"At first I was worried about trapping you in a sexless marriage, but now it feels like I might be trapped in one."

September 6, 2012 10:58 PM

My wife has been expressing concern about the long periods of dormancy in our sex life in the past 6 months or so. I don't notice it unless she mentions it. I'm trying to figure out the next step. Many more details within.

To start off, my wife and I have been best friends since freshman year of high school. She is 28 and I (a male) am 27. It was only about a year and a half ago that we became a couple, and our one year wedding anniversary is this month. We figured that the time we had known each other was sufficient pre-marriage experience. Since then we started supporting each other while each of us goes to school full time. She's pursuing her Bachelor's in Social Work. I'm pursuing mine in Engineering. School is going great.

A few important (maybe not-so-important) things to consider:

-My wife has vaginismus of the psychological variety. She was the victim of sexual assault as a middle schooler. I should make clear right now that this in no way affects my sexual attraction to her. There some men for whom this is an issue, but I am not one of them.

-The vaginismus prevents us from having penetrative sex at all but it honestly hasn't been much of a problem when we were doing it a lot. We made things interesting with things we bought from the adult toy shop.

-The vaginismus also makes it almost impossible for her to get a proper gynecological exam. We finally found a female gyno who has been really warm an understanding of the problem. Our next step is to go to a physical therapist. That visit is still pending at the moment. I try to be supportive by asking her if she's keen on setting the appointment, but as passively as possible. Since the condition is tied to both her personal health and sex life, I try to emphasize that the former takes priority.

-This traumatic experience, combined with constantly shitty treatment by her family, has left her with some pretty severe generalized anxiety. She's currently working with a psychiatrist to find the right medication to stave off panic attacks. Right now she's at 0.5mg of Xanax on an as needed basis. We both agree it's working effectively so far.

-I've been diagnosed with dysthymia, a form of depression, for which I'm taking 300mg of Wellbutrin daily. It has helped me tremendously and may have even helped my ADD issues as well. My doctor assured me that the Wellbutrin would have minimal sexual side effects if any.

-I'm otherwise pretty healthy and have gotten my BP to a nice 110/60 (not bad for a family history of hypertension), RHR of 70 or so. I attribute it to the 10 miles of so of fixed gear riding every other day. Height/Weight proportional as well.

So now we get to the meat of it. My wife reminded me a few days that we have not had sex in at least a month. I responded that studies have taken up a lot of time and fatigue has probably killed my libido. She then reminded me that we haven't had very much sex at all since spring break. This is true.

She said "At first I was worried about trapping you in a sexless marriage, but now it feels like I might be trapped in one." She says she feels inadequate and sexually unattractive. I personally feel inadequate for not being able to have sex with my wife with genuine enthusiasm. It's not just her. The idea of sex with anyone is patently boring to me at the moment and I am completely happy with myself otherwise in terms of academics and intellectual discourse with my wife, and I told her as such.

Nevertheless, she is still a little bit concerned and we agreed that I would think about it for a week, you know, really meditate on getting my sexual groove back, and we would consider serious options starting with a visit to my GP. I told her I wasn't especially keen on a doctor's visit because it doesn't feel like a problem, but we'll talk about it again in a week at the latest. She really wants me to see a doctor.

I just need guidance and help parsing the situation here. I hope I gave enough relevant details. Is this normal, first anniversary type stuff? Does my lack of interest in sex in general say something about the marriage as a whole? Is there legitimate reason to go to the doctor?

posted by anonymous to human relations (32 answers total)

are you 100% sure the vaginismus isn't an issue? because that really jumped out, and i couldn't help notice that you mentioned & dismissed it first thing.
posted by facetious at 11:15 PM on September 6, 2012 [6 favorites]

what i mean is, it would be one thing if you had always been a low-libido person or asexual. but you weren't, and now you are. and for a 27-year-old, being pretty busy with academics is not usually a libido-killer. so yeah it suggests that something's up that you're not totally in touch with yet.
posted by facetious at 11:18 PM on September 6, 2012 [1 favorite]

I told her I wasn't especially keen on a doctor's visit because it doesn't feel like a problem

If it's a problem for your wife, then it's a problem, and it would be good to make this a priority. I understand that, since it's not important to you, it seems like it just shouldn't matter. But your lack of concern for her sexual needs is eventually going to cause all sorts of other problems.

(And your wife is probably feeling pretty frazzled if you have hardly had sex since spring break.)
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 11:22 PM on September 6, 2012 [28 favorites]

I told her I wasn't especially keen on a doctor's visit because it doesn't feel like a problem

If it's a problem for your wife, then it's a problem, and it would be good to make this a priority.

This this this. If it's troublesome/worrisome enough that one of you brings it up, don't just blow it off. Go see a doctor.
posted by Pastor of Muppets at 11:24 PM on September 6, 2012 [7 favorites]

I personally feel inadequate for not being able to have sex with my wife with genuine enthusiasm. It's not just her. The idea of sex with anyone is patently boring to me at the moment

No sexual contact at all? If you genuinely can't muster up any enthusiasm for some sort of sexual activity with someone who would like that sort of attention from you, see a therapist. Some things to observe and mention would be if you have any interest in nonsexual touch such as backrubs and holding hands.

OTOH, you might be stuck in a mindset of feeling like you personally need to be overwhelmed with sexual desire to get the sex toys out and show your wife a good time. You don't have to be in a certain mood to do things your spouse would enjoy, and you might feel more desire once things get started. Experiment with trying different things and notice how you feel, rather than treating your level of arousal as a go/no go signal. Vary setting, music, lighting, time of day, etc.

You don't mention anything about how your living space is set up, but don't study for school in the bedroom -- remove anything from your sleeping area that makes you think of work, or is otherwise stressful in any way. If you have no other place for desks, set up a curtain you can close on them or make a canopy for your bed.
posted by yohko at 11:58 PM on September 6, 2012 [1 favorite]

The idea of sex with anyone is patently boring to me at the moment

Yeah. As someone who is also prone to depression this is really one of the first warning signs I look out for now. Maybe it's different for you, but you might want to check on this.
posted by grapesaresour at 12:05 AM on September 7, 2012 [3 favorites]

That is not normal first anniversary stuff in my book.

Your wife brought up what appears to be a serious problem in her eyes (and what would be a serious problem in many people's eyes, including mine), and your response to her was "it doesn't feel like a problem to me."

Not good.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 12:11 AM on September 7, 2012 [15 favorites]

Although I do think it is important for OP to try to stay tuned into his wife's needs, I think some of you are jumping on him a little hard. There is a lot going on in this relationship on both sides-OP seems to have been very open and attentive to the possible difficulties of his wife's vaginismus and it might be nice if his wife was a little understanding of his low libido.

I am also curious why your wife hasn't initiated sex with you if that is what she wants.

Heavy studying CAN cause a lack of interest in sex, as can depression. It seems to me that couples therapy could be good all round here, but so could a little mutual understanding.
posted by Isadorady at 12:25 AM on September 7, 2012 [7 favorites]

I'm with everyone else on this: your wife has perspective that none of us, even you, have on what's up with you, and she also has a legit concern for her own needs causing her to ask for something totally reasonable. Unless you're aware of a really obvious but private explanation that you're not mentioning here (namely, the possibility you're taking care of your own needs independently), talk to your doctor.

I'd add that you almost sound too sanguine and even-keeled about all this. I mean, probably you're just trying to put the issue to us as clearly and as objectively as you can, but I wonder if you're perhaps too neutral / content most of the time. If so, maybe that's something the doctor can help with too.
posted by Monsieur Caution at 12:26 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

My ex describes himself in this way. He has very low testosterone, and low level depression, and his lack of libido was a major factor in ending our marriage. I recommend you see a doctor.
posted by b33j at 12:27 AM on September 7, 2012 [5 favorites]

I was in this marriage.

I had vulvar vestibuliis and my husband had low-level depression and an Everquest addiction and he didn't want sex. This was me 7 years ago.

I found an OB/GYN who believed me and knew about vulvodynia and hooked me up with a physical therapist. I went to the physical therapist and the pain got a lot better. He went to a doctor and found his testosterone level was fine and was prescribed something for his depression that didn't much help and he wasn't interested in seeing a therapist or trying different medication. We continued not having sex.

We divorced and I have since remarried and enjoy frequent penetrative and non-penetrative sex with my new husband.

If you care about your relationship, please do not let this issue slip into the back of your mind. I resented my husband for not caring how big of a deal this was, and my resentment drove us further apart. Because not having sex with the person you love is a really big deal.
posted by rhapsodie at 12:51 AM on September 7, 2012 [10 favorites]

You're a 27 you're old man with no interest in sex, and you don't think that's a problem? Ok, fine, you don't think its a problem, you're content to live in a near sex-less marriage and you're not at all concerned it could be a symptom of something else ( the fatigue is a red herring IMO - you can manage a 10 mile bike ride but not sex with your wife?), but your wife is not content with not having sex. If you love her and want to stay with her then you should see a Dr about this problem, because it is a problem for her.

TBH, you sound a little resentful of your wife not setting herself an appointment with a physical therapist to deal with her problem. Otherwise, why mention it? If her vaginismus isn't a problem, why even bring it up? If its not her and you're just not interested in sex with anyone, why is her medical history relevant? While you haven't said it outright, including that information makes it seem that you dont want to see a dr because she wont.

Is this normal, first anniversary type stuff?
No. Definitely not. You are a young, healthy male in a fairly new relationship, not wanting sex for 6 months is not "normal"

Does my lack of interest in sex in general say something about the marriage as a whole?
No. There are lots of causes of low libido in men and given that you're not interested in anyone, not just your wife, likely your problem is medical and/or psychological, not a problem with your marriage or wife

Is there legitimate reason to go to the doctor?
Absolutely. The most troubling thing I read here is that you don't seem to want to get better. I could understand if you didn't want to go to the Dr because its embarrassing but you just don't seem to care... actually I don't get much of an emotional feeling from anything you've written. You seem pretty apathetic about the whole situation. This could indicate that your medication dose needs adjusting
posted by missmagenta at 1:17 AM on September 7, 2012 [9 favorites]

She said "At first I was worried about trapping you in a sexless marriage, but now it feels like I might be trapped in one."

If this is the first time she's told you of the problem, then this is mean.

If not, then you've left some things out.

Are you able to have an erection? Do you masturbate? Why would you not think this is a problem when your wife clearly thinks it is?

It's fine to have a naturally low libido, but when it is a radical change from a higher libido to a lower libido, then that's a problem.

It's also fine for you to be frustrated with your wife's inability to have penetrative sex. Of course that doesn't and shouldn't put any obligation on her, but it's not unusual for a husband to want that with his wife and be frustrated when that's no longer on the table.

You say:

I should make clear right now that this in no way affects my sexual attraction to her. There some men for whom this is an issue, but I am not one of them.

Well, something is affecting it. You're no longer sexually attracted to her. Why are you so adamant that this isn't the problem? I suspect you think that "good guys would be understanding and not let this be an issue, so I can't acknowledge that this is an issue because that would make me a bad person". Well, it doesn't. It makes you human.

I think if you care about your wife and you care about your marriage you will do everything you can to try to fix what is in your power to fix. Your current attitude is troubling and ultimately not helpful.
posted by inturnaround at 5:20 AM on September 7, 2012 [3 favorites]

Couples having a mismatch in libidos is a very common problem, it seems to me. My spouse and I went through this (before we were married), and we worked through it with a lot of patience on both sides.

What you're wife is saying to you is that sex is important to her right now, for whatever reason. What you're saying to her is that you don't care about her needs. Is that really true?

My period of low libido was also due to low-level depression, stress, and fatigue. I worked through it by dealing with those problems, not by ignoring them. One thing I did that seemed to help, oddly enough, was cut back on exercise. Contrarily, my husband finds that more exercise (especially weight lifting) helps his libido.
posted by muddgirl at 5:35 AM on September 7, 2012

Lots of information to parse here. But from what I gather you need to primarily engage in two things:

1. You both need to seek out doctors that can help alleviate the medical conditions you both are experiencing.

2. You don't need to have sex to have intimacy. So engage in things up to that point for now...make each other feel attractive, loved, and wanted, and you'll both feel better because of it.
posted by samsara at 6:01 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

Interesting that you are on Wellbutrin and experiencing a low libido, because it's known for increasing libido. However, I've known people on Wellbutrin who had marked changes in their personality, extreme irritability and even rage. Maybe it's not hitting your depression hard enough, because low libido is a sign of depression, or maybe you are reacting in a weird way due to your ADD. Is there any noticeable change in your libido since starting it? Some people have to ramp up the dosage (if the doctor thinks it's a good idea).

Just a thought, I'd definitely check in with a doctor because it sounds like low level depression if you aren't concerned about it. Or maybe some whacky side effect that only affects a small percentage of people.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 6:39 AM on September 7, 2012

It would be unusual for the Wellbutrin to be causing the sexual side effects - it's actually used to counteract those types of side effects caused by other anti-depressants. That being said, everybody reacts differently...

Definitely see your doctor - it's possible that adjusting meds could help, or that there is an underlying medical condition that is affecting things.

If it's important to her, it needs to be important to you. Take this from somebody who ignored his wife's requests to see a doctor about an issue for a couple of years, and nearly killed his marriage as a result. Any copay you might need to shell out for a GP visit is money well invested. Heck, look at it pragmatically - paying the doctor would be far less than paying a lawyer.
posted by PGWG at 6:41 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

If it's a problem for your wife, then it's a problem, and it would be good to make this a priority.

Ding ding ding, winner! I'm not really sure if your first stop is a regular doctor, a therapist, or someone else -- as much as anything, you just need to figure out what's at the root of what's going on, and that's going to take some digging. But yeah, she's not happy and that means you should take some reasonable steps to help things out.
posted by Forktine at 7:13 AM on September 7, 2012 [2 favorites]

Wellbutrin is one of very few antidepressants that is not supposed to affect libido, but not everyone has the same body chemistry. I was put on 150mg to start out with, and felt pretty great - my (already high) sex drive increased slightly, and I also had some ADD symptoms that got better. So when my doctor suggested moving up to 300mg to see if it had an even bigger positive affect, I said OF COURSE. Two months later and I was sobbing to my boyfriend because I didn't hardly ever seem to want sex anymore, and the meds made me kind of irritable, and I just did not feel like myself. So I went back on 150, and now I feel awesome again.

It looks like you have a lot of good advice in this thread already, but the medication was the first thing that jumped out at me. Maybe go back to your doctor and try a lower dose.


In a different vein, I don't know your wife (obviously) but I would be more encouraging of her to get her vaginismus stuff all checked out and fixed up (if possible). It can be really difficult to motivate ourselves to start on what may be a long road to the recovery of health issues, especially when the psychological is involved. You don't need to be pushy, of course, but that does not sound like a small issue to me, and I can only assume it's having effects all over the place that you're not even attributing to it.
posted by krakenattack at 7:55 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

Women need constant reassurance that you feel sexually attracted to them. If my husband and I go two weeks, I start to question myself as well as him.

Also, have you had your testosterone levels checked recently?
posted by AbsolutelyHonest at 7:56 AM on September 7, 2012

The amount of self worth that women have tied up in feeling sexually desirable is a toxic cultural thing that I wish were easier to address - but it's not.

I've been on both sides of the fence here. The not receiving and feeling unwanted side is not even on the same planet as the this doesn't really feel like a problem side in terms of emotional impact.

Blame is not necessary, and you are in no way at fault here, but your marriage depends on you being willing to hear your wife and make changes that alleviate what she is defining as distress.

Best of luck.
posted by skrozidile at 9:28 AM on September 7, 2012 [6 favorites]

Women need constant reassurance that you feel sexually attracted to them. If my husband and I go two weeks, I start to question myself as well as him.

Actually, I think it is that most people, male and female, need reassurance that their partner feels sexually attracted to them. This isn't unique to women. Also, for a lot of people, sex and sexual behaviours is how they keep a steady state of intimacy and closeness to their partner. For some people, if you take away the sex, the feelings of closeness and intimacy can start to peter off.
posted by PuppetMcSockerson at 9:38 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

Sidenote - have you cleared with your wife about posting her personal details of her sexual history to ask.metafilter? This type of question is often anonymous, and YMMV plus your wife's, but if you didn't already, you may want to check with her that she's also okay with you sharing this with your account, and by extension her's, linked to it.
posted by viggorlijah at 9:57 AM on September 7, 2012

Make an appointment with your doctor. It is a good example for your wife's reluctance to keep pursuing her issues, it can't hurt, and it make her feel better. Just schedule a check-up and bring it up as an issue of your current health.

Realistically though, your average GP is likely to say can you get an erection? Do you masturbate? Okay there's nothing wrong with you physically oh you have depression? It's a mental state. And they're probably right.

I've also been on both sides of this. Personally very much on the other side of it right now due to a very unambiguous medication issue that you know, there it is. It might not be that common for late twenties after a year of marriage but for 40s, after more than a decade, with kids? For sure keep working on it now because kid, it doesn't get easier.

When I was around your age and my wife was unsatisfied with how often we were having sex the things that made the biggest difference were cutting back on masturbating and having sex regardless of whether I felt "enthusiastic". Quite often I would discover unexpected reserves of enthusiasm once I was, you know, naked and having sex.

Personally whether I'm masturbating or not is a big window into whether my "libido" per se is the issue. If I have no problem jerking off but feel indifferent to having sex it's usually more about how my depression makes me resistant to emotional connection and intimacy. There are worse things than faking it under these circumstances.
posted by Luke Skywalker at 10:11 AM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

"At first I was worried about trapping you in a sexless marriage, but now it feels like I might be trapped in one."

I agree that this is kind of mean to come out and say, particularly after establishing a relationship of limited sexual activity to accommodate one partner's [mental/sexual/psychological?] condition.

Your wife is working on her bachelor of social work. No doubt she in encountering materials in her coursework that are helping her connect her own dots of trauma and shame. Perhaps she has been gradually becoming more comfortable with her issues of shame-embedded trauma, being her own sexual being, and wants to explore more. But it doesn't sound like she's communicated her progress with you up until this point (where it's become a problem for her now).

I also suspect that with the vaginismus setting the tone for the sexual part of your relationship, you've conditioned yourself not to be too sexually reactive to her and perhaps women in general, out of concern and consideration for your wife's condition.

But I think sending you for professional help is outsourcing the problem solving to some extent. If your wife wants to rediscover a more joyful, mutually sharing sexual relationship with you, there's lots of books out there -- even for sexual trauma survivors -- on how to kindle a healthier, less shame-entrenched spark in an existing relationship. Don't underestimate how much a partner is affected by a person's [in this case, sexual] dysfunction. By being her partner you are jumping the hoops with her, whether you realize it or not. A good book will work with both partners to help reset their switches and become better equipped for navigating more intimate sexual waters that have been previously blocked off for both of you. If your wife has learned to give herself permission to want and explore sex more, then I think it would be helpful for both of you to give yourselves and acknowledge that permission with each other. Feeling sexually inadequate and unattractive is something your wife can own by including you in her recovery process -- so that you're not mentally stuck at square one while she starts doing laps towards recovery in her mind, then getting frustrated with you for not keeping up.
posted by human ecologist at 11:14 AM on September 7, 2012 [2 favorites]

"At first I was worried about trapping you in a sexless marriage, but now it feels like I might be trapped in one."

Granted I don't know the situation, but this seems like something I would say to my husband to diffuse tension, not intending to be mean.
posted by muddgirl at 11:18 AM on September 7, 2012

[Folks, we'll all do a lot better here if we don't start calling other people sexist, just answer the OPs question?]
posted by jessamyn at 3:08 PM on September 7, 2012

Ok, then, since the question is partially 'is this not normal?' then I say no, it's fine, it's normal, but if it's a problem for your marriage, it needs to be addressed. No reason for anyone to feel (or be made to feel) like a freak.
posted by namesarehard at 3:11 PM on September 7, 2012

I would suggest David Schnarch's books, e.g. Passionate Marriage. He deals with couples who have sex problems and has a very fresh and innovative approach, that gets at the emotional issues, based on a many-decades career as a couples therapist. That might be a good way to start to get your heart in line.
posted by kellybird at 4:34 PM on September 7, 2012

Yes, getting defensive and feeling inadequate! I also had a little bit, "Gosh, he just wants me for my body, he doesn't even care what I'm going through right now!" But it was important for me to remember that he knows me better than almost anyone in the world - if he's saying, "Something's changed in a way that affects our relationship," he has a good claim to know what he's talking about. If he didn't care about me, about us, then he could have just broken up.
posted by muddgirl at 6:52 PM on September 7, 2012

(Also, do you feel comfortable asking her, "Are there ways I can show how much I care for you, how much I desire you, when I'm not feeling sexy?" For my husband, sometimes it was as simple as making an effort to initiate non-sexual cuddle time.)
posted by muddgirl at 6:56 PM on September 7, 2012 [1 favorite]

She says she feels inadequate and sexually unattractive. I personally feel inadequate for not being able to have sex with my wife with genuine enthusiasm. It's not just her. The idea of sex with anyone is patently boring to me at the moment and I am completely happy with myself otherwise in terms of academics and intellectual discourse with my wife, and I told her as such.

The bolded part makes me want to ask about how you two typically show intimacy and affection for each other, outside of sexytime.

1. Do you compliment her much? Tell her how she looks beautiful in that dress, how her hair smells so great, how you love her smile, etc.?
2. Do you touch her affectionately? Give her hugs, kisses on the neck and face, give her kisses on the lips out of pure affection? Give her butt a squeeze or a little spank for fun? If you feel these are just used as precursors for sexytime, work on changing that attitude.
3. Are you cuddly people? Do you tickle each other? cuddle in bed or on the couch?

Fixing the sex issue might not be the complete solution here. Your wife should think about whether she feels the lack of fooling around and giving each other orgasms is primarily what's making her feel this way. Or if it's more that she needs more intimacy and affection from you. I bet it's mostly the latter, from how you phrased things above.

There was a time when I felt inadequate and sexually unattractive, but we were having regular sex, so more sex wasn't the solution. I realized I was craving intimacy and physical affection like kisses, physical touch and compliments, and I only got that from him during sex. So we worked on it, made the effort to cuddle and kiss more (and it wouldn't mean sex was on the table), and I asked him to tell me out loud when he's thinking I look great in a particular outfit, if he thinks I look beautiful, etc. Improving that has done a lot for my feeling secure and desired.
posted by lizbunny at 9:11 AM on September 8, 2012 [2 favorites]