Comments on: Talking to Mom about moving in.

Question: Talking to Mom about moving in.

5845(f)(1)(D) — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 09:41:24 -0800

I've been thinking about asking my mother to move in with, or closer to, me and my wife (and maybe future baby). I'd love to hear your thoughts, and any guidance you can give to make it a good experience for everyone. Lots of specific questions inside, but any anecdotes are very welcome.

My mother is a lovely lady, and she and I (and my wife) all get on very well. She is active, has a number of friends she sees regularly, and still has a few clients in her small business (which she'd probably stop if she moved). She lives in NYC and is pretty much self-sufficient. However, she's getting a bit on in years, and I worry about her health (she's taken a few tumbles in the past decade resulting in broken bones). And, friends notwithstanding, I worry she's lonely; she's at the age where your cohort starts dying. And I miss her! She's great fun.

My wife and I have talked about her moving up either with us or to be near us. We're in Boston. My mother has also said she'd be happy to live closer to us when/if we have a baby.

Right now we live in a rental apartment that would be too small for the three of us, but we may buy a place soon. If my mother were to live with us, we'd organize our housing search around larger properties, rather than just finding a place for the two of us and baby. We could afford a larger property than our baseline--but my wife and I are both thrifty and risk-averse, and we wouldn't buy a larger place if my mother were not going to live with us. A place that would be comfortable for three adults and a baby could easily be $100,000 more than a starter condo that's only big enough for us and a baby. A small, but nice place nearby us for mom alone would probably be somewhere between $200,000 and $400,000.

I'm interested to hear your experiences in similar scenarios. In particular, this is what I've been trying to get my head around:
- If you have had a parent move in with you, how (if at all) have they contributed to the household financially?
- If contributing financially, have they contributed to the mortgage or down payment on your shared dwelling, or just groceries, etc.?
- Have you combined finances (e.g., joint checking accounts, tranparency on investments etc.)?
- How (if at all) has your parent contributed to household chores? Cook, clean, help with baby?
- Did you involve your parent in the house search, if you bought a house for you all to share?
- Did you claim your parent as a dependent on your tax returns, and how did your inome affect their Medicare/Social Security?
- Once your parent moved in, did you include him/her in all your plans (e.g., your weekly non-romantic dinner out, all your weekend trips, your vacations)?
- How did your parent navigate going from, perhaps, a very familiar place with old friends, to perhaps a different area of the country where they knew few people?
- Is it possible for an older person to get a mortgage for their own place, if she doesn't live with us? She's not rich by any stretch of the imagination, and lives off of public benefits and savings.
- Moving in with us would limit my mom's self sufficiency versus downtown NYC (even if we find a place that has good local public transport). Any thoughts on making this easier? I don't want her to be a prisoner (though I'm sure she'd be mostly content just hanging out in a backyard with an iced tea).
- Did your in laws (or other parent) get jealous? How did you deal with that?

Lastly, when did you start having these conversations with your parent? We've both said that it would be nice to have her closer, but haven't talked timelines. I don't want to propose it and then never find the "perfect place," and I don't want to spring a package deal on her, either.

Any and all thoughts appreciated.

By: srboisvert

srboisvert — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 09:52:16 -0800

Talk to your mom as soon as your partner okays it. My mom once told me her nightmare was having to move in with one of her children when she was older. My parents are now in a condo that is filled with other independent seniors and it seems to have improved their social lives compared to the family home they just moved out of that was in a standard suburban setting.

At the very least you will find out if it is something she would even consider and save yourself time if it is not.

By: the young rope-rider

the young rope-rider — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 09:58:01 -0800

The " if/when you have a baby" thing might not be an actual plan. My inlaws said that for years but ultimately, they really liked the life they'd built and once the baby was real, they did not move. I suggest renting or otherwise making temporary plans with the assumption that she won't move and then if your wife gets pregnant you can really sit down with her and see how she feels. At that point you can make housing decisions.

I should also warn you that once she is pregnant or has a small baby, your wife's feelings for your mother might change. On a deep level I did not consider my MIL family and never felt entirely comfortable around her in the early baby stages. We get along well but it's hard to logic away those kinds of feelings. Your wife's comfort is really important.

Finally, if she's getting delicate, childcare might be hard for her. It is a physical and sometimes strenuous job, and 40 hours a week might be way too tough. Usually her hours would be your hours plus commuting time. Long day. If you're looking more for occasional or emergency care, that is more realistic.

Finally finally, childcare in Boston is pricey, and you should be able to cover housing for her AND full-time childcare in case her health or willingness decline.

By: JohnnyGunn

JohnnyGunn — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 09:59:09 -0800

Do you have any siblings? If so, would they be helping out in any way financially or otherwise? If not, does your mother have any other heirs besides yourself? If you are an only child and your mother plans on leaving you whatever she has left, then this really becomes an issue of timing as to her helping to pay.

I would start this planning with a discussion with you, your spouse and dear mom. Ask her first if this is really something she wants, two what her expectations would be about living arrangements, babysitting, contributing financially and to the workload of a house etc. I think one of the worst things you could do is not include your mother in every step of the way. She may feel like she is being treated as a child, is losing her own voice, etc. She may also have some clear cut views on how it would work for her and how it would not work.

If she agrees to some form of the plan, you should speak to an accountant about all the financial aspects. I think the best way from a tax standpoint is for her to actually pay some of the expenses directly, but I am no expert in that area.

By: 5845(f)(1)(D)

5845(f)(1)(D) — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 10:11:54 -0800

Thanks for the answers so far--popping in to add that I am an only child, and my mother's sole heir (subject to her estate planning, which we haven't discussed yet).

By: st starseed

st starseed — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 10:33:06 -0800

While not a direct answer to any of your questions, I can say that having my mom extremely willing - and fortunately still able - to watch and care for my infant son two days a week has been a fantastic (and frankly, unexpected) treat. My wife and I both work, so we've saved a bit of money not having to do daycare, but more importantly, grandmother and grandson have developed an emotional bond that will, I hope, continue to grow. Good luck.

By: saffronwoman

saffronwoman — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 10:42:34 -0800

We live with my mom. We being me, husband, two teenagers, dog, and bunny. It took some time and some reworking of our relationship, but it's completely and totally worth it, for us.

We have combined our incomes and bank accounts. I pay the bills with the combined money. We discuss, as a family, large purchases (like the computer and ipad last year) and work them into our budget.

She participates as she chooses in our social life. That means she's fine with us having friends over for dinner even at the spur of the moment but sometimes she'll excuse herself to her private and very comfortable sitting room.

We help each other through lots of stuff. She had a replaced hip re-replaced recently and it would have been impossible, at least very difficult, for her to do this without the tons of support she got from us. It meant that the past year as she was considering surgery she couldn't really help with housework because she couldn't move a lot without dislocating the hip. It meant extra work for me, but she's fun and funny and we love her.

She's great with this kids, although now that they're teenagers they can be not so great with her (us). But having been through that with me and my sisters, she gets it. They've taught her stuff about animes, Japanese, photography, respect, atheism.... And she in return has taught them that life can be good no matter what age, canning, loving people unconditionally, and as a retired NP she doctors us when we hurt.

The garden is hers, my husband builds her raised beds so she can take care of the garden more easily and in return she grows so much food. And cans so much food. So much that we are running out of pantry space.

I wouldn't change what we have for the world. Even my husband loves having her here. She teases him, they hug, and disagree, and make up, and tell each other they love each other. And as far as we know there's no jealousy from his mother (although in all honesty, they never did have a very good relationship).

So, um, yeah. I'd do it. Just remember that she's not the babysitter, is still a vibrant woman, and needs reassurance that physical and emtional support as she ages will remain.

I just asked my mom what she would tell you, this is what she says (she's 76, btw): not being alone is good, feeling like you belong somewhere and are wanted is necessary and good. Sharing life together is wonderful.

By: Ruthless Bunny

Ruthless Bunny — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 11:09:08 -0800

I would consider properties with an In-law suite or a separate unit, or properties that could be converted to such. Preferably single level homes or units, duplexes, multi-family units, etc.

I do find that some folks love their homes and neighborhoods and become unhappy when removed from the milieu of their daily lives. It may not be about the ladies she plays canasta with, but about that checker at the Pathmark who remembers she has a dog, or the mail carrier who stops to talk with her. You should for sure discuss with your Mom.

I think having separate living quarters, but being a part of the family on a daily basis might be the best fit for everyone. Mom has her domain, your family has theirs, and you can have a common area, like gardens, or a patio, or a pool or whatever. Maybe you do something cool in the basement and then have a theater for the whole family to use. Whatever works.

If, for whatever reason, your Mom wants to move (maybe she meets and marries someone new) you still have a rental property, and you're not over extended.

I'm always about the best of both worlds.

By: mareli

mareli — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 11:21:55 -0800

Your mother's Medicare and Social Security would probably not be affected by such a move. If you included her as a dependent you might have to declare any Social Security or pension she gets as income. Speak to an accountant.

My favorite cousin lives in Boston with his family and is an only child. His widowed mother lived in DC and wanted to be closer to her son and family, but hesitated for a long time because she did not want to leave her home of 3+ decades, her neighborhood, and her friends. My cousin invited her to live with them, but she wisely chose instead to move to a retirement community near Boston where she could make new friends and spend more time with my cousin, his wife, their kids. That might be a good option for your mother, some sort of retirement community with progressive services as the need arises: independent living, assisted living, nursing care.

The other possibility I was going to mention is what Ruthless Bunny suggests above. How old is your mother? How mobile? Even if she's very mobile Boston winters tend to be harsher than NYC ones.

I'm a grandmother, and I plan to retire in a few years. At this point I'm thinking I'll spend a few months a year up north with my kids; we'll build me a granny cottage on the farm one of them owns. Then I'd want to spend the cold months somewhere sunny and warm. Your mother may have a similar desire to be warm. I know that the older I get the more I worry about slipping on icy sidewalks....

By: MultiFaceted

MultiFaceted — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 11:56:54 -0800

My grandmother (my mother's mother) has lived with us/my mom for the past 27 years, so she was there to help raise me and my sister and provide childcare when needed. Based on that, I'm going to give you some serious things to consider.

We build on a big room to our house for my grandmother (maybe 400 sq ft? It serves as a combined bedroom and living room) and tied it to the half bath. This gave her some privacy and a sense of ownership over her space, which I think is important for everyone involved. There has to be the opportunity for people to shut their door and have some privacy.

They did not combine finances because my grandmother is on Social Security and Medicaid due to income (and has been for a very long time) and all of that would have gotten screwed up. However, my grandmother gives them money for utilities and buys a lot of groceries. My grandmother also helps around the house as much as she can (I think she stopped mowing the yard when she was 85...she's 95 now and still loves doing the laundry).

The biggest drawback I've seen is when my mom got divorced and was single a while before remarrying. Not that that's going to happen to you, but my grandmother became rather possessive and controlling of the whole house during that time (it's in her nature) so when my mom remarried and stepdad moved in, coexisting became stressful. Personalities vary of course, but be thoughtful about your mom's personality and if any territory/control/possessiveness issues may come up between your mom and your wife, especially after a baby. Boundaries are very important, and you all need to be able to have the conversation as many times as it takes.

Other than that, I loved growing up with my grandmother! She took such great care of me and I give her a lot of credit for raising me. I also think that taking care of us and being so involved has kept her going for as long as she has. The hardest part has been me trying not to get pulled into taking sides when mom and grandmother disagree.

By: jbenben

jbenben — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 12:59:11 -0800

Retirement-type community nearby sounds ideal for all involved. Moving from downtown NYC into a living arrangement with you and your wife sounds pretty awful. Your mom likely doesn't drive, and the housing prices you are quoting don't sound like the walkable and diverse-type downtown neighborhood your mom is used to.

It sounds like right now she is self-sufficient, and were she to move, she would be almost entirely dependent on you for entertainment and getting around. Plus, it is HARD to go from being a city mouse into a suburban or country mouse at any age. That doesn't sound like fun for her, does it?

Talk to your mom. Look at retirement options with amenities and activities.

Winters are MUCH harder in the Boston area, too, and this effects what types of activities she'll be able to prticipate in if she moves. Your elderly mom won't want to be waiting around for public transport in the sleet and snow, if that's how you were thinking she might get around independently.

Talk to your mom. Hope it works out!

By: vignettist

vignettist — Tue, 09 Oct 2012 21:23:50 -0800

Just went through almost a year and a half of living with my MIL; she stayed with us in order to help with the baby. I will spare you the details but suffice it to say it was a very trying time on our marriage. It really all depends on the personalities involved, but in our case it was like having a 3rd parent and 3rd marriage partner in the house, and not in a good way. Plus she is 76 with bad knees so she doesn't walk well - that affected her overall ability to actually care for the baby, especially as he started walking. It ended up stil being a lot of work for us even though she was here fulltime. All of us are so much more comfortable now that MIL is staying at her senior living apt full-time, and only visiting from time to time.

To address your question about Social Security, we investigated this a couple of years ago, and we were specifically told that if MIL moved in with one of her children, her SS benefit would be cut. May be specific to her case with regard to how much she paid in (not much) and when she became a citizen (only a few years ago); I would advise an appt with SS for a specific review of your mom's benefits (also to see if they would do any cost of living adjustment if she changed locales).

Everything else aside, I think the opportunity for a close relationship between a baby and their grandparent is so rewarding for everyone involved. I really do hope that your circumstances will be better than ours and that you get to have your mom close, if not on the property.