he tried to be kinky and just didn't like it (GGG, y'all!), and the guy who was kinky in different ways from her and now she was the one trying it and not liking it. Moral of the story: everything is not going to line up for you with one person. And like the young rope-rider, I feel sad thinking that a good relationship that's 90% there can and may be ruined or tossed aside or cheated on for this 10%. I concur that you need to do your best to not pine and dwell over an extreme fantasy, which would probably not be as fulfilling as you think it would be (especially with someone who's not into it), and it's probably not THAT mindblowingly awesome that it's worth blowing everything else for.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:55 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:55 PM on May 28, 2014 [1 favorite]
hwyengr: "Seeing a pro domme isn't a viable option, mostly because I don't trust myself. I worry that I might in fact stray from an otherwise healthy relationship over a single aspect, after getting a taste."
This is why #2 is an issue for your partner - you are straight up saying "I would leave over this one specific fantasy". Sure, it's a 'maybe, if X' scenario, but you're hardly inspiring confidence in your own fidelity, or ability to moderate your sexual behaviour. You can't say "I don't want this to break us up ever" if you're also saying "it would totally break us up because I'd just be wanting it all the time". You're making this some externalised controlling factor when actually you do have control.
the young rope-rider has some really good points about 'feeding' the fantasy, and about the way community can escalate these kinds of issues. And that no-one gets 100% of everything fulfilled. Focus on some generalised mindfulness and gratitude, rather than a part of a fantasy that has nothing at all to do with the relationship you say is important to you.
posted by geek anachronism at 3:46 AM on May 29, 2014 [3 favorites]
This is why #2 is an issue for your partner - you are straight up saying "I would leave over this one specific fantasy". Sure, it's a 'maybe, if X' scenario, but you're hardly inspiring confidence in your own fidelity, or ability to moderate your sexual behaviour. You can't say "I don't want this to break us up ever" if you're also saying "it would totally break us up because I'd just be wanting it all the time". You're making this some externalised controlling factor when actually you do have control.
the young rope-rider has some really good points about 'feeding' the fantasy, and about the way community can escalate these kinds of issues. And that no-one gets 100% of everything fulfilled. Focus on some generalised mindfulness and gratitude, rather than a part of a fantasy that has nothing at all to do with the relationship you say is important to you.
posted by geek anachronism at 3:46 AM on May 29, 2014 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: I probably shouldn't have mentioned professional sex workers at all, but I was trying to shape the question more as "how do you cope with an unattainable fantasy". Sex is weird, and when you fantasize about something since you were 10 years old, making it your primary masturbation thought until you've settled down with whom you expect to be your lifetime partner, it's not so easy to just let it go. It feels similar to addiction, which it probably genuinely is. And in some cases, which you have all been gracious enough to emphasize, abstention is often the treatment for addiction. But it's hard.
For the record, I absolutely do love my partner and never want the relationship to end, which is why I posted this question in the first place.
posted by hwyengr at 5:11 AM on May 29, 2014 [1 favorite]
For the record, I absolutely do love my partner and never want the relationship to end, which is why I posted this question in the first place.
posted by hwyengr at 5:11 AM on May 29, 2014 [1 favorite]
Some would disagree, but I do think there is such a thing as sexual addiction. In that sense, it makes sense that you would be concerned about not "acting out" on things that you feel are a very strong compulsion for you. Would you consider going to see a specialist in this area? There are many counselors who would know exactly what you would be talking about when you say that you have a strong desire sexually, and you are concerned that you don't act on them for the sake of your relationship. It sounds to me that you are in a place in which you simply need some input on how it is that we go about controlling desires, learning to sublimate them to higher order desires that we have (i.e., relationship values), and learning to live, on some level, with unrealized desires. All of those questions are healthy to be asking, by the way, and part of a normal progression of personal growth. You would not be the first one to grapple with them by any means. Unfortunately (as is the state of the human condition), obvious answers are not always forthcoming but we can seek the help of others who have thought deeply about these things.
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:01 AM on May 29, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:01 AM on May 29, 2014 [2 favorites]
You're making this some externalised controlling factor when actually you do have control
Agree on this point. Take responsibility for acting; if you only react to external forces you'll feel miserable about the outcome.
Concerning what's happening: many sexual turn-ons are hot in part because they're forbidden. This is what makes self control difficult. Your desire not to pursue the thing is amplifying your desire to pursue it.
Unwinding from such a pattern is hard, complicated work. It probably won't involve removing the turn-on entirely, but it might eventually involve (say) developing a second one you're equally turned on by that is agreeable to your partner, and/or decisively letting go of wanting to enact a fantasy and allowing yourself to leave it as just a fantasy. Those are hard processes to go through though.
I'd recommend the second section of The Erotic Mind, it has some broad discussion of strategies for adjusting your relationship with "troublesome turn-ons".
Good luck.
posted by ead at 10:48 AM on May 29, 2014 [1 favorite]
Agree on this point. Take responsibility for acting; if you only react to external forces you'll feel miserable about the outcome.
Concerning what's happening: many sexual turn-ons are hot in part because they're forbidden. This is what makes self control difficult. Your desire not to pursue the thing is amplifying your desire to pursue it.
Unwinding from such a pattern is hard, complicated work. It probably won't involve removing the turn-on entirely, but it might eventually involve (say) developing a second one you're equally turned on by that is agreeable to your partner, and/or decisively letting go of wanting to enact a fantasy and allowing yourself to leave it as just a fantasy. Those are hard processes to go through though.
I'd recommend the second section of The Erotic Mind, it has some broad discussion of strategies for adjusting your relationship with "troublesome turn-ons".
Good luck.
posted by ead at 10:48 AM on May 29, 2014 [1 favorite]
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If we don't know what the kink is, or why meeting your need outside the relationship isn't an option, then it's sort of hard to answer this.
posted by showbiz_liz at 1:15 PM on May 28, 2014 [10 favorites]