How do I hold onto my own identity and goals while in a relationship?

February 16, 2013 4:21 AM

I'm in a three-year relationship. Recently, I've had a chance to spend more of my time with my own friends and relatives, and independently of each other four of them have said a variation of the same thing to me: that I am ignoring my own needs/goals in favor of my boyfriend's.

I'm not sure if that is true, or if it is, if it is entirely a bad thing. Here's our situation: About a year ago, we moved to a place so that he could have a good job. It is a place neither of us like much, close to his family but far from mine. I did not want to move here, but I felt that our stress would be a lot less if he had a good job, so I didn't protest. I found a job here but despite continued searching couldn't find anything remotely related to what I want to do with my life, and I am working 3-5 jobs to make a little over half of what he does (which isn't much). He has turned out to not really like his job, either, and we both want to live somewhere with more culture, so I convinced him to start looking for jobs in the area where my family lives, which has more job opportunities for both of us and is more the type of place we'd like to live. I feel like I did ignore my own needs during that initial move, but I think I have reasserted myself.

The other issue is what he wants to do in the future. His dream job, if he gets it (probable), will involve moving pretty constantly for a few years. It will be hard, if not impossible, for me to practice in my chosen field in some of these places. I do want to have kids in the near future, so that might be a good time to do that, but I am pretty much going to be left without a lot of career options. I think him getting this job would be fun and interesting, but I'm nervous that I'll look back and realize that my life was a hodgepodge of part-time jobs and taking care of other people. (He has said that he would drop this idea if I decided I didn't want to do it.)

In general, he is very accommodating to my needs and I don't think the problem, if there is any, lies with him. I feel so unsure about what will make me happy and what I will be able to do ("I'd probably be bad at that job anyway, so I'll just keep working jobs that don't matter so I don't screw up anything important") that I feel like it's easier to try to make him happy, and my own happiness will follow. I know that I need more therapy, but the aforementioned multiple jobs/long commutes/no money makes it tough. Has anyone gotten better about figuring out what they need, and expressing it?

posted by chaiminda to human relations (22 answers total)

The framework I use is this: at the end of my life, I want to be the star of the movie they make of it. I don't want it to be mainly about how I played a supporting roll in the life's of my partner, offspring, friends, whatever.

I love being supportive of the people in my life, of course, in part because as a woman I'm socialized that way. And I'm always working to be sure the balance IS a balance, and that I'm not always fitting myself into THEIR stories.

This may not be specific enough advice to be useful, but maybe it will be a helpful way of framing things for you?

All that said, this job for him that makes it really hard for you to do anything but be mom? It doesn't sound like a lead role, to me.

Good luck!
posted by rosa at 4:44 AM on February 16 [20 favorites]

You're not married to this guy, haven't established yourself in a career, and thinking about having kids? Cart way, way before horse.
I like rosa's advice, though the way women are trained to put others first is, to me, detestable. Why, after four of your friends observe that you're ignoring your own needs, do you say, "I'm not sure if that's true." There it is; they've put it in front of you on a silver platter. Now don't pretend it's not there.
What makes you happy? (and please don't say "making him happy.") Maybe you'll need to go back to school for further training, but don't let your crappy part-time jobs be the end of the road for you, or it'll be the end of your life.
posted by BostonTerrier at 4:57 AM on February 16 [5 favorites]

I'm going to play devil's advocate here, but maybe I'm just projecting.

What is wrong with OP thinking about having kids before marriage? We did it for precisely the same reason you outline, chaiminda. It felt like a good opportunity because my career prospects were/are slim at the moment. I'm young and don't feel like waiting until I'm established to find out that my fertility is declining.

I don't see anything wrong with your situation. You are asserting yourself realistically and looking out for the two of you as a family when you mention things like stress levels, family planning.

Maybe I'm the worst person to answer this because I identify with the statement, I feel so unsure about what will make me happy and what I will be able to do... that I feel like it's easier to try to make him happy, and my own happiness will follow.

This is just how I operate though. I'm accommodating! I don't think there's anything wrong with that so long as you're not actively unhappy and feeling stuck. I wouldn't put toooo much stock in what others want for you. Obviously they want you to succeed and be true to yourself. Are they really concerned with your happiness though, I wonder? Seems like they just don't understand your lifestyle.

As for expressing your needs to your partner, I think it just takes practice. I realised I was maybe deferring too much to my partner for some time and I started small. I stopped asking what he wanted for dinner and thought harder about what Iwanted. Silly things like that. I hadn't been unhappy with asking what he wanted, but I did fear I was forgetting myself. It's been good for me and my confidence. I'm prone to a laissez faire attitude with things I don't really care about, so again, it's taken practice to even pretend I care. Maybe you identify with this? I don't know. I think the major thing you need to decide is if you will in fact regret 'going along'. I can't really assess that for you.

Good luck OP!
posted by sunshinesky at 5:29 AM on February 16 [11 favorites]

I feel so unsure about what will make me happy and what I will be able to do ("I'd probably be bad at that job anyway, so I'll just keep working jobs that don't matter so I don't screw up anything important") that I feel like it's easier to try to make him happy, and my own happiness will follow.

I think this is your problem here. It's hard to assert your goals if you don't know what those goals are.

I know you're worried about affording therapy, but there are therapists who do work with a sliding-scale system, so it'd be worth looking for one, just to start. And if you go in with a specific target in mind, that can help target - and shorten - the amount of time you spend there. And seeing a therapist about "I'm having trouble figuring out what I want to do with my life" is completely valid.

Also - what is your chosen field?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:35 AM on February 16 [2 favorites]

It sounds to me like you are making decisions based on what is good for your marriage. Sounds like he is willing to do the same thing.So, I don't see it as you not taking care of your needs.
But to answer your actual question. Yes I have gotten better at expressing my own needs in a relationship. What helped was journaling and also reading this book: The Dance of Anger.

And just saying, being a mom can be a great way to be a star in your own movie.
posted by SyraCarol at 5:40 AM on February 16 [2 favorites]

I feel so unsure about what will make me happy and what I will be able to do... that I feel like it's easier to try to make him happy, and my own happiness will follow.

I love my husband and kid, and I love making them happy. Nothing brings me greater joy. But I made damn sure I knew what I wanted before getting married, because making someone else responsible for your happiness is a recipe for resentment and puts you in a very precarious place.

Marriage is hard. Having kids, as much joy as they bring, makes it harder. When things are tough, you need to be able to communicate what you need and work with your partner to make sure you both feel happy. You can't do that I'd you don't know what your needs are.

What worries me is that you seem to have delegated that very important task of finding out who you are and what you need to someone else. People change. What if he gets a crush on someone else, has medical issues, or a midlife crisis? These are not uncommon events in the course of a lifetime. Will you have made choices that leave you equipped to handle them?
posted by snickerdoodle at 5:42 AM on February 16 [2 favorites]

To answer some questions: yes, fertility/timing is why I am thinking about having kids already. I have always wanted to have children, more than I have dreamed of having the perfect job - some of that is socialization, but all the women of my acquaintance were career types and I rarely hear a similar attitude expressed by them.

I am planning on getting a masters degree (saving money for it now) which will enable me to work pretty much anywhere, just in a more limited scope than if we live in the U.S. I am excited about this career path and I think it will make me happy - just not sure how much I care about having a capital-C Career.

I really appreciate the perspectives thus far. You have all given me a lot to think about!
posted by chaiminda at 6:57 AM on February 16

I'm with sunshinesky here. the fact that you are now both looking for jobs in a place closer to your family, with better opportunities for both of you, and that you helped drive that decision doesn't sound like "losing my identity/goals" to me. I am thinking the commentary from your friends has more to do with your current situation than your actual relationship, but I gather they would have more insight than I would.

I, too, can heavily identify with being unsure what you want to do and how to go about it, whereas my boyfriend has a clear career path and upward trajectory. It's much easier to let your boyfriend take the lead when you don't feel like you have anything to lead with, but I've been there/done that and honestly... it didn't work out (previous relationship) but I have no major regrets. This was right around the time that my innate desire to please people took a serious backseat to my innate need to just live my own damn life, so I asserted myself in ways that seemed less obvious to outsiders but were critical to my development, and started caring less about other people's opinions.

I don't know what to tell you about your boyfriend's dream job and what it will mean for you because it's a dream, a possibility that is probable but not set in stone, and I think you should focus more on the now (which will obviously impact that future), but I stopped being super future-oriented a couple of years ago so take that with a grain of salt if you like. I also don't want children so that has never been a factor for me.
posted by sm1tten at 7:01 AM on February 16

If you care more about having kids than a career, then do that! It's tough to move around with kids, but I've known many people who have done it, and they managed, and their kids turned out fine.
posted by DoubleLune at 7:14 AM on February 16

Wanting kids more than a career is fine. Great, even! That sounds like one of your true interests, so pursue it. BUT don't make that goal entirely dependent on your partner. Having a partner who can support you in staying home to raise kids if that's what you want is a fantastic help. But marriages end completely unexpectedly sometimes, and if your ability to care for your kids is ENTIRELY dependent on having your partner's earning power then you and the kids are screwed. So do build a career that's more than just a series of part-time jobs. It doesn't have to be something you love more than staying home with kids, but it should be something you like and that could support you all if the need arose. Having a supportive partner is a wonderful thing, but treat is as something that makes your life at the moment easier, not something that you build your entire life around. If you ever find yourself thinking "if Partner left me/was hit by a bus tomorrow I don't know how I would pay the rent/buy food" then you've given away control of your life and should start taking some of that control back.
posted by MsMolly at 7:32 AM on February 16 [8 favorites]

I have always wanted to have children, more than I have dreamed of having the perfect job - some of that is socialization, but all the women of my acquaintance were career types and I rarely hear a similar attitude expressed by them. I am planning on getting a masters degree (saving money for it now) which will enable me to work pretty much anywhere, just in a more limited scope than if we live in the U.S. I am excited about this career path and I think it will make me happy - just not sure how much I care about having a capital-C Career.

Oh, okay, cool! It sounds like you really do know what you want after all.

So in that case, it sounds like -- and I'm just spitballing here, and giving you my perspective in response to what you've said - maybe part of your confusion is that you've always known you wanted to have kids, but you grew up surrounded by big gung-ho career types, and maybe you're afraid they wouldn't approve? I mean, I also respect your fear of "I don't want to spend my whole life just disappearing into other lives," but I think every parent alive has a fear of that. And that is a valid thing to be feeling. But I'm wondering if maybe all the women you've known being gung-ho career types is making you uneasy on top of that because you've wanted something different from them, you know?

I think pursuing a masters' and working on something on top of having kids is a fabulous life plan, even if you don't have a Capital-C Career and only do things part-time - because, if you think about it, having that "not just kids" goal would be one way of asserting your "I'm not just a mom, dammit"-ness, and you'd also be giving any future daughters you have an example of a woman who is pursuing all of her interests, and being able to balance them, on her own terms. And that is fabulous.

As to how to balance it all now, and how to start working towards your goals - maybe you don't have enough to take grad school full-bore full-time, but - do you have enough to maybe take a class? Maybe a course that would count towards a certificate program in your field? Because often, a class or two under the belt now can sometimes be "rolled over" as credit towards a future degree, depending on the university and the program in question. It'd also be a way to get your feet wet now and start exploring your field.

You actually have a clearer picture of what you want than I thought you did at first, and that's a huge advantage. Go for it!
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:09 AM on February 16 [4 favorites]

You call him your boyfriend and a lot of your statements are "I" or "he" but not too much "we". For example, you moved to an area that severely impacted your earning ability for his goals, but he is not contributing to your savings for more education? You talk about you wanting children but don't mention his opinions. Nor do you mention a commitment from him (not to say there isn't one, but it isn't mentioned). Marriage/commitment is an acknowledgement that your mutual priorities are more important that your individual priorities. And it offers legal protection against being unwittingly exploited. (Not that he would do it on purpose but when relationships fall apart often the benefited half doesn't realise how much the other half has been disadvantaged). Too often I have seen the mutual priorities be deemed important by one partner (negatively financially and socially impacting the trailing spouse) until things fall apart and the partner who financially and socially benefited from those sacrafices walks away with all those benefits thinking both are equal. So, I do see how your friends are wondering how much of you prioritising his needs is part of the ebb and flow of your relationship and how much is you setting a pattern to defer to him, especially if his recent choices have not been that great (moving to an area you both dislike for a job he doesn't even like and that does not pay well for him BUT has left you personally financially struggling and right now giving up your career goals).

It sounds like you need to communicate about overall goals - if you have children (and take the career hit) is he committed to supporting you and them regardless of your relationship status? Does he think your education is worth his financial investment? When he looks at his dream job (that involves much moving and you abandoning your career for several years) is the reward worth it to him if you split his salary down the middle? If he isn't prepared to hand over half his salary but is prepared to ask you to make those sacrafices for his benefit you might want to discuss mutual goals further. (A lot of the time the salary seems great for one person with the assumption the trailing spouse "won't cost much to support" since the rent etc in theory doesn't double; but if the salary is actually divided it becomes much more clear to the spouse that is earning the salary that they are asking more of their partner than they themselves would be willing to sacrifice and the financial outcome isn't as rosy unless the trailing spouse gives up any right to compensation).

You said you would like therapy but "multiple jobs/long commutes/no money" is holding you back. How is your boyfriend helping you achieve your goal there? Will he pay for your therapy, increase his share of the bills, encourage you to quit a job, move closer to one of your jobs etc, to make it possible to achieve this small but important and achieveable goal?

Relationships aren't all love and butterflies; ignoring practicalities like finances, priorities, and sacrafices sets one partner up to be resentful and is damaging to the relationship as a whole.
posted by saucysault at 8:14 AM on February 16 [19 favorites]

Wanting kids over career or the other way round is okay either way- and its nobody else's business to judge you on that. But the unfortunate reality remains that you cannot depend on the prospect of a long-lasting relationship for being either financially independent or supporting any kids that you end up bringing into the world, which is what I think you are doing, based on the patterns you have described here. Happiness is not something you chase after; happiness is something that follows when you do what you want in life. A person can never be your sole and eternal source of happiness- ask your therapist about it if you don't believe me- if you are able to get therapy, that is.

each other four of them have said a variation of the same thing to me: that I am ignoring my own needs/goals in favor of my boyfriend's.
I'm not sure if that is true, or if it is, if it is entirely a bad thing.

I disagree with your friends. I'd say that you are digging a grave for yourself- not for you AND the b/f- just for yourself. With each step you have taken, the hole gets deeper and warmer. Sorry if this sounds harsh but I really hope you realise what kind of a treacherous path you have taken on by putting the relationship/b/f over your needs, your wants and most importantly, your financial independence.

I feel like it's easier to try to make him happy, and my own happiness will follow.

What happens if one fine day, 10 months, years or whatever down the road, he wakes up one morning and tells you he is done with the relationship, or dies? Do you see yourself as financially independent at that time or are you still working 3-5 jobs AND taking comfort that HE is, and will always be, the source of your emotional and economical support? Now that you have lived all these last years trying to build a life around him and the relationship, and now that this illusion of a foundation has crumbled, what's your back up for surviving in the world?


I know that I need more therapy, but the aforementioned multiple jobs/long commutes/no money makes it tough.

So your life is so dependent/intertwined with his right now that you cannot even get therapy? And darling b/f is not paying for it either or helping you get it? As irrelevant or not as this is, when, if at all, is he planning to marry you? You've talked about your plans regarding kids and you are investing in a guy/relationship- when do you expect to see any returns on your investment? All things you need to be thinking about.

In general, he is very accommodating to my needs and I don't think the problem, if there is any, lies with him.

Which practical and logistic needs of yours have been met?

Has anyone gotten better about figuring out what they need, and expressing it?

You figure out your needs by assessing what situation you are in, where that situation is leading you and what happens if things do or do not work out the way you want them to. Its an analytical and reiterative thought process that continually takes in the info from the environment and updates your situation and strategy. Its not something that you take one hour to think about after dinner and are done with; or wait for the Gods to drop this info while you pray for some miraculous insight.

Finally, I highly recommend watching An Education. While its described as a coming-of-age drama, most women can probably use the lessons at any age in their lives.
posted by xm at 9:40 AM on February 16 [7 favorites]

I can't favourite saucysault enough. You are talking about this relationship as if you were one half of a married couple but dude hasn't put a ring on it. You are sacrificing real money and the happiness of your youth for a boyfriend, not a life long partner. If you want to have kids and live abroad and be part of a unit you need to ask this dude to make a commitment to that. If he balks, I think you'll look at things quite differently.
posted by fshgrl at 9:49 AM on February 16 [15 favorites]

I'm with xm on this.

(a) You are already a trailing/dependent spouse without marriage. That's...really not great if the relationship suddenly breaks up. It kinda sounds like you don't really have anything going for you alone that you super care about, so you might as well choose to sacrifice for the relationship/wait for the kids to come. I can see the logic of that, but....

(b) Even if you were married with kids, at any point in time you may find yourself having to support yourself and/or the kids and/or the husband, alone. What if he leaves you, or what if he suddenly becomes handicapped? Then you've put all your eggs in one broken basket.

You need to take care of you. You always need to take care of you. Right now it sounds like you're not doing it. It's really easy for women in hetero relationships to end up putting themselves on the back burner because "he makes more money" (gee, I wonder why the man always is making more money, so he always wins that argument) and "I want to stay home with the kids" and blah blah blah that's how we expect women to behave in marriage, and it sounds like even without marriage, you're doing this. You didn't bother to say what you want as a career path (I guess because you don't really care about it/aren't into it anyway, sounds like?), but it you really plan on spending your life as his satellite, at the very least you might want to look into a more mobile/portable career that you can do regardless of where he wants you to be living.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:14 AM on February 16 [4 favorites]

I think it's great for people of any gender to be excited about spending a stretch of their lives focusing on parenting full time.

But that's a time-limited endeavor. Then you have to figure out what else you're doing as your main focus.

I'm 48, and I have friends who are emerging from 12, 15, 18, 20 years of being a full-time mum or dad and trying to figure out what their next steps are. The ones who had an active and engaged career (paid or unpaid) rather than a series of random jobs they didn't really care about, are having a much easier time of it, both financially and emotionally.
posted by Sidhedevil at 10:28 AM on February 16

Following up on sauceysault: if he is doing these things (encouraging you to go to school, offering financial and emotional support for you to meet your goals), and you don't take advantage of this, he may very well get frustrated. I know men who eventually broke up with their SOs (after significant time had passed) because there was just a mismatch in ambition. They wanted women who were more equal partners, rather than those who would passively let them do the heavy lifting.

This is not to say that your idea of a relationship won't work, and the fact that you are trying to move to a place that's better for you is a really good sign. But both of you have to be on the same page about your roles, commitment and support has to be there, and it honestly puts you in a very vulnerable position should things go wrong.
posted by snickerdoodle at 10:57 AM on February 16 [1 favorite]

I agree with some above: you are making the choices that a married woman would make, but you aren't married.

It's not necessarily a bad thing to sacrifice for the household economy. Sometimes that makes sense in the long run. But:
- are you saving for retirement?
- are you saving, in general?
- do you own property in YOUR name?
- are you splitting expenses equally, despite your unequal income?
- are you going to be financially screwed if he dumps you in 5 years? Dies in 10?

Marriage provides benefits to underworking partners in the case of death or divorce. This is why some stay-at-home-moms qualify for a portion of their ex-husbands's retirement income in the future - it's not for reasons of emotions or morals, but it's specifically because they're getting compensated, from the household economy, for the unpaid work they put into the economy to keep it alive. That's also why they get that 401k if their spouse dies.

I am not saying you should plan your relationship in terms of its future breakup. AND you don't actually have to be married to get certain protections in place.

BUT: if you don't have a real household economy in place, you maybe shouldn't make decisions based on one. That can hurt you in the long run.

(This point may be moot - you guys may have already worked through this, and you may be maxxing the heck out of your IRA. Just thought I'd throw it out there.)
posted by vivid postcard at 11:33 AM on February 16 [3 favorites]

Oh, yeah, and I'd add: is he making sacrifices for, or contributions to, the household economy, or just you?

If he's not, then, yeah, you are probably too invested, or not taking care of yourself in a real way.
posted by vivid postcard at 11:44 AM on February 16 [1 favorite]

My mom was a fiercely independent woman her entire life. She paid her way through university to be the first in her family to graduate with a degree. She always said she didn't want kids and would never settle for what her partner wanted just to make him happy. And yet, she married a man who was in the military and had 3 kids with him (also during the period of most moves).

Her university friends gave her shit for it (you never wanted kids!) and her family was unhappy (you've moved so far away just for him!) but they missed the crucial point: she had made those decisions and was, overall, happy with them. She told me before she passed away that she was so glad that her life had taken such a completely different path from the one she envisioned when she was in university and that she didn't regret giving up her career aspirations in favour of focusing on her kids.

The one thing she had that you don't is that she worked in a field with fairly flexible hours and good pay (IT during the boom). It sounds like you're dissatisfied with that aspect of your life but you've also taken steps to fix it by considering moving somewhere with better opportunities for you. My mom coped with poor job opportunities by being a stay at home mom for a bit but she made sure that we moved somewhere she could also work when she was ready to go back to that.

It sounds like you have a good grasp of the realities of your relationship and that your friends/family may be projecting their own unhappiness/insecurity onto you. The important thing is that you feel secure in your decisions, respected in your relationship, and have a plan should things go downhill. It sounds like you do have this and your partner respects your choices. I don't see you as ignoring your goals, I see you as compromising: children are a goal, relationships are a goal, it's not all about employment and advancing up the professional ladder.

tl;dr: I wouldn't be concerned about what your friends/family are saying, even if they all say so independently, because they are not you and have a very different idea of who you are and what your relationship entails.
posted by buteo at 11:52 AM on February 16 [1 favorite]

I think you've gotten some great advice upthread about making your happiness and financial independence a priority regardless of what your boyfriend does. saucysalt's comment is a particularly good one in this vein.

The rest of my answer may sound harsh, but I truly don't intend it to be. I obviously don't know you or know anything about your life other than what you've posted above. But the following are the concerns I would have if I had a friend in the situation you've described. Maybe this is where your friends are coming from.

I've seen a lot of women in their twenties follow husbands and boyfriends around, seemingly with the same idea that their happiness will follow making their partner happy. In a lot of cases I think this is the easy way out. It's hard to be your own person! It's hard to make your way in the world and make your own choices out of the almost infinite options and follow your dreams. It's hard to build a life with a partner whose career needs might make your dreams more difficult to achieve, and it's hard to try to figure out a way for you both to be happy. It's hard to balance working and having children.

So I see a lot of women just giving up on all of those things for themselves and deferring figuring out their own lives in order to support a partner. There is nothing wrong with compromise and there's nothing wrong with loving and supporting someone. But I think many of these women are using their partner's ambitions as an excuse to not have to do the hard work of developing and pursuing their own dreams.

There are a couple of red flags that make me wonder whether this might be the case with you:
1. Four friends independently say they're concerned about you putting your boyfriend's needs above your own.
2. You talk a lot about the sacrifices you're making in order to reduce "our stress" or help him follow "his dreams."
3. You say things like "I feel so unsure about what will make me happy that I think it's easier to just make him happy."

I often want to tell these women not to give up on themselves so easily! I want them to fight the good fight and figure out what their life can mean beyond being a wife and a mother. I think rosa framed it wonderfully: I want them to be the star of their own movie and not just a supporting character in somebody else's. And even though I don't even know you, I want that for you too.
posted by Colonel_Chappy at 3:33 PM on February 16 [1 favorite]

I want to add to the chorus saying that you need to adequately protect yourself. I also followed a boyfriend overseas and quit my job to do so. However, before I did, we a) got married and b) got a pre-nup that specifically stated that half of any money that either of us earned overseas was mine. At that point, we weren't sure whether I would even be able to find a job and we knew that I would probably take a pay cut (which I did). Without the pre-nup, he would have been better off financially after the move, and I would have been worse off. With the pre-nup, we were in it together. Our incentives were aligned.

If you want to move to different places and have children, that's great. Go for it. But I really recommend the process of talking through the financial ramifications of those choices. I plan to stay married to my husband forever, but the fact that we explicitly said that we're 50-50 partners, no matter what choices we jointly make, has meant a great deal to me.
posted by oryelle at 1:25 AM on February 17 [2 favorites]