Building a lens filter system
September 20, 2013 2:44 PM Subscribe
What would be a good system/brand for lens filters without costing the earth?
Equipment: the Canon 10-22, 18-55, 50 1.8 and 100-400L on a crop sensor
I am looking at Circular Polarizers and Grad ND filters for the above lenses. With different filter sizes for the above lenses, how do I get these filters for most of my lenses? The Cokin P-series holder seems a good compromise, except that reviewers on Amazon and other places have complained that the either part of the holder shows up in the image or vignetting occurs.
Is there a reasonable cost alternative or the Lee system the only way to go? Is there a starting kit that you would recommend?
On the other hand, will a software solution like Lightroom + Nik Software's Color Efex Pro work instead of the "hardware" solution?
Equipment: the Canon 10-22, 18-55, 50 1.8 and 100-400L on a crop sensor
I am looking at Circular Polarizers and Grad ND filters for the above lenses. With different filter sizes for the above lenses, how do I get these filters for most of my lenses? The Cokin P-series holder seems a good compromise, except that reviewers on Amazon and other places have complained that the either part of the holder shows up in the image or vignetting occurs.
Is there a reasonable cost alternative or the Lee system the only way to go? Is there a starting kit that you would recommend?
On the other hand, will a software solution like Lightroom + Nik Software's Color Efex Pro work instead of the "hardware" solution?
Oh okay, brands: B+W Hoya, Luxon, one Nikon, all fine.
posted by Namlit at 2:59 PM on September 20, 2013
posted by Namlit at 2:59 PM on September 20, 2013
Best answer: Software can't replicate a circular polarizer.
Graduated neutral density filters you could attempt to replicate with different exposures and HDR processing or careful blending. Grad nds let you do it in one shot which you aren't going to get in software.
posted by TheAdamist at 3:08 PM on September 20, 2013
Graduated neutral density filters you could attempt to replicate with different exposures and HDR processing or careful blending. Grad nds let you do it in one shot which you aren't going to get in software.
posted by TheAdamist at 3:08 PM on September 20, 2013
adapter rings...they screw on between lens and threaded filter...you get your filters for your largest diameter lens and an adapter ring for each (smaller diameter) lens...this can be a bit wonky if your largest diameter lens is much larger than your smallest...mostly I just use fancy filters on my best lens (nikon 35mm f1.4) and have a ND or Polarizer (mainly for protection) on the others...yeah, those box-like filter holders do tend to get in the shot, particularly on your wide-angle
posted by sexyrobot at 3:11 PM on September 20, 2013
posted by sexyrobot at 3:11 PM on September 20, 2013
Yeah, I just bought a bunch of up-sizing ring adaptors, all up to 67mm, the size of my 2nd largest lens' filter size (the largest one is just too big). Then I bought one set of filters for all of them, and a few dupes for the largest lens. This also lets me use the same lens cap size for every lens, so I bought a bunch of durable metal pinch lens caps.
posted by RustyBrooks at 3:58 PM on September 20, 2013
posted by RustyBrooks at 3:58 PM on September 20, 2013
As a professional I don't think graduated NDs are worth it, especially on a cropped sensor. I'm picky about the tone and gradient of my skies, so even though I use strobes I generally spend some time in post on it. Lightroom makes this really trivial, if you don't want to use that just do it manually by processing a bracket of your RAW file and combining in whatever editing software you use. No need for any type of HDR software.
What I do think is worth it is the multi-stop adjustable (non graduated) ND filter. Very useful for lots of things, but really expensive.
posted by bradbane at 4:46 PM on September 20, 2013 [1 favorite]
What I do think is worth it is the multi-stop adjustable (non graduated) ND filter. Very useful for lots of things, but really expensive.
posted by bradbane at 4:46 PM on September 20, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: You get the largest filter size that's practical (usually 77mm, or even 82mm) - these are usually more expensive than their smaller versions. The idea is that they should cover your biggest lens.
You then use step up rings on smaller lenses - these can be had for very little (quite cheap). I would also recommend getting a lens filter remover. The rings and filters should be carefully and delicately screwed on and off, because it's easy to mess up the often fragile and densely aligned threads - you might even consider using some kind of dry lubricant on the threads, though be extremely careful not to overdo it as it'll get into your lens, sensor etc..
For vari-ND filters, you could pay a ton like for the Heliopans (which I have), or pay much less for the Genus Eclipse (which I also have), and I actually think the Genus is better.
However, be aware that no vari-ND filter will be as good as a dedicated one in a matt box. The problem is that these will quickly add up in cost to something quite substantial.
posted by VikingSword at 4:51 PM on September 20, 2013
You then use step up rings on smaller lenses - these can be had for very little (quite cheap). I would also recommend getting a lens filter remover. The rings and filters should be carefully and delicately screwed on and off, because it's easy to mess up the often fragile and densely aligned threads - you might even consider using some kind of dry lubricant on the threads, though be extremely careful not to overdo it as it'll get into your lens, sensor etc..
For vari-ND filters, you could pay a ton like for the Heliopans (which I have), or pay much less for the Genus Eclipse (which I also have), and I actually think the Genus is better.
However, be aware that no vari-ND filter will be as good as a dedicated one in a matt box. The problem is that these will quickly add up in cost to something quite substantial.
posted by VikingSword at 4:51 PM on September 20, 2013
Response by poster: Thanks for the responses!
@sexyrobot/@RustyBrooks: Which brand filters did you buy that allow upsizing rings for the 77mm filters? The lowest size yet for me is the 58mm .
@bradbane: Why do you think Grad NDs are not worth? Not trying to be snarky, but genuinely asking it, since a lot of photography blogs and magazines seem to be recommending them. Examples here and here as well as the latest edition of Outdoor Photographer magazine.
@VikingSword: Thanks for the Vari-ND filter advice. The Tiffen also seems to be much better, but do you see any vignetting when using them for ultra-wide angles?
posted by theobserver at 8:59 PM on September 20, 2013
@sexyrobot/@RustyBrooks: Which brand filters did you buy that allow upsizing rings for the 77mm filters? The lowest size yet for me is the 58mm .
@bradbane: Why do you think Grad NDs are not worth? Not trying to be snarky, but genuinely asking it, since a lot of photography blogs and magazines seem to be recommending them. Examples here and here as well as the latest edition of Outdoor Photographer magazine.
@VikingSword: Thanks for the Vari-ND filter advice. The Tiffen also seems to be much better, but do you see any vignetting when using them for ultra-wide angles?
posted by theobserver at 8:59 PM on September 20, 2013
Best answer: What I do think is worth it is the multi-stop adjustable (non graduated) ND filter.
And Singh Ray makes a great one of these. I'm curious if you have any other recommendations.
You learn something new every day - I have to be honest I've never seen anyone shoot with ring adapters and I've been shooting for years. I immediately wonder if there could be any problems that show up in your photos when using a filter that is too large for a lens. Obviously, this would affect your graduated ND filters. The gradiation could be totally out of frame if you use a filter that's way too large.
There's one or two great places to buy used photo equipment online.. I guess PM me if you're interested and I can point you in the right direction.
posted by phaedon at 9:03 PM on September 20, 2013
And Singh Ray makes a great one of these. I'm curious if you have any other recommendations.
You learn something new every day - I have to be honest I've never seen anyone shoot with ring adapters and I've been shooting for years. I immediately wonder if there could be any problems that show up in your photos when using a filter that is too large for a lens. Obviously, this would affect your graduated ND filters. The gradiation could be totally out of frame if you use a filter that's way too large.
There's one or two great places to buy used photo equipment online.. I guess PM me if you're interested and I can point you in the right direction.
posted by phaedon at 9:03 PM on September 20, 2013
Best answer: The Tiffen also seems to be much better, but do you see any vignetting when using them for ultra-wide angles?
On a screw-on filter you will absolutely see vignetting, especially on an ultra-wide lens. (You have to see it to believe, it can be brutal. And don't fool yourself, on wide shots, the corners of the image matter a lot.) I would suggest buying a filter or two and testing them out before committing to one company or a line of similar products. I bought a very expensive variable ND filter once and it spit out some crazy vignettes.
I know Photoshop has lens profiles and lens correction tools built in to help with distortion and vignetting. I don't think there is such a thing as a "filter-based" profile. But you can definitely use these tools to help.
As a side note (I can't believe I'm sharing my secrets), Nik Software is hands down the best plugin collection I've ever used. Hands. Fucking. Down. It's an amazing tool with no learning curve but then when you really get into, it can do wonders. But I don't use it for lens correction. Lens correction is usually handled at the "development" stage of the photo. I don't regret paying $450 for it. F'ing Google bought them out and dropped the price by $300 soon after that. If they end up baking these tools into Google+ or Picasa, the competition is toast. Who knows, maybe Adobe's Creative Cloud Monthly Subscription bullshit is a shot across Google's bow.
posted by phaedon at 9:17 PM on September 20, 2013
On a screw-on filter you will absolutely see vignetting, especially on an ultra-wide lens. (You have to see it to believe, it can be brutal. And don't fool yourself, on wide shots, the corners of the image matter a lot.) I would suggest buying a filter or two and testing them out before committing to one company or a line of similar products. I bought a very expensive variable ND filter once and it spit out some crazy vignettes.
I know Photoshop has lens profiles and lens correction tools built in to help with distortion and vignetting. I don't think there is such a thing as a "filter-based" profile. But you can definitely use these tools to help.
As a side note (I can't believe I'm sharing my secrets), Nik Software is hands down the best plugin collection I've ever used. Hands. Fucking. Down. It's an amazing tool with no learning curve but then when you really get into, it can do wonders. But I don't use it for lens correction. Lens correction is usually handled at the "development" stage of the photo. I don't regret paying $450 for it. F'ing Google bought them out and dropped the price by $300 soon after that. If they end up baking these tools into Google+ or Picasa, the competition is toast. Who knows, maybe Adobe's Creative Cloud Monthly Subscription bullshit is a shot across Google's bow.
posted by phaedon at 9:17 PM on September 20, 2013
Best answer: Well, there can be vignetting, but oddly it's a bit unpredictable - just because it's a wide lens it doesn't mean that it will vignette to the same degree than another wide lens of identical mm size, and then further, it will also depend on the filter brand. It all depends what you are looking for - I personally don't find vignetting to be the biggest problem (workaround: frame for cropping), I'm much more sensitive to color cast issues, resolution and artifacts (the heliopan sometimes displays a dark cross over an image etc.). A vari-ND filter is good when you need something that's fast, that's cheap (compared to a full set of filters), that's convenient to use and carry. But you pay for that with image. There's always a compromise involved, but that's OK, you just have to select your priority of the moment and use the right tool for the job.
posted by VikingSword at 11:00 PM on September 20, 2013
posted by VikingSword at 11:00 PM on September 20, 2013
Response by poster: Thanks for all the answers so far - the jury is still out for me on the filters. I am wondering if the Cokin X-Pro series would help build a system with different brand filters in the holders. Adapter rings don't seem to be causing vignetting as per the reviews.
Additional thoughts welcome...
posted by theobserver at 1:59 PM on September 21, 2013
Additional thoughts welcome...
posted by theobserver at 1:59 PM on September 21, 2013
@bradbane: Why do you think Grad NDs are not worth? Not trying to be snarky, but genuinely asking it, since a lot of photography blogs and magazines seem to be recommending them. Examples here and here as well as the latest edition of Outdoor Photographer magazine.
I just think in most situations (not crazy contrasty, a couple of stops) you have more control and more options in post that are very simple. For outdoor work I can definitely see them being useful, especially if you are shooting into the sun often or something like that. Depends on what you're doing, sounds like for you they might be worth the hassle of dealing with step up rings and all that.
Photography magazines are selling photography gear, so every problem tends to have a solution that involves spending a lot of money :).
posted by bradbane at 1:25 PM on September 24, 2013
I just think in most situations (not crazy contrasty, a couple of stops) you have more control and more options in post that are very simple. For outdoor work I can definitely see them being useful, especially if you are shooting into the sun often or something like that. Depends on what you're doing, sounds like for you they might be worth the hassle of dealing with step up rings and all that.
Photography magazines are selling photography gear, so every problem tends to have a solution that involves spending a lot of money :).
posted by bradbane at 1:25 PM on September 24, 2013
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posted by Namlit at 2:56 PM on September 20, 2013