Get thee to a winery
October 23, 2005 10:33 PM
After two years, I'm thinking of having a drink.
Almost two years ago, I quit drinking. This was in the midst of a painful break-up which, while it was not directly caused by substance-abuse, was certainly speeded along by it. Substances in question included alcohol, cocaine, marijuana, and ecstasy. It's worth noting that I'm a freelance guy, so work can be intermittent - ditto money and, for that matter, the validation and self-esteem that comes from work and money. At the time, they all (ie, work, money, and self-esteem) were in short supply. It was a terrible space to be in, so I decided that I needed to take more responsibility for my life, and I further concluded that I couldn't do so in the confines of the relationship. So I ended it and began to really focus on fundamental self-care - exercise, eating well, meditation, therapy, and sobriety.
Now it's two years out and life looks a lot different. The girl is thoroughly out of my life if not entirely out of my brain. I've made great strides in my career - it will ALWAYS remain unstable, but I've made considerable progress towards establishing myself more.
What's more, my sobriety feels like a constant weight that I'm dragging around, reminding me of a bad time in my life when I am working desperately to move PAST that time. I DID party too much, and it did negatively effect my life and a relationship that meant a lot ot me. BUT there were other issues involved as well, so I don't blame drinking exlusively. Even my shrink acknowledges that it's unclear whether sobriety is necessary for me - maybe I can simply drink responsibly...
My tendency is to be WAY too hard on myself in general, and I fear that that's exactly what's going on here - a sort of punitive self-care. Not drinking is fine, I can do it, but it's also extremely alienating. I long for the socially less-complicated days when alcohol was an acceptable social activity in my life.
So these are my questions: am I just rationalizing the desire to drink? Or have I "done my time", learned my lesson, is it finally, FINALLY, ok for me to go to the pub and have a pint or two with a buddy? If I do have a drink (I absolutely do NOT ever want to touch any of the harder stuff again as long as I live), should I do so ceremoniously? Feels like the end to a pretty big episode in my life, not something that I should flippantly let pass. What kinds of ground rules should I/do you set in order to prevent a relapse into unhealthy behavior?
Almost two years ago, I quit drinking. This was in the midst of a painful break-up which, while it was not directly caused by substance-abuse, was certainly speeded along by it. Substances in question included alcohol, cocaine, marijuana, and ecstasy. It's worth noting that I'm a freelance guy, so work can be intermittent - ditto money and, for that matter, the validation and self-esteem that comes from work and money. At the time, they all (ie, work, money, and self-esteem) were in short supply. It was a terrible space to be in, so I decided that I needed to take more responsibility for my life, and I further concluded that I couldn't do so in the confines of the relationship. So I ended it and began to really focus on fundamental self-care - exercise, eating well, meditation, therapy, and sobriety.
Now it's two years out and life looks a lot different. The girl is thoroughly out of my life if not entirely out of my brain. I've made great strides in my career - it will ALWAYS remain unstable, but I've made considerable progress towards establishing myself more.
What's more, my sobriety feels like a constant weight that I'm dragging around, reminding me of a bad time in my life when I am working desperately to move PAST that time. I DID party too much, and it did negatively effect my life and a relationship that meant a lot ot me. BUT there were other issues involved as well, so I don't blame drinking exlusively. Even my shrink acknowledges that it's unclear whether sobriety is necessary for me - maybe I can simply drink responsibly...
My tendency is to be WAY too hard on myself in general, and I fear that that's exactly what's going on here - a sort of punitive self-care. Not drinking is fine, I can do it, but it's also extremely alienating. I long for the socially less-complicated days when alcohol was an acceptable social activity in my life.
So these are my questions: am I just rationalizing the desire to drink? Or have I "done my time", learned my lesson, is it finally, FINALLY, ok for me to go to the pub and have a pint or two with a buddy? If I do have a drink (I absolutely do NOT ever want to touch any of the harder stuff again as long as I live), should I do so ceremoniously? Feels like the end to a pretty big episode in my life, not something that I should flippantly let pass. What kinds of ground rules should I/do you set in order to prevent a relapse into unhealthy behavior?
As you try to decide, one thing to think about may be the types of drinking your friends do. I'd be wary of trying to drink responsibly if all your friends are still into heavy drinking or drugs -- even if they don't try to force you into going too far, the pressure will be there.
posted by occhiblu at 11:04 PM on October 23, 2005
posted by occhiblu at 11:04 PM on October 23, 2005
This is how it begins.
Not how it kills you, but how it begins. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Weigh what you have to gain against what you have to lose. You will find that you have a devil in your ear.
posted by scarabic at 11:17 PM on October 23, 2005
Not how it kills you, but how it begins. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Weigh what you have to gain against what you have to lose. You will find that you have a devil in your ear.
posted by scarabic at 11:17 PM on October 23, 2005
(I absolutely do NOT ever want to touch any of the harder stuff again as long as I live)
FYI: I've heard that beer has alcohol in it.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 11:32 PM on October 23, 2005
FYI: I've heard that beer has alcohol in it.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 11:32 PM on October 23, 2005
What's more, my sobriety feels like a constant weight that I'm dragging around
I have been in much the same position as you. I quit drinking for several years until about ten years ago; I had been getting shit-faced drunk two or three times a week at one point. I have been drunk once since. It is rare that I have more than one drink in any given week, and I have a very, very extensive liquor cabinet. There's plenty of temptation there, except that I'm not tempted...
...because drinking or not drinking is not an important part of my life. And I think that this is why it's safe for me to have a couple of beers on poker night or to have a bit of scotch and a steak after work on Thursday, say.
As long as it feels like you're dragging around the weight of sobriety, I don't think you should drink. When it stops feeling that way, it will be safer for you to just have a couple of beers with the boys.
posted by solid-one-love at 11:38 PM on October 23, 2005
I have been in much the same position as you. I quit drinking for several years until about ten years ago; I had been getting shit-faced drunk two or three times a week at one point. I have been drunk once since. It is rare that I have more than one drink in any given week, and I have a very, very extensive liquor cabinet. There's plenty of temptation there, except that I'm not tempted...
...because drinking or not drinking is not an important part of my life. And I think that this is why it's safe for me to have a couple of beers on poker night or to have a bit of scotch and a steak after work on Thursday, say.
As long as it feels like you're dragging around the weight of sobriety, I don't think you should drink. When it stops feeling that way, it will be safer for you to just have a couple of beers with the boys.
posted by solid-one-love at 11:38 PM on October 23, 2005
I've read a bunch of biographies on both alcoholism and addiction, and they all say the same thing (as do, I believe, the AA) - there's no middle ground between sobriety and using: you're either on the wagon, or you're off it. You can't "do some time" and then start dabbling again.
It is terribly unfortunate that being sober can be such a bore (I completely agree), but the truth is that society tells us that it's OK to drink, but doesn't tell us the number of deaths from liver, pancreatic or kidney disease, or that alcoholism costs North America $170 billion per year. What I mean by that is there is a signficant amount of people who have gone before us who show that boozing is a much greater problem than we'd care to admit to ourselves whilst we're getting caught up in our convictions that going to the pub is an essential component of our overall happiness.
posted by forallmankind at 11:45 PM on October 23, 2005
It is terribly unfortunate that being sober can be such a bore (I completely agree), but the truth is that society tells us that it's OK to drink, but doesn't tell us the number of deaths from liver, pancreatic or kidney disease, or that alcoholism costs North America $170 billion per year. What I mean by that is there is a signficant amount of people who have gone before us who show that boozing is a much greater problem than we'd care to admit to ourselves whilst we're getting caught up in our convictions that going to the pub is an essential component of our overall happiness.
posted by forallmankind at 11:45 PM on October 23, 2005
As a person with a strong family history of alcoholism, I'm very leery of advising any person to take a drink. I truly believe there are some people who cannot handle it, not even one. Hard experience has taught me that I cannot handle even one cigarette without returning to a health-impairing addiction. On the other hand, I drink - I'm not an alcoholic, never been one, I don't get intoxicated, I don't like to get intoxicated, the vast majority of my days do not include alcohol. I started late and never got the addiction. Go figure.
First advice, take this real slow. The negative consequences of continuing to not drink are obviously rather minor and social in comparison to the negative consequences if you can't stop drinking.
Take your whole history into account. Did you start young? Were there sustained periods in your life when you were moderate and safe in your habits, and was abuse a relatively isolated component that existed primarily within the particular bad era of your life you refer to? Do you tend to be compulsive in behaviors in general?
Do you want to have a drink, or do you want to get drunk? Or maybe just nicely buzzed? In your abusing days, did you tend to set out to drink moderately, but then go off the rails after you had a few belts in you? Or did you set forth with every intention of hitting it hard?
I can't say whether this is wise or not. I think scarabic overstates the situation. There are people who have periods, even severe periods of abusive substance use who later can adopt a healthy pattern of use. But I also know there are people who absolutely can't risk doing even a little. I myself call these people "Dad" and "Brother." If you decide to try it, set clear, conservative limits (both on what you will ingest and how much). If you can't stick to them even in your trial period, you have your answer. As long as you refuse to drive while intoxicated you will almost certainly survive even if you prove to be unable to drink socially. But be committed not to lie to yourself if you can't stick to your own rules. If you go out with the firm intention of having no more than 3 drinks and end up having 5, it isn't because you decided you were having such a nice time and doing so well with it that it was okay. It's because you are unable or unwilling to curb a compulsive tendency, and thus really shouldn't be drinking. Going forward you will have to keep a very close eye on your consumption levels creeping up. But honestly? I suspect like most people you'll know pretty soon if you're handling it. Keep talking to your shrink, be honest and forthright about what's going on, and don't do stupid things.
posted by nanojath at 11:57 PM on October 23, 2005
First advice, take this real slow. The negative consequences of continuing to not drink are obviously rather minor and social in comparison to the negative consequences if you can't stop drinking.
Take your whole history into account. Did you start young? Were there sustained periods in your life when you were moderate and safe in your habits, and was abuse a relatively isolated component that existed primarily within the particular bad era of your life you refer to? Do you tend to be compulsive in behaviors in general?
Do you want to have a drink, or do you want to get drunk? Or maybe just nicely buzzed? In your abusing days, did you tend to set out to drink moderately, but then go off the rails after you had a few belts in you? Or did you set forth with every intention of hitting it hard?
I can't say whether this is wise or not. I think scarabic overstates the situation. There are people who have periods, even severe periods of abusive substance use who later can adopt a healthy pattern of use. But I also know there are people who absolutely can't risk doing even a little. I myself call these people "Dad" and "Brother." If you decide to try it, set clear, conservative limits (both on what you will ingest and how much). If you can't stick to them even in your trial period, you have your answer. As long as you refuse to drive while intoxicated you will almost certainly survive even if you prove to be unable to drink socially. But be committed not to lie to yourself if you can't stick to your own rules. If you go out with the firm intention of having no more than 3 drinks and end up having 5, it isn't because you decided you were having such a nice time and doing so well with it that it was okay. It's because you are unable or unwilling to curb a compulsive tendency, and thus really shouldn't be drinking. Going forward you will have to keep a very close eye on your consumption levels creeping up. But honestly? I suspect like most people you'll know pretty soon if you're handling it. Keep talking to your shrink, be honest and forthright about what's going on, and don't do stupid things.
posted by nanojath at 11:57 PM on October 23, 2005
There's a world of middle ground between abstinence and being a dead drunk all the time. I drank like a fish for much of my 20s to the point that it scared me (the first blackout will do that to you, especially coming from a family heavily populated with alcoholics). I stopped entirely, in large part just to see if I could. Well, as it turned out, I could and I did, and so when I went back to drinking awhile later I did so moderately/socially -- which is the level at which I've stayed for more than 10 years.
In other words, I can drink without ever having the desire to get drunk again, because pretty much all of the issues that were driving me to get drunk in the first place have been largely resolved for me now. So I can have a glass of wine with dinner -- or not. I can have a cocktail with friends -- or not. I can crack a beer while watching the White Sox go 2-0 in the World Series -- or not. There are plenty of people who can drink this way. You may very well be one of them, regardless of what seems to me to be an overly absolutist sober/drunk dichotomy.
posted by scody at 12:01 AM on October 24, 2005
In other words, I can drink without ever having the desire to get drunk again, because pretty much all of the issues that were driving me to get drunk in the first place have been largely resolved for me now. So I can have a glass of wine with dinner -- or not. I can have a cocktail with friends -- or not. I can crack a beer while watching the White Sox go 2-0 in the World Series -- or not. There are plenty of people who can drink this way. You may very well be one of them, regardless of what seems to me to be an overly absolutist sober/drunk dichotomy.
posted by scody at 12:01 AM on October 24, 2005
Oy, all these "Don't do it! Don't jump off the bridge!" answers seem a little compulsive to me. BOOZE WILL KILL YOU!
Firstly: No one can answer this question for you. You stopped drinking because you were doing it too much. Does this make you an alcoholic? I don't know. Really, only you and (I'm guessing) your therapist knows for sure (but then again, you might know but not be able to admit it to yourself, and your therapist might have absolutely no idea because addicts, after all, are really good liars, so actually... man, psychology is a bitch).
Secondly: Even though no one can really know if you are actually addicted to alcohol (although maybe a couple sessions with an addictions specialist could clear up the question), here's my 2 cents -- have the drink. It sounds to me like you were partying too hard (easy to do when you're younger) and decided to take the bull by the horns and just stop partying. Good for you. Thing is, a drink doesn't equal partying. Now you want a drink. Go for it, I say. I'm getting the hunch that you're not an addict. But what do I know? Which brings me to my third point:
Thirdly: askmefi is really bad at stuff like this. I'd try asking your friends (the ones who don't party and who aren't looking for enablers).
Fourthly: Civil, I believe he was refering to hard *drugs*.
posted by incessant at 12:05 AM on October 24, 2005
Firstly: No one can answer this question for you. You stopped drinking because you were doing it too much. Does this make you an alcoholic? I don't know. Really, only you and (I'm guessing) your therapist knows for sure (but then again, you might know but not be able to admit it to yourself, and your therapist might have absolutely no idea because addicts, after all, are really good liars, so actually... man, psychology is a bitch).
Secondly: Even though no one can really know if you are actually addicted to alcohol (although maybe a couple sessions with an addictions specialist could clear up the question), here's my 2 cents -- have the drink. It sounds to me like you were partying too hard (easy to do when you're younger) and decided to take the bull by the horns and just stop partying. Good for you. Thing is, a drink doesn't equal partying. Now you want a drink. Go for it, I say. I'm getting the hunch that you're not an addict. But what do I know? Which brings me to my third point:
Thirdly: askmefi is really bad at stuff like this. I'd try asking your friends (the ones who don't party and who aren't looking for enablers).
Fourthly: Civil, I believe he was refering to hard *drugs*.
posted by incessant at 12:05 AM on October 24, 2005
Fourthly: Civil, I believe he was refering to hard *drugs*.
I don't think so. The parenthetical statemnent followed the phrasing "if I do have a drink..." I'm not making a value call here--only suggesting that "a couple of pints with the lads" can just as easily turn into "face-down in a pool of your own vomit" as it could with harder alcohol, and that the point is essentially moot. If you're going to start drinking again, don't try and kid yourself into thinking, "Well, technically I'm just having a couple of beers... it's not like I'm drinking straight whiskey!"
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 12:20 AM on October 24, 2005
I don't think so. The parenthetical statemnent followed the phrasing "if I do have a drink..." I'm not making a value call here--only suggesting that "a couple of pints with the lads" can just as easily turn into "face-down in a pool of your own vomit" as it could with harder alcohol, and that the point is essentially moot. If you're going to start drinking again, don't try and kid yourself into thinking, "Well, technically I'm just having a couple of beers... it's not like I'm drinking straight whiskey!"
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 12:20 AM on October 24, 2005
Apologies for the mn problemns I'vbe been havbing with mny keyboard. Also, apparently, the vb problemn as well.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 12:21 AM on October 24, 2005
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 12:21 AM on October 24, 2005
If, on some level, you didn't realize this was a big deal, you wouldn't be questioning it at all, let alone posting to MeFi about it, you'd have gone ahead and done it.
Your own internal brake system seems to be telling you something. When it comes to addictions, our minds can make us suffer terrible convolutions in order to rationalize what we might otherwise realize is not very sane behavior.
Voice of experience, here. YMMV.
posted by wordswinker at 12:24 AM on October 24, 2005
Your own internal brake system seems to be telling you something. When it comes to addictions, our minds can make us suffer terrible convolutions in order to rationalize what we might otherwise realize is not very sane behavior.
Voice of experience, here. YMMV.
posted by wordswinker at 12:24 AM on October 24, 2005
Your post indicates that you know yourself pretty well, so it does seem odd that you'd ask a bunch of total strangers what to do. Perhaps you're looking to see how others faired in similar circumstances? But this is precarious because the reasons you began over-induldging, the problems surrounding it and your subsequent sobriety are very individualized. I recommend staying dry until you begin believing in your actions. Once you can answer the questions you've listed yourself, with confidence, your decision should be clear.
posted by quadog at 12:24 AM on October 24, 2005
posted by quadog at 12:24 AM on October 24, 2005
I just read Salerno's SHAM, and he points out that:
- alcoholics have a better chance on their own than with AA
- there is little to no peer reviewed research that validates AA's approach
- there are however studies that show that you can go back to social drinking without coming unstuck. In other words, scody's story is not unusual.
So this whole "one drink and you're screwed" idea, which originates with AA and its salvation/damnation model, is bullshit.
You recognized that your behaviour wasn't helping you. You stopped. You are now in a space where that behaviour is ok again. So have a drink.
If you need a rule, ask yourself periodically whether you regret drinking as much as you currently do; if the answer is yes, then stop or cut back again.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 12:26 AM on October 24, 2005
- alcoholics have a better chance on their own than with AA
- there is little to no peer reviewed research that validates AA's approach
- there are however studies that show that you can go back to social drinking without coming unstuck. In other words, scody's story is not unusual.
So this whole "one drink and you're screwed" idea, which originates with AA and its salvation/damnation model, is bullshit.
You recognized that your behaviour wasn't helping you. You stopped. You are now in a space where that behaviour is ok again. So have a drink.
If you need a rule, ask yourself periodically whether you regret drinking as much as you currently do; if the answer is yes, then stop or cut back again.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 12:26 AM on October 24, 2005
I don't really buy the idea of alcholism as anything more than a habit, either. Might be a moot point, but, it ain't heroin, coke, or tobacco. No shakes and such by going without.
You've proven that you can walk away from it without help (course, that's not really the question).
The question is: why are you asking us? Can you safely have a drink? Of course you can; you already know that.
What are you really asking? Is this about some sort of permission? If it is, watch yourself carefully.
posted by converge at 1:17 AM on October 24, 2005
You've proven that you can walk away from it without help (course, that's not really the question).
The question is: why are you asking us? Can you safely have a drink? Of course you can; you already know that.
What are you really asking? Is this about some sort of permission? If it is, watch yourself carefully.
posted by converge at 1:17 AM on October 24, 2005
I don't really buy the idea of alcholism as anything more than a habit, either. Might be a moot point, but, it ain't heroin, coke, or tobacco. No shakes and such by going without.
You sure 'bout that?
Might want to look again.
"Withdrawal, for those physically dependent on alcohol, is much more dangerous than withdrawal from heroin or other narcotic drugs...Withdrawal symptoms following a reduction or cessation of drinking [include] sweating, rapid pulse, tremors, insomnia, nausea, vomiting, hallucinations, agitation, anxiety, or seizures"
Or just google "alcoholism withdrawal" and pick any link, really.
posted by ori at 2:19 AM on October 24, 2005
You sure 'bout that?
Might want to look again.
"Withdrawal, for those physically dependent on alcohol, is much more dangerous than withdrawal from heroin or other narcotic drugs...Withdrawal symptoms following a reduction or cessation of drinking [include] sweating, rapid pulse, tremors, insomnia, nausea, vomiting, hallucinations, agitation, anxiety, or seizures"
Or just google "alcoholism withdrawal" and pick any link, really.
posted by ori at 2:19 AM on October 24, 2005
Nah, proper alcoholics do have to have a drink to stop the shakes.
But it sounds like you might have given up drink as part of the whole change rather than being addicted to alcohol. I saw a documentary about alcoholic homeless people and they can't eat properly cause their digestive system's fucked from the booze. They just live to drink..I dunno if that was you.
I gave up drinking for about six months along with other things as I was 'partying' every weekend and feeling bad all the time and out of control.
Now I don't drink that much, but I have a drink when I want and get drunk from time to time.
I think the most important thing is how you feel within yourself. It's pretty hard to get physically addicted to booze, so it depends whether you still want to drink to shut feelings out or escape from the working week or whatever reasons you had.
I feel that I've got things to achieve in my life and I'm confident within myself, so I don't want to lose all my time to booze and the rest. I think that this will work for you, but I can't say for sure...it's possible that some people could get addicted easily, so be careful.
I don't know much about AA, but it sounds like they just try and use willpower to cut out all drinking rather than looking at the reasons why people use booze.
Don't drink for social reasons - the only reason to drink is if you want the effect of drinking on your brain. And it is easy to think other substances are a good idea if you're drunk, so don't be around any.
posted by lunkfish at 2:41 AM on October 24, 2005
But it sounds like you might have given up drink as part of the whole change rather than being addicted to alcohol. I saw a documentary about alcoholic homeless people and they can't eat properly cause their digestive system's fucked from the booze. They just live to drink..I dunno if that was you.
I gave up drinking for about six months along with other things as I was 'partying' every weekend and feeling bad all the time and out of control.
Now I don't drink that much, but I have a drink when I want and get drunk from time to time.
I think the most important thing is how you feel within yourself. It's pretty hard to get physically addicted to booze, so it depends whether you still want to drink to shut feelings out or escape from the working week or whatever reasons you had.
I feel that I've got things to achieve in my life and I'm confident within myself, so I don't want to lose all my time to booze and the rest. I think that this will work for you, but I can't say for sure...it's possible that some people could get addicted easily, so be careful.
I don't know much about AA, but it sounds like they just try and use willpower to cut out all drinking rather than looking at the reasons why people use booze.
Don't drink for social reasons - the only reason to drink is if you want the effect of drinking on your brain. And it is easy to think other substances are a good idea if you're drunk, so don't be around any.
posted by lunkfish at 2:41 AM on October 24, 2005
Yes, you should get over the sobriety. Too many people swing violently between total sobriety and excess. This isn't control. Assuming you were never a raging alcoholic (in which case you simply can't be trusted with any alcohol), the next step is to establish control and allow yourself to drink a little.
A little means a little.
Some words from the wise:
First, establish a basic support network. Ask your friends to keep an eye on you and make sure you don't drink too much and you don't let it affect your life. They get veto power. If you drink enough to concern those who love you, then you don't get to drink anymore. Full stop, end of story.
Second, drink consciously. Decide the time, place and the amount that you will drink. Never enter a situation thinking to yourself "I'll just do a shot or two." Be hard on yourself. Make it clear: I will have X drinks Y minutes apart (drink slowly!) and I will eat Z and then no more.
Three, try to have fun. A lot of people in your situation build up these powerful psychological associations between alcohol and unpleasant memories. These associations can snowball and knock an otherwise fine person into a vicious cycle. Break these associations. Only associate alcohol with pleasant situations and people. DO NOT DRINK WHEN YOU ARE DEPRESSED. DO NOT DRINK IF YOUR STRESSED OUT AND NEED TO "RELAX." DO NOT DRINK TO PREPARE YOURSELF FOR A 'TOUGH DAY'. Only drink when you have friends and something to celebrate. Only drink the good stuff. The cheap stuff isn't even worth it.
Four, make it clear that you don't need alcohol at all to have a good time or to get through the week. Allow yourself to drink for a couple of weeks and then take a week "off." Set challenges for yourself eg 'I'll enjoy this partywithout getting buzzed.'
Lastly, take it slowly. There's no need to go from sobriety to liquid lunches at 2. Alcohol isn't a major presence in your life and you plan to live a long and happy life. Start off slow, with a drink here and there, and fall into a rhythm of being a light-to-moderate drinker. When the time comes and the situation calls for it down the road you'll be able to toast with the best of 'em.
posted by nixerman at 2:47 AM on October 24, 2005
A little means a little.
Some words from the wise:
First, establish a basic support network. Ask your friends to keep an eye on you and make sure you don't drink too much and you don't let it affect your life. They get veto power. If you drink enough to concern those who love you, then you don't get to drink anymore. Full stop, end of story.
Second, drink consciously. Decide the time, place and the amount that you will drink. Never enter a situation thinking to yourself "I'll just do a shot or two." Be hard on yourself. Make it clear: I will have X drinks Y minutes apart (drink slowly!) and I will eat Z and then no more.
Three, try to have fun. A lot of people in your situation build up these powerful psychological associations between alcohol and unpleasant memories. These associations can snowball and knock an otherwise fine person into a vicious cycle. Break these associations. Only associate alcohol with pleasant situations and people. DO NOT DRINK WHEN YOU ARE DEPRESSED. DO NOT DRINK IF YOUR STRESSED OUT AND NEED TO "RELAX." DO NOT DRINK TO PREPARE YOURSELF FOR A 'TOUGH DAY'. Only drink when you have friends and something to celebrate. Only drink the good stuff. The cheap stuff isn't even worth it.
Four, make it clear that you don't need alcohol at all to have a good time or to get through the week. Allow yourself to drink for a couple of weeks and then take a week "off." Set challenges for yourself eg 'I'll enjoy this partywithout getting buzzed.'
Lastly, take it slowly. There's no need to go from sobriety to liquid lunches at 2. Alcohol isn't a major presence in your life and you plan to live a long and happy life. Start off slow, with a drink here and there, and fall into a rhythm of being a light-to-moderate drinker. When the time comes and the situation calls for it down the road you'll be able to toast with the best of 'em.
posted by nixerman at 2:47 AM on October 24, 2005
Drinking responsibly sounds like something you can handle. Just remember that you have a commitment to yourself, your friends, and you career to make sure that you maintain the responsibly portion of drinking responsibly.
Here is my suggestion. Let someone that you see regularly, trust and respect know that you've decided to allow yourself the liberty of drinking responsibly. Preferably this person also has contact with other people you see regularly. Promise to check up with them and report your progress in an honest manner.
If you commit any of the following, or fail to report any of the following to your confidant, then consider your experiment a failure and go straight for counseling: binge, pass out, vomit, drink alone, lie about drinking habits, get a hangover, use alcohol to avoid someone, use alcohol to avoid work, miss work or any social engagement because of alcohol consumption. Remember, drinking responsibly is a commitment to yourself, your friends and your career.
But please, be aware, that before you do any of this, that there is a chance that you were better off not drinking at all, and if you are worried that you might not be able to handle it, then you probably shouldn't take the risk.
Best of luck.
posted by furtive at 5:16 AM on October 24, 2005
Here is my suggestion. Let someone that you see regularly, trust and respect know that you've decided to allow yourself the liberty of drinking responsibly. Preferably this person also has contact with other people you see regularly. Promise to check up with them and report your progress in an honest manner.
If you commit any of the following, or fail to report any of the following to your confidant, then consider your experiment a failure and go straight for counseling: binge, pass out, vomit, drink alone, lie about drinking habits, get a hangover, use alcohol to avoid someone, use alcohol to avoid work, miss work or any social engagement because of alcohol consumption. Remember, drinking responsibly is a commitment to yourself, your friends and your career.
But please, be aware, that before you do any of this, that there is a chance that you were better off not drinking at all, and if you are worried that you might not be able to handle it, then you probably shouldn't take the risk.
Best of luck.
posted by furtive at 5:16 AM on October 24, 2005
Don't hang with a bunch of fools that think getting drunk is the way to party.
I started drinking young. In my early teens, I was especially fond of whiskey, but I didn't care what it was, I'd drink it. Near as I can recall, my first blackout was at age 16. I was 14 when I discovered how handy an ice bucket could be, for things other than ice.
When I was 17, I decided to quit liquor. Then I was off to Italy, and discovered I could get ripped on wine. So I quit alcohol entirely, for awhile. PITA! My family are social drinkers. My grandfather, whom I adored, didn't like that I wouldn't take a drink. For awhile, I really didn't want to be around anyone that was drinking.
Now I'm 48. I drink when it suits me. Most of the time, beer, but I enjoy liquor when I wish. Days may pass when I have none. Weeks may pass when I never fail to have a beer in the evening. Last time I got anything like drunk was with my partner's parents, drinking home made plum liquor. It created no problem, and is a fond memory (I really like my partner's folks).
So, a person can drink too much, then quit, and latter resume enjoying drink. Just stay in control, and don't get involved with any silly idea that you need to be 'able' to drink more. If 1 drink makes you happy, leave it at that.
posted by Goofyy at 6:15 AM on October 24, 2005
I started drinking young. In my early teens, I was especially fond of whiskey, but I didn't care what it was, I'd drink it. Near as I can recall, my first blackout was at age 16. I was 14 when I discovered how handy an ice bucket could be, for things other than ice.
When I was 17, I decided to quit liquor. Then I was off to Italy, and discovered I could get ripped on wine. So I quit alcohol entirely, for awhile. PITA! My family are social drinkers. My grandfather, whom I adored, didn't like that I wouldn't take a drink. For awhile, I really didn't want to be around anyone that was drinking.
Now I'm 48. I drink when it suits me. Most of the time, beer, but I enjoy liquor when I wish. Days may pass when I have none. Weeks may pass when I never fail to have a beer in the evening. Last time I got anything like drunk was with my partner's parents, drinking home made plum liquor. It created no problem, and is a fond memory (I really like my partner's folks).
So, a person can drink too much, then quit, and latter resume enjoying drink. Just stay in control, and don't get involved with any silly idea that you need to be 'able' to drink more. If 1 drink makes you happy, leave it at that.
posted by Goofyy at 6:15 AM on October 24, 2005
Drink to enjoy the drink, not the effects of the drink. Consider looking into beer snobbery. There are plenty of wonderful beers out there for you to try. Many of them you can buy by the single bottle at the liquor store, thus limiting the amount you have in your home if you're worried about old habbits resurfacing.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:52 AM on October 24, 2005
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:52 AM on October 24, 2005
Some of these answers are really a mish-mash of speculation and opinion, a bit of it misinformed. But that's what you'll get: you're asking this question in a forum where many people aren't willing to discuss their drinking (and sobriety) histories with their name attached.
If you want to go drink, go drink. That's how you'll find out if you have a problem. In fact, that is essentially the only way to find out whether you're someone who can drink or not. And that's actually very much worth knowing.
If managed drinking causes you pain, or doesn't work out -- or if, god forbid, like the founder of Moderation Management, you run down some people while drunk -- then you'll know for sure. Or perhaps you're totally able to drink, and you've just had a nice liver vacation?
posted by RJ Reynolds at 6:58 AM on October 24, 2005
If you want to go drink, go drink. That's how you'll find out if you have a problem. In fact, that is essentially the only way to find out whether you're someone who can drink or not. And that's actually very much worth knowing.
If managed drinking causes you pain, or doesn't work out -- or if, god forbid, like the founder of Moderation Management, you run down some people while drunk -- then you'll know for sure. Or perhaps you're totally able to drink, and you've just had a nice liver vacation?
posted by RJ Reynolds at 6:58 AM on October 24, 2005
Lots of good answers here (except for the don't jump off the bridge! ones—that may be valid for a known alcoholic, but this is not a known alcoholic). Another data point: someone I was involved with years ago stopped drinking because she'd been doing a lot of it and someone she'd been drinking with joined AA and she got scared and joined AA herself. After a couple of years she decided she wanted to try social drinking again, and she did, and it was fine, and she hasn't had a problem with it since.
But listen to nixerman—don't drink when you're depressed.
posted by languagehat at 7:10 AM on October 24, 2005
But listen to nixerman—don't drink when you're depressed.
posted by languagehat at 7:10 AM on October 24, 2005
My feeling is that if you're someone who has quit drinking in the past because alcohol was causing you problems, you probably shouldn't start again.
I mean, what have you really got to gain? The taste of beer? They make non-alcoholic beer, you know.
And there's a lot to lose.
posted by ikkyu2 at 8:27 AM on October 24, 2005
I mean, what have you really got to gain? The taste of beer? They make non-alcoholic beer, you know.
And there's a lot to lose.
posted by ikkyu2 at 8:27 AM on October 24, 2005
what have you really got to gain?
Yeah, it's really hard to figure out why so many people drink alcoholic beverages. Are they getting paid off? Or is it some psychological disturbance that makes them do painful things, like those people who cut themselves?
*rolls eyes*
posted by languagehat at 9:19 AM on October 24, 2005
Yeah, it's really hard to figure out why so many people drink alcoholic beverages. Are they getting paid off? Or is it some psychological disturbance that makes them do painful things, like those people who cut themselves?
*rolls eyes*
posted by languagehat at 9:19 AM on October 24, 2005
I got drunk 1-2 times a day for about a year, quit for a while, and now have a perfectly healthy time smoking pot and drinking a few beers every once in a while. I did used to drink solely hard alcohol, and now I almost always drink beer or wine. Pinpoint what parts of your former drinking you want to avoid, and if you have any trouble respecting the boundaries you've set for yourself, stop drinking immediately. For me, it was drinking/smoking when I didn't WANT to, just because it was there, because I always did, because I felt I had to.
Because you smoked pot, too, I'll add that I started with pot and made sure I could do that responsibly before moving onto liquor.
posted by Juliet Banana at 10:18 AM on October 24, 2005
Because you smoked pot, too, I'll add that I started with pot and made sure I could do that responsibly before moving onto liquor.
posted by Juliet Banana at 10:18 AM on October 24, 2005
Well there's a lot to think about here. Much of it relies upon a rational outlook and a firm grip on the wheel.
That's the point where I wonder.
I can't judge whether at the point you stopped drinking you were an alcoholic or not. It's a disorder (the only one) that requires self-diagnosis. So from that point of view it might be worthwhile having a look at some literature from AA and any other established source that gives an outline of how one ought to judge themselves. Apply that logic back to when you stopped. If you meet a substantial proportion of the criteria then you would likely conclude that starting up again might be a risky venture.
But I wouldn't, on the words you've written, like to persuade you either way. It may also be helpful to talk about it a bit with a therapist - it can't hurt. The fact that you've brought it here indicates that you are unsure.
If you subscribe to the view that an alcoholic is one in whom a drink causes a chain reaction of pleasure far beyond that which occurs among mere mortals then all those precautions, all those checked boxes about behaviour to avoid and logical concerns to consider may in fact be a raising of the stakes for you. By this I mean that somewhere sometime circumstances and feelings may conspire whereby you circumvent intended plans or engage in behaviour you had outlawed.
If you're an alcoholic and you break one rule then there's the possibility that the subsequent disappointment you feel about yourself may start a slide. Then you do it another time. You feel twice as bad about yourself. You think you can't follow simple rules. Your self esteem lowers. Then other pressures come along. Soon rationality may leave and pain killing or feeling normal can take over. Rationalization and justification and resentments and alcohol fill up the black hole inside that was previously filled by self respect and pride.
If I'm sounding particularly pessimistic it's moreso to illustrate the potential downside. Which is why I suggest that we can't answer your main question. But for those people who have had disasterous consequences as a result of their drinking, it has to be the most important decision in their life.
Talk to someone professional.
posted by peacay at 11:38 AM on October 24, 2005
That's the point where I wonder.
I can't judge whether at the point you stopped drinking you were an alcoholic or not. It's a disorder (the only one) that requires self-diagnosis. So from that point of view it might be worthwhile having a look at some literature from AA and any other established source that gives an outline of how one ought to judge themselves. Apply that logic back to when you stopped. If you meet a substantial proportion of the criteria then you would likely conclude that starting up again might be a risky venture.
But I wouldn't, on the words you've written, like to persuade you either way. It may also be helpful to talk about it a bit with a therapist - it can't hurt. The fact that you've brought it here indicates that you are unsure.
If you subscribe to the view that an alcoholic is one in whom a drink causes a chain reaction of pleasure far beyond that which occurs among mere mortals then all those precautions, all those checked boxes about behaviour to avoid and logical concerns to consider may in fact be a raising of the stakes for you. By this I mean that somewhere sometime circumstances and feelings may conspire whereby you circumvent intended plans or engage in behaviour you had outlawed.
If you're an alcoholic and you break one rule then there's the possibility that the subsequent disappointment you feel about yourself may start a slide. Then you do it another time. You feel twice as bad about yourself. You think you can't follow simple rules. Your self esteem lowers. Then other pressures come along. Soon rationality may leave and pain killing or feeling normal can take over. Rationalization and justification and resentments and alcohol fill up the black hole inside that was previously filled by self respect and pride.
If I'm sounding particularly pessimistic it's moreso to illustrate the potential downside. Which is why I suggest that we can't answer your main question. But for those people who have had disasterous consequences as a result of their drinking, it has to be the most important decision in their life.
Talk to someone professional.
posted by peacay at 11:38 AM on October 24, 2005
I would recomend reading chapter 3 of the AA big book.
It will give you a good idea of what to look out for, and the (remarkable to some) advice to try some controled drinking if you are unsure of whether you have a problem. As it says, "It will not take long for you to decide, if you are honest with yourself about it."
posted by yetanother at 1:17 PM on October 24, 2005
It will give you a good idea of what to look out for, and the (remarkable to some) advice to try some controled drinking if you are unsure of whether you have a problem. As it says, "It will not take long for you to decide, if you are honest with yourself about it."
posted by yetanother at 1:17 PM on October 24, 2005
There's a lot of good thoughts and comments preceding mine, here's my take.
The sense I get from your words is that there's a lot more to think about than just drinking or not drinking. It sounds as though you have an "old you" - one who acted in ways that you recognized were not healthy and/or constructive. Then you have "new you" - and from what you say, the new you might be laboring under a heavy set of rules that you set up when you decided to change some things about your life. (See "alcoholic Catholicism" idea above.)
You mention your shrink - you might want to explore with him (or her) how comfortable you are with new you. If you are worried that you might "backslide", then I would take a look at what's causing you to feel like that, and what's causing you to want to be able to drink now. Was there any particular event, or just a feeling of wanting to relax the guidelines? Maybe he (or she) could help you talk about being hard on yourself in general, which might help you deal whether or not to drink
I am all for marking a new era in your life - but I would say to mark it with something else. Is there anything else that woud help you take a step forward?
I can't say drink or don't - but I can say that if you are questioning the wisdom of doing so, maybe you should give it just a little more time before you make a decision.
Be good to yourself - we've all made mistakes, and to one degree or another we all fear making them again. It sounds like you've taken a lot of steps to be proud of - don't lose sight of that.
posted by Puppy D at 2:09 PM on October 24, 2005
The sense I get from your words is that there's a lot more to think about than just drinking or not drinking. It sounds as though you have an "old you" - one who acted in ways that you recognized were not healthy and/or constructive. Then you have "new you" - and from what you say, the new you might be laboring under a heavy set of rules that you set up when you decided to change some things about your life. (See "alcoholic Catholicism" idea above.)
You mention your shrink - you might want to explore with him (or her) how comfortable you are with new you. If you are worried that you might "backslide", then I would take a look at what's causing you to feel like that, and what's causing you to want to be able to drink now. Was there any particular event, or just a feeling of wanting to relax the guidelines? Maybe he (or she) could help you talk about being hard on yourself in general, which might help you deal whether or not to drink
I am all for marking a new era in your life - but I would say to mark it with something else. Is there anything else that woud help you take a step forward?
I can't say drink or don't - but I can say that if you are questioning the wisdom of doing so, maybe you should give it just a little more time before you make a decision.
Be good to yourself - we've all made mistakes, and to one degree or another we all fear making them again. It sounds like you've taken a lot of steps to be proud of - don't lose sight of that.
posted by Puppy D at 2:09 PM on October 24, 2005
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by ori at 10:50 PM on October 23, 2005