Should I file a police report?
July 26, 2013 2:01 PM   Subscribe

A person I knew had sex with me when I was very drunk and I don't remember giving consent. But I'm reluctant to file a police report.

I have a friend. We used to be platonic roommates a few years ago in a different city, and now are living in the same city again.

When we were living together, he was fine. We were friendly but he traveled all the time for work, and I wouldn't characterize us as that close. On the last night he was living there, he invited me to a going away party, and later that night the conversation turned flirty-sexual. When we got home and went to our respective rooms, he texted me asking me to come up to his room for sex. I said no, and ignored his texts for the rest of the night. I was angry and creeped out at the time. Later, a couple of years later, when I first moved into the city, we met up for drinks and I let him know that he had made me uncomfortable, that I thought it was inappropriate, and I felt it was creepy. He seemed remorseful, and apologized, and we continued talking about work and careers in a friendly manner. He's significantly older than me and more advanced in his career, and began inviting me to some work functions to help me network.

I applied for a job at his company, was rejected, and texted him to let him know. He gave me some friendly grief for not using him as a connection (I passed my resume onto another person at the company who had specifically asked for my resume) and invited me to drinks at a hotel he was staying at. He stays occasionally at this hotel when he's working in the city, and I assumed it would be a few drinks to catch up.

Before meeting up, I texted a mutual friend that I was meeting this guy for drinks, and she responded, "Haha! be careful! You may end up in his bed tonight." I responded, "Oh god ew. Was rejected from Company, we're kind of talking shop."

It was actually a sales conference, which was why he was in the city, and an open bar. I didn't have anything to eat earlier, and didn't check my alcohol intake. When I realized I was getting too drunk, I told him I needed to eat something, and ordered a pizza. I ate most of it, but wasn't able to sober up. At this time I commenced drunk texting some people, and looking back on those messages, they were nearly completely unintelligible.

At some point I told him that I was too drunk, that I needed to go lie down, and he took me to his room. I remember looking out at the view, and then lying down. At some point he was in bed with me, and then touching me, saying/asking something like "why are you wet", and I responded, "No, I'm not wet." Then at some point he was having sex with me, and I stupidly asked, "X, are we having sex?" and then not doing anything. I felt resigned, like he had finally gotten me. Most shamefully, I remember moaning like I was into it. At some point, he said that we should have done this years ago.

Those are the things I remember. I woke up with a hangover, lay in bed, asked for water, and he left early in the morning. I threw up the water, some of what must have been the pizza, went home, took a shower and stayed in bed.

The next day, I decided to tell my new-ish boyfriend, and he said it was rape, and that I should go to the police. I said I didn't want to, and he said that there was a one very good reason I didn't want to go to the police--that I was very drunk and I had said yes to the guy. I got angry at this point because I don't think this actually happened, but there's no escaping the fact that I don't remember everything, and that when people blackout they can still see alert, interactive and conscious. But I don't think I initiated or gave consent. I said him, "It sounds like you'll lose respect for me if I don't go to the police." He responded, "Probably, yes."

The problem is, I don't actually want to file a police report. I don't think it'll do any good--I've read previously about how difficult it is to get a rape conviction, the backlog of rape kits, and quite frankly I feel ashamed that I put myself in this situation, and am ping-ponging back and forth about how he shouldn't have initiated regardless.

There's no trauma, I'm not hurt, and I took a shower. I feel angry that he had sex with me, but at the same time I knew what kind of person he was. I feel like this is a very grey area, and feel resentful of him and like I "lost". (Lost what? I'm not sure.) But I also don't feel like this is serious enough to go crying "rape!" and filing a report and having police take down my account and his account, it boiling down to a he said/she said, and nothing coming of it at all except me being branded as a drunk girl who pointed fingers.

I don't necessarily feel traumatized or incapacitated--I cried when I was telling my boyfriend what happened, but it was out of shame and feeling like I had cheated on him. I think that what is going to happen is that I'm going to be much more careful of my alcohol intake even with friends, and that I will avoid this person forever. I think theoretically that filing a report is the right thing to do, but the prospect of doing so does scare me and seems futile. What do I want to happen? I want him to apologize to me and not do this to anyone else, but I don't want to label this as "RAPE" either.

Theoretically, using the "if this happened to a friend" mind trick, I would be reacting just like my boyfriend, saying that this is a clear case of rape and that the person who had sex with me should be prosecuted. But now that it has happened to me, and I'm now a statistic, and now I know what it feels like (mildly, there was no tearing or violence) I'm reluctant to act beyond getting tested.
posted by blue rare to Human Relations (44 answers total) 8 users marked this as a favorite
 
Before meeting up, I texted a mutual friend that I was meeting this guy for drinks, and she responded, "Haha! be careful! You may end up in his bed tonight."

Call the police right now so that this serial rapist has a paper trail.
posted by oceanjesse at 2:09 PM on July 26, 2013 [34 favorites]


. I said him, "It sounds like you'll lose respect for me if I don't go to the police." He responded, "Probably, yes."

Your boyfriend is an asshole.
posted by desjardins at 2:09 PM on July 26, 2013 [180 favorites]


I'm really sorry you had this experience. Also, it seems your boyfriend is predicating whether you consented (and therefore, cheated) on whether you are willing to file a report about this guy. I can't begin to tell you how wrong I think that is.

If you were my friend, I would tell you not to let anyone shame you into doing something that makes you feel uncomfortable. I would support you either way.

I do think that you may feel differently about this incident as time passes.
posted by sm1tten at 2:13 PM on July 26, 2013 [17 favorites]


blue rare: "moaning like I was into it"

Doesn't matter. Your body was having a physical reaction to a stimulus. Doesn't mean you mentally wanted it.

blue rare: "that I was very drunk and I had said yes to the guy"

Doesn't matter. Still rape.

blue rare: "how difficult it is to get a rape conviction, the backlog of rape kits, and quite frankly I feel ashamed that I put myself in this situation"

Don't know about the first two points, but that last one is something he's counting on.

blue rare: "There's no trauma"

Bullshit. You were raped, which by definition is trauma.

blue rare: " don't feel like this is serious enough to go crying "rape!" and filing a report"

You were raped, which makes this serious enough.
posted by theichibun at 2:14 PM on July 26, 2013 [6 favorites]


Okay, listen: he raped you. You did not give consent. I don't want to make you feel traumatized or upset. If you are not traumatized, that's good! But don't try to explain that what he did was anything but rape.

Look: if you don't file a police report, this 'friend' will never realize the extent of what his actions were, and also will possibly do this again to another woman. You were obviously very intoxicated, to the point where you came to during sex, and ASKED him if he was having sex with you.

Please, please. Please file a police report. Bring a friend or family member with you (NOT your new boyfriend), and file the report. This doesn't mean you have to press charges, it's just the first step.

Your new boyfriend should NOT be a factor in this decision. You shouldn't file or not file because of anything your boyfriend said or how he feels. It's not about him right now, its about YOU.

http://womenshealth.about.com/lw/Health-Medicine/Womens-Health/After-Rape-Getting-a-Medical-nbsp-Exam-is-Essential.htm

I am so sorry this happened to you. Please report this. Even if you don't press full charges, perhaps you can start an official mediation with the asshole who RAPED you, so, as you said, perhaps he won't do this to anyone else ever again.

Being too drunk to talk or respond or to be passed out is NOT consent. It's just not. Good luck.
posted by zettoo at 2:14 PM on July 26, 2013 [3 favorites]


This sounds like rape to me. I am so sorry. That doesn't mean there are a set of steps that have to happen now, that you have to report anything, etc. It is absolutely okay for you to take time, not report, report, whatever. You had some of your agency taken from you and it's important that you don't feel forced into more choices by some other dude (your boyfriend).

Some people will feel you have an obligation to report, and it sounds like your boyfriend is one of those. With all respect, he needs to back the fuck off. If you need to take time to process what you want to do, it's not for him to judge you or assume that since you don't want to go through the extensive hassle of reporting just after a traumatic experience. Please call RAINN or your local support line and talk this through with them.

Again, I'm so sorry. Getting drunk is not an invitation for someone to rape you. Even if you were, at some point, flirtatious while blacked out, you were BLACKED OUT. The onus is not on you to fend off some sketchy guy, the onus is on him to only have sex with people who want to have sex with him. Please also consider that this may be a pattern with him and a lot of people take advantage of drinking, politeness, and socialization to make people feel as confused and violated as you do right now. Take care of yourself.
posted by c'mon sea legs at 2:14 PM on July 26, 2013 [8 favorites]


You were definitely raped. Lacking the ability to say no is not consent. Drunk consent is not consent. You may experience feelings of grief now, later, or not. You have a right to feel ANYTHING you feel.

As for your new boyfriend, he is an unsupportive piece of shit, a victim blamer, and someone who is allowing rape culture to continue. No you do not have to file a police report if you don't want to, if it makes you uncomfortable, or if you're just not interested.

You can consider talking to someone, maybe someone at RAINN, about your experiences. This has to be a stressful time for you. Please take care of yourself, and whatever you do, remember that this is NOT YOUR FAULT. I'm so sorry.
posted by fireandthud at 2:18 PM on July 26, 2013 [8 favorites]


Any chance he slipped you a roofie?
posted by carmicha at 2:18 PM on July 26, 2013 [26 favorites]


There's no doubt in my mind that it was rape, from what you have written I do have to wonder if he slipped something into your drink. I used to be of the thought that every woman should report, to prevent repeated rapes. Reading stories of women reporting their rapes has changed my mind. That said, I have read reports where the police do act in a compassionate and professional manner and the outcome is to the survivors benefit.

In the end, the decision is completely up to you. Being able to exercise your power in this choice is important. Your boyfriend is being an asshole.
posted by Dynex at 2:18 PM on July 26, 2013 [6 favorites]


he said that there was a one very good reason I didn't want to go to the police--that I was very drunk and I had said yes to the guy.

This part stands out. A prime motivation for a false rape accusation is often to assuage the jealousy of the alleged victim's romantic partner. "If you don't report it, I guess you were cheating" is as explicit as it gets and a rather low blow from your boyfriend. I am not saying whether or not rape occurred in this case, only that the boyfriend should not be involved other than to support your decision.

If you don't want to file a police report, then don't. File one only if you actually think you have been criminally victimized. You are the one who is best equipped to answer than question.

I am sorry that this happened.
posted by Tanizaki at 2:19 PM on July 26, 2013 [11 favorites]


First of all, you were raped. You aren't capable of consenting when you are drunk. Full Stop.

At least report the incident to the police. Walk in, sit down with a cop and give a statement.

"I would like to report a rape." Explain everything that happend truthfully, without your commentary. "We were friends, I was drunk, I laid down in his room, I realized he was having sex with me. I was unable to consent due to my extreme intoxication."

You don't have to tell them that you moaned, you don't have to tell them about the pizza.

You can tell the police, "I understand that these allegations are really hard to prove, I just want it on record so if someone else comes in they can see that they aren't the only one it happened to."

As for your current boyfriend, I dunno dude, I'd rather be with a guy who says, "I can't comprehend how you feel, I'll support any decision you make," than with some yutz who says, "I'll have less respect for you unless you report it."

Call a rape crisis center and discuss with one of the counselors there. They can help you weigh your options.

You didn't do anything wrong. You are blameless. This guy is a jerk and I truly hope he gets what's coming to him.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 2:24 PM on July 26, 2013 [20 favorites]


You don't have to file a police report if you don't want to. But maybe you'd like to talk with somebody? You can chat with a volunteer via the The National Sexual Assault Online Hotline and get more information and support.
posted by clearlydemon at 2:26 PM on July 26, 2013 [9 favorites]


Before meeting up, I texted a mutual friend that I was meeting this guy for drinks, and she responded, "Haha! be careful! You may end up in his bed tonight."

You know, i recently wrote a post on exactly this kind of crap. How many many friend groups at least contain at least one guy like this if only in a tertiary "yea he hangs out sometimes and shows up at parties" sense. And it only ever comes up after someone starts talking to their friends and then someone goes "Oh, you mean X, yea teehee he can be kinda like that sometimes" and totally minimize how fucked up that person is.

What you do about this is completely up to you, but having stood on the sidelines of a bunch of situations like this, this one seems pretty damn clear cut that the guys is a total "missing stair".

And guys like that count on operating in the "grey zone" and that anyone they victimize will be to self-doubting to actually do anything about it. It doesn't help that they essentially have wingmen in the mutual friends who minimize their actions.

I've seen far too many of this guys continue to act in this manner completely unimpeded because no one they victimize is confident enough to step forward. And it really, really makes me sad.

We can't(or at least, shouldn't) tell you what to do here. But in my personal opinion you should go to the cops. This guy isn't going to wake up one morning and go "oh god, i'm an awful person :O!!!". These types of dudes have a super entitled attitude and just convince themselves that the people they victimize "wanted it". He's looking at the same grey area stuff The Ichibun tackled above and using it to pat himself on the back.

I wouldn't let him.
posted by emptythought at 2:28 PM on July 26, 2013 [4 favorites]


Your boyfriend is victim-blaming, and for me, that would be something to dump him over.

Very few rape cases make it to trial, yes. Something that helps is if there's a paper trail of other accusations against the alleged rapist. So that would be one point in favor of reporting.

It is entirely your choice whether to pursue legal action, however. Not filing a report does NOT mean that you somehow consented. Filing a report and not having anything happen does NOT mean that you were not raped.

RAINN has more information (as well as links to hotlines and online chats, if you want more one-on-one support).
posted by jaguar at 2:29 PM on July 26, 2013 [6 favorites]


First, I'd like to nth that your boyfriend is being horrible. Really horrible. Your boyfriend's reaction, unfortunately, is an excellent example of why rape is frequently difficult to prove in court.

Please don't blame yourself for this. This was clearly rape. You were too drunk to consent, and you weren't aware of what was happening while it was happening to you. This man took advantage of you. The fact that you have vague memories of responding, sexually, does not change those facts. In fact, and not to get too graphic about it, studies have shown that physiological sexual arousal does not equal consent.

If you want to press charges, by all means, press them, as is your right. But don't try and justify his actions because you feel guilt. You are not the guilty party here; "I'm too drunk and I need to lie down" is not a sexual invitation. Make your decision based on what you want for yourself, not based on the rape-kit backlog, and certainly not based on your boyfriend's (sorry) slut-shaming, reprehensible attitude.
posted by sevensnowflakes at 2:33 PM on July 26, 2013 [6 favorites]


First, call a rape crisis center. They can provide you some really helpful information about what is likely to happen if you do go to the police and help you think through if you want to do that or not. In our area, you can even ask to have have an advocate go with you to the police station for moral support.

Second (maybe after you talk to the rape crisis center and get your own head clearer, you need to talk your boyfriend. We all say stupid things sometimes. The bottom line for me is that if, after talking about some more, he trusts you enough to believe that you are telling the truth and that he is willing trust your judgment and let you make your own decision about the police. (It is OK if he would make a different decision and you can talk about that but once you are clear about your choice, I would expect him to support you.) If he isn't able to do those to things that you have a serious problem in the relationship around trust and respect. If he can, then working this out should make your relationship stronger. I hope it will be the second.
posted by metahawk at 2:38 PM on July 26, 2013 [4 favorites]


This part sounds like a secondary consideration to you, but one of the reasons rape kits get backlogged is because most rape survivors know their rapist (somewhere between 60 and 85%), and the rapist often admits that sex took place but claims that it was consensual. In such cases, the rape kit doesn't really help prove anything, since the alleged rapist is already identified and both parties agree that there was sexual intercourse; nothing in a rape kit can prove lack of consent.

I bring that up only because law enforcement has gotten much, much better about taking rape accusations seriously and thoroughly following up on complaints. The backlog of rape kits is a problem, yes, but it may not be quite as condemning of law enforcement as it first seems.
posted by jaguar at 2:38 PM on July 26, 2013 [3 favorites]


I do think it's possible that he slipped something in your drink (you may think not because you drank so much, I do think it's possible even so) and that you would benefit from calling the rape crisis line right now to help you make a decision and possibly test to see if you were roofied.

You aren't left with two choices: report and it was rape, don't report and it wasn't rape. You can get worthwhile advice from experts who can clarify all your options while the iron is hot.

It's clear to me from your description that this was rape. Even if you specifically remember saying yes to him (and you say you don't think you did) it must have been obvious to him that you were too drunk to consent. At least that is my interpretation.

It's also clear to me that your bf isn't urging you to go to the cops out of moral conviction (and anyway it's not morally his decision) but in order to prove you didn't cheat on him. That's... Kind of despicable on his part. One guy uses his relationship with you to rape you, and the other guy uses his relationship with you to coerce and revictimize you, at least that is what this looks like to me. Do what *you* want.

But, I urge you to call the rape crisis centre about this. You don't have to follow through on anything they suggest either, but you won't be looking back and thinking "I wish I'd known I had option x or y before it was too late."
posted by tel3path at 2:39 PM on July 26, 2013 [13 favorites]


Whatever you decide, know one thing...

What does your decision have to do with other women who may be involved with this guy?

Nothing.

You would be no less of a good person if you decided solely for yourself and not take any action. Reporting rape is not a walk in the halls of compassionate sympathetic justice. You don't start a difficult, extremely personal in the criminal justice system to carry someone else's burden, unless you are prepared and decided this is your fight for others along with yourself.
posted by Kruger5 at 2:39 PM on July 26, 2013 [16 favorites]


Agreed with everyone else that it is entirely up to you whether to report or not. Or to make a statement or not. Part of any kind of crime is that it makes you feel like you've lost some control of things - whatever will make you feel like you are taking that control back is what you should do.

Adding that, whatever you decide about the report, that you should dump that asshole of a boyfriend, or at least read him the riot act for being a rampaging douchepick. He does NOT get the right to tell you how to process this event. Hell, I got mad at my own boyfriend when I had a seriously scary and threatening obscene phone call and he implied a couple days later that I maybe was "letting it get to me" - if he'd said what your boyfriend said, hanging's too good for him.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 2:42 PM on July 26, 2013 [3 favorites]


First of all, I am so sorry this happened. He was wrong to take advantage of you. HE was wrong.

Please do what's best for you -- not for your boyfriend, not for some imaginary future potential rape victim, but for you.

The suggestion to call RAINN or another local rape crisis support line is right on. The counsellor can help you to assess your options and should also have recommendations for who your BF can talk to. I'll gently recommend that you not confide much more to him for the moment, as his judgment is not at its best right now. I'm sorry about that, too.

A man raped me under similar circumstances about 15 years ago, and I did not report it. You can PM me if you'd like to know more. I'll just say that I have mixed feelings -- including shame, frustration, anger, sadness, and guilt -- but I've largely come to accept and understand that I did what was best for others at the time, and have only started to work in the past 7 years or so to figure out and do what's best for me.

I'm thinking of you. Take care.
posted by LynnDee at 2:48 PM on July 26, 2013 [2 favorites]


Your boyfriend's response is shitty and awful. This doesn't mean he's a totally awful person, just that he's totally failing to empathize. He probably can't wrap his mind around the failures of our criminal justice system to bring rapists to justice and treat victims with respect. He probably can't imagine being the victim of sexual violence. And for some reason, he's channeling this ignorance into a terrible reaction to your situation, rather than letting you explain what you need from him. He may be able to come to an understanding of how unacceptably he responded, and he may be able to apologize in a way that is meaningful and contrite. Or he may be showing you a major defect in his character. Either way, I suggest you set his wishes aside for the moment.

You need to take care of your needs first. Please call a rape crisis center in your area, or national hotline. The phone counselors are trained to talk about exactly what you're going through, and they're there to support you, not to support a particular outcome.
posted by Meg_Murry at 2:53 PM on July 26, 2013 [12 favorites]


I feel angry that he had sex with me, but at the same time I knew what kind of person he was.

Oh, honey, I'm sorry this is the loop that's playing in your head. This is part of how women internalize a particularly insidious aspect of rape culture -- the idea that it's our (at least partial) responsibility to avoid being raped, but not fully a man's responsibility to refrain from raping in the first place.

He is 100% responsible; it doesn't matter even a little bit if you "knew what kind of person he was" or not.

Love and peace to you. I hope you will reach out to a crisis center, and that you take to heart that we are all sending you hugs and support. Please be gentle with yourself.
posted by scody at 2:58 PM on July 26, 2013 [47 favorites]


Can I suggest that you not take anyone's suggestion here about what constitutes rape as a legal term and go consult a lawyer if that's what you're thinking about? Because I think I see a lot of highly unqualified and emotional advice being given here.
posted by shivohum at 3:09 PM on July 26, 2013 [1 favorite]


First, I am very sorry this happened to you.

Second, I have been in the boyfriend's shoes, in which my partner was raped by someone known. He had pushed her into a vulnerable situation (which she lacked the ability to prevent, due to past psychological issues and conditioning and this guy's masterful manipulation skills), and he took advantage of her. I had a very difficult time coming to terms with this and understanding what had happened. Her first accounts that something horrible had happened were very emotional, and she was blaming herself so much and apologizing so much that at first I thought she was confessing to having cheated on me. Which threw me way off balance and I felt betrayed. Only a few hours later was she able to communicate that she had been violently raped, that she had been drunk but had been pressured to drink, that she didn't want it to happen but was not able to stop it for a whole lot of reasons. At which point I did this 180 degree turn the freight train around emotional swing and became the caring partner she needed, but fuck, that was confusing and difficult. I also struggled a lot with feeling powerless and like I had failed in protecting her.

She seemed okay afterwards, and three weeks later nearly attempted suicide. The psychological trauma of such a violation can take a while to bubble through you. Please consider reading this book, Resurrection After Rape, which is available for free on the website. It has really helped my partner in a way that most things failed to.

Reporting the rape is a very personal choice. My partner decided to report it to the police, and had a very traumatic experience in which she was told that "likely no crime had been committed" because she had never said a clear no -- a horrible response from people in positions of authority who should fucking know better -- and getting that thrown back in her face again nearly sent her over the edge.

But regardless of what you decide I want you to know that you matter. Feelings of shame and guilt are really common in rape victims. Victim-blaming is common in our culture. You are the one with agency and control in this situation; you get to choose what's right for you; but I would worry for you if you shrugged it off like nothing had happened. Take care of yourself. Again I highly recommend the book.
posted by anybodys at 3:09 PM on July 26, 2013 [15 favorites]


This has already been said in this thread, but having sex with someone who is too intoxicated to give proper consent- which you were- is rape. No matter who he is, what kind of person he is, what their past history is, whether she got off on it, whether she said "yes", whether he convinced her that she wanted it so it was really her fault- it doesn't matter. It's manipulation and sexual abuse. It is how pedos and molesters groom their abuse victims. It is rape. You were raped. There is no grey area here no matter how you, he, or anyone else tries to convince you there was. You were raped. He took advantage of you.

You were too drunk to be trusted to walk yourself to a cab. Do you really believe that, even if you had said "yes", that would be any kind of meaningful consent? Not on your life.

What you choose to do about it is up to you, but I hope you make a police report. If you choose not to, I understand and I respect your decision.

I hope you think long and hard about whether you keep your boyfriend. It sounds like you deserve better than what he can offer you. He sounds like a sexist creep. Sorry to say.
posted by windykites at 3:12 PM on July 26, 2013 [1 favorite]


I don't think it's a reason not to report but I do think you should keep in mind that he may use the fact that you were rejected from his company to argue that any charges were retaliation. I would just be prepared for that argument.

However, as I said, the fact that he would argue doesn't mean he'd automatically win. In a situation where you're out on a limb and feeling vulnerable, any argument your enemy could possibly make sounds like a winner, any action he might take sounds like a life-ruiner, and anything you might say or do seems, in your mind, like trying to fight off a horde of Mongol invaders with a handful of wet noodles. In reality the deck is rarely stacked so completely against you.

Again, not urging you to report, just urging you not to assume that *anything* you eventually choose to do will be futile. You'll do the best thing, and you'll do it from a position of strength.
posted by tel3path at 3:19 PM on July 26, 2013


Just to say, if you're not feeling traumatized, then that's wonderful and don't let anyone tell you that your lack of a sense of trauma is "bullshit". You are under no obligation to be psychologically scarred by this in any way.
posted by zeri at 3:28 PM on July 26, 2013 [37 favorites]


Strongly seconding what scody said....

Mostly I hope you will focus first and foremost on taking care of yourself, and that even if and when you aren't sure how to do that, that you will try to keep that as a priority.
posted by BigHeartedGuy at 3:47 PM on July 26, 2013


I'm sorry this happened to you. I think you're being pretty hard on yourself. If a friend had told you that this had happened to her, what would you say? I would say, what happened is not your fault, I'll support whatever decision you make about filing a complaint or pressing charges and if you ever want to talk, I'm here for you. I might also say that your boyfriend sucks.

This guy took advantage of you. I think someone should tell him that what he did is Not Okay. You can tell him that in person, on the phone, in a letter, in an email. You can tell the police. You can tell a counselor. You can tell your friends. You should definitely tell your boyfriend. But please start by telling yourself.

And if you see this guy around, leave. It sucks that you have to leave because he showed up but for me, it's a way of reminding myself that what he did was Wrong. I saw a guy who had sex with me when I was super drunk at an event and I left. Friends tried to convince me to stay - one guy actually wanted me to give him a hug - but I left. It's a small thing but it felt like I was reclaiming some integrity.

You don't have anything to be ashamed of. If you were passed out drunk wearing nothing but a sign that said "please have sex with me," it still would not be okay.
posted by kat518 at 3:48 PM on July 26, 2013 [2 favorites]


If your desire is some kind of "justice" for you personally, that is a real long shot. A friend of a friend was violated with a broom handle while very drunk by a guy she invited home. She went to the police. The actively discouraged her from filing. I think she met the guy at an AA meeting, then got rip roaring drunk with him. So, yes, your drunken state may be held against you.

If your desire is to try to start a paper trail, change his behavior, possibly protect other women, a police report may help from that end.

If this just happened, yes get tested for possible roofie drugs as a minimum.

Also, I strongly suggest you start journaling. I think your intent to be more careful with alcohol in the future is a good plan but if you were roofied, your alcohol consumption per se may not be as relevant to this incident as you think. However,the self blame, confusion, etc that you feel is something that will make you a relatively easy mark for other men. For that reason, I am concerned for your future welfare. The healthy reaction here is to be mad as hell, not ashamed.

I spent one night consensually with a guy who disregarded my statement that a condom was a necessity for health reasons even if pregnancy was not a concern. I was ill and on a lot of medication and not in a good position, mentally or logistically, to make a huge deal at the time and just say "oh, hell no", which is what I should have done, but he will never touch me again so long as I live. He is a pig. I don't care if you did say "yes" somewhere in there. This man is a pig and even if the law says "nope, consenting sex, no rape occurred," if it were me, I would be mad as hell. Decent men do not take advantage of women like that, with callous disregard for their welfare.

Rape culture is not just about the assholery some men think is okay. We women drink the koolaid too and it is, absolutely, poisoned. The shame, self doubt, etc that you feel is rape culture talking. If you hadn't been brainwashed by the larger culture, I think you would be livid, not ashamed. I think you need to work on that internal dialogue in order to be safer. I do not say that to blame you. I say it to empower you. Working on that piece of it will help you learn how to be less vulnerable to the assholes in the world. I think that is important for your future welfare, whatever you decide to do about this incident.

(((((hugs, if you want them)))))
posted by Michele in California at 4:12 PM on July 26, 2013 [6 favorites]


This sound like a situation that a Rape crisis hotline should be able to help you work through. I am so sorry that you are going through this.
posted by vignettist at 4:22 PM on July 26, 2013 [3 favorites]


This guy sounds like an utter asshole and your boyfriend is just abjectly failing a pretty crucial test. On the other hand, I'd really like to nth the recommendation that you talk to people with real expertise in this area; a rape crisis hotline being an obvious place to start. While I don't think there's any question about this jerk's ethical culpability, I can't say the situation you describe sounds to my (non-legal-professional) ears like one that would have much of a chance of resulting in a successful rape prosecution. I'm also not sure that prior accusations of rape without accompanying convictions would do all that much to lay a "paper trail" that makes this guy more likely to be convicted in future. It's often enough the case that prior convictions get blocked from being brought up in court, I would think a halfway competent lawyer could prevent prior accusations from being admitted as evidence of anything. In any case, someone at a rape crisis hotline will be able to talk through your options (and help you clarify your feelings) about all these matters.

Above all, though, I think when facing something as awful and weighty as the decision whether or not to take this to the cops you really, really, need to be sure that whatever decision you make you're making it because you, personally, are confident it's the right decision for you. Being hassled into it because your boyfriend is failing horribly to be a mensch is not, ultimately, going to do you or your relationship with your boyfriend any good at all.
posted by yoink at 4:54 PM on July 26, 2013


"It sounds like you'll lose respect for me if I don't go to the police." He responded, "Probably, yes."

What a horrible, HORRIBLE thing of him to say. You were raped, and now your boyfriend, who you hoped would support you, he wants to coerce you and manipulate you to do something regardless of your wishes on the matter. Hearing that your boyfriend reacted this way causes me to lose respect for him.

Your local rape crisis hotline should be able to tell you more about what would happen if you did go to the police, how the police in your area generally act towards people reporting a rape, and the best way to go about it. They will leave it up to you as to whether to involve the police, in fact one of the reasons the rape crisis center is there is so you can have someone to talk to without taking the step to go to the police. Another reason they are there is so you can have someone to talk to who won't react the way your boyfriend did. If you aren't sure what to say to them, you can just read them your question.

But I also don't feel like this is serious enough to go crying "rape!"... being branded as a drunk girl who pointed fingers.

Being branded by who? You were raped. Filing a police report is not the same as pressing charges, and you can't personally press charges. If the DA (or someone like that, IANAL) doesn't feel there is enough evidence this may never go to trial -- and if it does go to trial, the authorities listened to you, and felt like there was enough evidence to bring it to trial. I doubt your rapist is going to list off everyone who said he raped them. Unless you or your boyfriend tells people about this incident, how would people brand you? They won't know.

What do I want to happen? I want him to apologize to me and not do this to anyone else, but I don't want to label this as "RAPE" either.

You can label it whatever you want in your own head. The police will use their own term for it, and it might not be the one you would use -- if your house was robbed, you probably wouldn't be labeling it as larceny, or as a violation of state statue 16-8a, or however the police choose to label it. Also, the definition of the crime of rape does not take into account whether or not you feel traumatized or incapacitated, just like larceny would still be larceny even if you didn't feel traumatized by it.

Some people are very resilient. How resilient _you_ are has nothing to do with whether someone else committed a crime.

It seems like you are thinking that by going to the police you can get him to apologize to you -- the police cannot force him to do this, and are unlikely to view "getting him to apologize" as something they would attempt to do for a variety of reasons. You can't keep him from doing this to anyone else, but you can (probably, depends on how things work in your jurisdiction) put a police report on file that the police will see if someone else reports being raped by him.

Google "rape crisis center cityname" or if you have autocomplete on something for your region, county, or state might pop up before you get the city entered. No need to wait for Monday, they are often staffed 24 hours.
posted by yohko at 5:35 PM on July 26, 2013 [2 favorites]


Tel3path: "One guy uses his relationship with you to rape you, and the other guy uses his relationship with you to coerce and revictimize you."

THIS. In your position, I would drop your boyfriend: if you choose not to press charges, he has made it clear that he will not be in your support network should you need one. And that's pretty fucking shitty for someone who claims to care about you and whatever people say they'll be for their partners when they first pair up.

When I realized (yes! realized! months later!) that I was raped by a friend of mine, I immediately cut off anyone who blamed me or excused my rapist, as well as the people who tried to force one outcome or another. The "file charges or you're an enabler" friends were hardest to cut off, but I had to. You may not find that this particular method of coping helpful, but I bring it up to illustrate this: a good friend may be angry on your behalf, but they will not use THEIR anger to influence a course of action in a life they don't lead and the consequences of which THEY will not have to bear.

Please reach out to some professionals about this. Do not pay attention to how others may think that rape survivors are supposed to behave. DO pay attention, however, to how *you* feel. Do whatever makes your head clearest, like going for a run, and keep running - every day, or whenever you need access to that mental space - until you've reached a decision and feel comfortable with it. Please call the support hotlines linked above by previous commenters.

You had your agency taken away from you for a night. It may take you a while to feel like you have agency again, or you could wake up tomorrow with fire in your veins. Or somewhere in between. Whatever level of energy you currently possess, funnel all of it into taking care of yourself.

You're in my thoughts. PM me if you would like some friendly internet support.
posted by Ashen at 5:39 PM on July 26, 2013 [3 favorites]


I don't have new advice, but I just want to agree with a couple points:

It's totally fine to report or not report it. There are real consequences to reporting it, not the least of which is that you have to talk about the incident with multiple people and some of them may not be sympathetic.

There's no way you "should" feel. It's easy to get into weird logic where you feel guilty, and then feel angry for feeling guilty, etc. It might help to talk through your emotions with a sympathetic friend or even a rape crisis hotline. Even if you don't think you were raped, a rape crisis hotline deals with similar situations and may be able to provide guidance.

Your boyfriend is acting in a pretty cruel way when you looked to him for support. That would be a serious red flag if my partner did that. Please take care of yourself.
posted by yaymukund at 7:00 PM on July 26, 2013


Just FYI for everyone: When you dial RAINN's national sexual assault hotline in the US at 1.800.656.HOPE, it automatically forwards your call to the local rape crisis center nearest to the area code from which you are dialing. There's no real need to research numbers or contact info for local rape crisis centers in the US unless you're using a cell phone with an area code that's not local to your area (in which case you'll just be forwarded to the center that matches your area code, which is not the end of the world, either).

There's no staffed national sexual assault hotline; that number always forwards to a local center.

More info.
posted by jaguar at 7:46 PM on July 26, 2013 [1 favorite]


Reading over what you wrote, it does sound like you might have been drugged. Not sobering up at all after eating seems weird. You could call a hot line and ask about how to get tested for drugs and how long they stay in your system. If you were drugged, I think you'd have better odds of getting a conviction.
Even if you weren't drugged, this guy is a total low life. I can't imagine a decent person not being freaked out by someone asking "are we having sex?". It's obvious that you were impaired. Don't blame yourself about what happen. This guy is the one at fault.
posted by stray thoughts at 9:10 PM on July 26, 2013 [4 favorites]


i am so sorry this happened. it was in no way your fault. i imagine it is easy to tell someone "talk to the police" but a whole lot harder to do in a confusing situation. i do think talking to someone at a rape crisis center would help you figure out what your options are and what is best for you to do. also, it is possible you were drugged. i do think it is good that you want to get your drinking under control though. i think that is really important for you to stay safe in the future. be gentle with yourself and get all the help you need. surround yourself with supportive people and let them know what you need.
posted by wildflower at 9:54 PM on July 26, 2013


The problem is, I don't actually want to file a police report.

Then don't. Seriously. My house got mega robbed, and I didn't file a police report, for reasons like yours. Nobody said to me "if you don't file a report, I'll assume you're lying." (wtf??) Nobody said "you should file so that fewer crimes will occur in the future." Even when I was assaulted in the street, I didn't drive around with the cops trying to find the woman. My view was that the whole thing had been unpleasant enough already, I didn't need to spend hours calling, waiting, in a strange cop car with (nice? not nice?) cops. Nobody judged that; they were just sorry about what happened. I know it's natural that the "report it?" question becomes freighted, but I wish it didn't. It is perfectly valid to not report the crime. I'm sorry that our culture makes this such a freighted decision.

I am so sorry this happened to you. Fuck that guy. I can't believe he did that to you.

It's not your fault. You sound resilient and like you have good instincts about what to do now. It sounds like you know what to do to recover and heal. All the best. I'm so sorry. It's not your fault.
posted by salvia at 9:07 AM on July 27, 2013 [1 favorite]


Almost ten years back I was assaulted by a friend of a friend. I was certain I had been drugged, but did not file a police report. I don't regret that decision. What I do regret is not telling my friends (the ones that knew the assailant). We were, at the time, very close and trusted each other. They would have believed me, and would have watched out for creepy behavior from this guy in the future.

If you don't file a police report, please consider outing this guy to any mutual friends you trust. Don't let him operate in the gray area emptythought described above.
posted by youngergirl44 at 9:25 AM on July 27, 2013 [1 favorite]


I will add that you can out him without calling it rape. One of my few regrets:

I got moved at work to avoid a man who had called me "honey" or the like about three times. There was nothing particularly alarming that he did that. It wasn't sexual harrassment. But a week later I learned he was slated to become my new boss and was married. I told my current boss and was moved very, very quietly during a general departmental rearrangement that did not make it overly obvious that I was specifically being moved as an individual. Not long after, an old team mate, a very attractive woman, asked why I moved to a new team. I said I went where I was told to go, no big.

This man was later fired. The rumor mill suggested it was either sexual harrassment or an affair. At that time, my former teammate and I exchanged stories. She had put up with his crap for like two years -- inappropriate remarks, loading her up with punishing amounts of work and giving her so-so reviews. I felt bad about not saying "we can discuss it confidentially over coffee" or something. Maybe she would have gotten relief sooner. This guy also operated in a grey area and that made it hard to report him because it seemed like there was nothing really clearly wrong to report. If we had both gone to HR, she would have had more credibility. Instead, neither one of us ever reported him to HR.

Since this was not even supposed to be a date but was supposed to be work related networking and talking shop, I don't think you even have to call it "rape" to make it clear what a creep he is. You can put the word out that he had sex with you while you were in no shape to consent and he knew it and it was not even supposed to be a date. You can let other women know he is not to be trusted and is not a "nice" guy.

You can elaborate as much or as little as you like depending on how well you know the individual and trust them. You can let some folks know you had too much to drink. You can let others know that people have suggested it sounds like he drugged you. Either way, his idea of "consent" is less than above board and his respect for a woman's boundaries who has professional contact with him really blows chunks in a big way.

(And I will add that if he drugged you, the only relevance your alcohol consumption has is that it makes it harder for you to determine you were drugged. In other words, it is (posdibly) a manipulative cover story on his part to pin the blame on you and instill self doubt in you. If he had drugged your coffee, you could have ended up with the exact same outcome except a lot more clarity that it was him, not you at all. In other words, if he drugged your alcoholic beverage, he is not only a snake but a very sly snake, talented at making it look like he's innocent. Ugh. All the more disgusting in my book.)
posted by Michele in California at 12:25 PM on July 27, 2013 [1 favorite]


What a horrible, HORRIBLE thing of him to say. You were raped, and now your boyfriend, who you hoped would support you, he wants to coerce you and manipulate you to do something regardless of your wishes on the matter. Hearing that your boyfriend reacted this way causes me to lose respect for him.

Yes. It would be great for Mr. "I Don't Care What You Think/Want/Feel When I Feel I'm Right" to know that that a whole internet of women now see his "respect" as something pretty worthless and have lost respect for him in turn.
posted by cairdeas at 12:54 PM on July 27, 2013


If I were you, I would report it, promptly. This isn't ambiguous. You were too incapacitated to consent, and he had sex with you.
Now, in court, or to the police, he might say that you were not too incapacitated, and he might say that he was also drunk. It's most likely that the DA will not prosecute this, because of lack of physical or other evidence. Still, it'll be good to get a police report on record.

The sooner you report this, the better. The longer you wait, the more uncertainty there is along the lines of mistaken details, etc.

Some people may say, "It's your choice," etc., and not encourage you to report it. Like encouraging you is a bad thing. Let me say this. If I were in your shoes, and someone had done something awful to me that actually fits into the definition of a reportable crime, I'd report it.

I have been in a situation where someone harmed me and it wasn't a reportable crime. I wished every day that the justice system would have had even some small amount of recourse, but it didn't. Instead, I was consumed by thoughts of vigilantism for at least a year, because I wanted so badly to do SOMETHING to stop a subcriminal sociopath from harming others, but I didn't have any such option.

The conversation you had with your boyfriend is a red herring. Forget about it. I honestly feel really sorry for you that a) You'd even have posed that question to your bf, which demonstrates not only his assholery but how ingrained your subjugation is, that you'd expect it, and b) That you'd be blaming yourself at all. But that's more of a topic for a therapist and a lamentation about our sexist world. In your shoes, I might lose the awful boyfriend, but that's another topic.

The one reason, if I were you, to not report this crime would be an effect on your career. In my case, I didn't go forward with any act of vigilantism, because I didn't want to take even the miniscule risk that a) I would be caught in illegal activity, or b) this person would retaliate and come after either me or my family, or my family's business. For me, it was most important to empower myself in the long term through my career, and my family's business, and I didn't want to risk anything there. I would (sadly) consider that reporting this crime might have after effects for you in your line of work, if this guy is in your same line of work.

However -- if that outcome is highly unlikely, and he can't affect your capacity to make money or get jobs, then I'd report this crime so fast your head would spin. I wish, wish, wish that in a situation where I was a victim, I would have had some legal recourse. I am almost jealous of you because you have the option to report it.

When I was an undergrad, I did report a crime. There was a serial rapist working as an RA at our school. He didn't rape me, but he dated me and callously dumped me. I felt uncertain about reporting him to our school's offices (about the other women, not about myself), but I did it anyway. (I was president of the living group where he'd been getting undergrads drunk and having sex with them. One was so drunk that she had to be carried out of his room, and also a virgin.) I was uncertain because of the conflict of interest and I had voluntarily gotten mixed up with him myself, etc. He was kicked out. Now, many years later, I am tremendously glad I did that. As far as I know, he didn't go on to rape anyone else. And most importantly for me, I tell the story in my mind differently when there was a concrete outcome vs. if there hadn't been. The fact that I had any self blame for getting mixed up with him was almost all the more reason to report. It allowed me to tell a story where his crimes had some outside legitimacy, and in which my self esteem didn't plummet even more, from victimization AND self blame. I would say that for me, the benefits of reporting it only grew over time. It's something that many years later, I am even more glad than I did. I think he's still an asshole, but he went on to have a monogamous relationship, and to be out of the school system as an RA, and he didn't victimize anyone else in that specific way. If I dig deep, and I am being honest, I can still find a little tiny bit of uncertainty that it was the right choice. It's totally unclear what alternate futures I might have had, had I not made that choice (like any other). But, overall I would say that I am 98% confidently convinced that it was best to report.
posted by htid at 7:25 PM on July 27, 2013 [3 favorites]


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