Hair's My Problem
July 29, 2013 9:20 AM Subscribe
I need suggestions for updos (up-dos?) for someone who has fine, thin, and limp (no volume) hair. And some helpful tips/suggestions/resources for getting better at keeping my hair looking nice. A huge novel inside.
I've seen this question but before that I was searching on pinterest and googling and tried the gibson roll.
Gibson roll (or any tuck into ponytail hole thing): I like it and it's do-able (after a lot of fiddling and getting the hole open and then trying to coordinate my fingers/hands to get the tail into the hole) BUT. The hair style on me looks flat at the crown and is just so unflattering. I don't think I'm doing it wrong, it just isn't good with my thin limp flat hair. Any recommendations from other people in the same boat as me?
Sock bun: Bought one of those mesh "sock" bun makers and I could not for the life of me get it to roll up my hair neatly all the around. As in, when I try to get an even amount of hair around in a circle I can't get it to roll all the way down neatly. I'm wondering if it's because the ends of my hair are layered?
Velcro bumpit: So hopeful! Unfortunately since my hair is so thin and flat....well it peeks through at the top and if I try to get enough hair to cover it up, its too far back to look natural/good! Volume is impossible. Products of all sorts either do nothing or weigh it down.
Curls: They don't stay. My hair will straighten out completely within an hour. I have tried: hot rollers, curling irons, and the brown paper bag thing. The only time my hair will hold a wave or curl is if I'm wearing a double french braid from the crown (which I can't do on myself!).
Arms/hands: They get so tired! How do other women manage to hold their hands up for so long to do these things?
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So should I just resign myself to just leaving my hair down all the time (updos look so elegant/pretty)? If so what should I do to make it look well groomed everyday (ranging from bare minimum to ultra diva)? Are there blogs out there I'm missing out on for people with hair like me? If it looks like I'm waay over thinking this it's because I stay pretty well informed with skincare and makeup things (I get them and they get me) so I know how to manage my look with my face. Hair has always been a big huge question mark/and huh?...which I feel results in what I think is sloppy looking hair.
I know a lot of this might get "go to a good hairdresser" well I've never been to one I liked and usually they don't listen to me anyway. I'm looking for advice/feedback/thoughts from those who are in the same boat as I am. And if you recommend a specific type of haircut, please include pictures!
Information that may or may not be relevant: Color is black and takes on a noticeable red/brownish tinge in light. Face shape... personally I think it's bullshit but: oval when not smiling and turns into a square, triangle, circle thing when smiling (cheeks and jaws seemingly morphing into forever alone face). Uneven/weird hairline that is not symmetrical in the slightest.
Ok that was longer than expected, thanks for reading all the way through!
I've seen this question but before that I was searching on pinterest and googling and tried the gibson roll.
Gibson roll (or any tuck into ponytail hole thing): I like it and it's do-able (after a lot of fiddling and getting the hole open and then trying to coordinate my fingers/hands to get the tail into the hole) BUT. The hair style on me looks flat at the crown and is just so unflattering. I don't think I'm doing it wrong, it just isn't good with my thin limp flat hair. Any recommendations from other people in the same boat as me?
Sock bun: Bought one of those mesh "sock" bun makers and I could not for the life of me get it to roll up my hair neatly all the around. As in, when I try to get an even amount of hair around in a circle I can't get it to roll all the way down neatly. I'm wondering if it's because the ends of my hair are layered?
Velcro bumpit: So hopeful! Unfortunately since my hair is so thin and flat....well it peeks through at the top and if I try to get enough hair to cover it up, its too far back to look natural/good! Volume is impossible. Products of all sorts either do nothing or weigh it down.
Curls: They don't stay. My hair will straighten out completely within an hour. I have tried: hot rollers, curling irons, and the brown paper bag thing. The only time my hair will hold a wave or curl is if I'm wearing a double french braid from the crown (which I can't do on myself!).
Arms/hands: They get so tired! How do other women manage to hold their hands up for so long to do these things?
-----
So should I just resign myself to just leaving my hair down all the time (updos look so elegant/pretty)? If so what should I do to make it look well groomed everyday (ranging from bare minimum to ultra diva)? Are there blogs out there I'm missing out on for people with hair like me? If it looks like I'm waay over thinking this it's because I stay pretty well informed with skincare and makeup things (I get them and they get me) so I know how to manage my look with my face. Hair has always been a big huge question mark/and huh?...which I feel results in what I think is sloppy looking hair.
I know a lot of this might get "go to a good hairdresser" well I've never been to one I liked and usually they don't listen to me anyway. I'm looking for advice/feedback/thoughts from those who are in the same boat as I am. And if you recommend a specific type of haircut, please include pictures!
Information that may or may not be relevant: Color is black and takes on a noticeable red/brownish tinge in light. Face shape... personally I think it's bullshit but: oval when not smiling and turns into a square, triangle, circle thing when smiling (cheeks and jaws seemingly morphing into forever alone face). Uneven/weird hairline that is not symmetrical in the slightest.
Ok that was longer than expected, thanks for reading all the way through!
I also use volumizing shampoo and conditioner. It really does work for me--I can see the difference. I use Nexus products to shampoo and condition, and Paul Mitchell products to style.
posted by feste at 9:38 AM on July 29, 2013
posted by feste at 9:38 AM on July 29, 2013
They're mentioned in the other thread, but I really like the Goody Spin Pins (they come in light and dark colors, mini and regular sizes) and the Goody Modern Updo pin. I have fairly thick, fine hair, layered and shoulder length for reference.
One time my hairdresser got me to try Matrix Amplify shampoo, and hoo boy did that give my hair a lot of volume (not quite needed by me on an everyday basis)! Downside was buildup. but using a different shampoo every once in a while fixed that. I haven't tried the actual volumizing and lifting products in that line because the shampoo and conditioner did quite enough! Other friends have had also had a good experience with them.
I also liked this Aveda product to lift at the roots.
Hope this is helpful, and good luck.
posted by sister nunchaku of love and mercy at 9:42 AM on July 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
One time my hairdresser got me to try Matrix Amplify shampoo, and hoo boy did that give my hair a lot of volume (not quite needed by me on an everyday basis)! Downside was buildup. but using a different shampoo every once in a while fixed that. I haven't tried the actual volumizing and lifting products in that line because the shampoo and conditioner did quite enough! Other friends have had also had a good experience with them.
I also liked this Aveda product to lift at the roots.
Hope this is helpful, and good luck.
posted by sister nunchaku of love and mercy at 9:42 AM on July 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Use mousse on the roots when damp. (I'm using some kind of Oscar Blandi sample right now.) Blow-dry upside-down, then put hair up. If I skip product and blow-drying I look bald on top. Long face-framing bangs help too.
I too am disappointed that updos are somewhat more work than just wearing it down. (I am not a regular blow-dryer.)
posted by purpleclover at 9:45 AM on July 29, 2013
I too am disappointed that updos are somewhat more work than just wearing it down. (I am not a regular blow-dryer.)
posted by purpleclover at 9:45 AM on July 29, 2013
You and I are hair buddies so here is my golden magical tip. It's not for a posh, special up-do because I don't think we're ever going to be able to do those without the aid of a very good hairdresser.
However, try this: when your hair is still just slightly damp from washing, and only brushed the absolute minimum if at all, bend forward til your head is upside down. Grasp all your hair at the crown about an inch away from your head and pull it through a band, then again into a loop-ponytail, the messier the better.
When you straighten up, it should fall just behind your head and hang down just a little. Pull little bunches out of the strands that are lying along the top of your head, so it's a bit lumpy and messy on top. Spray it with hairspray a bit once you've got it how you like it.
Now, what you have here is an up-do that makes you look like you have a ton more hair than you do, because it all poofs out where it hangs down a bit, plus it's impossible to pull your hair tight and neat when you do it the upside down way which is good for us fine hair people. BUT here is the best bit: you also have a down do, because when you pull out the band (for the night out at the end of your up-do day) your hair has been pulled upwards or outwards all day and so it has CRAZY VOLUME like you can't get with products, not that will last anyway.
PS: bonus tip, I only use shampoo once a week and wash my hair with cheap conditioner the other days - shampoo strips our weakling hairs of moisture and volume.
posted by greenish at 9:45 AM on July 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
However, try this: when your hair is still just slightly damp from washing, and only brushed the absolute minimum if at all, bend forward til your head is upside down. Grasp all your hair at the crown about an inch away from your head and pull it through a band, then again into a loop-ponytail, the messier the better.
When you straighten up, it should fall just behind your head and hang down just a little. Pull little bunches out of the strands that are lying along the top of your head, so it's a bit lumpy and messy on top. Spray it with hairspray a bit once you've got it how you like it.
Now, what you have here is an up-do that makes you look like you have a ton more hair than you do, because it all poofs out where it hangs down a bit, plus it's impossible to pull your hair tight and neat when you do it the upside down way which is good for us fine hair people. BUT here is the best bit: you also have a down do, because when you pull out the band (for the night out at the end of your up-do day) your hair has been pulled upwards or outwards all day and so it has CRAZY VOLUME like you can't get with products, not that will last anyway.
PS: bonus tip, I only use shampoo once a week and wash my hair with cheap conditioner the other days - shampoo strips our weakling hairs of moisture and volume.
posted by greenish at 9:45 AM on July 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
Best answer: Thin, limp, shoulder-length fine hair here (and lots of it, wheee.) And I can't stand wearing it down, and I hate how it looks short, and I just want to KILL IT WITH FIRE but anyway:
Sea salt spray is your friend! Bumble and Bumble makes probably the best version, in terms of being light and easy to work with, but even the cheapy drugstore versions will work. I like John Frieda, but it's hard to come by sometimes.
The salt spray will make the strands look thicker and it dries things out so they don't look greasy. It coarsens the surface enough that things like the spin pins or a small claw clip will actually grasp the hair, instead of just sliding on out. If you put it on damp hair and blow dry, it doesn't even look frizzy--just fuller. Spraying it on dry hair will make it look messy and a little frizzy.
posted by like_a_friend at 9:52 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Sea salt spray is your friend! Bumble and Bumble makes probably the best version, in terms of being light and easy to work with, but even the cheapy drugstore versions will work. I like John Frieda, but it's hard to come by sometimes.
The salt spray will make the strands look thicker and it dries things out so they don't look greasy. It coarsens the surface enough that things like the spin pins or a small claw clip will actually grasp the hair, instead of just sliding on out. If you put it on damp hair and blow dry, it doesn't even look frizzy--just fuller. Spraying it on dry hair will make it look messy and a little frizzy.
posted by like_a_friend at 9:52 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
The challenge that I have with my fine/slick hair is that I need whatever appliance (clip, rubber-band, barette, etc) to hold the hair really tightly, otherwise it all falls apart - either the appliance droops and sides down my head, or big locks of hair slide out and fall into my face, or both. I've got less hair than most people, in that the diameter of a ponytail that includes every strand of hair on my head is somewhere between 1/2" and 3/4", and most appliances are sized to hold a lot more hair than that. Thus, I rely on adjustable things, like rubber bands, and rubberized clips, and barettes that have multiple closure levels.
The problem is, the easiest way to be sure I've got all my hair in the clip is to slick my hair back. I've learned to resist that temptation. I had my hair done for a wedding and the lady tease the heck out of it. Mousse, backcombing each section like crazy, and then bundling them gently into an updo (the kind of thing that I'm thinking "that'll never stay!"), and coat the whole thing in hairspray until I realize nothing's ever falling out again. It looked great, but that's not how I want to live. I can kind of replicate it on special occasions, though.
My standard is a messy french-twist, grabbed in one of these rubberized clips (1,2). I bundle it all together in one hand, keeping my part in front because I don't like the way it looks brushed straight back, then twist that bundle repeatedly and fold it up against the back of my head, then grab the whole mess with the clip, leaving all the ends flopping over to one side. Having the ends of my hair loose like that makes the pull-back not seem so severe.
posted by aimedwander at 9:54 AM on July 29, 2013
The problem is, the easiest way to be sure I've got all my hair in the clip is to slick my hair back. I've learned to resist that temptation. I had my hair done for a wedding and the lady tease the heck out of it. Mousse, backcombing each section like crazy, and then bundling them gently into an updo (the kind of thing that I'm thinking "that'll never stay!"), and coat the whole thing in hairspray until I realize nothing's ever falling out again. It looked great, but that's not how I want to live. I can kind of replicate it on special occasions, though.
My standard is a messy french-twist, grabbed in one of these rubberized clips (1,2). I bundle it all together in one hand, keeping my part in front because I don't like the way it looks brushed straight back, then twist that bundle repeatedly and fold it up against the back of my head, then grab the whole mess with the clip, leaving all the ends flopping over to one side. Having the ends of my hair loose like that makes the pull-back not seem so severe.
posted by aimedwander at 9:54 AM on July 29, 2013
Long hair was very crucial to my sense of self and sense of femininity, such as it is, for many years. I cut it off several times (same hair profile as yours), but just couldn't get into short hair.
The major way for me is to blow-dry upside down and use standard non-aerosol hairspray. Then put into a bun without combing through.
One day I saw one too many 50something frumpy intellectuals on the train. My look of record. Long stringy hair. Style not updated since grad school. That's it, I said. Got a haircut. Much happier.
posted by skbw at 10:02 AM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
The major way for me is to blow-dry upside down and use standard non-aerosol hairspray. Then put into a bun without combing through.
One day I saw one too many 50something frumpy intellectuals on the train. My look of record. Long stringy hair. Style not updated since grad school. That's it, I said. Got a haircut. Much happier.
posted by skbw at 10:02 AM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I have fine/thin hair, shoulder length. I'm not surprised that you haven't found a good stylist, you'd think always-straight hair would be easy! Apparently that is not the case! If you happen to be in DC I can make a good recommendation, though.
I've had luck with a little bit of Redken Full Frame 07 Mousse just at the roots. It doesn't seem to weigh my hair down. Post-shower, mousse, blow dry (I half-ass the blow dry, it's fine). I also keep a small aerosol dry shampoo (I use Serge Normant, ymmv) in my purse at all times. A minute in the bathroom, flip head over, spray, back up again, run fingers through hair to comb into place. Hair miracle.
posted by troika at 10:05 AM on July 29, 2013
I've had luck with a little bit of Redken Full Frame 07 Mousse just at the roots. It doesn't seem to weigh my hair down. Post-shower, mousse, blow dry (I half-ass the blow dry, it's fine). I also keep a small aerosol dry shampoo (I use Serge Normant, ymmv) in my purse at all times. A minute in the bathroom, flip head over, spray, back up again, run fingers through hair to comb into place. Hair miracle.
posted by troika at 10:05 AM on July 29, 2013
For special event fancypants up-do hair, if it's frequent enough to annoy you, I would suggest investing in a clip-on fancy hairpiece. If you wanna be super fancy you can have it specially dyed to match your hair. Otherwise just approximate. A coworker of mine is an older woman with thinning hair (not the same as a full head of wispy hair, I know) does this and it looks great.
posted by elizardbits at 10:05 AM on July 29, 2013
posted by elizardbits at 10:05 AM on July 29, 2013
Response by poster: Awesome suggestions so far everyone! And yes troika I'm in the DC area (NoVA). The humidity here does not help with the hair (flat top, poufy bottom..stupid triangle shaped hair) and I'll be working in a corporate/government environment (maybe maybe not relevant info). Please keep the suggestions coming!
posted by driedmango at 10:11 AM on July 29, 2013
posted by driedmango at 10:11 AM on July 29, 2013
Yay! I can't speak for updos but for a cut, try Jess at Bang on U St.
posted by troika at 10:31 AM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by troika at 10:31 AM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
So, I know you tried a sock bun, but I didn't really understand from your post what went wrong with it. Then I googled the rolling down the sock bun method and figured it out -- that method totally would not work for me.
This is the method I use for making one. I wear one to work at least once a week, and have worn it to several weddings.
I have very thin, slippery hair; I used a leg from cotton tights that I cut the toe for the "sock"; I use these basic elastic-only bands (yes, they kind of tear my hair, but nothing else stays) - one wrapped a few times for the ponytail, then slide on the sock, splay hair and put an elastic over the whole thing (not wrapped), then bobby pin the ends around. This rolling method? Ain't nobody got hair for that.
posted by melissasaurus at 10:34 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
This is the method I use for making one. I wear one to work at least once a week, and have worn it to several weddings.
I have very thin, slippery hair; I used a leg from cotton tights that I cut the toe for the "sock"; I use these basic elastic-only bands (yes, they kind of tear my hair, but nothing else stays) - one wrapped a few times for the ponytail, then slide on the sock, splay hair and put an elastic over the whole thing (not wrapped), then bobby pin the ends around. This rolling method? Ain't nobody got hair for that.
posted by melissasaurus at 10:34 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Best answer: I have the same problem you do. My hair won't hold a curl, there's not enough of it to do those cute pinterest styles, most "volumizing" products do nothing, and little spiky pieces stick out everywhere when I try to put it in a bun or a twist. Here's how I get big hair and stable updos.
I bought some dry "volumizing powder" (the brand I use is got2b) and a ratting/teasing comb. When I shake the powder into my hair, it gets very tacky/sticky - seriously, it feels disgusting. Aggressive backcombing with the teasing comb, combined with the powder, will make it poof right out. Then I pin it with bobby pins in whatever style, and it stays put and looks good.
Here's the tutorial I learned this from: http://thehairpin.com/2011/09/the-big-hair-tutorial
You can also use the powder and just backcomb it a little bit if you want more volume when wearing your hair down. It's not great for an "everyday" style, since it turns your hair into a sticky monstrosity and is irritating to wash out; but you can accomplish some very nice-looking updos for special occasions.
I have also had some luck with putting my wet hair in rag curls and leaving them overnight.
posted by beatrice rex at 10:40 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
I bought some dry "volumizing powder" (the brand I use is got2b) and a ratting/teasing comb. When I shake the powder into my hair, it gets very tacky/sticky - seriously, it feels disgusting. Aggressive backcombing with the teasing comb, combined with the powder, will make it poof right out. Then I pin it with bobby pins in whatever style, and it stays put and looks good.
Here's the tutorial I learned this from: http://thehairpin.com/2011/09/the-big-hair-tutorial
You can also use the powder and just backcomb it a little bit if you want more volume when wearing your hair down. It's not great for an "everyday" style, since it turns your hair into a sticky monstrosity and is irritating to wash out; but you can accomplish some very nice-looking updos for special occasions.
I have also had some luck with putting my wet hair in rag curls and leaving them overnight.
posted by beatrice rex at 10:40 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Yes! The big hair tutorial from The Hairpin! That's what I came here to recommend.
I like this teasing comb and this hair powder, fwiw.
posted by k8lin at 10:46 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
I like this teasing comb and this hair powder, fwiw.
posted by k8lin at 10:46 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
You sweep your own hair back and secure it into a ponytail or something. Then you use a bun made of fake hair, which you can buy at Walgreens, to make it look like more is going on.
The fake bun, which resembles a small guinea pig, then becomes a point of great pride among your fellow thespians, such that you refer to it as the Hair Turd, and you have a lot of fun figuring out how to play with it, because it sure beats spending three hours on curls that won't stay anyway.
At least that's what my friend did. And WE liked it.
posted by Madamina at 11:19 AM on July 29, 2013
The fake bun, which resembles a small guinea pig, then becomes a point of great pride among your fellow thespians, such that you refer to it as the Hair Turd, and you have a lot of fun figuring out how to play with it, because it sure beats spending three hours on curls that won't stay anyway.
At least that's what my friend did. And WE liked it.
posted by Madamina at 11:19 AM on July 29, 2013
You must check out the Perfect Pony by Conair. It's like an instant boob job for your hair. The best $5 you will ever spend, guaranteed.
posted by rada at 11:27 AM on July 29, 2013
posted by rada at 11:27 AM on July 29, 2013
I also have very fine and stick straight hair. In general I've found that my hair looks much more voluminous on top of my head when I keep it shorter-- the longer it is, the more the length pulls down the roots. So, maybe consider that your hair type will lend itself better to a short cut?
Aside from that, get yourself some Schwarzkopf Dust It powder and sprinkle it along your crown, using your fingers to sort of rub it into the roots and fluff the hair upwards. This stuff is AMAZING.
posted by joan_holloway at 11:51 AM on July 29, 2013
Aside from that, get yourself some Schwarzkopf Dust It powder and sprinkle it along your crown, using your fingers to sort of rub it into the roots and fluff the hair upwards. This stuff is AMAZING.
posted by joan_holloway at 11:51 AM on July 29, 2013
A fine-haired friend of mine uses hair extensions for just this purpose-- I hung out with her while she was getting her hair done for her wedding, and was astonished at the difference just a couple of small extensions made in the "lie" and styleability of the hair. You can get sewn-in semi-permanent extensions, obviously, but she went with nice clip-in ones with real human hair from Sally Beauty Supply-- I think she said the price ran ~$70 or so.
posted by Bardolph at 5:27 PM on July 29, 2013
posted by Bardolph at 5:27 PM on July 29, 2013
I have straight, fine hair too and it looks best when I get it cut often (every 5-6 weeks). The style I've had the most success with is a bob with side-swept bangs (sorta like this). My all-time, can't-live-without-it favorite product is Aveda Phomollient. I think spray-on dry shampoo is pretty great for our kind of hair, too, but I can't stand the chemically smell.
posted by jrichards at 7:04 PM on July 29, 2013
posted by jrichards at 7:04 PM on July 29, 2013
Have you considered adding a hair accessory to the Gibson roll? I have remarkably similar hair to yours and usually wear some kind of flowered headband when I wear my hair that way. If that's too girly or cutesy for your style, what about a headwrap, scarf, pin, or clip? There are loads out there to choose from to suit just about any taste.
posted by pecanpies at 7:07 PM on July 29, 2013
posted by pecanpies at 7:07 PM on July 29, 2013
I have fine straight hair and have also pretty much given up on doing anything with it. My go-to wedding 'do is a low bun on one side, with flowers tucked just over the bun to hide any wonky sticky-outty pieces. Steal a blossom from a bridesmaid or a table arrangement. Gorgeous, keeps my hair off my neck and out of my face, and very simple to do. And bonus, you'll match the decor!
posted by Liesl at 12:26 PM on July 30, 2013
posted by Liesl at 12:26 PM on July 30, 2013
I know you said curls fall out, but have you tried the headband method? This works on my daughter's fine, silky hair, which otherwise doesn't hold curl.
I have a friend with hair like yours, and she does a lot of twisting back. Stuff like this. So adorable! You don't even need to take the twist into a braid, you could just twist and pin it back.
posted by yawper at 7:42 PM on July 30, 2013
I have a friend with hair like yours, and she does a lot of twisting back. Stuff like this. So adorable! You don't even need to take the twist into a braid, you could just twist and pin it back.
posted by yawper at 7:42 PM on July 30, 2013
Response by poster: You all are awesome! I marked a few as best because they were the ones I had literally NEVER heard of as a solution to limp non voluminous hair. I'll be busy the next few weeks playing with different methods and products for my hair. Definitely will give volume shampoos and mousse another shot as well as trying out the whole not washing the hair everyday thing. I actually cut my hair about two days after I asked this question and can definitely see more bounce/volume up top.
posted by driedmango at 6:24 PM on August 4, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by driedmango at 6:24 PM on August 4, 2013 [1 favorite]
Small addendum...I don't know how far your hair is on the pathologically thin spectrum, but my mother has pretty frighteningly thin hair and straight up rats it out with hairspray and a pick. Other commenters allude to this, but let me be clear, she teases every bit of it. Then she puts the whole thing into a French twist. Has it down to a science, not even 5 min. This could work for corporate. For outside work you may want to look into other ideas.
posted by skbw at 5:36 AM on August 9, 2013
posted by skbw at 5:36 AM on August 9, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
I do a french twist, which is easy, can be messy or sleek, and works with all kinds of looks. But it won't stay up if I don't have sticky products in it.
posted by feste at 9:35 AM on July 29, 2013