How to deal with a furtive, trespassing neighbor?
October 29, 2012 7:07 AM Subscribe
My neighbor encroaches on our property and leaves garbage. The police haven't been particularly helpful. What to do?
When we moved into our home almost 3 years ago, people who have lived on my street for decades told me that our immediate next-door neighbor is mentally unstable and not taking his meds. His family lives elsewhere and doesn't keep in contact with him. We noticed that he is very furtive and primarily comes out in the middle of the night, and that his property is littered with garbage - old appliances and mattresses, furniture on his roof, just a bunch of junk. This year he began coming onto our property regularly to leave weird trash: a rusty leaking paint can, burned garbage buried in our compost bin, a plastic jar full of used plastic utensils, etc. Flyers and ads left on his front lawn end up thrown onto our porch every week, a flatscreen TV showed up in the back of our truck, and for a while he was filling our trash cans rather than put out his own cans (we have since moved our cans to the other side of the house). Sometimes I actually see him in the act in the middle of the night, but usually I just find the evidence by the light of day.
The junk had been showing up more frequently over the past couple of months, so I called the police non-emergency line and was told to call immediately every time we see him on our property. Friday night I saw him on our porch around midnight, so I called the police and two cops were sent to talk to him. Saturday night at 3am he left a shopping cart next to our garage, so I called the police again. This time, one of the cops came to my door to say that since my neighbor quickly goes back into his house after dumping, they can't catch him in the act and that they have no evidence a crime was committed. I was told not to call the police unless he is doing something overtly threatening, or lingering on our property.
I'm so frustrated about this whole situation. Our neighbor has never tried to make direct contact with us or acted violently, but I feel threatened by his encroachment and I'm extremely creeped out by him. Admittedly, we have never approached him directly to ask him to stop, but the idea of a direct confrontation with him makes me very anxious. Plus I am 99% sure he would not answer his door because he's so reclusive. We've considered leaving him a note civilly asking him to respect the property line, but I'm not sure how to word such a note. I also found an address in the online yellow pages for one of his siblings, and we've considered trying to get in contact with them to help somehow. Does anyone have any experience with similar situations, or any advice as to how I can deal with this? I welcome any thoughts, thank you.
When we moved into our home almost 3 years ago, people who have lived on my street for decades told me that our immediate next-door neighbor is mentally unstable and not taking his meds. His family lives elsewhere and doesn't keep in contact with him. We noticed that he is very furtive and primarily comes out in the middle of the night, and that his property is littered with garbage - old appliances and mattresses, furniture on his roof, just a bunch of junk. This year he began coming onto our property regularly to leave weird trash: a rusty leaking paint can, burned garbage buried in our compost bin, a plastic jar full of used plastic utensils, etc. Flyers and ads left on his front lawn end up thrown onto our porch every week, a flatscreen TV showed up in the back of our truck, and for a while he was filling our trash cans rather than put out his own cans (we have since moved our cans to the other side of the house). Sometimes I actually see him in the act in the middle of the night, but usually I just find the evidence by the light of day.
The junk had been showing up more frequently over the past couple of months, so I called the police non-emergency line and was told to call immediately every time we see him on our property. Friday night I saw him on our porch around midnight, so I called the police and two cops were sent to talk to him. Saturday night at 3am he left a shopping cart next to our garage, so I called the police again. This time, one of the cops came to my door to say that since my neighbor quickly goes back into his house after dumping, they can't catch him in the act and that they have no evidence a crime was committed. I was told not to call the police unless he is doing something overtly threatening, or lingering on our property.
I'm so frustrated about this whole situation. Our neighbor has never tried to make direct contact with us or acted violently, but I feel threatened by his encroachment and I'm extremely creeped out by him. Admittedly, we have never approached him directly to ask him to stop, but the idea of a direct confrontation with him makes me very anxious. Plus I am 99% sure he would not answer his door because he's so reclusive. We've considered leaving him a note civilly asking him to respect the property line, but I'm not sure how to word such a note. I also found an address in the online yellow pages for one of his siblings, and we've considered trying to get in contact with them to help somehow. Does anyone have any experience with similar situations, or any advice as to how I can deal with this? I welcome any thoughts, thank you.
Every time I've had to deal with difficult neighbors, the only solution that actually worked was to go out of my way to make relations more friendly. Attempting to establish boundaries or calling the police just pissed people off and made them even more passive aggressive.
My only hesitation in this case is that he appears to be mentally unstable. If you can ascertain that he's just weird and lonely, bake him some cookies and try to chat with him a few times a week. The problem will most likely resolve itself, and if it doesn't you'll have an opportunity to gently bring it up. If he is mentally unstable.. I think I'd resign myself to cleaning up his messes once a week.
posted by zug at 7:14 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
My only hesitation in this case is that he appears to be mentally unstable. If you can ascertain that he's just weird and lonely, bake him some cookies and try to chat with him a few times a week. The problem will most likely resolve itself, and if it doesn't you'll have an opportunity to gently bring it up. If he is mentally unstable.. I think I'd resign myself to cleaning up his messes once a week.
posted by zug at 7:14 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
Have you contacted your county/municipality? Chances are there are bylaws that prevent having unkempt property/dumping etc. and he can at least be given fines for dumping and not maintaining his property, which is an incentive to stop the behaviour and it'll perhaps escalate things if he doesn't pay the fines. Have a bylaw officer come out and look - at least he'll then be on the radar for them and you have another contact should it again become a police matter.
Also, what's the fence situation? You could consider building one if it's practical.
posted by jimmythefish at 7:15 AM on October 29, 2012 [7 favorites]
Also, what's the fence situation? You could consider building one if it's practical.
posted by jimmythefish at 7:15 AM on October 29, 2012 [7 favorites]
What about setting up a cheap camera activated by a motion detector? Then you would have some evidence to present to the police when they arrived.
posted by Wolfster at 7:17 AM on October 29, 2012 [18 favorites]
posted by Wolfster at 7:17 AM on October 29, 2012 [18 favorites]
Our neighbor has never tried to make direct contact with us or acted violently, but I feel threatened by his encroachment and I'm extremely creeped out by him.
I would try to meet this situation with compassion rather than fear. He's ill and not operating in the same social construct you are, but he's statistically unlikely to be violent or to cause you any harm.
Having said that, I would install floodlights as a first measure, and consider fencing if necessary.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:19 AM on October 29, 2012 [9 favorites]
I would try to meet this situation with compassion rather than fear. He's ill and not operating in the same social construct you are, but he's statistically unlikely to be violent or to cause you any harm.
Having said that, I would install floodlights as a first measure, and consider fencing if necessary.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:19 AM on October 29, 2012 [9 favorites]
Motion activated security camera. At the very least, he is trespassing.
posted by headnsouth at 7:31 AM on October 29, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by headnsouth at 7:31 AM on October 29, 2012 [4 favorites]
I wonder if a fence might help. Not something huge, just as a physical reminder of the dividing line between the properties.
posted by jaguar at 7:42 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by jaguar at 7:42 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
Fence, motion activated floodlights.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:45 AM on October 29, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:45 AM on October 29, 2012 [3 favorites]
Trying to reason with a mentally ill person is going to get you nowhere. Check with your local health department to see what help can be offered to him. Unfortunately without a person being a danger to himself or others, the police or health officials will not get involved.
The best you can do is to button up areas of your property so he doesn't leave surprises.
posted by JJ86 at 7:49 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
The best you can do is to button up areas of your property so he doesn't leave surprises.
posted by JJ86 at 7:49 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
Motion Activated Floodlights and Camera. Cheap and Cheerful. Should also scare the bejesus out of him the next time he goes over to your house in the dead of night.
If a fence is practical, a fence.
Call Code Enforcement on him for the garbage on his property. They may find a hoarding situation and it may push him to action to rid his own house of crap.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 7:53 AM on October 29, 2012 [5 favorites]
If a fence is practical, a fence.
Call Code Enforcement on him for the garbage on his property. They may find a hoarding situation and it may push him to action to rid his own house of crap.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 7:53 AM on October 29, 2012 [5 favorites]
The chances of you changing this man's behaviour are slim. Motion activated lights and small fence make sense. If it were me, I would also send back whatever crap he leaves to his property. Right now it seems as if he is being trained to use you as his garbage removal service.
I would also consider getting a big dog. A loud scary dog. Maybe rent one from a security firm.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 8:55 AM on October 29, 2012 [3 favorites]
I would also consider getting a big dog. A loud scary dog. Maybe rent one from a security firm.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 8:55 AM on October 29, 2012 [3 favorites]
What about setting up a cheap camera activated by a motion detector? Then you would have some evidence to present to the police when they arrived.
Given the guy's furtive disposition, I'd guess that motion activated flood-lights might be just as effective. But the camera isn't a bad idea.
Have you tried just tossing the stuff back onto his property? That might be an effective signal that he needs to stop if he doesn't want direct confrontation, which is something I'd guess he's at pains to avoid by your description.
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:56 AM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
Given the guy's furtive disposition, I'd guess that motion activated flood-lights might be just as effective. But the camera isn't a bad idea.
Have you tried just tossing the stuff back onto his property? That might be an effective signal that he needs to stop if he doesn't want direct confrontation, which is something I'd guess he's at pains to avoid by your description.
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:56 AM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
In addition to the excellent comments of motion-activated floodlights, security video cameras, and a fence, you may wish to consider a large dog. I wouldn't get one just for this, but if you were already thinking of getting one, now seems to be a great opportunity. No matter what, I do not think a fence is optional at this point. You need a physical narrier.
You don't seem to be in an HOA-covenanted area, but even if not, the poor state of his property is likely to be in violation of municipal ordinances. You may wish to report that situation to the city or county.
I wish I could express more optimism about local social services or public health departments, but the fact is that you are not going to get him to submit to any medical treatment against his will. He is not going to change.
posted by Tanizaki at 9:00 AM on October 29, 2012
You don't seem to be in an HOA-covenanted area, but even if not, the poor state of his property is likely to be in violation of municipal ordinances. You may wish to report that situation to the city or county.
I wish I could express more optimism about local social services or public health departments, but the fact is that you are not going to get him to submit to any medical treatment against his will. He is not going to change.
posted by Tanizaki at 9:00 AM on October 29, 2012
Also, what's the fence situation? You could consider building one if it's practical.
He'll throw stuff over it. ASK ME HOW I KNOW.
(Though it could keep him from physically crossing onto your property, which would be better for your peace of mind.)
posted by BrashTech at 9:19 AM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
He'll throw stuff over it. ASK ME HOW I KNOW.
(Though it could keep him from physically crossing onto your property, which would be better for your peace of mind.)
posted by BrashTech at 9:19 AM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Admittedly, we have never approached him directly to ask him to stop, but the idea of a direct confrontation with him makes me very anxious. Plus I am 99% sure he would not answer his door because he's so reclusive. We've considered leaving him a note civilly asking him to respect the property line, but I'm not sure how to word such a note. I also found an address in the online yellow pages for one of his siblings, and we've considered trying to get in contact with them to help somehow.
You've lived with this for three years and never contacted him? Not even a note? Doesn't that seem a little weird for actions that bother you to this degree? Your neighbor may be mentally ill--but that seems equalled by the pathological level of passive-aggressiveness going on right there.
The guy doesn't have any record of violent behavior. His actions are not directly physically threatening (if creepy and bizarre). Look, mentally ill or not, it's basic decency to try to resolve this with him personally, or at the very least contact his family. Before you jump all over the police and security cameras and floodlights at the very least try talking with him and his family. At worst, you'll make no inroads but get an idea of what you're dealing with.
posted by Anonymous at 9:35 AM on October 29, 2012
You've lived with this for three years and never contacted him? Not even a note? Doesn't that seem a little weird for actions that bother you to this degree? Your neighbor may be mentally ill--but that seems equalled by the pathological level of passive-aggressiveness going on right there.
The guy doesn't have any record of violent behavior. His actions are not directly physically threatening (if creepy and bizarre). Look, mentally ill or not, it's basic decency to try to resolve this with him personally, or at the very least contact his family. Before you jump all over the police and security cameras and floodlights at the very least try talking with him and his family. At worst, you'll make no inroads but get an idea of what you're dealing with.
posted by Anonymous at 9:35 AM on October 29, 2012
He could throw stuff over the fence or, even worse, pile stuff up against it. Now you've built a fence that is slowly collapsing into your yard.
posted by JoeZydeco at 9:50 AM on October 29, 2012
posted by JoeZydeco at 9:50 AM on October 29, 2012
Have you tried contacting code enforcement for your city? This is what they are there for - the guy's yard sounds like a public nuisance already (notwithstanding the trash encroaching on your property) and they can bring to bear the threat of eviction and demolition if he doesn't get it cleaned up. They can also put him in touch with the mental professionals I suspect he really needs.
posted by Leezie at 9:50 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Leezie at 9:50 AM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
Another vote for a fence, a nice tall chainlink fence or a solid hedge. (Chainlink because it blocks access but not view: hard for him to move furtively along it if you can see every step he makes.)
And motion-sensitive lights all over; if need be, add a security camera or three. The good thing about a camera setup is that that would give the police the evidence they need to actually DO something about this..... until then, it's just you said/he said.
posted by easily confused at 10:34 AM on October 29, 2012
And motion-sensitive lights all over; if need be, add a security camera or three. The good thing about a camera setup is that that would give the police the evidence they need to actually DO something about this..... until then, it's just you said/he said.
posted by easily confused at 10:34 AM on October 29, 2012
No fence!
I have dealt with residential situations like this.
It sounds like a few super bright motion-activated spot lights will do the trick. This guy likes being all furtive and sneaky in the dark, so deny him that option on your property.
If he tampers with your new lighting, then start calling his family, the code enforcement for your city, the police, consider a fence, etc.
It's OK that you don't want to talk to this person, leave him notes, or anything else that puts you directly in his zone of attention, personally. I get it.
Change the circumstances on your property with motion-activated bright lighting. I bet this will do the trick, and keep your property safer all around, too.
Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 10:42 AM on October 29, 2012
I have dealt with residential situations like this.
It sounds like a few super bright motion-activated spot lights will do the trick. This guy likes being all furtive and sneaky in the dark, so deny him that option on your property.
If he tampers with your new lighting, then start calling his family, the code enforcement for your city, the police, consider a fence, etc.
It's OK that you don't want to talk to this person, leave him notes, or anything else that puts you directly in his zone of attention, personally. I get it.
Change the circumstances on your property with motion-activated bright lighting. I bet this will do the trick, and keep your property safer all around, too.
Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 10:42 AM on October 29, 2012
No one would want to be mean to Boo Radley. Is it your turn to be Atticus Finch? The motion activated lights and the cookies seem like the best ideas. Once you are friends, perhaps you can explain to "Boo" how to recycle/get rid of flyers and other trash. He might really not know how to cope.
posted by Cranberry at 1:51 PM on October 29, 2012
posted by Cranberry at 1:51 PM on October 29, 2012
I'd think the lights would do the trick. If not, you *could* raise the stakes further by adding motion-activated alarms. They might wake you up in the middle of the night - which might be what you want? Maybe not?
posted by sarah_pdx at 6:50 PM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by sarah_pdx at 6:50 PM on October 29, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm flummoxed by the idea being expressed here that despite the fact that your gut is telling you to stay clear of Mr. McCrazypants next door, you should just be NIIIIIICCE to him. That he's really just sort of like a very big feral kitten and all you have to do is put down some cookies, and when he gets close enough, you can skritch him behind the ears and then you'll be his BFF and flowers and rainbows and a pony!
Look, that might be true; it might turn out that way, but I can't tell you how many times I told myself I should just pluck up my courage and go knock on my McCrazypants neighbor's door and offer him a jar of the jam I just made and some home-made bread, or a pie from the apples off my tree. And yet something held me back--my gut just said no. Right up until the morning he set his truck on fire as bait and killed a firefighter and wounded two police officers before he set his house on fire and burned it down around his ears.
What is the name of that book that Mefites are always on about? Something about a gift of something . . .
posted by miss patrish at 9:55 PM on October 29, 2012 [9 favorites]
Look, that might be true; it might turn out that way, but I can't tell you how many times I told myself I should just pluck up my courage and go knock on my McCrazypants neighbor's door and offer him a jar of the jam I just made and some home-made bread, or a pie from the apples off my tree. And yet something held me back--my gut just said no. Right up until the morning he set his truck on fire as bait and killed a firefighter and wounded two police officers before he set his house on fire and burned it down around his ears.
What is the name of that book that Mefites are always on about? Something about a gift of something . . .
posted by miss patrish at 9:55 PM on October 29, 2012 [9 favorites]
Well. That came out really inflammatory. The main point I was trying to make is that you should be cautious, move slowly, protect yourself. Of course, most mentally unstable people don't get violent, but living next door to the insanity is so danged wearing, and sadly, until he crosses a certain line, there is very little you can do about it. To find out where that line is, you might have a chat with someone down at city hall; they often are perfectly well aware of the issues with this guy and might be able to give you some guidance.
Once again, please be cautious. Listen to your instincts. Be safe.
posted by miss patrish at 10:01 PM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
Once again, please be cautious. Listen to your instincts. Be safe.
posted by miss patrish at 10:01 PM on October 29, 2012 [2 favorites]
I have dealt with a similar neighbor and in the three years I lived next to them, never got anywhere. Their elatives knew they had a problem but no one did anything because they never hurt themselves or others. Imagine knowing your neighbor is crouching next to a bush on the other side of the property line, silently watching you come and go.
A motion activated sprinkler is also an option, there's one on Amazon for $50.
You could try contacting your local elected for assistance, like a city councilperson.
posted by dottiechang at 12:57 AM on October 30, 2012 [4 favorites]
A motion activated sprinkler is also an option, there's one on Amazon for $50.
You could try contacting your local elected for assistance, like a city councilperson.
posted by dottiechang at 12:57 AM on October 30, 2012 [4 favorites]
motion activated sprinkler is an excellent idea.
posted by fingersandtoes at 8:36 AM on November 1, 2012
posted by fingersandtoes at 8:36 AM on November 1, 2012
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Kololo at 7:14 AM on October 29, 2012