Moving from London to NYC
May 18, 2013 11:38 AM   Subscribe

I'm 40, likely to be moving to NYC from London with my partner and 11 year old daughter, and am fortunate enough to have an apartment to rent out in London which gives me a budget of 5,000 dollars a month. Where would MeFi people recommend to live in Manhattan when looking for a 2 bedroom place with that budget? I have no clue, have never been there but it seems like the greatest place on Earth!
posted by colie to Home & Garden (23 answers total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
Depends where you are going to work, depends what your plans are for school for your daughter, depends on what your priorities are (nabe/space/age/doorman/elevator). $5000 is a nice budget for a two bedroom and you should be able to find something in every nabe, but nothing crazy. Some of the more desirable nabes there just isn't much in terms of housing stock of real two bedrooms.

So if you tell us more we can be more helpful.

BTW - this being MetaFilter the comment after mine will be "move to Brooklyn" - don't rule it out. You can afford Manhattan, but you might find the housing stock and neighborhoods offer more options for you.
posted by JPD at 11:53 AM on May 18, 2013


Best answer: Have you accounted for your daughter's education? Because that is potentially a big factor here. You're going to have difficulty getting her into a public (free) school that requires an entrance exam - it's super competitive and you'll have missed all the deadlines. That leaves selecting a neighbourhood specifically for the school, or adjusting your location and rental budget to accommodate $40,000 a year in private (fee paying) school tuition.

To me this would be the single most important factor in where to live, as you're potentially accounting not only for your commute but hers as well.
posted by DarlingBri at 11:56 AM on May 18, 2013 [2 favorites]


Yep, seconding the fact that your daughter's schooling is the number one issue since your budget is very good. With money to spend, every nieghborhood is nice so I would just worrying about making your school/work/home commutes short and pleasant, mainly based around where your daughter will be attending school.
posted by bquarters at 11:59 AM on May 18, 2013


Nthing that this depends on your daughter's school.
posted by Sara C. at 12:04 PM on May 18, 2013


Response by poster: Thanks guys for your replies, we will be moving in June 2014 but since I am already paying for my daughter's education in London, I expect to pay for it in NYC.

The NYC office is not found yet since I work for a little tech startup (I know, I know, but we've all got to earn a buck somehow...) so it's all up for grabs. I guess that having been pretty poor for my whole life, I've got a shot at a year or two of having it reasonably nice, so was just looking for recommendations along those lines. I know London very well in case anyone needs the same thing in reverse!
posted by colie at 12:26 PM on May 18, 2013


Best answer: Regardless of whether you go with public or private education, the specific location of your daughter's school is still the top priority in terms of where to live.

IME most plucky little start-ups tend to cluster "downtown", which for your purposes can be considered Manhattan south of 34th street and north of the Financial District. That said, it depends exactly how little your start-up is. Obviously a start-up can be run out of your apartment, or from a desk in a coworking space in Brooklyn, or a storefront in deepest Queens, or really anywhere. But if you plan to be in what passes for NYC's tech ghetto, it'll likely be downtown Manhattan.
posted by Sara C. at 12:30 PM on May 18, 2013 [1 favorite]


Yeah, it totally depends on where your kid is going to school, not whether you're paying for it or not. There are great public schools on the Upper West Side that are as good as some private schools.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:59 PM on May 18, 2013


but since I am already paying for my daughter's education in London, I expect to pay for it in NYC.

Then you would be well advised to start pondering your choice of private schools now, and planning to apply between September and December of this year. NYC schools are radically individual, with personalities as distinctive as the Hogwarts sorting hat destinations. (I am sure many Mefites can advise if you post a future Ask.) They can also be so competitive parents have been known to hire tutors for kindergarten admission. Also just check you're on top of the educational cost premium in the US; my British husband's fee paying school is now £15,000 per year; my NYC private school is now the most expensive school in America at $38,800 per year, but a host of top NYC schools are not far behind.
posted by DarlingBri at 2:58 PM on May 18, 2013 [1 favorite]


But keep in mind that if you daughter is 11 now and will be 12 when you move, you need to think ahead when considering schools since you could conceivably be moving to NYC during her last year of elementary school and then looking for her to move in 2 more years to a different middle/high school. The most intensive competitive year to change schools is for 9th grade. (I'm just guessing your 12 year old would be entering 6th grade, typically the last year of elementary school -- though some schools have combined lower/middle schools.)

Unless you find a private school that goes from elementary through 12th grade (and there are many), you will be involved in looking for high schools by the time she is halfway through middle school. ALmost everyone in nyc goes through the competitive, tutor-hiring, essay-practicing year in 8th grade in prep in order to have their choice of schools in 9th grade. Students in NYC typically travel all over Manhattan, and even trans-boroughs, to go to the high school of their choice. I'm not sure I would base where to live on one year of elementary school so I'm just advising to look at the big picture.
posted by third rail at 3:34 PM on May 18, 2013


Regardless of whether you go with public or private education, the specific location of your daughter's school is still the top priority in terms of where to live.


But keep in mind that if you go for private school, you will meet many, many families who do not live really near their kids' school even in elementary. People very typically cross town,or go up or downtown, for example, to get their kids to school. I would definitely get educated immediately about schools but you do not have to live right in the vicinity of the school unless you are sure you want to be zoned in that specific public school.
posted by third rail at 4:00 PM on May 18, 2013 [1 favorite]


Here is a blog post from a London mummy educating her children in Manhattan. I don't think she has a good grasp of the private school landscape in its particulars (her school lists and explanations are... not well versed) but she has the educational cultural shock down. Her explanation of the top tier public schools is of no use, either; while the Anderson School is yes, free and is yes, in the Upper West Side, it is arguably more difficult to get into than Harvard and where you live plays no role in admission.

Your daughter will have advantages, though. She will be an attractive candidate because diversity is very sought after and this includes expat families. She will likely test very well on her ERB (which she will need to take in London) through you will want to get a book and take practice runs seriously. Set aside several hundred quid to apply to probably half a dozen schools. And for God's sake pick six schools that go K - 12 so you only have to go through this hell once.

Anyway: figure out where you'll be working first. Then come back to tell us about your kid in another Ask and get a shortlist of schools. Narrow it down and it will be much, much easier to triangulate workable residential areas. Thirdrail is right that kids travel all over, but I'll tell you that my 20 minute subway ride from Union Square to 76th and Lex was absolute fucking bliss compared to some of my other educational commutes.
posted by DarlingBri at 4:01 PM on May 18, 2013 [3 favorites]


To get back to the question of the original post: I am a parent who had kids in NYC public and private schools (we moved from the city a couple of years ago) and still have nieces and nephews and lots of friends with families there, and I am there at least 5 times a year staying with families in many neighborhoods. So my opinion is based on a sense of how families I know live in NYC. If it were me, with that budget, I would look on the upper west side or morningside heights near riverside drive. You could get a lot of lovely room in a nice building there. I say that because it is relaxed, lots of green space, and just a very family oriented neighborhood. Personally, with kids, I like to be able to go outside my building and feel that I am in a relatively quiet, residential, non-commerical and non-touristy part of the city. After a long day at work I just think it is nice to have that sense of peace. Thiis a very very subjective opinion, but if I were moving back right now (waaaah) that is where I would pick to live. I personally would have no problem crossing the park to have my child go to school on the upper east side, or going up to Riverdale to one of the schools up there, if we could not find a school on the upper west, though yes, I would certainly not want to go from the upper west side to the lower east side, for example, or vice versa, if it turns out that is what your work commute would involve. OK, over and out, and good luck!
posted by third rail at 4:15 PM on May 18, 2013 [3 favorites]


Response by poster: Thanks everyone... I knew the schools thing was going to be tough but yikes it sounds ten times harder than London, and I thought that was bad. Going to revise the housing budget downwards I think.

But, persevering, if I was to try and get her into one of the fancy girls' schools on the Upper East Side (she goes to the London equivalent now, which nearly kills me financially, but I grew up in poor schools without any breaks so it's my thing now), would the fact that we are English and not wealthy count too much against us? Is there any point in trying?

Thanks again for all your posts.
posted by colie at 1:43 AM on May 19, 2013


Though I agree with third rail on the Upper Westside/Morningside Heights for quality of life with a child, the commute downtown is harrowing, not something I'd do voluntarily every day. And a tech start-up will probably be downtown...
Maybe Brooklyn?
posted by mumimor at 2:58 AM on May 19, 2013


I was to try and get her into one of the fancy girls' schools on the Upper East Side (she goes to the London equivalent now, which nearly kills me financially, but I grew up in poor schools without any breaks so it's my thing now), would the fact that we are English and not wealthy count too much against us?

Seriously it doesn't work that way these days. They want a good pool of applicants. Apply. And see the part about diversity.
posted by DarlingBri at 3:17 AM on May 19, 2013


Agree with Darling Bri -- absolutely apply if that is your thing.
Nightingale-Bamford might be the girls' school with the most financial aid potential?. But Brearley, Spence, Chapin, too will all *like* the fact that you are English, I think.

As for commuting: when you find out where your office will be, just make sure you can get there on one subway line. Changing trains is what makes commuting exhausting in NY. Most people who live uptown commute down to midtown or downtown for work, but do not try to switch trains to do so if you value your sanity. As mentioned above you can find a similarly gorgeous, peaceful residential neighborhood in Brooklyn as to the UWS and get a very nice place even with your budget shifted down for the school tuition. But if you are set on having your girl in an UES school, I think you will want to look at housing on the upper east or upper west side, depending on where your office turns out to be, so that you will have a single train commute downtown with no change of train, and still be able to have your daughter get to school uptown without a difficult commute for her.
posted by third rail at 3:34 AM on May 19, 2013 [1 favorite]


I would add to third rail's advice about commuting:

I lived on both the UWS and the Village, and went to an UWS school, an UES school and a Riverdale school. The best was Village > UWS or UES by subway because it was fast and easy. Middling was UWS > UES because cross-town buses are the suck. The worst was anywhere to Riverdale because the commute (by private buses) is just long and restrictive. If you're working downtown, I thinking living there makes the UES very doable.

The only other thing I would add is that by going for all-girls, UES schools (don't forget Hewitt, and Marymount which isn't actually Catholic no matter what they say), you are eliminating without exploration a breadth of educational opportunity that is simply not represented in English education. You will not find the like of Calhoun or Saint Ann's in the UK. And if you want to know how "good" these schools are, you look at their ollege admissions.

Anyway you might want to look at a wide range of options; a more diverse student body with more diverse interests and a student body from less uniformly very wealthy families than you'd typically find at Spence/Chapin/Nitengale can be prophylactic.
posted by DarlingBri at 5:56 AM on May 19, 2013 [1 favorite]


The worst was anywhere to Riverdale because the commute (by private buses) is just long and restrictive.

It is interesting, I think you'll find everyone has a different experience. I won't say explicitly my connection to this within my own family, but for us, going from the upper west side to Riverdale for high school has been and is currently very, very easy on the # 1 train or by the bus that leaves from the neighborhood and seems much improved from decades past; similarly, my best friends finds it very, very easy sending their chidren from the west side to Brearley, Hunter College elementary and high school, and other schools given the improved buses now. So I would really look into what's right for you and for what the commuting is like now.
posted by third rail at 6:05 AM on May 19, 2013


BTW St. Ann's is probably my personal favorite private school in all of NYC and would make life very easy if you were to choose to live in Brooklyn and work downtown. But it is very different from "a fancy upper east side girls school" if that is what you know you really want.
posted by third rail at 6:20 AM on May 19, 2013


Best answer: Living in Tribeca / West Village and going to St Ann's seems very much in keeping with a Londoner working at a tech company to me, although perhaps I'm vaguely assuming you're in creative to say that. Upper West Side (70s-90s) would be my suggestion if you want a little more traditional type neighborhood, access to Central Park, and an uptown school.

The east side is mostly dead above 14th street, while below 14th street is the opposite, maybe too loud and nightlifey these days though there are quiet streets, and there is a nice park (nothing like any of london's parks, but for new york it's something). In the 80s the east village was like the Deptford of NYC and the squatters camped out there, but things have changed.

That is one reason people move to brooklyn. Park Slope is, not surprisingly, by a big park, and the neighborhoods between it and manhattan on the subway have also been built up. I don't know how important greenery is to you, but as a Londoner you may take it for granted. New York is paved over for the most part. It relies on air conditioning to make summer survivable.

I guess the main thing is, what do you want out of your neighborhood?
posted by mdn at 12:45 PM on May 19, 2013 [3 favorites]


Response by poster: Thanks mdn, such a helpful comment... regarding what I want from a neighborhood, it's tricky because with a (just turned) 11 year old it seems I'm on the edge of still wanting greenery/cafes/schools, but then again if she might be 13-17 while we're there (or who knows how long) then maybe she would want the Manhattan dream of hanging out in crazy cool places as much as I do? On balance I think I want an area like Camden Town in London, if that makes sense to anyone.
Cheers!
posted by colie at 1:31 PM on May 19, 2013 [1 favorite]


Ah, if you're looking for Camden Town, the East Village is where I'd start. It's gotten a little mall-ified in recent years but there is still cool stuff going on and I bet you could find a very nice place with your budget. Curious what might be available I did a search, and discovered you could (or could have last year) rent Bret Easton Ellis's place. But it's a loft, not a two-bedroom :).
posted by mdn at 6:04 PM on May 19, 2013 [1 favorite]


I would pick neighborhood first. I think lots of people are understating the randomness and difficulty of getting your kids into name private schools. Especially at an odd age. You'll find a place somewhere, but it might not be where you originally thought it would be.

The mapping London nabes to NYC nabes thing is hard because physically the cities are so different. NYC and especially Manhattan are so compact that the trip from UES to the East Village via Express subway is about as long as the trip from Camden Town to Islington via underground.

So culturally it makes sense, but from a "living there" perspective it is quite different. I learned this the hard way in the opposite direction - all of my acquaintances in town lived in west London and I lived in Shoreditch - any night out with friends involved real travel for someone. Manhattan + Brownstone Brooklyn is quite compact by comparison.
posted by JPD at 8:49 AM on May 20, 2013 [1 favorite]


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