Lapcat: male or female?
September 1, 2012 2:32 AM Subscribe
Kitteno or Kittena? Help us decide which kitten to keep.
Last month, our cat had a litter of 5 kittens. We are planning to keep one of the kittens, but it is very hard to make a choice on which one.
There are four males and one female. Given our cat is not really a lapcat (rather standoff-ish and rarely purring), we wanted to keep one that would become more so. The vet advised us to keep a male as they tend to be more lapcattish. But the female is all so curious about everything and interested about what we do. And one of the males looks exactly like his mom when she was small... and purrs very loudly!
So, in your experience, which sex would get along better with cat mommy? And would either of them really be more likely to be more of a lapcat?
Please, no scolding about not spaying our cat. We planned this cat pregnancy to give the mom a companion and she will be spayed next month. We also have plenty of good homes for the kittens.
Last month, our cat had a litter of 5 kittens. We are planning to keep one of the kittens, but it is very hard to make a choice on which one.
There are four males and one female. Given our cat is not really a lapcat (rather standoff-ish and rarely purring), we wanted to keep one that would become more so. The vet advised us to keep a male as they tend to be more lapcattish. But the female is all so curious about everything and interested about what we do. And one of the males looks exactly like his mom when she was small... and purrs very loudly!
So, in your experience, which sex would get along better with cat mommy? And would either of them really be more likely to be more of a lapcat?
Please, no scolding about not spaying our cat. We planned this cat pregnancy to give the mom a companion and she will be spayed next month. We also have plenty of good homes for the kittens.
Gender actually makes no difference, adult neutered cats don't have noticeable secondary sexual characteristics. I've had sibling cats twice, once the female was the snuggliest and once the male. When it was the female I occasionally had people tell me how male cats are the most lapcatist despite the obvious evidence to the contrary right in front of them, so it's definitely a thing that people believe. But the science doesn't bear it out.
So keep the one you like the best and that seems like it will be the best companion for the mother cat (since that was kind of the point). Their personalities do change over the first several months, partially due to them just growing up and partially due to your influence, so give whomever lots of snuggles and it will be all good.
Of course, I've always found three cats to be the magical number ...
posted by shelleycat at 3:20 AM on September 1, 2012 [2 favorites]
So keep the one you like the best and that seems like it will be the best companion for the mother cat (since that was kind of the point). Their personalities do change over the first several months, partially due to them just growing up and partially due to your influence, so give whomever lots of snuggles and it will be all good.
Of course, I've always found three cats to be the magical number ...
posted by shelleycat at 3:20 AM on September 1, 2012 [2 favorites]
Oh, I'm assuming you'll neuter the kittens right at puberty time, because male cats can develop not-so-great secondary sexual characteristics if you leave them too long before neutering. One thing which may help sway you is that the neutering is a lot cheaper for a male.
posted by shelleycat at 3:22 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by shelleycat at 3:22 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I've always had male cats until recently. The first let you know in no uncertain terms that he was NOT a lap cat, but would deign to let you scritch his ears if he jumped into your arms while you were standing. Not sitting. :) The second was very much a lap cat, while the third has been more the "no, I will NOT sit on your lap... wait, is that a book you're reading? Oh hey I'd love to sit on your book" type. The fourth was super-cuddly but not very lap-y. I've had a girl kitten for almost a year now (so she's become a "cat" recently), however, and she is like "MOW LAPS ARE THE BEST MWAP I LOVE LAPS MEWMEW" and I have just never seen such a chatterbox cuddle-lovebug. Apparently her mother is the same way.
So I'd say pick whichever is the cuddliest with you now; whichever's personality you enjoy the most. They do carry over kitten behavior into adulthood when they're neutered early – my big furball liked to sit in my hair and gnaw it when he was a wee lad, for instance, and he still occasionally does that. My little girl-cat has always been a wide-eyed adventuress, and hoo boy that has not stopped either, hehe.
posted by fraula at 4:10 AM on September 1, 2012
So I'd say pick whichever is the cuddliest with you now; whichever's personality you enjoy the most. They do carry over kitten behavior into adulthood when they're neutered early – my big furball liked to sit in my hair and gnaw it when he was a wee lad, for instance, and he still occasionally does that. My little girl-cat has always been a wide-eyed adventuress, and hoo boy that has not stopped either, hehe.
posted by fraula at 4:10 AM on September 1, 2012
Best answer: Please keep two, if you possibly can, they are so much happier together and twice as much fun. Three cats is a good number, not unmanageable. And since the mama cat is staying, you will have no issues of integrating a strange cat which can be difficult. Yes, their kitten personalities do carry over to the adult cat, and do have a vet confirm the sex. I thought I knew how, but Attila who we thought was male, being the biggest and most adventuresome kitten, turned out to be Tilla, a female when we took her to be neutered.
posted by mermayd at 4:39 AM on September 1, 2012 [7 favorites]
posted by mermayd at 4:39 AM on September 1, 2012 [7 favorites]
...get along with cat mommy? Male, in my experience.
But jeez, what a pig-headed boy we kept when we had to make that decision!
You know, one that knocks down all the plants every night...that Mraaw!s endlessly for me to open the door and then goes the other way...turns over dustbins, even when they're weighed down with bricks...worms himself through the narrowest of inaccessible upstairs bathroom windows and makes a mess...
If I had to do this over I'd chose the female kitten just for smart-independence-points.
posted by Namlit at 4:48 AM on September 1, 2012
But jeez, what a pig-headed boy we kept when we had to make that decision!
You know, one that knocks down all the plants every night...that Mraaw!s endlessly for me to open the door and then goes the other way...turns over dustbins, even when they're weighed down with bricks...worms himself through the narrowest of inaccessible upstairs bathroom windows and makes a mess...
If I had to do this over I'd chose the female kitten just for smart-independence-points.
posted by Namlit at 4:48 AM on September 1, 2012
I have had five cats in my life, 3 males and 2 females. All of them have been pretty good lap cats. One of the males was less of one than the other four but relatively so as the others were big cuddlers. I would probably lean towards a female because all three of the males had unrinary tract problems. But once again, that is my small data set.
posted by Silvertree at 5:17 AM on September 1, 2012
posted by Silvertree at 5:17 AM on September 1, 2012
I have two (unrelated) females, introduced as adults (well, adult and teen, but the adult had lived with other pets before) and they tolerate each other well enough now. They don't fight, and they sometimes play, which is great for the older (she's 12) cat, but they don't really cuddle or groom or anything.
Both of them are affectionate to me in their way, though I wonder if a male would have bonded better with my older female. (The younger was a stray who showed up where I work and I took her.)
My main complaint with having two females is that female urine tends to smell much more pungent than male urine, and neither of mine go outside, so the litter box is a problem.
posted by carolinecrane at 5:31 AM on September 1, 2012
Both of them are affectionate to me in their way, though I wonder if a male would have bonded better with my older female. (The younger was a stray who showed up where I work and I took her.)
My main complaint with having two females is that female urine tends to smell much more pungent than male urine, and neither of mine go outside, so the litter box is a problem.
posted by carolinecrane at 5:31 AM on September 1, 2012
Response by poster: We would love to keep both the boy and the girl, but alas we only have a small upstairs flat (and no garden) and I don't think three cats would really fit comfortably in there. Those of you who have three cats, how much space do you have for your cats?
As for their personality, the two we're struggling to make a choice with are very different. The little girl explores a lot, but does curl up to sleep near one of us on the sofa once in a while. The little boy is much more settled, he is less inquisitive though still curious and runs around but he also likes to be sleeping in a corner on his own; he seems much more quiet.
And yes, whichever one we keep will be spayed/neutered. We're not planning on having any more kittens and I have heard horror stories about male cats spraying.
posted by tweemy at 5:35 AM on September 1, 2012
As for their personality, the two we're struggling to make a choice with are very different. The little girl explores a lot, but does curl up to sleep near one of us on the sofa once in a while. The little boy is much more settled, he is less inquisitive though still curious and runs around but he also likes to be sleeping in a corner on his own; he seems much more quiet.
And yes, whichever one we keep will be spayed/neutered. We're not planning on having any more kittens and I have heard horror stories about male cats spraying.
posted by tweemy at 5:35 AM on September 1, 2012
I doubt you will notice the difference between two and three cats, and I support the "keep two" philosophy. We have four cats (and one crazy Siberian Husky) in a small, one bedroom house, granted they've got some spaces to hide in to get away from the dog. Keep them both, twice the fun!
posted by HuronBob at 6:13 AM on September 1, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by HuronBob at 6:13 AM on September 1, 2012 [5 favorites]
Boy cats rock. Since you already have a girl cat (mom) why not keep the boy and experience the glories of having a boy cat for yourself?
posted by monkey!knife!fight! at 6:45 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by monkey!knife!fight! at 6:45 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
If you really do have specific homes waiting for the other kittens, keep the boy. Anecdotally, you'll hear that a male and female adult cat (both neutered) get along better than female and female, although that's not a hard-and-fast rule.
However, should you actually be planning to hand off the surplus kittens to a shelter, then my advice is to keep one of the black ones. There's definitely a bias against black animals (happens with dogs too) and a black kitten is somewhat less likely to be adopted, so you should assure one of the black kittens an immediate home.
posted by zadcat at 7:27 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
However, should you actually be planning to hand off the surplus kittens to a shelter, then my advice is to keep one of the black ones. There's definitely a bias against black animals (happens with dogs too) and a black kitten is somewhat less likely to be adopted, so you should assure one of the black kittens an immediate home.
posted by zadcat at 7:27 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
I don't think three cats would really fit
I don't know where people get this idea that cats needs lots of space. They're not horses. Some room to run around is great, but they will make their own fun and room in a given space. Our downstairs neighbors just adopted two more cats, bringing their total to five, in a decent-but-not-huge apartment. We have three cats, and our ideal is really four (but one cat is elderly and we really can't make her accept a new cat). We've also had as many as five in this flat, though that was one cat too many, we felt.
So yes, keep two kittens!
posted by rtha at 7:54 AM on September 1, 2012 [3 favorites]
I don't know where people get this idea that cats needs lots of space. They're not horses. Some room to run around is great, but they will make their own fun and room in a given space. Our downstairs neighbors just adopted two more cats, bringing their total to five, in a decent-but-not-huge apartment. We have three cats, and our ideal is really four (but one cat is elderly and we really can't make her accept a new cat). We've also had as many as five in this flat, though that was one cat too many, we felt.
So yes, keep two kittens!
posted by rtha at 7:54 AM on September 1, 2012 [3 favorites]
Best answer: The girl kitties we've had have been more bonded to one person where the guys have been more affectionate with everyone. That said I agree with everyone saying keep two - litter-mates will be buds forever. We currently have a mother cat and two of her sons - all middle-aged kitties now. The guys will sleep together and play together all the time, mom is more standoffish with them although very cuddly with us, particularly with my son. She'll be upset when he leaves for college next year!
If you don't already have a kitty tower I recommend finding a corner for one - our cats made the transition from outdoors to indoors cats a few years ago and the tower made a huge difference - they play, fight, scratch and sleep on it every day.
posted by leslies at 7:59 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
If you don't already have a kitty tower I recommend finding a corner for one - our cats made the transition from outdoors to indoors cats a few years ago and the tower made a huge difference - they play, fight, scratch and sleep on it every day.
posted by leslies at 7:59 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
Eh, I've lived in a 2-bedroom apartment with 4 cats. You really need to have 2 Littermaids in there if you are not on top of the poop detail (which my roommate was not so much), but it's doable. I don't think space is an issue for cats, compared to dealing with poop smell in an enclosed space.
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:35 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:35 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Cats are healthier and live longer when they have company, and siblings are really great to pair as pets. The cats need as much room as they want, really; as long as they can romp through the room(s) when they feel like it and have a sunbean to snooze in the other 95% of the time, they'll be fine. KEEP BOOOOOOOOTH!
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 8:35 AM on September 1, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 8:35 AM on September 1, 2012 [4 favorites]
We have had sibling boy cats in small-ish apartments for 5 years. They don't need a lot of space. I agree with above to keep both! :)
posted by artdesk at 9:05 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by artdesk at 9:05 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]
I currently have 2 female cats - 1 is a cuddle-buddy, 1 prefers to lounge solo. I don't think gender makes a difference.
posted by Fig at 9:48 AM on September 1, 2012
posted by Fig at 9:48 AM on September 1, 2012
My main complaint with having two females is that female urine tends to smell much more pungent than male urine, and neither of mine go outside, so the litter box is a problem.
I noticed exactly the opposite when my roommate had a female cat and our friends had a male (both neutered, same litterbox set-up). My roommate's female cat's box was not nearly as bad as our friends' male cat's box. I think it must actually be an individual thing.
posted by Ery at 10:26 AM on September 1, 2012
I noticed exactly the opposite when my roommate had a female cat and our friends had a male (both neutered, same litterbox set-up). My roommate's female cat's box was not nearly as bad as our friends' male cat's box. I think it must actually be an individual thing.
posted by Ery at 10:26 AM on September 1, 2012
I used to prefer male kittens in the past simply because it was less expensive to neuter than spay, and was less invasive surgery. (I've never owned a cat that enjoyed riding in the car, and spaying used to require at least two trips to the vet.)
That said, I've also learned that a kitten's behavior is not necessarily indicative of how it will behave as an adult. For example, we've had Tweak since she was born, and she got her name because of her nervous jumpy behavior. She mellowed out quite a bit by the time she was six months old. As a kitten she played and responded equally with Mr. Adams and me, but she's now 12 years old and for at least the last decade she has been Mr. Adams' cat. She seems to tolerate me because I'm the one who cleans the litter box and fills the food and water dish, but it is his lap that she always flops down on when we watch TV. And when we go to bed she always insinuates herself between us and snuggles up against Mr. Adams' side, begging for petting. She'll eventually turn belly-up and demand that he stroke her tummy for some 20 minutes or so before both fall asleep. (Mr. Adams even sleeps with an old pillow in the center of the bed - Tweak's pillow. For her to get comfy on, and to lift her up so that she's at a comfortable petting level for him.)
posted by Oriole Adams at 10:49 AM on September 1, 2012 [2 favorites]
That said, I've also learned that a kitten's behavior is not necessarily indicative of how it will behave as an adult. For example, we've had Tweak since she was born, and she got her name because of her nervous jumpy behavior. She mellowed out quite a bit by the time she was six months old. As a kitten she played and responded equally with Mr. Adams and me, but she's now 12 years old and for at least the last decade she has been Mr. Adams' cat. She seems to tolerate me because I'm the one who cleans the litter box and fills the food and water dish, but it is his lap that she always flops down on when we watch TV. And when we go to bed she always insinuates herself between us and snuggles up against Mr. Adams' side, begging for petting. She'll eventually turn belly-up and demand that he stroke her tummy for some 20 minutes or so before both fall asleep. (Mr. Adams even sleeps with an old pillow in the center of the bed - Tweak's pillow. For her to get comfy on, and to lift her up so that she's at a comfortable petting level for him.)
posted by Oriole Adams at 10:49 AM on September 1, 2012 [2 favorites]
Tweemy's partner here; otherwise known as Shoops' human. We've been dithering over the 'which to keep' for a while, and narrowed it down to these two. We've literally said 'OK, we're keeping this one' for both girl and boy kitty at several times, so it's been really hard to choose - we love them both in their own way.
We gave them all temporary names as we weren't sure which we'd end up keeping, the girl is Scrat, the boy Manny (after the squirrel and elephant in Ice Age). Scrat is a bundle of energy and very inquisitive - she's pretty much always first to explore onto places and is constantly chasing and running with the others, and she's definitely longer legged than the rest as they grow. Manny is the fluffiest of the bunch, and comparing to his Mum's pictures at the same age, think he might even end up fluffier. Despite being moggies, Shoops has been mistaken for a Maine Coon several times. We do love the fluffly strokable tail... He's also the purriest when being stroked; while Scrat purrs loads when suckling, she does it less when snuggling. Scrat is more likely to come and say hello on the sofa though, especially if you have a laptop... Manny is currently playing with my foot. We're a bit concerned that Scrat isn't quite litter trained yet, and is sometimes using the floor next to either tray, despite constant emptying (dear lord, do 5 kittens produce a lot of poop), though we'll hopefully sort that out. Her mum never covers her poop though, so we're hoping to litter train these guys better than Shoops was before we got her.
We've had shoops since she was a kitten. It is surprisingly hard to get kittens here (rural south UK) as everybody now neuters them early; you can get breed cats for hundreds, but moggies are actually pretty rare. Took us several months and quite a distance to get Shoops. Local shelters largely only have older problem or abandoned cats, and we weren't considered a suitable host family as a) no garden and b) about 100 yards from the main road through town. We put the kittens up for advert yesterday evening, and already have two now going to a family in a couple of weeks when they're first ready to leave at 9 weeks; we also have a backup destination for a third if needed. Whatever happens, they're not going to a shelter or the vet. At most now we need to find a home for the 2nd Cole, and whichever of Scrat/Manny we don't keep. If we keep both, and go for backup plan, they've all already got homes.
Shoops has largely been an indoor cat, and we aim to do the same for any we keep, though she does go for a wander when we're outside sometimes - she really wants to go out at times, but doesn't wander too far. She has a huge cat tree, though she mainly prefers it as a scratching post. Suitable sleeping spots include my desk, laptops, sofas, our bay window especially, on top of a bookcase... We love her to bits, even if she's not turned out to purr much (she can, but it's so quiet you can only hear it at whisker distance). She sometimes will make biscuits on a blanket next to you, even if she's not a lapcat. And she does like cheek strokes a fair bit. Part of why we planned on her having kittens was her for to have company as we missed out on getting her brother. We've been kinda getting used to having 6 cats, so having two go away is already a wrench.
Space wise, the kitten themselves obviously have no problem running about all over the and finding sleeping spots and playing with toys, even if they do sound like marbles on the laminate to our downstairs neighbour when they're at full chase round mode! It's more that having up to three litter trays, and that three adult cats cooped up in the same place all day when we're at work might make them a bit twitchy. Shoops has been a bit lonely we think; we don't want to go too far the other way and stress her out. Though we do have a cat flap, we keep it locked.
The other factor is we're thinking baby in the not too distant future; though we're hoping to move up a proper house at some point, the drop in prices rather hammered us on this place, though the mortgage is plenty affordable. So it's not 'physical space' per se; just more whether 3 cats on their own will be ok while we're both at work, and/or three cats plus baby when it gets to that point. And three cats aren't much more expensive than two, and I'm not particularly worried about that, I am thinking the budget will get tighter when we go down to just my salary for a while and I don't want to over-stretch us, even if we do have a decent nest egg building up atm...
Anyway, to cut a long post down before it gets longer, we're definitely considering keeping both; just trying to make sure we consider the ramifications of having three adult cats for a decade or more. I'm also the worrying type. Shoops is my first cat (was a dog guy before), though not my wife's first. Overall, it's been very successful so far. Just want to make sure we look after them all properly as responsible owners. Very interesting that so many have said keep both...
posted by ArkhanJG at 12:54 PM on September 1, 2012
We gave them all temporary names as we weren't sure which we'd end up keeping, the girl is Scrat, the boy Manny (after the squirrel and elephant in Ice Age). Scrat is a bundle of energy and very inquisitive - she's pretty much always first to explore onto places and is constantly chasing and running with the others, and she's definitely longer legged than the rest as they grow. Manny is the fluffiest of the bunch, and comparing to his Mum's pictures at the same age, think he might even end up fluffier. Despite being moggies, Shoops has been mistaken for a Maine Coon several times. We do love the fluffly strokable tail... He's also the purriest when being stroked; while Scrat purrs loads when suckling, she does it less when snuggling. Scrat is more likely to come and say hello on the sofa though, especially if you have a laptop... Manny is currently playing with my foot. We're a bit concerned that Scrat isn't quite litter trained yet, and is sometimes using the floor next to either tray, despite constant emptying (dear lord, do 5 kittens produce a lot of poop), though we'll hopefully sort that out. Her mum never covers her poop though, so we're hoping to litter train these guys better than Shoops was before we got her.
We've had shoops since she was a kitten. It is surprisingly hard to get kittens here (rural south UK) as everybody now neuters them early; you can get breed cats for hundreds, but moggies are actually pretty rare. Took us several months and quite a distance to get Shoops. Local shelters largely only have older problem or abandoned cats, and we weren't considered a suitable host family as a) no garden and b) about 100 yards from the main road through town. We put the kittens up for advert yesterday evening, and already have two now going to a family in a couple of weeks when they're first ready to leave at 9 weeks; we also have a backup destination for a third if needed. Whatever happens, they're not going to a shelter or the vet. At most now we need to find a home for the 2nd Cole, and whichever of Scrat/Manny we don't keep. If we keep both, and go for backup plan, they've all already got homes.
Shoops has largely been an indoor cat, and we aim to do the same for any we keep, though she does go for a wander when we're outside sometimes - she really wants to go out at times, but doesn't wander too far. She has a huge cat tree, though she mainly prefers it as a scratching post. Suitable sleeping spots include my desk, laptops, sofas, our bay window especially, on top of a bookcase... We love her to bits, even if she's not turned out to purr much (she can, but it's so quiet you can only hear it at whisker distance). She sometimes will make biscuits on a blanket next to you, even if she's not a lapcat. And she does like cheek strokes a fair bit. Part of why we planned on her having kittens was her for to have company as we missed out on getting her brother. We've been kinda getting used to having 6 cats, so having two go away is already a wrench.
Space wise, the kitten themselves obviously have no problem running about all over the and finding sleeping spots and playing with toys, even if they do sound like marbles on the laminate to our downstairs neighbour when they're at full chase round mode! It's more that having up to three litter trays, and that three adult cats cooped up in the same place all day when we're at work might make them a bit twitchy. Shoops has been a bit lonely we think; we don't want to go too far the other way and stress her out. Though we do have a cat flap, we keep it locked.
The other factor is we're thinking baby in the not too distant future; though we're hoping to move up a proper house at some point, the drop in prices rather hammered us on this place, though the mortgage is plenty affordable. So it's not 'physical space' per se; just more whether 3 cats on their own will be ok while we're both at work, and/or three cats plus baby when it gets to that point. And three cats aren't much more expensive than two, and I'm not particularly worried about that, I am thinking the budget will get tighter when we go down to just my salary for a while and I don't want to over-stretch us, even if we do have a decent nest egg building up atm...
Anyway, to cut a long post down before it gets longer, we're definitely considering keeping both; just trying to make sure we consider the ramifications of having three adult cats for a decade or more. I'm also the worrying type. Shoops is my first cat (was a dog guy before), though not my wife's first. Overall, it's been very successful so far. Just want to make sure we look after them all properly as responsible owners. Very interesting that so many have said keep both...
posted by ArkhanJG at 12:54 PM on September 1, 2012
I'm all for females being more lap cats than males and think they do better living with their moms, but of course the answers here are all over the place. This is due to the anecdotal nature of relationships and the fact that Cats. Are. Weird.
If you know you have homes for everyone, the black cat issue is not a problem. If you are really wishing you could keep three, remember there's a whole vertical component to your space that cats can exploit which effectively doubles your cat's living space. It's pretty easy to put up walkways, stairs, perches and create hidey holes, and you might even consider a window space for three season use.
You may not mind carpeted perches, which I think are slightly tacky, but a friend has made something like these, which are quite nice. There are two above his couch, about 28 inches wide, nearly all the way to the ceiling, and they have one or two knickknacks superglued to the shelves, a few books securely fastened, and two have pictures anchored with L-brackets that the cats sleep behind. There is carpet only on the top shelves which can't be seen. The couch is slightly pulled out from the wall, and there is another Ikea Billy-style shelf about eight inches wide behind it on legs. The shelf holds a (heavy) plant pot and some books they occasionally kick over. Everything is very nicely made.
The wife designed two window spaces that mount on the outside of the house. They extend out about a foot and are cat high, have a solid top and bottom and plastic lattice on the front and sides and she puts potted plants on them in the summer, and seasonal decorations in fall and winter. I don't think the landlord has cottoned on to the fact that they are used to air out the cats.
The husband took the doors off the cabinet under the bathroom sink and created a place for two litter boxes. They are very tidy and responsible people, and the landlord is comfortable that they will return the apartment to it's original catless condition.
There's also a nicely crafted wooden raised enclosed box beside their entry with room to store shoes under and to sit on that holds two litter pans with a divider in between. Entry is on the sides, and the back is open halfway up for light and air.
They have other nifty things rigged up in coffee tables and under their captain's drawer bed, and you don't realize there are four cats in a small one bedroom apartment. Of course, the one cat prefers to chill out in a paper bag in the middle of the living room floor.
Even if you don't keep three cats, two would be more than happy to be catered to. ;)
Test for which kitten to keep if you decide on being a two cat household: Have a friend take each kitten to their place one at a time for an hour or two. See which one you miss most.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:11 PM on September 1, 2012
If you know you have homes for everyone, the black cat issue is not a problem. If you are really wishing you could keep three, remember there's a whole vertical component to your space that cats can exploit which effectively doubles your cat's living space. It's pretty easy to put up walkways, stairs, perches and create hidey holes, and you might even consider a window space for three season use.
You may not mind carpeted perches, which I think are slightly tacky, but a friend has made something like these, which are quite nice. There are two above his couch, about 28 inches wide, nearly all the way to the ceiling, and they have one or two knickknacks superglued to the shelves, a few books securely fastened, and two have pictures anchored with L-brackets that the cats sleep behind. There is carpet only on the top shelves which can't be seen. The couch is slightly pulled out from the wall, and there is another Ikea Billy-style shelf about eight inches wide behind it on legs. The shelf holds a (heavy) plant pot and some books they occasionally kick over. Everything is very nicely made.
The wife designed two window spaces that mount on the outside of the house. They extend out about a foot and are cat high, have a solid top and bottom and plastic lattice on the front and sides and she puts potted plants on them in the summer, and seasonal decorations in fall and winter. I don't think the landlord has cottoned on to the fact that they are used to air out the cats.
The husband took the doors off the cabinet under the bathroom sink and created a place for two litter boxes. They are very tidy and responsible people, and the landlord is comfortable that they will return the apartment to it's original catless condition.
There's also a nicely crafted wooden raised enclosed box beside their entry with room to store shoes under and to sit on that holds two litter pans with a divider in between. Entry is on the sides, and the back is open halfway up for light and air.
They have other nifty things rigged up in coffee tables and under their captain's drawer bed, and you don't realize there are four cats in a small one bedroom apartment. Of course, the one cat prefers to chill out in a paper bag in the middle of the living room floor.
Even if you don't keep three cats, two would be more than happy to be catered to. ;)
Test for which kitten to keep if you decide on being a two cat household: Have a friend take each kitten to their place one at a time for an hour or two. See which one you miss most.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:11 PM on September 1, 2012
Poop! Meant to say that the shelf behind the couch is mounted horizontal as one long shelf at couch height, the two above are vertical.
...3 cats on their own will be ok while we're both at work, and/or three cats plus baby when it gets to that point.
Perhaps you should consider child care rather than cat nannys?
Regarding the expense of keeping three cats, you might consider pet insurance just in case of major vet bills.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:17 PM on September 1, 2012
...3 cats on their own will be ok while we're both at work, and/or three cats plus baby when it gets to that point.
Perhaps you should consider child care rather than cat nannys?
Regarding the expense of keeping three cats, you might consider pet insurance just in case of major vet bills.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:17 PM on September 1, 2012
Perhaps you should consider child care rather than cat nannys?
You mean we couldn't just leave the baby in the living room with mummy cat while we both go back to work? Damn.
OK, OK, I could have phrased it better first time round.
posted by ArkhanJG at 3:22 PM on September 1, 2012
You mean we couldn't just leave the baby in the living room with mummy cat while we both go back to work? Damn.
OK, OK, I could have phrased it better first time round.
posted by ArkhanJG at 3:22 PM on September 1, 2012
Best answer: Keep a boy cat - specifically one that understands what a litter box is for, purrs when petted, looks DIRECTLY in your eyes when approached and is willing to be held for a very long time. Indifferent litter box users start young usually. The direct eye contact thing is more indicative of affection for people (and possible trainability) although sometimes it results in crazy not friendly. The holding thing is not something you cat grows into or out of but seems to remain constant in neutered cats.
YMMV but these are my guidelines. So speaketh the cat lady.
posted by fiercekitten at 3:55 PM on September 1, 2012
YMMV but these are my guidelines. So speaketh the cat lady.
posted by fiercekitten at 3:55 PM on September 1, 2012
Cats are healthier and live longer when they have company.
A lot of what's written here is anecdotal observation – viz. my old cat, who utterly insisted on being my sole cat, lived to be 20; my current cat, who's in good health, and who is almost as absolute about being sole cat, is 18. They've had my company, but both these cats made it abundantly clear that no other cat was wanted in their life.
posted by zadcat at 4:52 PM on September 1, 2012
A lot of what's written here is anecdotal observation – viz. my old cat, who utterly insisted on being my sole cat, lived to be 20; my current cat, who's in good health, and who is almost as absolute about being sole cat, is 18. They've had my company, but both these cats made it abundantly clear that no other cat was wanted in their life.
posted by zadcat at 4:52 PM on September 1, 2012
Having watched two friends (and seen the same thing play out on ask.me) adopt a kitten in a house with an existing older cat, only to find that the kitten NEVER really seemed to work out the litter box thing (still pooping on the floor one year on!), I would say you should keep whichever kitten is best at using the litter box. No matter how cute and cuddly and good with mama the second cat is, you will curse her/him if you end up in a months-long struggle to avoid excretions on your furniture.
And I don't think you can figure out the lap-cat thing at this age. Our kitty was the snuggliest cuddliest kitten ever who always wanted to be on your lap, and who snuggled up with total strangers at every opportunity. She grew out of it and is kind of stand-offish as an adult cat. Other friends say that their older cats didn't become lap cats until the age of four or five, but now totally are.
posted by lollusc at 6:13 PM on September 1, 2012
And I don't think you can figure out the lap-cat thing at this age. Our kitty was the snuggliest cuddliest kitten ever who always wanted to be on your lap, and who snuggled up with total strangers at every opportunity. She grew out of it and is kind of stand-offish as an adult cat. Other friends say that their older cats didn't become lap cats until the age of four or five, but now totally are.
posted by lollusc at 6:13 PM on September 1, 2012
My current cats are brother and sister, and both still have the personality they had when they were tiny (him: super snuggly, her: a little more aloof). One or both of them was erratic with the litterbox until they were around six months or so, but are both fine now. Having had kittens together, I'd never get a cat on its own again (without being judgey about others who do different!). They're just so much fun and so nice. I think you should keep both.
posted by thylacinthine at 6:17 PM on September 1, 2012
posted by thylacinthine at 6:17 PM on September 1, 2012
zadcat, your evidence is anecdotal also, ya gotta admit. And of course a naturally solitary cat is happiest when solitary, I've had a few and they do indeed walk best alone.
But when you have two siblings who are accustomed to each other, they'll be happiest together. And there are some arguments for two cats getting more exercise from play, using more energy in play together and thus being less destructive, and a young sibling set with an older cat can be easier on the older cat as the kids will play together instead of harassing the older cat.
Anyhoo. As someone pointed out in a cat question I asked last year:
Cats are a slippery slope. Sooner or later, one cat = THREE.
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 7:40 PM on September 1, 2012
But when you have two siblings who are accustomed to each other, they'll be happiest together. And there are some arguments for two cats getting more exercise from play, using more energy in play together and thus being less destructive, and a young sibling set with an older cat can be easier on the older cat as the kids will play together instead of harassing the older cat.
Anyhoo. As someone pointed out in a cat question I asked last year:
Cats are a slippery slope. Sooner or later, one cat = THREE.
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 7:40 PM on September 1, 2012
L'Estrange Fruit, totally anecdotal, it's just another example of how almost any sweeping generalization about the domestic cat can be countered by another.
posted by zadcat at 7:54 PM on September 1, 2012
posted by zadcat at 7:54 PM on September 1, 2012
Fair do's, zadcat.
*shakes on it, pours a couple of scotches with complimentary cat hair garnish*
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 8:36 PM on September 1, 2012 [3 favorites]
*shakes on it, pours a couple of scotches with complimentary cat hair garnish*
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 8:36 PM on September 1, 2012 [3 favorites]
If you're set on only one kitten (my vote is for two*), I'd go with the boy kitty. He seems to be more of what you're looking for in a cat, but it is hard to say what he'll be like when he's full grown. One of my cats took three years to become a lap cat and he's been with me since he was eight weeks old (no trauma in his past). With no notice he was climbing into my lap and continues to do so. All of my cats are happy to be lap cats on their own terms and on their own schedules. The female is the least likely to be cuddly except when watching TV (she likes True Blood and Deadwood). Her brother insists on cuddling when I'm at my computer.
*I have four cats in a 1000 square foot, two bedroom house. I had two of them in a 350 square foot RV. Cats do not need lots of space as long as you have good enrichment for them (condos, toys, play-time, etc.). Think vertical, not horizontal.
PS: Cats are weird.
posted by deborah at 10:55 PM on September 1, 2012
*I have four cats in a 1000 square foot, two bedroom house. I had two of them in a 350 square foot RV. Cats do not need lots of space as long as you have good enrichment for them (condos, toys, play-time, etc.). Think vertical, not horizontal.
PS: Cats are weird.
posted by deborah at 10:55 PM on September 1, 2012
Response by poster: Anecdotal evidence is what we want! Cats are nothing if not anecdotal, and weird of course! We're running a tally at the moment on the options. It is close, but keeping the boy is winning, with keeping both just behind.
So we have 'decided' so far (we might change our mind again by tonight) that whatever the final decision, Manny stays. Keeping Scrat too is what we are trying to decide on. As ArkhanJG pointed out, we are trying for a baby, and I wonder if three cats would accept it when it comes and not be more of a danger later on. Even Shoops who is careful and knows to play without claws sometimes scratches one of us by accident. When I start thinking about this, I even wonder if we should keep any but Shoops.
But then, Shoops looked so bored and lonely. Which is what prompted the kittens in the first place. So we are keeping one at least.
posted by tweemy at 4:25 AM on September 2, 2012
So we have 'decided' so far (we might change our mind again by tonight) that whatever the final decision, Manny stays. Keeping Scrat too is what we are trying to decide on. As ArkhanJG pointed out, we are trying for a baby, and I wonder if three cats would accept it when it comes and not be more of a danger later on. Even Shoops who is careful and knows to play without claws sometimes scratches one of us by accident. When I start thinking about this, I even wonder if we should keep any but Shoops.
But then, Shoops looked so bored and lonely. Which is what prompted the kittens in the first place. So we are keeping one at least.
posted by tweemy at 4:25 AM on September 2, 2012
Response by poster: Oh, and the 'black' ones are not black, but dark brown and black tabby. They are getting lighter and lighter too. I think they might turn out like Tiffany cats from what I have seen.
posted by tweemy at 4:31 AM on September 2, 2012
posted by tweemy at 4:31 AM on September 2, 2012
Best answer: Vote for keeping both. My cats are brothers and they love one another so much, and because they are the same age they can be all silly together and tear around the house and play. I am so glad we have both and not just one. Plus then my husband can hold one while I'm holding the other, or we can have them have gladiator fights with each other in adjacent cardboard boxes. And it makes me day every time I get up and they are curled together like a yin-yang.
We are also expecting a baby soon and I think my husband would rather give away the baby when it comes than consider giving up his cats. I also have noticed with two other babies who hang out at my parents house that don't have their own pets at home, they got extremely attached to my parents' pet (who is a dog, but I think friendly cats could fill a similar role). They follow her everywhere, and both of their first word was not mama or dada, but the dog's name (and in one case the second word was "arf!"). There are a lot of sharp pointy things that can hurt your kids out there, and you can't protect them from all of it.... and there is nothing like having a pet to love.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 4:47 AM on September 2, 2012 [1 favorite]
We are also expecting a baby soon and I think my husband would rather give away the baby when it comes than consider giving up his cats. I also have noticed with two other babies who hang out at my parents house that don't have their own pets at home, they got extremely attached to my parents' pet (who is a dog, but I think friendly cats could fill a similar role). They follow her everywhere, and both of their first word was not mama or dada, but the dog's name (and in one case the second word was "arf!"). There are a lot of sharp pointy things that can hurt your kids out there, and you can't protect them from all of it.... and there is nothing like having a pet to love.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 4:47 AM on September 2, 2012 [1 favorite]
To address your baby issues specifically: all three of my kids' first word was cat. At the time we had two cats and they loved the kids unconditionally, let them literally crawl all over them. As they got to be toddlers the cats became a little less tolerant of being mauled but were always gentle enough in their responses that it was never a problem. The cats were around 5 when the first kid was born.
posted by leslies at 9:13 AM on September 2, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by leslies at 9:13 AM on September 2, 2012 [1 favorite]
imo a toddler incoming is even more reason to keep both, so they'll play with each other rather than being bored and trying to play with the baby!
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 11:37 AM on September 2, 2012
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 11:37 AM on September 2, 2012
Best answer: I have a toddler as well as the two young cats, and I was always (especially in my pre cat loving days) very concerned about cats and babies in the same house, but my guys have always been super patient with the baby (altho the female is in general a little less likely to hang around when the baby is being annoying), allowing her to carry them around and lie on them. They have never scratched or bitten her. I have dozens of boring stories about how wonderful the boy cat is with the baby! but she just adores them.
posted by thylacinthine at 3:10 PM on September 2, 2012
posted by thylacinthine at 3:10 PM on September 2, 2012
Regarding your question about a baby and a cat together in a house, I've told this story before but it applies here so I'll repeat it: Years ago friends of mine had a Siamese cat that they'd had since kittenhood. When the cat was about two years old, the couple had a baby. They were afraid of jealousy problems and always watched carefully when the the cat and infant were together (because the cat seemed fascinated by the baby). As it turned out, the cat was always ever so gentle with the babe and became its constant companion. When their daughter began to babble as babies do, one of the first sounds she made was to imitate the way a Siamese "talks." After a few months, they always had to double-check to see whether it was the cat or the baby when they heard meowing.
posted by Oriole Adams at 11:41 AM on September 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Oriole Adams at 11:41 AM on September 3, 2012 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Update: we have decided to follow the near-consensus and to keep two kittens. As the weeks have gone by, ArkhanJG has gotten closer to Cole, one of the black/brown tabbies, so much so that we decided to keep him, along with Manny. In the end we were concerned about the possible future disagreements between two female cats and thus kept two males who are very happy with each other and their mom. We also felt Scrat would be happier on her own than those two.
Three of the kittens are now gone; the flat feels empty without five running kittens but it allows us to give more attention to the two we kept.
Thank you all for your good advice and anecdotes, you have helped us make a (good?) decision and to think about it thoroughly.
posted by tweemy at 10:59 AM on September 17, 2012
Three of the kittens are now gone; the flat feels empty without five running kittens but it allows us to give more attention to the two we kept.
Thank you all for your good advice and anecdotes, you have helped us make a (good?) decision and to think about it thoroughly.
posted by tweemy at 10:59 AM on September 17, 2012
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But it really could depend on your kittens' individual personalities - I don't know how much gender comes into play when it comes to lapcat suitability.
There's no chance of your keeping a boy and a girl?
posted by Chorus at 3:17 AM on September 1, 2012 [1 favorite]